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Nonprofit Radio for January 12, 2018: Free Coaching In 2018 & Maria’s 2018 Plan

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Curtis Springstead: Free Coaching In 2018

SCORE coaches small nonprofits nationwide through its network of volunteer specialists in marketing, HR, technology, management, finance and more. Curtis Springstead is from the northeast New Jersey region and he reveals how to get free, ongoing support for your organization.

 

 

Maria Semple: Maria’s 2018 Plan

Maria Semple

Maria Semple has strategies for your fundraising, digital marketing and prospect research. She’s our prospect research contributor and The Prospect Finder.

 

 


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Board relations. Fundraising. Volunteer management. Prospect research. Legal compliance. Accounting. Finance. Investments. Donor relations. Public relations. Marketing. Technology. Social media.

Every nonprofit struggles with these issues. Big nonprofits hire experts. The other 95% listen to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Trusted experts and leading thinkers join me each week to tackle the tough issues. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.

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Welcome to twenty martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas to be either ninety five percent on your actor named oh, i’m glad you’re with me, i’d suffer the effects of organ neo-sage if you got taste saying you missed today’s show free coaching in twenty eighteen, four coaches small non-profits nationwide through its network of volunteer specialist in marketing, hr technology management finance and mohr kurt kurt springstead is from the northeast region, and he revealed how to get free, ongoing support for your organization and maria’s twenty eighteen plans. Maria semple has strategies for your fund-raising digital marketing and trusted research prospect, research contributor and prospect finder. I thought he’d take you twenty eighteen plans all this month responded by pursuing full service fund-raising data driven and technology enables, tony got a last person and by wejust piela guiding you beyond the numbers. Western piela dot com hello durney credit card processing into your press of revenue stream. Tony dahna made black teller i’m pleased to welcome kurt springstead to the show. He is a certified mentor and chairman for the score northeast new jersey chapter his near forty year career was in information technology and ranged from programmer trainer and adjunct professor. Tow it, director, consultant and non-profit boardmember score is at score. Mentors and score dot org’s. Kurt springstead. Welcome to the show. Thank you. It’s. A pleasure to have you, um, score. Now, i i grew up with score being the service corps of retired executives, but that’s ah, that’s. Old news, right? Yes. We’ve dropped that. That acronym? Because it turns out that nearly half of us are working to some degree, many full time in some part time. Okay, so so i was like, like, aarp is no longer the american association of retired persons. It’s just aarp like that, right? Like that. Okay, um, and score is nationwide and supported by the small business administration. Technically, we have our own funding from the directly from the government, and we’re a partner of this administration. They just kind of helped me or the money out. Okay, okay. But of course, score is itself a non-profit so people can give to score and support the work. Well, the way we have our own non profit foundation called the score foundation. Okay, in order to to accept funds donated from the public or from corporations that want to sponsor is because as a government agency, which is what we are, we obviously can’t take donations. Oh, you’re still you like you’re a part of small business administration? Not just i thought, supported by the website says, supported by i thought that meant like you get grant, you get a grant from score. I mean, from s b a. But what exactly happened? Wear actually empowered by an act of congress and they give us a small grant that they they ask our big brother, the spd administer. Okay then, when someone tried to donate a large sum of money a few years ago, we had to figure out how to make advantage take advantage of that. So i created the square foundation, which then sponsors various programs that were involved in whether it be training or outreach. They allow us to be more effective than what we get from the government. Okay, so the yes. So the score mentors are acquainted with non-profits not wanting to turn down gift if they don’t have to. Absolutely. Well, we we end up in our particular chapter having to raise nearly half of the money we need to operate. So we understand all the all the issues that not-for-profits okay, excellent. Eso s o score is i think i feel i feel like my voice just crafting a score score score score is mentoring that is on coaching that is available nationwide, including for non-profits let give us a sense of the breath of this. What? What? What non-profits could learn? Sure. So, yeah, one of the key services we do offer is confidential and free mentoring for as long as you’ll have us. And, you know, there’s about thirteen thousand of my friends in three hundred thirty chapters across the country with people who have done everything you can imagine serial entrepreneurs, uh, people with industry specializations, i spent a lot of time as you mentioned it, but we have people who are retard lawyers piela people have come from not-for-profits organizations and so on, and then what we offer you is whatever services you might need it’s really, in terms of a coaching, a relationship. So if you were people come to us with simply a gleam of an idea, i’d like to create an organization or like to create an entity that does the following and i need to know where the steps are. What are my resource is? How do i make it happen? And since most of us and our careers have been down that road already, either in for-profit or not-for-profits we can i tried to tell you where the where the dangers are and what kind of decisions you might have to make. Okay. And that’s, that’s, that’s pre startup. But our listeners are are already in non-profits, you know, vast majority is already in non-profits so i first of all, i just love the idea that this is available to us as us taxpayers and non-profits ah, you know, in part supported by our small business administration. I love that guy like that, right? So actually, you should be really important. Happy the taxpayer because for every dollar the government gives us, we return fifty dollars. I don’t think there’s any other group in the government that actually gives money back. Is that right? Yeah. Okay. So the yes. I mean, well, you know, we tend to see a lot of people who are looking to start a business, but probably nearly half our business. People who already in business. Ok. For a significant period of time, and so the services are the same. The questions they’re sometimes different not trying to find out necessarily where to go, but we have some trying to grow or i’m thinking of adding a new line of service, or i’m struggling with managing the people that i have a client come to me has been a business for twenty five years, and suddenly the numbers went went rid. She had no idea why that happened or what was going on had, uh, any number of people who come to us with, uh, you know, i just we feel we need to grow. We need to serve more of our clients. We’re not getting out to the the community we were designed to serve. How do we make people aware of us? How do we get volunteers? All those kinds of questions that we run into excellent. Okay, so so even though it’s small business administration, you know that there’s a reason that you’re on non-profit radio i want listens to b b certain that they can avail themselves of this inn non-profit so so whether it’s marketing or law or human resource is a righty or accounting? What? I mean, like any any business functionality is available for the is available as coaching and mentoring that i haven’t run into anything yet that i can’t find, you know, the reality is that for, you know, a cz you’ve mentioned, i’ve been on board and, you know, i’m i’m running a fifty person ah, small non-profit myself locally with the team that i have, so i’m struggling to find more money trying to struggling to find volunteers, i’m tryingto struggle to keep them engaged, too. Figure out how i can reach more clients, which is one of the reasons is wrong with you today. What can i do to make sure that everybody knows our service is out there? So we have the same kinds of problems, the same issues. So, you know, sometimes you need legal advice, and i appreciate the nuance that there are some regulations and some decisions that are different for those of us who are in a not for profit status and the have you got a charitable registration you need to set up? How do you? Some of the legalities of when we hyre people on how we treat them are a bit different howto do with the tax situation. I mean, one of the most interesting questions i get it someone has come to us, has had a for-profit business i have working with a woman who’s been teaching art for a number of years, but now she wants to turn it over and offer some of her courses for free on the internet. And she was going to look for grants. Well, unfortunately, she’s a commercial operation and the number of grants for a commercial operation are quite small. So we started to talk about how she might look at establishing an aw for-profit and attract people to make donations to that business. So i, you know, i’ve only been with score about three years, but i’ve been all over the map. So in terms of those kinds of questions, i can’t help but notice the similarities between my four business work in my not-for-profits although, as every business has its own unique nuance, um where where we do our best to help with that? Yeah, we have to take our first break so you just hang out for a moment and it’s time for a break. Data driven fund-raising field guide that is their newest resource on the listener landing page. There was more data generated in twenty, sixteen and twenty, seventeen, and in all of previous history made that is amazing and it’s too much for you to deal with a field guide to help you translate the data. You have the fever got into actionable inside, drive your fund-raising so you can act on your data, not be stuck in its muddled through it. You know that, ah, fancy report that you get out of your fund-raising starita basis is not worth anything. If you can’t act on it and have it helped you in your fund-raising what is taking what they’ve learned in working raise large organisation, and they have boiled down to basic principles for you in data analysis. The data driven fund-raising field guys it’s at tony got a flash for students capital p now, back to springstead and free coaching in twenty eight i’m with kurt springstead on, we’re talking about score, which is consulting, coaching, mentoring, that’s available to you in all these different areas that that kurt has been touching on anywhere in the country. Him he happens to be in the northeast new jersey chapter, but how many three hundred chapters you said throughout the country, country hundred thirty welcomed the beauty of it is we have a significant number of clients that we service, uh, who who are comfortable with an exchange of e mails, and we’ve also started in the last year or two significant amount of mentoring the video conference, so if the particular expertise you need isn’t in the small team, in your neighborhood or in your your area, then with some help your you, khun, search and find a person anywhere in the united states, and you can make the arrangements to work with it. I was working with the young man who originally met with him in kentucky or talk with him while he was in kentucky and one day we were chatting while he happened to be in china working on this project, so we’re no longer bound by the code we working. Okay, excellent. All right. Very good to know. All right, so if someone wants to work with score, we want to take advantage of this vast consultancy basically that that’s free to us way get started with the the website it scored out. Or gore or how oh, that is the most efficient way to do it. Okay, you go to score dot organ, you’re going to find one of several buttons that it’s going to or hidden around the screen or on the screen that will tell you, you know, meet with a mentor. And at that point, you’ll be asked to you know what? How do you want to do that? Face-to-face email whatever you type in very minimal information that your name and address phone number email a little bit about what you want to talk about and hit entering within two business days. Somebody is probably going to be back in touch with you trying to establish the appointment to move ahead and you make a distinction between mentoring and consulting? How do i know which of those is better for me? Okay, well, actually, there you’re going to be with one person. We find that we have to wear a couple of hats were primarily mentors and had been a consultant most my life. I could make a hope, a simple distinction. A mentor, a guide you through the process asks you questions, ask you to probe things, operas you advice and counsel and points it out, but allows you to come to your own conclusions. We make no judgments about what it is you’re proposing to do or how you propose to do it, because ultimately it is your business. But there are times when what you need is information and instructions specifically how to do something and when we can do that, you know, we can’t practice law, and we can’t do the work of people do, but we can we can help you review a business plan, our build, you know, proposal to a bank. We’re going to coach you on that when i was a consultant, i i also would charge you to do that work or i do it for you. We are not. Equipped to fill out your business plan, but to help you go through that. So most of the time were mentors were were advising coaching, encouraging, sometimes supporting when times get tough. But every once in a while you need someone with the main expertise. Oh, and that’s, when we put on our consulting hat for a bit of time. Now, how do you get familiar with the work of the non-profit before this before this initial meeting? So so the initial meeting is for the purpose of, of understanding. What is it you want to accomplish? Where are you? What have you done so far? And then establishing a game plan? And one of the key things is do we need other players in the meat in the mix? That’s the advantage i have i i i’m probably meet with you with someone else anyway, just because more people that are listening, the better hyre information will gather anyway. But then if i know that there’s a particular expertise or challenge at the moment, then i can go out and make sure that i have the right person with me at that time, or i might need to do. Some more research to find out through my other channels, other partners that we work with to make sure that we have the information that you’re going to need or the access so the resources that you want. So that first hour, so it is really sort of like the doctor taking your vital signs, we need to kind of know what we’re dealing with first, before we start begin to do any kind of diagnosis. I mean, many people come to us, i think they have just a quick question. They want to get answered, and and that may be true, but oftentimes during the dialogue, they come to the conclusion that they there’s more than they had asked for the problem’s bigger or the questions are broader than they had thought and that’s that’s why we look at that first meeting is simply this sort of the diagnosis, okay? And you’ll stay with them. You said it’s a cz long as they’ll have you. Right, so the ad varies a bit by by chapter, but in our our chapter, the basic model is if i were to work with you, for example, i would intend to work with you for as long as you have me and as time would go on, i would expect you would need to have many different resource is, and you’d need things well beyond whatever my expertise might be. So i’m going to just make sure that i’m going to be your single point of contact with score throughout that entire relationship and get you the resource is that you need within score and without way our research, your partner, the fda, there might be a time when we need to reach out to there were two other governmental agencies, for example, to help you with something you’re trying to do and that’s the ideas we have that you can you can build that relationship with deaf. You not constantly telling your story to new people who might show up the answer a question, i suppose it’s something general, i’ve had guests on talking about, you know, planning on dh here we are in january talking about planning for the new year, i suppose it’s like, you know, i don’t feel like my will keep it in your in your ballpark, you know, i don’t feel like my eye is is adequate. You know, but i’m not really i mean, i don’t feel like the programs we have or the methods we have, like we’re two spreadsheet dependent, but, you know, i’m not really sure what direction to go or what, and i don’t know how much you know, money i need to spend, i suppose it’s something you know as general is that, uh, you know, sort of nebula nevertheless, is that well, that’s actualy pretty specific. Thank you, really? For that i was trying to give you a hard i was trying to give you a hard hypothetical. Yeah, so the whole idea’s, because i happen to have that the main expense, i’d start asking in little more in depth questions and understand and why you have these feelings with the challenges are what, what your current situation is preventing you from doing what things you think you’d like to be able to do, and we could talk about whether or not your system would do that. And then because i’ve had thirty or forty years, i can start to help you figure out how to shop for a new solution. If that’s the right case i could give you. Some ideas of what the orders of magnitude of expense might be the time to get these accomplished some thoughts about the steps of going forward, you know, recently have been advising a couple of people who are creating app in their particular space, and it’s it’s been a lot about strategy? You know what kind of a platform that we put it on when i have no money to start with? And then what do i do if i open up my app and i suddenly become, you know, huge, i’ve got, you know, one hundred thousand users where am i thought i might have a thousand on the first day, so all those kinds of things, you know, we’re equipped to do it, and, you know, it doesn’t it’s not always going to happen in a one hour session, and we understand that, yeah, of course, yeah, now i assume this is all confidential, absolutely pr every year we’re we’re required to re certify on our code of ethics and the number one tenant is confidentiality we that’s built into the when you actually agreed to be a client, you’re you’re covered by that, and i could just tell you from my own experience, unless we engage of one of my colleagues into a into a particular client, i’m not likely to be speaking about your personal situation with other members of the team. Frankly, just no, no need to do that. So you could be you can be absolutely certain that whatever we talk about it it’s just between us. Can we bring in other people from the organization? If i want, maybe it’d be helpful for you to talk. Tio my c f o r a boardmember can we can we engage multiple people on our on our side? Absolutely. We recently had a team of from my office to meet with the entire board, a new organization to provide some residents living facilities for people with special needs. And they were struggling with there being pressured but costs. And so it was important to get the full perspective from from their, uh, their leadership to what they thought their challenges and issues were. And that was so we had a nice big meeting, so we’re oftentimes it’s scaled up. And that sounds like a good story. Good non-profit story. How were you able to help? Those folks they st louis where they, you know, they gave us a rundown on what they saw, their challenges and what the in terms of the quality of people they needed toe hyre because of the concern for the people that the population they were serving, the challenge is about how they were funding the business. There were some options available to them, given the structure of some of the reimbursement that’s available through healthcare plans and such on dh ahs well as the diversity of their program, and we were able to share with them from our differing expertise. I had someone who had financial background, and there was another one with people back, personnel background, and i looked at some of the systems approaches, we were able to provide them with some frankly, in their case, so a way of sort of prioritizing the many challenges that that they had, and that seemed to be a recurring theme by the way that we run into many of the existing businesses there are there are so many things we could work on that sometimes we can’t make up her mind, which is the one that, uh, it’s going to be the most productive well and that’s, that and that’s a big challenge, of course, in the non-profit community, especially now, as you know, if if if we see government funding reduced to the point, where are our state can no longer offer services, you know, i think a lot is going to fall to non-profits and prioritization is going to be the challenge. I mean, this is gonna be so much more that needs to be done. Can we do it? Should should we be doing it on def? So you know how right? And, you know, i think the other thing is that for many clients of in both the non-profit world as well, the for-profit world, sometimes the best be that outside force or that outside opinion, um, your board is a good team, your volunteers were good team, but you you are not already looking through a filter based on your day to day knowledge of what, what you do and how you’ve done it. We come in with with none of those constraints, we don’t we don’t know everything about the business, so we’re not afraid to ask stupid questions or two proposed the idea from another industry or another space that perhaps could be adapted to your space. One of the interesting things we teach some business start up ideas, and one of the concepts in there for one of the leading thinkers is that there are no new business models. There are simply people who were innovatively applying business models into a world where they have not traditionally been used thinking of things like amazon into the book market, for example. So sometimes it just creates it’s just good to hear somebody who doesn’t already have the corporate think, if you will say, agree with your idea or think that your priorities are correct. What about around social media? If i if i feel i’m struggling, i’m not sure which which channels to be in? Um, i’m not you know, i don’t feel like i’m thoroughly engaged with people you know is help with social media within within the score of expertise to a degree, yes, i would be we find that more often than not just because of this, the fact that it moved so quickly, even with some of the the younger subject matter experts that we have on our team it’s just hard to keep up, so we understand i mean, frankly, is an organization we were struggling every day and constantly checking to make sure that what we’re investing in, what we’re doing is social meat is working, but so we can give that some overviewing could put that in the context of other efforts that you might be doing to get your workout, but we also can help you identify a partner if that turns out to be the right thing, because there are two aspects to it through the strategic aspect, which we can offer probably more help with, and we have we have, you know, hundreds and thousands of resource is on our national website on a variety of topics, several of which are around that we also produce a webinar every week on a different topic and oftentimes social media’s his way one part of that so we can provide that overall information, but sometimes it’s uh, i will just tell you that score we’ve hired a contractor who actually implements a lot of our strategy and making sure that we’re getting post out, helping us figure out howto measure and find out if it’s actually working if we’re if we should be boosting post if we should be buying at how are we using our google place that nature so we can get you two started in that the right direction? Sometimes all we can do is help you be a good customer when you have to go out and buy a resource. Because you what? You really someone who could come and spend time, day after day doing the work for you, which were just not structured, right? Right. That’s, not yours. Ok, but but you can’t help identify the questions we should be talking. We should be asking potential vendors and identify the for us, you know, a process for for hiring, whether it’s frankly, whether it’s, a social media manager or ah or an outsource cfo or right. I mean, you can help with that, you know, acquiring the expertise? Absolutely. And so it will be better than just sort of, you know, hitting up google and looking for the one in neighborhood. Yeah, we’ll give you some some measurements of some things you can ask during the interview. What should you look for in their in their background or in their proposal, if that’s the right thing and some sort of sense of perhaps with the fees and costs on toby, i’m thinking about this, too. In terms of finances, you know, a lot of people, lots of people get into non-profits started non-profit because they have enormous passion for some cause and let’s put aside the question whether forming a non-profit was the right business decision to make or not because they already passed, that they’re already incorporated, but they often are lacking the business savvy that it takes two to scale and sustain. And i think i think financial issues particularly stand out what you know suppose suppose that’s me, i mean, i got a lot of passion and i’ve already incorporated is a non-profit but i’m not sure i’m accounting correctly, you know, people talk to me about ah, accounting software, you know, how do i start? Right? And you have the reality also is this significant potential legal and issues if you don’t do that sort of thing, right? So yeah, that is that’s a very common peace. I would just tell you that very few people who go into business a cz well, who might have a passion for a not for profit uh, area really ever intend to be the business person they wanted. They want to serve the population, they wantto feed the cause they want to, you know, sell the best pizza, whatever it might be. So and then they say, oh, not so now. I’ve got to run this business thing and double these forms, and the government wants something, and i got to write a check to this guy and i just, you know, what’s all this about and that’s where we can provide a couple of layers of support sometimes it’s simply where those of us who are from score who have the financial chops of the management chop could just be that that mentor we meet with you on a fairly regular basis, help you realize, you know, figure out howto watch the pulse in your company and make some of the long term, bigger decisions if you’re comfortable doing the day to day checkbook and that sort of thing, okay, for other people, it’s it and, you know, maybe you’re lucky and you you’ve blossomed you in your really big skill, you know, i was on the board of a couple of not-for-profits that are, you know, had million, multi million dollar budget. So we we had professional accounting firms to do it eso again helping to find the right people. But also, you know, people will tell you, make sure you do the right accounting and so on. But you need to go with them and help them explain to them well, what your strategy, which your long term plan for the organ ization? Where am i going to go next? Because that might affect what they do today. So we can help you crystallize and formulate those plans on growth situations. And then you have someone who could do the day to day blocking and tackling. If you do need sources of funds, where do i find that? You know, if i’m not for-profit i have some opportunities. Perhaps go for grants. How do i write a grant? Where would i find a grant writer? Do i need a grant writer? That kind of thing all come up as we go forward. And then also how do our their limitations on the money that i have? I can tell you that in my organization. There are certain things that i can’t pay for with the money the government gives me to operate, but i can pay for with the money i get through donations off. All right, so these are all factors that we many of us have expertise we have their knowledge of and worst cases again, we will help you become the better informed consumer of services for by a professor. All right, we have to leave it there. I just wantto make sure that people understand, too, that there are a lot of do-it-yourself resource is at score dot org’s articles outlines templates. Kurt mentioned one hour webinar every week, so i’m encouraging you for twenty eighteen to check out, score, score, dot or ge and at score mentors. Kurt springstead thank you so much, my pleasure. We need to take a break. Redner’s here’s a testimonial, i was on my new position when i began working with regular piela my confidence, i can have grown knowing that i can rely on the professionals to answer any questions and make recommendations that will ensure the success of our non-profit you were given sound advice enabling us to increase investment income while at the same time, protecting you. Ask that. I trust and respect our audit team on the forward to their annual visit and vote. That is, from a midsize religious organization in the big graft. Dahna look at this. I mean the people of more than piela e-giving investment income on that’s. Good advice. And the person looked forward to their orders. I don’t think you have no properties are looking forward to order. I think they’re more feared, maybe dreaded, but it’s not a fortune from the midtown religious organization in the mid west and diversity of expertise reminds me of all the guys that they have all the guys, guys, guys, all these forms in ten places and white papers on diver subject oppcoll way beyond accounting. No, lecter goes way beyond the numbers for their clients. You know that you’re supposed to change audit firms every three years to get a fresh perspective on your practices on the first set of eyes looking over your books and your management management processes. You want the advice of a firm that goes broads help you? I think you know beyond the balance. So that is what i’m always saying. They go beyond the numbers talking on one of the people you could talk to. Is you too, who’s? Been a guest on the show martignetti piela dot com that’s not tony. Take two. Well, it’s almost for your twenty eighteen planning there’s. More coming after this one next week. Takagi what is the new tax law metoo for your twenty eighteen? Hundred. And on january twenty sixth, it’s gonna be me and amy, i’m gonna be talking about starting your plan e-giving programs in twenty eighteen, and then amy sample ward is gonna have her twenty, eighteen plants, just like maria has plans coming up very shortly. We’re supposed to have joe garrett. Unfortunately, he had a family emergency, couldn’t make the day that we were gonna be recording, so we’ll get joe garrett back fund-raising plan. But instead of joe playbook, that i get that, but i’m always got, so we have got you covered for the whole year, all month of january, that is all you got to do. My pleasure. Welcome. Maria semple, prospect finder, trainer and speaker on prospect research. Latest book is magnifying your business. Six tools and strategies that growing your business or your non-profits our joy and if they’re free, get the prospects finding dot com and at maria semple welcome back, maria semple. Happy new year. Happy new year county. How are you today? Thank you. Doing great. Thank you very much. It’s. Good to talk to you. And and you’ve been thinking through what i’m calling maria’s twenty eighteen plans. What are you going to start with? So, you know, i thought i would give a little bit of a mixed some tips that i might be, you know, might have offered through my focus. Well, it’s, um, it’s really focused in on prospect research in particular. And just, you know, trying to make sure that non-profits are a cz short up, as they possibly can be for the upcoming year. Okay, so that book might like that magnifies your business school gravity’s growing your business or your non-profit looking talking about? Yep. That’s the one that’s, the books magnifying. Okay, i wanna make sure that was it. All right. So what? Do you want something? Well, you know, i was thinking about thie importance of really solidifying your relationship with individuals. Andi, this is where i think non-profits really have the greatest strengths on dh, their greatest opportunities as well, for growing. So, you know, when you think about, you know, launching a major gift effort or maybe upgrading your major gift effort, this is really the year to do what if you haven’t done so already? So, you know, sort of a first step that you might consider doing is to do a database screening. There are a number of companies out there that will screen your entire donordigital base, um, so that you’re really able to kind of elevate those those prospects that might be hidden in your database and give you an opportunity that you know where to focus your efforts. All right? So you’re encouraging diversifying into an individual e-giving program if you don’t already have one that’s, right? That’s, right? But you need to know where we’re to focus so very often if you’ve got a board that’s been changing out a lot or you’ve got, you know, a lot of staff changes and so forth. And you really don’t have that longevity and people really standing who’s in that donor database, so you’re able to sort of look at it on your own, obviously that’s seen cheapest way to do it right? Because now you’re not, you know, outsourcing anything, they’re not paying anybody to screen the database, but i really find that when when organizations take an opportunity to do that, it gives them the chance elevator to the top, the names of the people they should really be focusing in on. So, you know, you might even do it. Has a lot of the companies will allow you to send in a batch and test your database to see, you know, if it’s going to be worthwhile. Thio do the whole thing. Okay, um, something else you want to have in place before you do a major gift on individual individual giving program, major gifts or welchlin yeah, you’re gonna end up with maybe get program if you take this important step starting individual e-giving program’s going to end up with major donors, some are goingto give more brothers, but either way, you want to have ah, constituent relationship matters in a database. You crn database in place on dh. There are very affordable ways of doing that there’s so many different cloud services and there’s some that you just played by the records. So when you’re starting small, you know, you don’t have to have the major’s your commitment, maybe database, that, uh, that is only going to have a couple dozen names in the beginning, but you want to have a way of capturing all those relationships all those different data points with people because of something that you just mentioned area staff turnover, when when one person leaves, they’ve had all the conversations with, you know, half your donors, uh, you don’t want to lose weight, and i talked about that. You don’t want to lose all that precious information, right is right, and, you know, it’s a problem as as i’m sure you’ve seen in your own consulting that happens time and time again, where you get in there and you talk to an organization and they say, you know, well, you know, i’m new here, i’m only on the job three months i’m really not sure what those relationships were like on dh then you find out that you know, a lot of conversations and so forth, which simply not recorded anywhere. Elearning yeah, i mean, the last thing that you want to do is call the donor and say, hi, you know, my name’s, maria semple, on our new year of the organization, and i’d like to get to know, you know, for your interest, why do you give to us, you know, i mean, you should know that you should know all of that information. Yeah, i just had that conversation with your your predecessor two months ago, so so database screening find find people on, of course don’t only pay attention to the wealthiest in your in your in your database on that also have your e r n, right? Okay, you’re you’re also encouraging, looking into recurring yeah, you know, this is a place that you have an opportunity to garner, and i’m going to say those smaller gifts, those people that will commit ten dollars in most twenty dollars a month, whatever it is that’s hating their credit card, everybody so, you know, many of us are already used to paying whatever netflix, whatever this monthly charges that’s hitting our credit card accounts. On dh so it’s already sort of been absorbed into our monthly budgeting and so forth. And so if you can convince people to start setting up a recurring, uh, payments to your organization that’s going to go a long way to helping booth and of course, you’re not talking to the major gets here. You are talking about getting people in, perhaps at a much lower entry point and keeping them engage. I think it’s pretty standard practice, but i was going to make this explicit no on that donation page that you’ve got. You want to have a button for making monthly or something like that so that the person who is giving at a level that could conceivably be the monthly recurring donation could easily do it, you know, you know, ryan and i have to go in someplace special to make a set of recurring giving, i think that’s pretty standard, but i want to make it quick, make sure hyre no, that could be it could be very valuable. And you know what we get on saying that people just forget about it and fills, usually until their credit card expires, and then they’re reminded oh, yeah, no, i got this thing, and then and then sometimes that’s an opportunity for you asking for upgrades when a person is reevaluating. I mean, yeah, there’s always a chance that they’re goingto stop those donations at a point like that. But there’s also a chance that they’ll they’ll increase it. So you use a of failed transaction as an opportunity to essentially increase. Yeah, yeah, and, you know, it’s an opportunity for you to really start using the language that you would use, maybe with a major gift donor-centric tuo invest on a monthly basis in our organization, you know, you might have a monthly investments that you have set up for, you know, for yourself, for your for one kings or, you know, whatever we’d like you to take just ten dollars and twenty dollars a month and invest with our organization in the future viability of the organization. So, you know, give that compelling story, give that compelling reason why they should be engaging and investing with you on one thing faces, okay? And that’s, uh, you wanted to be telling them stories about about your outcomes, basically, what a big part of the story. Selling that’s, right? That’s right night. I saw that you actually had done them a video recently, you know, kind of on this topic as well. You know, you’ve got to be able to thankfully tell your story and, you know, there’s a lot of information out there on the web, all you need to do is really do a google search for non-profits storytelling, um, there are a lot of experts in that arena i’ve seen some of them speak even at the american marketing association conference on dh you know, the thing that you have to get across to people is, yeah, you’ve got your stats on, you know, those important metrics that you’ve got to be able to communicate, but that’s usually not what’s going to sell somebody right on on wanting to invest with your organization. So you’ve got to be able to humanize it and tell stories about the impact that your organization has on the community and, you know, making sure that you’re kind of a hearing too, really good storytelling, a beginning, a middle and an end and really understand all the different types of stories that there are out there. There’s a reason why we can’t remember, you know stories about whatever little red riding hood and the three little pigs, right? There’s a certain set up to those stories, you can learn tons of information about that on the web, and i really encourage you, teo teo, focus focus in on getting the story straight not only for your major gift donors, but also across the board at all we know right now definitely cross for this matter from e-giving five dollars a month with five dollars, more than they need to know what you’re infected and we’ve had listen, we have a guest here too. You go, teo durney martignetti dot com and search storytelling, the the guests we’ve had on that subject will obviously come up. Yeah, you got to share your impact? Um, you’ve also been thinking about trying to capitalize on sigil ambassadors? Yeah, yeah. So talented people. Yeah. So, you know, i’m sure that this is something that amy sample ward talks a lot about when when she’s on your show, tony as well. But, you know, you want to think about engaging people to be able to help amplify your message. Right? So, you know i think we’re all asses point sort of accustomed to seeing campaigns were online where your friends or maybe joni there their birthday, you know, raising money for an organization on behalf of their birthday, that type of thing. So those types of sort of crowd funding these people are digital ambassadors for an organisation when they do that, all the people that were involved in that bucket challenge, they were digital ambassadors, right? And there were some that were really, really strong, obviously that the first family, the first guy that kicked it off, they must have had a pretty good following to get to get kissed off as well as he did, but you wanted to try and figure out who those digital ambassadors are if you don’t have any really it’s time to start recruiting some on broadening your outreach, even if you have to think about some paid opportunities, you know, on facebook such as, you know, i don’t know ads are boosted post, yeah, big book and also twitter yeah, yeah, you know, as you find the people who are most network most deeply connected and you start a campaign you wantto be working with them. And this is something that any and i have talked about to work them back channels. You get them enthusiastic and you get them talking before you start your public campaign, right? Get there. And you get that they’re connected to help you in the public. And so that i know that people who follow you, uh, people who were with you and you have the most followers fanned. Whatever. You know, those were the most connected are going. Teo, be active participants in your campaign. Maria, we gotta take a break. We’re going toe. We’re gonna come back and talk more about yeah, ambassadors. And i know you have some resources share finding them right now. I gotta take a break. Elearning credit card payment processing brovey check out the video at tony dot m a flash tony, tell us explained the process of businesses joining tell us on having their credit cards, other payments process by tello’s and reminds you that you are going to get fifty percent of the revenue that hello elearning that’s a long revenue stream because they have one hundred percent satisfaction rate. So you can be assured that the business is going to be pleased, and you’re going to be earning revenue from this four, a good long time every single month. Also, the video for their, uh, one hundred percent satisfaction and the price match guarantee. You go beyond that. Tell us, can’t save the money that you started to tell us, and you’re getting two hundred fifty dollars. So it’s worth starting. Think about businesses. That next-gen tio, you know, as the rest of you watch the video. Think about like, a local body shop where, by the way, out there, all wearing masks and your protection jewelry store the area where they make a pie with the crust recognize from a bakery where hope that we don’t have very good. Um, think about that think about the businesses that you’re you’re boardmember zoho family members only any of these potential referrals to tell us for credit card processing, you just have to generate some interest to check out the video. That’s brightstep teo, your long tail of revenue. Tony got a last tony tellers. Now, look, rebecca miree simple and her twenty eighteen plan. You have some resources for finding who the deepest, most networked ambassadors are among your constituents. Yeah. Yeah. I have some resources that you might want to consider looking into. First of all, i came across a great white paper download that blackbaud put together. They put together a nice free guide. And it’s actually called super has the kids program how to create a super advocate program. So there i read through it, and it looked like there were a lot of really good chips in there. So that might kind of give you the first time ideas about how the framework and what it is that you might want to do and, you know, it really is going to be able to create opportunities foreign organizations most committed supporters really did take more action hyre value actions than than a typical supporter. This’s why you’re our joy and of your cubine free, right? So that the guide is free, but the guide three guys? Yeah, another one, right, yet so a couple of other things actually one that you brought to my attention called attentively, which is one of the blackbaud solutions actually wait give you the opportunity to identify whose influential so they say that a mass email files with social data and so that you can better understand the social side of yours supporters. So if you do have an email list, it is an opportunity to see who amongst that list might be really great social ambassadors reorganization, that’s attentive dot leaves they’ve got a y yeah, they they also make the point that home email i just better don’t. Usually the one people used to sign up with social network, so if you have a file of of home addresses, home email addresses attentively that’s not that’s not well, my treat so that’s not a free one, but no that’s correct zsystems blackbaud but value there and finding the most connected people and you got zaptitude what is zaptitude about? Yes. Zaptitude right. Kind of an interesting name. They have one of their service offerings is called good influence. And i learned about this company a few years ago. And i actually met some of the folks behind the company at one point and met people at the american marketing association conference who use this tool. Two years ago, you been holding out on us. You got a couple of years. You’re feeling it now in january twenty eighteen, you know, i’ve got i’ve got to keep some gems for you. I don’t think w hole not on non-profit idealware way. Never talked about you and waited. All right, maybe you alright? I get it out? Yes. So anyway, they have they have a tool called good influence and basically it it’s an opportunity to is your existing customers because this is used side both, you know, businesses and non-profit so in this case, your existing donors to dr support through new donors. So it’s a platform that really again helps to amplify not so much doing the search like thehe tentative job l y product would do, but really, this could be a platform for you. Teo, try and scale off your digital ambassador efforts. And when i was going back and reviewing some information about the current leadership team i’m looking at the bio of the founder and ceo is kind of interesting in marinette, we talk about the good influence product with the bat phone for the social activation engine for the famous i spoke a challenge current, so i’d be interested in having another conversation with him, actually myself. Teo, figure out more about how exactly the good influence taught. It played into that. I stuck a challenge. Okay, cool. And that’s that information about that is that zaptitude yeah. Dot com. Right. Okay. That’s that that to write? Well, you would be our most likely contributors. So let’s, get some prospect. Researcher idea. That is okay. So i was also thinking about a new arena we haven’t talked about before, which is maybe trying to research some of the companies in your community that are set up as the corporations and so i know, you know, you know why i don’t want to get thrown in the jargon jail so let’s, talk a little bit of what? You know well, listeners know that’s okay, well, that’s all right, gene cog and i’ve talked about the corpse on there now, and they’re they’re social, social good missions, not sickly, profit driven, but they certainly can be profit making, so you’re okay. You’re okay, cool. Cool. Ok, good. So there’s, actually a website called b corporation dot net. Uh, where you can go and search by state and see, you know what? All the big corporations are right in your state on dh. Then, you know, you’re kind of using, you know, good old fashioned prospect research looking at that company, trying to figure out who’s behind the company and so on and so forth and trying to learn a little bit more about him. You know, these people already have a social mission built into their companies. Perhaps the work that you’re doing can align some way with a particular social mission. So, you know, i think it’s an opportunity for you two. Maybe developed, um, uh, some relationship with him. Yeah, most of the time. It’s, private companies, so relationship supply. The companies that are set on our course. I love it. It’s, like it’s, like doing the same kind of research assay. Would foundation wear where they would be court they’re aligned with, and whether you might fit in. Yes, in-kind. What do you got for us? You mentioned a family you mentioned foundation so it’s touch upon that for a moment. If you have not made your annual trust to your local cooperating collections of the foundation center in your in your next the woods it’s time that you do that no, we’re going ahead and get a subscriptions directly to the foundation directory online. So if you have the funds to do it and you do a lot of foundation’s research definitely worth while having that tool in house, but it is available fourth grade if you go to the foundation center or one of their cooperating collections in your community. So what i recommend is to try and focus in instead of the really big foundations in your state, which everybody seems to kind of know today everybody goes, everybody goes, yeah, focus more in on the foundations that are the family foundation’s, even if they do not seem to have a lot of assets and some you will even notice some will come up xero and assets and don’t let that turn you off because if they had gone through the effort of setting up the framework for a sound of private foundation, but there may be, you know, a plan in the future that that family is may be planning to sell business and funding the foundation, and you don’t know what the thinking is behind it and it’s going to get to know them a little bit. So don’t discount the ones that you even see with xero asset, okay? And you trying to find connections between your non-profit and foundations not only terms of mission, but you know, if you’re looking in your state, you’re looking for a board connections two are some kind of some kind of relationship, right board connections, mission over laugh, it could be that they are literally in your county or in your town. So these air opportunity three to try and develop relationships with some of these people don’t forget, i mean, if it’s a family foundation, people behind the whole thing on dh there’s, you know, it’s just happens to be the vehicle by which they are, um, you know, putting all of their philantech through so it’s worthwhile, taking an opportunity to research it there if you don’t have any access, any way of accessing the foundation centers products you could do a similar type search on guide star okay, another case, and as you do your research, don’t be afraid to bring lips of foundation board members and foundation names to your board meeting try to have a board members or, if not at your meeting, circulated some other way, but have your boardmember scrutinizing the foundations that you’ve found that align with your work and start getting people you’re boardmember you know where the where the connections might be, but we gotta leave maria, thank you very much. Happy new year, thank you are joining of thirties and free, you’ll find her at the prospects finding dot com and at maria sinful next-gen takagi what’s the new tax balm for your twenty eighteen fund-raising plan if you missed any part of today’s show, i didn’t think you’d find it on tony martignetti dot com were supported by pursuing online tools to small and mid sized non-profits data driven and technology enables twenty dollars, by pursuing your guiding you beyond the numbers regular piela dot com and tell us credit card payment processing your passive revenue streams. Tony got a last tony killers our creative producers try my family, which is the line producer shoretz social media site. Shadow and its wonderful music. In-kind you give me that? We’re not from the radio. Big non-profit ideas for the odd third, ninety five percent go out and records. What’s not to love about non-profit radio tony gets the best guests check this out from seth godin this’s the first revolution since tv nineteen fifty and henry ford nineteen twenty it’s the revolution of our lifetime here’s a smart, simple idea from craigslist founder craig newmark yeah, insights or no presentation or anything, people don’t really need the fancy stuff they need something which is simple and fast. When’s the best time to post on facebook facebook’s andrew noise nose at traffic is at an all time hyre on nine a, m or p m so that’s, when you should be posting your most meaningful post here’s aria finger ceo of do something dot or ge young people are not going to be involved in social change if it’s boring and they don’t see the impact of what they’re doing. So you got to make it fun and applicable to these young people look so otherwise a fifteen and sixteen year old they have better things to do if they have xbox, they have tv, they have their cell phones. Me dar is the founder of idealist took two or three years for foundation staff to sort of dane. Toe add an email address their card it was like it was phone. This email thing is fired-up that’s why should i give it away? Charles best founded donors choose dot or ge somehow they’ve gotten in touch kind of off line as it were on dno. Two exchanges of brownies and visits and physical gift mark echo is the founder and ceo of eco enterprises. You may be wearing his hoodies and shirts. Tony talked to him. Yeah, you know, i just i’m a big believer that’s not what you make in life. It sze, you know, tell you make people feel this is public radio host majora carter. Innovation is in the power of understanding that you don’t just do it. You put money on a situation expected to hell. You put money in a situation and invested and expected to grow and savvy advice for success from eric sabiston. What separates those who achieve from those who do not is in direct proportion to one’s ability to ask others for help. The smartest experts and leading thinkers air on tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent.

Nonprofit Radio for January 5, 2018: Free Software/Consulting in 2018 & Integrated Tools

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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent on your aptly named host happy new year. I very much hope that you enjoyed time with your family friends for yourself. You know, i i’m always preaching solitude. I hope you got some of that too happy new year, lots of good wishes and i’m glad you’re with me. I’d be forced to endure the pain of gastro mix arria if i had to stomach the idea that you missed today’s show free software and consulting in twenty eighteen oracle net sweet offers valuable products and technical assistance to you what’s available and how do you take advantage? Peggy duvette their head of social impact reveals it all and integrated tools kayman sample ward, our social media contributor and ceo of non-profit technology network, explains the value and challenges of integrating many of your office functions, including social engagement, into a single platform like oracle met sweet and ten is in the midst of integration right now on twenty steak too. You’re twenty eighteen all this month, responsive by pursuant full service fund-raising data driven and technology enabled tony dahna slash pursuant and by wagner, cpas guiding you beyond the numbers wagner, cps dot com tell us turning payment processing into your passive revenue stream. Tony dahna may slash tony tell us here is peggy duvette with free software and consulting in twenty eighteen it’s my pleasure to welcome peggy duvette. She has been a thought leader in technology, social change and women’s leadership for over five, fifteen years as the head of social impact at oracle. In that suite, she is responsible for the donation of the nets wheat products to non-profits located around the world as well as the capacity building programs. Peggy is at peggy duvette. Peggy, welcome to the show. Well, thank you, tony and i have to be here today, it’s a pleasure. And i’m anxious to talk about what? What? What? What’s being offered because this is i want to share this with our listeners because i fear that there’s not great enough awareness on de so i want to do what we can to increase the awareness of everything that’s out there. Um, just just give us a little bit of the history. It was just a year ago. There was ah, nine point three. Billion dollars purchase of net sweet by oracle what what was what was going on there? Why? Why join forces one turned forces? I think you know, our mission is very similar to our recalling a sense that we we’re interested in accelerating the social impact of non-profits all around the world on what better way to deal with hyre recall, if you will so we can complete that mission. We’ve been blessed. And now that we are part of a recall program has grown and we’re able to support non-profits globally again, regardless of the ability to pay. And how do we do that? We do that by all means we give away a dignity donations to our software program, and we also offer capacity building services and probono services all around the world. Yeah, and we’re going to we’re going to have enough time together to get into the details of that on dh how non-profits take advantage? So i i assume this this new relationship is going well. Yes, yes, it has been going very well. First year. Okay, s so you were at you right in that sweet. Sounds like yes. That’s, right? You know, i started my background as an executive director of a nonprofit oppcoll wise earth in the bay area in california, it was a small non-profit under one for five million, and i remember as a needy, a heart it wass to, you know, to look into technology. It was overwhelming when, you know, very technical on remember trying to talk to partners, vendors, you know, leaders in the field, and it was super overwhelming. So when i found out that nest with that, sam was looking for new leadership, like that’s intriguing, you know how friend it eas to, you know, have access to an amazing technology, and then our powers many non-profits to leverage that have been quite a fantastic journey, and that meant, yeah, excellent. And now the latest, of course, the the coming together with with, with oracle, i don’t want to cause a partnership, but collaboration now and and so even greater distribution possibilities and greater possibilities for non-profits so you are responding, working within the social impact. So just before we get into detail about the offerings, just what? What is the mission of social impact within oracle net suite? Sure, our mission is to accelerate. The full impact of non-profit and so fun surprises globally, we got a list of the ability to pay with their signature programs. I mean, to date, we’ve served around a thousand non-profits we’ve offered about ten thousand hours of probono, which is, you know, they couldn’t around one point, five millions of probono hours given to our social impact restrictions and let’s, eso, let’s, go into what the offerings are, i think, for people who are aware that that you know that these donations are out there. I think people think predominately of the software, the products, but but there’s offerings beyond that. Right, i think what you need about necessary call social impact it it’s not just about that techno generation. Well, i mean, that technology is important, you know, when you think of running a non-profit what we want to put more of our resources on a program area, we still need to make sure that we manager data, that we do our report right to abort the quarter and so next is and the rpc sam, it allows you to, you know, run for operations, you know, if i want to think about an example of a social impact metoo non-profit that diverting nets with right now? I mean, i could serve the legal aid to tidy of rochester so it’s a small non-profit that provides probono legal services might in the new york area, they have around fifty employees on dh how did the leverage that street? You know, they basically been able to user accounting, self tour, get the old time insights into the costs and revenue stable toe basically said time in terms of on hardware and mention it. So those kind of services never that sexy to think about, you know, all the back and operations. And how to manage that. But at the end, when you able to spend less time on your record keeping on your back and operations and you can really support the audience that you’re trying to serve. So next witness for informer, you know, its key offering is about helping non-profits focus on the mission so they don’t have to worry about the back and operations. But as we know, you know, undertaking technology chance for another bit of any side, whether you one hundred fifty milion or if you wanted to run, it can be overwhelming. You know, alfred, you tend to jump chanpreet technology, and then you forget that it takes much more than just taking the software. So what was talking to me at the time when i joined the company is the fact that unique kind of the opposition, which is not only, you know, we will help you identify whether net suite is the right software for dignity to foryou operations, but once we’ve identified that, and if we basically affected uto through a program, then you have access to a probono services and a sweet probono offering is very people what we do is we match our employees will are experts in next week with social impact recipients, and every quarter you have access to basically probono i was from employees so it’s, very generous offering from arika net suite and like i said, two days we’ve offered around ten thousand hours of probono yeah, okay, we’re going to go out with our need to take a break shortly, and then we’ll come back and we’ll get into more detail about the especially about the software, but but also the probono in the capacity building, so you need to take a break pursuant, data driven fund-raising field guide that is their newest resource on the listener landing page, which is tony dahna slash pursuant capital p please. There is so much data available to all of us, it’s, you know, feeling like overload if you don’t know how to manage it, if you’re not being thoughtful about data management and we’re talking just about the data that you have internally. So this field guide is designed and will make data less daunting for you. This is what it’s got five high level steps you can take to translate your business objectives into action real world case studies showing you how other non-profit org’s are using data to achieve their fund-raising goals and a worksheet with thought starters to help your team find the right focus and begin building a data driven culture. It’s the data driven fund-raising field guide tony dahna may slash pursuing capital p now back to peggy duvette hi, peggy let’s talk a little more about what the technology offering is aside from a cost accountant costing cost management accounting. I know there’s cr em. What other technology? Ah, it’s helping to manage the back end. Buy-in i think you know what would recommend with technology likeness suite where you can literally, you know, run your whole operation. It’s tough with your financial first. You know, eunice with twenty financial, make sure it meets kind of you day to day operations for management for the board. And then you can expand to c r m to invent tree control to, you know, being a web store. So you get pretty much do it all and, you know, depending on non-profit we serve, they will leverage next week for a different use, obviously. But i think what’s key is because you can. Do it all and a lot of ah non-profit that we serve will tend to be attracted innocents because they have this persistent, you know, so desire to bring it all together into a unified system. So, you know, if i think of food for the hungry in canada, you know, they help comedians and developing nation in africa, asia, and and, you know, at the time they had dispersed zsystems you know, it takes time to maintain eso by basically using nest with a unified system and also take on the e commerce, they’ve been able to basically increase their fund-raising income, spend less money in tow support, but more into fund-raising so they can support more than program, it can be especially cumbersome when there’s not even a disparate programs, but there’s a combination of programs and spreadsheets, you know, trying to manage that way, you know, i see that sometimes and it’s it’s just such a drain on time and efficiency. Duitz yeah, i mean, you need to you need to use the technology that’s out there to help you lorts right, and i think what’s, even more important, you need to write you need to use the right technology because i’ve seen especially for the smaller non-profits maybe under one million, we tend to want to see that free tide would get excited, you know, critical she can, you know, i can use this, but but what i would say over and over is remember, freeze, never free. It takes time to train new staff or you volunteers, but you don’t have any staff dedicated. It takes time to implement it takes time to documenta intimidations and then you know what went stayed in her group is not that you just used next week, but you leverage message foryou, mission that’s where we want to see they used the technology on dh that leads to the second of the three offerings under under social impact. The sweet probono where net sweet employees will actually spend time with you helping you on board and leverage the technology. So let’s, talk about let’s. Talk about what’s available there buy-in yeah. So i think it goes back to what we were discussing, which he’s wants you. You’ve made the decision right with you. Bored with your constituents to undertake any technology. How do you ensure that you leverage that? Technology so it’s past kind of like a date to the operation is how do you insure that the things that happen you could actually make strategic decisions be more efficient with your reporting and so a lot of non-profits decisions from the dignity of the nation applying ana quietly basis, you know, it could be anything from, you know how to import my data into this sweet teo, for example, with canada, they recently had a probono project where they work on the dashboard on, you know, they serve a lot of non-profits that they want to be able to have the dashboard, so they understand where the service is offering are going so again, probono is being used as a way to help diving to some specific operation parts of the business. Ah, and have them understand how they can leverage next week for that piece. How much probono time r ah, are the your employees e-giving each year? What? Is there a requirement? Right? So our company’s global so today we’ve given around ten thousand i was probono right on the quality they sees, you get basically a team of two to three employees that they tend. To give him on twenty hours each. That’s pretty generous. Andi remembers, was the expert something? The biggest opportunity for the perfect is, you know, what do you need? Right? And then we able to match you with ernest it in place. You can then help you. And then, you know, if that first put it works, you can apply again the following quarter, right? This is not just a one time offering. Okay. Okay. And the help that there are that they’re providing is just around use of the the net sweet products. Yes. That’s, right? Yes, that’s, right? I don’t think we do. Also, that might be a little unusual is when people, when non-profit starts being interested in a technology donations, you know, we have a very sore application asking a lot of questions from, you know, you know, what do you intend to do? What problems that you’re trying to stall? You have a sponsor? Do you have dedicated, volunteer, dedicated staff? So we’ll have a lot of questions really prompt the non-profits really think about what it they intend to do, and we also very comfortable saying, hey, you know, did you really think about this maybe you might not be radio you may be really again, it’s very important for us to just ensure that and one does not take a dignity for the sake of taking it, but more liberating. Yeah, okay. And we’re gonna talk about the metoo process shortly, but so, yeah, so we’ll we’ll come to that. Anything else you want to say about the probono a third of this, the social impact offerings that this generous volunteer volunteerism? Yeah, another programs that were recently lunch, which is around our capacity building element is with lunch this year of financial section reading court and what it is as a non-profits kind of apply and get accepted into the program. We bring them into cohorts of, you know, between five to sixteen, you know, five to fifty non-profits and then together, they basically going to go through a twelve with programs where they are going to be learning how to set up the basic financial of next week. And and what did you have to do? This we, you know, over the years as we served? I mean, at the commercial level, we’ve served around twenty five thousand, you know, organizations so we set up a lot of you know we’ve got a lot of learning and ilsen living practices. So we basically does love this training material to have the non-profit leverage our leading practicing, andi so they have all the pre configured options, and they can set up the basic financial. So then after twelve weeks, they can actually go live on the system. And the reason we’ve been financials actually within the cohort can a format is to ensure that non-profit can learn from each other as well. Says that we know is that when you’re known undertaking such a journey, you can be a little overwhelming. And so we built for this program. You know, it has no charge. It’s sound an education, basic, but we do that once a quarter and it’s bean extremely successful and again it’s it’s about, you know, how can we help non-profits field days technical capacity on whether they have a dedicated, paid staff or fall into a run, and this is called sweet capacity. This is the third, yeah, it’s, certain moments difficult financial accelerated, oh, it’s, not called sweet capacity anymore. So we were gonna have many tr capacity is basically a lot of buildings on vehicles and finish that. Okay. Okay. So what else then is available? And so so what you were describing is that’s a twelve week provoc program. And and you just do that once, right? Because that’s really the onboarding and the implementation of yourself. Is that right? You think about it. You know, perfect scenario is your high. You get accepted, you know, you have access to, you know, our license, you know, for free to a base in mission program. Right? So you get the license, then you apply for financials. Actually, with a cohort get accepted within twelve weeks, you go live on the system with running a basic financial, and then you can start, you know, applying for probono if you want to start leveraging so the dashboard or looking to other aspects of necessary that you want to start using. Okay. And reiterate that you know, there any reason why non-profit might be interested in that tweet? You know, one could be that they are next. And, you know, they want a software that can start helping render financials, right? Yeah. Get off springstead. Yeah, another reason could be going from quickbooks. Also having this existence have been extend that wanted to be able to scale and have one basically a doctor that can do it on. Yeah, and quickbooks especially, you know, that’s not made for non-profits that’s made for businesses. Yeah. Yeah. All right, all right. Um okay. So let’s, let’s move then. So we’ve talked about the three different components of what social impact offers. What let’s talk about how you apply and what’s in what’s involved the application. You start, you start online so you could apply to two different ways. We have a partnership with a text. I hope you know, listeners here’s about takes up it’s a wonderful organizations that provide a technology of discounted rates. So if you’re interested in that suite oh, we also for like, a minute on brown toto, the software that can be discussed later. But you can go through text soup and apply there. Or you could go directly to a website as the nets without com slash social impact. Andi, you would kick on, apply it’s a pretty so application again, you know it’s important to us, that the non-profit krauz understand what it means to undertake a technology chance, so we’ll ask you a lot of questions around, you know, what problem are you trying to solve? Are you really to undertake that technology change and you have the difficult capacity, and once you apply, you know, we’ll attend me. Traitor will contact you, and then you’ll be in touch with basically people in so short, that group to discuss a can of ah ah, software. And they give you a little. Yeah, right. So so there is going to be a personal aspect of this somebody’s actually gonna talk to you. That’s, right? That’s, right? Yes. Okay. So common thing too. Yes, different talking to somebody because, you know, we understand again that non-profit please can vary depending on the size and the mission. S so it was very important for us to be able to create that personal connection. And we’re lucky to be able to do that and have the resources to do that. Andi, i want to repeat the earl it’s it’s, not sweet dot com slash social impact, right? Fact? Or of course, you know, i think it’s interesting. That okay? And you know, if i want to think about some of the data we’ve collected over the years, summers self-funding mission recipients last year eighty seven to ten off a non-profit you know, seekers were saying that next week was going them to do things that they could not do otherwise with the size of the staff and budget so small. Non-profit i could not normally afford, you know, technician that left with are finally able to do things that they couldn’t have never twinned up thirty also, this ability to divert resources to focus on your mission instead of focusing on the complexity that is true impact when you get statements like that, that we’re able to do things that we were not able to do. Pre-tax win, yeah, yes, all right, so and what what types of organizations so you’re looking for when we touched on this a little bit, but let’s, let’s flush it out. What? What kind of challenges should people be able to document it? Sounds like size is irrelevant. Tell us little more about what? What you’re looking for when you review read those applications, right? Yeah, no, totally so yes, size is a real event and it’s important to us because we really want to support non-profit oh, non-profits regardless of their ability to pay and so it’s not perfect at a budget, you know, we’ll have a team that can help them if they don’t have a budget. We also have the social group that can help them, you know, again, it goes back to why, you know, why do non-profit need technology for the operation again? I think what’s important? Are you trying to solve? You know, do you have a problem? That’s accepting emissions and your delivery ofthe program? And if that’s so you need more transparency young, exponential, you know, i’d be able to have reports to board on the time you matter are used for countless hours creating those reported yes, every color, every boardmember sweet, definitely in the right position for you, andi. So, you know, we will ask you those questions for the application, nothing that will ask you as well, you know, is what kind of system are you currently using? Because if you’re using this system, i’m not a powerful, but you’re not leveraging this. Maybe you’re into another system that you want average might. Not be the right thing on, so we’ll definitely ask you about. You know what system you’re using to generate you, but your actual, too. When your perils that compass, if people all of that on dh, then we’ll ask you about some of the challenges that you’re willing to work on. You know, with your staff, a newborn. Is it important that the that the board is involved in this process? I wouldn’t sit in for its importance, i think what’s more important is whether the person that’s interested in doing that changes is an executive monster we’ve seen over the years, especially when it’s technology implementation that it’s important to have an executive bouncer meaning either add management level or boat level that support kind of the shit of technology because, again, it takes a lot of effort to intimate and then to train and volunteers. Yeah, it’s ok. Eso having a sponsor and it sounds like, you know all this leads me to believe, you know, you don’t want this software whether donated, have paid for, um, languishing on dh not being leveraged that’s, right? And if you look at, you know, at and ten right and ten released a report every year, i think that the failure redder, contextually implementations one fifty percent in the u s mom, i know this is why it’s so important to us as a people fear of the education that they really ask themselves the question, right? How many hours is the person responsible to manage intimidation is willing to allocate, right? I mean, you know what? You could have spent training. And documenting the implementation i value we know in the nonprofit sector people who take right there’s a lot of changing that you don’t want to invest in a new technology, and then a month later, as that person leaves yeah, right, there’s no continuity. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we know in ten. Very well on non-profit radio amy sample ward, their ceo is our social media contributor she’s on each month, right? Amy is ordered for nine in-kind is actually literally going through an implementation with that right now. Really? Oh, excellent. Oh, actually, right next time, maybes on i’m gonna quiz you about how it’s going. Okay, outstanding that’s it well, it’s a great organization to smartly leverage technology that they should be able to give you some wonderful testimonials further on, we bless. Like i said, we have non-profits oppcoll size, you know, sex of global, which is a pretty good politic organizations, right? We have, you know, we may have that legal aid society in russia. So that’s tiny again interest is, you know, if you’re ready, we here and we could to support your the foundation center is another good example there they’re very big throughout. The country i’ve spoken, they’re here at the headquarters in new york foundation center as a ah uses that uses you extensively. That’s, right. That is an excellent excellent. All right, we have about a minute and a half left. Peggy, what do you want to leave us with to encourage non-profit t seek you out? I mean, nothing of all. I think of the industry and heart technology’s evolving. You know, as some prosecutors, we need to leverage better technologies for missions. Right? So i want her and critter leaders out there, tio, you know, to the diligent work explore, you know, really explore what problems they’re trying to solve it. They can really, you know, ken of the back and operations. So they get the commission, and our tony street is here. You know, we’re here to help the sector. We’re here for the long term and would be delighted to help you. So that journey if you if you wish and desire to do so with us. All right. Excellent. Peggy, thank you very much. My pleasure. Thank you very much. She’s at peggy duvette dvt. And again, if you want to apply, you can either do it through text soup or at net st. Dot com slash social impact. We need to take a break. Wagner, cpas here is a testimonial quote. I was new at my position when i began working with wagner cpas. My confidence has grown knowing that i can rely on the professionals at wagner to answer any questions and make recommendations that will ensure the success of our non-profit parenthetical. Here we see the sea piela going beyond the numbers close parenthetical. We were given a sound advice enabling us to increase investment income while at the same time protecting assets. Parenthetical here was seethe see piela going way beyond the audit that they were hired to do. Close parenthetical. I trust and respect our audit team and look forward to their annual visit. End quote. No need for parasitical parenthetical because we just ended the quote. And here we see this pepe doing so well that their client looks forward to their return in the next audit season. This is from an unnamed but nonetheless reputable midsize midwest religious organization. So check out rechner. If you use them, then you can expect them to go beyond the numbers for you. You’ll start looking forward to your orders. Is that realize that even possible you’re looking forward to your audit season? Well, mr or miss midwest religious organization says it israel it can be you. You know you can trust the word religious organization. They’re not gonna lie. If you don’t trust them, you can trust me. And if you don’t trust me, then there’s your life. Your life has no meaning. I regret i feel bad. I feel awful for you. Trust us. Trust us. Here. It non-profit radio. All right, so we’re a little i got a little off the path there, but the point is whether cpas way beyond the numbers, you know, look at how they’re coddling this client. It’s. Amazing. You can work with heat coach tomb, you coach tomb has been on the show twice. You could check him out to ten. Seventeen and a eight, seventeen. Fifteen two shows he’s been on weinger cps dot com. Now, time for tony’s. Take two all this month on non-profit radio it’s, your twenty eighteen planning starting today and for all of january were all about your twenty eighteen plans. Would you like free business coaching in? Twenty eighteen we just heard about free software and an implementation and capacity building consulting about business marketing coaching in twenty eighteen we’re goingto have guessed from score tell you all about that what is the new tax law mean for your twenty eighteen fund-raising plan? Jean takagi is going to parse it all out. Maria simple will have her twenty eighteen plan. Any sample ward we back later this month with her twenty eighteen plan. Andi, i’m going to do start your plan giving in twenty eighteen. I said that wrong. I’m going to do start your plan giving in twenty eighteen emphasis on the wrong part of that sentence. And i should’ve been on the on the subject of instead of the somme junked of many of these are pre recorded. Oh, yes. On a day where we had studio technical problems. So i apologize in advance for the poor sound quality. I mean, they’re horrible, but they’re not up to ah, not up to the typical non-profit radio standards all this month, your twenty eighteen plans, all you need to do is listen. That’s it. That is tony steak too. And speaking of listeners we gotta do. The live love it’s going out it’s going it’s rampant west palm beach, florida. Portland, oregon. Framingham, massachusetts. White plains, new york, germany, guten tag son ramon, california, xero oshima, tokyo and toko ri zawa, japan. Konnichiwa! Rosenberg, texas. Lansdale, pennsylvania. Tampa, florida. Woodbridge, woodbridge, new jersey you’re pissing me off. I want you to identify yourself. I demand it. You’d identify or stopped listening. You are so under my skin. It’s unbelievable. Woodbridge, new jersey now live! Listen love out to woodbridge, the netherlands live listen love to you and the united kingdom of course, i don’t know whether it’s ah england, northern ireland, scotland, wales by population, of course it would be englund, but that’s that’s what? The probability can’t be certain united kingdom live listener love to you wherever whichever nation you are in the podcast pleasantries. Thank you so much for being part of our podcast audience know the vast majority of you, it’s, probably like two thirds or so are catching us on itunes, and then stitch is number two and that drops down to, like eight percent or so. So it’s a big difference between number one or number two and then lots of small podcast platform’s doesn’t matter which everyone you’re you’re ah acquiring non-profit radio from pleasantries to you and the affiliate affections to our am and fm stations throughout the country. Another one maybe coming on. I don’t want to jinx it. Another one may be coming. Yeah, yeah. In any case for the current am and fm affiliate listeners affections to you and chef award she’s here, she’s, our social media contributor. Yes, standby, please. While i give you your august introduction that you you’re deserving of hyre a zoo because you’re in august personage. So you deserve in august introduction, our social media contributor and ceo of intend the non-profit technology network. Her most recent car, third book, social change. Anytime everywhere about online multi-channel engagement, you’ll find her at amy, sample, ward, dot or ge and at amy rs ward hello and happy new year. Yeah, happy twenty eight, thank you very much. Thank you for joining us for amy’s twenty eighteen plan. Yeah, it makes sense, and i had a segment called amy’s twenty eighteen plants figured it made sense to bring you on and do it. Does that sound that sound logical? You’re the aptly named you know, you’re the aptly named guest for the amy’s twenty eighteen plan segment that’s all i’m saying so that sounds great. So you had good holidays first? Yeah, good holidays. That and an office was closed, so everybody was taking the whole last week of the year off, eyes the week between d’oh um, okay, so let’s talk about well, you’re you’re gonna be i didn’t mean to confuse you or the listeners. You’re going to be joining us for amy’s twenty eighteen plan that’s later this month. Today we’re talking about integrated tools. Sorry about that. Did iraq? I could use myself. Sometimes you confuse me a little, but i figured i would just roll with it. You wanted to have i amuse myself and also confused myself. Now, of course, today we’re talking about the integrated tools was confusing with tony. Stick to what i just said you’re gonna be on for amy’s twenty eighteen plan that’s later this month. I believe that’s going to be twenty sixth of january. Okay, so first i have to ask. You know, i was i was pleasantly surprised when i was talking to peggy that was obviously pre recorded, but to find out that in ten is taking advantage of the oracle, that sweet offerings. So how’s it going well? We were not up and running in it yet. Cohort programs that peggy was talking about eyes, something that antenna has participated in. And in what is probably not recommended for a technology migration, we had a staffing change for the staff person who was leading the micro wave. Just she and i talked about that. I’m sorry she and i talked about that. You need tohave you need to have consistency across. Exactly. So what was really beneficial, though, is that the consistency across ended up actually really being the probono team because they had been a part of, you know, facilitating the cohort that anton was a part of in addition to a number of other organizations, kind of going through the setup and decision making process for how you want to implement the tool. Andi, all of their process include kind of worked bucks, sir. Worksheets. You know where you’re kind of tracking? Ok, this is how we want our piano report toe work or this is the new chart of accounts were going to use, you know, whatever you’re putting into the system, you’re kind of tracking that and work sheets. So we had both documentation and the probono team that were consistent, even though the staff lead changed during the process, which i think is pretty unique for a software migration that people may be going through, and we’re now hopefully, in a month we’ll be, you know, over and using that as the primary system versus existing systems were getting close, all right, that’s, a that’s a big deal than this migration tio this integrated platform that’s going to be a big deal that’s an important time for you. Well, at least for now, it will be just as integrated as our existing solutions are. It will just hopefully be more dynamic and robust with that data management that it has and all of that, we use it primarily for the financial accounting, even though next week itself has many different. Okay, i see. So you are. You’re integrated now you’re on a platform, whatever. It’s integrated now, but you’re looking for more robust sounds like data data analysis report. Okay, excellent. Excellent. Now one of the things that she asked do you feel that there’s anything like technology wise that holds you back programmatically at ten? Yeah or no, you might not feel that way. I mean, wait, we try really hard to not let our technology dictates our programmatic decision, which is a challenge. That’s not the world that technology is built in right technology has built with the assumption that, like, once you use our software, everything will be better, because of course we’ve thought of everything, and we know exactly how your data should be structured and all of that which any of us, that our users no that’s, never the case, but so we try really hard to not let technology dictate our program decisions or plans, and i would say that then creates more of the challenges for us because we are we’re not saying, oh, what could this tool do? Cool, let’s do that were saying, what do our community members need? What we want? What do our programs necessitate? Oh, well, way don’t have a way to do that with our technology, so we run into more challenges that way, and then try and you know find solutions or create solutions. And honestly, i think a staff position that so many organizations don’t have that in ten does have it means we are able to in house create solutions with those problems come up is that we have a web developer in addition to a nice director on staff, so together they can, you know, work with staff to figure out what it is we’re trying to dio identifies cem, you know, possible solutions and then actually go build them and implement them in to our you know, whether it’s our website, that single sign on khun work for this tool we’re trying to add or you whatever it is. Ok? Yes, i see the value of a web developer, a coder, someone who codes and designs web solutions. You have that. You have an employee. Does that? Yeah. Okay, exactly. I would say most of what? What? There. Building and designing our integration. They’re figuring out okay. Well, if this data exists in the database but we wantto be able to make sure this part of the website is dynamic or we want to able to send an email message, you know, as soon as somebody takes that actions. How do we get all of these different systems? Talk to each other and that’s what they’re designing and implementing. All right, so, so consistent with that. No, we were talking about integrated tools, andi, we’ve already, you know, scratch the surface of it. But anything more you want to add about what, what the value of this is. I mean, how how robust it can be when you’ve got the right sweet together and data analysis. And now everything the platform supposed be doing is is humming. Yeah, i mean, there, it’s just so hard for me to try and and justify it because it’s hard for me, tio imagine not wanting everything to be integrated. You know, the power of knowing that all of your staff are on ly doing the things that humans can dio and one of the things that a computer or your website or your database continue to not work in their time doing those things. It’s huge, you know, and it means that they can, instead of having to and her data or try and, you know, run a report and put it into excel and do a bunch. Of things to figure out their answer that those things can be automated, then you know that community members are just going to get the email notifications that they need or the reminders that they need automatic when they need to get them with all the information that’s correct and that staff are there just to respond when somebody replies that email and says, oh, i can’t make it to the class. What can ideo great? That staff person only spent five minutes today, you know, helping somebody who needs to change their registration vs two hours, trying to figure out who to send a notification to which information they need. You know, i think it’s just non-profits are chronically talking about how we’re understaffed. We don’t have enough time, so let the robot do as much of the work for you as they can so that the few staff you have in the few dollars you have are going to the most important work. Yes, please leverage technology. I mean that’s. Why that’s? Why places like and ten and ten dot org’s that’s. Why it exists tech soup. You know the oracle net suite idealware. I mean, this is why these organisations exist to help you leverage technology i could be on such a soap box if we don’t have only two minutes left no, but you so that you know, i think for some organizations that feels really overwhelming on one side because it just feels like, how are we ever going to get all these presents talk to each other, but on the other side and that’s kind of a technical project management solution, right? Like, well, let’s, just figure out how we get them to talk to each other on the other side, i also hear from from organizations that well, if we automate things and they won’t be personal and that’s really what you know our community expects from us on dh, we’re just not going to automate things because it’ll lose. It’ll feel, you know, generic, and they’ll lose that human touch. I really don’t believe that. I mean, unless you’re on ly able to write emails that sound like a robot wrote them, you know, you can still write a very personal sounding, human sounding message and have that be the notification, you know, it doesn’t mean you need to be automating like your own personal outreach. But just all of those standardised things. They could still be written nicely. You can still do a be testing on them. You could still, you know, quarterly. Go in and say let’s, change the subject lines and see if he’s get better results. You can still do a lot to make them better and better and better. But you are not manually writing them every day. Yeah, you can. You can automate with personalization, the things they’re not. These things are not mutually exclusive. Okay? And we’re gonna go out for a break. When we come back, i’m going to ask you if you can take off a couple more things that you feel machines should be doing. You mentioned e mail or email? You mentioned data entry. Maybe you could take off a couple of things that even, you know, you know, if it’s in ten or not, but things that common routine things that machines should be doing for us when and so we can reduce this burden of feeling understaffed all the time. All right, take a break. Tell us. Credit card and payment processing. Check out the video. It’s at tony. Dahna slash tony, tell us and this video is going to run you through how businesses that you would refer to tell us, make the switch over there how you get fifty percent of the revenue that tell us earns remember that’s a that’s a that’s revenue with a long tail, fifty percent of everything tell us gets from the businesses you refer one hundred percent satisfaction rate, the pressure match guarantee that they’ve got and remember as a non-profit radio listener, you go beyond that, you get two hundred fifty dollars, if tell us cannot save a business money on its fees. Um then today, easy out if a business isn’t satisfied, but tell us has a hundred percent satisfaction rate among the businesses and non-profits so, you know, you don’t have to worry about that, but it’s there think about the businesses that this makes sense for and after you watch it, send them to the video like local supermarket, and i hope they have a large organic section at least lots of produce organic produce choices, thegame shop, warcraft, league of legends i don’t even talking about the liquor store i like when they have limes at the checkout that’s very, very convenient for my gin and tonics. I appreciate that the restaurant’s if the service is good, don’t i don’t like abrupt or an attentive servers st avoid those places, get them to watch the video after you watch it. Ask if they’ll consider switching to tell us and this would be revenue for you for the long term each month. Tony dahna em, eh slash tony, tell us for the video now, let’s, go back to amy sample ward. We’re talking about integrated tools. I put her on the spot. But she’s such a superstar that i know more pushes the ceo of intense. So i bet she’s probably got more examples that we have time for things. Amy, what should machines be doing for us that you feel non-profits are not leveraging. Well, a big one. I’m just thinking about, you know, so much of the non-profit radio community is fundraisers. Ah, huge one that i think a lot of organizations don’t take advantage of it, letting your data, whether that’s, your website or your database, et cetera do some of that predictive thinking for you and then just send you, you know, if they don’t automation isn’t just focused on automating things for your community. This is also automating things for yourself and your staff. So sending you a notification of hey it’s been six months since the donation from x y z you know you could put in these these are our lead pearly donors. Hey it’s been too long since the last date. Yeah here’s your reminder to go, you know, asked him out to lunch or something that i d’oh because i found really helpful and then then we don’t have a lot of really high dollar donations. And when when we do have those there’s, you know normally more of our relationship there and all of that, but any time there’s a donation, even if it’s a one dollar donation, i have set up a person so that when the person who made bad donation gets like the, you know, the normal system thank you, message and all that i’m i’m actually bc seed so i can reply to it and add a personal message on top and almost, you know, easily ninety percent of the time people then respond to that right away and it turns into hey let’s set up a call or i would love to see it with that event. We’re both going teo et cetera, and it really helps with that relationship building. But i let the computer tell me i didn’t spend, you know every week have to remember to go into the database and run a query to see if anybody’s donated as soon as they donate. I’m bc feed on the email that thanks for that so little pieces that that again focused my energy on the relationship side and not on running the numbers and, you know, exporting a report from the database every week so that you’re that you’re on time and even that and even then you wouldn’t have to do it every day, every hour. Teo to be as prompt as the bcc reminder that the bcc thatyou get yeah, okay that’s an awesome one. Alright, what help us but i because when you another one that we use a lot of here is automating. This is going to feel much more technical, technical than the last suggestion, but automating a lot of sinks between our different systems, even though that data isn’t necessarily impacting what they displayed on the website or shows up in the online community, we still want to make sure that our central database has at any moment all the right data, comprehensively across, you know, a single community member, so we’ve automated a lot of data sinks again, even though, you know, i’m sure that some people would say it’s not necessary, because, it’s, just, you know, that data isn’t technically going anywhere, controlling anything it’s really important for us that if we go the database and we look up tony martignetti we know everything that you’re doing so that we don’t just say, oh, well, doesn’t look like tony’s ever participated actually, you have all this activity over here say, in one of our online group, we want to make sure we see all of that, so we’ve automated a lot of those sinks, and the benefit of that is that we can also then set up loss of dynamic, we would say dynamic cleary’s, but technically segments so that when we design, say, a new email campaign over in the other channel, we could query against all kinds of really rich pivetti history. Have you registered for events? Have you donated are you remember? They could say, are you somebody that regularly posts in the discussion group and have attended online event? You know, a way we can more realistically engage with you? Because we know really what? Ugo yeah, and it’s all it’s all carry a ble all these attributes are queria ble. So you, khun hyper define the type of person you want toe send this new campaign too, exactly, and to be merry wonky about it. And maybe we could talk about this some other time, but and ten has a kind of four outcome impact evaluation plan, and in one one of those outcome areas is that and tens work and impact is increasing the number of what we call technology champions in organizations. So it doesn’t matter what your title is, but it’s people who, you know kind of understand that technology is central to what they mean to do, regardless of what team they’re on and that they’re comfortable managing it, making decisions and all the things that intense trying todo i had to create some sort of measurement around how many quote unquote technology champions there are we have created on algorithm that has a different point values for different activities that you’ve done within ten, some of them expire after a week, some of them expire after years with the most hyre later so it’s a very, very involved, dynamic algorithm, and because we have a central data repository that brings in all of those different activities that youve done with us across different systems were then able tto have a rich algorithm that says, actually, here is the number of people we consider attacks champion instead of saying, well, we intend wants to measure our impact. So i guess how many people came to the ntc, right and feeling really limited by system because we’ve integrated them were ableto have what we think is a much more kind of realistic you yeah, yeah, yeah, i mean, the number of attendees and we always talk about that, i always ask you and and thankfully the trajectory is always rising, but that’s really a vanity metric. You could have twenty, five hundred people at a conference and lousy speakers and there wasn’t much engagement, and the food was terry. I mean, right down to the food is poor and the the calendar wasn’t. Well organized, the communications were poor. The wifi didn’t work. But we have twenty, twenty, eight hundred people were had twenty, five hundred last year, so our impact is better. No. Yeah. Okay. That’s all right, all right. Let’s, move to some of the challenges. You know, i hope we’ve i hope we’ve covered motivation for god’s sake. You know, if you are always like amy said, if you are thinking that you are understaffed all the time, you just don’t have enough people to do the things that you need to do, then use it. Call on these organizations once i ticked off before and ten oracle net sweet idealware tech soup, let them help you with technology. And so that your your staff can like amy said, focus on what onley humans khun do and get the machine’s doing that. The routine wrote stuff that you don’t realize is routine and wrote and it’ll free up time and you won’t be understaffed. Gosh, you know, i feel like joe scarborough was on, so yeah, you know, i think what comes up often for organizations, at least in the end and community is once everything and you could think about this. And you know any other kind of area of your life once everything is integrated and tied together like a car, you know, when something seems to break, it can often time, especially for an organization who has relied on outside experts or probono services, etcetera to set them up, it can be hard or feel very dante nw to diagnose. Well, what is the part that’s broken right on. Sometimes we erroneously and problem solve that right to figure out. Okay, well, even if we have a suspicion of what we think is broken, how do we solve it? If again, it’s still part of this connected? Yeah. And sometimes we erroneously blame, blame technology or erroneously blame people because we we haven’t really adequately tested whether where the real problem is, and then we go down a wormhole chasing something that’s, not the real cause of the problem. All right, directly. And, you know, i would just remind folks that even if it does feel daunting, like we have all this integrated systems and now something is broken, i would still argue that you’re in a better position to try and have ah, quick fix kind. Of band aid work around and then create a better solution in an integrated system set up than you are if you have isolated systems, because what does that mean in a world where you have isolated systems? If something breaks that entire tool, whether it’s housing data or messages or whatever is currently out right in an integrated system, you mean you think of it like your body, right? Like one arm doesn’t feel great right now, but it’s part of your whole body, you can adjust the way you walk or list with your other arm or whatever, in in in a totally independent system set up. You would just say, okay, well, that arm is now on, and maybe it’ll come back, maybe it won’t, because you don’t have your not ableto leverage everything else. I’m sorry we have to leave it there. She’s, our social media contributor ceo of inten she’s at amy rs ward. Thank you so much, amy. Thank you. Next week, free coaching in twenty eighteen and maria’s twenty eighteen plan. If you missed any part of today’s show, i beseech you, find it on tony martignetti dot com were supported by pursuing online tools for small and midsize non-profits data driven and technology enabled. Twenty dahna slash pursuant wagner, sepa is guiding you beyond the numbers. Weinger cps dot com tellers, credit card payment processing, your passive revenue stream. Tony dahna slash tony tell us our creative producers. Claire miree off sam liebowitz is the line producer. Shows social media is by susan chavez thiss wonderful music is by scott steiner. Brooklyn with me next week for non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent go out and be green. What’s not to love about non-profit radio tony gets the best guests check this out from seth godin this’s the first revolution since tv nineteen fifty and henry ford nineteen twenty it’s the revolution of our lifetime here’s a smart, simple idea from craigslist founder craig newmark insights orn presentation or anything? People don’t really need the fancy stuff they need something which is simple and fast. When’s the best time to post on facebook facebook’s andrew noise nose at traffic is at an all time hyre on nine am or eight pm so that’s when you should be posting your most meaningful post here’s aria finger ceo of do something dot or ge young people are not going to be involved in social change if it’s boring and they don’t see the impact of what they’re doing so you gotta make it fun and applicable to these young people look so otherwise a fifteen and sixteen year old they have better things to do if they have xbox, they have tv, they have their cell phones me dar is the founder of idealised took two or three years for foundation staff to sort of dane toe, add a email address their card. It was like it was phone. This email thing is right and that’s why should i give it away? Charles best founded donors choose dot or ge somehow they’ve gotten in touch kind of off line as it were on dh and no two exchanges of brownies and visits and physical gifts. 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Nonprofit Radio for December 22, 2017: Recruiting Your Next CEO

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My Guest:

Dennis Miller: Recruiting Your Next CEO

“As a board member of a nonprofit organization, the most important responsibility you are likely to assume will be to hire your chief executive officer.” So starts the book, “A Guide To Recruiting Your Next CEO.” Whether you’re on a board or work with one, you need to know what’s what for this critical duty. Author Dennis Miller walks us through.

 

 


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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, i’m glad you’re with me. I’d get slapped with a diagnosis of cattle lep c if you tried to hypnotize me into the idea that you missed today’s show recruiting your next ceo as a board member of a nonprofit organization, the most important responsibility you are likely to assume will be the hyre your chief executive officer. So starts the book a guide to recruiting your next ceo, whether you’re on a board or work with one, you need to know what’s what for this critical board duty author dennis miller returns to walk us through on twenty state too next month’s non-profit radio we’re sponsored by pursuant full service fund-raising data driven and technology enabled tony dahna slash pursuant and by wagner. Sepa is guiding you beyond the numbers wittner, cpas, dot com you’re not a business you’re non-profit appaloosa accounting software designed for non-profits non-profit wizard dot com tell us turning payment processing into your passive revenue stream tony dot m a slash tony tell us i’m glad that i can welcome dennis miller back then a c miller he’s, a strategic leadership coach and executive search consultant with more than thirty five years experience working with non-profit board leadership and chief executives across the country. He’s, managing director of the non-profit search group, an executive recruiting firm. His latest book, his fifth, is a guide to recruiting your next ceo. The executive search handbook for non-profit boards you’ll find dennis and his book at dennis c miller dot com he’s at dennis c miller and i’m very glad that his book brings him back to non-profit radio. Welcome back, dennis c miller happy to be back, tony way happy well happened years coming up. Yes, stopping here. That’s appropriate. I’m sorry. Thank you. And to you what does the sea foreign dennis, c miller, dot com and charles that’s my father’s name. So, so many dennis mellows and grammar school in high school, we put my seeing and i’m very proud to be a similar dennis charles. All right, you don’t mind if i don’t call you tennessee miller the whole hour, though, i just call me yet that it’s anything you’re like. Okay, now. Dennis overviewing i just have to be it has to be anymore denigrating the dentist, then it’s fine, now you’re by phone, you’re in, you’re in los angeles, is that right? Yeah, i’m actually in the los angeles area of isn’t that it’s a business appear this week and now we’re spending time. My wife and i went our two sons on their families and grandson out here and los angeles and heading up to santa monica santa monica pier, right after the show. So good. All right, well, we won’t hold you up. In fact, if you want take off now, we can just back the whole thing. Did you do you need to go public transportation is going to leave in five minutes or something or you’re okay. You’re okay for the hour. Okay. Now remember the last time you were here? You almost had a heart attack. You were running down the street. You were late. Your your, um your cheeks were rosy. Your heavy breathing. You needed a few minutes to take deep breaths. So now you’ve after to go to los angeles. And this way you can call him by phone. Well, okay, you don’t. Worry about running running to the studio. Okay, okay. You didn’t have a heart attack. You know what i was saying? I really have no salmon. Naralo were had a regular. You may have. No, you did. You had a high. You’re definitely out of my heart because your face was red. All right, why do we need this book? Why are you causing trouble with this tome? Well, think about it that there’s probably over a million more more than a million non-profits around the country and with the number of people that are just paid to retire over the next five plus years on any research, uh, just staggering sometimes close a seventy five percent. The ah the vast majority of people went into the non public sector and leadership positions where baby boomers from the sixties and seventies went to sort of the cultural change and wanted to commit themselves to having a big impact in the communion. So there’s, a lot of retirement going on, and the the biggest responsibility that a member of the board can have is selecting the next ceo. And then on top of that, when you think about the challenges of the environment in the non public sector, the leadership conferences have been dramatically changing, so it’s an important time for board members to understand what is needed to recruit the next ceo that’s why i wrote the book ok, seventy five percent turnover in the next ten years we’re going to have i’m probably less i mean, it’s, it’s quite a bit, if you think about people that grew up in the sixties and seventies, where you know it’s now two thousand, you know, seventeen and people in their sixties and thinking about stepping down another part of life and a lot of recruitment gonna be needed get latto leadership so it’s going to be required for this sector. Now, one of the opening questions is whether we should go this recruitment alone or hyre a such consultant now you’re you’re biased. You say that in the book you’re biased, but, you know, can you weigh the pros and cons for us? You know, so i’m biased certainly wasn’t if someone if someone wants to go about it a lot, i think the book will help them with that for sure you want to go in alone is this year. You have people on the board or staff with the expertise and recruiting. Do you have the time commitment that’s going to be needed for the board members, too? Not only identify the profile of the next candidate, but spending the time and now is reaching out and screening candidates. So there’s a lot of work involved that lay out those except in the search committee. Klaus is here. I think that what a lot of people doing today is realizing that, you know, whatever the figures that they’re going to be paying and most trees probably in area someplace between twenty to thirty five percent are cases. Twenty five that the advertiser over five years and sometimes really not that high. And yet. So you want to have an expertise this like anything else? If he needed a lawyer of financial account, you’d be hiring someone. It’s a challenging thing to go about on your own and the other aspect, tony, uh, for people who want to go about on their own is by just posting sort of adds a social media. Whatever you going toe on ly get the people that are looking for a job. And you know no either how good they are. However performing they are. Well, if they’re happy, a search from is going to recruit people that are not looking for that job. And that’s part of what you want. What i have that those percentages thatyou quoted that’s of the first year cash compensation. Is that yes. So someone makes ah a position whether the ceo our c f o r development amglobal to say the position i was one hundred thousand dollars. You know, the average three is going to be, you know, twenty five thousand dollars. But if this day five years it’s five thousand dollars a year which comes out to be about a hundred dollars a week or twenty hours of any and, you know the thing about it’s, probably the smartest investments that aboard would want to make. Okay, noah particularly because the right person and they stay for a period of time. It it’s okay. And i guess the main advantage of going on your own is your saving that fee. Well, you saving the fee, but you also, you know, better be prepared for the time that your board is gonna have that so that you poisoned cons here, but most most really good organizations will use the search from for certain keys positions. Okay, okay. Um, let’s say we just have about a minute before ah, first break, dennis so let’s, just identify that this ceo change is not something necessarily to be feared. I mean, just in a minute or so, this could be an opportunity, a great opportunity. Well, that’s, how you look at him and i were doing a search right now when we’ve got the finalists been seen by the search committee and in beginning this is that this is the first time this organization has used a search firm. And, you know, they admitted they made some mistakes in the past. But you’ve got to go from, you know, not a crisis, too. This is a phenomenal opportunity, too. I just take it, get a new leader. But i have an assessment of your organization and have some advice and give me and people get on the board. And we’ve been here for quite a while. Or fairly new it’s a exciting time to take a first look atyou organization. So it if the glass is half full it’s i look at it is very exciting times one organization, most clients feel the same way, all right? And we’re gonna talk about that. That assessment right after this right now. Time to take a break pursuant. Proven strategies for stewardship. That is their oh so timely webinar replay for you stewardship strategies, because lots of people giving right this quarter this month how do you keep them giving year after year after year? You know how costly it is to lose donors and replace them. We know nationwide that donor attrition is around seventy five percent annually. Sad that’s ah that’s supposed to be ah, supposed to be our president tweeting sad. But if you have to tell the judge, you have to tell what it is then it doesn’t work. Ah, but but maybe it did work. I’m not there to listen to you laugh. So maybe it worked out fine, so i didn’t need to. Rachel and kathy are going to give you examples of top thank you’s. They talk about automation without sacrificing personalization. They have free templates for you to use. And if you don’t mind, i would like to throw in that the value. Of the personal touch of handwritten notes for your special donors, all proven stewardship strategies. You’ll find that webinar at tony dahna em, a slash pursuant capital p now, back to dennis miller and his book, recruiting, ah, guide to recruiting your next ceo and dennis similar so let’s, talk about that. That possibility for assessment. You, uh, you say that you might. I considered doing strategic planning. I guess if you have time before getting into the recruiting process for the next ceo. Yeah, well, the you know, the question always is, you know what comes first, right? Chicken or the egg? Tony, do your hyre our ceo or d’you hyre our chief development officer before you have a plan and and kind of it’s up it’s up to the client, the organization, but give you a couple examples, whites sort of better toe at least an idea of where you want to go and what you want to achieve. So let’s say, uh, you want it, you go out and hyre ceo hoping that day will build your plan and let some party of plan is to be more involved in philanthropy maur involved in cultivating. So seeing donors? What if that seo hee just hyre doesn’t have that experience will now you’re stuck. So what if your needs is to grow? You’re bored and you, seo yi sa doesn’t have that so one of the things that i recommend the clients is that’s not necessarily happen to have a full blown strategic plan, but certainly it’s a good idea to have a real sense of your strategic vision where you had it, where you want to head, what some of the big strategic goals you have, um, what things that you need to get done, and then obviously it’s much easier to in to identify that the characteristics on the qualities and experience of the ceo. So you bring someone on board who is the right cultural fit for your organization. So that’s, why it’s important to take a look at kind of way you want to go before you just went on board? You say that if you’re not going to do a full, full blown strategic plan planning process, you want to at least identify what your organizational goals are? Yeah, i mean, i think there are some people that, you know don’t do oppcoll bonem metoo plan, i think that you could do that, but i think more importantly, uh, what you want to do and a good search from what we do is we do sort of an assessment of where you’re at in your life, uh, cycle as an organization and as a board um, and then we interview members of your board and you’re seeing your team to get a sense of where you’re at that helped us for magically beginning the onboarding plus is what your next ceo? So we know kind of what their challenges are versus going about it blind, so i do think that you wanna have, and i point this out in the book, you want to have a sense of your strategic vision, we’re heading and pick up some of the key goals you’re having here. So when you’re interviewing kayman thatyou want, make sure they’re lined with those gold here and it makes a much smoother transition, some of the goals you you lay out besides mission envision our fund-raising and development, you know what you want do around that you’re bored ceo relationship, your programs and services and of course, you know, the book explains what goes into detail on each of those, but, um, yeah, i would have a couple of it, certainly. You know, your organizational capacity. What do you have in terms of leadership development? Do you have ah plan to develop the people you have there? What’s going on with you border. You’re building the right board. Are you branding the organization and communicating with the impact you’re having is important things today. So there’s a lot of ah, strategic goals, that one. Should be having with this process and you want to get a sort of buy-in from your board and have the new ceo committed help temple with this upleaf and okay, so this new ceo is gonna have need to have some skills on dh you make the point that you don’t want to be constrained by what the what the skills and talents of the existing ceo are. We want to be thinking beyond that, i mean, that’s that’s part of what this organizational either planning or identifying the goals is going to do is help you look forward, not current, you know, you just don’t want you don’t want to just replicate the current ceo’s talents, but you want to build on those for the future and you identify a whole bunch of, you know, potential skills that you might be looking for a visionary thinker, entrepreneurial spirit, relationship builder, etcetera. But you want to be going beyond the current? Yeah, i mean, it’s easy question when you have someone, you know, you know what kind of kind of see what you’re looking for? And then the person who has been in the job, you know, for the past ten, fifty years, your name is surely people we’d like someone like charlie. Well, maybe you do. Maybe you don’t. I think that the challenges that you previously eoe had maybe sell it, but they also be very different. And one of things that you just mentioned that i have in the book, in another books, in my work i do, tony is the idea of today’s competencies for ah, executive leadership in on public sector, dramatically different than they were five, ten years ago. There’s nothing wrong with what they were in the past. You know, aboard we’ll look for someone who was a a mission based person who could have built a good relation of in the community, probably someone who could manage people in programs and perhaps someone who could go out get a grant. Though their skills are still important today, they look for more than just skills. But competition traits such as they want a visionary thinker today, when the past the ceo or executive director would implement the board’s vision. Today, boards are looking for ceos to create their own vision cream organization. I want a visionary thinker, which takes coverage of grey. Division number two certainly. People want the idea of relationship will the building relationships outside inside the organization? Uh, someone who’s, a social entrepreneur who can help develop the resource is in partnership that you need not just managed him when you got so is the whole siri’s of conferences that identifying the book, including, you know, today being a collaborate it’s, not about how big of a budget you have in control it’s about collaboration. So, yes, there is a lot of new compass out there for ceos and executive represented, but i use the term song with ceo. Exactly. Director? Yeah. That’s a fair that’s. Fair fares. Similarities. Of course. I did have a guest years ago. Eugene fram. He was a professor that i think he was a university of rochester. Andi made a case that he wanted it to be the ceo. He he felt that chief executive officer conveys a greater gravitas than executive director and ceo. That chief executive makes it less likely. Now it doesn’t make no guarantee, but less likely that board members will get involved in the nitty gritty the day to day management, you know, be be micromanaging ceo versus an executive director? I don’t. Do you have any preference for one over there? I know the book uses anonymously, but you have a preference for one. Over the other day, i d’oh you know, tony it’s a point you’re raises a really good one. And i do highly in the book of my work. But i do think today the more contemporary title is chief executive officer. Um, the more contemporary title is bored shiver support president what you kind the past is, um, it may just be words, but i think they have a lot of connotations. They do hide them so i’d like to see board chair for sport president. I think the top late personal pipe paid for sex should be the president ceo. And i think that was provoc pulawski right there when you’re out there with donorsearch oh, it’s more than just an executive director overseen the apartment. You really keep executive making things happen? I do. I do before the words ceo cubine taking andi also executive director. I mean that’s that’s sort of a uniquely non-profit terms way wanted to think that running like businesses run. This thing like a business happens. To be a nonprofit corporation. But don’t tell this to run like a business on my other interviews with you came up the term, you know, non-profit attacks that business plan, i think it’s important that today’s title be ceo. I just really think that important title they have let’s get into some nitty gritty. I want to start with the the search committee who belongs on this thing. Well, clearly, i think the this you know that in terms of size of dominant members of the search committee should be members of the board. Now, can you have a non board member on such absolute who might that be? Well, if you have someone on your community that you know has experienced with search maybe a human resource background and then on your board, you want to get their advice and gets a good that’s a good conclusion. But generally speaking, if you have a board say of, you know, twelve to fifteen people, you may one of the search committee of maybe five, you know, maybe seven maximum, but i’ve seen larger or smaller. Um, so sizes of the committee is important. Number two, uh, be tremendous amount. Of time commitment so the members of the search committee have to realize it’s going to be in involvement here in some time, and then obviously, the key part of that will be who will be your chair, the search committee, in some cases it’s, a chair of the board, which is completely appropriate. Other times that could be the vice chair of the future chair. Ah, a lot of people ask me all the time. Would it be ok, though? Has the form of a former board chair? A starita search for money and i would say maybe i would say maybe on ly, because if the former board chair eyes focus about what happened yesterday and not involved as much in your strategic planning for the future and not somebody think of something because they won’t know like what they’re looking for, yeah, this’s committee’s got to be a forward approaching organization, afford protect committee so i think that’s kind of that that’s something to think that i would be looking for a nose of membership. What about an employee putting one one employee on the committee? I don’t think that’s a good idea, actually, i think it’s a bad idea to come out writer bae and say not well, give example. Okay, uh, i’ve had people wondering to put, you know, uh, you know, the current ceo on the search committee, and the answer is no, that law office of the current ceo, maybe and help in the search committee and the consultant or either inside or outside of the search committee helped develop aspects of the position provoc what will be the ideal qualifications and experience of the next ceo? But the board hires and fires a ceo um it’s also very uncomfortable before a current ceo to be on the search committee. I had a case where it wasn’t my search client, but it was my client that i helped with succession planning in they had internal candidate for the position. And when the search committee, as this person, what changes would you make she’s very awkward to be talking about the change you want to make with theo? Of course, right. So i have. But now, those times when you get there, some people have their v p of hr on the search committee if they need it lays on. But remember, people it’s not a good idea. Has staff it’s not good to have senior members of the committee on the search committee. It should be his boardmember dahna okay, predominately. And then you said maybe a volunteer. I love you. He needs expertise. I mean, if you know if you’re going to not have a search committee and may sometimes people can hyre a certain person not to do the search, but just give advice. But i think you want someone on the committee that has experienced in recruitment, identifying screening candidates and all that type of thing so you can build it up with the great. Okay. Okay. Um, this search committee has to assure that applicants confidentiality is going to be maintained, right? You want a crucial because on i make it clear to all my such you could be. You could be sued for. Ah, um, you could be potentially have a lot of liability for exposing that. There is a candidate. You tell your friend, by the way. You know, tony is it’s been interviewing for me and and before you know it, tony’s, you know, employer finds out, you know, feels like this oil is the prom. So you have to protect confidentially, it’s something that i have to establish the trust of my chance coming in, derek, they’re they’re adamant, and it’s just goes with the same goes with the business, i have to keep them confidential. There’s no way can let people know they’re seeking a job. Yeah, and this goes part me, tio, some of the time commitment, you know, if if there isn’t a, uh, a search consultant helping some of these conversations that the early stage is going to be after hours, people are going to be comfortable talking between, you know, nine and six p m yeah, after the day i’ve had, you know, i mean, our business is growing tremendously, what’s what’s going on, but, you know, when people say yeah, you know, maybe i’ll do it myself, but listen, if you can, if you know it’s up to you but the time involved for not just the identifying the characteristics and compasses of what the third, if you want up with the outreach to potential candidates is very time consuming if you’re going to delegate that members of the search committee a wall so, you know, professionals are working or even retired it’s a lot of work involved in screening people, scheduling interviews, scheduling meetings, being qualified to interview people, it’s a lot of time of all the narrow and candidates down and doing the reference, checking it’s quite a bit. So there’s a lot of work that’s involved in a process, not just putting it out there and then, you know, interview case it’s quite a bit of work to both sell candidates on why they want to take a look at this opportunity that’s really important, which is when i was just going to point out that you say some things that caught my eye was very, very interesting i hadn’t heard before that the search committee has an obligation. So our role teo, be selling the applicants on the organization not just to be not just to be a neutral a neutral committee, but be advocates for the auriga yeah, i mean, the candies are going to come in, they’re gonna come in prepared and they’re there to sell themselves. And what often happens on some cases where the search committee say, jeez, i thought, you know, how come they don’t think that we’re the best? Thing since sliced bread. Well, you want to convey a sense of optimism, a sense of enthusiasm. So you need candy it’s, goingto, besides what the search consultant is going to be telling them about the organization recruiting for as a search committee, i remember that you want to be portraying avery plaza of image. You want to be sort of extending your hand, you want to be greeting them. You want to make them feel welcome and warm, even if you’re not going to be selected them. And you noted, under process, you want to believe what a very positive feeling for donorsearch that’s, a major altum search committee acid. All right, interesting let’s, move, teo, resume screening. You’ve got you’ve got a ton of tips, you’ve you’ve reviewed thousands of, but you’ve got you’ve got a lot of tips to share, share a couple of resume screen tips. Now we’re at that stage that these things were coming in. Just repeat that, tony. I’m sorry about a lot of people coming in. Resume resumes. A lot of resumes coming out sametz share share a couple of resume screening tips. Oh, couple things one of you want to look for clary right off the bat. Eyes cloudy. Is it clear as to how their name and how to get ahold of you? You don’t always have to have your home accuracy stays, but certainly a phone number and email address. I think i look for one of things that we look for on our team is more of a chronological history. I want to know kind of where where’s your career, ben and a couple of tips. You look for someone’s been, you know, in a job every one or two years, and they leave quite quickly that that’s a signal textile, red flag, red flag and it were bad thing. But it should be there. The other thing that, uh, those there some people for it is the functional resume where you get a sense of what their skills are experiences. But you never get a sense of where they performed that. So two things on a resume. Both. For people that are considering throwing their hat in the ring on applying for position or respond to a search from is clary, is the resume clear of what i’ve accomplished? Is it clear what have achieved as a clear in terms of the timetables have? And i think that’s a couple of tips on the resume that really yeah, that that gap in employment that could be a woman who took time off to raise children absolutely was a caregiver was a caregiver for pareles that was concerned about a gap, and i said, just tell me you have a phd in parenthood. I mean, i’d be proud to be apparent way we don’t have parents, we don’t, you know, keep going, so i think it’s a totally appropriate but be honest with what you don’t want to do, it’s, not the cover things up here, and so then, you know, present yourself in a positive tone, but certainly be honest, if you took a couple of years out or timeout to raise children to be proud of it, and so you did, but these skills and bring back the table and begin the work force, i think it’s implying with that, let me ask you a quick one. Does this turn you off when you see people with email addresses that are hotmail or a o l does that suggest to you that somebody is out of touch with technology? No, i don’t, you know, not any detail. Why? Because most of them have to e mails. They have their business emails and their personal emails, and so they don’t want ah search from or an organization that there may be talking to going into there. Professional at work email like, yeah, no, i get that. I’m okay with the email accounts. It’s, when i see you know, dennis at, you know, big love of dot com i have eyes that see you. I’m gonna try that one. Yeah, okay, but wait. Yeah. And then when the e mails that are unprofessional, like baby cakes, you know, but yeah, i don’t want to be the case. That field. Yeah, that’s unprofessional, but all right, i think it’s okay does to protect your you know, your private from work, i think that’s. All right, but let me ask you, but but my point was if it’s an added you know, sort of an out of date domain like jool or hotmail or yeah, who you know, does that suggest to you that somebody’s not hip with the current with technology it’s possible? I know nothing about that. If that you know, if you have an out of the email address and then your resume looks out of date and it’s not clear that’s not gonna help you. So if that is your email address on minutes at a oh, well, i mean, i’m fine with that. I’m fine with that. All right. As long as not baby cakes today. Well, all right. Way to take a break. Regular cps. I got a testimonial for you, quote. I was new at my position when i began working with wagner cpas. My confidence has grown knowing that i can rely on the professionals of wagner to answer any questions and make recommendations that will ensure the success of our non-profit. And you see, i always say they go beyond the numbers. This’s the truth. It comes out right here in the testimonials, we were given sound advice enabling us to increase investment income while at the same time protecting assets. Tony. Inserts a question. Does your audit firm do that for you? Recommending investment investment alternatives for you? I trust and respect our audit team and look forward to their annual visit end quote, how many do you look? I’m dying to know. Do you look forward? Your annual audit that’s probably more like dreading your annual audience, but somebody from this midsize religious organization in the midwest looks forward to their annual audit. You can to check out wagner, regular cpas dot com apolo software you’re non-profit but you used accounting software made for business stop wasting your time using business accounting software for your books like quickbooks turbo cash asap microsoft they’re not made for you. They don’t do fund accounting for you. They’re built for businesses apple owes accounting is designed for non-profits it’s in the dna for tired for pete’s sake it’s in a dna easy, affordable and you need thio use to check out the pricing. By the way, it is quite reasonable non-profit accounting for you, they’re at non-profit wizard dot com now time for tony steak too. Next month on non-profit radio you’re twenty eighteen planning if you want free business coaching in twenty eighteen we’ll have a guest from score he’ll be telling you all about it. You’re online giving plan for twenty eighteen joe garrick, the fund-raising authority will be with me. Where’s, the new tax law mean for your overall twenty eighteen fund-raising plan. Jean takagi is going to parse it out for us. How about in twenty eighteen? You get free software and consulting from oracle net suite. The vp of their social impact team will be on plus maria and reassemble course. You know her aimee semple board. You know her with their twenty eighteen plans. It’s all in january. Or you need to do is listen. And that lovely is listener is tony steak too? And doesn’t that sound like live listener? Love is coming up. Indeed. You were right would reach new jersey. Woodbridge, i want you to identify yourself. I demand it. Otherwise you have to stop listening. I want to know who this season. Woodbridge, new jersey. So loyal! Identify yourself! Use the hashtag non-profit radio on twitter, email me tonia tonia martignetti dot com i wanna know who you are. Tampa, florida, new york, new york multiple thank you for that live listeners love to all these places port murray in new jersey honolulu, hawaii killing worth connecticut live. Listen, love going out there, the honolulu i don’t think we’ve had certainly not recently, i don’t know if you’ve had a little before live love going out there all those places. How about in china, guangzhou, lee, how and other in china that we cannot see? That’s interesting. Guangzhou we can see other cities we cannot see. But now to everyone in china, united kingdom, of course live lesser love to you tokyo tokyo was with us. Konichiwa, germany is with us. Guten tag germany on germany mast and also castle kassell, germany, putin dog to everyone in germany listening and also in japan toko ri zala, konnichi wa to took a result. How about those podcast pleasantries over twelve thousand of you, the vast majority of our audience that’s where you’re listening and pleasantries go to you. Thank you, podcast listeners for being with us and i am and fm affiliate listeners throughout the stations throughout the station’s well throughout the stations throughout the world yeah, throughout the country anyway. Throughout the stations throughout the country affections, affiliate affections to our am and fm listeners in those stations throughout the states throughout the country, affections to you. Dennis miller’s with us, you know him, we’re talking about his book, a guide to recruiting your next ceo, you know, we can we can cover the whole book, so just get the thing we’re going to say, you know, it’s, a dentist, see miller dot com that’s where you’ll find dennis in this book just get the damn thing, it’s just that i don’t know how to make it any plainer. All right. Anyway, denis let’s, continue our our joint through, um okay, so we’ve got a bunch of resumes and the book goes through lots of lots of resume screening tips. I mean, when they really don’t have time to go through all the tips, but there’s a lot there. Now we’re into interviewing. So you say there are two things we’re looking for? They were looking for the interpersonal and skills ability? Absolutely. I mean, the tv process. Once we screen people in terms of resume on paper, we certainly begin actually with phone interviews and then once leaves, go to the phone into the process and we can get a better sense of with they are as a potential candidate, we may explain a final car. Weather at one of salary package so without wasting people’s time here. But there are a couple two things you’re looking for. Um, do they have a cultural? Do they have interpersonal skills that will build your team on the team builders over there? You know, ah, they collaborators of the communicators and then obviously did they have the ability to deliver positive results? And i think those two things is what kind of, you know, separates the people who get to positions and those that don’t hear i we advised certainly the search committee on, you know, the question should be focused on limited tony to, you know, their person’s behavior, their skills, their experience, what they bring to the table, not things that deal, what things like, you know, age and discrimination and gender and all those kind of things that you want to avoid. But the bottom line is who can communicate their ability to get along with people because it’s a team game antionette glamarys also there too, things that are a crucial now one of things that you may ask me, i’ll just what answer ahead of time we have and your listeners can get their contact and get onto our newsletter. But we at non-profit search dot com. We provide a candidate matrix that has sort of a scoring sheet with certain questions on it. Ah, what a total score fifty. And whether it’s on leadership, communications, street, strategic planning, board, relationships, etcetera. So when people of actually going to the interview process on the search committee and you’ve got forty eight people, suppose, you know, going in the search committee members can evaluate for people. And i have this matrix a kind of sense of where, you know, people come out scores and usually it’s a good tool that have for them. You have a lot of resources at the non-profits search dot com. So you mentioned throughout the book, but that’s scoring matrix is one of them. All right, so let’s, get into some details here. Now is the whole committee meeting with every every candidate. Because if it’s subsets of a committee meeting with different candidates, then i don’t think that doesn’t seem fair to me because different subsets or going to judge people differently. Yeah, well, here’s what we do, um and, um the answer is that the entire search committee needs prepared to interview all the candidates now in a case we just have here. Because it’s got multiple locations. There are actually eight people on, uh, a search committee and four will meet in one location and four met another location. Actually, each candidate each of the five final candidates you met which weiss but they but they are all seeing yet you cannot have one group meets somebody. Candidates and another good meet the only other candy that’s part of the process with a search committee. He’s gonna be on the committee. You have to have the type of zoho so every every candidate should be seen by every person on the search committee. Absolutely. You you advocate. I mean, this is sort of a no brainer, but just make it explicit. You know, you don’t want to be asking. Yes, no questions. You are open ended questions. Yeah. You you don’t want to say, you know, you want to you want to engage him in conversation and they want to get you in a conversation two and so, you know, asking questions. What was the most challenging thing you had a deal with in your current? Position on your most recent position. What was the you know, your biggest achievement? Hey, is an issue for us. How would you deal with it? You stay away from the yes and no questions. And we have, you know, we’ve identified on a website and our resources and our book here, you know, question to be asking, but yeah, not open it. Not not. Yes or no. Open ended questions. Engagement of conversation is the best of them. Okay, let’s say, we’ve everybody has interviewed all the candidates. Uh, now what’s, our next step in the committee. Well, what you want to do is the one i have everybody’s gonna score the candidates and give feedback on the candidates and have the board chair or someone assigned to oversee the accumulation of all the scoring. So you can see how people did. And then what you want to do is and what we do is i have a conversation with this chair of the search committee. And then, uh, i will meet with the search committee. One of my senior member of the team will meet with the search committee depending where the searches on what it’s for and then we they may determine that. Listen, there’s one final candidates is one person they like, and they want to bring him back to meet with people in the organization. Take him on a tour or there’s. Two final plans. They’re not sure. So that there’s a process here. The process here is obviously too, uh, what? The other candidates know that they did well and they thank him before participating. But there’s someone at this point in time that has a skill centre experience. That’s mohr meets the needs of my client. Ah, we hope to see him again the future and then focus in on, you know, having to help them make a final decision on the candidate before we get involved and advise him on making, making a final offered and employment contract employment agreement right now in this scoring, obviously somewhere going to score highest and high esten hyre than others. But suppose there’s just there’s just a sense that, you know, even the highest scoring one or two, they’re just they’re just not right. It was just, you know, like i said, every in a group of five somebody’s going to score the highest but but even that highest one, they just don’t feel right. You know, how do we we feel like we may have to go back to the go back to the recruitment process. Well, have expressed happened. You know, only once in my recent experience, where in most cases, uh, in addition, the scoring members of the search committee and, you know, as you know, the millions and millions of people that serve our non-profit board throughout this country and in other countries and canada, you know, our bright, committed people they gotta see if you get a feel for you know who you think would fit in here. So usually, you know, the scores will help you because it gives us feedback. But usually you get a kind of a feeling you would be the best person for that. If there’s a situation, um, that, you know, the search committee sees the final candidates. And if it happens that you feel like there’s, you know, just not feeling it for those candidates. I absolutely would highly recommend that he go back and do the search again. We have a situation with a very prominent national foundation. Uh, we started with believing out of pool of eighteen candidates, uh, middle down, teo wither down to eleven that was down to five and five people came in, and so with the entire team and that team in there of identified, you know, to people and long behold some discussion and some some time issues and then people not sure what decision to make and there was some inexperience on the team making the decision and they kind of planted and they just, uh, well, i’m not sure i’m ready to pull the trigger, so we were disappointed for the work we did. We will back out into the search again, and usually you don’t get the great candidates again, and we did, and it worked out so it’s for some reason, you don’t feel it. I dont just say, well, because is a high score because you’re going to live with this person quarter what use with this not happen, tony, you, um you know, the search is doing the work, you’ll get the right candidate, but if a some reasons you feel that, you know, this is i just don’t feel it for this person is going to fit in here. Then don’t just pick someone because of scored the scores are one of the many tools will you offer to help you pick your candidate? Is this a stage where we should be calling references now? We’ve we’ve narrowed it down to our top two or so, yeah, so what way? Well, a cz we get the final can’t wait do ask for a reference, but here’s, what we do, we don’t ask them, they could tell us who they’re going to use the reference we are specific and ask him for the type of reference we’re looking for example, and a ceo case we know they can’t talk about the company, we’d like the house, then talk. We’d like to talk to someone who is a boardmember maybe a boardmember another organization would like to talk to someone that appear that they have done a lot of work with. We would like to talk to someone that has worked for them, so, uh, we don’t always talkto the references i had a time, because if you’ve got, you know, four final candidates we spent about our time it’s that wee if you’re not going to be chosen, why go? Through the house full of asking people speaking the reference. But with your various final candidate, we actually do a thorough construct. And i have a little bit of a funny story that that you listen, um, you may enjoy just quickly here, and it goes back a long time ago when i did my first search believing not thirty years ago. And i was recruiting someone to head up a healthcare foundation and came down to two people. And there was a man, a woman. And i remember the, uh the man had sort of mohr experience, but the young woman has seemed like much more potential. Anyway, for some reason, the man had given me a list of ten references. Don’t ask me why, but he gave me ten references, and i call it the first six references. Iss man kind of walked on water. He was, you know, could have been their spiritual guru by the time i got seven. Eight. I really got a sense that people were not that comfortable. Then by the time i got the nine and ten people were asking me, you know, why did you what did this guy even you? Give me a reference, i recommend anything, so the moral stories you want to keep, you know, kind of dig in here and it’s, certainly you have a right as a as an organization, and you have a right as a search committee to, you know, find out what you know about people, which is what we do, um, and same time protecting confidential alley, but certainly, you know, we need to do with our research on them and in addition to references, we obviously do a check on educational credentials, and then we advise our clients baseball what state they’re in about what they can do and not teo regarding they want pursue, uh, feeling criminal background check will and credit credit risk of credit reports. It sounds like that guy on his word document that he gave you with the list of what was thirty years ago. We didn’t have work, but have we have word we’re going? We’re using them word perfect where you had toe right down at the bottom, you have to change the bold face down at the bottom of page. Anyway, it sounds like he conflated his do not use list with his reference list that he did want to use like the last four we’re we’re on a separate list and he somehow put the two of them together. All right, we got to take a break, tell us credit card and payment processing. They have a video. Check out the video at tony dahna slash tony tello’s. It explains what the process of businesses switching to tell us is and how you the non-profit that refers them will get fifty percent of the revenue that tello’s urns that’s passive revenue for you your organization. Each month it talks about their one hundred percent satisfaction rate. They have a price match guarantee, but that’s in the video, but for non-profit radio listeners, you get way beyond a mere price match. If if tell us, can’t help, you’re the first referred business is by saving the money, not just matching but saving. Then you get that two hundred fifty dollars, that you’ve heard me talk about, so worth it for you very likely tell us we’ll be able to save the money, but just in case not you’re protected and so is the business. Really, because it’s still still then is helping you. In the video covers, free switching to tell us they have a ninety day easy out but tell us has a hundred percent satisfaction rate, so they’re not gonna need not gonna need the easy out ninety days. That means there and it’s free, but they’re not going to eat it, but it is there, but they’re not gonna need it. Think about the businesses that make sense for you to refer and check out the video at tony dot m a slash tony tell us now, back to dennis miller and his book, a guide to recruiting next ceo let’s continue our joint ajanta dennis okay, so we’ve checked references, references and this and that we’re bringing some people in were like site tours and what their meeting some of the staff now too, and maybe even some of some of the people who are getting our services no, what we worked a man don’t do that metoo staff until they are having a place where we don’t really know sexuality you don’t. You don’t really want the staff on my opinion on a ceo level. Uh, they have to pick the ceo if it’s another level? Certainly if it’s achieve opening office of chief financial officer it’s totally appropriate to have other members of the executive team meet with them. The finer who’s a better vet culture that’s line. Okay, but on a ceo though you are make it clear that the board is making the decision and i would not have staff involved on interviewing until all right. So who are they meeting that in thiss day when they’re going to visit the visit the site? Well, so many have gone to the search committee. Obviously, there is no one else to meet except the entire board. So if you’re talking about the ceo, which is what? We are way wrong that once a search committee has made decision before on offers made it’s what the search committee wants to do doesn’t really have any authority to itself. You wantto search committee should be making a recommendation to the entire board and in many cases, and i will advise us is have that final ceo or in the case where this too close candidates committed meet the entire board may be on the same day, you know, spend a little time with each one. Um, if if there’s one that’s clearly, uh, the person that everybody wants don’t waste the time of having to feel you have to bring a second one and you give it someone hope when is when they’re not probably going to be selected but i have an interesting story, tony, that you listen. May one here, uh, about a year ago we did a search for a ceo and the search committee had him ranked wanted to have this ah, woman rank one in a guy number two. And i had agreed with that recommendation thought it was the best way of going. And by the time those two candidates came in to meet with the entire board and this is an unusual situation ah, the board ended up going with the number two candidate and not the number one candidate and some things came up in discussions. Then i think at the end of day they made the right decision. So don’t forget the board has a final hiring authority. They delegate that that a search committee to search committee xero recommended candidates, but do not hire a ceo from a search committee on ly they must meet the entire board. Have you ever heard of co ceos? Yeah, i have and i found it never. Well, couple times it rarely works there. It works in a case where today there’s a lot of mergers and acquisitions, so both people take on the role of co ceo won, they have responsibility for maybe certain geography one than another o once focus more on one thing before not tow have it. I think coz ceos is like koh board chairs. It doesn’t make a feeling that anybody’s really in charge. Um, i’m working with an organization right now out in california because we do certainly national searches as well as in canada and, you know, there’s a transition going on and is this it the heart organization? It’s important to know who’s in charge? So if it has to happen and you’re particularly the merger, can you have it? Yes, but ideally it sooner than later. It’s only a transition. You can’t have a co ceo doesn’t work. I’ve seen coach, chief development officer and it doesn’t work either. I mean, i think someone has to be in charge. So that’s my opinion. Okay, way explored co ceos with jean takagi, so if anyone wants teo, get more on that. That was the main nineteenth twenty seventeen show with jean ok, alright, we, uh we it’s time to negotiate an offer we were ah, we’ve selected our top one you like guards, guidestar they have i don’t know if you mentioned i know them. Guide star has a has a good salary guide comes out every year. So it’s it’s current but you have other studies that you like? Yeah, a couple of things we have a good sense of what the marketplaces like different geography, maybe waken use guide star and i i like the organization well, but here’s the palm and it’s not guide, says the bomb is that usually the data that’s in there where you have the five highest, complicated employees? It’s probably two years old, even if it says two thousand sixteen and you’re in seventeen, it may have been, you know well, about a june of two thousand fifteen, so i don’t rely upon that nestle as a guide for making offer. I know what the organization is looking to pay. I know what what the sally is. People that are looking and then we i advise uh, i’m involved in every ceo, so i advise my client is what i think it’s going to take to get the person i’ve seen clients do salary surveys using geiser and other things that committee from other compensations raised there’s nothing wrong with it, but what you don’t get from that, you don’t know, uh, what the performance of the organization has been you don’t know how well they’ve done. You don’t know what, how well they’ve done with fund-raising, you know, you don’t know much about him other than what the total budget is. So on one of the advantages of a search for meditation now based upon the work they’re doing what what the rate is to attract some money and that’s kind of what we do. Okay, let’s, spend our last couple minutes. Ah, you know, you just got it by the book because there’s a lot more about negotiating the offer in the book, but i want to spend last couple minutes, just about two minutes or so on on onboarding this’s a board responsive board responsibility. Well, it’s a big thing. I mean, you know, if you talk to ceos, i mean half of them have never been on border. So what does? What does he mean by sort of onboarding candidate? Well, uh, our onboarding onboarding if you don’t get onboarding you get hired and then you start and then you go geez, i don’t know this is the way itwas, you know, you’re not supported in your new job. So dahna whatyou onboarding were first to the idea of preparing a ceo to adjust to the new social, cultural and professional components of the new role and or to the board here, really very important that i be some type of onboarding process um, so as example here, here’s some things you would want to be thinking about what onboarding here is, um, let’s be clear. So both the board and the ceo and again, you could say the same thing about a ceo or cfo. What she development altum same thing here is what are the expectations of each other? Clearly that’s gonna come up during entry puss, but that needs to be known. How often does the board chair want to communicate to the ceo? Did they want to meet monthly? Did they want have a phone conversation on every other friday did they want emails or not emails that they want to meet for breakfast? Um, what does the board want the ceo to accomplish in the first thirty days or sixty days, or maybe one hundred eighty days? Uh, what the cultural issues or financial is that the organization is facing, um, what senior members of the team may have some performances the watch out for who had the key stakeholders outside the organization like donors of all tears that you want to see how to make sure that building wishes, perhaps maybe with a local congress person or a member of the senate assembly here. Dennis, we’ve got to leave it there. There’s too much. All right, keep a melissa. Thank you, tony, for this. I appreciate you and all your happy holiday season and the great thank you so much, dennis. Same for you. Get the book. It is a guide to recruiting your next ceo. You’ll find it at dennis c miller dot com and you’ll find him at dennis c miller next week. Happy new year. There is no live show affiliate listeners. You are covered. Of course we’re going to replay zombie. Loyalists. If you missed any part of today’s show, i beseech you, find it on tony martignetti dot com were supported by pursuant online tools for small and midsize non-profits data driven and technology enabled. Tony dahna slash pursuant weinger sepa is guiding you beyond the numbers. Wagner cps dot com appaloosa accounting software designed for non-profits non-profit wizard dot com and tell us credit card and payment processing, your passive revenue stream. Tony dahna may slash tony tell us our creative producers, claire meyerhoff, slam sam, sam the slam liebowitz is the line producer show social media is by susan chavez, and this very cool music is by scott stein of brooklyn’s. Thank you for that information, scotty with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Go out and be great. What’s not to love about non-profit radio tony gets the best guests check this out from seth godin this’s the first revolution since tv nineteen fifty and henry ford nineteen twenty it’s the revolution of our lifetime here’s a smart, simple idea from craigslist founder craig newmark insights orn presentation or anything? People don’t really need the fancy stuff they need something which is simple and fast. When’s the best time to post on facebook facebook’s andrew noise nose at traffic is at an all time hyre on nine a, m or p m so that’s, when you should be posting your most meaningful post here’s aria finger ceo of do something dot or ge young people are not going to be involved in social change if it’s boring and they don’t see the impact of what they’re doing. So you got to make it fun and applicable to these young people look so otherwise a fifteen and sixteen year old they have better things to do if they have xbox, they have tv, they have their cell phones me dar is the founder of idealist took two or three years for foundation staff to sort of dane toe add an email address card, it was like it was phone. This email thing is right and that’s, why should i give it away? Charles best founded donors choose dot or ge somehow they’ve gotten in touch kind of off line as it were on dh and no two exchanges of brownies and visits and physical gift. Mark echo is the founder and ceo of eco enterprises. You may be wearing his hoodies and shirts. Tony talked to him. Yeah, you know, i just i i’m a big believer that’s not what you make in life. It zoho, you know, tell you make people feel this is public radio host majora carter. Innovation is in the power of understanding that you don’t just put money on a situation expected to hell. You put money in a situation and invested and expected to grow and savvy advice for success from eric sacristan. What separates those who achieve from those who do not is in direct proportion to one’s ability to ask others for help. The smartest experts and leading thinkers air on tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent.

Nonprofit Radio for December 15, 2017: Zombie Loyalists

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My Guest:

Peter Shankman: Zombie Loyalists

Peter Shankman

Peter Shankman is a well-known and often-quoted social media, marketing and public relations strategist. His book is “Zombie Loyalists.” He wants you to create rabid fans who do your social media, marketing and PR for you. He’s got super ideas and lots of valuable stories. I like to play this each December. (Originally broadcast 12/19/14)

 

 

 

 

 


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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent on the aptly named host oh, i’m glad you’re with me. I’d be thrown into kenna mortal phobia if you told me zombies caused you to miss today’s show zombie loyalists peter shankman is a well known and, uh, often quoted social media marketing and public relations strategist. His book is zombie loyalists. He wants you to create rabid fans who do your social media, marketing and pr for you he’s got super ideas and lots of valuable stories i’d like to play this each december, and it was originally aired on december nineteenth twenty fourteen authorities take to the estate tax and planned e-giving we’re sponsored by pursuant full service fund-raising data driven and technology enabled tony dahna slash pursuing and by wagner cpas guiding you beyond the numbers when you’re cps dot com, you’re not a business you’re non-profit apple it’s accounting software designed for non-profits non-profit wizard dot com tell us turning payment processing into your passive revenue stream. Tony dahna slash tony tell us here’s the first bit of peter shankman and zombie loyalists. I’m very glad peter shankman is with me in the studio. He is the founder of haro help a reporter out connecting journalists with sources in under two years from starting it in his apartment, hora was sending out fifteen hundred media queries a week to more than two hundred thousand sources worldwide. It was acquired by vocus in two thousand ten he’s, the founder and ceo of the geek factory, a boutique social media marketing and pr strategy firm in new york city, peter is on nasa’s civilian advisory council. You’ll find him at shanklin dot com and he’s at peter shankman on twitter. His latest book is zombie loyalists using great service to create rabid fans. I’m very glad his book brings him to non-profit radio and the studio welcome peter, get to be here, honey. Thanks. Pleasure. You live on the west side of manhattan. And you and you there’s a there’s. A pretty well known five star steakhouse. I’ll get wolfgang’s not far from you know, but you pass it to go to a different steakhouse, right? Morton’s? Correct. Why is that more? I’m a zombie loyalist importance. What does that mean? I love the service. The attention to detail the quality the sort of where everyone knows my name mentality when i walk into that mourns or any mortons around the world, they have a tremendous custom relationship management system. When i call one number ah, in new york or anywhere in the world, it they know who i am by my cell phone. And i’m treated with just, you know, phenomenal. Uh, happiness toe here for me. And my wishes are granted is aware, and we have any happy hour holiday party coming up at morton’s next couple days. And, you know, as always, i forgot to call and make a reservation. You know, i called yesterday and said, hey, i need a and she has to get a reservation for seven people. Dahna you know, there’s a night at, uh, seven p m, which is, you know, the week of holiday play, and they looked and they said, oh, well, and then i guess their computer system kicked in. Of course, mr chang is not a problem. I’ll get the fire anyway, you know how it will have a great booth for you that, you know, and we’ll tell us names the people attending and you know, you know, you know, they’re going to specialize menus for them and their names on they really they have ah, really high level of service that they provide not just to me that’s the beauty of it, you know, it’s one thing for everybody, yeah, it’s one thing, if they do was provided to me, but they do that for everyone, and that is huge because, you know, being able to call when a normal person makes reservation and not that i’m special, i’m actually rather abnormal. But what a normal person makes a reservation and says, no more tests, okay, greater. You celebrating anything so, yeah, it’s, my wife’s birthday waiting always ask after anyone said, oh, you know what? It’s, my wife’s birthday great what’s her name and her name’s. Megan, whatever. And you go in and they and you sit down on the on the menu, it says happy, but they make it, and then megan, whoever she happens to be well in the next forty five minutes, you know, taking fifty selfies with her menu and that’ll go online and when her friends, you know, want that same experience, they’re going to go morton’s you say in the book you get the customers you want by being beyond awesome to the customers you have. And that’s. Why? I want to start with that morton’s story, which is in the middle of the book. But they do it for everybody. And then they have the vips as well. And there’s the terrific story of you tweeting tell that story that’s a good story, but it’s a good story. Love stories. I was flying home from a day trip to florida and was exhausted and starving and they trip meaning you’re flying down a canoe down to six a m lunch meeting flew back same day. You know, one of those one of those days and ah, i jokingly said the tweet hey, morton’s. What? You meet me at newark airport when i land with a porterhouse in two hours. Ha ha ha ha ha! Um, you know, i said it the same way you’d say winter. Please stop snowing things like that. And i landed find my driver and said, next, my driver is a is ah, waiter in a tuxedo with the mortons back. They saw my tweet. They put it together. They managed to bring me a a steak and and, you know, as great of a story is that is that’s, that’s, it’s a great stunt and it’s a great story, and it wasn’t staged. It was completely amazing, but, you know, that’s not what they’re about, they’re not about delivering steaks to airports, they’re about making a great meal for you and treating you like world when you come in and, you know, if they just did that, if they just deliver the stake, the airport, but their quality and service sucked, you know, it wouldn’t be a story, you know, you know what they did for peter, but, you know, my steak’s cold, you know? So what it really comes down to is the fact they do treat everyone like kings and that’s that’s really, really important because, well, why is it happening to have a great experience of morton’s? And then you tell the world, you know, oh, yeah, great dinner last night, that was amazing, i would totally there again. And as we moved to this new world where, you know, review sites are going away and i don’t, i don’t need to go to yelp reviews and people i don’t know, and you know, if they’re shills, whatever the case may be, i don’t know or trip advisor, same thing i want people in my network who i trust and people in their network who they trust, then by default, i trust so and that’s going to that’s already happening automatically, you know, when i when i land in l a and i type in steakhouse, you know, not me, i know, i know where the steak house on telly, but if someone typed into google maps or facebook steak house in los angeles, you know they’ll see all the state houses on google map, but if any of their friends have been to any of them, they’ll see those first. And if they had a good experience, only if the sentiment is positive will they see those first and that’s pretty amazing, because if you think about that, the simple act of tweeting out of photo oh my god, thanks so much more in love this that’s positive sentiment, that network knows that. And so if you’re looking for a steakhouse, you know, and your friend six months ago had that experience oh, my god, amazing state this great place the sentiment will be there on dh. The network will know that that we will show you that steakhouse because you trust your friend. And this is where we start to cultivate zombie loyalists. Exactly is through this awesome customer service of the customers. You you have say more about something. Yeah. I mean, you have so many companies out there who are trying to get the next greatest customer. You know, you see all the ads, you know, the facebook post, you know, we’re at nine hundred ninety, followers are ten are one thousand follower gets a free gift. Well, that’s current saying screw you to the original nine hundred ninety followers who you had who were there since the beginning. We don’t care about you. We want that one thousand you know, that’s. Not cool. The the companies who see their numbers rise and you see their fans increase in there. There. Ah, revenues go up are the ones who are nice to the customers they have. Hey, you know customer fifty two. It was really nice of you to join us a couple months ago. How do you know? How are you? We notice that you posted on something about a you know, your car broke down? Well, you know, we’re not in the car business, but you know, you’re you’re two blocks from our our closest, ah, out loud or whatever and, you know, once if you need to come in, have a cup of coffee, will you use the phone? Whatever, you know, those little things that you could do that, that that really focus on the customers you haven’t make the customers you have the ones where the zombies who tell other customers have great your and this all applies to non-profits certainly as well the question, but even more so yeah, i mean, if you know non-profits constant worry about howto make the most value out of their dollar on how to keep the dollar stretching further and further. And, you know, you have this massive audience who has come to you, who’s a non-profit who said to you, you know, we want to help here we are volunteering our help and just simply treating them with the thanks that they deserve, not just a simple hey, thanks for doing it, but actually reaching out, asking what theywant asking how they like to get the information, things like that will greatly increase your donations as well as making them go out and tell everyone how awesome you are letting them to your p r for you and that’s what a zombie loyalist does and this is for this could be donors could be volunteers in the organization who aren’t able to give a lot, but giving time is enormous. And if you know if they have such a great time doing it, they’ll bring friends as as zombies do. You know zombies have one purpose in life? A real zombies have one purpose in life. That’s defeat it doesn’t matter how the mets are doing, it doesn’t matter, you know, because chance that they lost anyway. But it doesn’t matter how how anyone’s doing you know, what’s going on in the world economy, it doesn’t matter what matters was zombie is where they get their next meal because they feed and they have to infect more people. Otherwise they will die zombie loyalist to the same thing. All they have to do is make sure that their custom, they tell the world we all have that friend who does it, you know. That one friend who eats eat nothing but the olive garden because, oh, my gods! Greatest breadsticks everywhere, you know, and they will drag your ass the olive garden every single time they get that chance. That’s a zombie loyalist. And you want them to do that for your non-profit and there’s a big advantage to being a smaller, smaller organization. It could be so much more high touch. And we’re gonna talk about all that. We got the full hour with peter shankman. Gotta go away for a couple minutes. Stay with us, it’s. Time for a break. Pursuant they’ve got a webinar replay for you. It is proven stewardship strategies very timely because lots of people are giving to you this a month. So how do you keep them giving next year? And in twenty nineteen et cetera? You know how costly it is to lose donors and have to replace them? Nationwide dahna attrition you’ve heard guests say it it’s around seventy five percent each year, which is crazy. I’ve had guests trying to help you with that. Hopefully, your numbers are below the annual average, the nationwide average. Keep your donors you after year with a strong stewardship program that’s what this webinar is all about stewardship strategies rachel and cathy give you examples of top thank you’s they talk about automation without sacrificing personalization and they have free templates for you to use. The webinar is proven stewardship strategies it’s at tony dahna slash pursuant capital p now back to peter shankman and zombie loyalists. Peter, it doesn’t take much, teo stand out in the customer service world doesn’t really doesn’t, you know, and the reason for that is because we expect to be treated like crap. You know, if you think about that book, i love this example, whenever i give speeches, i asked, i asked you in the audience and like, who here has had a great flight recently, like at least one personal raise their hand? Ok, what made it great and without fail there? And well, we took off on time and i had the cd was a sign and we landed on time and like, so you paid for a service, they delivered that service, and you’re over the freaking moon about it, like that’s the state that we’ve become, you know, that’s how bad customer service has been that you are just beyond thrilled that they did exactly what they said they were going to win, nothing more less than twenty minutes in the post office line exam, and i’m ecstatic exactly, you know it it’s so we really are at a point where we only have to be one level above krauz i’m not even asking my client to be good, just one level of crap, you know, if everyone else’s crap and your one level above that, you’re going to win my favorite. My favorite jokes, thie two guys are out in the woods, hunting in the woods and the just jog. It was the first one sees a bear, and they see this barren bears raised up he’s about to strike, and the first one reaches down and tightens up his laces on his running shoes and it was the studio don’t be, don’t be needy, you can’t outrun a bear and just kind of need to understand how wrong you know, i love that joke because it’s it’s so true that’s the concept, you know, all you have to do is be just a little bit better than everyone else, and you’ll win the whole ball game. Now we have to set some things up internally in orderto have the structure in place, no question about it to create the zombie loyalists. Yeah, i mean, you haven’t. You have. Ah, company, where the majority of people in your company are afraid to do anything outside the norm, you know? I mean, lookit, lookit a cellphone companies, you know, they call them cause you have a problem, right? T or t mobile. You call them your problem? They’re actually the customer service. We’ll handle your caller actually judged and rewarded based on how quickly they could get you off the phone. You know, not on whether or not the fix your problem fast, but how fast they could get you off the phone. Which means how many more calls get everybody worked when i worked in america online, we all had to do a day of customer service every month just to see what it was like. That was a brilliant idea. But, you know, again, it’s just it was a system called vantage for you to sign on. And as soon as you signed on, if you want to call, you know, that was tacked. Against you, if you’re in a call and it went over a certain amount of time that was tacked against you, so the decks were stacked not in the favor, the customer. There are some companies out there who allowed there customer service employees to simply be smarter about what they dio and do whatever it is they need to do to fix the problem. You know, my favorite story about this verizon wireless? I went overseas, i was in dubai and i landed two buy-in i’m turning my phone had gotten global roaming on my phone, which, you know, twenty bucks for every hundred megabytes. Okay, so i land and i turn on my phone and it says, like, before i’m even off the plane, i get a text that you’ve used two hundred dollars in roaming charges. What the hell, you know, three hundred dollars by turning it off the planet. We’re something’s up here, so i called horizon on a nice guy answer the phone and oh, yeah, i mean, you know, the first thing that was yes, sir, you do have global roaming, but it doesn’t work in dubai. Okay, well, that’s not really global that’s. More hemispherical roaming, i think, is the issue, and so i said, well, look, i’m gonna be here for a week. I said, you know what? You have my credit card, bill me like cubine bilich a thousand bucks and you let me have the phone for, like, a week and you know that, you know, five hundred hours i won’t go over to gigs would just do something for me. Sorry, sir, i’m not authorized to do that. You can look. So what i have is well, you can pay twenty dollars and forty eight cents a megabyte. I’m like i’m sorry. Seriously, which equates essentially too. I will be charged. Twenty thousand forty eight seconds, three thousand forty eight cents for every i think the times for every four seconds of the video gangnam style if i would decide to watch my phone like this is pretty ridiculous. So i simply hung up. I’m hung up on your eyes and i went down the street to the dubai, the mall of the emirates, which is the largest mall in the world, is a freaking ski slope in that, and i’m not joking and as a ski slope in this mall and went to one of like the eighty six different electronic stores in this mall. I bought an international unlocked version of the same exact cell phone. I have went next door to the local sim card store, but, eh, sim card that gave me twenty gigabytes of data and a thousand minutes of talk for forty dollars. I then put that in my phone because i it’s an android phone. I simply typed in my user name and password for google and everything imported. And verizon did not get a penny on that trip. How easy would have been from horizon to say. Okay, you know what? We’ll cut your brake. They still make a lot of money off me. And i would tell the world how great verizon wants to work with and how wonderfully, how helpful they were. Instead, they guaranteed that i will never. They will never make a penny from any international trip. And i take what? Fifteen of them a year? Because now my cell phone, um, my international cell phone that i bought all i do is pop out the sim card on my land, wherever i am putting a new sim card so and you’re speaking and writing and telling that story boards and then rittereiser and every time i tell the story about variety, i make it a little worse. Apparently verizon tests out the durability of their phone by throwing them kittens. I read this and, you know, it must be, you know, not necessarily, but you know, the concept that that all they had to do all the energy was in power mark right now, and it wasn’t mark’s fault. Mark was a really nice guy, but he was not allowed to do that. He would get fired if you try to do a deal like that for me and so it’s this concept, you know, and the funny thing is it comes down if you really want to go go down the road in terms of a public company like verizon of where the issue is, you could even trace it to fiduciary responsibility because the fiduciary responsibility of any company’s ceo all the way down the employees to make money for the shareholders future responsibly means by not allowing me and they don’t allow a mark the customer service agent to to help me on dh take a different tack is actually losing money. Too many ceos think about the next quarter oh, we have to make our number six quarter. I’m fired companies and other countries to anything with next quarter century, and they make a much bigger difference because he okay, what can we do now that we’ll have impact the next five, ten, fifteen years? You know, and really implement the revenue that we have and an augment and cos america don’t don’t think about that. That’s a big problem i’d buy a product line has a lot of natural and recycled materials seventh generation and their their tagline is that in in our every decision, we must consider the impact on the next seven generations. It comes from an american indian, it’s great it’s a great line. I mean, just think about how much money horizon would have made for me in the past three years over just just my overseas you’d be telling a story about like them, about morten, like the one about things? Look, a lot of people listen to me and they went for a time when you googled roaming charges variety when you google verizon roaming charges my story about, however, how i saved all this money really big came up first because i did the math, and if i had not called mark and bought my own cell phone and done this time, i would have come home with thirty one thousand dollars cellphone bill and your damn authorizing one damn thing about that is we’re like up to bad start with fine print and plus the employee who sold you the quote international plan, right? I’m sure you told her, didn’t she said, where you going? I’m going to canada and i’m going to dubai. I’m assuming she didn’t know where to buy wass she when we thought it was near canada, but yeah, long story short couldn’t use it. All right, so employees have to be empowered there’s to be we have to be, but changing a thinking too. I mean, the customer has to come first. The donor of the volunteers don’t volunteer. You get at the end of the day where’s your money coming from look, if you’re non-profit or fortune one hundred where’s, the money coming from, you know and if you we see it happening over and over again we’ve seen what you’re seeing right now play out every single day with company uber on uber it’s so funny because uber makes you know the value of forty billion dollars right now, but that doesn’t mean anything. It doesn’t mean anything if people are running away in droves, which people are there’s a whole? Delete your uber app movement that lord, no god, you people are doing what’s the problem well, it’s several number one, that uber is run by a bunch of guys who honor the bro code. The company was actually started by a guy who, in on business in business insider, said he started the company get laid, his goal was to always of a black car when he was leaving a restaurant to impress the girl he was with that he came out and said that, and you see that culture run rampant throughout uber from their god mode where they can see they actually create there was, ah, don’t read this, my business insider as well that they created a hookup page that showed or, ah, walk of shame page that showed where good women were leaving certain apartments like on weekends oneaccord believing certain place on weekends, going back to their home, it was obvious that they, you know, some guy, and i think they did that, and of course, just there their whole surge pricing mentality, which is, you know, two days ago there was a couple of symbolism the terrorists, thinkers, harris attacking in sydney at that at that bakery, and sidney, uber and sydney instituted surge pricing for people trying to get out of harm’s way, you know? And and they later refund it all was a computer glitch, i’m you know, i’m sorry you have a stop fun and you can when you see something happening like that, there has to be someone in the office because you know what? Not cool, we’re going to take care of that and hit the stop button, and it was, yeah, bad tons and tons and tons of bad publicity. You know, i was having an argument with one of my facebook page facebook dot com slash peter shankman because they said, oh, you know, so what? They don’t, they don’t turn surprising. I have enough cabs there and, you know, people can’t get home, i said, i’m pretty sure that the on ly come, but i’m sure that no one had cab companies there. I’m sure that there wasn’t anyone who had enough cars. They’re private cabs, uber’s, whatever yet the on ly stories i read about companies screwing up during the event where uber not joe’s sydney cab company you know, i didn’t see him staring up because he didn’t turn on surge pricing, you got it. You got to respect your customer after as we’re ah training for that then not only trying to change that mind ships well in in trying to change that mindset rewards for custom, for employees that do take go to go the extra mile. Well, first of all, if you give the employees the ability to do it to go the extra mile and understand they won’t get fired, you’re not going to get in try always to tell every one of my employees you never get in trouble for spending a little extra money to try and keep a customer happy you’ll get fired for not doing it, you know you’re fired for, not for seeing an opportunity to fix someone and not taking doing everything that you could, you know, rich. Carl is famous for that rhys caldnear hires people not because whether they could fool the bedsheet but for how well they understand people. Because in wisconsin’s, mind it’s, much more important to be a people person and be able to be empathetic. And that it’s such a key word empathy is just so so sorely lacking. You know how much you’ve called customer service? Yeah. You know, i have to have to change my flight. Might my my aunt just died. I really dio ok. Great that’s. Three dollars. I just wanted one hour earlier. You know, you show up at the airport. Your bag is overweight by half a pound. That’s twenty five dollars. I just can you can you just cut me some slack, you know, so empathy and giving the custom, giving the employees the ability to understand that the customer that sometimes you can make exceptions and it is okay to make changes. And this is where a smaller organization has huge advantage. It’s. Easier to change. That’s. What kills me. You know, i go to these, try to frequent small businesses. When can i get you something? Small? Businesses and they won’t. They act. Like large businesses, you know, in the respect that they don’t have ah, like they want to be respected almost they don’t have, like, a sixty six thousand page code that they have to adhere to. They can simply ah, do something on the fly. And yet, for whatever reason, they won’t do it. And it’s the most frustrating famous and what guys, you’re acting like a big you act like mega lo mart here, you know, and you’re not mega lo mart, and you’re just joe’s house of stationary, whatever it is and, you know, not be able to help me, you’re pretty much killing yourself because you don’t have eighty five billion customers would come to the door after me, you know? But i have a pretty big network and for a small business, two get killed socially as social becomes more and more what how we communicate, you know, it’s, just craziness, it’s, you know, we’re pretty much in a world, i think, where something almost hasn’t happened to you unless unless you share it a joke that, you know, if i can take a selfie, was i really there but it’s true, you know we do. Live in a world where, you know, i remember god ten years ago, maybe not even not even ten years ago, i was one of the first people have a phone in my camera, you know? And it was like, running from that’s what i said, yeah, carry my phone, right? And it was like a i think a point, eight megapixels, you know, it looked like i was taking a picture with a potato, but it was it was thiss i remember it was two thousand two and i was in chase bank and there was a woman arguing with the teller, and i pulled out my video, you know, it was there the crappiest video you’ve received, i pulled out and i said, you know, i started recording and the one being the cat woman wasn’t the woman behind the counter was talking to the customs saying you do not speak to me that way. You get out of this bank right now and the customers saying i just wanted my balance and you and your manager comes over. I get this whole thing on my little three g motorola phones phone and i remember i posted online and gawker picks it up. I gave him my e mail. You know, my headline, i put my blood was, you know, chase where the regulation ship is that go out yourself, you know? And it was it just got tons of play on gawker picked it up, it went everywhere, totally viral, it’s one of those things he was just like, you know, this is in two thousand two it’s twelve years later, how the hell can you assume that nothing is being with that you’re not being recorded? You know, i i and we’re blowing i sneezed a couple weeks ago and ah, ah, not to get too graphic here, but i needed a tissue big time after i was done sneezing, i’ve never going through my pockets, looking for desperate, looking for tissue, like looking around, making sure it wasn’t on cameras somewhere that someone didn’t grab that with hoexter viral sensation, you know? I mean, i went god, i went to high school with eight blocks from here, right? If the amount of cameras that aaron lincoln center today were there in nineteen, eighty nine, nineteen, ninety, i’d be having this conversation entirely i’d be having this conversation behind bulletproof for themself? Yeah, so, you know you’d be you’d be talking to you have to get special clearance to visit me. Pray be it the super max in colorado, you know, it’s one of those things that you just like my kid who’s who’s almost two years old now is going to grow up with absolutely no expectation of privacy the same way that we grew up with an expectation of privacy. And i’m thankful for that because she will make a lot less stupid moves, you know? I mean, god, the things that i thought, you know, in in high school, i thought the stupid is in the world, thank god there wasn’t a way for me to broadcast that to the world in real time. Thank god creating these zombie loyalists, and we’ve got to change some we’ve gotta change culture and thinking and reward zsystems let’s, go back to the cost of all this. Why is this a better investment than trying to just focus on new donors? I love i love this analogy and accufund analogy let’s open a bar and there’s, a very cute girl across the across the park and catch my eye catcher. I got to go. You know, you don’t know me. I’m amazing in bed. You should finish your drink right now. Come home, let’s. Get it on. I’m impressed. I am that good chance. Are you gonna throw a drink in my face? Go back talking to her friends. I’ve done a lot of research on this that’s probably now lets us sue let’s. Assume an alternate world. I’m sitting there on my phone. I’m just playing like you know, no boards with friendraising and she’s over there talking to friends, one of her friends. Holy crap! That’s peter. Peter shankman. I’ve heard him speak he’s in this fantasy world. I’m single too. He i think he’s single and he’s having this amazing guy. I know he has a cat. You haven’t. You should totally go talk to him. The very least i’m getting this girl’s number that’s pr. Okay. And what do we trust more me with my you know, fancy suit collar going over the seventies leaders in hi. I’m amazing. Or the girl saying, hey, we’ve been friends since their great i’m recommending that guy. You should trust me on this, you know? Obviously, that that’s where good customer service comes into play and that’s where corporate culture comes into play because i have a great experience with you and at your company, i’m going to tell my friend when they’re looking, and i will stake my personal reputation, there’s nothing stronger than that. And these are the people who want to breed at zoho willis that’s stronger than advertising strong of the marketing and they’re going to share people want to share that think about the internet runs on two things it runs on drama, drama and bragging are bragging and drama and if you if you need any proof of that, you know, go and look at all the hashtags with crap that’s happened, you know, bad customer service, bad, whatever, but then look at all the good hashtags you know, when our flight’s delayed for three hours and we’ll lose our seat. Oh my god, i hate this air land on the worst airline ever, but when we get upgraded, right hashtag first class bitches or whatever it is, you know it looks to me like that on the because we love to share it’s on ly a great experience. If we could tell the world and it’s only a bad experience, if we could make everyone else miserable about it as well. Need to take another break. Wagner. Sepa is they really do go way beyond the numbers they want you. They want you to know about these guides. The guides, they have many, many guides their help. You find your way through technical stuff. Break it down. Make it simple for you. Um, for example, ordered committee versus finance committee. If you’ve got these two committees, they’re different. What are the different roles and responsibilities? Um, this is one that hangs people up. You’ve heard me mention it before. Independent contractor versus employee checklist. Um, you don’t want to get snagged by your state department of labor or the federal, possibly department of labor and punch. Potentially be penalized. So i was talking about with tom. Was cell back-up early november. You want to do this right? Employees versus independent contractors, your disaster recovery plan. It sounds boring, but it’s important, if you have some kind of man made or natural disaster, where you going to go? How you going to run your non-profit business? How quickly can you be back-up serving people disaster recovery plan when he’s got something on that. Um, if your church church church internal audit plan, take a look at that bank statement review form. Take a look at that. All right again, wagner the going way beyond c p aying regular cps dot com click resource is then guides i plus software. You’ve heard me talk about this, the differences fund accounting that’s why you don’t want to be using quickbooks or microsoft or a p or turbo cash or something made for businesses fund accounting because you don’t want to miss spend money that has been given to you critical. Check him out. It’s apple owes accounting easy, affordable non-profit accounting non-profit wizard dot com now time for tony’s take two the state tax is lowering this or eliminating it going to hurt gif ts from the states ah, you’ll see it in my video. There is some evidence that when state taxes are low or we’ve had none in this country that it ah depress is charitable, giving the incentive isn’t there. People tend to give mohr to family, um, and reduce their reduce their giving to charities on dh. There are arguments on both sides. Um all right, so check out the video, you’ll well, i mean, i can’t be definitive, but i can’t talk about it on the video, and the video is at tony martignetti dot com talking about the state tax and whether it’s goingto hurt planned gif ts from estates and that is tony’s take two now back to peter shankman and zombie loyalists. Peter, you have a golden rule of social media that that a good number of customers like to share and people are going to keep doing it, people will always share again. It goes back to the concept that if you create great stuff, people want to share it because people like to be associated with good things. If you create bad stuff and buy stuff, i could mean i mean anything from, like, a bad experience too, that content people not only won’t share that, but we go out of their way to tell people how terrible you are. Yeah dahna you know, how many times have you seen companies fail horribly? You know, after major disasters when company’s heir tweeting, you know, completely unrelated things after after random school. Shooting? No, it was after the shooting at the theatre in aurora, colorado, the dark knight, the tweets hey, shooter’s, what’s your plans for this weekend, you know, and i’m just going, really, you know, but of course the thing was the thing was retweeted millions of times, you know, with a sort of shame on the so we were society, like i said earlier, that loves to share when when great things happen once but love to tell the world when we’re miserable, because we’re only truly miserable when you make everyone else miserable. Arika it’s funny you mentioned, ah, generosity siri’s the one of my favorite stories, which goes to sort of a bigger picture of culture, and somehow when you’re just doing your job because that’s what you’re supposed to do your job, but you don’t realize there are ways to get around that i i listened to your podcast, among others, when i’m running through central park on dh, more like if you know my body type more like lumbering through central park, but i get there, i’m in iron man have it and so i go to central park and it’s super early in the morning cause i usually have meetings and i dont run fast down. I run like i really dont run fast, but but as i’m running but let’s give you the credit that you have done a bunch of iron man, i have try that. The thing that i do, i do it. You know, my mother tells me that i just have very poor judgment in terms of what sports i should do. But on the flip side, i’m also a skydiver, which is with my weight is awesome. I fall better than anyone, you know, but so i’m running through central park last year. It was february, february of thirteen and fourteen of this year and it was pretty fun for forty five in the morning because i had a an idiom meaning and had to ten miles. So four foot every morning running about but labbate around nineteen, seventy ninth eightieth street on the east side in the park and a cop pulls me over and i said, what you doing? Look at him, you know, i’m wearing black spandex. I have a hat, it’s five degrees. I don’t wantto playing checkers, you know? Well, you know, i’m like i’m running and he’s like, okay, can you stop running? I’m like, okay, you get the park’s closed. Look, i’m in it. Look around, there are other people who know part doesn’t open exam like he’s ago would you have any idea? And you’re like, no, i’m running, he does what you name? I’m like seriously, look, i’m writing you a summons i’m like you ready metoo sametz for exercising for i just want to clarify that you’re writing metoo and sure enough, the guy wrote me a summons for exercising in central park before it opened. That charge was breaking the violating curfew. You know, i’m like i get the concept the curfew is to keep people out after two a m it’s not to prevent them going in early to exercise, to be healthy. I’m like, i’m not carrying, you know, a six pack, i’m not drinking a big gulp, i’m not smoking. I mean, i’m doing something healthy and you’re writing me a summons for it. Um, i said, you know, i’m gonna have a field day with this. I said, i kind of have some fathers, there will be a lot of fun i’m not you know, i know you’re just doing your job, sir, even though you have the discretion not to, but okay, so i go back home, take a picture, might take it, email it to a friend of mine in new york post front page, new york post next day. No running from this ticket, you know. In your times covered it, runner’s world covered. I mean, i went everywhere. Gawker covered it, you know? And my whole thing was just like, dude, you have discretion. Look at me, you know, i’m not i’m not even going super fast for god’s sake. I’m just just trying to exercise here, you know? And of course i went to court and i beat it. But how much money that cost the city for me to go to court fight this thing? You know, every employee you have to give your employees the power of discretion, of power, of empathy to make their own decisions. If you go by the book, bad things will happen. And again, small shops so much easier to do. Yeah, flatline flat organizations. I work with a non-profit animal rescue non-profit a friend of mine was a skydiver and shut him out. But i can’t but there’s a friend of mine scott ever and she was killed in a base jump several years ago, and her husband asked to donate in her memory to this non-profit so i sent him a check. And about three months later, i get a coffee table book in the mail and i was living by myself the time i didn’t own a coffee table. It was you no more money to spend on my flatscreen and i ah, remember, i call i look at this coffee table guy throw i throw in the corner, i look at it over next couple days, it pisses me off about how much, how much of my donation did it cost to print? Melon produced this book to me, and so i called them up. Well, sure, we believe most of our donors are older and pry prefer to get a print version as opposed to, like digital, you know, where they throw it away like you don’t throw digitally, but okay, i’m like so so you’ve asked your you’ve done surveys in, you’ve asked all you know, we just assume the most number older i’m like, i open my mouth one of joining the board and spent the next year interviewing customers, interviewing every current and past donor-centric get their information and shock pre-tax ninety four percent said online, and so over the following year, we launched facebook page, twitter, page zoho flicker account, youtube everything p s the following year for that donations went up thirty seven percent in one year in that economies, right ran away tonight, donations went up thirty seven percent in one year, and they saved over five hundred thousand dollars in printing malian reproduction. Imagine going your boss boss revenues up thirty seven percent and we save the half million dollars in boston about your really good beer. You know, all they had to do was listen to their audience, be relevant to the audience you have, and they will tell you what they want. We have tons of tools for segment. My god, you’ve gotta listen to what segment you want people want to be, you know, someone? Someone asked me today. You know what, what’s the best way i knew nothing about their company what’s the best social media left me to be on should be on twitter shevawn facebook i said, i’ll answer that question if you can answer this this this question to ask you is my favorite type of cheese gouda or the number six they said, i understand that’s not a real question like neither is yours like i can’t tell you where the best place to be your audience. Can i said, go ask your audience, believe me, they will tell you, there’s a gas station, the midwest come and go. I just love the name kumo, angio and their tag around. But you can read more about the tagline is always something extra. I mean, come on the jokes just write themselves for god’s sake, but they don’t take themselves too seriously love that. Come on ghost knowing the name of the company gas station and, you know, i remember there in iowa and i went to visit a friend in iowa, and i was like, you’ve got to get a photo of you in front of coming goes on, and the beauty of this is that and some of their employees actually look at their customers when they’re on their phones. We start to go, you know what? Use twenty more facebook and they say, oh, you and they record the information and they know it customers will give you so much info if you just ask them, because then they feel invested, they feel invest in your company, they feel like they that you took the time to listen to their non-profit requests of their their their questions, and they feel like they’re nufer harrow every month we have a one question harrow survey, you know, heroin question survey, and it was we get like a thousand people responded spend entire weekend emailing everyone responded, thanking them personally and touchpoint hyre weekend, but it was great because we’ll wind up happening is that? You know, if we took their advice and launch it on monday with the new thing, they oh, my god, how did this? They took my advice. Yeah was your advice to a hundred other people advice, but we took it and they don’t like it and it just it just made them so much more loyal, and they tell hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people we get in. There were days i got there days where i was in temple one morning, the garment center, synagogue and my phone. I feel like phone getting really hot in my pocket, which is not normal, and i’m starting her on i look at it it’s almost on fire. It had frozen because we were mentioned in seth gordon’s morning blogged. Oh, and at that time i was getting emails every time we get a new subscriber and the phone actually frozen and was locked and and was, like overheating i t at the battery and, like, reset the entire phone because we’ve got so many new fourteen thousand subscribers in, like, three hours scene obscene, you say excuse me, you say that customer service is the new advertising, marketing and pr? Yeah, it really is. Well, again, you know, if we’re moving to that world where so imagine a lot of limp and i love that i can use this. Now imagine a lot of land latto lamb has water, oil and a heat source, right heat source heats the oil, the oil flows with water, it makes pretty colors i’ve heard it looks really good when you’re high now i’ve heard. Now imagine if crystal’s imagine if you’re, uh, everyone you meet in your network, okay, is a drop of oil. The water is your network and what is your world? Everyone you meet in your network from from the guy you’re sitting doing the radio interview with to the guy who serves you ice cream with local deli to the guy who does your dry cleaning to your girlfriend to your wife to not same time to your kids. Second grade teacher to your second grade teacher years ago. Everyone you meet is in your network, you know, right now, when facebook for started, i would see the same weight from a kid. It was junior high school his posted on the same weight as like my current girlfriend, which is ridiculous. I don’t need to know about everything my friend from junior high school’s doing, having talked to kate in fifteen years, his face was getting a lot smarter, as has google. Now i see the people labbate kate with the most okay. And if i if i reach out to communicate with new people, they start rising and my feet in my stream if i don’t, they fall it’s just like a lava lamp. Every person you connect with is a drop of oil that heat source at the bottom that’s rising, raising or lowering those drops of oil is relevance. So imagine the heat sources relevance and the more i interact with someone, the more the higher they go in my network in the more i see of them, the more trust level there is when i’m at a bar and i meet someone at a restaurant unconference i meet someone i don’t need to, um connect them. I don’t need to go on facebook friend request, you know, awkward friend requesting is when you seven think that lesson my friend requested some of the real world with second grade will you be my friend? My daughter is doing that because, you know it’s like cat will you be my friend? Kind of the captain will be here, but, you know it’s, this awkward thing who the hell friendly west someone if i find hang out with you, the bar and we connect again and we talk and we go out to dinner and we’re having a good time with friends. I don’t need to first request that you, you know, that’s going away, friending following liking and fanning is all going away. What will interact is the actual connection. So if i meet with you and i have a good time with you and we talk again, if i use your business if i go to your non-profit if i donate if i volunteer, whatever the network knows that the more i do that the more interact. With you, the more you have the right to market to me and the more you will be at the top of my stream in the more i will see information about you, the less i will have tio search for you. But if you do something stupid or we’re no longer friends xero you’re going to fade. I don’t unfriend you just disappear. Unfriending is also dated a woman we broke up. It was nine months after we broke up. There was one from the other one because it’s just awkward zoho kapin friend of me. But you know the causes of not having to do that of just, you know, okay, i haven’t talked in a while. I don’t see your post anymore. The real world that’s how it should be and if you’re not feeding zombie loyalists, yes, they can start to defect. No question about it. I wanted to spend a little time on if you’re not reading now you are talking to them, giving them what they want, talking about their information, helping them out. They will gladly go somewhere else with someone who is, you know, if i have a great experience of the restaurant every week for three years, and then all of a sudden, over time, of noticing less and less that restaurant’s doing less and less tio, take care of me, you know, and maybe management’s change, and i don’t feel that, you know, i’m ripe for being infected by another company. I’m right for someone else comes to, you know, peter, because if i tweet some like, wow can’t believe i have to wait forty minutes for a table that didn’t used to be like that. If if someone else a smart restaurant, they’re following me and they’re going great, you know, appears no, wait, no way over here. Why don’t you come to blocks north? We’ll give you a free drink, you know, you know, and that right there that’s first sign of infection and i might become infected by another by another company because mommy little us for them and so let’s take you have a lot of good examples. Let’s, take a one on one situation. How can we start to cure that? The simple act of realizing following your customers, understanding when they’re not happy and fixing the situation before it escalates, you can contain a small outbreak a small outbreaks. Well, viral outbreak. You can contain that by getting the right people. Finding out what the problem is getting them to one room, fixing their problem, healing them. You have a good united story right back. When was continental? I was a frequent flyer and booked a trip to paris. Andi, i was very angry because they charged me four hundred dollars, looking for you. I remember what it was and that i called the ceo just just for the hell of it. I’m like i’m going. I wrote a letter or an e mail. So this is before social, right friend wrote an email, the ceo and like this ridiculous. I’m freaking fired-up like three months later, my phone rings hello, peter, please hold for larry kellman, ceo of coming little and i’m like, oh, crap, you know? And i got your telephone he’s like peter hated misjudgment e-giving started these fees of their new way. We sent that note. I’m getting it and see it. We’re gonna weigh them for you. But if you have any more problems, you know, feel free to call me and end of the phone the next forty minutes. What is staring at it like, holy crap? Larry kellner, the ceo of united airlines, just called me and talk to me and it was like, it was like, god coming down and say, you now have the power to levitate your cat. It was just ridiculous and so, you know, i have been faithful to continental and now united ever since on dh they continue to treat me with respect and do great things, and they’re they’re improving. They were getting a lot of crap over the past several years and that there really are starting to improve its nice to say, and not only, of course, your own loyalty, but you’re oh, my god, how zombie loyalist for them and how many times how much it’s unquote fired-up latto bradrick attract so many friends to united? I’ve made so many friends. I mean my father, you know, he only fleshing out it now, which means he only drag. He dragged my mom on the internet and i only drink my wife. You know, there’s a lot of lot of work that way we gotta go away for a couple of minutes when we come back. Of course. Peter and i’m going to keep talking about his book comes out in january. Zombie loyalists got to take a break. Tell us credit card and payment processing it’s passive residual revenue for you pays you each month. If you become one of their non-profit partners, you will get fifty percent of every dollar that tello’s urns from the businesses that you refer. And how do you do that? You think about the businesses that air that are already supporting you, whether it’s something local or something bigger that supporting you, is it possible for them to switch their credit card payment processing? I guess odds are it’s going to be something local? Smaller business is going to have a lot more control over who processes their credit card payments. Think of businesses owned by your board. Think of businesses down the street, you know, in the neighborhood family businesses. If they’re taking credit cards, they could potentially be a referral from you to tell us. And remember that special non-profit radio offer that that tell us has if teller’s can’t save them money, you are going to get two hundred fifty dollars a gift to you from tell us. If tellers can’t help them, so make those merchant referrals think about the business is that are that are supporting you that air in your community that take credit cards, it’s like every business. Um, those can all be potential referrals. Tell those payment processing, tony dahna may slash tony tell us now, back to peter shankman and his book zombie loyalists. You have some examples of zombie loyalist leaving and mass like dominoes netflix they’re both they’re both in the book so it’s so one leaving, if you know if you know, start the cure one leaving, yeah, and then that’s the thing you know, the little experience, maybe the internet with the hashtag everything like that, you know, it doesn’t take a long time for those things to sort of blow up in your face and, you know, the other day, everyone say, oh, you know, twitter’s responsible for for us losing another, you’re responsible for you losing? Yeah, yeah, and if your product isn’t great and you’re your actions, don’t speak well of who you are, then there’s no reason your customers should stay with you, you know? And it was all social media is really hurting. I know you’re hurting yourself. The only difference is that social media makes it easier for the world to know. Yeah, they’re just telling the story. Dominoes and netflix are good examples. They bounce back, they took responsibility and yeah, they both owned dominoes came out and said, you know what? You’re right, our pizza and we do have a problem. We’re going to fix this and they spent millions fixing it, and sure enough, they’re back with a vengeance. Now i may or may not even ordered the maroons in awhile, and i live in your city that’s, that’s a that’s, a sacrilege. But, you know, i have the app on my phone from oversea no traveling, somewhere being should bring or whatever and you know what? Do you get it? Eleven thirty at night when your flight’s delayed me landed dahna um, which reminds me i should go exercise on flip side looked so much like netflix. They they also were screwed up, you know, they were losing that trial switch between the two. They came up with a new name and it was so gross and public. Oh, man again, you’re watching the same thing happen with uber right now, so we really need to see if they’re able to repair themselves. Listening is important, but both those both those two examples they’d listen to their customers think there’s a problem with listening because everyone’s been saying, listen, listen, listen, for months and years and years and years now, but you know, no one ever says that you have to do more than just listening to listen actually follow-up you know, it’s one thing to listen, you know, i used to have my wife, i could sit there and listen to her for hours, you know? But i don’t actually say anything back she’s just smack me, you know, and go to the other room, and so you really have to it’s a two way street, you know, listening is great but can’t respond and look, i think further, and i was like, oh, twitter, so great, because someone was complaining on twitter and we went online, we we’ve saw the complaint that we fixed their problem in yes, how about if the problem that exist in the first place, you know? Because the great thing about twitter is that, yeah, people complain on twitter the bad thing about it is there complaining about you on twitter so it’s like what if the problem didn’t exist in the first place? What if? What if you empowered your front desk clerk to fix the problem so that i didn’t have to tweet hurts is my favorite story of all this i used to rent from her it’s religiously, and then i went to aa phoenix sky harbor airport has past april and i gave it i was giving a speech and go on my name’s supposed be on the board, you know, second grade that car and it wasn’t okay. What happened? I’m going upstairs. I weighed forty minutes on the v i p line after forty minutes they finally say, you know there’s a on ly one guy here a lot of people might have better chance we go in the regular line. Okay? Probably told us that a little earlier in the regular spend forty five minutes waiting the regular line it’s now been are you tweeting while this is happening? Well, i had to know i was actually not only tweeting i don’t have time to create a mean that should give you some idea. Of how long i was online with myself on those over, even if that means i get to the counter. How i can help you. Yeah, i was downstairs. The vp doesn’t tell me. Owe you have the appearance of asian intern upstairs? Like yeah. Ok. Let’s, let’s put a pin in that. They just sent me up here. Like, right. They have to help you. Well, it’s. Not really. They you guys for the same company. I mean, i could see the reservation on the screen. You you can help me. Sorry, sir. I can’t help. You have to go to the next. Like you just next to me. Okay. So if you know anything about sky harbor airport in phoenix, all of the rental car coming through on the same place. Yeah. So i walked fifty feet. It’s a bus takes you to the big a big a civilian where they’re all next week. I walked fifty feet from the cesspool of filth. Depravity that was hurts to the wonderful zen garden of tranquility that was avis and inform, innit? And i had a nicer, cheaper, more nicer, less expensive car given to a woman named phyllis who? Was sixty six and moved to phoenix from detroit with her husband for his asthma. I knew this because she told me she smiled at me, she brought her manager out and said that’s, another refugee from hertz, and i said, this happens a lot. They’re like, yeah, i’m like, well, you think they have done something about it and so on the way out in avis, i thank them. I walk past her, so i shoot on this, you know, sort of look at the look of the beast. I get my avis carnage at my hotel wanted to tel. I write a wonderful block post about my experience, called peter, and hurts in the terrible, horrible nobody could really bad customer experience. What you have a kid, you find rewriting titles about your blood post that have to do with kids books. I do not like hurts, sam, i am and and i included in this block post the five things i’d rather do than ever rent from hurts again. I think number three was was ah ride a razor blade bust through a lemon juice waterfall. With just, you know, and it’s a bit, but of course, the next day hurts reaches out to me. Oh, miss jay manuel, this is ahead of north american customer service that’s all you’re back, i’m like like, you know, we’d love to have make no like you’re not going to fix the problem. Number one seven avis car. I’m never going back to her it’s number two through a five people yesterday, five people interacted with all of whom had the chance to save me and keep me is a customer for life, a customer who have been so happy and i would have loved you five people blew it, so don’t waste your time trying to convert me back. You’re not going to know what you want to do is spend some of that energy retraining your staff to have empathy and to give them the ability and the empowerment to fix my problem when it happens, because five people, it takes every single employee to keep her company running. It takes one to kill it. Yeah, p s avis reached out to thank me personally. And i am now just this ridiculously huge loyal fan of avis. And always will be. You have a pretty touching story, but when you worked in a yogurt shop, you’re really young. We have a couple minutes tell it tell it could stay that was in the east side, which again, is yet another reason why i live on the west side. Nothing good ever happens in manhattan’s east side, so i was i was working and i can’t believe it’s yogurt, which was a store that i think back in the i c b y no, no t c b y was the country’s best yogurt the countries i c b i why was a poor i can’t believe that you can’t believe is that your family was yogurt was a poor attempt to capitalize on his teamviewer working in this store, and i go in every day and make thee over to clean the floors. I do, you know, a typical high school job, and it was during the summer and houses people walking by things like second avenue or something. And there were these brass poles that hyung from you know there was awning, right? That’s elearning that there and then the brass poles that held the awning. Up and they were dirty as hell, right? I’m sure they’ve never been polished ever. And i found i found some brass polish in the back with all the beer in the back and went after anyone outside. And i’m positive polishing the polls. My logic was, if the polls are shiny, people saw them, maybe they come in the store, maybe they’d want toe, you know, buy more screenplays and the manager came out, what the hell you doing? Told him what i thought. I’ll pay you to think inside, you know, like there’s. No customers in there. Okay, i’ll make sure the yogurt still pumping it full blast and i quit. I just quit that job. I mean, like, i couldn’t even begin to understand why someone would invest. I mean, t own a franchise bring fifty grand to at least to buy that franchise. Why wouldn’t he invest in the two seconds it took a little elbow grease to make the police claim that might bring in more customers? What the hell, you know, but you’re not paid to think you’re not paid to think my favorite line. Yeah, i just i i encourage if any kids. Listening. Those teenagers. If you. If you boss says that to you, quit quit, i will hire you. Just quit it. Probably worse thing in the world that you could possibly do, because you have customers who you have customers who every day could be helped by people who are paid to think and that’s the one you want. We gotta wrap up, tell me what you love about the work you do. I get paid to talk. I mean, my god is the same stuff i use get trouble for in high school, but on a bigger picture, what i really love about it is being able to open someone’s eyes and haven’t come back to me. I run a series of masterminds called shank mines, business masterminds, shank minds, dot com there day long seminars around the country, and i had someone come to meet so, you know, i took your advice about x y z, and i started listening little more, and i just got the largest retainer client i’ve ever had in my life by a factor for she goes, and i just can’t even thank you never said gorgeous by-laws aki listselect kayman thank you enough. Oh, my god, being able to help people. You know, at the end of the day, we’re i’ve yet to find another planet suitable for life. I’m looking so we’re all in this together and if that’s the case, you know, why wouldn’t we want to help people just little bit more? You know, there really isn’t a need to be as do she is as we are as a society, we could probably all be a little nice to each other, and you’d be surprised if it’ll help. The book is zombie loyalists, published by pal grave mcmillan comes out in january. You’ll find peter at shankman dot com, and on twitter at peter shankman. Peter, thank you so much. Thank you. Next week, dennis miller returns with a guide to hiring your next ceo. If you missed any part of today’s show, i beseech you, find it on tony martignetti dot com were supported by pursuing online tools for small and midsize non-profits data driven and technology enabled tony dahna slash pursuant regular c p a’s, guiding you beyond the numbers wagner cps dot com stoploss accounting software designed for non-profits non-profit wizard dot com and tell us credit card and payment processing, you’re passive revenue stream tony dahna slash tony tello’s, a creative producers claire meyerhoff sam lever, which is the line producer. The show’s social media is by susan chavez, and this music is by scott stein you with me next week for non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent go out and the green heimans buy-in what’s not to love about non-profit radio tony gets the best guests check this out from seth godin this’s the first revolution since tv nineteen fifty and henry ford nineteen twenty it’s the revolution of our lifetime here’s a smart, simple idea from craigslist founder craig newmark insights orn presentation or anything? People don’t really need the fancy stuff they need something which is simple and fast. When’s the best time to post on facebook facebook’s andrew noise nose at traffic is at an all time hyre on nine a m or eight pm so that’s, when you should be posting your most meaningful post here’s aria finger ceo of do something dot or ge young people are not going to be involved in social change if it’s boring and they don’t see the impact of what they’re doing. So you got to make it fun and applicable to these young people look so otherwise a fifteen and sixteen year old they have better things to do if they have xbox, they have tv, they have their cell phones. Me dar is the founder of idealist took two or three years for foundation staff, sort of dane toe add an email address card. It was like it was phone. This email thing is right and that’s why should i give it away? Charles best founded donors choose dot or ge somehow they’ve gotten in touch kind of off line as it were on dh and no two exchanges of brownies and visits and physical gift. Mark echo is the founder and ceo of eco enterprises. You may be wearing his hoodies and shirts. Tony, talk to him. Yeah, you know, i just i’m a big believer that’s not what you make in life. It sze, you know, tell you make people feel this is public radio host majora carter. Innovation is in the power of understanding that you don’t just do it. You put money on a situation expected to hell. You put money in a situation and invested and expected to grow and savvy advice for success from eric sabiston. What separates those who achieve from those who do not is in direct proportion to one’s ability to ask others for help. The smartest experts and leading thinkers air on tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent.

Nonprofit Radio for December 8, 2017: Scale Up & Sustain

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Kathleen Kelly Janus: Scale Up & Sustain

It’s a question I hear often from nonprofit leaders: “How does my organization get to the next level?” Kathleen Kelly Janus’s research leads her to the answers and she shares them with you. Her new book is “Social Startup Success.”

 

 

 

 

 


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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, i’m glad you’re with me. I’d be forced to endure the pain of knee or throw sis, if you gave me the false impression that you missed today’s show scale up and sustained it’s a question i here often from non-profit leaders. How does my organisation get to the next level? Kathleen kelly janice’s research leads her to the answers and she shares them with all of us her new book is social startup success on tony’s take two next month’s non-profit radio we’re sponsored by pursuant full service fund-raising data driven and technology enabled tony dahna i’m a slash pursuant and by wagner cpas guiding you beyond the numbers weinger cps dot com, you’re not a business. You’re non-profit at close accounting software designed for non-profits non-profit wizard dot com and tell us turning payment processing into your passive revenue stream. Tony dahna slash tony tell us i’m very glad to welcome kathleen kelly janice to the show. She is a social entrepreneur, author and lecturer at stanford university. Her work in philanthropy millennia oppcoll millennial engagement and scaling early stage organizations has been featured in the wall street journal, huffington post, stanford social innovation review non-profit radio is there techcrunch and the san francisco chronicle. I’ve been in the wall street journal too, so you know she’s, the co founder of spark i haven’t cofounded anything that’s the largest network of millennial donors in the world. Her new book is social startup success. How the best non-profits launch scale up and make a difference she’s at cake janice and i’m very glad and pleased. Thrilled that kathleen’s book brings her to non-profit radio. Welcome, kathleen kelly. Janice. Thank you so much for having me. Tony it’s, my it’s. My real pleasure. I am. I am anxious to talk to you about this book. As anxious as i was to read it because i do always get that question. How do we get to the next level? And i believe you have. I believe you have the answer. Answers, answers. I believe you can point us in the right direction. I hope so. Okay. Okay. I want i’m going to start with reading something. I’m actually gonna start with the conclusion of your book. Thiss paragraph. Just it struck me. So it says the journey. And we’re going to talk about your journey has made me even more keenly aware of how many non-profits are operating on a month to month basis, scrambling to raise money to sustain them. While so much innovation has occurred in the nonprofit world in recent decades, my conversations with organizational leaders and my observations of their daily routines have impressed upon me how considerable the challenges any non-profit faces are, no matter how innovative its model or impactful its services. What’s going on out there? Kathleen kelly jansen, janice well, i think you you really summed it up nicely. There. Those are your words, not mine. I just give you something up. I just i’m a copycat. What what’s happening is that we’re we’re on the one hand living in a philanthropic renaissance, it’s a really exciting time for non-profit innovation. So many incl, credible ideas are happening, and i’ve really had a front row seat here in the silicon valley watching so many non-profits capitalizing on a lot of the growth that we’ve seen in the tech industry as well, organizations like key by using crowd fending teo, be able teo support organizations in the developing world. And then, on the other hand, we have so many incredible ideas that are dying on the vine because organisations can’t get the financial support that they need to get to the next level to get to a level of sustainability, and i became really interested in this question myself. I was really, really curious. Why are some organizations succeeding and wire others really flailing? And it turns out that in fact, two thirds of non-profits in the united states are five hundred thousand dollars in below revenue, and many of these organizations should stay small, community based organizations and are feeling an important role in the non-profit community. But many of these organizations want to scale. They figured out a proven model that is working to support their beneficiaries. T help create a more just world, and they simply can’t get the capital they need to grow. And so might research really explores the foundations of success. What is it that organizations need to do in order to take that next step, and to grow their impact to the next level? You talk about the struggle to scale, which is essentially what you just said, even more eloquently. So? So? So let’s, we’re not gonna have time to go through the the entire book, you know, you’ve got five elements of what you think it takes toe scale and be sustainable, so i’m gonna i’m just gonna start with encouraging people. You just, you know, if you want to get to the next level, you just got to buy the book. I mean, non-profit radio is good as it is cannot substitute for this for this book. So all right, i may mention that a couple times, so why don’t you walk us through the five parts of what you believe, you know, your researches, you know, lead youto believe are the essential parts of what what’s needed? Sure. So there’s five strategies that i identify at that came up over and over again and one hundred interviews that i did around the country of organizations that have scaled past two million dollars and beyond and and that’s really the level that i define as a certain level of sustainability. And so the organizations that tend to scale really all exhibited these five strategies. So the first one is that they began testing their ideas very early on. And before they went out and raised money, they figured out some ways tow pilot it the programs so that they could figure out what was working at what was not about that by the time they went out to market, they had they had awesome impact to show and were able to get funded for that and b we’re able tio, then integrate a culture of innovation that helped them constantly improve their models as they grow. The second strategy is that these organizations that the organizations that tended to scale more quickly in a large survey that i did the survey results show that these organizations, we’re able to say that they began measuring impact from the very start from day one and that’s that makes sense because those are the organizations that were able to go out and tio show donors that they were having an impact. And but those are also the organizations that are able teo increase their impact by letting go of programs that aren’t working or tweaking them and making them better. So that impact measurement is really key and it’s, often something that organizations struggle with the third strategy is funding experimentation. And developing a plan to test both earned income sources as well as philanthropic income to figure out a funding model that works, and teo to be able to take the organization to scale there is no one size fits all sending model for nonprofit organizations. Every organization has to figure out what’s gonna work for them. And so putting some processes in place to test out different sources of income is going to be the best way for organizations to figure out what that is. The fourth strategy is developing a culture of collective leadership. I think we all have this tendency in today’s society, tio to revere the founder to put founders on the pedestal, whether it’s in the for-profit world with mark zuckerberg, the founder of facebook, or associating apple with steve jobs or even in the nonprofit world. And, you know, the quintessential example is mohammed yunus is is the founder of the grameen bank and won the nobel prize, and leaders should be honored. But at the same time, they’re the best organizations figure out that greatness is not built on one person it’s built on the backs of teamwork and the best organizations figure. Out how to bring in senior leadership early on so that founders can go out and spend time on fund-raising and strategy that they have really strong boards of directors that help help them grow their organization. And they flipped that hierarchical pyramid on its head and put the staff up front because they realize that they’re staff are the ones that are on the front lines making an impact and have the closest connections often to the beneficiaries is really the key to their work. The final strategy is storytelling with purpose. I think we all have a tendency to listen, teo a ted talk or ah, great political speech and think, wow, that person is just a natural. But when i went out and talked with all of these leaders, the best storytellers spend a lot of time practicing their craft. I had one social entrepreneur tell me that her she feels she’s an olympic athlete, and her olympics sport is storytelling and speech making, and because she could be speaking the word of god. But if it’s told in a boring way, then no one’s going to listen to her and these leaders figure out that organizations can have impact when they’re able to build a movement, and that comes with telling a good story and getting people on board and it’s not just that the leadership level is at every level of the organization because these organizations realized that staff members, board members, beneficiaries and champions can all be brand ambassadors for their organizations. And so they work hard. Teo help them with their storytelling so that everybody can go out and be champions for the cause of the five strategies. And to me, what was most exciting about this research is that i kept waiting for someone to say, you know, it’s, just charisma or grid or some sort of innate trait that makes an organization succeed or not. But no one said that on, and in fact it really came down. Teo thes strategies that any non-profit can implement, no matter what kind of resources they have at their fingertips. Kathleen, we had to take it’s time for a break. I wanted to do the overview. Hang with me while we take a break. Sounds great. Pursuant. The art and science of acquisition. That is their newest paper to help you bring in new donors paper covers strategies that work from successful acquisition campaigns you want to think of this as your campaign for new donors. Now i know this is fourth quarter, and you’re probably not devoted to acquisition. You’re more focused on ly bones and sideburns. Tryingto get those people back in and you’re and a renewal gift from your current donors for this year. So download it, check us out and keep it for next year’s acquisition work because it is it’s available now, you know that pursuing his data driven so research is going to be based on numbers, their research and what they have found is going to be most successful for you in your acquisition work, which metrics are most important for you to track? What is success look like et cetera. It’s not easy to bring in new donors let pursuing help you it’s, the art and science of acquisition, and it’s at tony dot m a slash pursuing capital. P in brovey okay, kathleen, i’m sorry. Thank you. Thanks for holding on their kapin. Okay. Excellent. I want to do some with our live listener love. Okay, kathleen, you are there, right? Yes. Absolutely. Ok, wonderful. I feel like doing the live lister love a little early. So let’s shout out to tampa, florida would ridge, new jersey woodbridge. So consistent with the listening i’ve some believe in. Would you please identify yourself? Woodbridge, newjersey, please come forward. I want to shout you out in person. Um, new york, new york, multiple new york, new york. We’ve got charlotte, north carolina live was naralo vago. And after charlotte and jersey city, new jersey my, my, uh my dad’s, my dad’s hometown, that’s, where he was born on mcadoo, half jersey city, new jersey live listeners love to you college station, texas is with us. So our germany good dog, seoul, south korea, on your haserot comes a ham nida mexico city. No! Yes, mexico city, mexico we’ve got multiple there. Good afternoon. Born a smart bona bona santa that zilly bonem start is is italy with us pornos era if you are, tehran is with us and took a result japan and the united kingdom live lesser love to each of you. We’re gonna divide it up today. The other two thirds are going to come a little later on all right. Kathleen. Now you don’t, you don’t like to go by katie or kate or cath or k. You’re strictly a kathleen girl. Is that right? That’s, my name kathleen. Okay, no, katie’s. Okay, okay. Um let’s, talk about your journeys i mentioned in when i read a little bit from the conclusion your parents were very active and promoted a spirit of giving when you were young. This is that seems to be the genesis of your interest in this hole in the whole sector. It was definitely an inspiration for me. I’m really lucky that i grew up in this amazing little small town and napa, california and my parents were very involved in the nonprofit sector. My dad was a community banker and my mom was a teacher, and they they served on dozens of non-profit boards throughout the year, so when i think about our weekends, we often spent time volunteering in soup kitchens or serving at the local medical clinic for low income workers, but our volunteer efforts and there we we sat around the dinner table and talked about how organizations often struggle. So my parents were talking about fundraisers they were hosting tio try and help support an organization that was struggling to get the resource is that needed to do that important service work. That’s what was where his thiss was actually this was dinner table conversation for you? Yeah. You know that that’s that’s ah that’s not comin right. I didn’t know any different. I know, i know. Yeah, but, you know, it’s, not it’s, not. I mean, i know you’ve realized that since then, but that’s a remarkable okay. I’m sorry. You know, that’s just that’s. Just remarkable, as i was reading about you having these conversations with your parents about sustainability, even though that word we weren’t using that word, but that’s what you were talking about? Well, yeah, and it’s. Not that my family was very sophisticated, it’s, just that they believed really strongly that there are people in our community who are not as fortunate as us and that it’s our duty to give back to those people. But that it’s not just about giving back teo, people who are less fortunate it’s about making sure that the organizations that are supporting them are strong so that they can provide those important social services. That something that was very much a part of my upbringing. Yeah. That’s outstanding, um and let’s. Now come to the research that lead you to the er to the overviewing that you gave us earlier. What was thea? Was the process for this lots of interviews? Yeah, so i really came at it because i had experienced this issue myself personally when i graduated from law school, i started my own small non-profit with a group of women and san francisco called spark, we engage young professionals and gender equality issues, and we also had this problem where we had a ton of buzz. In the beginning, we were growing our revenue every few months, doubling our annual budget, and then at a certain point, just when we were hitting our stride, we hit a wall and we couldn’t get the capital that we needed in the door to get to the next level and increases the impact that we wanted. So that was around the half a million dollar mark wasn’t it has a million dollars for us and for every for every non-profit it it could be different, but i have found that that half million dollar mark is a really critical st hump because it is a place that a lot of organizations struggled to get beyond that kind of like initial grant funding and initial seed capital to really get some more sustainable grant in the door. So to get back to your question about the process for me and when i began teaching social entrepreneurship at stanford wearing my research cap, i began looking at this question more critically. I developed survey and sent it out tio thousand organizations in the united states that were in some of the top social entrepreneurship portfolios, like echoing green and a show cow and school. And so i heard back from them, and i tested everything from, you know, was their social media better and helping them scale? Or was it there impact measurement in the way that they were measuring impact? And i came up with some initial findings that i went out and tested and got to go out and interview in person one hundred organization founders there they’re funders their beneficiaries, their staff, and really just asked them a key question, which is what is the secret to non-profit success and the findings they’re based on the stories that they told me in those interviews, the the parts that i wantto start to focus on is that that early stage you call it testing, testing ideas, i think of it is sort of you know, mastering as much as you can. The problem. Like trying to get your mind around what the problem is and testing solutions to it. Um, i is it okay if i describe it that way? Absolutely. What i found in my research is that the best social entrepreneurs fall in love with the problem, not the solution. Well, if there is a lot harder when you fall in love with that solution, teo, let it go even if it’s not working, but if we really focus on the problem, then you’re going to be a ble. Teo, figure out the best strategy to address the problem. You talk about ideation and brainstorming and not allowing any solutions to be censored at at the early stages. Yeah, and that’s you know that is that this human-centered design theory that has come up at stanford, at the d school or in various capacities? It’s really? Just a fancy way of talking about problem solving and a process for understanding how to brainstorm ideas, and it doesn’t really have to be fancy. I also do an example. An organization that i interviewed. It was wishbone, which is ah, crowdfunding site for low income kids who want teo have summer experiences in the arts are in fillmore and cooking helped them following their follow their dreams, and when the organization started, they didn’t start by launching this huge website in this platform and investing a lot of money, and then, you know, then find the kids, they did it the other way around. They did a really low cost test to figure out whether the model would work, so the founder was a teacher for low income students in los angeles at the time she assigned an essay to them and ask them to write about their passion. Then she took some of her favorite papers, and she photocopied them, and she stuck them in a male in the mail with a stamp and sent them to her relatives and her friends to say, would you fund these kids to be able to follow their passions in the summer? And she got a bunch of money from those people, and she was able to send them to summer camps and do internships and realize that there was really something there, and so it was really just this kind of low cost testing. In the beginning, that helped her figure out what worked and what didn’t and helped her develop an engine that she could then grow too scale and it is hard to to throw off solutions. I mean, you know, remove solutions, eliminate them, you know, you feel like you’ve got some resources devoted to it, but the outcomes are just not coming. It’s it’s hard to throw off, throw them off, though, and and started a family a lot of work to overcome that a lot of organizations get stuck in that cycle for two reasons. One is because it’s really hard, teo admit failure. So i think that’s a big problem in the sector is just getting more comfortable with failure, but because oftentimes sees these programs are doing important work and it’s not that they’re necessarily bad, maybe not the most impactful they be. I’ll tell you a story of one really successful example of this, an organization called last mile health founded in liberia. Tto help get help care for some of the poorest communities there, tio decrease their mortality rates had when it started thirteen different programs, everything from women’s health programs, tio aids programs helping patients with hiv aids as they started to grow, they realised that the program that was having the biggest impact was this program that was helping bring community based care to the rural areas of liberia, so there were no doctors there, there were people who had to walk, sometimes twelve, thirteen hours to get to the capital city on dh they had very few doctors serving millions of people, and so these community health care workers were able, teo give them the treatment that they needed, sometimes using cell phone service, teo get care remotely and as it turned out, because it was so successful, they decided they made a very hard decision of closing down all these other programs that were very good programs but just weren’t having that kind of level of impact they wanted to see. And when the ebola crisis hit in two thousand twelve, that was absolutely critical because they had focused their efforts on these community health care workers, those community health care workers were able to prevent it’s a global health crisis, so i can’t think of a better story, you know, that they really because they were able to focus their energy on a program that was working, they were ableto have massive impact, and so i think we all have to keep that kind of end goal in mind when we’re when we’re doing this, that it’s really about maximizing the potential of the impact that we can have and let’s talk about measuring that impact let’s start with the distinction between you’re outputs and your outcomes or your impact. Well, what i found is that a lot of organizations tend to to focus on the outcome on the on the outputs, those air, the vanity mac tricks that are very easy, tio t c so for example, how many people are participating in your programs or how many people are coming to your website to get social services but ultimately it’s not showing how the programs are having a change on their life, their long term outcome, it might even be something physical, like how many’s ah, backpack kits we put together for homeless outreach. Yeah, but then what is the home of the people do with them? And how did that change their lives? Great and does not change their lives? Thank you. Get out of homeless because it was really the ultimate goal, and so this is something that i think a lot of organizations struggle with because non-profit leaders are not data scientists, and sometimes it can be overwhelming to think about, like, how do you measure outcomes? How do you measure the ripple effect of providing that backpack to a homeless youth and what that does to get him in the door to a shelter that does that help him ultimately get a job and ultimately get him off the streets? That’s a really hard path to follow, but you don’t have to be a data scientist, and it doesn’t have to be so hard, and in the book, i give a lot of really tangible strategies that non-profit organizations can use to help figure out what are the long term outcomes and get past these vanity, not metrics that just make us feel good about our impact but aren’t really telling us whether we’re making progress toward the old nicole kathleen, we just have about a minute or so before next break, talk a little about the, uh, using this data to help you tell your story. Yeah, that was something that i saw. Over and over again is we have a situation where seventy five percent of non-profits collect data, but only six percent of them feel like they really know what to do with that data on the best non-profits figure out how to get it into bite sized chunks of information that someone can easily digest in just a few minutes and that khun b, whether you’re a small organization or whether you’re a huge organization, it really just comes down to those bite-sized pieces of information, indulge me while we take another break, wagner, cps they really do go way beyond the numbers for you, lots of resource is on their at their sight. When you’re cps dot com, you’ve heard me talk about the different guides and templates that they have there’s a lot of help for your nine ninety if you are preparing that yourself, i know you may very well be outsourcing that, but if you’re if you’re doing it yourself, there’s nine ninety help there’s help for your board different board committees like finance versus audit. What? What are the different roles that your boardmember and those two different committees should be filling? And how do? They complement each other. How do you keep them separate or didn’t finance committees there’s a conflict of interest policy for board members? There’s. An ethical statement, forbush, board members. So lots of board help. Employee’s versus independent contractors that’s a morass for for a lot of offices you know, you don’t want to get penalized by your state department of labor for mischaracterizing so there’s a checklist for employees versus independent contractor all right, so that those are some examples of the guys that are out there when you see piela is there more than just cpas, as i say, way beyond the numbers you go to regular cps dot com click resource is and then guides abila software, you are a non-profit but there’s a good chance you’re using accounting software that was made for a business like quickbooks or turbo cash, or and the problem there is that those don’t include fund accounting, so to cover yourself, you are probably using some external spreadsheets to keep your funds separate, or you’re using separate bank accounts to keep things separate because you don’t want to spend one one designated fund for a different purpose, like the jim renovation money on the lunch program. So you want to use a ah, a software and accounting software that includes fund accounting and that he’s made for non-profits and that is appaloosa counting helps you separately. Account for each of these different designated funds that you probably have and need to keep separate. You go to non-profit wizard dot com, and that is the landing page for non-profit radio listeners non-profit wizard dot com now time for tony’s take two next month non-profit radio is dedicated to your plans for twenty eighteen for instance, we’re gonna have something on the oracle net sweet social impact offerings, there’s software that allowed people may be aware of, but there’s also consulting from social impact the social impact team at oracle net sweet. We’ve got somebody to talk about that picky duvette from oracle net suite or business advice from score this is theirs. It’s free to you as a taxpayer funded in large part by the small business administration, we’ve got somebody from scored explain what’s available there. Where’s, the new tax law mean for you in the new year, jean takagi is going to explain it. You know him, of course, are legal contributor plus maria simple with prospect research amy sample ward on social media they’ll both be with me in january. Also talking about your twenty eighteen plan so the month of january devoted to next year’s planning. The video is at twenty martignetti dot com, and that will be very shortly. All right. And that is tony’s take two. Let’s, let’s continue with the podcast pleasantries. He was surprised i divided it up. We say on the heels of the live listen, love has to come. The podcast pleasantries well, the heels a little longer this time it’s a stiletto this time podcast pleasant few star over twelve thousand listening in the time shift. The vast majority of our audience is there, and i’m thank youl thankful that you are with us pleasantries to the podcast listeners and the affiliate affections to our am and fm affiliate station listeners throughout the country. Thank you so much for being with us. I’m grateful that your station includes us in their weekly schedule, and i’m glad that you are listening on the on the terrestrial on the terrestrial side, the am and fm affections to the affiliate listeners, thanks very much. Kathleen kelly. Janice. Thank you. You’re welcome. You’re still there, right? Yes. I’m here. Okay, cool. Um i noticed you. Ah er is going back to your parents. You you dedicated the book to your parents. And you say for my parents who taught me the value of citizenship? How do you define that citizenship. What do you think of a citizenship? Well, for me, i’ve been raised with this idea that we all have a duty to give back to making the world a better place, and so we all have the capacity to make impact in some way and to me that’s really exciting, and i think getting even mohr and more prevalent, i acknowledge that not everybody was is lucky to have been raised with that mentality as i was, although i’m sure there are others who had those really important dinner conversations about social impact where no, no, i’m not sure how called prevalent there you are, but more and more what i see with my students at stanford when i see the next generation, is that there is this changing mentality that non-profit work used to be just about writing a check to a foundation or teo non-profit and then being on your way, people want to roll up their sleeves now they want to get involved non-profit work is no longer relegated, tio, you know, when you leave the office at five p m that millennials are thinking about how can they make a difference in their work in making the word world a better place? Whether that is using their skills to do pro bono work, or whether that’s e-giving back through donations and getting others involved in like minded causes to me, this is really exciting because it’s increased the potential for all of us. Teo make an impact in the world because we’re thinking about social change in a in a really different way. But it’s also really exciting for non-profits because there’s an opportunity for non-profits teo capitalize on that and i think too many non-profits out there are operating in this old fashioned model where they’re seeking donations may be they have, you know, an annual event or an annual dinner where they bring people together for a long program and over dinner and then that’s it, they collect their money, and then they get back to them the next year when it’s time for the dinner again, but people don’t want that donors don’t want that they want to be engaged, and they want teo feel like they’re making an impact. And so the onus is on the non-profits to really think about how to help donors get involved and ultimately that will lead teo, i think more funding for organizations as well, you encourage non-profits to think about earned income, recognizing that it may not fit in every situation that there might be non-profits where it’s not appropriate. But let xero about the potential for earned income and howto explore it. Well, i am keenly aware, as someone who i was trained as a human rights lawyer, that not all causes air suited for earned income human rights work is a perfect example of someone cannot afford the bus fare to get to the courthouse in the first place. They can’t afford to pay a lawyer for their rights. Many organizations are going to rely on philanthropic capital to fill that gap, and that is important and that’s okay, but what i found in my research is that when possible, the organizations that are able to bring in earned income are going to be ableto have this kind of level of sustainability that helps them get through the hard times. Ah lot of organizations talked about the recession in two thousand eight went so many grantmaking organizations pulled funding that they had already promised these this was money that organizations were relying on, but their endowments had gone down. And tanked with the down jones, and so they weren’t able to provide that really important funding and the organizations that had earned income sources, like a fee for service model or, ah, model where they were selling products, those air, the organizations that had the fuel to get them through that time when they didn’t know where their next philanthropic check was coming from. So it’s something that i think all non-profits need teo, at least consider as they develop their funding model, are their sources of earn income that can help grow the organization and and be willing to experiment with those. Absolutely you also encourage a multiyear fund-raising plan so it’s a little about what you’re going to that i think so many organizations think about fund-raising like filling a bathtub with a teaspoon it’s painful, you’re putting the water in teaspoon by tea spoon, and then at the end of the year, when you start a new budget cycle, you drain the bathtub and you start over again. That is a really painful way to approach fund-raising and what the best organizations do is they think about fund-raising on a multiyear strategy’s, so they make sure that their grants, when possible, are multi year grant so that there looking at funding three to five years out and not just here in a year, and then they help educate their donors on the importance of that, so not just not just foundations, but also individual donors who can contribute on a year to year level. And when you set that culture into motion, it helps you think much bigger about the prospects for fund-raising a supposed tio from a place of scarcity, that mentality of scarcity it’s hinders a lot of not just organizations, but people, you know, they just they feel like the think aren’t going to get what they need kayman it really does, and i hate to use that example because i think it’s really easy, you know, as a researcher to say, just think bigger non-profits i can think is because they wanted that doesn’t mean that the funding is going to come in the door, but i do notice there was one funder that i interviewed who said you can tell the difference between the organization when you ask them the question, what would you do if you had ten million dollars? And the ones that are able to answer that question right off the bat, those were the ones that are going to go big because they’re the ones that are thinking in that way and that have a plan and are and believe that they can get there. And so i think it’s really, it is really about mentality in many ways. Yeah. Wait. Okay. So we need to overcome that. We need to have the courage to think at the ten million dollars level. Absolutely. And owners need to be thinking bigger too. I mean, go both way and that’s your responsibility to help your donor’s think that way, grayce imagine what we could do if we had ten million dollars. Imagine how many lives we could touch. Inspire those donors to be a part of the solution? That is really what it’s all about collaboration. You mentioned it earlier when you were giving us the eloquent overview. Um, let’s, let’s. Talk about the collaboration delegation. Strong leaders are not afraid to past tasks onto others. It’s really critical and organizations cannot succeed without a really strong team. The story that i love that really illustrates this is of kiva dot or gray mentioned earlier that crowdfunding platform to support small businesses in the developing world using donorsearch unnie from premiere from criminal united states, but also now all around the world, and this organization started right around the same time that i co founded spark, and so i got to see this firsthand competition, yes, and they well, well, they were anywhere competition, but you could benchmark against i guess you were well, yeah, and and it was really amazing story because jessica jackley and matt flannery, the founders, were on oprah winfrey. They were featured and bill clinton’s e-giving book and were featured on the oprah show that income that didn’t come for you as co founder of spark no, as much as you like, we saw what happened for them, they raised eleven million dollars overnight after being on the oprah show. They they literally crashed their servers and and we’re no longer able to accept funds, and so overnight they had to think about leadership in a very distributed way because they needed all hands on deck in order tio distribute all of those sons that they had received, and so now is an organization. They have one hundred employees and five hundred volunteers around the world. There, keep a fellows go into the field, tio tio follow-up on the grants and tio ensure that there going where they say they’re going. And teo, tell those stories and catalog those stories, they rely on all those volunteers and all those staff to be on the front lines. And so they have strategies to make sure that those people, their staff, feel empowered. Teo, support the mission of the organization. So an example is they allow their staff to develop their own impact metrics so the staff can feel connected to how their work in particular, is contributing to the mission of the order are excellent. Okay? It’s, not it’s, not top down, right? We’re we’re talking about the antithesis of top down leadership. Absolutely. I mean, even their feedback model, they have horizontal feedback mechanisms so that they’re not e-giving and receiving feedback in a top down way, and that really helps set into motion this culture of horizontal value for all employees. All right, kathleen, we take our our third break. I want to remind listeners the book is social startup success if you’re listening live. You could be cooking right through now to barnes and noble or amazon. Be buying it while i take this break. Tell us. Credit card and payment processing. This is a way for you to become a partner with tell us by referring to them businesses that would be willing tohave tell us on the ceo is why it look at the fees that the businesses are paying for their credit card and other types of payment processing. But, you know, credit card being the most common. Think of the businesses that you talk about, the ones that perhaps your your board members run or are part of businesses in your community that are supporting you now in different ways, whether it’s through some kind of sponsorship or they are purchasing tables at an event, or making outright gift to you. However there supporting you, might they be willing to change their credit card processor toe also benefit you. And the benefit that you will get is fifty percent of the revenue that comes from each of these businesses to tell us will be yours. Not fifty percent of the profit. Fifty percent of the revenue that comes from tello’s that comes to tell us from these businesses will be yours. And if tell us, can’t save the businesses any money, then you will get to what you want. You will get two hundred and fifty dollars. That is. Tell us his promise. You can see the whole bargain at tony dot m a slash tony tello’s. Kathleen, the the other part of collaborative leadership besides strong strong senior leadership is a strong active board. What do you like to see there? Well, a lot of organizations. Start out with it what i call in the book of friends and family reward where they know they have to legally have a board of directors, and so they go out and they recruit anyone who’s close to them tio help them with their organization, and this leads to a lot of problems because friends and family are not always the most suited to help you grow an organization on they don’t always necessarily have the skills, and oftentimes friends and family tell you what you want to hear, those really pushing you to be your back, not going to challenge you tell me they’re not going to challenge you. They’re not going to challenge yes, exactly, and so and so and so, really what? I saw it, the organization that scaled had a robust organise, a robust organizational board that was suited for the skills that they needed and the talents that they needed to grow the organization. And even if it meant having to go through that a brutal process as moving from the friends and family board tio more robust kind of governance board my husband always we have three children, and my husband always likes to say i can’t fire my mother in law, you know it’s a lot easier sometimes to hire a baby sitter. Well, that should be your job. You should be finding your own mother is so much easier for you to do. No one wants to have to fire their mother, so don’t put your mother on your board. That’s the lesson on dh really getting it right the first time is the best recipe for success, but there are strategies that i talk about in the book for how to move past the friends and family board to govern in sport. That’s really going to help challenge you and get you through the strategic planning process to help you build a theory of change so that you can show your a solution to the problem and illogical and impactful way board relationships. Very tough for lots of organizations. The relationship between the ceo and the board sometimes it’s a micro managing board, even those even the relationship between staff and the board can sometimes be difficult. Um, intra board relationships there’s a lot, there’s a lot of potential for problems there there’s a lot of potential for problems and there’s a lot of potential for solution. Well, one leaves you doesn’t have to be that heart. One of the key things that i talk about in the book for developing a really strong board is putting the policies in place. Sue you’re very clear about what the expectations are of your board. I think a lot of these challenges come in when it’s just not clear, whose role is what and what boardmember zehr supposed to do. So let me give you an example. Organisations that responded to may survey said that only fifteen percent of their boards are involved in fund-raising when asked what they would like their boards to do, more of sixty six percent of the executive director said they would like their boards to be doing more friendraising so that’s a huge disconnect and i would i would ask those organizations will what have you done to communicate with your board that you would like them to be doing more fund-raising what have you done, teo, establish what their fund-raising goals are in the board policy. What have you done to support their fund-raising efforts? Have you provided events that they can bring their contacts? Tio, have you given them the stories that they need to tell at a cocktail party so that they know how to make an elevator pitch if you want your board to be involved in friendraising you need to lay the foundation to make that happen. So i think a lot of board frustrations but executive directors have with their boards can easily be alleviated by just laying the foundation with clear policies and clear expectations like the model of collaboration that you were talking about, you know, bottom up you encourage that also in in storytelling, and i know i’m not sure if you had a well, i was gonna say my favorite part was the storytelling part, but if you had to pick, that was my favorite. I’m not saying that’s the most important if is it possible for you to say which of these? And we’re going to talk about storytelling very moment, very shortly, which of the five areas is like, most important, are you willing to rank them like that? Or you think they’re all equally it’s like asking maeda choose my my favorite child? They are all important, but i will say that that that that kind of they do, i write about them in the order that i write about them, because i think that they do. They do lay the foundation for success in that order, so you can’t tell a good story until you have the deed of and the qualitative stories to show for that, and so that impact measurement and that testing process is really key to get there. So you did. You did think through the sequence of ah, that you’re goingto present these in the book, yeah, it’s, that sequence is very important, okay? Non-profit metoo tested me more haphazard, but you, you thought through that when you’re writing a book is different. So you you, actually, you thought through this, okay, i’m gratified to hear that, okay? So let’s, talk about the story telling you. You like again, bottom up. Absolutely, it has. Teo involved everyone around you there’s an organization i interviewed called ideo dot or ge, and they used design thinking, teo help non-profits develop innovative solutions in their work, and they have this thing that they they implement on and their staff meetings called storytelling roulette, where they spin the wheel like a wheel of fortune, they they spin it and then randomly it will land on a story and they’ll pick a staff person in advance who on the spot has to tell that story as if they were pitching it to a donor or a potential partner? I’m not because, eh, every staff member hasn’t necessarily been involved in all of those projects and doesn’t necessarily have that institutional memory. That is the way to build institutional memory. It’s also a way to build skills. Storytelling is not something that just happened. Storytelling happens with a lot of practice and, uh and and a lot of opportunities to practice one of my dear friends, nadine burke harris has ted talk with three million views, and she runs an organization called the center for youth wellness focuses on toxic stress when i interviewed her and asked her about that ted talk, she said. She practiced it for six months, this ten minute talk, and she said, by the end of those six months, her has been could’ve given the ted talk for her because she had practice it so many times in front of him. So i think it’s important, that we remember to make this space for that practice, not only for ourselves as leaders of organizations, but also for all of our teams and our boards and even beneficiaries talk about in the book. Yes, i wanted to go to the beneficiaries. I was, so you’re so you’re so comprehensive. I was hoping you were gonna leave beneficiaries, then i would sound smart, so i know. But what about beneficiaries? But, yeah, way, just have about a minute and a half left before we wrap up. So talk about encouraging beneficiaries to tell. Well, i think when you’re working with beneficiaries to tell stories, i think there’s ah lot of things that organizations need to do to be very conscious of what it means to put a beneficiary in that position and to set them up for success. So it’s not always appropriate, and i think what organizations have two d’oh ah lot of thinking to make sure, for example, that the beneficiary is well past and being part of the program, that they are in a better place to be able to tell that story. But there really is no more powerful story for unorganised ation to tell them someone who has successfully made their way through the program and has created a better life because of that outcome. And so we talked earlier about output versus outcomes that is an outcome when you can show that someone’s life has changed and hearing that from a from a beneficiaries own mouth is really going to be your most powerful sales person for the organization. Those air so compelling the mean those khun b riel tear jerkers literally it’s and they don’t have to be high production value, but they could be very very compelling. Very, very moving. Absolutely. All right. We have to leave it there. I want to thank you very much. Catherine kelly. Janice. Thank you. Thanks for having me. Tony it’s been my absolute pleasure. The book. Get the book for pete’s sake. We just did a romp through it. You need the book. Social startup success have the best non-profits launch scale up and make a difference next week, zombie loyalists that’s our annual replay of peter shankman talking about extreme customer service. If you missed any part of today’s show, i beseech you, find it on tony martignetti dot com were supported by pursuant online tools for small and midsize non-profits data driven and technology enabled tony dahna slash pursuant regular ciba is guiding you beyond the numbers. Wagner cps dot com appaloosa accounting software designed for non-profits non-profit wizard dot com and tell us credit card payment processing your passive revenue stream tony dahna may slash tony tell us our creative producers claire meyerhoff. Sam leave lorts is the line producer shows social media is by susan chavez and this very cool music is by scott stein you’re with me next week for non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Go out and be great. No. Kayman oppcoll what’s not to love about non-profit radio tony gets the best guests check this out from seth godin this’s the first revolution since tv nineteen fifty and henry ford nineteen twenty it’s the revolution of our lifetime here’s a smart, simple idea from craigslist founder craig newmark insights orn presentation or anything? People don’t really need the fancy stuff they need something which is simple and fast. When’s the best time to post on facebook facebook’s andrew noise nose at traffic is at an all time hyre on nine a, m or p m so that’s when you should be posting your most meaningful post here’s aria finger ceo of do something dot or ge young people are not going to be involved in social change if it’s boring and they don’t see the impact of what they’re doing so you got to make it fun and applicable to these young people look so otherwise a fifteen and sixteen year old they have better things to dio they have xbox, they have tv, they have their cell phones. Me dar is the founder of idealist took two or three years for foundation staff to sort of dane toe add an email address card. It was like it was phone. This email thing is right and that’s why should i give it away? Charles best founded donors choose dot or ge somehow they’ve gotten in touch kind of off line as it were on dh. No two exchanges of brownies and visits and physical gift mark echo is the founder and ceo of eco enterprises. You may be wearing his hoodies and shirts. Tony talked to him. Yeah, you know, i just i’m a big believer that’s not what you make in life. It sze you know, tell you make people feel this is public radio host majora carter. Innovation is in the power of understanding that you don’t just do it. You put money on a situation expected to hell. You put money in a situation and invested and expected to grow and savvy advice for success from eric sabiston. What separates those who achieve from those who do not is in direct proportion to one’s ability to ask others for help. The smartest experts and leading thinkers air on tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent.