Nonprofit Radio for November 16, 2020: Adult Learning

My Guest:

Nico Chin: Adult Learning
To be the change around racism and white privilege, we’re going to have to create and learn new beliefs, systems, processes, and behaviors. So let’s learn how we adults learn. Nico Chin is our teacher. She’s founder of Up With Community.

 

 

 

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Board relations. Fundraising. Volunteer management. Prospect research. Legal compliance. Accounting. Finance. Investments. Donor relations. Public relations. Marketing. Technology. Social media.

Every nonprofit struggles with these issues. Big nonprofits hire experts. The other 95% listen to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Trusted experts and leading thinkers join me each week to tackle the tough issues. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.

Nonprofit Radio for November 9, 2020: How To Work In Uncertainty & Low-Cost Fundraising Software

My Guests:

Gail Bower & Karen Eber Davis: How To Work In Uncertainty

A June study of nonprofits has lessons for now and our future. The election may be settled, but there are unknowns afoot: reaction to the election; the pandemic; a divided federal government; federal stimulus; racial reckoning; climate change. The study’s co-authors shepherd us. They’re Gail Bower at Bower & Co. Consulting LLC and Karen Eber Davis at Karen Eber Davis Consulting.

 

 

 

 

 

Chris Bernard & Amadie Hart: Low-Cost Fundraising Software

 

Chris Bernard and Amadie Hart, the co-authors of Tech Impact’s new software selection guide, talk us through: What these systems offer; how to compare them; and how to select the best one for your needs. Chris is from Tech Impact and Amadie is at Hart Strategic Marketing.

 

 

 

 

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I love our sponsors!

Turn Two Communications: PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is our mission.

 

Dot Drives: Raise more money. Change more lives.

We’re the #1 Podcast for Nonprofits, With 13,000+ Weekly Listeners

Board relations. Fundraising. Volunteer management. Prospect research. Legal compliance. Accounting. Finance. Investments. Donor relations. Public relations. Marketing. Technology. Social media.

Every nonprofit struggles with these issues. Big nonprofits hire experts. The other 95% listen to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Trusted experts and leading thinkers join me each week to tackle the tough issues. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.
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[00:03:18.74] spk_0:
Hello and welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio. Big non profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. By the time you hear this, the election will be settled. It damn well better be. I hope you were okay. Going through it. I was immersed in the horse race and probably too much, which means I still am as I’m recording. But by the time you’re listening, it looks like it’ll be over. I hope we’re both OK. Be sure to take care of yourself, please. And others, I will do the same. Let’s each be understanding of what we and those around us have been through. It’s been a crisis, a trauma, and it’s time to start healing. I know there’s a lot of work and a long journey ahead. No doubt if we each take care of ourselves and have compassion for others, we’ll be starting that journey on the right foot. Let’s get started together. Is non profit radio still your favorite abdominal podcast? I just love that word. Why say weekly? When you can say abdominal, force your friends into the dictionary, I’ll start a campaign to replace the word weekly maybe not. No campaigns for a while. Oh, I’m extra glad you’re with me. I get slapped with a diagnosis of politico phobia. If you lobbied me with the idea of missing today’s show How Toe Work in Uncertainty. A June study of nonprofits has lessons for now and our future. The election may be settled, but there are unknowns afoot. The pandemic reaction to the election, a divided federal government, federal stimulus, racial reckoning, climate change. Need I continue. The study’s co authors shepherd us there, Gail Bauer and Karen Ebert Davis and low cost fundraising software guide Chris Bernard and Amidi Heart. The co authors of Tech Impacts New Software Selection Guide. Talk us through what these systems offer, how to compare them and how to select the best one for your needs. So stop asking, what’s the best system? Although I did Antonis take two. My November webinar were sponsored by turn to communications, PR and content For nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot c o and by dot drives Prospect to donor simplified tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant for a free demo and a free month here is had a work in uncertainty. It’s my pleasure to welcome Gail Bauer and Karen Ebert Davis to non profit radio. They are co authors of the study. What’s Really happening with non profit revenue? They’ll. Bauer is founder and president of Bauer and Co. Consulting LLC, a revenue strategy firm that helps nonprofits become self sufficient by developing reliable sources of revenue. Trained as a futurist, she studies where society is headed and what trends may impact her clients. Businesses Gail is author of the book How to Jump Start Your Sponsorship Strategy. In Tough Times, She’s at gale Bauer dot com and at Gale Bauer. Welcome, girl.

[00:03:47.14] spk_2:
Thank you. Hi, tony. Good

[00:03:48.39] spk_0:
to have you back. Thank you. Karen Ybor Davis and her firm, Karen Bieber, Davis Consulting Guide Organizations To discover propulsion tools to grow their profits and performance. She helps clients create dynamic partnerships and make an extraordinary impact. Her book is Let’s raise non profit Million’s Together. She’s at k e d. Consult dot com Karen, welcome to the show.

[00:04:14.26] spk_1:
Thank you, tony. It’s wonderful to be here.

[00:04:16.34] spk_0:
Pleasure. Pleasure. Have you both? Um, whoever wants to start, I don’t know with, uh, introducing the study and and a little about your timing and methodology. Who’s best?

[00:05:11.64] spk_1:
Karen. Go ahead. Sure about March this year we were looking at concerns and issues in the sector. Gail and I have been working together on different projects serving the sector for two years, and we realized that things were happening so rapidly. We didn’t really have a good handle on it, and we couldn’t go to meetings and meet someone and find out what was going on. So we said, Let’s go ask them questions And so we created this survey really curious about what was happening with individual income streams. There was this blatant, um, pictures of information and that things were just shutting down. All income was off and that yet that’s fine. But what was really happening? And from that, we put the survey out asking about individual income streams and what was happening. And the data was not surprising. About 125 people responded, but was fascinating to us, where the comments people made in the questions that were not multiple choices and that’s where we really have been still mining a lot of interesting things when I looked at it again, fresh, there’s new fresh things to see even though this data was collected in June.

[00:05:41.74] spk_0:
Okay? And Gail So I see. Ah, throughput of this is really the uncertainty that people were facing in. Well, you published in June. So I Karen, you said you were surveying what? I guess March, April May. I’m

[00:05:58.25] spk_1:
sorry. We surveyed in June, and then we came out in July.

[00:06:24.14] spk_0:
Okay, I see. So June, still early in the pandemic, Dale. Um, but uncertainty remains. And and now we’ve Now we’ve added the election to the pandemic and economic uncertainty and social justice upheaval. Uh, there’ve been more murders of black folks at the hands of police. So there’s Yeah. Uncertainty.

[00:06:25.31] spk_2:
Yeah, lots of uncertainty. When will there be a vaccine? When can we all get together again, et cetera, And all the other topics and all the, you know, all the details and sub issues of all of those that that still remain in our culture. So, yes, there’s a lot of uncertainty. There’s frankly, always a lot of uncertainty, but right now it’s at a fever pitch and times

[00:06:48.26] spk_0:
times five or six.

[00:08:45.54] spk_2:
Yeah, Exactly. And things were just shifting and changing so rapidly. It is really hard to get a handle on things. So I think one of the big differences between then and now when people completed the study and now is the biggest worry was Oh, my gosh, the pandemic. What does this really mean for us? You know, back in the beginning, you may recall people are thinking and we’ll be out of the office for two weeks and we’ll come right back. Well, now we know it’s gonna be more like a year and a half or so, um, we don’t really know. So now we’ve started to see people sort of settle in and and know that they have to continue operating. They can’t just stop. They have to continue operating, um, in the face of uncertainty. And so we’re starting to see people, you know, really? Take, I I would say one of three pathways count. I’m curious to see what you are seeing. And and tony, I’m sure you have an interesting perspective as well. But I think there are some people that have, uh, strategies from before that still have some merit. They might have had to update them or makes, um, you know, course corrections, but they’re still going strong with what? They’re what they’re doing. Um, some people and I’m talking about, in particular with revenue. Um, some people have had to make wholesale change, for example, organizations that are really dependent on in person revenue, like like concerts and, you know, performances and Gallas and things like that. It’s very difficult to be in in, you know, together and digital works to an extent. And then there are people that are really scrambling to figure out how they’re going to shift their revenue. Ah, lot of times, many of these, maybe your listeners, they run smaller organizations who may not have their footing. Yet they may not have developed repeatable, reliable revenue, which is really one of the hallmarks of being an unsustainable position. And so so this. This is a group that has to be really deliberate and thoughtful about their business model to make sure that they’re being creative. And they’re being thoughtful about the revenue sources that they developed. But they make sure that they understand how their business model functions so they take on the right

[00:09:15.84] spk_0:
forms of revenue. And Karen, I guess these these three sort of cohorts, maybe our sets of of of leaders, uh, emerged from those narrative comments that you were talking about.

[00:10:42.04] spk_1:
Well, we really saw that 0.3 kind of leaders, people who were still in a panic mode like Oh my gosh, and just kind of like whining. And it’s difficult in a survey because you’re taking a survey in any 15 minutes and you might have just had disastrous news. And so a little whining would be natural, appropriate, but the collection of the information and then there was these people who are kind of in this phase. We’re, like, really factual. This is is the tires of my car all flat? What am I going to do to fix it? And then this third group that was moving what we call the solving cells they were already moving into some like, Let’s try this. Let’s try that. So the e think in some ways we’re all we’re all those places, depending on what’s happening, we move through some of that, um, post election. Maybe we thought we were gonna have a plan, and all of a sudden it’s like, Oh, my gosh, how did this happen? Or where we at on Dhe then was like. Okay, now, this is what is what do I do with it? So it’s a begins to be a resilience model. The challenge is, is if you get stuck in any of those places if if you are just, you know, totally in the fax, we can’t operate. We can’t do it. We can’t that that’s a challenge, because you’re not gonna You’re not gonna make it. You’ve got to find some way to try to survive. You may not make it anyway, but trying something that makes logical sense, um is, I think, imperative.

[00:11:07.04] spk_0:
Alright. And that’s ideal for kicking us off with. With the last 25 or 30% of your your study is devoted to what? You know, how do we go forward? What? What’s the value of this info for your organizations? And by the way, let’s shout out where folks can get a copy of the study. Where is that? Karen? Okay, I’ll tell you what. I’m gonna talk to Karen. So, Gail, why don’t you look that up? That’s okay. Yeah, well, we want folks to be able to get this because we waken, uh, take off some of the stuff that I would like most to talk about, but there’s a lot more in the report. So, Karen, um, you the first thing you suggest is taking care of yourself, taking care of your organization. I’ve had other guests say the same thing, but it merits, you know, self care, organizational care. What, your ideas there.

[00:11:43.34] spk_1:
And And I would say part of that self care is recognizing you need more thinking time thinking

[00:11:44.10] spk_0:
is thinking is highly underrated. Yeah, terribly underrated thinking. Thinking is valuable,

[00:12:41.14] spk_1:
amazing and and define the place in time to say I am not gonna put out a fire for the next hour or whatever it takes. And I want to think about what it feels like. Maybe in six months. One of the re reading of some of the data is we were in June. We were so much right now. We were so much in the present. This is happening now and there was no there was no discussion of the election in June. There was no discussion off what the new year would bring, what we’ll be doing in 2021 that was six months away. Not all of us are into the future. But some of us should have been talking about it. So that ability to self care to take some time to think as well as toe recognize no one has been on this path before. No one has the answers. You don’t either. But you know your organization best and prioritize your brilliance about that.

[00:13:17.14] spk_0:
Okay? And organization Care to taking care of those who work with you for you, above you. Below you, you know? E feel like because it z things are so uncertain. Way need to take care of. We do need to take care of each other. You know, we have to go beyond the normal for some nurturing for some listening for some empathy, compassion. I feel I’m doing that. And I feel it in others to, you know, more. More more questions about How are you doing? How are you doing? You know, not just how are you? Like we used to Do you know before March? How you doing? You know, everything’s fine. Yeah, I’m good. Yeah. Yeah, more. I mean, there’s there’s more depth to that and and, you know, and beyond.

[00:13:38.84] spk_1:
Yeah, and in some ways, we have time we’re no longer running. We’re no longer commuting. Most of us are many of us. We are no longer running. Two meetings across town toe have lunch as a networking meeting. That would take three hours our day. And so we’re working more hours. There was an article in the Wall Street Journal this last week mentioning how many more hours people are working and it’s going to work on dhe yet we still have family obligations. So taking care of the people. Your staff, um, is really critical. I’m working with a group of CEOs, and the conversation they wanna have next is how to keep your non profit staff saying in the midst of a pandemic. So how do you help a staff member who has childcare full time at home?

[00:14:32.14] spk_0:
So, yeah, we need to be good to each other and understanding. Empathic compassionate. Yeah. Um, So, Gail, I didn’t mean to be the directive male testosterone burdening. But when I said look this up for you know? So, yeah, you give you homework while I was talking to Karen s. Oh, where can we find this study?

[00:14:36.54] spk_2:
I made a quick, short length. That’s not even that short but tiny u r l dot com forward slash revenue study results

[00:14:44.94] spk_0:
Okay, so it one more time,

[00:14:52.70] spk_2:
I put it in the chat box here to revenue a tiny URL dot com slash revenue study results.

[00:15:31.54] spk_0:
It’s time for a break. Turn to communications. They help you build relationships with journalists because of our relationship started and nurtured by turn to the New York community. Trust got to features in The Wall Street Journal. That’s the value of the pre existing relationships Turn to specializes in working with nonprofits. One of the partners, Peter Pan, a Pento, used to be an editor at The Chronicle of Philanthropy. The return hyphen two dot ceo Now back to how to work in uncertainty You’re you have ideas about revamping strategy.

[00:18:47.54] spk_2:
Yeah, well, so as I was starting to say, with with your business model, a lot of organizations are continuing with revenue forms that they had in this study. We found, um, interestingly, some conflicting information. Whereas some respondents found that individual giving was decreased, uh, or they expected it to decrease over time. Another group found that that was their shining light, that it was the form of revenue that was going to increase eso, you know? So I guess it’s sort of just depends where people are in their life cycles and where they are in their strategies and so on and so forth. But one of the hallmark mindsets that we saw that came from this are, as Karen said, the ones who had moved along the scale of resilience and who were taking a very positive mindset. Who were they believed all out in their mission and in their abilities to get the word out about their mission and all the, you know, all the good work that their organizations were doing and to think really creatively about how to move forward. And so, in thinking about a new organizations business model A Z, I mentioned earlier organizations need to be thinking about what forms of revenue have the most staying power now. And how might they want to expand the revenue? What other you know, are there other sources that could be coming into the fold? But they have to do it again very thoughtfully for, uh, for how the organization works. So a business model is not just revenue that comes in and expenses that go out. That’s a budget. Ah, business model is actually the system about how you know how the business side of your organization actually operates. So, for example, um, corporate sponsorship is a big piece of my expertise, and people call me all the time with questions about sponsorship and getting some help with that. And I’m always listening for the right conditions that are going to help them create success. And I try to guide people when I’m hearing conditions that won’t be successful. So, for example, every business model has some key activities key relationships that are important for success. Sponsorship, for example, requires an active marketing operation, a strategy, a set of operations, an audience to be successful. It requires staff and organizational competence, because if you don’t have anyone that can actually go out and talk to a corporation and you know, initiate relationships to develop them, then you know you’re not gonna have success there. And so it sounds like a pretty obvious peace. But, uh, you know, organizations are under a lot of pressure from the board members. Let’s try this. Let’s try that Somebody that I spoke to recently said Oh, well, you know, our board member thinks we oughta have sponsorship. And when we talked further, three organization doesn’t really have a marketing push. Uh, it’s maybe not even appropriate that they would have a consumer market being pushed. They certainly don’t have events that would be viable. Sources of revenue and the work that they do. It was very intimate, very personal. And so I just said to her, I’m not really sure that sponsorship is the right fit for you. She was relieved. She was relieved to hear that, because now her brain is freed up and she can focus on revenue sources that are gonna be the right fit. So we are all four. And Karen, I’m sure you would echo this. We’re all for people being creative. But don’t spend your wheels on creativity where you know, you have roadblocks right in front of you. So you have to really make sure that your business model is the right fit for any form of revenue that you’re gonna pursue

[00:19:22.57] spk_0:
anything you wanna add. Thio?

[00:19:26.94] spk_1:
Yeah. Tell on opposite story. Because because it really depends on who you are and what kind of value you could bring to the market. So looking for your revenue in terms of what is our value, how can we bring it? Who needs that value? One of the woman people I work with, who is the CEO? They had been doing a lot of educational events, and we see the little bit of sponsorship well, their their revenue for those has just gone up tremendously. They recognize that the rate is a medical related thing. That the doctors who people who are promoting different health cures and their industry could no longer reach patients directly except through them. And so their ability to capitalize on that restriction inside of doctors offices like payday for them on dhe, they’ve taken advantage of it. So what may not be your neighbor friends? Non profit solution may indeed be your solution, and that’s matching that value that you have. And now maybe you can see new value with the value of what people are seeking and making those connections.

[00:20:32.10] spk_2:
That’s a good point, I think, to some of the other issues that you mentioned tony. So the racial justice issues, for example, that’s another, uh, that’s another, uh, point of leverage because obviously many nonprofit organizations are really devoted to racial justice issues, you know? Well, even before the incidents, the death of George Floyd this summer and, um, organizations that may not have had that as strongly on the radar certainly are more interested in that now. And that is a point of overlap with the corporate sector. We’re all saying that this is a really important issue. So there may be opportunities to have work funded or to expand audiences in the and in the, you know, in the colors of community. Ah, commune communities of color. Eso that people more people are being attracted to these missions and corporate sponsors. Sponsors can benefit from that as well, and can help, you know, joined the cause

[00:21:51.24] spk_0:
again. Let’s stay with you for your next idea is just basically keep. Just keep asking. Uh, including for for requests, planned gifts, But keep on asking your folks for for support,

[00:21:53.04] spk_2:
right? So, yeah, I mean, Mawr and more organizations are, you know, communicating with donors and communicating with supporters throughout the year. And, um, you know, there there has to be ah, lot of emotional mo mentum without causing donor fatigue at the same time. So these regular opportunities to be in touch with donors and to be, um, you know, engaging them in the mission, engaging them emotionally. And what’s happening, um, is what’s gonna really help bring that donor to the fold? An

[00:22:30.45] spk_0:
individual individual generosity was something that you highlight in the in. Early reports of the survey, as as a shining moment, are shining experience for a lot of non profits that their donors have come through for them. But of course, you got to keep asking so that give them the opportunity to come through for you.

[00:23:59.24] spk_2:
Yeah, I think a lot of ah lot of organizations in the beginning, uh, sort of panicked, not seeing where their mission fit in the big scheme of the pandemic on I know, I had several conversations like this with executive directors and leaders and the nonprofit sector that, you know, we need organizations of all stripes. Right now, we still need the full panoply, the full infrastructure of non profit service’s to help, you know, continue making our society better because, you know, there is such a ripple effect from all of these issues, from racial injustice from the pandemic and, you know, health care disparities and so on and so forth. So we need all the non profit infrastructure justice importantly and therefore non profits have an opportunity to really update and update their messaging update the ways that they’re talking about some of these really topical issues and how their cause their mission is to attack or solve a certain portion of it and keep their organization in the spotlight. So it’s really important for this regular communication at the same time, while acknowledging that some people may not have the means to give at this time because, you know, we do have a you know, a problem with the recession. At the same time,

[00:24:07.81] spk_0:
you need to be understanding but still straightforward about what your needs are. Yeah, not not humble about it. Yeah, Karen, let’s go back to you for looking at risks. Uh, this it’s It’s sort of running through what we’ve been talking about a little bit, but just make it explicit, you know, looking at risks to potential revenue.

[00:24:27.44] spk_1:
Absolutely. I think everyone woke up and realized that their earned revenue wasn’t a sure thing was it was one of the first biggest learnings. Um, but they’re also going back to the donors that that donors were like the heroes of this because they showed you people loved you. Um, one of the useful things your listeners conduce oh, is to write down all the things that are worrying them and look at the ones that they really can control. Um, you know, they cannot control um, when we get the vaccine. I don’t think unless they’re variant vaccines on dhe, they can control a lot of things they can’t control when it will really be there. Special. Most favorite people will come out and come to their meetings again. We don’t know, but they can control how often they talked to those donors and what they offer them bring them and share and how they provide that value. So getting out and saying, My gosh, this whole list of things, it’s like, Oh, my gosh, it’s so scary. Well, a number of those you can’t do anything about, but the ones that you can are the ones you can focus on and and and getting real clear where you have leverage with your time and energy and effort, and then really, in terms of your revenue.

[00:25:31.54] spk_0:
Now, that’s excellent. You know, Look, focus on what you can control and, you know, obsessed privately about that which you can’t. But you’re you’re non profit. Needs not to be going down the path of, you know, What are we gonna do about when the vaccine comes out? You know, our Yeah, exactly. Exactly. All right. Um, let’s stay with you for a digital You. I think a lot of non profit have already figured out some of this, but there’s There may be more work to be done around enhancing your digital, um presents skills.

[00:26:04.74] spk_1:
Yeah. Yeah. Digital is gonna be with us. We are not going back. You know, I just don’t think every board’s gonna ever meet every time at once a month in person again, I think we’re gonna have selective. So we’re gonna have a hybrid world. And so we all need to have some growth in digital skills. And it’s well worth watching the zoom videos and getting getting up to date on those and getting some skills because you need to figure out how to do breakout rooms and poles and all those things. But that aside, digital is becoming one of the heroes of this experience to people are having events that were for their local people who could come in for the evening and comfort event. And all of a sudden, the people who are coming to events, it’s much larger in his national or statewide. And who knew that I was doing in Miami biz? Um, conference last week? And we have people from all over the state of Florida, and I’m thinking, Oh, it’s not Miami biz anymore. It’s statewide, And what does that mean? And who are you? And if you’re really good at digital, maybe that’s your revenue opportunity.

[00:27:06.74] spk_0:
Yeah, your events are no longer constrained by where you’re gonna host, huh? Where you’re going to rent a hotel ballroom or or by where your offices

[00:27:15.44] spk_1:
and your ticket prices might be very different.

[00:27:21.89] spk_0:
Yes, right, right. All right, Gail. Anything you want to add? Thio Digital Digital presence.

[00:27:39.49] spk_2:
Well, I just think that helping people focus on expanding their capabilities. Uh, and seeing you know, people may feel flummoxed about digital skills. Uh, e think I

[00:27:41.23] spk_1:
think you

[00:27:41.57] spk_4:
have been

[00:27:41.84] spk_2:
out to two ways e Karen around Karen. And

[00:27:46.75] spk_0:
don’t just pick your co authors. Pronunciation. Karen, you talk breaker.

[00:27:50.40] spk_1:
I know what she met.

[00:28:09.07] spk_0:
Okay, Perfect. Middle of the road. All right, I get about what part of the country are you in? Maybe that Z in Philadelphia. I’m from New York, New Jersey. I mean, I live in North Carolina now, but now, so that’s not the explanation. Yeah.

[00:28:09.77] spk_2:
Anyway, yeah, So people might be stumped about about gaining digital skills, But But if people could start to see that as an opportunity, I’m really an optimistic person. So trying to see some of these new changes in our world as positive as you know, new ways to communicate with people and that there are, you know, so many people figuring these technical, you know, technical skills out or these thes new capabilities out. So the goal might be, um, learning how to have new capabilities for the organization and continuing to expand resilience so that when you emerge from this period, whatever it is, however long it is, you’re stronger in that you have new capabilities. You’ve learned new ways to hold events or you learned new ways to market to people. I’m working with a client, right? now on really subsea financially expanding the way that they attract new people to the organization using all kinds of digital skills. And it’s really been fun. It builds on things that I already knew how to dio that they were sort of new to. But we’re all learning new things together about how toe how toe communicate with people when we can’t see them with limited budgets so that their organization can continue to grow The same organization also, um, expand. Like many organizations turned their in person event into a virtual one wants to have their virtual event in person next year. But they thought that there’s so much value about their virtual event that they’re going t o continue doing it. But for a very specific audience that may have less access to the in person one because of costs And

[00:29:56.41] spk_0:
probably so they have a digital component with camera camera, too, and live streaming

[00:30:02.64] spk_2:
exactly, exactly and and all kinds of other capabilities. So so it really you know, while this might be a difficult time and they’re all exhausted and they’re working so hard and doing so much, but by the time and there’s some other changes that we made digitally to that that we just realized. Yes, you’re like, Oh, my gosh, We’re gonna have all this new data. So? So making these commitments and these steps and he’s taking these actions now is gonna pay off later. So it’s, you know, we’re all slogging through and trying to find moments of joy through through this, you know, challenging time for everybody, but hopefully will all emerge stronger and with new capabilities and more resilient in the long run. And that’s the That’s the eye on the prize right now.

[00:30:48.84] spk_0:
Okay? No, Gale, you’re trained, is a futurist, and we’re recording on Wednesday, November 4th. So who’s gonna win the election?

[00:30:57.29] spk_2:
Futurist? The first thing futures learn is you don’t make predictions, okay? Yeah, exactly, But we

[00:31:06.02] spk_0:
already within the next. It’ll

[00:31:07.40] spk_1:
be a white male. What

[00:31:10.38] spk_0:
do you say?

[00:31:10.70] spk_1:
Yeah, it will be a white male

[00:31:12.43] spk_0:
male. Yeah,

[00:31:13.18] spk_2:
in their seventies. Yeah, hopefully

[00:31:18.24] spk_0:
the vice president will not be, um eso eso futurist. You don’t want to touch like the next 18 months. You have to go 18 months and out. Is that Is that like you have a boundary beyond within which you will not. Well, some some awareness or understanding off.

[00:31:36.84] spk_2:
Yeah, different futures focus on different time horizons. There’s some some futures that focus really long term. So, for example, there are colleagues of mine that might focus 10 50 years out and might advice, for example, depart Ah, highway department in a state that has a growing population so that they can figure out where to put highways. My focus tends to be shorter term because that’s what nonprofits really need help with eso the advice this week. Yeah, not this week. Yeah, look a little bit longer the next couple of years. Just take a look at all the all the trends that are happening and the impact of those trends. And, um and again, as Karen said, spend some time thinking, see what this might mean for yourselves and don’t get hung up about any one way or the other because the future hasn’t happened yet. Eso we wanna be thinking about all the possible futures and carve out your path where you want to go. But always stay alert. Toe all of these different trends and resilient Yeah, and be willing. Thio shift on a dime when you learn more information so that you are prepared for any threats and you have the opportunity to seize opportunities and you don’t get, you know, you don’t get caught under a nen coming wave that you hadn’t thought about. It just helps us some more creative and more resilient and more agile as we’re going through this.

[00:33:21.14] spk_0:
And you know that that sounds like a, you know, a lead into the to our sixth idea, which is considering new markets, new audiences. Um, So I’m gonna turn to Karen too. Sort of Take us out. And, uh

[00:34:04.23] spk_1:
Okay, So So it’s we kind of have referred to it in this conversation. People finding new ways. Andi, I think this is the crux of what the message is is what worked in January. Probably is never gonna work quite the same way again. And in some ways, that’s a good thing on and one of the people I work with, I am not going back. I’m not doing some of those things, so it’s an opportunity to shed some things on, then make room for the new possibilities. Who needs your value? Where can it be provided? How can you communicate that that that you have this value and that they should really invest in you to get it is really the the hub of finding new places.

[00:34:36.74] spk_0:
All right, that’s Karen Ibra Davis. She’s at K e d. Consult dot com and co author of the study. What’s really happening with non profit revenue is Gail Bauer, who remains a, uh, flummoxed futurist. She’s at gale Bauer dot com and at Gale Bauer study again is at tiny u r l dot com slash revenue Study results. Karen Gayle Thank you very very much for sharing.

[00:34:39.34] spk_2:
Thank you so much, tony.

[00:34:40.67] spk_1:
It’s been a pleasure.

[00:34:50.22] spk_0:
It’s time for a break. Tony is take two my webinar. I’m hosting a free webinar. Start your plan to giving in 2021. Yes, I’m hosting Kind

[00:34:55.08] spk_1:
of

[00:36:55.95] spk_0:
nice hosting my own, No longer subjugated to the will of the outside hosts. Know which I’m Of course, I’m always grateful for I get so many invitations, I don’t have time to host my own. But so at this time I’m hosting my own webinar. No, no more subjugation. Uh, it’s a quick shot. We’re gonna do this in 50 minutes. What plan giving is how to identify your best prospects, where to start your plan giving program, how to market your new program. And, of course, I’m gonna leave plenty of time for questions, which is my favorite. I enjoy the questions a lot, so I hope you’ll ask a lot. We’re doing this quick shot on November 19th. Thursday Thursday, November 19th at three O’clock Eastern. You can sign up for the Free Webinar at planned giving accelerator dot com slash webinar. That number again planned giving accelerator dot com slash webinar. I hope you’ll be with me posting my own, that is tony. Stick to now. It’s time for low cost fundraising software guide I’m pleased to welcome the co authors of Tech Impacts. Consumers Guide to Low Cost Fundraising software. Amid the Heart is a contract writer and researcher for Tech Impacts, Ideal Wear and president of Heart Strategic Marketing. She has a wide range of experience helping nonprofits assess their needs, select software to meet them and engage audiences and constituents. She’s at comedy Am a D. I. E. Chris Bernard is managing editor at Tech Impact. He’s a career writer and journalist with 20 years experience in newspapers, magazines, advertising, corporate and nonprofit marketing and communications and freelance writing. Tech Impact is at Tech Impact dot or GE. Comedy Chris Welcome to non profit radio. It’s good to have you.

[00:36:59.23] spk_3:
Thank you for having us, tony.

[00:37:02.73] spk_0:
Absolute pleasure. Chris. Let’s start with you. Please acquaint our listeners with Tech Impact.

[00:37:45.90] spk_4:
Sure, tech impact is a national non profit. We offer a variety of programs, and service is to other nonprofits everything from tech consulting software selection. Managed service is to our workforce development programs in Delaware, Philadelphia in Las Vegas, where we offer all sorts of educational opportunities for young people. We also have, since 2000 and 18, when we merged with Ideal, where we have an arm of the non profit that produces all sorts of publications and training for nonprofits around the country, most of them free of charge, including this. This publication we’re talking about today

[00:38:17.96] spk_0:
Now I used to refer toa ideal wear when I had Karen Graham on, she was the CEO of idea where, as the consumer reports of non profit software and she bristled a little bit, not really. You know, Karen didn’t get upset. I don’t know if she ever gets upset. She didn’t get upset at me. She bristled a little bit like a little pushback. Well, not quite. Uh, do you? Do you object to that? Do you bristle it? That that explains that whatever description of idea where

[00:38:20.51] spk_4:
you have been with ideal where since 2000 and six. Tony and we that is certainly accurate for one part of what we do. I think if anybody would argue that point, it’s only that we do so much more than just software reviews.

[00:38:35.22] spk_0:
Okay, Okay, Fair enough. Alright. I’m sure Karen explain that to me too. But because she bristled, I have to bring it up. So? So let’s let’s let’s dive into the title. So we know what folks are gonna be looking at and what they should be expecting. So how do you define low cost?

[00:38:54.22] spk_3:
Well, that’s one of the things that we did. Well, we first embarked upon the report over the years, we’ve always had fairly standard methodology for how we go about the report. And one of the factors that we do with the very beginning is decide. Okay, what is blow cost in today’s market? So in today’s market. We were talking with subject matter experts who represented people who work in non profits and work with the technology, as well as consultants who help nonprofits with their technology and decided that for this version of the report, $10,000 for a year’s worth of software is about the ceiling that we could have.

[00:39:38.12] spk_0:
Okay. And how about fundraising? How do you define fundraising versus C. R. M or donor management? Because this used to be called the guide. The low cost donor management software. Yes, we actually

[00:41:08.31] spk_3:
had a lot of conversations about that. Um, with all the systems that we have in here really run the gamut, some of them do call themselves C R M. Some of them do call themselves donor management systems, and some call themselves fundraising systems. And so we do set aside part of the report to talk about what we mean by each one. Um, so for the systems that were in the report, we needed them or to, um, really be the sole database for a non profit or have the ability to be the sole database for a non profit, um, and then let them do things like create online forms, a variety of online forms. Let them, um, creating collect data from email marketing campaigns. We did require systems in the report to be cloud based, and we also did require them to be able to, um, process online payments either natively or through an integration. Um, we needed them to be able to track fundraising metrics on the dashboard, um, and manage a report on both online on direct mail fundraising campaigns. So it’s a sort of, ah, lot mawr expensive than the systems that we looked at in previous versions of this report. Because in many ways, the work the nonprofits of I was doing in this area have really expanded a lot. And they’ve required systems and technology to keep up

[00:41:35.41] spk_0:
with that. You have 10 different functionalities that you measured. You measure all the system against I know, um, and that folks is just gonna have to get the guide. Obviously, we’re not gonna take off all 10 functionalities. Um, Chris, I’m guessing, uh, the following is not the right question to ask. What’s the best system? Uh huh. We try 5.5 minutes. We could just wrap it up. What thing You don’t Nobody has to read the guide.

[00:41:44.51] spk_4:
This is the fifth edition of the guide. And one thing that has not changed throughout the course of each generation is that we make a ZX clear as possible that there is no best system. This is not about ranking the systems against one another. It’s about teaching nonprofits what systems offer and how to compare them and how to select the best one for their needs. Because ultimately that is the best system. It’s going to depend on your specific needs,

[00:42:16.10] spk_0:
and you have very conveniently, I think, a dozen different use cases so that you can try to fit your needs into maybe one of those use cases, or maybe overlap a little bit like tiny but growing and prices critical midsize and want a system that grows with us. Meet easy, set up and use. No. And you have a dozen of those different use cases,

[00:42:50.50] spk_4:
right? That was one of the, uh, the features that comedy brought to this edition of the guide, where we’re always looking for ways to make it easier for the nonprofits in our audience to access the knowledge that’s in it. It’s a massive undertaking to put together, but it’s also a massive undertaking to read. Yeah, comparing that many systems against hundreds of requirements, criteria just results in a lot of data. And how do you make that data useful? So looking for sort of entry points for nonprofits, Ahmedi came up with the idea of coming up with use cases that were common to nonprofits in our audience demographic to help them understand how other nonprofits reusing the system, find the use case. That sort of matched in a reasonable sense what they were doing. And then that’s that’s sort of a starting point for them. Thio begin Narrowing Systems

[00:43:30.49] spk_0:
The comedy. This is the first guy that you participated with?

[00:43:35.31] spk_3:
No, actually, I did work on. I did several of the software evaluations from the previous version of this guide, and I can’t take full credit for the use cases and that we had a smaller, um, or more limited version of use cases in the last edition of the guide that helped, uh, divide up some of the systems or sort them into categories. But what we heard from people in the intervening years was That was one of the first things that they turned to in the last edition of the guide when they were trying to get their hands around what systems toe look at because they didn’t feel like reading all of the profiles. So realizing that that waas, um, the most useful entry point for non profits made it much more, um, it made it much more attractive as

[00:44:31.09] spk_0:
e made it more accessible. Yes. You know, these are the 44 or five systems that will suit best. This, uh, this use case, you know, And like I said, you know, times 12. So whoever is best for this, how do you think non profit could best use the guide, like Or maybe maybe what do we have? What we have to know in advance before we can get the most out of the out of the guide.

[00:45:02.59] spk_4:
I’m gonna let Ahmedi field that question, but I just wanna close the use case conversation by pointing out that not all the systems eso we picked systems to match each of the use cases, but depending on each organization, specific needs other systems that we didn’t choose for a particular use case might still be perfectly valid system for that use case, and it really comes down to specific needs. We just can’t drive home enough that this is the beginning of the conversation. And it should not replace due diligence on the part of the non problems themselves.

[00:46:49.68] spk_0:
Okay, Okay. You know what? I’m ready before we before we take on that. How best? Use it. Well, but I feel like we should just I just wanna take off a bunch of the I can’t mention them. I can’t name them all, But just so folks get an idea of what what products we’re talking about I just wanna I’m gonna sample from the table of contents. So black black Bart Boomerang e tapestry Every action Kila little green light nation builder Network for good Neon C r M salesforce salsa virtuous. Okay, so I just So people get an idea What? Just have some sense of what the universe is like that we’re talking in the abstract about time for our last break dot drives dot drives engagement dot drives relationships. Dot drives is thes simplest donor pipeline fundraising tool. They have made it customizable, collaborative, intuitive. If you want to move the needle on your prospect and donor relationships. If you want to get folks from prospect to donor, get the free demo for listeners. There’s also a free month. It’s at the listener landing page. Tony dot Emma slash dot We’ve got but loads more time for low cost fundraising software guide. So how should we? How can we best use this thing? What? This This thing, this guide, it took you like, 20 minutes. You know you thing, it’s like, uh, less time than this interview is. This conversation is the guy’s done? No. This, uh, in depth guide. What should we have in place or what should we be thinking about? Like before we take it on?

[00:47:09.26] spk_4:
Well, I think it

[00:47:52.08] spk_3:
follows along really much of the best practices in choosing any software system, not just, um, donor management or fundraising or C r. M. And the first thing that you dio is have do a lot of work internally about what it is that you do now, um, and what it is that you’re going to be doing in the future, Like what your goals are for fundraising and how the software can possibly help you meet those goals. So once you go in there, we have a full section that actually goes through the 10 different types of functionality that we review in the guide and talks about different questions that nonprofits can ask about things that they do. Um, that how it how it fits into, um, their work and so they can use that section to decide what it is that are the most important functions that a software package would do to meet the goals that they have, um, selected both presently and for the future. And then from there, they can prioritize that and then use those, um, prioritize functions to take a look at which systems do well in those functions. Which systems offer those functions? So while we have sort of the high level look at it in the in the pdf version of the report, the online version of the report actually goes into depth on every single function that is below the is part of the 10, um, divisions that we have so that self so that nonprofits can really look at the details and figure out which systems do exactly what and whether or not, it meets their needs.

[00:49:09.07] spk_0:
So the guide is that guides dot tech impact dot or ge slash forward slash donor hyphen management, hyphen systems and Chris. There’s much more than a PdF there. I mean, there’s certainly there’s a pdf version of the guide could go through that, but there’s a lot more on that site. A lot more robustness. Talk about what? What folks will find it that u R L

[00:49:58.27] spk_4:
Yeah, sure, we, as I mentioned before, this is the fifth edition of this guide, but we have probably put out more than two dozen consumers guides on different topics over the years, and it had long been a dream of ours. That idea where to make it even more useful to our audience with a digital version of the site that could be interactive that offered searchable sort herbal charts toe make it more user friendly to compare systems on. This is the first guy that we’ve been able to offer that, uh, digital site, which so it’s kind of a micro site version of the report, and we are adding functionality to it on a rolling basis as we’re able to so in the next week or two. We’re hopeful that we’ll be able to announce, um, added functionality to the comparison charts that let people just highlight which systems they want to compare in, which features they’d like to compare them against so that that’s coming.

[00:50:16.86] spk_0:
That’s just like consumer reports, just like you could do Sorry camera. You could do a head to head comparison or compared two or three on the criteria. The functionalities that are most important to you,

[00:50:28.35] spk_4:
right? And we have the common mission with consumer reports of educating people about purchases because this is a big, big purchase for nonprofits and thio that same point because there’s so much information in this report, and yet there’s still so much information we don’t cover. We’re also offering a companion training Siri’s, where one of our expert trainers is conducting live demos of 12 systems from this guide, and thanks to the generosity of Fidelity Charitable Trust, we’ve been able to make that Frito anybody who signs up while that Siri’s is already underway. All those demos are being recorded, so anybody who goes to the tech impact website and signs up for that training can have for free access to live demos or recorded demos of the 12 systems from this report.

[00:51:19.61] spk_0:
How did you pick those 12 question? Well, there are 12 use cases. I wow already know the answer, but I’m asking you,

[00:51:56.16] spk_4:
I’m gonna let Omni speak to this one in more detail. But we chose 12 systems toe line up with the use cases, not because they are the best systems, but because the it would be a little bit too much of a lift for us to do the detailed long reviews of every system out there. So we chose 12 that Air Representative off what systems can do in terms of meeting the needs of organizations for each of those use cases. How many do you want to add to that expound on that or clarify that?

[00:51:59.19] spk_1:
Yeah. So overall, we have 20

[00:52:01.16] spk_3:
three systems in the report on dhe. 12 of them, as Chris just said, were chosen to represent the 12 East cases that we have to select the ones from the use case. It wasn’t again the best system. Um, but it was a system that was highly representative off what you can do in a good portion of the use case. So, for example, the use case that we have for organizations that do a lot of, uh events is that we took a look at the ones that had strong events packages. Um, you know, uh, most of the systems that we looked at had either, uh, native or integration to be able to do some work on events. But there are some that really provide ah, lot of features around events. And so those were the ones that were in there and the ones that the one that we chose to represent the events category, um was, you know, a really good representative of that in a good representative. Overall,

[00:53:04.06] spk_4:
we get a lot of emails from people saying we’re looking at two systems. Neither of them are in your list of 12. What’s wrong with our systems? And we wanna We wanna make it clear that all the systems in this report are excellent systems. They all have different strengths and weaknesses, and that’s what’s going to guide people’s decisions. There are other systems that didn’t make it in this report. They’re also excellent.

[00:53:29.82] spk_0:
You say that you say that explicitly the report. Yeah, but they just didn’t meet your criteria for evaluation. Right?

[00:53:50.25] spk_4:
And people can read about the methodology by which we the methodology we used to find systems and how we narrow the list down on. We’re happy to answer questions by email, but it’s an important note that just because it’s not one of the 12 that we chose is representative To meet those use systems does not mean it’s not a good system, and that should not be a deciding factor. This is just an effort to educate people toe, help them start making decisions about what’s right for them.

[00:54:05.24] spk_0:
And Chris, those 12 videos are at the site that I read.

[00:54:27.94] spk_4:
Uh, no, I will put a link up there. But if you go to Tech Impact dot or GE and look at our training calendar, you confined that training on. Sign up for that and we will send you a link to all the different recordings that we’ve already done. A ZX well, Azaz, uh, invitation for the upcoming ones that have not happened yet. Okay, Okay. In fact, I’ll send you a link. You can post it on your page with this recording, if you like.

[00:54:39.54] spk_0:
Okay. Yeah, Thank you. I will. Um What else? We still got a few minutes left together. What else? You want folks to know about the guide? You’re unwilling to answer the question? What’s the best system? So that’s off the tape. That one’s off the table? Uh, no. What else would you like to know? What else would you like folks to know about the guide?

[00:54:48.74] spk_4:
I think you hit on a key point, which is that this used to be the consumer’s guide to low cost donor management systems on. For a lot of people who are familiar with that report, which has been out five times in the past, they may not realize that this is the same one because of the title change. So I just want to assure people that this is the same report. We’re just changing the title to be more in line with how the vendors and subject matter experts and users, a ZX well are talking about these systems.

[00:55:19.14] spk_3:
I also wanted to point out that it’s not the guide. While the primary focus of the guide are the reviews of the systems and the profiles that air in there, one of the things that we do put in there is. We take a look at trends and we take a look at how the marketplace has changed. And we do provide, uh, some advice for nonprofits who are in the process of selecting a system about, you know, some of the things that they should be looking out for and some of the things they should be thinking about. So I know it’s a long report. I wrote a lot of words, but that there are some good things in the front of the book material, so to speak, that can help sort of position the systems within the marketplace is the whole

[00:56:06.83] spk_4:
report of this size is a massive effort on. It can’t be done without the participate participation of a lot of people subject matter experts, consultants, but also the vendors themselves who are generous with their time for the demos and the fact checking on. We also couldn’t do it without the generosity of our sponsors. Which brings me to the point that we should talk just quickly about our editorial firewall. People will notice that some of our sponsors are also vendors of systems, but those of us who put the report together don’t know who the sponsors of the report are. That’s handled by Karen Graham in a different part of the building entirely. And we’re not aware of who the sponsors are until publication day. So one has no input with no impact on the other whatsoever.

[00:56:56.53] spk_0:
Do the sponsors know whether their system is going to be part of the guide?

[00:57:20.43] spk_4:
Not when they not not at the time of sponsorship. We have to reach out to them at some point when they become of, you know, when their system is selected, because they have to do the demos and everything. But there are Obviously it’s a limited constellation of vendors out there. All right, it’s tough to fund this kind of work, were grateful for the generosity of all our sponsors and advertisers who make it possible. But we have a pretty rigorous editorial firewall up to prevent any kind of impact from the sponsorship on inclusion in the report.

[00:57:56.03] spk_0:
Okay, we trust Karen Graham. She bristled, but you admonished me, could even go so far to say admonished, Um okay, should we, uh, I’m gonna read the u R l one more time Should we should we leave it there and encourage folks? Thio. Encourage

[00:57:56.70] spk_4:
them to sign up for the free training to see the demos. And if people do need additional help choosing software, if this is still too much of a lift for people to do on their own, which is valid considering the importance of a decision like this, that is something Tech Impact can help with. They can find that on the website as well.

[00:59:40.72] spk_0:
Assistance Assistance with selection. Yeah, okay, again the guide and the site that Chris described. Guides dot tech impact dot or GE forward slash donor Hyphen management Hyphen systems. How many Heart is a contract writer and researcher? Her company is heart strategic marketing, and Chris Bernard is managing editor at Tech Impact. Take impact dot or ge a median. Chris, Thank you so much. Thanks very much, Thank you. Appreciate it. Next week, A special episode. Adult learning with Nico Chin. If you missed any part of today’s show, I beseech you, find it at tony-martignetti dot com. Beseeches still good, but I am really liking abdominal abdominal May overtake Beseech I’m not sure were sponsored by turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot ceo and by dot drives Prospect to donor simplified tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant for a free month and a free demo. Our creative producer is Claire Meyerhoff shows Social Media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our Web guy, and this music is by Scott Stein. Thank you for that affirmation. Scotty, be with me next week for non profit radio. Big non profit ideas for the other 95% go out and be great.

Nonprofit Radio for November 2, 2020: Boards And Asking Styles

My Guest:

Brian Saber: Boards And Asking Styles

Brian Saber returns with his new book, “Boards And Asking Styles.” Your board’s Rainmakers, Go-Getters, Kindred Spirits and Mission Controllers all need to work with each other, your CEO and your staff. Brian shepherds you through how to make that happen. He’s president of Asking Matters.

 

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Board relations. Fundraising. Volunteer management. Prospect research. Legal compliance. Accounting. Finance. Investments. Donor relations. Public relations. Marketing. Technology. Social media.

Every nonprofit struggles with these issues. Big nonprofits hire experts. The other 95% listen to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Trusted experts and leading thinkers join me each week to tackle the tough issues. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.
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[00:02:12.84] spk_1:
Hello and welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio. Big non profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host is non profit radio your favorite abdominal podcast? I certainly hope so. You know there are seven days in a head, Ahmad, Of course, that’s the noun form. I’m so proud of myself. When I discover a new word that I have to open with this on. I want to thank Miriam Webster for sending it to me that I can discover it and be so proud. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. Id Bear the pain of leishmaniasis If you bit me with the idea that you missed today’s show boards and asking styles, Ryan Saber returns with his new book, That’s It. That’s the title boards and asking styles. Very straightforward. No fluff in the title reserved all the fluff for the book. We explore how the asking matters work that he pioneered will help strengthen your board responsive by turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot c o and by dot drives, raise more money changed more lives. Tony dot m a slash dot for a free demo and a free month non tony steak to a November webinar. I’m very pleased to welcome Brian Saber back to non profit radio. He’s president of asking matters home to the asking styles which help people understand and embrace their unique strengths. As fundraisers, he’s spent his entire career asking for money for nonprofits. I’m gonna telethon, Caller. I made your gift officer and executive director and now as a consultant. His first book was asking Styles Revolutionize your fundraising. His latest book We’re Here to Talk About Today is boards and asking styles. A roadmap to success. Asking matters is that asking matters calm and he’s at Brian Saber. Brian. Welcome back to the show. Congratulations on the new book.

[00:02:21.54] spk_0:
Thank you, tony. Thanks for having me back. I’m glad to see that Cove. It has indulged your wit at all.

[00:02:28.16] spk_1:
Thank you for recognizing that I haven’t undoubtable wit. I’m, uh I’m floored by that s oh, what a way to launch. Tony is wit. Uh, it’s not dull. It’s definitely not dull. No,

[00:02:40.64] spk_0:
it is not. We can use all of it that we could get these days.

[00:03:24.74] spk_1:
Yeah, we could use even even my just barely a Ndlela wit. Thank you. Uh, no, you gotta have fun. It’s my show, you know, whatever the hell I want to do, I mean, I just, you know, we’re gonna We’re gonna learn. But if we’re not gonna have fun, I’m not gonna bother personally personal. So lets you Mm. Let’s start out with the asking styles. We gotta lay the groundwork for the for. The handful of listeners don’t know aren’t well acquainted with the asking styles. Let’s lay that framework for folks. Then we’ll see how it helps your board. What’s his asking styles thing? Great.

[00:04:30.64] spk_0:
So the asking styles were developed a decade ago. Now by my co founder, Andre kills dead and myself. We develop them because everywhere we looked in the field, we saw people who said I’m not a fundraiser. I’m not this. I’m not that in particular. We saw it with the boards. Most board members have come onto boards. Will say I’ll do anything but fundraise. I’m not a fundraiser. I hate fundraising. I can’t ask my friends for money and so forth. And we knew how critical boards were to fundraising and that the type of fundraising. We were talking about the more significant gifts that come from developing relationships one on one, that that fundraising was all based on personality and relationship. It was much more art than science, and we had to help people understand where they fit in it so they could be comfortable. So we went about figuring out what makes someone’s asking style. We felt two characteristics. How one interacts and how one thinks were most important, how one acts on the extrovert introvert spectrum, how one thinks on the analytic, intuitive spectrum, and based on that there would be four basic styles and that you fall into one quadrant or another, but with a little bit of another style that no one felt cleanly in one box. There were some people who were uber this or uber that so such analytic introverts, the type of people who sit behind a computer writing code all day and such intuitive extroverts that, you know, creative just floating all over the place. You could never pin him down with massive ideas, but that most of us were somewhere in between had a little bit of this and that and we wanted people understand that. So we created this rubric for the field for the field of non profit to help everyone feel more comfortable and understand how to fundraise more successfully. How to tell their story in their own way from their own strengths. Not to worry about an elevator pitch, not to worry about reciting lots of outcomes measurements if they want to speak from the heart and a different, passionate, visionary way not to worry about that piece of what really sold them was outcomes and goals and plans that they had to speak in the language that was authentic to them. And that would be compelling, uh, to the donor, Teoh, a prospect or a current donor. So that’s that’s what we developed and meeting

[00:06:25.34] spk_1:
meeting board members. I realize this is not only for board members, but that’s our conversation today, and that’s you’re saying that’s where you found it. Most relevant, and then where they where they are, what worked with what you are type of person that you are in the quadrant will identify the quadrants and versus trying to make you something that you’re not, makes you uncomfortable

[00:06:29.20] spk_0:
right, and we started with boards than spent a number of years, much more focused on staff, developing a lot of materials in depth courses in a membership in such a brother. I bought Andreae now seven years ago, which is hard to believe. So I

[00:06:44.65] spk_1:
was going to say Now this started with you and Andrea Kill Stead, who’s been on the show. And then what? You pushed her out. You took her expertise on, then pushed her out for a nominal buyout.

[00:09:47.96] spk_0:
I broke her kneecaps and said, That’s it. Off you go. Um, you know, Andre is a She is a huge go get her. She’s a big ideas person and she has brought a tremendous amount of the field. But it was at her instigation because she said, You know what, Brian? I like really building these things. I have these big ideas. They’re running. It’s not really me, and I can see where you because my secondaries mission controller and I could do this plan full stuff where you would be better at running it and and and Andrea is significantly older than I am. I don’t think she would be bothered by my saying that. So she within a different point in her life and she said, Let’s let’s do this So I took it over. And as you may know, she went on to then build capital campaign, uh, toolkit with Amy Eisenstein. That’s been another great thing in the field. Yeah, so I took it over in, uh, 2013 and have spent the last seven years really developing the styles. Everything from the iconography you see now Thio the application of the styles in many ways, and I’ve got done trainings across the country and lots of conferences that are mostly for staff. And interestingly, I’m now circling back to board. And I’m doing a lot of board work, a lot of board trainings. And out of that came this idea that my second book should really be focused on board. When I started, it was pre now with this and and the the additional complications of being the board member and of running a non profit in many ways, they asking styles or even more important, because boards have to be at their best. In order for the organizations to survive, everyone has to be at the table. Helping to build resource is and everyone has to work together in a collegial way that create some synergy and makes everyone feel like they’re part of a team. And it’s hard to get to know board members anyway, when all you do is meet every two months for two hours and maybe you’re in a committee or two and that those meet once in a while. Now it’s all by zoom. Everyone’s overwhelmed zoomed out, and yet it’s more important than ever for people who feel their team and you have new board members I’ve seen. I’ve been delighted to see a number of announcements lately of organizations that have brought on new board members during this time, which is, you can imagine is challenging. You think of a board member coming thio their first board meeting, sitting in a room and getting to meet and experience other people and see how things really work. And now it’s all by zoom, which is much harder in a very different dynamic. So so, understanding the styles and how everyone interacts is even more important for on boarding a new board member. Look, you work, you get

[00:09:50.28] spk_1:
to recruit when we talk about recruitment to exactly but so Let Tze identify the styles. So you have things to spectrum. You got the analytic, intuitive spectrum, and you have the extrovert introvert spectrum. So if you know, put the extrovert introvert on the vertical and the analytic intuitive on the horizontal, you get four quadrants. So what are those? What are those for?

[00:10:14.26] spk_0:
Eso top left. You get the analytic extroverts. The rainmaker always goal oriented. Uh, driven, competitive. Keep their eye on the prize. Knows they’re succeeding based on the numbers, right? Did I reach this goal? Did I bring this money? Gets to to raise as much money. Then you have the intuitive extrovert top, right? The go getter, big vision thinker. Lots of energy brings people along with their enthusiasm on always sees the opportunities. So is bringing that big passion and excitement about the future. Anything’s possible. Then you have your intuitive introvert, your kindred spirit. Feelings oriented. I am primarily kindred spirit were our hearts on our sleeves. Everything is personal for us. No matter how hard we try to make it otherwise. And because we have that, uh, sense of sensitivity, we are sensitive to others. We tend to be very accommodating. We want other people to be heard and feel good and such. Also good skills for fundraising, different from the core rainmaker skills. And not to say a kindred spirit can’t be goal oriented. And a rainmaker can’t be compassionate and attentive on then mission controller. The analytic introvert bottom left. The Eagle Scout who always gets the job done. Very methodical, systematic plan ful and best at sitting back and listening and absorbing what’s happening. Great listener and observer, which, as we know, is so key to fundraising. So those the styles and they all complement each other and work well together can sometimes frustrate each other. But, um, but those are the styles,

[00:12:01.78] spk_1:
okay? And we each way each most likely have ah, primary and a secondary correct. So you’re you are kindred spirit and mission controller.

[00:12:13.21] spk_0:
Yeah, I am pure introvert. They which surprises people since I do so much public speaking and training. So people who know about the acting profession of lots of actors actually are shy or introverted, and you get in front of an audience and you do your thing.

[00:13:37.94] spk_1:
It’s time for a break. Turn to communications. They help you build relationships with journalists because of a relationship built by turn to the New York community. Trust got to features in The Wall Street Journal. That’s what happens when you have the existing relationship. And then when you want to be heard, the newspapers, the outlets, they take your calls. But you gotta have the relationship set up ahead of time. That’s what turn to is gonna help you do build those relationships. They specialize in working with nonprofits. One of the partners, Peter Pan A. Pento, was an editor at The Chronicle of Philanthropy. The right turn hyphen two dot c o. Now back to boards and asking styles. Perfect example of that. Aside from Brian Saber, uh, I’m seeing a lot of interviews with Sasha Baron Cohen because he has a Borat sequel out, and he has said, I’ve read it in online and I saw an interview with him. Eso he said a couple times. He’s primarily a shy, shy guy, but you know, he has characters who are obviously grandstanding. No, it alls, you know, it’s off, but s Oh, absolutely, And I and you people can go to asking matters dot com and you could find out which one of these you are right. You right. You could just do three minute little three minute quiz or so right?

[00:14:03.18] spk_0:
Exactly. Thank you. Yeah. You want it to be true. False questions. True. False? Yes. No, you know.

[00:14:10.12] spk_1:
And you The site admonishes us. Don’t spend a lot of time e I already did it. I didn’t just do it last night knowing we’re gonna prepare. I already know that. I’m, uh I’m primarily a kindred spirit as well. By birth. I’m a kindred spirit by birth but a go getter by practice and

[00:14:28.55] spk_0:
teach your primarily kindred spirits secondarily. Go getter.

[00:14:31.79] spk_1:
Yeah, secondary. Go get e No. Yeah, yeah.

[00:14:34.64] spk_0:
Pure, pure. Intuitive is what it’s saying. Massive, intuitive. Yeah, a lot of gut on the idea. Not a lot of planning percent. That’s a problem. A problem you got a plan ful person to about right? Yeah,

[00:14:49.44] spk_1:
I know. Now we need all four. But that’s why that’s why I’m not on any boards. Just do it. We’ll look back in six months.

[00:14:57.59] spk_0:
I’m not on any boards either. As a matter of fact, it seems it feels like a busman’s holiday to me. And I’m going when they’re gonna want me to fundraise. Andi. I’m not a big process person. Like go getters are much more into process. So Andre and I, over the years had to figure this out because she was pure process. Idi ated out loud, you know, lots of ideas. She could sit for hours and my eyes would plays over like I can be very cut to the chase. The Mission Control. Okay, let’s just do it. Let’s just lay it out. Let’s just get to the details and do it. And we finally realized that our meetings could only be a certain length of time. And I say all that because that been a challenge for me, with boards and any groups at all where I’m sitting there and I’m a little impatient, like Okay, let’s I just want to move to the next thing. I don’t want everyone talking and processing. I’m happy to go with someone else’s idea. Let’s just move it along. Three.

[00:15:52.31] spk_1:
Our brainstorm session is such a three hour brainstorm session is such a bore?

[00:15:57.24] spk_0:
E identified something in the 1st 10 minutes way Had something in the 1st 10 minutes. What? What did you say? Say it again the idea seemed pretty good to me exactly three

[00:16:11.09] spk_1:
hours ago. We could’ve had lunch and dinner by now.

[00:16:13.21] spk_0:
Exactly. Caught a good movie and come back just for the conclusion. First

[00:16:27.74] spk_1:
it sounded pretty good to me. Oh, right. Exactly. Contrary. Thio Brainstorming ideation session. All right, so, um all right, so let’s apply this to the board. So, as you had said, it helps if we know who is what. What is who on the board. What do we have? Do we have a imbalance of rainmakers and no process people to back them up, you know? Right. So we need tohave way. Need to have a balance,

[00:19:11.44] spk_0:
right? I mean, think of any planning session. Let’s let’s say you’ve got right now. There’s so many issues nonprofits, air facing. So let’s say it’s an issue of Well, what programming do we go forward with knowing that the current conditions are going to probably last into next summer? Okay, let’s make that assumption is aboard. Here we are. What are we going to do? Is an organization so the rainmaker is going to say Okay, well, what’s the goal? Right? What’s the goal of all of this? What outcomes. Do we want what we want to? Um, you know, we want to maintain We want Thio, serve our clients as well as we can. We want to stay fiscally responsible that then you have the go getter. Who’s saying the visionary who saying, Well, this could be the opportunity to pivot right opportunities, not problems, solutions, not problems. Let’s think out of the box. This could be the chance. We were looking for the kindred spirit. The very heart oriented person is saying, Well, we can’t forget the clients. We can’t forget the staff, you know, we need to you know, it’s really important that we come through for everyone, whether it makes the most financial sense or long term sense or not. And the Mission Control is saying Okay, great. I agree that we have that goal. I agree. You know, we could be something different. I agree. We have to care about people. But how are we going to get it done? It has to be realistic. And you can see where If you have an entire board of one or the other, you’re you can’t get the work done, right? Right. You need someone to check what you’re doing. We all need checks and balances and we need different voices. So once you look at the style so that you can see where if you’re going to do strategic planning, you need to have the four styles around the table to come out with a strong plan. Otherwise, you’re gonna have a plan that’s missing either the goal and outcomes or the big picture or the heart or the structure. And then and then you’ve got to fund. Then you’ve gotta work your way back into it Too late. Okay, way made a plan. But now Wow. Turns out we don’t know how toe executed because we didn’t have any mission controllers in the group or, you know, we didn’t think big enough. We went right into the weeds because we didn’t have our visionary in the group and so forth. So

[00:19:39.34] spk_1:
let’s talk about recruitment. If we’re, uh we’re gonna bring folks onto the board. Uh, you want this to be one of the factors I mean, there, there, obviously, you know, we need accountants. Maybe, you know, whatever. Whatever skill sets, you have gaps. And of course, those those really are predominant in your board selection. But you’d love for folks to find out what these potential board members asking styles are. Yes. So send them toe asking matters dot com as your recruiting them.

[00:19:44.29] spk_0:
Yeah, right. Wait three

[00:19:46.87] spk_1:
minutes. They print the report. Okay,

[00:20:13.04] spk_0:
Sorry. We don’t want you any go getters by you know, the reality for almost every night fucking is. We don’t get to pick and choose that much when we’re looking for board members. So some organizations really can. Others, at the very least, though, can say, Okay, we’re looking at our board, and we really seem to be missing kindred spirits. That’s bad. So lets

[00:20:15.89] spk_1:
you gotta have your You gotta have your kindred spirits. That’s

[00:20:18.26] spk_0:
bad. Absolutely. Eso eso when we go out, let’s keep that in mind, right, Because we might have more candidates and way might have more candidates, and we could put on in any one point. We might be bringing people on in classes, and we might want this first class to include another kindred spirit or two, and we might put off other people for a year. So it’s another factor. It’s not just a factor in who to choose, but how to understand who you’re choose, right? How to understand maybe what they’re saying and where they’re coming from. And to be ableto envision how that person would interact on the board, given that person style and the style of the board to get a sense of whether the person fits in or how the person would fit in. So it it not only helps you choose but helps you understand what you’re

[00:21:20.83] spk_1:
and you may not have. As you said, you may not have the luxury of selecting from half a dozen, you know, potential board members. So at least the one person that is before you know what his or her style is. And, as you said, how they’ll how they’ll work with the rest of the board. Right? Okay, okay. And and this applies for the for the CEO to write mean CEO board chair relationship. Don’t we want to know where those were? Those two folks stand

[00:21:40.34] spk_0:
right? I mean, you’re not going to choose one based on their style, but based on their style that they’re going to have different strengths and challenges and in their in their roles as the two leaders and in terms of how they work together. Because you, if you’ve gotto generally, the CEO is reporting to the board share most regularly. If the relationships going well, they’re meeting regularly. The chair is, in a way, guiding the CEO. The CEO is guiding the chair, Um, and so if you’ve got a chair, who’s a go getter and you have a CEO who’s a mission controller, especially when you have people who are diagonal to each other on the grid? Okay, who are you might call them polar opposites. There could be a challenge working together. One wants all this detail, the others flying by the seat of their pants. Ones, you know, very sensitive to criticism. The others just throwing it out there, vice.

[00:22:50.24] spk_1:
Because because if there if there, uh, diagonal diagonal to each other, then you’ve got You’ve got an intuitive extrovert. Uh, no. An intuitive introvert working with an analytical extrovert,

[00:23:15.24] spk_0:
right? I know. As a kindred spirit, intuitive introvert, that rainmakers, thes analytic extroverts can challenge me. I can get a little anxious because they’re very assertive. And for may I read assertive sometimes to personally, they’re not doing anything wrong, right? They’re just they’re being themselves. They’re bringing certain traits to the table, and I’m reading them a certain ways of kindred spirits. So now if I know, uh, this is why we might be having that challenge. We could talk it through and and at least understand each other better, like in any relationship. Um, in any personal friend relationship, any relationship, understanding the other person helps you depersonalize what’s happening.

[00:25:34.41] spk_1:
It’s time for a break. Tony is take two. I’ve got a webinar coming up It is. Start your plan. Giving in 2021. It’s a quick shot is gonna be just 50 minutes in and out. We’re gonna talk about what plan giving is how to identify your best prospects, where to start your plan giving program, how to market and promote your new program. And then I’m gonna leave plenty of time to answer your questions, which actually is my favorite and arguably the most important thing. Getting your questions answered. So there’s plenty of time for that. That’s it. Join me. It’s Thursday, November 19th, three o’clock Eastern time, which means two o’clock central, which means one o’clock mountain, which means noontime Pacific. No discrimination here by time zone. I do not discriminate against time zones. Everybody’s everybody’s. Everybody’s got a time. That’s the way it is. So, uh, quick shot. How to start your plan? Giving or start your plan giving start your plan to giving in 2021. You sign up for the webinar at planned giving accelerator dot com slash webinar. I hope you’ll be with me. That is, tony is take two. We’ve got plenty of more time for boards and asking styles You have, ah, formula. I don’t want to scare. People were math, math phobic, but very simple formula. You say teamwork plus camaraderie equals synergy. Yes, what’s behind that involved? There’s no there’s no regression analysis. You don’t have to know absolutely sine or cosine or tangent or or anything

[00:25:34.89] spk_0:
like that. Absolutely nothing. I was thinking. I was trying to think through as I was developing this book, what I wanted to say and why. And I came up with that, that that having the best board a board that really is on fire, if you will to me involved, uh, involves two things or is dependent on two things one teamwork, the ability teamwork is respecting everyone being able to hear other voices, uh, respecting decisions that come out of committee and so forth, respecting everyone sitting around the table and having an equal voice and things like that. That’s teamwork. And, um uh, Michael Davidson who? I do a lot of work with his quote in the book. He’s

[00:26:25.70] spk_1:
He’s been on the show

[00:26:26.81] spk_0:
e adore Michael and I’ve learned so much about governance from him over the last two decades. I’ve known him actually about almost 20 years because we met at Hudson Guilt. He was doing work for them, and I was working for them. Uh, and he talks about teamwork a lot because he’s a rower, as you know, and you have to be a strong team, you’re not gonna get anywhere.

[00:26:52.84] spk_1:
His company logo is is a right right,

[00:27:25.04] spk_0:
the board coach and it’s rowing and he talks about so he talks about teamwork. He talks about how you can do your job. If you don’t know what it is, you won’t do it. If you don’t think everyone else is doing it right, you have to be a team. It’s one of the reasons why I think everyone has to fundraise on the board because that’s what makes the strongest fundraising team. Not having a fundraising committee and saying over those five people are responsible for all the fundraising board is going to dio, so teamwork is very important and camaraderie. You also have to like each other not to be friends, but to you need to find it worth being in someone else’s company. And even if someone is very different from U. S. O. U. And that comes from getting to know people, not Onley sitting around the board table. But in a more familial way, it’s That’s the reason why some of these social engagements just before, after a board meeting, having board members go out to dinner together. All of that is really important. That’s why they do it in the corporate world, right? That’s why there are all these team building events. They build camaraderie, not just on the camaraderie helps the team work. But

[00:28:08.93] spk_1:
I don’t have Thio build the comrade. I don’t have to walk across hot coals barefoot

[00:29:29.74] spk_0:
E No, I wouldn’t do that either way. Okay? Yeah, No way could just have dinner together. We can have dinner together at one organization. I I had. I had board members in rotating groups of 4 to 6 go to dinner after a board meeting. So there were six board meetings during the year and twice a year each board member went out with a different group of people. So everyone got to have dinner with everyone during the year and such. It helped, Um, so when so looking at the asking styles, you can understand better how to work as a team. And you can also understand what, what types of activities would help build camaraderie? Because we’re all not going to like the same things. I, as a kindred spirit, don’t want to go to a big party with the whole board. I’d much rather go to a small dinner or just have a one on one coffee, right? If I could do that with a few board members, over time, I’m golden. I build that relationship if you send me Thio. The board president’s house to schmooze with all the other board members doesn’t work as well for me. Given my style, it doesn’t mean you don’t do it, but just a ZX with training and other things, you have to have a variety of activities to appeal to everyone. Just like you have to let people have a variety of stories to tell their own stories because everyone’s gonna go to tell the different ones. So eso building camaraderie, um, you do have to proactively work it. It part of that it overlaps both is making sure everyone has a voice right that everyone feels they are part of this group, that they’re integral to it, that people hear them see them. And so it goes back and forth, the teamwork and the Senate and the camaraderie. And that’s what gives you the synergy. So that’s how I came up with that concept. Okay? Yes. Okay.

[00:30:38.54] spk_1:
You you talk about Well, actually, before we talk about some process for meetings like making sure voices get heard, you have some concrete ideas. How about a story? Can you, uh, can you share something? In the 20 years of asking styles where you’ve seen a team, whether board or not, I mean, board would be ideal improve their outcomes because they became asking styles aware they became they were red pilled and finally e saw the saw the wisdom of asking styles.

[00:32:40.04] spk_0:
Wow, we’re going there. You? Mm. Well, I constantly hear stories. There’s someone on the website I often hear from from executive director slash CEOs who have these ah ha moments about their board chairs for sure who have these Ah ha moment about their boards, Whose then see the challenge, why their board is so challenged in some way and can address that. Who? Who realized g. I’m providing staff often say I’ve given the board all this information. I don’t know what why they why they keep asking the truth of matter is have they read it all? And if they’ve read it, have they interpreted it all and stuff? And the truth that matter is that we’re not necessarily giving every board member the information they need. So I constantly hear these ah ha moments from staff who say, Now I know what this board member needs. If I’m going to engage this board member effectively in fundraising, this is what I have to give this board member. I’m giving them the wrong information. So I hear that a lot that that has really helped. I did some work with Esperanza Academy, which is a private 100% tuition free and privately funded girl school north of Boston. Um, it might be in Lowell. I’m trying to remember where they are now. On. I worked with their head of development and then did a training herself and said it was extraordinary how how the asking styles moved her board ahead. There was a fundraising in terms of working with each other. It just took it, took them to, Ah, a whole new level. And I think I’ve always felt the beauty of the styles is that she point before you don’t have to know any big logarithms. There’s no jargon or anything. It’s very simply put, e don’t use fund these words and and all of this stuff e talk very plainly about it in the styles are very plain. I don’t try to make this scene like, uh, you know, like the you know, what is it? The theory of relativity, The theory of relativity.

[00:33:20.95] spk_1:
That’s where you get into cosign on C can’t

[00:33:23.16] spk_0:
exactly or pie or whatever Very straight

[00:33:27.13] spk_1:
first, unjust non jargon.

[00:33:29.54] spk_0:
Yeah. And so yes, so tons of ah ha moments. Um uh, respecting people to work with each other differently, working harder to make sure all voices are heard. Um uh,

[00:33:43.66] spk_1:
let’s pick up on that. Voices are heard. You have some. As I was saying, you have some concrete ideas about board meetings, making sure some folks you gotta check with them in advance, etcetera. So what? Her voices get heard at board meetings,

[00:34:04.24] spk_0:
Right? Well, I, for one, virtually never talk in a large group as a kindred spirit of mission controllers Air similar. I don’t often give my opinion in front of a large group. I don’t often ask a question. I don’t take up a lot of time in a group like that. Um, so I might have a very valid and important point that the group needs to hear that the chair wants everyone to hear. And I’m simply not going to express it in the group. And you see the people I trigger. I train all the time. You have guests all the time. You know which guests you have thio work harder, thio, or give the or wait longer to allow them to pull their thoughts together. That’s happening around the board table. And it’s happening even more so now with the video that with Zoom because everyone does tend to talk over each other. It’s hard to know when to stop. It’s harder than it was in person. Looking around the room where you feel it, you feel who’s going to talk next, Right here. You’re not sure. And then two or three people blurt out at the same time. So someone like me is going to be even less likely to participate because that blurting out and talking over someone is more awkward for me. Yeah, so

[00:35:20.44] spk_1:
you get into that rhythm where everybody stops on, then you beats and everybody talks. Everybody stops to more beats everybody, you go ahead. So then they all go ahead to beats later, right? Yeah.

[00:35:31.89] spk_0:
Dance, right. It’s a and I’m not going to do that dance. Necessarily. A lot of people won’t. So So if

[00:35:42.34] spk_1:
I promise that I won’t be, uh, talking over you, I’m just being a smart ass.

[00:35:46.35] spk_0:
Me to s o a chair. A smart chair who really wants everyone’s voice heard and taken into account needs to either reach out to those board members in advance and solicit their opinion or specifically call on them, make time for them right When I train, I look around that room and we’ll actually in advance of training. I will ask the CEO or whoever engaged me. Who should I be watching out for in one way or another who’s going to talk too much? And I’ve got to make sure that person doesn’t monopolize, are training who’s not going to talk because And regardless of what I’m told in advance, I see who’s not participating and I make sure everyone’s participating. It’s not that they don’t want to, or that they don’t have anything to say. It’s just that this is a tough venue for them. Be in a room with 25 other people and all the noise and people talking over each other. So you either have to solicited in advance or solicited in the room or solicited afterwards or send out a questionnaire, asked people by email to tell you in advance, you have to make sure that everyone’s voice is heard,

[00:37:12.83] spk_1:
and that’s a part of teamwork and camaraderie to ZX respect. Yes, yeah, that you’ve become aware. Now you’re red pilled. You know, some people are not gonna speak at the meeting or being very. It’s gonna be uncomfortable for them to do it. You have to make allowance for that. And that s so that builds up your That builds up teamwork and camaraderie. People feel respected there, literally being heard

[00:37:51.73] spk_0:
right now. Some people just, you know, talk a lot and don’t mean to cut anyone else off and want to hear the voice. And then there’s some people who just want to hear their own voice. And actually, one of the pieces of board membership is it’s not for everyone. You have to believe in teamwork. You have to believe that the team comes first. I’m not saying that the styles in any way can identify who would want to be on a team or not, because it’s much more complicated than that. But but there are challenges to group work, and those challenges impact certain styles more than others,

[00:38:12.92] spk_1:
Right? So yeah. All right, let’s talk about fundraising. How does this out of the styles impact board? Fundraising? Yes.

[00:40:53.41] spk_0:
So that we’re working on the whole decade, obviously. Uh, yes. Since they asking style started from a fundraising bend. It’s a very critical ways. The first one which we talked about earlier which is the number one way, is in terms of the story that each board member is going to tell. What is a board member going to stay in the in the most? In the simplest format, you run into someone, and the person said, Well, tell me about X y Z organization. What is it? You is a board member going to say to try to excite that person? What’s your story that is going to be impacted by your style? Whether, as we talked about it, whether it’s very goal on, strategy oriented, visionary oriented, hard oriented plan oriented? Okay, then you have Well, how is each of you going to go about this process of identifying and cultivating and maybe asking for money? And I say, maybe asking because the most important roles Board member, the most important role of board member can have in fundraising in my mind is the identifying, cultivating, thanking, recognizing piece everything but the ask. When it comes to the ask, some board members will ask on their own or with other board members. But in most organizations, you could bring the executive director and head of fundraising or someone else, to sit there in the room with you and actually say, tony, would you consider a gift of $10,000 for X y Z? Um, it’s all the other work that’s so important Thio for board members to help with. And that’s where style really matters. How are you going about going to go about cultivating as a board member? What’s comfortable for you? You have to take into account to some extent what what works for the donor? We don’t know. We usually don’t know the donor style, but if we don’t ask board members to do things they’re comfortable with, they’re going to be reticent about doing them. And they may not do them well, right? Well, I don’t want I don’t want to send my board members out out to slaughter, basically, by sending them out to do things they won’t do well and it doesn’t serve the organization well, so eso I will would think through if I have ah, big special event. My extroverted board members ago ended be better ambassadors of those events than the introverts who don’t tend to go up to people they don’t know and engage them in such. They’re going to be better at one on one effort. Uhh. Some people are going to be better at communication written communication, writing lovely emails with lots of great information in them. Some are going to be better at picking up the phone and having a quick chat on dhe. People will partner in different ways based on their styles.

[00:41:41.91] spk_1:
Time for our last break dot drives that drives engagement dot drives relationships. Dot drives is the simplest donor pipeline fundraising tool. It’s customizable, collaborative, intuitive. If you want to move the needle on your prospect and donor relationships, get the free demo for listeners is also a three month. You know that you go to the listener landing page at tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant. We’ve got but loads more time for boards and asking styles.

[00:43:06.10] spk_0:
So if I would like, um uh, I have a donor in mind and I bring something. The table is the CEO or the chief fundraiser, a za kindred spirit. I may look around to see who compliments me on the board, right? Or if I’m let’s say I someone has a relationship, OK, Soo is a go getter, and Sue has a relationship to this donor, so I want to go with Sue? Well, I’m a kindred spirit and Susan go getter and whoa! It turns out that our donor is a mission controller. So now how am I going to engage? So what is the best role for Sue? Is the go getter to play? And what might we have to watch out for? Right? How would we wanna make sure Sue doesn’t trip over herself? A za go getter going with me to see a mission controller? So it gives me a road map as the staff member, or certainly is the board members to how I could be effective, what my challenges might be. Even in the initial contact, we talked about this all the time of asking matters that from kindred spirits and mission controllers are much less likely to just pick up the phone and call someone out of the blue, even if it’s just calling to make an appointment. I don’t I never liked the phone, and I feel lucky that most of my career has been in the age of email. I will almost always email first if I know. I don’t know. Well, and I know the donor just wants me to call It is different, but most of the time we don’t know who. Uh, we don’t We don’t know people that well and I’m going to I’m going to write first by email. And if I know a board members that way, I’m not gonna push my board member to pick up the phone. I’m going to say, Do what’s comfortable for you If it’s comfortable to send an email, Do that. If you know the person well enough to send a text and the text. If calling and trying to catch that person is what works for you do that, so I help the asking styles help bring fundraising to the board member in a way that’s palatable.

[00:44:01.99] spk_1:
Got some ideas about you. Caption it. Under keeping board members committed, exposing board members to program Share your ideas there.

[00:44:57.99] spk_0:
Most board members do not experience or or view programming often enough. Board members come to organization excited by what you’re doing. They have a lot of passion. Yeah, I’m on the board now. I’m so committed. I love what you do and then end up spending almost all their time in board meetings that are mostly about procedure and budget and can be very dry the most organizations today or bringing program staff for program participants to board meetings on a regular basis. I hope everyone listening today is doing that, and so board members get some exposure the 10 or 15 minutes every two months. But that’s minimal. Board members have to C programming ideally, in person right now. That’s really hard. Maybe through zoom through video, maybe through a Q and A with various program directors and such. And again, the asking styles will impact what type of interaction will keep board members committed. So if I want to keep my mission controller board member committed, I need to keep focusing on the plans and making sure the board that board member feels good that we’re going about our work in a very methodical, systematic, well thought out way. That’s what and to share all the information about plans because the Michigan that that is the material that the Mission controller board member can absorb and appreciate. I’m not gonna do that for the go getter. The go getter isn’t gonna look at those plans, right? The go getter is gonna wanna have a telephone call with the program director with a or Or meet lots of participants and engage those participants and maybe participate in programs, whereas some people might feel it a little awkward to do that, the go getter will jump right in. So for my go get a board member, I might do that for my rainmaker. You know, a ZX. You can see the same themes keep coming up with this idea of strategy, vision, heart and plan strategy, vision hardened plan. So you got it. You have to bring that to each board member and then bring that into the It’s the meeting.

[00:46:43.30] spk_1:
I would rather you say the heart first. Uh, that’s the kindred spirits. I’ll fix it in post production. I’ll move.

[00:46:55.26] spk_0:
You do that. You do that. The only way I can always keep everything straight is to always go go clockwise. Yeah, no matter what I do, I’m always saying Rainmaker, go Gator. Kindred spirit, Mission Control and using my hands to remind me now that everything is vision is Elektronik. I’ve actually the vision. The image is reversed on the screen. And now that ever you could see my hands, I’ve had to learn like yoga, teachers and others. Yes, you gotta be. Oh, right. Yeah, exactly. So it’s a new skill I’ve learned the last seven months

[00:47:23.99] spk_1:
you’ve got. You’ve got the benefit of no video here. Yeah,

[00:47:26.58] spk_0:
exactly. Like my hands doing anything.

[00:47:34.08] spk_1:
Audio podcast. Yes. Mm. Alright, What else? What else do you wanna? You wanna talk about that? We haven’t talked about around asking styles in the board

[00:47:39.82] spk_0:
asking styles. And

[00:47:41.33] spk_1:
you wrote a whole book, for God’s sake.

[00:47:42.97] spk_0:
Yeah, I can imagine

[00:47:43.91] spk_1:
more. There’s more than what I asked you what

[00:47:48.45] spk_0:
it is, though, you know, though, I don’t want to scare people off either. And as you know, tony, it’s not a big book, and it’s purposely not a big look. It’s actually only 16,000 words. If people know anything about books, it’s only 100 pages because there are lots of beautiful full color photos and graphs and things like that. It’s a book you can read in a two sitting,

[00:48:06.04] spk_1:
which I appreciate. I like all the photos, something the pictures I sometimes have authors on. I’ll say, you know, there’s no pictures or there’s not enough

[00:48:13.77] spk_0:
well in my books. The only book in full color. I want to say that cause I’m really proud of it. It costs a lot more to make it, but, uh, but the styles Aaron color right? The graphics are so so. It’s actually very pleasurable book. And the reason for that It’s really important for every board member to read it right.

[00:48:29.73] spk_1:
Easy read. Do it over a weekend easily. You could do it in a day if you had to, but yes, so we hope

[00:48:52.16] spk_0:
to say, you know, today we covered a lot of the major points in it, about about recruiting, camaraderie, teamwork, telling her story, leadership and such. Those are the major piece in the book. The one thing I’ll say is that you’re pushing the book, I guess, is that it has a bunch of exercises and questions to ask yourself is Well, and the important thing is not is not to believe that G if I if I’m going to address the challenges on my board, it’s got to be some big project I need to bring in a consultant or boy, this is gonna be a lot of hard work. There are lots of small steps you can take.

[00:49:15.92] spk_1:
Yes, you finished the book with the next steps?

[00:50:03.86] spk_0:
Yes and yes. And all along the way there are some exercises the next time you have zoomed called do a breakout room and just ask. People spend five minutes saying, Okay, my style is this. What does that mean for how I work with you or something? You’re going to build teamwork and camaraderie. And so I want people to take away that that make improvements toe how your board operates, which is so vital to how your organization gets through this and thrives in the future. Uh, does not have to be a big, overwhelming project through the asking styles and lots of other means. You can take small steps and get there. The

[00:50:08.46] spk_1:
book is a pleasure. It’s a pleasurable pleasure to read. It’s an easy read. You want to know your style. You goto asking matters dot com. Do the three minute survey. Send your board members as a little fun exercise chat about it. That’s you know, that could be a next step, but

[00:50:18.71] spk_0:
absolutely that

[00:50:24.46] spk_1:
a whole chapter of next steps and, like you said questions throughout. Okay, Brian Saber, Thank you very much. Uh, have you. Actually, Absolutely. So the book. Get the book. There is more depth. There is more depth in those 16,000 words than than a lackluster host can cover with, even with an exemplary guest. Eso. The book is boards and asking styles. A roadmap to success matters that asking matters dot com and Brian is at Brian Saber and Brian. Thank you again. Real pleasure. Thank

[00:50:52.97] spk_0:
you. Don’t have a great day. Good luck to everyone.

[00:51:31.56] spk_1:
Thank you Next week next week. I got it here right next week is Oh yes, next week is low cost fundraising software and what’s really happening with non profit revenue. If you missed any part of today’s show, I beseech you, find it on tony-martignetti dot com. Responsive by turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot c o and by dot drives, raise more money, changed more lives tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant for a free demo and a free month for listeners. Our creative producer is Claire Meyerhoff shows Social Media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our Web guy, and this music is by Scott Stein. Thank you for that affirmation. Scotty, you with me next week for non profit radio big non profit ideas for the other 95%. Remember, it’s your favorite abdominal podcast. Go out and be great.

Nonprofit Radio for October 27, 2020: Mommy Lied To God

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That’s Carlos Maestas’ new book. He’s a storysmith and he’s got tips and strategies to improve your storytelling. He’s the founder of Key Ideas. What’s this got to do with Mr. Rogers Neighborhood? Come listen! Come learn.

 

 

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[00:01:37.34] spk_1:
welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio big non profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d suffer with pro so PAG nausea If you made me face the idea that you missed today’s show. Mommy lied to God. That’s Carlos. My Estate’s new book. He’s a story Smith, and he’s got tips and strategies to improve your storytelling. He’s the founder of key ideas. Come, listen, come learn Antonis. Take two planned giving accelerator were sponsored by turning to communications, PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot ceo and by dot drives. Raise more money changed more lives. Tony dot Emma slash a free demo and a free month. What a pleasure to welcome to the show. Carlos My estas. He believes storytelling is the best way organizations and people can move others to action. He’s the author of the book Mommy Lied to God. Life Lessons in Authentic Storytelling. He’s founder in chief story. Smith at key ideas, helping organizations sharpen and share their messages. He’s a stand up comedian who once opened for Saturday Night Live alumnus Dennis Miller the company is that key ideas dot Net And at Key Ideas, Inc. Carlos is at key ideas. Carlos Carlos Mast us. Welcome to the show.

[00:01:48.74] spk_0:
Hey, tony, It’s so great T b with a veteran podcast world. I I’m honored to be with you today.

[00:02:08.74] spk_1:
Oh, thank you. I’m gratified. Pleased. Pleased to have you were gonna regular some fun with storytelling? Absolutely. Um, I have to tell you, it’s a little sad for me to have to say Saturday, Saturday Night Live alumnus before Dennis Miller’s name. Because there was a time when being that would be like saying today. You know comedian Jim Gaffigan, right? He was so well known. He was He was fabulous.

[00:02:24.71] spk_0:
Yeah. Did the weekend update for exactly weekend update? Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, I grew up watching SNL. Probably way before. I should have, you know, my mom. My mom was Was she? Her style was like, Yeah, you’re interested. Like, let’s stay up. And, you know, I probably fall asleep, you know, right before we started getting really bad. Yeah, you know, that was

[00:02:52.85] spk_1:
when it was the not ready for prime time players.

[00:02:55.26] spk_0:
Yeah, Yeah. Gilda

[00:02:57.23] spk_1:
Radner. Dan Ackroyd John Belushi?

[00:03:03.74] spk_0:
Yeah, Newman And then Dana Carvey, you know, later and eyes. And, you know, it was It was It was so much fun to watch. And so I would stay up late and probably was up till till probably the weekend update, and I’d fall asleep. So, you know, Dennis Miller was It was definitely a guy I watched. I probably don’t understand a lot of the jokes back then, but, you know, it was definitely one of the things that made me want to get into doing stand up eventually.

[00:03:29.00] spk_1:
And how about opening for him? How did that come about?

[00:04:54.60] spk_0:
Yeah, you know, opening for him was one of those Those, uh, calls you get that you’re you’re not expecting on dhe? It happened about a week before he was coming into town. And interestingly enough, it was the same day that I had a huge presentation for a group of nonprofits on and and so I had to remember what I was supposed to say in that presentation. It was called a text summit, and it was happening at Rackspace in San Antonio, and there were over 200 non profit leaders that we’re gonna be there for this event. And it was probably the biggest presentation had done for nonprofits up until that point. And then that night was the show with Dennis Miller. So I was a wreck the week before, you know, I was just trying Thio not mixed up the two presentations on dhe then and then just, you know, rehearse and try to be as prepared as I could. But I I’m one of those guys that Yeah, I am nervous until the minute I had hit the stage and I’m good on dhe Then on DSO It was just one of those calls I got and I was like, Of course, I’ll open up for Dennis Miller. And it was this beautiful, uh, really beautiful theater in San Antonio called theater. And it’s been there a really long time. Some of the biggest acts have come through and perform. There’s right on the river walk beautiful

[00:05:03.74] spk_1:
people in the audience.

[00:07:25.84] spk_0:
Yeah, so I think that it was It was so I gauge it by how much the tickets were not. The tickets were like $60 a ticket, and and I think it was their capacity there, probably around 1500. Maybe a little bit more and it was full. I mean, it was I don’t know that it was sold out, but it was pretty close to it. I mean, because I remember I was I you know, I opened for him and they started setting up seats in the front where there weren’t any seats. They were like adding seats to the show on DSO you had, You know, I kind of made a joke about it because you had these people that were in steerage at the time the rafters on, but they were still paying $60 a ticket. And then you have these these people It must have been the VIPs that they were putting right in the front. And, uh and I was like, thinking to myself, You know, you cannot bomb when someone’s, you know, paying $60 for it to get on dso I did. I did 20 minutes and I got to say it was it was a great radio and it was really cool to meet him. What? One thing I could tell you a short little story. You know, I didn’t get Thio actually meet him until he was coming on the stage, and I believe that the group that had booked him, you know, it was they were used to doing. They’re called Live Nation and they do a lot of concerts e they concerts. Yeah, huge on. But the comedy is something they do less frequently. And I know the person who was in charge of this. I think it was like his first comedy, big comedy show. And so he said, If you could, you know, finish your set and at the end, all you have to say is Dennis Miller will be here with you shortly and that’s it. You know, say thank you and say he’ll be with you shortly and someone else is gonna bring him up. And so I was like, Okay, I’m like, I can’t you know, I won’t mess that up. And so I’m thinking, there’s a break between and you know, I’m finishing my set. And then I see Dennis Miller to the right. He’s on stage, and I’m like, Oh, that’s cool. He’s like watching a little bit of show. Uh, and so I do exactly what the guy says, you know? Hey, thank you so much Dennis Miller will be with you shortly. And so then I start leaving the stage. And then Miller’s walking on stage like the worst intro You work thing you could do like he’s the headliner. Yeah, you

[00:07:47.56] spk_1:
wanted If they had told you to introduce him, you know, you would have got the crowd all whipped up. Exactly what? San Antonio, Let’s bring on the Incredible. It was a Saturday night live on them. And all you got to say was he’ll be with you shortly. He’s

[00:08:01.35] spk_0:
my I’m I’m the hometown guy. I’m supposed to get the hometown crowd. Yeah, And so then he spends the first five minutes of the set making fun of me because of the intro that he just got. And so he gets on there, and he’s like, Well, thanks for whipping them up into a frenzy. Carlos, I’m like, Oh, gosh. And you know that

[00:08:20.59] spk_1:
you got screwed. You got screwed the stagehand or whoever gave you the bad direction

[00:08:27.20] spk_0:
I had, you know, it was it was it was my nerves and not thinking. Well, maybe, you know, maybe he’s gonna bring him up, but yeah, the guy said, you know, just do this. And, uh And so I was thinking there’s some of the I p that was gonna bring

[00:08:38.82] spk_1:
it right. There’s somebody else that you don’t know. Uh, we’re gonna bring him on. No, you did. You did what anybody would have done. You follow direction.

[00:09:19.24] spk_0:
Eso Then afterwards, I got a chance that he was gracious enough, and I think he was doing probably like a red eye flight out. He didn’t even stay eso, you know, I got to watch a set from from the side of the stage and then on. And then, you know, he took a picture with me afterwards and that, you know, that was it. That was it was quick. But, you know, it was definitely one of those things that I will not forget for the rest of my life. But it’s also cool to me. It was also, you know, nice that I was connected with earlier in the day. You know what I what I really do for a living which is help support nonprofits and getting a chance toe. I think they probably got more out of it than the audience that was.

[00:09:29.48] spk_1:
They were setting up more seats in the front row because you were selling. They were selling tickets as you were on stage. Yeah,

[00:09:37.44] spk_0:
I would

[00:09:38.06] spk_1:
say, Oh, I gotta be part of this state. I gotta be part of the show. Listen to this guy, Carlos. And he’s only the opener. So they were selling additional seats, and that’s why they had to set them up in the right in front, right

[00:09:48.96] spk_0:
up in front of space. Left you doing stand up at all? Yeah.

[00:09:55.87] spk_1:
Yeah. Are you still doing stand up at all?

[00:10:00.44] spk_0:
You know, I I not A lot of people are doing stand up right now, you know, unfortunately, um, and I will do stand up. You know, any opportunity that I get, what I’m what I’m doing more often than not as I work doing, stand up into the workshops that IDEO profit. And so I get it because it’s it’s really tied closely with my personal story and and so that I have an opportunity to do that. So it’s more of that than it is, you know, traveling and doing shows. But I will. You know, any time I have an opportunity to do it, I’ll Yeah,

[00:10:40.64] spk_1:
I we’ve stand up into my presentations. Also, I have a signature opener that I use and et cetera. So

[00:10:44.98] spk_0:
that’s great comedians. And I’m sure you went through doing stand up. I think the reason you’re such a great communicator is that you know, what comedians are brilliant at doing is taking people on a journey and a very finite amount of time. Right? And you have a short amount of time to create an emotional response out of an audience. And, you know, there’s some of the best at simplifying very complex issues. And so, you know, I think that’s that’s one of the little things that I e. My comics and just people could present. Well, they have a way of using humor that really, you know, makes a connection.

[00:12:06.24] spk_1:
Well, it’s simplifying is one of your tips. Of course, which, which we which we will get to. Yeah, you have toe, right? You got a rare if I there, you gotta not, right? I don’t mean that. I mean, you gotta narrow it down to the basics that are the most the most interesting, funniest, punchy ist right and cut out the, uh, stuff that doesn’t really help. Your doesn’t really help your case, and you got to do it in. Well, in your case, 20 minutes when I do. When I was doing stand up, I was getting, like, six and eight minutes sets. So you know, when you’re just getting warmed up, all of a sudden the red light comes on and you’re being motion not motioned off, but signaled off that you got to wrap it up in 30 seconds or so. Um, but we’re gonna talk while we were talking about your story telling not mine

[00:12:09.27] spk_0:
a great lesson. No tony. And for for nonprofits or any percenter, because sometimes you only have six minutes. You have six or seven minutes for presentation. And what what you learn to do is a comedian, is you. You try things, and and when they’re not working, you should cut him out. Otherwise, you know, you’re not you’re not gonna get the response you want. And it’s the same thing for anybody who is in charge of making presentations on a regular basis.

[00:13:27.54] spk_1:
I think of boards exactly along the lines of what you’re talking about. Um, it’s rare to get the full amount of time that’s out that you’re allocated in advance at a board meeting. You know, they’ll say you get 25 minutes or a half hour or 15 20 minutes and I’ve gone down to, like, six because other topics before me went over And what we still have to finish on time or there’s a lunch deadline or, you know, whatever. It’s rare that you get the full time that your plan and you wanna fly, you know, you gotta Okay, we’re gonna cut these slides. Well, you’ll get this in print or you have this in print. We’re gonna skip these because I’m now down to, like, 1/5 of the time. But here’s the most important stuff, you know? And you got to do that with, like, 10 minutes notice sometimes depending on how the board meeting is right. And there are other instances of that, too. But I think of board meetings as being the like, the least likely to stay on time and on. They’ll stay on agenda. But on time allocation least likely I find,

[00:13:34.59] spk_0:
Yeah, if you’re down on that, if you’re down on that agenda, you’re you’re likely gonna have to cut. You should just already Starting on.

[00:14:08.24] spk_1:
I’m always the consultant anyway. I mean, the consultant is the the most expendable, right? You know, he’s here. We’re paying him anyway, so, you know, and and, uh, we got to squeeze him in because he he traveled here. But there’s other stuff That’s I don’t just seems always more important than the plans giving. I do plan to giving fundraising, but the message is you’re right. You gotta boil it down to the key messages. And and you’re right. Sometimes you got to do it on the fly. Mhm.

[00:14:08.85] spk_0:
That’s right.

[00:15:25.31] spk_1:
So let’s talk about you though. Um, so you’re right. You’re a reckon tour storyteller, right? And so I do want to tell her I want you to tell your stories, tell some stories and then we’ll pick out the lessons that your tips and strategies that we can learn from from different stories. But is that OK? Way. Okay, e I wanna I wanna base it around the stories not around the strategies, which will we will cover. But I feel like we got I got to give you time to talk about Fred Rogers from Mr Rogers neighborhood. You revere this man as a storyteller. It’s time for a break. Turn to communications. They help you build relationships with journalists because of a relationship built by turn to the New York community. Trust got to features in the Wall Street Journal. That’s what happens when you get the good relationships before you want to be heard in the media. You got the existing relationship turn to specializes In working with nonprofits, they’ll help you build those relationships. One of the partners, Peter Pan A. Pento, was an editor at the Chronicle of Philanthropy. They’re at turn hyphen two dot ceo. Now back to Mommy. Lied to God. Why is that? What can we learn from Fred Rogers?

[00:16:56.64] spk_0:
Yeah, well, I’m probably aging myself a little bit, too. Just that that I know who he is, um, and and watched him, you know, growing up. But you know, you when you experience something as a child, you experience it and you don’t you don’t quite know what what draws you in about it. And it’s not till you you hear the stories behind what was very a very intentional approach of how Fred Rogers, you know, worked at connecting with kids and just how authentic he was as a storyteller. And And the reason I used Fred Rogers is an example is because he was a non profit, right? He worked for a nonprofit E. Yeah, exactly. Hey, had to be really scrappy on dhe. There are a lot of parallels with how he told stories that I find with nonprofits to you because, you know, he had just a small team and, hey, didn’t have the budget that, you know, folks like Walt Disney and and some of the other major studios that were producing content for kids. But he did it anyway. He was successful at it, you know? And so, you know, one of the things one of the lessons about about Fred Rogers is the lessons and consistency and how he would open the uh huh. Coming in, he would take off his suit jacket, you know, put on the cardigan on and take off his shoes. Put on. And that happened. I didn’t think about it much. It’s like, Why is this guy changing on? You know, you don’t think about it as a kid, but what? What? What he was doing is he was creating something that you know kids could anticipate and expect every single time show would start. Even though the show is different and

[00:17:23.55] spk_1:
routine, there’s that routine is comforting.

[00:20:03.84] spk_0:
It is comforting. It’s comforting, especially when you have kids who who knows how un inconsistent their routine might be right in their home life. And so there are little things like that that just get you comfortable with what’s about to happen and knowing that, you know, you work to build that trust with your audience. But after you have, then they, you know they look forward to that routine. And so you know, messaging when you share your story and sharing a consistent message and not, you know, changing you can change your approach and you can change. Uh, you know you can change the the the content on dhe What you used to tell that story, but your messaging should be consistent. You should be sharing a consistent message every time, and you should try to get people feeling comfortable with who you are and what you dio. And it’s a lesson that you can learn with with your donors, you know, because if you’re establishing a relationship over a period of time. They should feel, uh they should feel that they understand you in a way that others may not a tw the beginning if they’ve been with you for, you know, five or 10 years, right on Dhe. There’s other things. You know, The one of the things I appreciate about about him is that he told he was he told stories that had heavy content, but they were It was they were stories that, you know, kids were living through your heart. You know, if he was alive today, he would he would for sure be doing content on the pandemic. And, you know, like, things that were, you know, he things that were in the time, really a traumatic things that were going on in our history. Things like war, uh, the threat of nuclear. Or, you know, Martin Luther King’s assassination heavy, heavy things that you would think we would try away from that, you know, for a kids show. But he figured out a way of making it safe, Uh, and and communicating in a way that was age appropriate for the kid on dso they they left the show being better for it. because it wasn’t something that was just being swept under the rug. You know, I think about my own daughter. I’m a father, three, But I have a daughter. That’s six. And, um, you know, just because we don’t talk about it, If we were to not talk about what’s happening with the pandemic, she’s gonna she’s gonna have a ton of questions anyway. You know, shoot for the first. You know, a few months of us staying at home from school and wearing masks. You know, she was she was You could feel how heavy it was for her. On dhe. She would say things like, I don’t want anyone to get the Cyrus should say the Cyrus, it was hard to cry. Wanted to correct her. She you know, she was 12 and saying Cyrus would be different.

[00:20:34.00] spk_1:
Miley, Miley, Cyrus

[00:20:35.40] spk_0:
e. I don’t want anyone to get those

[00:20:37.49] spk_1:
Wiley Wiley virus. The Miley Cyrus

[00:20:39.51] spk_0:
e don’t wanna get to Miley Cyrus s. Oh, you know, we we what it did? Is it it? It gave us an opportunity to just have, you know, really appropriate conversations with her.

[00:21:04.24] spk_1:
Uh, Fred Rogers, Didn’t you like you’re saying didn’t shy away from difficult subjects. He found an appropriate way to discuss them in an intimate you know, an intimate way by reducing it. Thio What kids needed to know and was was he still was he still on the air in on September 11th?

[00:21:59.24] spk_0:
You know, I think he came back and did a special I don’t think he was. If if I remember doing the research for this, I don’t know that he was still doing the show, but he was still, you know he was. He was young enough to be able to come on and and talk about it. I think there was on PBS. There was some, like, special or interviews that he gave around that time, and but he’s still so what they did is they evolved the show into this Daniel Tiger’s neighborhood, which is it’s basically, you know, they still do kind of that the same music and same theme, but it’s a cartoon now. Ah Nde s Oh, yeah, I mean, I think that those are the kinds of things that you know when you live life. There’s there’s plenty of things to celebrate. But there are also a lot of things that are just really hard. And I think that, you know, if we don’t take the time Thio just be authentic with with our kids or with who we serve or with our teams. Um then, you know, we’re missing out on an opportunity thio grow from those experiences

[00:22:45.54] spk_1:
and remain relevant as well. You can’t ignore what you know Everybody around you is experiencing and still expect to be relevant during and afterwards It’s if you know everybody is suffering something or celebrating something you have tow. You have to talk about it if if if you have a if you have a voice. I mean, if you have a channel Yeah, Alright, so let’s I’m gonna get to some stories now because this is the storytelling book. So, you know, usually I’m very dictatorial on non profit radio, and I I’m gonna throw it to you because I’m not really Well, you know, maybe I’m dictatorial. I don’t know. I like the guy. I’d like to guide the conversation. Let’s see, I’m a guy not a dictator, but for you. But what You know, Of course, you have your signature story, but what story you wanna open with you Tell a story.

[00:23:19.94] spk_0:
Yeah, Well, yeah. 11 lesson that I think is really important A zit relates Thio Just powerful storytelling is to seek first to understand before being tell

[00:23:25.66] spk_1:
us a story about that.

[00:28:09.54] spk_0:
Yeah. So there was a politician. We’re you know, we’re in an election year. So we’re hearing a lot about politicians, is not We’re probably sick of it, but, uh but But there was a politician that was running for a seat in taxes was his first time running a zey House representative on Dhe District 123 in San Antonio. And, um, he wanted to run on on a platform that really involved making a difference in education. You know that tze not very different right is there, you know, there’s there’s, there’s a handful, there’s there’s always ah lot of politicians that they’re going to run on a platform of education, especially It’s the first time and really specifically what he wanted to do is try. Thio changed the way that schools were financed on, but it’s different all over. In Texas, schools were financed largely by property tax, which could make it very difficult in urban areas where you have a large population of students who are in homes that air either rented or their property values are are low, very low. And so the schools where there may be the most need. Ah, nde, it’s not a maybe it is where there is the most need. Get less funding. And that’s kind of that’s how it is. That’s how it goes and so on. Do you know what? What? To add insult to injury? This was by design. You know, if you’re familiar with with red lining, then you may know that, you know, we have a hit three in the country of banks drawing lines through through communities and neighborhoods and saying we’re not gonna lend in these communities because they’re more at risk. And Andi also there, um, you know, the property values were the lots were a lot smaller and because they weren’t lending in that area, people couldn’t fix their houses up. So the problems kept, you know, perpetuated. But in addition to that, you know, if you lived in affluent neighborhood, um, it was a legal, I believe, until like the seventies too deep to put restrictions in your deeds that your house could not be transferred to somebody of color on Dhe. So, you know, it was It created a huge issue in San Antonio. And so San Antonio’s, uh, been one of the most economically segregated cities in the entire country. On DSO here is ah, a man that grew up in one of these neighborhoods. That was the poorest zip code and all of the county. And he wanted to make a difference, you know? And But he understood a lot because he knew how how, on education could change a child’s life because he he went to school. He worked hard. He graduated from the University of Michigan, Got a lot agree, spent a lot of time, you know, working on some of these issues, you know, in his work as a nutter knee. Um, but he was He was the freshman, you know, House of Rep, then it for his district. And so what he did instead of going in and just leaning on his own understanding on dhe shaping policy, what he did is he went and visited every single school that was in his district. Ah, nde. It was a very diverse district there about 55 schools, and you met with the principles at each of those schools, and you wanted to hear their stories about where the biggest needs were. And so it’s a There are a lot of things that he learned, but I’ll distillate toe this one big thing on dhe. The reason. It’s kind of a personal thing because one of the schools that he visited, my wife, was a principal and it and it, and it was in the district where he grew up in which is which is 72 07 in in San Antonio its’s It is for years and years over over 50 years of the poorest of code in in the city on dhe. The thing that she wrote on the whiteboard under challenges in the biggest challenges food insecurity. And so imagine you know, your leader of a school and you’re trying to get kids, uh, on grade reading level on dhe. You know, Thio sort of have them close gaps that exist with their learning. But you get kids that are coming to school and they’re starving on eso. They’re having problems focusing. They’re having problems, you know, with behavior. All of those things were connected. And so if you’re the school leader, you can’t really control what happens at home before they get there. But it’s having happened. Your school and so across the board, he learned that this is something that you know what’s happening in every single school that he represented and and and some of the schools were in areas that were historically very impoverished. But some of it was happening in some of the more fluent schools as well. On DSO toe add insult to injury. The food that that they would get at that school would have to be thrown away. Anything that wasn’t so there were perfectly good food that wasn’t touched. I’m not talking about this stuff on people’s plates, but like apples and oranges. You know, milk that wasn’t open, you know, if it wasn’t eaten, there were. There were, oh, school district laws and roll school district rules and state laws that said anything untouched, even if it was completely fine had to be thrown away. So here you have these hungry kids and you have you have, ah, you know, help in the same school. But because of the overlapping policies you know, they weren’t able to do anything about it. So he created the fairness and in feeding act. And what it did is it allowed these schools to kind of create these little pantries within the school. And it let the food service staff put out things that were that were not, um, eating for that. If a kid had an apple in to touch it and wanted to put it on the share table that any kid at any time could go up and take that food home with them on dso you know it it got bipartisan support because it wasn’t this Democrats story in a in a you know, a red state, right? It was this Democrat story, would visited all these schools and taken the the leaders stories on dhe to committee. And so it got bipartisan support and and that was path. And, you know, at the Times Texas was the second most food insecure state in the entire kind of country. Eso you know, here here is like one person just taking the time. Thio actually ask questions before he decided Thio pitch his ideas and and it led to his second term um, being able Thio. He became a co chair on the final on the education Committee on dhe. He was able thio actually pass ah, finance reform his second term that e think it put about $30 million into the school district that he came from. And it was a reform that just was was a also passed by bipartisan support on dhe thing he wanted to do in the beginning was able to do a second term just by going in and, you know, taking the stories of the people who do the work at Thio, the people who could make a difference.

[00:36:18.13] spk_1:
It’s time for Tony’s Take Two planned giving accelerator. This is the membership community that I have created to get your plan giving program started in 2021. You’ll join for a year, and I will teach you everything I know about how to get your plan giving program started. We’re gonna be working with charitable bequests. We’re gonna identify together your top prospects, your Tier two prospects. We’re gonna get the solicitations out. I’ll help you with the follow up to those solicitations. Whatever requests or information you get back from them, we’re gonna keep that process going. We’ll talk about exposing your board to plan to giving everything you need to get your plan giving program started in 2021. We’ll do it together. I’m gonna have live trainings, Which, of course, all record. So if you can’t make the live version, we’ll do small group. Ask me anything. Sessions. I’m gonna have a podcast exclusively for planned giving accelerator members. There will be resource is like samples, samples off letters, samples off other advertising. Copy that. You might put in your newsletter or your annual report. Samples of welcome letters toe welcome people into the recognition society. That’s another thing. We’ll talk about creating your recognition society. So you’re thanking all your new plan giving donors everything you need to get planned giving started in 2021. I’ve been doing this since 1997. I know how to launch your plan to giving program. I know how to start a program so that in 3 to 5 years and in out years beyond that, you’ve got the program that you want. I know what to do in the beginning. So then the long term, you’ve got a successful sustainable plan giving program. You know, I do webinars and there’s value in those. Of course I don’t maketh um, empty shells there. There’s value. People know it. If you’ve listened to any of the webinars I’ve done, you know that this the accelerator is a much, much deeper dive. I mean, the webinars are what, 45 minutes to an hour, rarely, even a now and a half. The accelerator is a year long program, and I’m estimating the person who is doing it with me in your non profit. And by the way, you can have up to three people in one non profit join uh, would spend about our a week. So you’re looking at, like, four hours, maybe five hours a month, max in the trainings, and then in the follow up work that you’ll be doing on your own step by step as I’m teaching, right, take a look at planned giving accelerator dot com. What I want to do with this is get 1000 or 1500 new plan giving programs launched in the United States. You know, I’m doing it to expand planned giving. I want to see so many more planned gifts and planned giving programs in the US the average charitable bequest is about $35,000. So when all those 1000 or 1500 programs scale up to 100 gif ts when they get to that point, that’s roughly at a minimum 3.5 billion New plan giving dollars for US charities That’s what we’re all about. That’s what I’m doing this for. I wanna help you get your plan giving program started. Join the accelerator. Let’s do this all together. Let’s get these new 3.5 billion new dollars for us. Non profits from planned GIF ts expand planned giving in the country started in your non profit. We’ll be doing it together, all right. It’s all at planned giving accelerator dot com. And that, my friend, is Tony’s Take two. And so the lesson is, understand? Understand what the hell you’re talking about

[00:36:59.53] spk_0:
just on your own understanding and make sure that you’re asking questions from people who are who are doing the work every day and and it doesn’t mean you may have done the work right, but they’re they’re always, you know, people who they’re doing the work. Then and there. And we need to make sure that we’re asking the right questions so that we can get to the right solutions. You may be the expert. You may have done the work, and you may have done the job, but you you still need thio. Add voices from the people even that you serve, um, to make sure that your coming up with the best solutions.

[00:37:03.53] spk_1:
Yeah. How about another one?

[00:38:16.32] spk_0:
Yeah, eso another journey. I would say that that was really important. Is, you know, powerful storytelling. Um, doesn’t always have Ah, a a great beginning. Eso There was, ah, guy that I had a chance to interview That was with this, uh, non profit called chrysalis Ministries. And they dio they help reduce the recidivism rate from people who are coming out of jail and in prison. And they do this through, you know, syriza classes like a A classes and any classes financial literacy classes on dhe. They try to get help, people, you know, get back on their feet even if they’ve maybe started out making some mistakes on dhe eso. There’s this guy Jose that was an athlete in high school. Um, he got hurt on Dhe started to fall in with the wrong crowd. And he was he was getting bullied by these this group. And because he was sort of like a of preservation, he decided to join the group. And so that led to him being in a gang. Hey, started Thio sell drugs he started to use, uh, any. He landed up in jail. Um, and then he was in jail and then ended up getting in a gang in jail. But also, uh, you know, tryto thio survive. And so we fell in with the Texas Syndicate, which look Zeta Zeta cartel. We’ll use the Texas and the kit sometimes to carry out contract. Let’s just a contract work contract

[00:38:58.67] spk_1:
killings, right? E contract beatings if if you’re not quite as bad as deserving of death. Okay. In the

[00:41:51.11] spk_0:
prisons, right, it was, but it but it was killings. It’s just the right the right word. Uh, and and so this isn’t the group you wanna, you know, falling with if if you are trying to turn things around, but eso he ended up, you know, going in and out of prison. And the last time Hey, he was in prison for armed robbery on Dhe. He was facing 30 years and hey, had he What he did is decided he was going to turn his life around and joined this ministry in prison. That was a faith based ministry. And, um, he started to kind of share his own story. And, you know, he was getting clean, obviously, and doing the work and his his he ended up getting his sentence commuted to 12 years on dso when he got out, What he decided to do is you got hired by a non profit that was working at in Austin, in Texas, on the youth youth criminal justice reform on because he has been a lot of his youth in jail, in and out of jail. He could speak thio what it meant to be in jail. And, you know, he had never gone to the capital before. And now he was meeting with senators, um, you know, on and sharing his story and sharing why, you know, things needed to be to be changed on dso. Here’s a guy who, you know, had a hard asked and made a lot of mistakes, and you could have run from that part of his life and not shared that part of the story. But he’s now using it to do good for others. And it’s an example of, you know, some of the struggle with our own personal story and the hard parts of our story. And we don’t want to talk about it because we may even be ashamed of it. Or maybe just really painful to talk about on dso What I what I want to communicate through this story is, no matter what you’ve been through, you know you can always use that thing. Teoh be good for somebody else. And you know, I e over over 1000 people in my career. And some of them have been through some of the worst things, you know. They overcome homelessness. They’ve overcome addictions. They’ve had family members that they have lost some of them Children on dhe. The one thing that they all have in common is that they’re using that experience, uh, to to to try to make something good coming from it. Um, and so our stories have a way of, you know, if they’re they’re just in the dark, they can have a way of festering in the dark and continuing to cause a lot of pain for us. And we can get to a point in our lives where we can share then that one thing that was a hard thing can actually, you know, helps save someone’s life for help. Change someone’s life. Ah, nde eso Those stories don’t have to be wasted and so that you know, I would say the first. A step to becoming a great storyteller is just acknowledging that you have one, that there’s value in it on dhe that, you know, if you spend some time thinking about you know who you want to reach on, who you’re meeting that they are. Stories have a way of differentiating us, but also connecting us at the same time. And that’s that could be very powerful.

[00:42:56.20] spk_1:
Yeah, I love that point. You’re making the book. It differentiates because it’s unique. It’s unique to you. Your story makes you authentic and unique. But the broader lesson connects us to others as well.

[00:43:01.50] spk_0:
Yeah, that’s that’s right. You know, nobody has exactly your same story, but there’s there’s parts of that story that are going to connect with people in different ways. And that may make all the friends. Um and I don’t think we do it enough is leaders not not just in fundraising. I think it’s incredibly important and fundraising. You’ve, you know, made a career helping people fundraise. But also, you know, and I have to and it’s always leading with those stories that I think are there what people remember. You know, statistics are really important on dhe. You can include stats, but it’s not what people are gonna like. Hey, did you did you hear about about those statistics? That’s incredible. And right, you don’t you don’t remember? And so when

[00:43:48.37] spk_1:
one of here one of your tips is to is to avoid the you call the curse of knowledge

[00:43:53.90] spk_0:
right

[00:44:06.39] spk_1:
now and have a again drilling down to the simple and not littering it with stuff that isn’t really needed. Thio serve the purpose. And again, the curse of knowledge your stuffing too much in

[00:44:09.26] spk_0:
Yeah. Yeah, it goes back to what we’re talking about, you know, when making presentations is just tryingto to simplify your message on dhe. You know, when you when you talk about when you’re when you’re making your presentation, you’re or you’re doing a video. You know, really anything that sharing your story. You think about it as a trailer for the organization. You know, a trailer, a movie trailer gets you excited to go see the film. You know, it doesn’t give everything away. And I think that when you have the curse of knowledge what what you What you’re trying to do is make what you’re about to say, connect with everybody in that audience on giving them all the information that you know, toe where you think, how could they not support me after I say all this? But when you when you’re trying to be everything to everyone, you end up being nothing to everyone. And and that’s the That’s the thing is, um, you know, trying to avoid that. And so we have. Ah,

[00:45:05.49] spk_1:
movie trailer is a great analogy.

[00:45:08.89] spk_0:
Yeah, yeah, and And so, you know, we have a 80 20 principle. When it comes to how we share stories, we’re gonna we’re gonna 80% of it is gonna be aimed at the heart and try and create that emotional or response 20% of its going to share measurable impact and, you know, maybe dropping in a couple, you know, bullet points here and there. But, you know, if people get interested enough, they’re gonna wanna they’re gonna go seek that information out, or it won’t break the ice enough for them to ask you the questions where you can Then give them a little bit more information.

[00:45:39.79] spk_1:
Since you talked about just mentioned the heart and and then the mind following. Why don’t you tell about the elephant and the rider?

[00:45:48.79] spk_0:
Yeah. So this is this is pulled from a book that I recommend for any non profit leader called Switch by chipping Dan Heath. Uh,

[00:45:59.76] spk_1:
say it again. Yeah,

[00:46:01.44] spk_0:
sure. Switch it. Switch how to change when change is hard on it. ZB written by Chip and Dan Heath They have a consulting firm. They’re also college professors, uh, and and have written, you know, many really, really, really good books. Some of my favorites. Um, but talk about this analogy of an elephant and a writer, and the Elefant is sort of the emotional side of us. It’s the one that you know is it feels pleasure. It feels pain. It’s, you know, maybe even more intuitive. And then there’s the writer that you that is perched atop the elefant That is more the planner, the strategic, you know, person the one that likes Thio things. The container store has the answer to all of e

[00:46:57.42] spk_1:
appreciated that in the book cause I love that I happen to love the container store e o container store l fa I wait for the January sale every every I know January. I know it’s 35% off sales coming every 30 30% off sale is coming every January, even when they do the 2025% off during the year. Don’t don’t buy the Alfa then, not for January and February. They do the 30% off Alfa every year. That one that, like, Resonate, I gotta chill. Yeah, it’s the container store. All right? There’s a much more important point than the container

[00:47:28.48] spk_0:
store. No, I’m all about the Alfa to you actually weigh Need a little more organization.

[00:47:34.77] spk_1:
Oh, I love Alfa

[00:49:27.07] spk_0:
s o. You know the there’s you would think that the person person top the elephants is in control But we all know that we only have so much control atop an elephant. And if that elephant wants to move in a certain direction, it’s going to move in that direction and you’re just along for the ride. And and so you know, it’s a very simplified, uh, explanation of this elephant and writer. But you know, what they talk about in the book is what we need to do is leaders is we need thio. We need thio. Give the elephants a little bit of motivation and we need Thio inspire that elephants that it wants to go in that direction. And once it starts going in that direction, we need do everything we can to clear the path on DSO clearing the path means, you know, if you’re sharing your story, um, you know what are some misconceptions people may have about about you and what you do. Let’s clear the path by clearing up those misconceptions, but you know, more importantly, let’s let’s give there elephants a little bit of incentive to want to go with you, and that comes through the right emotion behind sharing your story and you think about the reason we’re drawn to the best novels, the best films, the best music it Tze not about the technical side of how it was produced. You know, I think we can appreciate that if we if we take the time to understand that part of it and us, you know, some of the people who have the Alfa subscription, they may geek out on that right. But the reason The reason that we continue Thio be motivated eyes because of how it makes us feel and we want it. We want to feel that whether we you know, whether we’re expecting to or not, you know it Z That’s what we remember. And it’s the way a song makes us remember our childhood or makes us remember that great love it za about how we feel and and so there are plenty of of examples of in business how that is true.

[00:50:17.16] spk_1:
Two time for our last break dot drives dot drives Engagement dot drives Relationships that Drives is the simplest donor pipeline fundraising tool. It’s customizable, collaborative, intuitive. If you want to move the needle on your prospect and donor relationships, you want stronger, deeper relationships. Get the free demo for listeners. There’s also a free month. Just go to the listener landing page at tony dot m a slash dot We’ve got but loads more time for Mommy lied to God

[00:50:30.05] spk_0:
when were advertised Thio by some of the largest companies in the world. You know, they’re not They’re not speaking to our head there, speaking to our heart. They want us to feel something. Just

[00:50:44.86] spk_1:
why, Why they do what they do and less about what? What? How to describe what they do. But the why Simon Sinek talks about that, too. On dhe you you don’t reference him in the book. But I was thinking about him as I was reading. You know, he says, people, people buy why you do what you do, not what people don’t buy what you do. They buy why you do what you do.

[00:52:10.35] spk_0:
That’s right. Right. And you know, here’s the thing that nonprofits need to remember is you know, the advantage that they have over for profits is that those the why is built into what you do, and it is why you exist. It is, you know, there’s no there shouldn’t be any shortage of stories to tell if you’re doing great work. The challenge and you know, is that you know, we have to convince our boards. Uh, Thio, invest in our own story, you know, because because we don’t have the same kind of money that you know for profits do it could become a challenge and marketing and sharing our own story. It’s not invested in the way that it should be. You know, it is the one thing that will pay dividends on git is what Will will continue Thio, you know, educate an uneducated audience on your work. It’s your stories and so that that needs to be a constant investment. And I’ll say it. Share this one thing. Uh huh. Not yet. That’s my daughter. She just asked if it’s lunchtime,

[00:52:15.42] spk_1:
She wanna come over and say hello

[00:52:16.65] spk_0:
e Think she is that she just she left the room. She’s, uh eso eso. What I’ll say is, you know there are. There are there are boards that will approve things like marketing directors on DSO. Then they invest in a person, which is a great first step. But then they give them no budget to do that work. So if you have a marketing director and you’ve not given them a substantial budget, you know a significant enough budget to to be able to go out and do the work and create content to do the work. Then you’re putting yourself at a disadvantage. And so the person can’t just sit there and, you know, create things. Um, out of thin air, you know, we it takes it takes money to do that. And

[00:53:09.15] spk_1:
that’s that. That myth of do more with less? Yeah, I never I never understood that. And now I just rail against it. Uh, it annoys the hell out of me, for people suggest that we just do more with less. It’s not possible,

[00:55:14.34] spk_0:
right? It takes money to do to do the work. And, you know, and it Z you know, you’re already scrappy if you’re a non profit um, leader. But, you know, the executive director can’t be all all things you know, and they’re crucial to the mission. Their fundraising, They’re they’re they’re leading the organization, you know. But many times there also running the social media page and, you know, you’re you’re doing the job of of 10 if not more. And and so, if you’re gonna make the investment and bring in somebody If you believe that stories are important, then make it a significant part of what you dio and give it some time and see it’s going to pay dividends in the long run. You know, one when another quick example of you mentioned sharing stories. Eso There is a school foundation that I’ve worked with them actually on the board of the foundation now, so I’m working with them in a different capacity. But we created, um, a syriza vignettes for them because they do these innovative grants. And so they fund you know, these mini grants to teachers A teachers will, Will will request a certain item and right, you know, right the grant application. And then the foundation goes And how the committee they select, you know what they confined and then they find them. And so there was a a story of this a teacher that requested a string instruments for his class. And so they got, you know, it got funded. There were violence and various string instruments that that were provided to the class. And we just filmed him talking about it and film the students playing Ah nde. It was a very simple He did a great job explaining what they do. And, you know, the growth he’s seen come from from having those instruments from the students. And it was a short video the executive director, Judy Gail, had with the S A s D Foundation. Um,

[00:55:34.34] spk_1:
what’s the What’s the name of the foundation is

[00:55:53.24] spk_0:
the San Antonio It’s s a I S D Foundation, San Antonio Independent School District Foundation on. She said that video to the person who had funded that grant it was the $10,000 grant they had funded it and provided that donation through the foundation. And she said, Hey, just wanted to say thank you for for the support and wanted you to hear the story. She didn’t say, Hey, you know, we need more money. We you know, we’re desperate here. She just she just sent it with a thank you. And within an hour she got an email back from the funder that said, This is incredible. I want to talk to you about expanding this program district wide and so that the $10,000 ended up turning into $100,000 on. But it was just a simple thank you, and it was just seeing the kids and hearing the story of the educator who was trying Thio provide an innovative experience for, you know, for the kids on DSO So just just, you know, give it a shot. Use those stories on dhe and don’t ever stop sharing those stories because they’re so important to the work that you dio.

[00:56:57.83] spk_1:
Is there a lesson specifically that we can extract from the Independent School District Foundation? Story may be authentic or what? What else? What other of your tips fits in there?

[00:58:02.22] spk_0:
Yeah, I would say it’s, you know, just about, uh, understanding the importance of of just keeping your investors, uh, aware of what you’re doing through thank you’s if there if you’re commuting, if you’re communicating to them 10 times through out the year, you know, eight of those times should just be thank you’s and sharing stories, and maybe two of them are, you know, asking for money. Um, on dhe, I think one lesson you know is also that, you know, we we often times when we’re thinking about creating content or thinking about creating content for a new audience that is not invested in what we’re doing. And on dhe. That’s important. You’re always gonna have a non opportunity, should always have an opportunity to bring new people into the work that you do. But don’t forget about those who have been with you, you know, for for since the beginning or the last five years. And it’s it. It’s probably more important to keep those folks educated because, as we know in non profit world, you know, we know the same thing there because we know it is in business, which is it’s way more expensive to get a new customer than it is to keep.

[00:58:26.22] spk_1:
And even some of your donors may go back 25 30 years.

[00:59:07.42] spk_0:
That’s right, Yeah, well, and I think it’s all you know. How are you educating their airs, right? I think another huge problem that nonprofits have is that their their their funding base is aging and that the the next generation may not have the same priorities, and goals is the is the generation before them. And so what are you doing to kind of bring in some of that the new then the new leadership and maybe a balance of younger leadership and younger funders into the fold because, you know, it’s it’s important, right? Like you, you gotta you gotta constantly work at at thinking about the next, you know, 10 10 10 years.

[00:59:43.52] spk_1:
There’s also an opportunity there for potential planned GIF ts among those folks that are aging and that’s that’s what I do. We have to leave with the last story, which has to be your signature story. The title of the book comes from this signature story, so I way can’t wrap without without having that story. So I think that’s perfect. Perfect one thio end with

[00:59:51.37] spk_0:
Yeah, well, tony, you built it enough. You built it up enough to where I feel like I do have to share it for Mitt for other people have asked. I said, You know how the book got titled this in Chapter three and I want you to reach

[01:00:05.91] spk_1:
trying to buy Well, people, I’m going to say by the damn book because there’s more strategies and tips and lessons than than we were ableto touch in an hour. So, um yeah, but don’t I can’t have you hold out on non profit radio listeners. It’s not gonna mean they don’t buy the book because because there’s more. There’s more that we haven’t talked about. So you

[01:02:32.70] spk_0:
gotta get book. Yeah, that’s true. That’s true. Well, so the title of the books Mommy lied to God and s 01 of the best lessons that I got when I started doing stand up was from a friend of mine who at the time used my roommate. And hey said, Look, if you’re going to start writing comedy, you need to write about yourself on DB because it won’t sound like what everybody else is trying to say. And eso it’ll always be true to you. And when you perform it, you’re gonna perform it with just a different level of energy because it comes from a place of truth, right? Absolutely. Yeah, Absolutely. Yeah. And so, you know, it made a lot of sense to me on dhe. That is one of the characteristics of authentic storytelling. And so you know, when you’re when you’re sharing your story or when you’re presenting, you know, you pulling from your own experience is really important. The hard thing for me at that time is that experience was I was going through a divorce. And so how was I going to make an audience laugh about the most painful thing that had happened to me up into that point. And I think when I had the roommate, I was I wasn’t even divorced yet. I was separated. So I’m talking about raw. I’m not talking about, like, thinking about 10. You know, even five years. It was It was I was going through it. And, uh, so, you know, I decided to do it. I’d give it a shot. And so, you know, I wrote a couple of jokes like this, and it was like I going through. Ah, divorce. I wanted to work things out, but her boyfriend wasn’t willing to compromise. You know, let me see you on Wednesdays and every other weekend, you know, give me a month or in the summer, you know, stuff like that on dhe on, then you know the money, like God was, you know, look, the hardest thing about going through a divorce is being a single dat. Any single dad will tell you that if your kid doesn’t get what they want automatically, they start crying for their mom. I said okay. He was really upset. I said, I’m just going to talk to him. I said, Son, I know you miss your mommy, but Mommy doesn’t live here anymore. It’s like, Why, Daddy? It’s like, Well, Mommy and Daddy stood up in front of a room full of all our friends and family, and Mommy vowed before God to be with Daddy till death do us part. But see, Daddy’s still alive, honey. And that’s right, Mommy Live thio. So I got I got quickly down as the you know, the bitter mommy lied to God. Comedian, right, The bitter divorce guy. And the thing about it is, you know, there’s a lot more thio the material. But, you know, the thing that differentiated me was the thing that that connected me with the audience of people who maybe had been through a divorce themselves or their parents were divorced, or at least any. But everybody knows someone who’s been divorced, right? And so those were the folks that were laughing the loudest on DDE. You know, I wanna I wanna give a disclaimer for one. I never actually said Mommy. I never told my son that, in fact, you know, he, uh, he only heard the joke recently when I was in its because I wrote this book and the book was coming out right And I could have easily entitled the book. Daddy lied to God. I could have done that, but But the reason that I was mommy lied to God was just That was a part of my experience. And I told myself up If I ever write a book, you know, it’s gonna be called Mommy lie to God on dhe. I think that you know, it Tze important to think about those things in our lives that, you know we naturally may shy away from and know that, you know, sometimes embracing them on Dhe using them to push ourselves forward is like the best thing that we can dio on dso it was, you know, comedy was cheaper than therapy for me. I probably should have been in therapy. And I don’t advise that if you should be in therapy that used to stand up instead way probably all know comedians that air like, Wow, you really need to talk to somebody. Uh, thats a professional, um but But the reason that it’s true to my story is that you know, through that experience. You know, it’s led to the work that I do now on. Did you know I truly believe in the power of sharing us your story, no matter where it came from?

[01:05:10.69] spk_1:
Carlos. My estas? Get the book. Mommy lied to God. Life lessons in authentic storytelling He’s founder and chief story Smith at key ideas. It’s at key ideas dot net and at Key Ideas Inc. And he is at key ideas. Carlos Carlos, Thank you so much. Wonderful.

[01:05:21.22] spk_0:
Thank you so much. Tony has been great talking with you and hopefully we can stay in touch. Real

[01:05:26.94] spk_1:
pleasure. I’d love to. Absolutely. Thank you.

[01:05:29.69] spk_0:
Alright, tony. Take care.

[01:05:58.09] spk_1:
Next week. Brian Saber from asking Matters Returns with his new book were sponsored by Turn to Communications, PR and Content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot ceo Talk about storytelling. Do it, Do it for the media and by dot drives raise more money changed more lives. Tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant our creative producer is clear. Meyerhoff shows social media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our web guy and this music is by Scott Stein. Thank you for that affirmation. Scotty, be with me next week for non profit radio. Big non profit ideas for the other 95% gloat and be great, I’m it.

Nonprofit Radio for October 19, 2020: Virtual Volunteering & Artists Sunday

My Guests:

Elizabeth Neufeld: Virtual Volunteering

During the resurging pandemic—and after—there are smart ways to keep your volunteers engaged virtually. What’s this got to do with the movie, “Miracle on 34th Street?” Elizabeth Neufeld shares her thinking. She’s CEO and founder of Strat Labs.

 

 

Chris Sherman: Artists Sunday

Chris Sherman crafted this day of artistry that follows Thanksgiving and precedes Giving Tuesday. He explains what it’s about and how you can join the movement.

 

 

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Board relations. Fundraising. Volunteer management. Prospect research. Legal compliance. Accounting. Finance. Investments. Donor relations. Public relations. Marketing. Technology. Social media.

Every nonprofit struggles with these issues. Big nonprofits hire experts. The other 95% listen to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Trusted experts and leading thinkers join me each week to tackle the tough issues. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.
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[00:01:56.54] spk_1:
Hello and welcome to tony-martignetti non proper radio big non profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d suffer with Leuco play Kia if you rubbed me with the idea that you missed today’s show Virtual volunteering during the Resurging Pandemic and after there are smart ways to keep your volunteers engaged virtually. What’s this got to do with the movie Miracle on 34th Street? Elizabeth Neufeld shares her thinking. She’s CEO and founder of Strat Labs and Artists. Sunday. Chris Sherman crafted this day of artistry that follows Thanksgiving and precedes giving Tuesday. He explains what it’s about and how you can join the movement. Antonis, take two planned giving accelerator were sponsored by turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot c o and by dot drives, raise more money, changed more lives. Tony-dot- M.A.-slash-Pursuant for a free demo and free month. Let’s get started with virtual volunteering. It’s my pleasure to welcome to the show. Elizabeth New Felt. She is CEO and founder of Strat Labs, supporting change agents in every corner of the globe by telling and marketing their stories. Her background is in operations, program development, community engagement, strategic marketing and communications. The company is at Strat labs dot us and at the Strat Labs. Elizabeth is at Lizzie Neuf. Any us on Instagram? Lizzie, welcome to the show.
[00:02:03.84] spk_0:
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. I’m happy to be here.
[00:02:12.84] spk_1:
Absolutely pleasure. It’s good to have you were talking about virtual volunteering. You You have a post on this? Eso
We’re gonna talk through it, though, and we’ll get into more detail. Um, you’re just basically I imagine sprung from not wanting to lose contact with our volunteers who are more accustomed to being live face to face kind of volunteers. Yes,
[00:02:32.60] spk_0:
we had a lot of people reach out right when things were shifting and it was going to become clear across the country
that volunteerism it was going to take a turn in terms of how we were going to be able to volunteer during a global pandemic. When a lot of non profits rely on actual physical bodies and hands to get their work done on DWI started kind of quickly digging into what that was gonna look like we work with a lot of nonprofits, but we also work with a lot of social enterprises and companies that have pretty robust volunteer programs where they’re partnering with nonprofits and they rely on it for both. They reliant for employee engagement as well. A ZX, the nonprofits relying on the actual volunteer. So this was a big thing for us. We wanted. We wanted to dive in.
[00:03:21.34] spk_1:
Yeah, that’s increasingly popular. Ah, very common now that companies want their employees to be engaged with the
non profit with their non private partners as part of sponsorship or, you know, is part of giving. I’m hearing more about that. It seems much more common now.
[00:03:40.14] spk_0:
Yeah, it’s it’s incredible. I mean, we we hear it from almost everyone that we work with, that they want some kind of
employee engagement program that involves volunteering and the nonprofits that we work with. They tell us the same thing on the other side is that they don’t just want sponsorship dollars anymore. They want that, you know, employee

engagement. They really want to buy in. And that becomes increasingly more difficult when we’re living in such a virtual world because you know a lot of that employee engagement in those volunteers. It’s it’s about the community that they build and the community in that engagement, and they do that in person. You know, it’s meant as a team building activity, so it becomes more difficult. But we’ve been working on it with our clients and and really studying and researching and trying to come up with different ways and people can engage. And, you know, I think something to know in something that was It’s been very interesting to me is that the value of the volunteer hour is valued currently at $27.20 and that’s up 7% from 2019. So even in the midst of this global pandemic, the value of the volunteer hours still going up, which means it’s still relevant and it’s still necessary
[00:04:54.34] spk_1: who values that time
[00:05:04.44] spk_0:
that was done by the independent sector and the Do Good Institute. They put out what they put out a wonderful
survey, and they and research around it and what they actually break it down by state, and it shows you how much your state has the volunteer, our value, Dad. It’s pretty impressive e.
[00:05:24.94] spk_1:
All right. So one of the things that you recommend for ah, virtual volunteering is putting together a lobbying campaign.
[00:06:00.11] spk_0:
Yeah, you know, if your organization is involved in a particular issue and things have kind of been on pause, whether
you know, human service is that you’re a habit to had scaled back during this time. You know, one thing that you can do is and I don’t mean lobbying necessarily in the formal sense of being coming a lobbyist because that comes with other, you know, issues and complications as it relates to the 501 C three status. But just more in terms of getting your cause out there on a broader scale, really, really making a case for support for your cause. So it doesn’t necessarily even have to be for your organization, but just for your cost. So if you work with people that are homeless and you want to talk about this issue of homelessness in America, you know, bond together with other organizations that are doing similar work and come up with a campaign or a cause that helps you advocate and lobby for these issues.
[00:06:24.34] spk_1:
And so you would you would be encouraging your folks to do what kind of stuff for you.
[00:06:32.40] spk_0:
Ah, lot of times executive directors they want toe. They want to do this work and they want a partner with other like
minded organizations around the country around the world. They just don’t have the time. So if you can utilize your volunteers to dig in and assign a couple volunteers to become thes advocates, they become more of a global policy advocate, then necessarily for your specific cause and get them excited about it. So if you’re dealing, you work with people with disabilities, you know, encourage them and get them started with a list of organizations that you’ve always wanted to connect with and go after those organizations and come up with a platform that gets the conversation around disability out there in the world in a bigger way.
[00:07:26.34] spk_1:
Or if you work with Children. I mean, there’s all kinds of different Children’s causes, Uh, s So this is related to
something else you recommend, which is encouraging. Volunteering at other organizations. Yeah, cool. I love this is like this reminded me of Miracle on 34th Street. Macy’s recommending gimbals.
[00:07:34.04] spk_0:
Yes, absolutely so We saw this a lot in the beginning of things starting to shut down in March and April where, you
know, employees were at home and they were furloughed and they were on, you know, they were on hold, they didn’t know what they were going to do. And we heard of a couple different groups and some clients saying, We’re going to recommend that are employees go out and volunteer with other organizations because, you know, meals need to be delivered still, and, you know, people need to be checked on in some capacity, and so we’re gonna make up a list of company or organizations that we no need bodies, and we don’t have that need right now. And we’re gonna push that out, tow our volunteers and our staff and ask them to contribute it. It’s really a beautiful, you know, kind of coming together. I’m still hearing about it quite a bit. I’m hearing it more on the corporate side where, you know, if an organization that they were supporting is no longer accepting in person volunteers, they’re getting referred to do other work with other groups.
[00:08:44.84] spk_1:
Yeah, and of course, you’re gonna get the gratitude of those other organizations. Dio. Yeah, so talk about
collaborating and trusting each other, working together. You know, that’s yeah, it’s beautiful, really. That’s very savvy

on. Did you know it happens organically? You said, you know, it was just organizations were thinking of this. We may as well. We have this talent. We have these folks who are motivated. We may as well refer them where the need is if we don’t have it any longer. Yeah,
[00:08:58.55] spk_0:
no, it’s true. Really organic.
[00:09:02.34] spk_1:
What’s another? Another idea for virtual volunteering.
[00:09:05.50] spk_0:
Yeah, so another thing that I We’ve been working with a lot of our clients just gearing up for annual campaign season
on this end of year. Giving is that, you know, with older volunteers so those that may be closer to retirement or in their retirement and are volunteering with organizations but don’t feel comfortable being in person. We’re really encouraging a robust writing letter writing campaign for the for end of your giving. So not just asking them to write letters to group of people, but to come up with their own messaging to come up with their own sort of passion and their plea, and to set some goals around it, you know? Is it 50 a week? Is that 100 letters a week? But you can really cover quite a bit in terms of a mailing list with personal letters, and I think the impact this year on on end of your giving is gonna be tremendous. So if you get that personal letter in the mail, I think it’s going to mean a lot more this year than it ever has before. People are missing that connection and that touch and and the, you know, the campaigns of old will not no longer be, you know, able to kind of just be a letter that they get that’s printed on, you know, and looks good and has the right graphics. There’s gonna have to be that personal touch.
[00:10:48.94] spk_1:
It’s time for a break. Turn to communications. They help you build relationships with journalists because of a
relationship started by turn to and nurtured the New York Community Trust got to features in The Wall Street Journal. That’s the value of relationships with journalists turn to specializes in working with nonprofits. One of the partners, Peter Pan A. Pento, was an editor at The Chronicle of philanthropy. I like saying his name. Peter Pan, a pento. Lovely. They’re at turn hyphen two dot ceo now back to virtual volunteering
[00:10:58.54] spk_0:
for younger generations were kind of encouraging a similar idea, however, we’re looking at it, utilizing the tools that
they’re used to working with. So, for example, we’re taking younger volunteers, and we’re asking them to engage and do community management on social media. So a big thing that our clients often says, I just don’t have time. Thio interact with people on social media. And that’s how you get a following. And so similar to writing a hand written letter, we’re asking people to reach out to influencers in their space that they think would be interested in their cause on Bright them a direct message on Instagram or Facebook, Um, leave comments on different peoples pages and mention your organization in the comments so that people will potentially refer back. So we’re trying to think of things for every age range of volunteers because we know that you know, handwriting. A letter may not be something that a 20 something you know here wants to dio,
[00:11:54.54] spk_1:
but for somebody who’s 65 or 70 that’s ideal. Eso. What kind of support do we need to give you? Need a resource
Page? Uh, messaging. What? What,
[00:12:04.24] spk_0: you have to
[00:12:04.55] spk_1:
give these folks thio support them?
[00:12:07.04] spk_0:
Yes. So when people are developing their annual campaign and they’re really looking at, how are we going to utilize
volunteers right now, at this time of year, something that we’re recommending that they do is come up with that list of assets that they’re going to need to send every volunteer in a folder. And so for some volunteers, you’re gonna want to send that directly in the mail so that they have a hard copy of it, and some you’re gonna be able to send them a link to a you know, a folder through Google or whatever you may use, whatever your platform is. But you want to include photos. You want to include case statements, um, you know, call the actions and then let them pick what they what is most interesting to them? We’re encouraging people to come up with at least the recall. The actions that they can pick from that will suit them in terms of there’s kind of an overarching called action and there’s these sub called actions on Dhe that’s filters into a bigger campaign. So for letter writing, and that’s really important on Dhe, then in terms of managing it, you know, everybody should get their own list and they should be working off a list, and there should be

no overlap with those lists. I mean, not that it would be bad to get two letters from an organization, but you want to make sure, and you try to line people up with people that they’re connected to, whether that’s geographically or because they were a donor, that they knew at some point are, you know, you try to make that happen. There is quite a bit of process that goes into it, but you’re it’s October, so you have some time to plan that out.
[00:13:28.54] spk_1:
What are some of these calls to action that you see?
[00:13:31.54] spk_0:
Um, well, you know, this year we’re still working on a lot of those. I mean, obviously the big one being to donate, But it
depends on the organization. So ah, lot of our organizations, they’re saying that they really want to use this time to build their mailing lists and to build their following online, and so we’re including that in a potential call the action. So beyond just asking for dollars, we’re actually including that, you know, in the past that may have been Come volunteer with us or set up a volunteer day with your company or your community, and we just don’t know if that’s going to be possible this winter. So we have to kind of get creative and think of ways to engage with people online.
[00:14:08.44] spk_1:
Something else you suggested is ah, listening campaign.
[00:14:11.84] spk_0:
Yeah, I think this is really important right now. You know, we’re I feel like we did a lot of this in the spring and I think it
needs toe happen again. Right now we’re doing this right now with the Girl Scouts of Colorado and it’s been we haven’t we actually are just sending it up today, and I’m really curious to kind of see what comes back. But it’s going thio help inform how the organization moves forward starting in January and with a listening campaign. What you’re trying to determine is, you know what? Where are people right now? How can you show up for them? This relates specifically to volunteers. So, you know, they were used to working with your organization for so many years, or even maybe if they had just started. But they’re sort of, Ah, deflation. That comes, you know, that has come in the last few months with not having in person engagement. And so you want to really here where they’ve been? Have they been impacted by cove? It have they lost their job? Are they gonna When things turn around, will they be able to continue to volunteer with? You were looking at all of those things to help us better understand how we can communicate with volunteers so that when things do open up a bit more, we conserve their needs. Justus Muchas. We want them to serve the community.
[00:16:01.44] spk_1:
I wonder if there are ways to that. You can get the volunteers together now. I’m thinking, Well, you know, I I do plan to
giving fundraising. So volunteers that we work with are usually 70 and over, but I don’t think it’s restricted to that. But volunteers look forward to the community. You know that their community of volunteers, even if I’m a community, could be four or five people and I’m not talking about 100. But, you know, they look forward to that time together Twice a week. They’re doing something together, or once a month, whatever it is, and they’ve lost that. So I wonder if there’s a way to that You could rekindle that community online for folks Thio keep in touch with their fellow volunteers.
[00:16:07.56] spk_0:
Yeah, we we have recommended and we’ve set up a few of these, um, ambassador programs, volunteer ambassador
programs, And they actually they’re great because I think every organization really should be thinking about doing this. We do this. This came from the social enterprise world from the for profit world and that people would bring together ambassadors to help them sell product or to get their name out into the world. But there’s no reason that the nonprofit world shouldn’t do this on day. One of the organizations that I’ve worked with the range of Motion project does an amazing job with this, and I think they have maybe 50 ambassadors right now. It could be wrong on that number. Uh, the range of motion project
[00:16:49.59] spk_1: Colorado Denver area.
[00:16:51.22] spk_0:
They’re actually a global organization. They do have an office in Colorado. But they serve individuals, um, that are in
need of prosthetic devices around the world and the the website for its romp global DOT or GE. But they’re pretty incredible because they started this ambassador program a few years ago, and it has just grown every year. And it’s not just online, like there is a component of it that lives online. But there is this community that has been built around it, and in an age when we can’t get together, they are leaning on the online piece of it. And so that can include setting up a private Facebook group for those individuals or email group that you could just send constant email communication. Thio. I know that some of them not just wrong, but I know other organizations have, ah, text chain with their ambassadors, and you know, it’s it’s These are people that are out there talking about their organization and

doing good for them and also raising money for them on. But it’s also a great way to get Presas Well. A lot of these ambassadors come to the organization or these volunteers with good stories, and some of those stories could be shared in the press. Um, in a way that, you know, while it relates back to the organization, it has a real personal feel which the press love.
[00:18:24.64] spk_1:
Yeah, right. So, again, that’s Romp romp, Global Motion program romp global Dot or GE. I’m Global. Okay. I love that
ramp. Romper Room? Yes, exactly. I’m old enough to have grown up with Romper Room. What was her name, Miss? Uh, you know, I think I went to the studio once too. I
[00:18:26.41] spk_0: think I was
[00:18:26.74] spk_1:
in the Romper Room studio. I’m pretty sure I did her and I did. Bob McAllister to On What the heck was he? Bob
McAllister.
[00:18:34.24] spk_0:
There’s one generation above me, e I know of it.
[00:18:39.42] spk_1:
Wonder what the heck was Bob McAllister? He was the host of something. I was on him. But then Romper Room was
Yeah, I miss I don’t know, Miss Kelly or something. Can’t remember. Oh, uh, if anybody remembers should be any tony at tony-martignetti dot com. What was the name of the lady on Romper Room? I’m sure I could find it, But who’s that host? The woman who hosted Romper Room. She was like a kindergarten teacher. She
[00:19:02.22] spk_2: was It was
[00:19:13.74] spk_1:
wonderful. It was It was a romper room. Um, yeah. So Okay, back Thio. Sorry. So, um 1965 digression. Um on de So
when you have thes when you’re putting these folks together, I mean, what’s your role, like keeping in touch with them too, Or like, if their ambassadors for you, you know, how do you How often do you wanna be in touch with them? Like thanking them, seeing how they’re doing, asking if they need coaching or help or anything like that. What’s your role in keeping it keeping it going once you’ve given them tools in the platform?
[00:19:36.97] spk_0:
That’s a great question. I’d say that the issue that we see the most is that our clients will set up an ambassador
program, and then it will fall apart shortly after nobody is managing the community. So our suggestion is that at least once a week, at the very minimum, there should be some kind of prompt that goes into the Facebook group are on email that asked people to respond, and then in a non going weekly basis, we’re asking and this could be another volunteer role. This could be a volunteer that manages the community. That’s a little bit meta, but it’s meant to, you know, if there’s a real superstar volunteer, get them to be the community manager and have the manages ambassadors because you do wanna be interacting with them at the minimum on a weekly basis. But the idea is that you want to be giving them a prompt. It will further communication and conversation among them and then also a call the action eso You know whether or not that’s, you know, doing a funny video around, um, there cause that is, maybe at home and then they can all post if they all do. A video community edited together. Um, you could do these like, you know, have them set up a virtual fundraiser for the organization, and they do it together. They’re doing it in there, you know, group. They could also go out for press. You know that as a group they could go out for press. They could set a challenge for the community, like a running challenge or climbing challenge or a swimming challenge. Um, you know, they can also be tasked with being, you know, kind of doing what we talked about before with social media, which is going through and tagging celebrities and news outlets and kind of getting their name out there. But there needs to be someone at the helm who condemn erect some of that. And I recommend in this day and age that that person should also be a volunteer. It’s a great time that
[00:21:34.36] spk_1:
seems like the gold standard. Like if you can get a volunteer who’s that engaged, then you know they could take it the
way the fellow volunteers, you know, it’ll be easy. It’ll just just be a little friendlier, like then the organization like looking over your shoulder. You know, even if it’s a friendly relationship, you know, it’s just better if it’s self managed.
[00:21:42.44] spk_0:
Yeah, and we recommend to get them together. I mean, this has to happen virtually this year, but so I think it’s great.

Get them together. You send them some kind of fun box or something, you know, prior to their virtual retreat, and do a retreat where they plan out their activities for the next you know, 12 months. So we’re recommending people do that November, December, and maybe you send, you know, like some cookies or some You know something you know, to kind of get them ready, A stress ball. But you’re gonna be online for two hours. And you guys were gonna plan the month, you know, every month, an ambassador related activity again, these air volunteers. But this is kind of the way we have to think through, You know, the new age of volunteerism, given what we’re living and that you can’t necessarily show but a warehouse and pack boxes or ship meals out for people you know or deliver things. So you have to think of these other things. And I do think it can spanned generations to I know it probably sounds, given that a lot of it’s online, that it would only be for the younger generation. But we’ve seen that. You know, the older generation likes this Justus much. They want that opportunity to connect online their home, probably even more than the younger generation with less opportunity to connect. So Zoom has become, um, you know, a fixture in my mom’s life, and she’s 70 something years old. It’s also become a picture of my grandmother’s life, and she is 90 something years old so they’ve even become accustomed to this new way, and I think it’s important to provide that during the day.
[00:23:10.04] spk_1:
That’s great. You still have your grandmother,
[00:23:13.85] spk_0: Your 100. 0 my God, I’m
[00:23:57.44] spk_1:
so lucky to have them. That’s wonderful. Yeah, I have been hearing that zoom and even just some some older folks
who didn’t even have email or had an email but never used it. You know, in the first few months it wasn’t really catching on. And But as things dragged on and now sort of a resurgence, Um, I think folks have caught on that the only real way to keep in touch on a good frequent basis is going to be online. So they’ve they’ve adopted. They’ve they’ve adopted online work more than they were like March, April, even may some. It’s become more, a lot more. A lot more popular. Yeah, in really just the past, like 33 months or so, Yeah,
[00:24:06.40] spk_0:
we’ve seen some good multi generation programs pop up using utilizing volunteers where in old the older generation
might lead a class like an on going class. Maybe it’s monthly or every other week for a younger generation. We specifically saw this in the arts? Quite a bit. We had to art clients, clients that worked in the arts. And they utilized this format. And it worked really well where they were utilizing this sort of this older generation, um, to help teach some of the classes that would have otherwise been in person and being taught, you know, by someone else, Um, that had availability at three o’clock on a, you know, Thursday. But this was being done, you know? You know, at any time they could schedule at any time, and people from around the country were signing in to be part of it.
[00:24:53.34] spk_1:
What else? What else you wanna talk about around virtual volunteering?
[00:25:06.24] spk_0:
No, I think, um, you know, another idea would be, um, e just looking at something. So another idea I have, in terms of
virtual volunteering is really you know, that thinking through that the staff at these organizations are being test, but there’s been a lot of cutbacks. We’re hearing that, you know, staff have been reduced quite a bit at nonprofits just to stay afloat. And so ah, lot of staff that these organizations are taking on task that they may not feel qualified for, or even just the amount of work that they have is, you know, increasing on a daily basis. And so you can utilize volunteers to come in and help with, you know, administration. And doing that online is pretty easy. You know, whether that’s entering gifts, um, into a database where it’s cleaning up databases in preparation for an annual campaign or, you know, all the things that used Thio. You know, we’re kind of given that people would dio, but not not necessarily. You know, you may think like, well, I can’t do that because they can’t be in person, so I can’t teach them. But I think set up a meeting with them on Zoom. Show them how to do it, share your screen, give them access to the database or the system and let them help you Really, with that process piece, because ultimately, when we head into 21 it’s gonna be really important that people have a very strong volunteer process in place in order to maximize the benefit for that. For those that group of people
[00:26:36.54] spk_1:
so basically looking Thio use volunteers to fill gaps in expertise that maybe you’ve always had. Or maybe now you
newly have because you have the you have to let let folks go which tragic to start with. But the reality is, the work still needs to get done.
[00:26:43.39] spk_0:
Yes, absolutely. With everybody working at home in the in these companies, there’s actually a lot more access to them

and a lot of ways because they are at home and so they need to jump on, you know, a 30 minutes, um called to hear about a project that they could potentially take on for you as a volunteer. They may have more availability than they would if they were in meetings all day or they were off site, and then they had to come meet you somewhere. So in some ways it has provided a lot more connection that otherwise would have been harder to dio.
[00:27:14.24] spk_1:
We got time for one more.
[00:27:19.74] spk_0:
One more idea. Well, the other thing I was going to say, and I think this kind of gets lost in the mix, and this probably
should have been one of the first things I mentioned, but, you know, I think it’s important is we talk about process and how we you know and developing process so that you’re ready to go for next year. I think setting goals for your volunteers is a really, you know, strong way to approach a volunteer program. Eso even if the if the if you choose this Met, I like smart goals. I think that those air really helpful And I think, you know, just provides volunteers with additional motivation for donating time so you could do that in the form of incentives. Um, you can create opportunities for volunteers toe lead kind of what we were just talking about. Either you’re an ambassador program or even helping out in the case of staff that have been, you know, had to let go and they’ve got to take over. But I think if you’re if you set goals, however, you choose to do them, you know, I think it will give you a benchmark, um, for how to measure whether or not these volunteer programs or successful. They know the larger organizations have that because they have a person dedicated to volunteer management. But these smaller organizations don’t always do that, and I think it’s really critical.
[00:29:02.34] spk_1:
Okay, start with goals. Yeah, that’s right. It wasn’t the first thing you said, but we got there. And by the way, Bob
McAllister’s program was wonder Rama e thought of it. I did not Look it up, wasn’t I Wouldn’t do that while we’re talking e I still need to know who who ran Romper Room. Okay, She’s Elizabeth Elizabeth. Lizzie Neufeld. The company is Strat Labs. They’re at Strat labs dot us and at the Strat Labs. And she is at Lizzie nuf on instagram. You’re not on Twitter, Lizzie?
[00:29:07.49] spk_0:
Not really. Okay, hard. I got two little kids and I got I have to prioritize my social media, which I don’t even like to begin
with.
[00:29:16.21] spk_1:
All right? So people, people will find join instagram. Sounds good. You got You got lots of ups. You got lots of kids
pictures on instagram.
[00:29:23.04] spk_0: Yes. Okay.
[00:29:24.84] spk_1:
Thank you very much for sharing all these ideas. Thanks very much, Lizzy. Thank
[00:29:28.15] spk_0:
you so much pleasure to be here.
[00:33:26.84] spk_1:
Good to have you. Thank you. Time for our last break. Dot drives drives engagement dot drives Relationships that
drives is the simplest donor pipeline fundraising tool. It’s customizable. It’s collaborative. It’s intuitive. If you want to move the needle on your prospect and don’t relationships check out the free demo for listeners. There’s also a free month. You go to the listener landing page at tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant. It’s time for Tony’s Take two. Start your plan giving in 2021 with planned giving accelerator. I launched planned giving accelerator because I want to see a bunch. I want to see 1000 or 1500 new plan giving programs in the U. S. And when those each scale up to 100 new gif ts and knowing that the average charitable bequest in the U. S. Is $35,000 right? That’s a minimum of 3.5 billion new plan giving dollars for nonprofits. That’s what I want to do in planned giving accelerator. How are we going to do it together? We’re gonna get your program started in 2021. I’m gonna have live trainings. Of course they’ll be recorded. So if you can’t make the live naturally, we’re gonna do ask me anything sessions in small groups, I’m gonna have an exclusive podcast, not tony-martignetti non profit radio. That’s a fabulous podcast. We’ll have Justus fabulous of podcast, but it will be exclusively for members of the accelerator, just like the trainings. And they ask me anything sessions and the Facebook community that we’re gonna have. So there’s gonna be networking and learning from others who are in the community as well. That’s plan giving, accelerator. We’re gonna get your plan giving started in 2021. Like get this off your to do list. Do it together. I’m going to teach you everything I know about how to start and

grow your plan giving program. I’ve been doing this since 1997. Starting plan, giving programs, consulting in it since 2003. But since the very beginning, that’s all I do. At first, I was a frontline fundraiser, director of planned giving throughout my 23 years in planned giving. That’s all I’ve done start programs. So I know how to do it. They’re successful. Programs that I’ve worked with have raised over $100 million. You’re not going to get $100 million at least not in the first year. But I have a long record doing this with startup programs. I know how to get it started for you. I know what to do in the beginning so that in 35 10 years from now you’ve got the plan giving program you want. It’s all that planned giving accelerator dot com First class starts in January. Check it out. Join on def. Not even for the organization. You know, for your non profit forgetting that program started, think about it as to professional development. If you don’t know much about planned giving or anything about planned giving, consider it professional development. You’re gonna learn you’re gonna learn how to start a program. You learn the basics of planned giving so you can expand your career. A ZX well again. Planned giving accelerator dot com Check it out. Any questions? You can contact me through that page. Take a look. Plan giving accelerator that is tony. Stick to We’ve got a single butt cheek of time left. Here is artists Sunday. It’s a pleasure to welcome Chris Sherman to non profit radio. He’s founder of Artists Sunday. The Oranges at Artists Sunday, calm and at artists Sunday. Chris is at C V. Sherman. Chris Sherman. Welcome to non profit radio.
[00:33:29.24] spk_2:
Thank you, Tony. Good to be here.
[00:33:33.24] spk_1:
Pleasure. Good to have you. Let’s start with the obvious question. What is artists Sunday
[00:33:59.94] spk_2:
In a very good question, it is. So it’s essentially think of Black Friday or small business Saturday. But for the arts so
small business Saturday is the Saturday after Thanksgiving, black Friday and Friday after Thanksgiving. Artist Sunday is the Sunday after Thanksgiving, and the whole idea is to shop with artists and shop for something hand made on that day. Something handmade, uh, all kinds of art. So your traditional heart argued, Hang on the wall, something you put on your bookshelf to something you wear something that you take with you a wide variety of art. It is available through artist Sunday on artists from across the country.
[00:34:17.64] spk_1:
Okay, eso as the Sunday after Thanksgiving, where you have you have a lot of people traveling that day. So are you.
Are you among the travel advisers saying, Don’t travel on Sunday either go Saturday or Monday
[00:34:55.52] spk_2:
because that is that that is the one drawback to that particular Sunday. Actually, what we’re saying is we’re using
Sunday is the anchor. It’s not necessarily the day you have to shut up. You can’t certainly, and there will be certain promotions that are going on from artists and our agencies across the country. But just like Black Friday is not on Friday any longer. Artist Sunday is really just an anchor, so the idea is for you to shop with artists sometime during that time period for the holidays.
[00:35:05.14] spk_1:
Have you used giving Tuesday as, ah, model,
[00:35:10.04] spk_2:
giving Tuesday and small business Saturday. I’ve looked pretty much in our models for this process, and what we’re
doing is we’re saying it’s free to artists to participate, given the tool kit. Looks like you get if you were, you know, giving Tuesday or small business Saturday. And so it’s free to the artists and it’s free to nonprofits that support artists.
[00:35:31.44] spk_1:
Okay, good. I was just gonna ask about organizations joining as well.
[00:35:36.24] spk_2:
Exactly. So organizations are invited to join across the country. We’ve got organizations that are participating with
more joining every day. Those could be art district’s could be cities. Could be counties could be states. Could the chambers of commerce could be private organizations, non profits that support the arts in some way, shape or form anything from churches. Thio associations are invited to join and promote this to their artists and get their artists involved. And they get this tool kit as well that they can s so it’s really kind of a turnkey solution. You basically give them a tool kit to help them market, help them work with their artists to get them out there in public exposure. And then we do a national. We’re doing a national PR campaign to to tell consumers about this as well.
[00:36:39.37] spk_1:

Now you’re also competing. Besides travel, you’re competing with God. This is This is our day of is a day of rest for a lot of people. That’s true. What do you say to the? Okay. Okay. You have an answer. I know you have an answer. Uh, okay. Competing with God is a big, you know. That’s a big deal.
[00:36:46.73] spk_2:
I don’t know if we’re competing with God. We’re working.
[00:36:49.40] spk_1:
God. Okay. He’s Is he blessed this He’s giving you? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Awesome. Well, you’ve got God on your side.
Then you’re not competing at all. He’s in a field. God’s an affiliate member.
[00:37:00.97] spk_2: That’s true. He’s a partner.
[00:37:10.53] spk_1:
Okay? He listed should be listed among your partners. Yes, alongside God. I saw a lot of government agencies or
agencies or I don’t know how you would agencies. I get a counties, counties. I saw a couple of states I think to
[00:37:51.73] spk_2:
right. We’ve got, I think, 10 or 11 states now with regards to government agencies. I mean, there are 4000 art district
according to the national damage for the arts on. And, you know, we’re working with as many of those as possible signing. There’s many because as possible to join us. This is obviously the first year. But the whole idea is to have this take on a life of its own and become, you know, a Christmas Sorry Thanksgiving holiday tradition. Are
[00:37:51.87] spk_1:
you an artist? Is that what created?
[00:38:27.62] spk_2:
Yeah, Yeah, came to mind as last year on Artist Sunday, the Sunday after Thanksgiving, I saw a boost in sales and
thought, Wait a minute. This is kind of curious. There should be a day for artists for this kind of stuff, you know? So so that’s really kind of how the idea came about. And in addition to being a photographer, I’m also an entrepreneur, so I’m gonna kind of brought the two together, bringing my photography and the entrepreneurial experience Thio create the other Sunday. Is
[00:38:27.78] spk_1:
there a space in here for performing artists?
[00:38:30.72] spk_2:
Sure. Certainly so. Experiential artists performing artists, however you might determine them, uh, this year with that
maybe kind of difficult for them Thio, you know, in the theaters being closed in that type of thing. But certainly for musicians being able to sell their work, whether it’s a downloader CD if people still buy CDs that cut, uh, can certainly participate as well as visual.
[00:38:54.00] spk_1:
Okay, something outdoors is conceivable, Uh, whether if the weather permits in November, if you’re in the Southern
tier, it could be an outdoor performance.
[00:39:04.52] spk_2:
Exactly. And we actually have actually have a group with a traveling piano. I don’t know the name there somewhere out
of the West Coast, but they’ll do outdoor performances and a piano on a flat bed or something like that. And you know, the commune with nature and God and, uh, music.
[00:39:28.82] spk_1:
So folks who are interested they should go to artists sunday dot com
[00:39:52.32] spk_2:
Correct? Yep, we’ve got over 1000 participants. We’ve got 930 some artists. We’ve got 188 nonprofit organizations
across the country that are participating in war, signing up every day and you know we hope to have several 1000 by by artist Sunday by Thanksgiving time frame
[00:40:38.11] spk_1:
All right, well, hope non profit radio audience helps you hope listeners. Check it out. Artist. Sunday Thank You, Chris

artists sunday dot com and at artists Sunday, and Chris is at C. V. Sherman. Chris Sherman. Thanks very much And good luck. I hope you get those thousands thousands next week. Mommy lied to God with Carlos Mestas were sponsored by turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot ceo and by dot drives raise more money, changed more lives tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant for a free demo and a free month. Our creative producer is clear, Meyerhoff shows social Media is by Susan Chavez Mark Silverman is our Web guy and this music is by Scott Stein. Thank you for that affirmation, Scotty. Here with me next week for non profit radio, big non profit ideas for the other 95% Go out and be great