Tag Archives: fundraising

Nonprofit Radio for March 15, 2021: Relationships With Funders

My Guest:

Shavonn Richardson: Relationships With Funders
There’s too much transactionalism and not enough relationship building between nonprofits and their institutional funders. Are you a transactionalist? Do you want to walk toward the light of relationship fundraising with foundations and corporations? Shavonn Richardson can show you the path. She’s CEO of Think and Ink Grant Consulting.

 

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[00:00:13.94] spk_3:
Hello and welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio big

[00:01:56.24] spk_1:
non profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host of your favorite abdominal podcast. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d get slapped with a diagnosis of African trypanosomiasis if you bit me with the idea that you missed this week’s show. Relationships with Funders. There’s too Much Transactional is, um, and not enough relationship building between nonprofits and their institutional funders. Are you a transactional ist? Do you want to walk toward the light of relationship fundraising with foundations and corporations? She, even Richardson, can help you. She’s CEO of Think and Ink Grant Consulting, tony State, too. Podcast pleasantries, reduction. We’re sponsored by turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot c o. I’m very pleased to welcome shaven Richardson to the show. She is founder and CEO of Think and Ink Grant Consulting. She worked as a program manager for a corporate funder, deploying over a million dollars in grants and sponsorships to Atlanta nonprofits. Now she gets grants for her clients and has successfully leveraged over $25 million in funding. She’s a Forbes thought leader and serves on the board of directors for the Grant Professionals Association. She’s at Shavon Richardson and her company is at Think and Inc grants dot com. Welcome to nonprofit radio Shabaan.

[00:01:57.78] spk_0:
Thank you, Tony. Thanks for having me.

[00:02:02.04] spk_1:
Absolutely. It’s a pleasure. Do you know the shaven Richardson who stole your name from Twitter before you before? I

[00:02:08.81] spk_0:
wish I could hunt her down and get her her Twitter tag. Yeah, that would be more convenient for sure. You

[00:02:17.04] spk_1:
haven’t. You have not threatened

[00:02:18.09] spk_0:
her? Not yet. Not yet. But if you find her, let me know.

[00:02:21.14] spk_1:
Okay, well, we know how to find her on Twitter. She’s Ron Rich. Uh, we don’t like her Shiban Richeson

[00:02:28.70] spk_0:
on

[00:02:36.64] spk_1:
Twitter. So you have the, uh, background of being a program manager. You are concerned that and I obviously you saw this as a program manager that folks are are to transactional, right? They submit these blind applications they don’t have relationships with with program managers like you. You wanna like you used to be. You want to turn that around?

[00:03:20.44] spk_0:
Yes. Yes, yes. I was a program manager at Bank of America Foundation. Oversaw a lot of the, um, grants that came in and sponsorships that would come in. Reviewed applications, build relationships with non profits. And I think my biggest pet peeve was, um, someone committee what we call a cold application without any outreach to our office or any connection or we knew anything about.

[00:03:25.44] spk_1:
So even with Bank of America, we can we can have we can. We can establish a relationship with a person at Bank of America

[00:03:32.19] spk_0:
Foundation that it is doable.

[00:03:36.64] spk_1:
Okay, all right. And I presume the folks with the relationships have a better shot of getting funded, right?

[00:04:11.94] spk_0:
Why are they overall, just in general? We’re talking about any funder, right, whether it’s a corporate funder or a family foundation or any sort of private foundation, the more they know about you and more about your nonprofit organization and more about the really valuable work that you’re doing. Um, they’re more. They’re in a position to make a determination whether they want to invest in support, that the work you do. So it’s all a part of getting to know you. You’re getting to know them and making sure that there’s an appropriate match,

[00:04:40.84] spk_1:
because the program manager is basically an advocate for your grant application, right? If they believe in it, then they have to bring it up. Obviously, it’s certainly a Bank of America, you know, to bring things up to folks, folks above to to get approved funding. So, like, aren’t you? Isn’t the program manager basically the advocate for the grants that that, uh, he or she believes in?

[00:05:25.34] spk_0:
Yeah, well, you know, they can be an advocate, right? It just really depends, because every fund is different, right? So, you know, some funders will have the program managers make the decision as a group as to who gets funding. Sometimes the program managers are in a position to kind of gather all the applicants, maybe writing a summary, uh, what the program is, and then maybe boarding it to a board of directors or a committee or a group of non profit leaders that are responsible for actually making the decision. But either way, a program manager is involved in the process. Um, and the more they know about you, the more that you know, there might be some opportunities for them to be an advocate if it’s appropriate.

[00:05:41.74] spk_1:
Okay, So if we’re thinking about, uh, let’s start with the corporate since you were on the corporate side and then we’ll talk. We’ll talk about foundations to, um, But let’s start with the corporate side. How do you? Well, I guess it starts with research. You’ve got to make sure you’re talking to a corporation that funds the type of work that you do in the area where you are, right. So it starts with good research,

[00:06:58.04] spk_0:
especially research, you know, especially large funders, large corporate funders to get a lot of emails and calls from everyone right about different things. But if you just start with going to their website and learning more about, they’re giving priorities. Every corporate funder has given priorities or their focus areas on their website. You want to make sure that the work that you’re doing is in line with one of those focus areas so that you’re not reaching out to a funny to say, Hey, do you support this really cool thing that I’m doing when it’s already very clear on their website that they do or they don’t all the times they’ll have, like a little survey of yes or no questions to see if you’ll be eligible to apply, so that’s that’s the first step. The next step would be kind of, um, the outreach, right? Some will say, Hey, we don’t have the capacity entertained phone calls. If you want to engage with us, please send in a l O I, which in our industry is considered a letter of intent or a lot of interest. So that’s just a quick summary of your program for them to get to know you. Others have just a general inbox, um, email that you’ll find on their website. If you have questions, you know, here is a way to contact us. So those are kind of like the first ways to start connecting with a potential corporate funder and build a relationship.

[00:07:11.57] spk_1:
If there one that’s willing to take calls, you, uh, you pick up the phone and what do you say?

[00:07:18.84] spk_0:
Well, I say they were at least I can say, at least for our clients that it’s a very strategic conversation we actually plan. Yeah, just don’t pick up the phone calls. They take calls school. I mean,

[00:07:33.94] spk_1:
let me chat them up about my work. Okay, So what do you think What are you planning before you before you do pick up the phone?

[00:09:00.44] spk_0:
Yeah. So if everybody gets on the phone, it’s always good to have at least one or two people that you’ve connected with, um, as far as their contact information. Right? Because folks leave, folks come and go all the time. So the one person that you’ve connected with, if they leave, then you’re you’re kind of out of luck. So it’s good to have, you know, to contact, right? Um, if you reach out via telephone to arrange some time on someone’s calendar or via email, I would always say limited to 15 minutes, right? They’re busy people. And in that 15 minutes, you have a clear understanding of what you’re talking about. Oftentimes with our clients, these unscripted conversations that we plan, we’re not scripted word for word. But we do have a strategy as far as what we want our clients to share during those conversations and really stick to it. Um, in the end, leave a few minutes for any questions. Um, always end with a like a follow up like, Hey, you know, how can we stay connected? Is it okay if I, you know, seeing you a letter from a person we just recently helped, or how can we stay connected and and And that’s a start, right? And to keep it a warm connection, right? Figure out ways to keep them engaged, to always keep my breast of the work that you’re doing. And I think the key point is to do this regardless. If there is a pending grant deadline, do this when there’s no grant deadline, right?

[00:09:28.64] spk_1:
I was gonna ask about that. Okay, So there’s no, there’s no even grant deadline yet. You’re just opening the channel before so that you’ve you’ve made the point in a couple of your blog posts or videos that, you know, don’t wait until two weeks before a deadline. You try to open a conversation, you’ve you set yourself up like maybe not definitely for failure, but you’ve You’ve made it a lot harder on everybody. So So this is before there isn’t even a day before There’s even a deadline posted.

[00:09:48.24] spk_0:
Exactly. And you know, sometimes if you do this work without a deadline, sometimes when a grant does come down the pipeline, don’t reach out to you and they’ll say, Hey, you know, we’ve been talking for the last six months. I think this is a good opportunity for you. Check it out and they’ll just forge you an opportunity. And that’s that’s even better, right? Because that means that your top of mind for them,

[00:11:03.44] spk_1:
it’s time for a break. Turn to communications. You know, the relationships that turn to has. These are examples. Examples. The Wall Street Journal, The New York Times, CBS Market Watch, The Chronicle of Philanthropy. Those are the biggest. They have others, and they’ll make others others where you belong, where they can help place you so that when there’s a news hook that you belong in, they know who to call. They’ve got the relationships relationships. That’s how you get yourself positioned in the media that you want when you want it there at turn hyphen two dot c o. Now back to relationships with funders. You see the symmetry here you see, you see how it’s all connected with the relationship theme transcending. It’s resplendent with relationships. Unbelievable. So in that phone call or in these series of calls, as you’re keeping in touch with them, you’re trying to show them how your work aligns with their funding priorities. I mean, especially in that first. Like you said, a 15 minute phone call. You’re trying to hook them into what you do and how it overlaps with what they fund, right?

[00:11:19.94] spk_0:
Exactly. And I think when people go wrong is that they just they’re just so excited just to share all the work that they’re doing and they make it about them. But you know, these social, corporate friends, this is not altruistic. Giving is like it’s a reason why they’re investing in you is because you’re aligning with what they need to do. So always to keep the funder in mind and making sure that you are aligning to what they are looking for.

[00:11:46.94] spk_1:
And then over time, as you’re keeping in touch, is it okay to email them when you maybe have a big success? Or I don’t know, uh, email them announcements. Maybe about a couple of new board members. I mean, is that kind of stuff appropriate? Is that is that a good way to be keeping in touch with them?

[00:12:00.54] spk_0:
Exactly. Right. Exactly right. Press releases, uh, update new things that are happening. That’s always good to kind of keep them in loop. I discourage people from including them on your mass newsletter distribution list. Um, that’s a big no, no, definitely any personalized communication. If you want to extract information from your newsletter, that’s fine. But let it be personal. Let it be from the executive director. Uh, I know I personally have small when I’ve received stuff in the mail. Like I’ve received pictures of those that we’ve helped with a little handwritten letter in crayon. Hi. Thank you so much for the grant. That’s a tear jerker. And a lot of times I would put them up in my office. I was just going to say

[00:12:43.05] spk_1:
that. I bet you put them up

[00:12:44.01] spk_0:
in your office. I put my office

[00:12:45.78] spk_1:
crayon letters from, like, a seven or eight year old.

[00:12:50.24] spk_0:
Yeah, put them up in my office and, you know, there you go There on my mind. 3 65. So, um, getting something in the mail, you know who gets stuff in the mail anymore, right? So it would stand out. I’d say, Wow, it’s a package on my desk. What is that? And it really made a difference. So anyway, that you can engage them, whether mailing something or be email not too often, but when you really feel like there’s something significant that you’d like to share,

[00:13:50.94] spk_1:
so it’s not really that uncommon. I mean, it’s not really that different than keeping in touch with individual donors, you know? All right, So you’re saying you know, you wouldn’t include them on your in your e newsletter mail list? Okay, that’s that’s an exception. But you know, your major donors, like you’re inside individual donors, you keep in touch with them. You build relationships with them for when the time comes that you are going to be asking them. I mean, these are all strategic relationships. They’re not like you said. They’re not altruistic. Uh, you know, there’s a purpose behind these, but it sounds parallel to individual relationship building.

[00:13:54.74] spk_0:
It is okay. It is very parallel, and it’s so odd. I know I know a lot of fun reasons that are like, really good at engaging with individual donors, and I tell them like that that’s just not my jam. And then I think about it like, but there’s really a lot of like you could really apply to say, strategy. So that doesn’t mean that, uh, you know, it’s it’s necessarily a difficult thing. It’s just you just have to do it right? Like how it with a strategy and apply it

[00:15:11.54] spk_1:
because even Bank of America is made of people. Yeah, right. I mean, you’re you’re a person. You have feelings you like to be kept in touch with. You know, you like to get warm, soft, fuzzy, You know, things in the mail, like you’re saying so. You know, even Bank of America is made of people, so connect, connect on a personal level. All right. All right. So then let’s just follow that that relationship through a little bit. So now let’s suppose there is a grant application deadline Now it’s I don’t know how. How far in advance do we find out about these things? Like, three months or six months? Random varies. Okay. All right. So you find out now there’s an application. Three months, three months. You’ve got three months, but you’ve got a relationship with the with the company. Um, what do you do? You pick up the phone and say, Well, you know, can I apply or do you You just apply or you can leverage. How do you leverage your relationship?

[00:15:14.20] spk_0:
You pick up the phone, you send an email. Hi, Sally. We just saw that you guys have in our p available or a great opportunity available. And it’s due in June. Whatever. Whatever. We’re definitely interested in applying. This is the program that we’re looking for funding for. What do you think? Do you think this would be a good fit? Thank you so much for your time. I know your time is super, super precious, and you’re super busy. But thank you for your time. And any insight that you can provide will be very helpful.

[00:16:06.54] spk_1:
Okay. Okay. Um and then you go ahead. I mean, you got to follow. You gotta follow all the details. You make the point somewhere that if it says font size 12 and you do font size 11.5, you’re putting yourself at risk. Exactly. Okay. And then your work, of course, is preparing. You know, you gotta get budgets and referrals, and you gotta You gotta follow the follow all the guidelines.

[00:16:28.04] spk_0:
Yeah, well, a lot of our work, we’re unique at thinking and great consulting because we cover all aspects of great seeking from beginning to end. Uh, we do the nonprofit consulting to strengthen your organization, so you submit a strong proposal. We do, the research will go and find a good opportunities Will do the actual writing what you’re referring to. And we actually do the evaluation support. So we’ll evaluate the program. Um, at the end of the program, a lot of nonprofit leaders have to form four different relationships just to get all of that done. Um, but our team actually has people on staff to do all of those things, So we make it really easy for nonprofit leaders.

[00:16:52.04] spk_1:
We were talking about grants, grant application, But how do how does it vary if it’s if it’s sponsorship,

[00:18:04.34] spk_0:
uh, sponsorships? It’s And it’s weird because it’s changing with sponsorships. Before, It used to be just a marketing spin, right? It was awareness, and I’m talking about corporate funders. It was just bringing awareness to a brand, right, Um and it was tied to kind of like, you know how many people are going to see us and you know, the quality of the target market that we’re engaging and all that and I find that, like, sponsorships are getting more like grants now, like they want impact. They want, um, outcomes and objectives and all of that. So they’re kind of like a hybrid, so to say. But grants are definitely just, um, very structured. Just the classic K. You know, what is your mission? What is your program? What is your budget? What you’re hoping to achieve? How are you going to measure success? The application for a sponsorship, I would say, would most likely and again these lines are blurring, not be as intensive, although they do vary by thunder. Um, but, um, yeah, so I would say that they, for the most part not as intensive. But I find them getting a little more intense as far as asking very similar related questions.

[00:18:17.34] spk_1:
Are you seeing a lot of companies that want employee engagement as a part of sponsorship agreements?

[00:19:12.94] spk_0:
Absolutely. So the employee engagement pieces key and what that looks like is having employees opportunities for employees to come out and volunteer with a non profit organization. Or sometimes it’s the exact opposite. There’s some corporate funders that won’t even give to your nonprofit if it isn’t recommended by an employee or former employee is not, you know, um, active on the board or volunteering, or that they will see kind of employee recommendations before they give or give a preference. Or sometimes they’ll even be a question. They’re like, Do you have some of our employees that are engaging with your nonprofit like, What is their role? And a lot of those questions are optional, but some, um, won’t even give unless it’s like referred to employees. So employing instrument is key. And I think a lot of nonprofits overlooked at because that is something that corporate funders value. But sometimes nonprofits don’t always have the capacity to engage

[00:19:46.34] spk_1:
right, You know, if it’s a sizable company, I mean, they want maybe hundreds of employees engaging in a volunteer capacity or like I’ve heard of, you know, maybe stuffing backpacks or, uh, if it’s, uh, it’s a soup kitchen or something, you know, then then there’s ability for cooking and serving and an administrative work as well. But it could be like you’re saying. I mean, it could be a capacity thing like you just you may not have the capacity to manage the number of employees that they want to have volunteering.

[00:19:56.84] spk_0:
Exactly, because, I mean, you need a volunteer manager. You need to you know, it has to be a good experience for the corporate sponsor.

[00:20:28.84] spk_1:
All right, So you you got to manage capacity to think about what’s appropriate. But on the other hand, you know, it could be a small It might be a small local company where, you know, maybe they just have, like, 20 employees, and they want to send half of them, you know, once a month to spend five hours or something. So maybe you can Maybe you can accommodate 10 employees for five hours twice a month. Okay. Think about. All right. Um, what do you What do you say you mentioned the l. A y. The letter of inquiry or interest? What do you What are you saying in an l O I

[00:21:37.64] spk_0:
so L o I, um some some funders will give specific instructions on how to respond. It’s almost like a mini grant, right? Um, others are just kind of open ended. Like, hey, just send us an l o I. And so for the open ended alloys, usually it’s just a brief summary of your organization when I say brief, I mean brief. It is not. A whole historical layout of your organization is very brief just to give them some contacts for you to start talking about your actual program. So once you give a brief overview of your organization, give a brief overview of the project very succinctly and talk about how your project can potentially in line with a lot of the great work that, um, the funder is doing. Depending on who the front er is. You know, you may want to end it with, you know something to to make you stand out or really aligned with what the fund is looking for. But in essence, that is what l. Y looks like.

[00:23:39.04] spk_1:
It’s time for Tony’s Take two podcast pleasantries. I’m enjoying sending the podcast pleasantries, which at times have been podcast pleasantries. But they’re not today. These are the ones that have survived the pleasantries because, you know, it makes me nostalgic for the studio days when there were live listener love, affiliate affections and podcast pleasantries. Yes, the Studio days with Sam the podcast pleasantries are the only ones that survived. Uh, the other audiences, uh, Well, I cast off. It’s not that they not that they departed. I cast them off the podcast pleasantries. And I mean the affiliate affections and the live listener love in that order. So I’m I took the initiative. And what remains is our biggest audience. The podcast audience. You? Yes. You listening right this minute. I’m sending pleasantries to you. I’m grateful you’re a listener. How much plainer can I make it? And I don’t know. Yeah, I’m enjoying sending these podcasts pleasantries. They may end. I’m not sure. I’m not sure when the podcast pleasantries will end. Let’s just Let’s just go with it. See how it feels. Weak, Too weak. I think that’s the the best strategy not to make any commitments, long term or otherwise. Pleasantries to you, our podcast, listeners. Thanks for being with me. That is. Tony, take two. We’ve got Boo Koo, but loads more time for relationships with funders with shaven Richardson. Let’s go back to where you You are submitted your grant application. Now you’re waiting. Mhm. Mm. Can you leverage your relationship that you that you have with the with the funders to ask? How was it received? How does it. Look, What am I? What are our chances Look like, What can you do after you’ve submitted the application? Hopefully by the deadline. If you didn’t make it by the deadline, you’re

[00:24:31.74] spk_0:
out, right? Yeah, exactly. They hold fast to the deadline. I would say. I mean, this is very a really difficult question to answer, because while an application is being reviewed, you don’t want the appearance that you’re trying to sway a prog program. Managers mind or influence it while it’s pending. So oftentimes, um, if you check in, they won’t respond because they’ll say we’ll get back to you after X y z deadline. And that’s it. So for some, it’s it’s sitting. Wait, Um, if you’re fortunate to have some type of in and get some insight, then that that that’s just pure fortune because you definitely want to have the appearance that you’re trying to influence or get a ahead while they’re in the process of reviewing applications.

[00:24:45.92] spk_1:
Okay, so the decision is supposed to be made based strictly on the application

[00:25:14.14] spk_0:
at that point. Yeah, because, you know, it’s it’s a competitive thing, right? So, you know, you can ask all the questions you want prior to submitting, right? Build all the relationships you want. Um, once that deadline hits, they have all the applications in, um, they’re in the process of reviewing the applications, so you almost have to allow that to go. But if you do find someone that says, Hey, I was in the room and it gave great feedback or with the face to it, like that’s just that’s just a blessing, because that that definitely doesn’t happen.

[00:25:45.74] spk_1:
Okay, Okay. So don’t don’t don’t overreach like then you’re then you’re taking advantage of the relationship, and that’s obviously a negative. Okay, um but it sounds like you would encourage folks to to definitely be in touch during the application process while you’re if you’re not sure about what, How to answer a question or, you know, as you’re preparing the application, it’s it’s fine to be in touch,

[00:26:20.74] spk_0:
of course, and I would even take it a step further. I would even say, Don’t submit an application if you have not had some type of outreach or connection with someone in the office. I mean, really like like we call it submitting a cold app, just submitting it blind you’ve never had a conversation with anyone in the office, there’s no connection. The most likely look at you and they say, Well, who is this person? All right, Well, maybe we want to prove it now because we need to get to know them better. Maybe they will reapply, and we’ll consider it then. So I would definitely say before you even think about submitting an application to have some type of connection, some type of outreach with the thunder. First,

[00:26:38.04] spk_1:
let’s switch to the the private foundation side. Is it very different relationship

[00:27:59.94] spk_0:
wise? I think it’s the same relationship wise. I think access and capacity is different. Uh, there’s some foundations that have, um, our all volunteer led. They don’t have paid staff, right, So you may not be able to get someone on the phone to talk to. They may have board meetings once a quarter, Um, and you just have to submit and wait till they meet, right? And so the capacity is limited, But then you have other foundations that are very, very friendly and very open to talking to people and encourage the outreach and have the time and the resources available so It depends on capacity. I know that covid and working from home change things a little bit as far as capacity. Uh, you know, before we might have been able to get, um, folks on the phone when they were in the office. But now that their home, it’s like, um, they have a bigger workload now because of shifts in, you know, staffing and different things that have changed. So getting someone on the phone might be harder, because now they have so many applications to manage, right? Because every nonprofit needs money, especially now in the middle of a pandemic. So, you know, maybe when they were in the office, people endemic, they might have had some time to have a conversation with you. But now that they’re working from home, they might be down a staff member. They have more applications. Their capacity may not be the same.

[00:28:20.04] spk_1:
All right, so yeah, I guess you would start with the website to try to figure out whether they accept calls, right? And inquiries by phone, like you were saying on the corporate side. But after that, just I mean, if if the website doesn’t really say, just reach out and try and see what see what happens.

[00:29:23.14] spk_0:
Yeah, and I will also say not to to make it more complicated. There’s some foundations out there that don’t have websites. No way to connect with them. Um, you might get a phone number, right? Like there’s foundations that don’t have websites. And so that’s why sometimes beyond just your normal a Google search. Um, sometimes I will say, you know, go to a great writing firm or nonprofit consulting firm. And if they’re willing to do some research for you, um, go that route because I know we have, you know, just relationships with funders and people who worked with that don’t have websites. But we have, you know, the connection there and were able to kind of, like, you know, make an introduction or do something, and we have our ways of finding out who sits on the board and you know how to make those connections. And so, you know, try to do as much as you can on your own. But I would always say, like if you need help, like, don’t be afraid to kind of reach out for help, especially if it’s one time support, right to get of insight on opportunities are available out there and the relationships that you need to build.

[00:29:54.74] spk_1:
Okay, Yeah. A foundation that doesn’t have a website. Sounds pretty closed. I mean, they’re not even They’re not even telling publicly what their funding priorities are. So you have to drill down and do research. What about the, um Well, it used to be the foundation center. Now, is it candid the the, uh, the service that they have, which is a subscription service for grants for foundation research? Yeah, F c. I forget what it used to be called FC Something

[00:29:58.78] spk_0:
etcetera online

[00:30:08.24] spk_1:
foundation center online is that? I mean, I know, I know listeners have to subscribe to it, but is that a valuable, um, research tool?

[00:30:15.94] spk_0:
Absolutely. A lot of those those foundations. Um, some are have websites, some don’t. Right. Um and so using as a resource, you can always pull up the funders they linked to nine nineties. So you’ll see an address and a phone number and a list of board directors. And there’s a lot of insightful information, so that’s definitely a good resource.

[00:30:42.34] spk_1:
What about on the federal funder side talking about a federal agency. What’s the relationship building like potential there?

[00:30:48.34] spk_0:
Yes, that’s a good question. So it’s kind of different, right? It’s not as, um personal as far as sending emails. Hey, this is what we’re doing. It’s more informational. And so every foe. And that’s the opportunity announcements for federal grants, mainly. Yeah, we

[00:31:08.73] spk_1:
have. Sorry. What the heck is a PFOA

[00:32:25.64] spk_0:
federal opportunity announcement? You’ll hear it reference that you’ll also hear RFP but this RFP saying for I don’t know. Sorry, guys. Yes. Okay, so, um, so with that, you will always see a list of everything you need for the grant. What to include? How to submit. Um, and usually will have multiple documents sometimes. Um, if you go to their website, you’ll see frequently asked questions. Always attend. The webinar always have the opportunity to ask questions during the webinar if you didn’t attend a lot of times to have replaced. So it’s good to attend that first. And I say this because they always have a contact of a person to reach out to. If you have questions, you want to be able to reach out to that person. If you have questions but asking questions in a way that you’re kind of sharing more information about what you all are doing and building a relationship that way, like having a person that you can go to to ask questions. The reason why I heavily recommend reading the RFE in its entirety and listening to the Webinar because you do not want to ask questions that have already been answered. I don’t like that they don’t like that. You’re not demonstrating that you’re listening or paying attention or doing anything right. So having that person that you can ask questions is away. I mean, I don’t want to use the relationship, but it’s a way that so that they know that you’re serious, right?

[00:32:45.14] spk_1:
It’s a more professional. It’s more. I mean, these are all professional relationship, but this one’s a little more arms length.

[00:32:46.94] spk_0:
Yeah, more arms lane.

[00:32:48.64] spk_1:
Okay.

[00:32:49.23] spk_0:
Yeah, no sending. You know, emails of the latest updates. Like, you know, none of that. Nothing in the mail like it’s a professional relationship for sure.

[00:33:26.14] spk_1:
Okay. Okay. Um let’s see what happens when, uh, when you get turned down? Suppose you have the Suppose you have the relationship. I don’t care whether it’s corporate or private or federal, well, federal. You have some kind of relationship, but whatever you get turned down, But you do know somebody at the at the thunder you’re you call sobbing, you’re not sobbing, but you’re disappointed. You know what? What do you What do you recommend when you get the rejection?

[00:34:15.04] spk_0:
Yeah, well, you know being rejected is never easy. It’s often disappointing. I say that that that’s an opportunity to position yourself for your next wind, right? Um, I always ask for feedback on the application and some things that we could do better to strengthen application next time. I think that’s very invaluable to get that sort of insight and be able to resubmit. But taking consideration, the insight that was shared and also just, um, keep on applying for other grants. And I’m going to speak to the emotional piece because I think sometimes it discourages nonprofit leaders to a point where they lose their steam right, and they don’t want to keep applying. But I will say rejections do happen. Um, keep applying to the next great opportunity, see it as a learning lesson and see it’s an opportunity for the funding to get to know you better, and for you to get to know the funder better and just be more aligned with what they’re looking for.

[00:34:39.34] spk_1:
Okay, so it’s it’s good to reach out and get the feedback.

[00:35:52.54] spk_0:
I’m not. And with federal grants, I’m just going to add this. Um oftentimes, reviewer, um, well, provide comments on the proposal and know that you can always ask for those comments. Okay. And that’s feedback as well. So that’s how you get feedback for a federal grant for foundation grant. It’s Hello. We received the decline letter. Would love to get any feedback that you can provide to improve our chances for applying in the future or to be better line now. You may not always get a response because, especially with corporate funders, um, you know, they don’t ever want to put it out there like they’re giving one non profit and advantage over another. So sometimes they may just say if they do reply, they’ll say, Um, yeah, you know, you didn’t make it. You know, here’s the link if you want to apply it in the future, and so if you don’t get a response, don’t be surprised, but definitely try to get some insight. Okay?

[00:35:53.54] spk_1:
And you might have that relationship. Is it okay to pick up the phone to the person that you have the relationship with and ask them? That’s not overreaching it?

[00:36:05.03] spk_0:
Not at that point. It’s already been decisioned. Okay, Okay.

[00:36:08.33] spk_1:
What do you want to spend a little time talking about? I’ve been asking all the questions. What? What do you think? Relationship building wise. Haven’t we talked about that? You want listeners to know?

[00:37:10.43] spk_0:
I just want to emphasize the importance of doing. And I know that nonprofit leaders, executive directors, those that sits on sit on boards your time is stretched and we understand that, and we know it and there’s so many competing priorities. But I do recommend for nonprofit organizations to have a relationship building strategy. The top 20% of the folks on your list that you want to reach out to this year and focus on that 20% have a strategy in place. And it’s not only just calling and emailing, but also engaging in person when we’re able to write in the community right? That’s another way to build relationships and have those authentic connection. So I know it’s definitely sometimes not easy because there’s so many responsibilities. But it is definitely, definitely important. And it will take you much further than what you think.

[00:37:17.83] spk_1:
You practice yoga, right? Do does your Does your yoga practice inform your work? Is that impact your your work?

[00:37:48.73] spk_0:
I will say it keeps me ballots, right? Like I think everyone and I encourage nonprofit leaders and business owners alike to find something that keeps you balance. Because writing France, uh, is sometimes can be really stressful, right? It’s It’s a high pressure, deadline driven industry. Very cerebral. I’m fortunate I’m an introvert. So this this works very well for me, right? I am. I’m in the right profession for sure. Sound

[00:37:57.66] spk_1:
like an introvert?

[00:38:03.42] spk_0:
I don’t. I am. I am an extroverted introvert. That

[00:38:15.82] spk_1:
sounds a little a little oxymoronic. What is an extroverted introvert? You are one. But how do you It depends on the setting. Is that like you? If there’s a microphone in front of you, then you’re an extrovert. But if you’re at a party, you’re an introvert. What? How does that work?

[00:39:06.82] spk_0:
Well, what it is if you’re an introverted person you refuel yourself by doing introverted activities. So if it’s being by yourself or reading and writing, that’s what you reveal yourself. And then when you do extroverted activities, it drains you right. You feel like you have to kind of come back to your reading and writing to refill yourself. Extroverts are the exact opposite. They reveal themselves by interacting with people and talking and began doing things. And then if they’re doing something that’s like, quiet and reading a book, it drains them. So you really have to identify what drains you and what feels you and I know being introvert fuels me, and I do like doing extroverted things. But when I do them, I am completely a exhausted. If I’m speaking somewhere, I have to plan, uh, the next morning to just decompress and do some yoga and some introverted activities to kind of re fuel myself. Before I kind of get back in the mix of things

[00:39:20.82] spk_1:
you ride horses to.

[00:39:22.75] spk_0:
I do

[00:39:24.72] spk_1:
so that’s another. I guess that’s an introverted active right. That’s a solo. I mean, you could be just one of the person or something, but that’s pretty much a solo activity is,

[00:39:43.22] spk_0:
you know, and I look at the things that I do like to do, and they tend to be so activities. It’s just This is very strange, although I I like people. I have a great team, were really well connected. But I do know that I enjoy horseback riding and yoga and doing things like that.

[00:39:47.22] spk_1:
All right, the extroverted introvert. I understand now. It’s what you get, which you derive their energy from exactly. Okay, so now you’re exhausted talking

[00:40:06.41] spk_0:
to me for a No, I’m good. I think this was This was good. This is a nice balance for me. I think. You know, if I was doing a keynote somewhere, I’d be totally exhausted. That’s different. Yeah,

[00:40:09.13] spk_1:
non profit radio is not exhausting. No,

[00:40:11.36] spk_0:
no, it’s good.

[00:41:05.21] spk_1:
Thank you, Stephen. Thanks very much for having us. Sheldon Richardson. She’s at Shavon Richardson, and the company is at Think and Inc grants dot com Next week, Jeanne Takagi returns with Build Your best Better board, Bud. Maybe we’ll leave out the bud. That’s sexist. Keep that. Keep the butt out. It’ll just be build your best Better Board and Jeanne Takagi, always a pleasure to have him look forward to that. That’s your next week’s show. All right, if you missed any part of this week’s show, I beseech you find it at tony-martignetti dot com. We’re sponsored by turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot c o. Our creative producer is Claire Meyerhoff Shows Social Media

[00:41:08.33] spk_3:
is by Susan Chavez

[00:41:09.70] spk_0:
Mark Silverman

[00:41:17.31] spk_3:
is our Web guy, and this music is by Scott Stein. Thank you for that affirmation. Scotty, be with me next week for nonprofit radio. Big non profit ideas for the other 95% Go

[00:41:38.31] spk_1:
out and be great. Mm, yeah.

Nonprofit Radio for February 8, 2021: Opera Singer to Fundraiser

My Guest:

Yolanda F. Johnson: Opera Singer to Fundraiser

Yolanda F. Johnson’s classical opera training informs her fundraising practice. She’s the founder and president of YFJ Consulting and the first African-American president of Women in Development, NY. She’s with us for the hour.

 

 

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[00:02:12.24] spk_1:
Hi there. I’m shaking it up this week. It’s a throwback. I picked an archive show, and I’m keeping it intact right down to Tony’s Take Two from Boise, Idaho, and the podcast pleasantries in the live listener Love you remember those. The sponsor messages are current, though. Got to keep the sponsors satisfied and fulfill contractual obligations. It’s from back When When we were in the studio, remember, remember the New York City studio with Sam? Sam Liebowitz, our producer? Yes, a throwback here is from June 28 2019. Hello and welcome to big ideas for the other 95% on your aptly named host. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d be stricken with Hemi Diocese Asia if you blindsided me with the idea that you missed today’s show From opera Singer to fundraiser Yolanda F. Johnson’s classical opera training informs her fundraising practice. She’s the founder and president of Y F J Consulting and the first African American president of Women in Development, New York. She’s with us for the hour. I’m Steak, too. Hello from Boise were sponsored by turn to communications PR and content. For nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot c o and by dot drives. Prospect to donor. Simplified for a free demo and a free month. I’m very glad to welcome Yolanda F. Johnson to the studio. She has nearly two decades of experience as a fundraising expert and professional musician. She is founder and president of Why F. J Consulting and the first African American president elect in the 40 year history of women in Development New York. Her company is why f j consulting dot com Women in development is at UID and why dot or GE? And she’s at Yolanda F. Johnson. Welcome, Johnson. Thank you for having me. My pleasure. Come a little closer to the mike. Okay. Classically trained opera singer. I’m surprised your voice

[00:02:27.70] spk_0:
If I’m singing, you’ll

[00:02:28.61] spk_1:
hear everything

[00:02:29.57] spk_0:
way

[00:03:01.44] spk_1:
may get to that. No, I wouldn’t put you. Okay. Um So congratulations, President Elect of women and Development with New York. Uh, you begin your term on July 1st. Awesome. Congratulations. Thank you. So timely. You see, everything in your career has led you to this day on. Indeed. Everything that we’re gonna talk about and and coming up, uh, culminates here. You’re at the pinnacle. It’s all downhill from here. That means it’s all downhill from here. I’m sorry. Uh, okay. So, uh, your Nebraska girl I am. How did you find your way from, uh, Nebraska Thio Professional opera Singing that Z, That’s not a typical trip for Ah, Nebraskan.

[00:03:12.54] spk_0:
Well, not necessarily so. But we all have our own paths. And I began with music probably four years old, and that was piano first. And then I started to sing in church, actually went to get a music degree of performance degree in undergrad in Oklahoma, went to get a graduate degree that had a focus in fundraising, arts administration and fundraising and then sold all my worldly goods and moved to New York. Because this is where you could do everything

[00:03:39.89] spk_1:
for singing, for singing principles originally or or fundraising or something else.

[00:03:45.07] spk_0:
Interestingly, I never did fundraising. Some people always have day jobs or you see performers and they have other jobs or servers or something like that. Hospitality. I’ve always loved both. I’ve always loved music, and I’ve always loved fundraising, and I’ve always had them in my life simultaneously.

[00:04:02.36] spk_1:
Okay? What does it mean to be a classically trained opera singer? What? What is that what

[00:04:08.76] spk_0:
it means? I worked really hard with lots of teachers. Um, toe learn proper technique to sing opera and classical music. Uh, opera and recitals. Art song. Um, I specialize in spirituals as well with the underground railroad.

[00:04:25.44] spk_1:
Oh, really? Okay. Um, we’ll say a little more about that. What about spirituals in the underground railroad? I mean, you’re performing those now? Yeah.

[00:04:43.84] spk_0:
Yeah. I have an album called Feel the Spirit Feel. Feel the spirit. Feel it. Yeah, And I have a concert lecture called a spirituals experience. You like that? Spirituals

[00:04:46.96] spk_1:
experience, spirituals experience, a concert lecture, eso that’s talk and singing.

[00:04:51.86] spk_0:
Yes. I teach people about the hidden messages behind some of the music, the spirituals, some of the things they meant with the underground

[00:06:00.34] spk_1:
railroad. Okay, okay. I haven’t seen a lot of opera. My the pinnacle of my opera attendance was probably I saw Aida in Italy at the Battle of the Baths of Caracalla, which is an outdoor. It used to be a bathhouse in ancient days. Now it’s, uh it’s a performance space and I was traveling in Italy. I just stumbled on these tickets from a booth on the street. Stumbled on those two. Yeah, they were. Well, I had to pay for them, but I stumbled on the booth that was selling the tickets. Just said Aida Caracol. And I thought, Well, that’s cool. I know what Caracalla is. Um, so I mean, this was a lavish. I mean, I eat it takes place in Egypt. Uh, I know, you know that, but for for for the Neophytes out there, uh, I need to take place in Egypt. And there were There were all kinds of animals. There were camels. I think there were tigers on stage, like 100 and 50 people. I mean, this was a lavish. There were live animals and lots of people. It was amazing. It was amazing. It was a beautiful night. Um, anyway, so, um, have you performed e

[00:06:03.98] spk_0:
have not performed the only one I

[00:06:05.22] spk_1:
know. Okay, e don’t even remember. This was years ago. I don’t remember, but I know it involves a queen and love and a mistress and Egypt. A lot of just like 90% of opera. Okay, Um now you’re still currently You’re still performing? Yeah, you have some. You have a show coming up.

[00:06:23.04] spk_0:
I dio have a show in August of Gian Carlo Menotti’s The Console and we actually put it in contemporary times. So it sparks dialogue about the immigration debate.

[00:06:35.94] spk_1:
Okay. Ah, nde. We’ll say it now and then. We’ll remind listeners at the end, where can they see the console?

[00:06:45.69] spk_0:
They can see the console. I’ll be Magda Magda in that production at the amphitheater at the Hudson River Museum in Yonkers. It is not upstate, it’s just the suburb

[00:07:13.14] spk_1:
Yonkers. It’s not yet well, right for New Yorkers, that’s upstate. But it tze not upstate eerie and buffalo upstate. Okay, but for geo centric New Yorkers who think this is the center of the universe, that’s you need a passport to get toe Yonkers. OK, eso if I don’t. If I forget, remind me that put little pitch in for that at the end to um so now you’re before we get to weed. So opera and singing informs your consulting. It does Y f J consulting very much. What’s the What’s the influence their of singing over fundraising?

[00:07:26.91] spk_0:
Well, since you know, as I mentioned, I’ve always had a love for both. I found this intersection that makes me so excited. And it’s using performance practice in philanthropy and and fundraising. I realized I was at somewhat of an advantage, right, because, uh, I knew how to get into character. I knew how to breathe. I knew how to get through things that make may make other people nervous. Um, by using the things I had learned as a performer and all the world is a stage. I have a workshop that I just launched a month or so ago called All the World’s a Stage, and it deals with that. It helps people. It coaches them through, um, being on that fundraising stage and using performance, practice, toe, succeed and excel.

[00:08:10.29] spk_1:
So we’re talking about overcoming the anxiety of what face to face meetings, uh, training session, public speaking, kind of public speaking,

[00:08:26.91] spk_0:
making me ask, making the pitch, knowing how to pivot if I’m talking to you and it’s not going quite right knowing what to say next. That’s improv. Improv. Yeah,

[00:08:40.66] spk_1:
uh, interesting. Because I was trained. I was I was coached, I guess, uh, years ago, when I was getting started, public speaking. I didn’t feel like I was very strong and my coach was a jazz singer and she brought in some elements of jazz, which is largely improv on Dhe. Then we thought this was incredible. She she and I worked together for a couple of years, on and off, and then she felt like she had done everything she could to help me, and she recommended I take improv classes on. I loved improv so much that I, instead of taking one class, I took four classes. Like in a year. There were three months classes. I think I could come back to back improv at UCB, the Upright Citizens Brigade here in New York City. Uh, that really she she did take me to another level, but then improv. Just the confidence of walking on stage with a scene partner with knowing only one word like knowing your first word of your first sentence and relying on your scene partner or team.

[00:09:25.64] spk_0:
And even if you’re not confident faking it until you make it getting into character, taking that breath, walking out there and just doing it, getting that performance done, whatever it is if the stage is the boardroom, if it’s on the stage, um, you’re always on stage, right? Pretty much in life. You wanna live an authentic life, but you also wanna be prepared and be able to navigate.

[00:10:52.24] spk_1:
All right, So let’s all right, let’s take our first break and then we’re gonna talk a little more detail about, uh, some of the things you just ticked off, like some of the some of the, um singing lesson performance lessons that specifically that inform your informed fundraising and speaking etcetera, little detail. Here’s that break that I inarticulately introduced turn to communications. The Wall Street Journal, The New York Times CBS Market Watch The Chronicle of Philanthropy Turn two has the relationships with outlets like these. So when they’re looking for experts on charitable giving, trends in philanthropy, they turn to turn to turn two turns to you. There’s lots of turning going on because your turn to his client turn hyphen two dot c o. Now back to from opera singer to fundraiser, say a little more detail about I mean eso I riffed on improv, but what are some of the specific, uh, skills that you could bring from performance toe help fundraisers.

[00:11:01.74] spk_0:
Well, one thing in particular, I think, whoever your audiences, if it’s 205 100 people in an auditorium, if it’s your board of directors, if it’s some major donor prospects, um, you know, always being prepared, nothing will save the day like being prepared. So you have to

[00:11:17.78] spk_1:
prepare. Yeah,

[00:11:52.94] spk_0:
nothing’s gonna get you by you don’t prepare. Um, but once you have that, there’s a certain peace of mind that comes And then so you understand your audience and you wanna make sure that, uh, there’s a level of comfort between you and them with, especially with American audiences. Um, we don’t breathe a lot as native speakers of English. Have you ever noticed? Well, have you ever noticed that you’re talking and you’re just having this conversation with somebody? Maybe not you, because you’ve done improv, but a lot of us other people were just talking and then suddenly take a really deep breath.

[00:11:53.59] spk_1:
Yeah, and sometimes on the show. And I think everybody here is my breath. I’m like some kind of Godzilla. Something.

[00:11:58.88] spk_0:
Yeah. You take a huge breath because you haven’t been breathing. You don’t wanna walk around breathing too much. But you want to relax, right? Because your audience, actually on the subconscious level consents. You’re not breathing, and it makes them very uncomfortable singing or speaking. If you’re going to long, they’re like, Oh, my God, she

[00:12:16.10] spk_1:
hasn’t. I’ve also done stand up comedy along with along with improv and the audience can definitely sense fear. Maybe it comes from breath. I don’t know, but they could tell when you’re nervous and that makes them nervous. And your material could be fabulous, But they’re scared for you. So they’re not laughing the way you want them Thio audience they can smell. Yeah, right. I mean, audiences consents eso you got okay, So be prepared. Gives you confidence. You’re not fearful. People don’t sense your fear,

[00:12:45.91] spk_0:
right? And then you just know what you’re doing, right? I’m having a conversation with you. Have done the research. You do your prospecting as a fundraiser. You read your lines. Um, you learn your music as a performer, be prepared, whatever it is that you’re doing. And then that gives you that peace of mind. So I’m having a conversation with you where I don’t necessarily just have bullet points in my mind that I want to cover. I have them there is back up. But I can have a real authentic conversation with you. Right? And and from that comes hopefully dollars and cultivation of relationships and augmenting of audiences.

[00:13:30.64] spk_1:
Um, anything else we can, uh, touch on Besides, Okay. So preparation, preparation. What about breathing? Are there breathing at Do you go through breathing exercises with clients? What’s a breathing exercise? Could we doing?

[00:13:32.79] spk_0:
Sure teach me. So

[00:13:35.25] spk_1:
I’m trainable. Do I need to stand up for it? We can. We pretend I’m standing cause then we gotta adjust the mic and everything. Okay, Pretend I’m standing.

[00:13:53.48] spk_0:
So whenever you take a breath, the proper breath is not a shallow one that just goes straight out front. Right? It’s ah, breath that’s barrel shaped. We have these muscles between our ribs. Everybody talks about the diagram, but think of your not necessarily untrue. But think about your intercostal muscles, right?

[00:13:59.57] spk_1:
That’s the ones that connect the ribs to the spine.

[00:14:01.62] spk_0:
So your breath should be barrel shaped, not shallow. There you go.

[00:14:05.94] spk_1:
And into the shoulders, like up, up,

[00:14:28.34] spk_0:
up. It doesn’t have to be affected deep. And then you control it out. Mhm. Whether or not I’m sitting there and I’m about to perform or if I’m about to ask you for $10 million you take that breath, then I can look you in the eye and we can have an authentic conversation. Okay. Did that help? Did you notice the difference between the shallow and the

[00:14:42.74] spk_1:
also the pacing of your the way you were talking to? Yeah, together. Okay. Like you change, you can change the mood in a conversation through pace.

[00:14:44.47] spk_0:
Exactly. And pace is very closely related to

[00:14:46.71] spk_1:
breath. You could get people’s attention with silence. You built in a little silence. Not awkward, but there’s some pauses. You could get people’s attention that way. Yeah, I do that. Stand up trying to get I do that sometimes. Stand up, take a pause. Like every second doesn’t have to be filled with syllables. Right,

[00:15:04.24] spk_0:
Because in the audience starts getting stressed out. Okay.

[00:15:11.04] spk_1:
Okay. All right. Thank you. You’re welcome. Um, this is very good. All right. So this is the intersection of performance and on dhe fundraising. And of course I mean, you’re right. We are like, sort of constantly performing and fundraisers all them or whether you’re in a board meeting where you’re in a 1 to 1 meeting and it may not even necessarily be a solicitation. You’re trying to get to know someone, make them comfortable so that a couple of meetings from now, you know, you’re gonna ask them to be, uh, step up for the campaign or for the dinner, or to be a major volunteer or be a board member. You know, whatever it is not only about dollars.

[00:15:42.97] spk_0:
Whatever ask it is that you’re going to make. You can’t just ask people unnecessarily immediately for money. You want to cultivate that relationship, and you wanna be asked again, or you want to have your invitation accepted the next time so you can continue that process?

[00:16:23.14] spk_1:
Yeah. And if it’s awkward, uncomfortable, you’re lowering the chances of going to get an email. Yeah. Yeah. You get an email after a call, right? You get a voice, you leave a voicemail, you get an email. That’s bad. That’s usually a bad sign. Um, okay. Um, let’s all right, let’s talk some about wid 40th anniversary. You’re the first black. Uh well, they’re all females. Your first black president of wid. Congratulations on that milestone. Um, what’s what’s coming up for wod This is a big anniversary year for we do.

[00:16:27.72] spk_0:
It’s a huge anniversary. Here I happen, toe. Just love this organization. I don’t just say that, um it’s been a really big factor in my fundraising career and in my life, and it has some amazing women that are really running this town as far as fundraising is concerned in the tri state area. Really? And for our 40th anniversary, um, we have lots of wonderful things planned new programming. We have a really row best programming schedule. We’re gonna delve deeper into some issues that we haven’t necessarily touched upon before about the experience of being a woman in the field.

[00:17:03.74] spk_1:
Like Like what? What are some of those issues?

[00:17:09.64] spk_0:
Uh, well, we’re actually gonna have a conversation about the role of men. Okay? You know, uh, and we’re gonna look holistically at the with woman and And who women are in the development field and embrace

[00:17:19.91] spk_1:
the role of men. I mean, like, I could synopsis eyes that I can summarize that in a sentence. White men have all the power.

[00:17:25.74] spk_0:
Well, we’re going to talk about that. Maybe you should come to that session.

[00:17:44.14] spk_1:
That’s very interesting that you say that I wasn’t gonna bring this up. Um, but I will. Eso Years ago, I tried to be a speaker at UID, and they had some kind of policy. I don’t know if it was written or or just, uh, er de facto, but they weren’t They weren’t bring in male speakers.

[00:17:48.69] spk_0:
Well, I’ll put it this way. Would is open Wit is really smart. Okay, I will say that not just because I’m the leader of the organization, but we were dealing with some really highly intelligent people who make really good decisions for the organization where it’s at at whatever period that

[00:18:04.22] spk_1:
was Well,

[00:18:05.94] spk_0:
I don’t I don’t know that they blew it. They just made a decision that was best for the organization. But that being said, um, we our mission is to empower women in the field, whatever that means in whatever way, um is appropriate at that time. And so, in this particular season, we’ve been around for four decades, and, uh, we find the value in having that conversation about empowering women And what does that mean? You know, how can this whole village of people in philanthropy empower women in the development field? And so, um, at that particular session, it would make a lot of sense, possibly for you to join us. Well, I would like committees listening. Right? We have witnesses.

[00:18:47.58] spk_1:
Okay, I would I would love to. We’re gonna send out live Whistler in love with you. How many are in Manhattan right now? Um, but I also want to make clear they don’t doesn’t have to be, uh, men in the room to talk about dealing with male

[00:18:59.69] spk_0:
power. No, not not. Not at all. But we, as women, have talked about for a long time. And now we need we want to look at it from a different perspective. And not only that, but again empowering women. So we have programs around professional development skills based, um, wellness. You know, we’re gonna be introducing that this year. We’re going through a rebranding. So we’re gonna launch that at our member meeting in September. Eso just lots of really wonderful, exciting things. We also talk about leadership, of course. You know, in the trajectory of ah women and development members career. How to assess that. And then we have this amazing network of women that are so supportive. There’s a sense of camaraderie with wood that’s just unique,

[00:19:42.25] spk_1:
is with National. And this is the New York, uh, chapter we’re talking about, or is with New York unique

[00:19:49.54] spk_0:
with other women and development. There are other chapters, but there’s not a national body that oversees us. Uh, but there’s a chapter, and there’s would Greater Boston. Um, there’s one in New Jersey. There’s one upstate in actual upstate, not in Westchester. E think there’s one around Westchester to, um and you know, we’re actually doing some research to really discover. So if, uh, your audience is broad, right all over the country. So if there are with chapters that we may not know of, we want to talk to you, actually, because we like toe toe, have a conversation with you about getting together and working together.

[00:20:27.14] spk_1:
Um, does wid you mentioned the network does, does does we’ve encourage mentorship. You must

[00:20:58.04] spk_0:
we Do We have an organic mentor ship that happens? I’ve had several really, really, um, pivotal mentors that have come through with that have taught me so much. Uh, and I think that we all find those relationships. It’s why going to our networking events going to our programs. You end up developing the circle of colleagues and really friends that it lasts for years.

[00:20:59.32] spk_1:
Yeah, it’s it’s crucial. I’ve had lots of guests talk about it, and I’ve experienced it myself. Um, mentorship.

[00:21:22.64] spk_0:
Yeah, it’s very important. And that’s one of the beautiful things about many and leadership with with our board of directors Phenomenal women. Uh, and I don’t say that I don’t give free compliments. Um, I mean it when I say that and they are so open to, you know, spending time with young professionals with other people if they have questions, um, really championing. And again, we all go back to empowerment of women in the fundraising field.

[00:21:41.18] spk_1:
Is there a coronation on Monday? Uh, Monday Coronation event that we should be attending at Cipriani, or oh, uh, no,

[00:21:49.60] spk_0:
but we just had our woman of achievement a week or so ago. Um, no, there isn’t it. It’s a quiet transition, but, uh, but nonetheless enthusiastic.

[00:21:58.04] spk_1:
What is your first official act? A ZX president.

[00:22:02.64] spk_0:
My first official act I already have a task list for Monday of some things that just need to get done. I’ve been working for a while, actually. Are outgoing president. I’ll give her a shout out here. Bryant, Um, wonderful person and leader. And,

[00:22:16.49] spk_1:
uh,

[00:22:23.04] spk_0:
she’s the director of development there. And so I’ll just be looking forward to a lot of the things that I’ve started implementing. Really? As early as January, she was very supportive. We started a system that hopefully I’ll be able to continue of allowing the person coming next, um, to begin the planning process so that they could be ahead of the game before that July 1st period.

[00:22:41.26] spk_1:
It sounds like you have that advantage. I did. And how long is your time? Two years. Two years? Okay. And 2020 is the 40th year of Is that right?

[00:22:49.83] spk_0:
This is our 40th anniversary year, but we’re gonna have ah, birthday anniversary bash in January to celebrate that we’re entering

[00:22:56.97] spk_1:
that. Oh, wonderful. So that at the Pierre Hotel? No. Would you like to sponsor? E Don’t know about sponsoring, but I might come. Where is it? Where you doing it?

[00:23:05.14] spk_0:
Uh, those details will be available later. We have a lot that we’re launching at the meeting in September.

[00:23:09.97] spk_1:
Okay. Okay. So, January January, Miguel in

[00:23:13.53] spk_0:
January. Not big gala, but big celebration

[00:23:15.98] spk_1:
celebration. Okay. Okay.

[00:23:17.86] spk_0:
Um, as an events person, I’m very careful about that. Word. That g word,

[00:23:34.16] spk_1:
uh, means a certain certain expectations. Right? Ah, 1000 people A tw the world over story. Right? Right. So, events, um, do you Do you still enjoy events? Still like, Do you still like putting them together? I mean, I know that’s not your practice, but you still like being the organizer of events

[00:23:41.64] spk_0:
on a personal level. I think I planned my first event when I was six years old.

[00:23:45.94] spk_1:
Okay, that was two years after you started music so late, Bloomer in events. All right,

[00:23:50.64] spk_0:
Um, and I personally, I love to love people through that they’re being bringing them together through ah, common bond. A mission, Uh, just, you know, an affinity for something with delicious food and for was ready for you mentioned food? Yes. Food

[00:24:06.69] spk_1:
and food and wine, I think are great. Lubricate er’s for a room.

[00:24:11.74] spk_0:
Yeah. You know, just it’s that sensory thing. Yeah, the sensory thing

[00:24:15.44] spk_1:
and sharing. It’s a share, sure, coming together with a table, not necessarily sitting around it. But it’s a buffet table, you know? Or if we are sitting down together, it’s sharing a space, That’s why. Yeah,

[00:24:40.14] spk_0:
exactly. And for a, it should have that same sentiment. I think you know, we’re all what makes it special is that you’re coming together to celebrate. It’s a culmination of them, you know, belief in that organization’s mission. Um, it’s not just the party, but it is a celebration, you know,

[00:24:42.34] spk_1:
Um, yeah, events. I have a hard time doing events. I just the details, like, Does the bunting match the flowers? You know, things like that I don’t have a lot of patients for So I am grateful that there are people who enjoy doing

[00:24:53.79] spk_0:
it. And I love campaigns. You know, Those are my focus areas with my practices, events and campaigns. And I happen to specialize in anniversary campaigns that culminate in an event. So, you know that marries those two

[00:25:05.90] spk_1:
things that the anniversary Yeah, the anniversary, as you’re doing with wid, should be celebrated over a long over over a long period, right? Plan. These things in advance.

[00:25:14.50] spk_0:
Yes, I mean,

[00:25:15.89] spk_1:
not just a one night like a one night thing. 40th, 40th anniversary night and then e. It should be multiple activities right through a year

[00:26:07.84] spk_0:
exactly on. So it is the 40th anniversary year. That’s why we’re starting in 2019. It’s the year and then it will culminate next year, and there are lots of things planned. So we have. We’ll have our woman of achievement lunch and again next May, And, uh, then we’ll have the celebration in January. But everything this year, you know, we have thematic concepts across a year. A lot of the time this past year was women in philanthropy, and this coming year is gonna be focused upon being around for four decades and what would has meant to the fundraising field. And, uh, and where it goes from here with has meant a lot tow women in the field. We have some real pioneers, um, many of whom are still around and still supportive of the organization, and we’re really appreciative of them. Oh, see, And I know I will, but you

[00:26:10.75] spk_1:
know, I’m not. Leave somebody out, right? And then you’ll feel

[00:26:12.90] spk_0:
bad. Let me do that disclaimer. But I am that type of person that loves to give people individual attention. And then I’m like, Oh, wait. Next week on your show, you mentioned these

[00:26:21.14] spk_1:
names. E o. I put I put her on the spot so she did not come prepared. But names, um, pioneers who are members of wid

[00:26:30.79] spk_0:
Linda Hartley.

[00:26:32.24] spk_1:
Okay, I know her. She’s been on the show when she came out with her book.

[00:26:35.73] spk_0:
When is amazing? Um, Shirley Jenks, who you also know

[00:26:39.17] spk_1:
I know Shirley very well. Done some work with her Shirley Jenks and J n ks in, uh, in here in the city.

[00:26:56.44] spk_0:
Margaret Holman is a past president. Margaret. She has a relationship with Nebraska to okay, she’s on the board of the University of Nebraska. Um, we have a current board member who just co chaired, uh, woman of achievement luncheon this past year. Jane Carlin, Who’s a beautiful person. Uh, and then Oh, my God. See, now I don’t know Susan Yulin. You know Susan because she know my favorite people on the Planet

[00:27:13.26] spk_1:
E. Yeah, but just generally, for non profits, do planning in advance of your upcoming anniversary. You know, if it’s your 50th year or some organizations you know, 125th year you wanna be start planning that a couple of years in advance whether there’s gonna be What’s it gonna be? Is it gonna be a fundraising campaign or it doesn’t have to be. But it’s a good hook. Whatever it’s gonna be, you should start planning out of major anniversaries. I think two years in advance or so

[00:27:42.60] spk_0:
that’s a good timeline. Yeah, it gives you time toe to think ahead and be creative.

[00:27:47.44] spk_1:
Maximum advantage. Big news

[00:27:49.82] spk_0:
hook. I’m a piecemeal or by nature. You won’t really see me dive into something and completed all at once. I like to be ableto work on it and take a step back. Go back to it. Have the daily experience of your life. Inform some of the decisions that you make, You know, you keep living life and things happening there, like, you know, I’ll go back to this and maybe I’ll try it this way. So, um, so what is definitely We’ve been planning ahead and we’re excited.

[00:31:24.04] spk_1:
It’s a life practice. Piecemeal. You say piecemeal. I would say life, it’s a life practice you come back to things. Um okay, um let’s zoom, Let’s take our break. And when we come back, I want to talk a little about your experience as a black woman in fundraising and ah, survey that we have, uh, so hang on there. Okay, great. Alright. Thank you. Don’t walk out now. Time for. Stick to hello from Boise, Idaho. I was just there for a long weekend. Visiting dear friends. Um, and I recommend Boise on, by the way, it’s Boise, Boise. I mean, you don’t Boise, but it’s not Boise for you. East coasters. It’s Boise, Boise, Idaho. Um, I learned just like it’s Oregon, not Oregon. There’s no easy Oregon at the end of Oregon. Um, a little bit of a digression. So, Boise, what about it? It’s got mountains, beautiful mountain range, snow capped mountains in the winter and the spring even when the temperature is is, uh, more modest, you know, down below the beautiful, snowcapped mountains. Um, they take their beers very seriously. 16 brew houses in Boise Now, I did not get to sample all of them. I went to a couple. Uh, I can shout out, uh, powder powerhouse h A U s powerhouse. Very nice place. Um, 10 barrel, which happens to be downtown. Uh, those air to that that we went to there was a third one. I can’t remember. They also take their food very seriously. If you go downtown. Around where? Around where? Uh, 10 barrel is 8th, 8th Street and Main Street. Lots of restaurants and other brewpubs and breweries not serving food. Right along eighth and main. Um, lots of serious restaurants there. And I don’t mean serious upscale. Just very good food. Reminds me of Portland a lot. In that respect, they take this food very seriously. Um, what else about boys? Oh, just drive 10 minutes, 15 minutes. You’re out your way out of the city. We visited a winery, so I’m recommending Boise as a travel destination. And there’s more in my video. Um, and you will find that at dot com. And that is. Take two. Now, let’s, uh let’s continue a little more with Yolanda F. Johnson and upper singer to fundraiser. Whoa, Look at the bursting. Oh, man. When we get to live listener love, we’re bursting. But we’re not doing that now. Okay? Bursting I mean, there’s a lot at first were bursting with live listeners on We’re on Facebook Live to Oh, I guess I should do is all shout out All right, Aunt Mary. Mary Bob Largent. Hello, Rosemary Video. Love to see you. Thank you for being with us on Facebook. Give us give us a little Give us a love on Facebook and I’ll be happy to shout you out. All right, so all right. So the power in nonprofits is maintained by white men. Uh, they’re they’re overwhelmingly the board chairs, the board leadership, the CEOs, the C suite, the senior fundraisers. What’s been your your experience as a black woman doing fundraising in that culture?

[00:32:19.44] spk_0:
Well, coming from Nebraska, how’s it going? And it’s interesting that it is a national issue, is it not? You know, no matter where you are, even in a place is diverse. A ZX New York City. That’s still our reality. And, uh, it’s obvious that, uh, philanthropy would do well from continuing, um, diversity and my experience as an African American woman in the field, you know, You know, this year we did a diversity Brooke and I did a diversity and inclusion task force for wid because we were looking at the room and amazing women. Um, but the room could be a bit more diverse, you know? And so we wanted to think about that. One of the first questions was, you know, is the field already diverse? Does it exist that way? It’s just that people may not, um, come out and aren’t necessarily feeling as welcome for whatever reason, or, um, are they just not there? And so, because of some of these studies that have come out recently, I was I spoke at a case conference and diverse on diversity and fundraising in Indianapolis in April, and that was one of the things we talked about. Is diversifying that pipeline for fundraisers because you don’t necessarily see yourself,

[00:32:47.04] spk_1:
Did you have you come to any conclusions whether it’s, uh, there, there are there is greater representation in fundraising, but people are not coming out or there just isn’t the representation that we’d like to see

[00:32:59.91] spk_0:
both.

[00:33:01.14] spk_1:
It is okay. I kind of think there’s more. The latter. They’re just not just not represented, but

[00:33:26.24] spk_0:
it’s both. It’s both because we have to make those efforts toward diversifying the pipeline. We have to look to the future. We have to look to see what’s happening now. We have to stay self aware and just aware in the profession. Um, and that’s the thing. You know, inclusion is the exact opposite of tokenism. So inclusion means that you’re naturally, organically there. You’re appreciated for what you’re bringing to the table. And when you don’t see diversity, sometimes that doesn’t come to mind. So one of the things with is gonna dio is really focus on that this coming year. And, uh, just make sure it’s on our mind, You know, if you have an opportunity to invite a speaker or toe work with different people and partners, Um, is there someone who’s just disqualified who may be a little more diverse? Um, thinking fairly, you know, they’re just disqualified again. Like I say, it’s not tokenism, but just making sure that’s on your mind, because when something is not on your mind, it’s, um it doesn’t exist. Okay,

[00:34:04.72] spk_1:
right. So, consciousness awareness consciousness. Yes. Critical first step, but necessary, but not sufficient. You know, there needs to be action. They need to be conscious. Action? Yes. Not just policies not just tokenism.

[00:34:40.04] spk_0:
Yes, I’m outcome oriented person. So I believe in the process. But I’m not interested in staying stuck there. So we have some definite recommendations that our task forces made to the board of directors that we’re gonna be implementing in the in the coming year. And so just toe elaborate a bit on my answer to your question. So, yes, there are fundraisers of color in the field, but as the cause effective study shows, you know, Yeah, um, mentor ship professional development, because, you know, they were still underrepresented. There’s more work to be done to get those. You know, um, professionals of color, all of the support that they need to survive and to thrive and at the same time work to be done to develop that pipeline so that we continue that into the future with great consciousness and then being intentional about it.

[00:35:49.54] spk_1:
I know that I personally have been paying more attention to this just within the past two years or so. Um, so but I don’t know if that s Oh, I see. So I Seymour conversations about this, but I don’t know if that’s because I’m participating Mawr and I’m or I’m thinking about it more. I woke. I woke, um, or if the conversations really are happening more frequently and there is greater awareness than there was three years ago, do you? What’s your sense? Do you do you think, Do you think there’s, uh, not not saying sufficient awareness or or action? But you feel like there’s more activity around diversity equity and inclusion now than there was just like three years ago?

[00:35:53.54] spk_0:
I do, yes, and strategically. So you know, I’m a strategic thinker.

[00:35:58.75] spk_1:
Meaning what?

[00:37:11.23] spk_0:
Uh, there’s been a lot that’s been going on for the past few years, but now people are really buckling down their understanding those exact, um, facts and figures and metrics, um, that they want to capture. And then we’re talking to each other more about how to move that forward. There was a great event, um, a week or so ago, on June 18th, it was held at the deep, and we there’s a committee, a host committee. I was on it. Um, one of the lead researchers for the study was on it, um, the a f p person who’s involved with their idea programming. Um, people from case. It was a pretty good host committee of us. And I’m sorry if I’m forgetting anyone and and then, um, on a barber barber as well whose? Ah, noted phenomenal fundraiser. We all got together to get the fundraisers of color together in New York City. And, you know, it was interesting because honest said to me, we’ve been doing this in D. C forever. Can’t believe, you know, like it’s interesting that New York hadn’t done it yet. And so we did. We got it done. We got together, um, divided. We fall united, we stand, and so we’re aware of each other more aware of each other. Now, instead of being siloed and in a vacuum of ourselves, um, for whatever reason, we can come together and work together and push everything forward, move the needle.

[00:37:38.33] spk_1:
Well, that moves that leads to empowerment. Exactly. Were working together. Okay, Um, so now you’re your personal experience as a as a fundraiser. You feel like that’s ah, anomalous for an African American woman? Um,

[00:38:54.82] spk_0:
somewhat I you know, I’ll give the greatest shout out of all to a woman named Lori Krugman from would be remiss if I didn’t mention her name, uh, jokingly call her my would mom. Sometimes she really brought me into the organization and and introduced me to so many different things and people that have to do with fundraising. But it takes a village, no matter what the color that transcends color lines. It takes a village of people sometimes to pull you up to support you, to help you get that professional development and to help you move forward and to encourage you. Um, it’s something that’s on my mind for young women of color. Of course, in the field. It’s something that personally is important to me because I think it does make a difference when you see someone who looks like you, just like, um, not only within the field, but even within your organizations. You know, Um, that kind of had gone over my head at first, and then I had a board member mentioned that to me where I I used to work and they said, You know, a lot of these kids are seeing you, and it makes a difference because they think that the executive offices, or, like the big bosses in the office, is up there in the executive director and all of that. And the fundraisers and philanthropy, That’s a whole other issue within it, you know? Do they really understand that this is a viable profession for them? You know, first, the profession had to get the respect it deserved on and then because, you know, we work hard and we’re educating this, and a lot of us have degrees that are focused upon this. We’ve studied the science of fundraising, and it should be fully respected. They

[00:39:11.86] spk_1:
used to be thinking that these event planners

[00:39:14.05] spk_0:
and right there, just out there

[00:39:17.53] spk_1:
holding your hand out and it just comes

[00:39:19.52] spk_0:
It’s like, No, no, no, no. We work very hard. Um, and so you have to have that first. And now we have to diversify. And we have toe really consider all of the different issues within the field.

[00:39:32.02] spk_1:
Um, the woman who you said you’d be remiss, uh, gave you guidance, Coach? Mentor? Um, she is at a white woman. It is Okay.

[00:39:44.32] spk_0:
Happens to be yes, but I had, um, some really wonderful African American women, obviously, who have been integral to my life. I had, you know, a good balance, but um,

[00:39:56.87] spk_1:
but it’s sharing the power, sharing the power. It’s important to have role models and mentors off of whatever ethnicity. Nationality?

[00:40:21.71] spk_0:
Yeah, we all have to work together. Because if you’re there and if things air imbalanced in the first place, then if white males air really? You know, at the the pinnacle of power, then you know. And what role do white females have Are females of whatever color, but you have to reach back, and you have to help people.

[00:40:34.41] spk_1:
Yeah, that’s why I say share the power. Uh, okay. Um, so you’ve had a, uh you’ve been fortunate and your and your obviously grateful,

[00:40:38.51] spk_0:
and I want to do everything I can for all of the

[00:40:45.92] spk_1:
president of wind. Now, you can lift up others, uh, and they’ll see a black woman in power at wind.

[00:40:50.01] spk_0:
Yeah. I mean, I think that makes yeah, it makes a difference.

[00:41:05.21] spk_1:
Um, let’s talk a little about the this cause effective study. Okay. This is, uh, money, power and race. The lived experience of fundraisers of color. Um, are you familiar with what they did? I mean, speak to what they did. What the process was. Just interviews, etcetera. can you

[00:41:21.01] spk_0:
speak to? They did. Ah, lot of in depth work. Um, Judy and Cynthia, if you’re listening, this is the shout out to you. That’s the executive director of cause Effective. And then Cynthia Rhetoric who did a lot of work on that, and she actually engaged me. I was interviewed for this. They worked very hard at getting a diverse array of professionals of color to answer and to participate in the survey. Um, I was, ah, reader at the end as well. Um, another wonderful person. So Neil Omen. Um, I know he was a swell with a f p. And, uh, I’m very happy for them. I’m very proud of them. Of the work that they’ve done. This is a very important study, and I think it’s gonna be helpful. Helpful tool if we don’t set it away, you know, you have to keep these things out and keep

[00:42:23.50] spk_1:
remembering like the strategic plan that goes on the show. Yeah, cause effective, terrific organization. We’ve had guests on, um, Greg Cohen comes to mind he’s been on a couple of times. And then someone who, Uh oh. Now I feel bad. Someone who retired out of cause effective. She’s Greg Cohen’s neighbor in Brooklyn. Because I was out there. I was at their summer party last year, and they shared. There was a back shared backyard thing. Um, it’s not. It wasn’t Judy, though. I feel terrible now, Uh, she’s retired, so she probably doesn’t listen. Well, nobody listens to this show. E

[00:42:33.41] spk_0:
shouldn’t. Yeah, well, you

[00:45:48.49] spk_1:
just told me we’ll take it to make it. Fake it to make it that way. Um, okay, let’s take our let’s take our very last break, okay? And then we’ll talk more about the more about the survey study. Time for our last break. Did you like that? Take to throw back quote. There’s nothing as simple as dot drives. Our execution team meets once per week to sit down and go through our dot drives pipelines. It’s fun to watch them have a healthy dialogue and to see them get excited about their numbers rising towards their goals. Fun indeed. Watching numbers rise two goals dot drives has allowed us to take those relationships and bring them to a deeper level end quote. But there was little commentary in there. I’m sure you, uh you sussed that that was Wendy Adams, director of donor engagement at Patrick Henry. Family Service is prospect to donor. Simplified. Get the free demo for listeners. There’s also a free month, all on the listener landing page at. We’ve got but loads more time for this throwback with Yolanda F. Johnson from June 28th 2019 from Opera Singer to fundraiser. All right, now we gotta do the live listener Love. Uh, Steve Cook give you a shoutout on Facebook. Steve Cook joined us on Facebook and let’s let’s start abroad. There’s just so many I’m not even gonna use the languages. Like comes a et cetera. We’re just gonna go through where everybody is. Seoul, South Korea, Denmark. Jakarta, Indonesia. Tashkent, Uzbekistan. Who you’ve been with us before? It was Becca. Stand not the first time. Not not every week. Try to make it a little more regular. There I was. Becca stand. Would you please try? Toe should be with us every single week, but no live. Listen, love Thio. Hochi Minh City in Vietnam. Um, Porto Alegre, Brazil. Whoa! Tehran, Iran. Tehran has been with us before. Yes, not the first time. Glad to have you back. Live love to Tehran on Thio Toronto, Canada And now we made it to North America. So let’s spring in New York, New York. Three people. We’ve got multiple listeners. Looks like three while ago. Uh, right here in the city of New York. Uh, Gillette, New Jersey. We’ve got Brooklyn, New York, in, uh, we’ve got Clifton New Jersey. Wallkill New York. Woodhaven, New York. Bellmore, New York. All right, Staten Island. Staten Island is in Yes. Welcome Staten Island. Live love to Staten Island. So who’s not with us? Bronx and Queens Chicken. Maybe there. Maybe they’re masked. You know what? They could be masked. I’m sure that I’m sure Bronx and Queens are with us. So live listener, love, live love to you. Thank you so much for being with us. And for those of us on those of us those of you with us on Facebook live love to you as well on the podcast. Pleasantries to the to the over 13,000 that I keep saying it’s nowhere near that, but, uh, no, we have 13 over 13,000 podcast listeners. Um, listening in the time shift. Wherever you squeeze us in. I don’t know. Weekends. You binge. Listen, you spend Sunday listening to hours of podcasts on end. Thank you. Pleasantries to you. I’m glad that we’re in your podcast Library. Pleasantries to the podcast, listeners.

[00:45:58.05] spk_0:
Pleasant. That’s one of my It’s almost like a therapy. Oh, it’s almost like the lips, the teeth, the tip of the tongue, the pleasant pleasantries to the podcast Listeners

[00:46:09.22] spk_1:
Podcast pleasantries. I’m a big fan of a big fan of, uh, what did you What was the little phrase you just said? The lips, the teeth, the tip of the tongue, lips, the teeth, The tip of the tongue? Yes. Is that little exercise? Yes, it is. Right before you go on stage,

[00:46:19.26] spk_0:
isn’t just toe enunciate. Like I said, native speakers of English. Sometimes when you’re, uh, enunciating on stage, it could be difficult to decipher what they’re saying. And so a lot of deep bonds going on and what we think is over doing it. But that’s what it takes for the audience to actually hear what we’re saying.

[00:46:38.78] spk_1:
It does the lips, the teeth, the tip of the tongue. Okay, what do you do right before you go on performance, right. The minute before your first appearance on stage. What are you doing as a thing as a singer, I mean, as a Well, I guess there’s any kind of performer. What are you doing in that last minute?

[00:47:01.58] spk_0:
Um, I’m saying a little prayer, okay? And I’m getting excited because I’m ready to share this with the audience.

[00:47:07.99] spk_1:
Your blood pressure’s

[00:47:10.21] spk_0:
sometimes, but not really. I’m pretty. Chill. I’m ready. Thio, go do it. If I’m prepared that I said I will never be that person backstage like, Oh, my gosh. I know I didn’t read any of this stuff, but I sure hope it goes okay, That’s terrible. Um, and so I just It is what it is at that moment, right? And so I just get excited and go out and share it. All right, Well, thank you for sharing a little prayer to Yes, definitely

[00:48:06.27] spk_1:
prayer. Alright. Um okay, So the cause effective study was it was interviews. There were surveys, lots of personal interviews. Yeah, people of color. Remember to stay close to them. There we go. Okay. Well, I wanna hear everything that you say. Um, so they learned some things. Um Why d I is important. This is interesting. Now you’ve mentioned earlier with you said we’d has a diversity and inclusion. You don’t include Uh um equity equity. Uh, it’s an I d I It doesn’t matter. I mean, were you short changing people because you didn’t include the ease?

[00:48:13.95] spk_0:
No equities? Not at all. Um, I guess it could have been a debt if, but it’s a d t i f. Um, the equity is inferred in that. It’s just that it’s not called the d. I think, and people have different thoughts and opinions on what each word means. You know, some people don’t like diversity as much anymore, and they’d rather focus on equity. E

[00:48:32.73] spk_1:
i e I All right. It’s like L g b t q plus. I mean, now we put the plus until it’s all inclusive. Just a part of it. If you’re not LGBT or Q, you’ll have to just be in the plus because okay, what did you say before? D T d t I f

[00:48:47.44] spk_0:
d I T diversity and inclusion task force.

[00:49:27.67] spk_1:
Okay, okay. We have jargon jail on. I hate to see imprisoned even for a short even for a short term. Um, so we know, I think we know why it matters. Um, you know, interesting. Making explicit that money is power. And for fundraisers of color, you know, they’re they’re seeking money from the people who have it, which are largely white and male. So that’s a that creates a dynamic for fundraisers of color that, um, white fundraisers don’t have toe sort of deal with overcome your depending on the opinions of the people they’re trying to get the money from.

[00:50:22.36] spk_0:
Well, and I wanna add to that whole diversity discussion. Donors of color, you know, they’re out there donors of color and tapping into them. You know, just like we have toe work on the pipeline. We have to support people who are already in the field, and we have to think outside of the box. And remember everyone who’s been blessed with, um, the ability to be a philanthropist. And what does that even mean? Now, you know when you think that it’s so pie in the sky, but it’s not. It’s right in front of you to be a philanthropist in many ways. You know, the Indiana University Women’s Philanthropy Institute. We had a partnership event with them in May, where they revealed some of the women give study and, you know, adult in tow. You know, how do you define being a philanthropist? So we have philanthropists of color that need to be tapped into as well That air, um, came be called ignored. Sometimes I think

[00:50:30.26] spk_1:
you find that you feel like we’re not reach. The community is not reaching out toe donors of color wealth, wealthy folks of color.

[00:50:33.78] spk_0:
I think it’s a complex issue, but I think I could say yes to that in some ways. Um, but remember that a donor of color, um, we’ll also have probably had certain life experiences as well. So you know,

[00:50:48.76] spk_1:
it’s Yeah, we’ll have

[00:50:50.06] spk_0:
Yes. Okay.

[00:51:09.32] spk_1:
I feel like we’re not We’re not We’re not getting thio. So I’m surprised that that you find that because if we’re if we’re trying to get support for our organization, I mean, it ought toe come from anybody who has the means exactly the means to support us. E mean, money is color blind.

[00:51:10.57] spk_0:
Amen to

[00:52:05.95] spk_1:
that. Okay, that’s an interesting insight. I never I have to think more about that. Pay more attention. I’ve never. I’ve never thought about that. All right, Uh, you’re full of good ideas. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Uh huh. Mhm. Okay, s. So I think we understand why the, uh d matters like we’ve sort of flush that out. So? So some of what they they say something interesting. Fundraising reflects and magnifies the racial hierarchies of our culture. That’s sort of what we’re scratching at. You know, um, it’s a, you know, fundraising is, uh there’s there’s just inherent, irrespective of people’s color. Uh, there’s it’s a It’s a fundamental power subservient relationship. You have money, and I’m asking for it. I mean, I do fundraising. I do plan to giving fundraising People of wealth have money, and I’m pursuing it. Eso there’s

[00:52:09.78] spk_0:
you’re definitely pursuing people that have a certain amount of

[00:52:12.27] spk_1:
Yeah, Well, now, modest people of modest means could do plan. Gift to That’s true. Let’s not forget, okay? Actually, just like anybody could put will request for 1000 or $5000 in there will

[00:52:22.92] spk_0:
probably And that goes to the same point of What does it mean to be a philanthropist? You know, if you’re giving $500 whatever you have to give. You’re still helping a cause. It matters.

[00:52:31.45] spk_1:
A lot of people don’t think of themselves as philanthropists, but they indeed they are. It doesn’t really matter. I mean, they’re supporting organizations. But people who write $20 checks, $50 checks, they don’t they don’t think of themselves as philanthropists.

[00:52:43.42] spk_0:
And I think that’s what I you is trying to get people to think differently, especially with women donors toe value yourself and to understand, um, that contribution that that you’re making to society through whatever

[00:52:54.68] spk_1:
the size well, they understand they’re contributing. What what’s the importance of? You could educate me again. Eso I’m trainable just need the ideas. What? What? What’s the importance then of them recognizing themselves as philanthropists?

[00:53:08.25] spk_0:
Because it empowers you in a different way. When I see myself a certain way, um, it allows me toe think differently. And when I’m making those decisions, uh, it might allow me toe to get involved with an organization on a deeper level on bring in my network. You know, we could talk about give and get so it can be open lots of different doors and just change the way that people think about themselves and about, um, the ways that they give.

[00:53:33.59] spk_1:
So we should be encouraging our donors to think of themselves as philanthropists. Yeah, including the 20 and $50 donors.

[00:53:39.70] spk_0:
You’re a philanthropist, and we appreciate your gift and

[00:53:42.96] spk_1:
that. Well, there’s always that. Yeah. I’m just trying to distinguish the philanthropy. Think of yourself as a philanthropy. Yes.

[00:53:48.55] spk_0:
And then, you know, it’s that strategic thinking. So, you know, it’s that same story of the whoever it is the janitor, somebody who passes away and leaves five million

[00:53:57.54] spk_1:
dollars right there lived a very modest life. They 40 year old car, they were driving or whatever, right? And then they have millions of dollars to leave. You

[00:54:04.70] spk_0:
never know you can you never. You can’t judge a book by its cover. And so you never know what’s going on. You treat everybody with dignity and respect and appreciate their gift. And you never know what network they might bring in or, um, people they can introduce you to.

[00:55:00.94] spk_1:
Yeah, that’s all true. Yeah, it’s just a philanthropist thing. Getting getting your modest donors small dollar donors to think of themselves as philanthropists. Interesting. Okay. Um, all right, So this is the, uh, talking about the magnifying, the racial hierarchies. Um, and we just have a couple minutes left. All right, so let’s leave the survey. That’s enough of that survey. Yeah. So, again, it’s money, power and race. The lived experience of fundraisers of color. It’s published by cause effective, which is, I believe it’s cost effective dot or ge. And now that you have the name of the survey study, you should have no trouble, obviously finding it and check it out. Okay, Um, a couple minutes left as, ah, professional woman in in fund raising your own practice, What would you like? Thio? Would you like to leave our listeners with?

[00:55:48.99] spk_0:
Well, um, I just like to reiterate how honored I am to be leading with in this 40th anniversary year. I’m excited about I’m continuing the work of my practice. We already talked a bit about events, and I also specialize in campaigns and in going in and assessing what’s happening with small and medium sized development departments and helping them to get to the next level. So I look forward to continuing all of that work. Um, and I also look forward to continuing singing have a vocal workshop coming up in a couple of weeks. And then, of course, the console again August 10th at the amphitheater at the Hudson River Museum. And it’s gonna be It’s deep, you know, using music, using art as that medium to spark the dialogue, the conversation, the thought about these current issues and you cannot make. Yeah, you can’t make this up, though. The libretto has not been changed. It’s 70 years old, and it could have been on the news last week.

[00:56:12.03] spk_1:
Really, it’s fast. Okay, when does when’s the opening?

[00:56:14.63] spk_0:
It’s when we talk. It’s a one night only thing. It’s August 10th 8 p.m. August 10

[00:56:18.42] spk_1:
2019. If you’re in the New York City area,

[00:56:21.10] spk_0:
check Yolanda. If johnson dot com

[00:57:34.32] spk_1:
Please Dio. That’s who she is. She is. Hold on to F. Johnson. Her company is Y F. J Eyes. Her company is at Y. F. J hyphen consulting dot com. Women in Development. You’ll find that W I D n Y dot or GE, and she is at Yolanda F. Johnson and thank you so much. My privilege. I’m back. It’s February 2021. Now, next week riel listening. Let’s talk. My guest will be Emily Taylor. If you missed any part of this week’s show from 2019, I beseech you, find it at dot com were sponsored by Turn to Communications, PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot ceo and by dot drives. Prospect to donor Simplified Our creative producers. Claire Meyerhoff shows Social Media is by Susan Chavez Mark Silverman is our Web guy, and this music is by Scott Stein. Thank you for that information, Scotty, do with me next week for big ideas for the other 95% go out and be great.

Nonprofit Radio for January 25, 2021: Peer-To-Peer For 2021

My Guest:

Brandon Smith: Peer-To-Peer For 2021

David Hessekiel returns with a look at this year’s P2P prospects. But not before a survey of the P2P carnage that was 2020. There are distinct opportunities for 2021 and David shares the collective advice of thought leaders and practitioners. He’s the founder of Peer-to-Peer Professional Forum.

 

 

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Every nonprofit struggles with these issues. Big nonprofits hire experts. The other 95% listen to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Trusted experts and leading thinkers join me each week to tackle the tough issues. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.
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[00:01:53.74] spk_1:
Hello and welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio big non profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host of your favorite abdominal podcast. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d suffer the embarrassment of gastroesophageal reflux disease if you made me choke on the idea that you missed this week’s show. Peer to Peer for 2021. David Hess Akil returns with a look at this year’s P two p prospects, but not before a survey of the PDP carnage that was 2020. There are distinct opportunities for 2021 David shares the collective advice of thought leaders and practitioners. He’s the founder of Peer to Peer, Professional Forum and tony Steak, too. We’ve calmed down, were sponsored by turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot ceo and by dot drives prospect to donor simplified tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant demo and a free month. Here is peer to peer for 2021. It’s my pleasure to welcome back after several years. David Hesse Kiel. He is founder and president of Cause Marketing Forum Inc. Helping nonprofits enlist millions of people to raise billions of dollars through the peer to peer professional forum and partner with businesses to do well by doing good through engage for Good. Both organizations hold national conferences to provide access to practical information and inspiration To help nonprofits forge valuable connections. You’ll find them at peer to peer forum dot com and at Engage for good calm. David is at Dave cause welcome back to non profit radio, David.

[00:02:14.75] spk_0:
It’s great to be back, tony.

[00:02:16.77] spk_1:
It’s a genuine pleasure. Good to have you after after probably too many years. I’m sorry for that. But here we are now. So no, no more lamentations

[00:02:24.90] spk_0:
about no time like the present

[00:02:37.34] spk_1:
to talk about peer to peer. Um, first, just acquaint us with you’ve got You’ve got three organizations there. You got the Cause Marketing Forum. You got the peer to peer professional forum and you’ve got engaged for good way. Know what they’re doing generally, but drill down a little bit. Eso listeners understand what

[00:02:43.62] spk_0:
your marketing forum is really just the the holding company for all for these two endeavors a

[00:02:54.60] spk_1:
shell company. That’s where your that’s where you really tax money enough

[00:02:59.56] spk_0:
money to be dealing with the Cayman Islands and all of that. Alright, alright. It isn’t that interesting

[00:03:01.54] spk_1:
about that, Okay?

[00:04:09.54] spk_0:
Actually, originally, I started the company with the conference that was called Cause Marketing Forum, All about how businesses and nonprofits could work together. Over over the years, that area of interest morphed. And so the words cause marketing became a little dated. And so we changed to engage for good, because businesses are now looking more holistically at the whole field of how they can have values and do purpose driven work. Creating a better world while still being faithful to their bottom lines. And so that now involves not only consumer facing programs but programs designed to attract and retain and motivate employees activism on the national and international scale. And a lot more, um, peer to peer professional form. I’m a big name changer. I started that one back in 2000 and seven as the Run Walk Ride Fundraising Council because I think that many of your your listeners will be familiar with the term peer to peer fundraising. But way back in 2000 and six, when I was really pondering this, that didn’t exist. People never use that free we

[00:04:24.73] spk_1:
didn’t say Peter P a peer to peer. So run, walk, run, walk rides.

[00:05:11.44] spk_0:
So I tried to come up with the title that would telegraph what we were talking about. Um, and it took a number of years, but we picked up steam when peered appear became a a common phrase we re branded, and I learned something very interesting along the way. That is a lesson for us all. I learned we had a huge spike in the number of people who came to our conferences, listen to our stuff after we made that change. And I mean, it’s a great It was a great rebranding, but it wasn’t that great. And I was learning that certain people were being so literal that they were saying, Well, if I don’t have a run or walk or a ride, I’m not invited to the party.

[00:05:17.16] spk_1:
E can’t do a dance.

[00:06:18.34] spk_0:
Exactly where is really what we’re talking about? Is this amazing engine off fundraising and community development in which a non profit has its supporters get involved in some activity and then reach out to their networks to get support, as opposed to the traditional form in which most fundraising takes place where the non profit directly makes an ask in many different ways individual giving, legacy, giving all sorts of different campaigns here. They’re using that power of that network to get money from people who who they probably would never have talked to because they weren’t particularly interested. But those relationships create a lot of opportunity. And so a peer to peer professional forum We actually held our last conference the last week of February.

[00:06:22.04] spk_1:
Got it right in. We

[00:06:23.37] spk_0:
were so lucky. In fact, although the pandemic was mentioned in a couple of panels, we had no idea. Of course, tsunami that was approaching us.

[00:06:37.36] spk_1:
You were two weeks lucky or two or three weeks luckier than in 10, and had Thio canceled, canceled their conference and scrambling. Do what? Do what they could thio put online.

[00:07:00.84] spk_0:
I’d like to say that I was smart. I was just in that case, that was very, very 40. Yeah, way had 650 plus people that with largest conference we’ve ever had, and I speak with a lot of these people frequently, And if I had a dollar for every time somebody said to me, Oh, my gosh. The last business trip I took was to be with you in Austin. Yeah, I could retire. Yeah, well,

[00:07:14.76] spk_1:
you have to have 650 bucks. You live meagerly in Rye, New York. If you could retire on $650 a dollar from each one, I’ll give you $10 for each one. You still wouldn’t be able to retire. Six. Its’s a metaphor. It’s an aphorism. Yes, I understand. But you know, I take aphorisms literally. Unless I’m the one using them. And then Then what? You’re being silly. Where you taking me literally for? There’s no winning. There’s no way, because I do. Whatever the hell, it’s nice to post, and

[00:07:42.56] spk_0:
it’s nice to be king. So you’re the host. What do you

[00:07:55.74] spk_1:
say? I’m the host. I’m the king. Yeah, that’s good. I should use King King non profit radio. All right, so, so much a peer to peer is online that there was virtually no impact on the on peer to peer fundraising throughout. 2020 right? It was already online. I’m

[00:10:08.04] spk_0:
sorry you’ve low star game because that’s absolutely not true. Oh, my gosh. It was so a zay said once in a part of time, we were called the Run Walk Ride Fundraising Council, and in one sense, you are right, which is that off all forms of fundraising. The group, the area that perhaps has the deepest penetration of fundraising being conducted online, maybe peer to peer because people who are involved in these types of programs will reach out and use email and social media to collect all of those often smaller contributions. So there is a great penetration, but most of the activity has an analog sort of physical component in the real world, although the balance is changing. Walks, for example, mass gatherings of people, thousands of them every year. We started off in February going okay, It’s getting to be spring walk season. Let’s get going. We’re good luck this season and within a month, basically, this spring, the spring season was completely canceled and everybody was scrambling to create some sort of virtual experience so that they would be able to continue to do that fundraising and then within another couple of months, because we all thought we all hope that we all thought in the early days Well, all right, this is a pandemic. But how long could it last? So we were optimistic that fall programs would happen because these types of programs are very weighted towards the spring and the fall. In a lot of the country, it’s too hot or people are away on vacation, so they don’t do as much of this summer anyway, This the fall went away, and so there was a mad scramble to come up with alternatives to what they had traditionally done

[00:10:15.99] spk_1:
right. And you’ve got some recognition for folks that did that particularly. Well, just just give us some perspective about what? What, what these these cancelations in spring and fall meant to the community nation.

[00:12:14.64] spk_0:
So you know it’s been interesting were one of our best known pieces of research is the called the Top 30 Report. We do a study in which we look at it. The 30 largest programs we do, one actually in the US and we do another one in Canada, and over the first few years that I was involved with this field, we were doing very nicely. The collapse financial collapse happened in 2000 and 8, 2009, and we’ve actually had negative numbers for nearly every year since then. But when you group them all together, it’s usually a couple of percent. Maybe. And I was hoping that this coming year would be the year that we would actually finally have black ink and produce a report that said it was going to that it was positive on General. Well, nothing could be further than the truth, because nonprofits, uh, through no fault of their own, like all of us, in different aspects of our lives, you know, you promised People X they were used to doing X, and now all of a sudden X for 95% of the situations was impossible to do, and so they would create virtual. And anyway, we found out that I’m using a general term that is about a 50% drop off in the amount of money that they raised from these programs. It really like any average. It’s an average. So you had some that were in the 70 80% of recapturing what they had expected to raise, or at least how much they raised the previous year. You have some in the forties, you have some that were canceled and you have a very few very, very, very few situations where they’re actually were physical programs. I actually I mean, there are more than non, but I know of one in particular. Uh, and it was it. It’s been a devastating year.

[00:12:41.64] spk_1:
So you’ve got these three organizations that, um I don’t wanna really talk about them specifically, but name them that that you identified as having done particularly well in adapting. And then, you know, what can we learn from these in aggregate?

[00:13:51.74] spk_0:
Eso It’s It’s again like everybody else. We’ve also had to make major changes the way that we share information. We upped tremendously the frequency off distance learning that we were providing through our organization because everybody was hungry for information and was locked in and they couldn’t go out. Um, and we have had a tradition over in recent years, off every year late, naming one organization as the peer to peer fundraising organization of the year and sort of looking at the totality of what they do. Sometimes it’s for one program. Sometimes it’s for ah group of programs, and as we looked at last year, we decided that it would be more instructive to look at a few examples of programs. He was a program within a program or otherwise that did well and use them as learn herbal moment. So we picked out three, and each of them illustrates a different point.

[00:14:35.24] spk_1:
It’s time for a break. Turn to communications. The Wall Street Journal, The New York Times Do you wanna be in papers like that? How about CBS Market Watch? The Chronicle of Philanthropy? Turn two has the relationships with outlets like these, so that when they’re looking for experts on charitable giving, non profit trends or philanthropy, they call turn to turn two calls you turn hyphen two dot ceo now back to peer to peer for 2021

[00:16:46.64] spk_0:
In the case of there’s the L S Association off its Greater Chicago chapter, and even though they had a spring event as part of the large Ailes walk Siri’s, each chapter was sort of left to fend somewhat for themselves, and they made a fast move, which was one of the things that helped some groups and being having having difficulty making a decision and telling people what was coming up. The pike was a big problem for a lot of groups. Um, they said, Okay, there is not going to be a large Chicago walk. What? We know that a whole bunch of you have signed up. About 150 groups have signed up as teams in this case, largely family teams, people who have somebody afflicted with that terrible disease of ales. We want you to create neighborhood walks, and we are sending every one of you a walk in a box kit. Oh, it’s amazing that, you know, it’s ah, big box full of of instructions and door hangers to put around their neighborhood, explaining that they were gonna be walking and asking people to give and all sorts of fun, uplifting type of stuff shirts, etcetera. And they were able to got about 125 groups to actually walk. They had even some more grandiose plans which were defeated by the by the pandemic and by some of the unrest that was happening at the exact time that they were supposed to have their their program. They were going to send, uh, emissaries out to the neighborhood, walks and provide them with with cupcakes and have super It’s a superhero themed walk Superheroes gonna visit there weren’t allowed to send people out. But by giving people something, really, by generating excitement, you look with all the stuff we’ve got. They were able to I think they raised about 75% of what their previous total had been. So a less was so taken with their approach and some of the many smart things that they did that they encouraged and taught many of their other chapters to adopt some of their techniques and it stood them in good stead. And they’re and they’re planning to continue that for next

[00:17:12.06] spk_1:
year. So innovation Is that what you were captured you about the

[00:17:39.54] spk_0:
yes, there was association that all all of these in some way, shape or form of innovation. In this case, the easiest shorthand to say is if you can’t bring the people you know Mohammed to the mountain, bring the mountain to Mohammed where we are, they created some of the excitement. People do walks, not because walks air so exciting. I mean, it’s not like you’re going to the, you know, if you if you’ve decided, you’re going to do it, you’re a runner and your you’ve set yourself a personal goal and you’re doing a marathon. There’s a whole big exciting thing, but walks are neat, but people want to be able to congregate. Of course, be a part of a team. Well, that wasn’t possible is here. So they helped create some of that spirit by sending it out. So that was their innovation.

[00:18:04.93] spk_1:
Bunch of a bunch of smaller communities. Instead of one big community of tens of thousands of people coming together, there were 100 25 communities that came together throughout throughout Greater Chicago.

[00:19:21.04] spk_0:
You’re absolutely right. Will be Dana Farber, and Dana Farber does a number of amazing programs. One of their programs is the Jimmy Fund. Dana Farber has this amazing New England charity called The Jimmy Fund. There is called the Jimmy Fund Walk. David Dana Farber is a cancer research center, and what is best known about that walk it’s they’re based in Boston is that follows the route of the Boston Marathon. So for years, that was sort of what they lead with the excitement that you were actually going to be able to do the route off the marathon and all of a sudden, impossible can do that. And I think that they’re example. They were also able to have a strong performance. But it taught them a lesson about the importance of changing your messaging to never lose sight of the mission and the stories of the people and the impact that the people who are walking have. And by shifting that model of messaging to their supporters, it stood them in very good stead. And then the third group that we

[00:19:28.00] spk_1:
wait before you move on. So what did they do in place of the walk? Uh,

[00:20:11.04] spk_0:
of it A. And an encouragement to go out and walk on your own. Okay. They also created online ways to get involved and to be a part of, ah, a group program. But this was just a really good lesson in how strategically changing your marketing message makes a huge difference. And sometimes we way. It’s easy to get caught up in sort of the sizzle. And this was going back to the steak, which is the reason why you’re doing this. Yes, it’s very cool to be on the marathon route when you’re doing this to help save kids and others. We’ve got cancer

[00:20:17.08] spk_1:
back to the why? Why?

[00:22:26.34] spk_0:
Why? You sound like Simon cynic. And then the third group that we’re going Thio. Yeah, well, I’m a big admirer to the third one is, uh, the Terry Fox Foundation, which I don’t I imagine that many of your most of your listeners Air American in Canada. The Terry Fox Foundation is very well known. Terry Fox was a young man. I think this was back in the eighties, perhaps where who had cancer and he lost one of his legs. It was amputated and he decided to fight cancer to raise money by running across Canada. Very, very dramatic. Um, and he passed away, and they created this Terry Fox Foundation, which holds numerous walks and runs all across Canada. Once again, they went from a group that does almost 1000 events. Ah, year to one that couldn’t hold any in person. And there’s is an example. We’re really honoring them for having the guts to complete what they had it planned. Terry Fox. An amazing organization. One of the largest peer to peer fundraisers in Canada, but also a very traditional organization. And frankly, and they have said to us not as digitized and in their approach to doing business as most other leading nonprofits were. And they had made a decision in the previous year to make a major pushing how they acted and in reaching out to their supporters via digital means and raising money digitally of doing all of that in a very new and much more modern way. And many organizations with all of the change that was coming down the pike as the pandemic swept through the industry, would have said, Oh my gosh, this is not the year to do a major all overhaul of all of our systems. And instead the Terry Fox folks said, You know what? Let’s stick to the course. Let’s do this They did. It was very successful and all the more helpful to have that digital communication and fundraising in a time when you can’t get together and they recruit about forgetting the exact number. But this sort of like seven of the $8 million that they would have raised, they raised a large percentage of the money that they would have raised

[00:23:04.84] spk_1:
a profile encourage for doing something audacious, right at a time when a lot of organizations might not have, but they saw the need. Yeah, great. And they seized it. Absolutely. So let’s zoom. Let’s look forward then. So, though Well, those three organizations gonna be honored right at the march. You gotta You gotta March conference coming up. The people could find find out about the conference where

[00:23:28.24] spk_0:
they will go to peer to peer forum dot com. And they will find out about this event that we’re holding Thea er Noon, Eastern time, March 1st, 2nd and 3rd with a great love or information on overview off the field as well as very this very specifics off. If you do walks or if you are a hospital or if you do cycling events, there are special breakout sessions for all of those and more.

[00:26:07.97] spk_1:
It’s time for tony steak, too. We’ve calmed down Well, maybe I should say I’ve calmed down to events, seemed to have turned down the national temperature or at least turn down my temperature. Maybe I’m extrapolating from myself for everybody. Maybe that’s unfair. Although I am the center of the universe, we know that non profit radio is here with me non profit radio and I are the center of the universe. So maybe I’m not being unfair, but so maybe it’s more what I’m feeling. These two, these two things these two events seem to have have calmed me, and maybe they have calmed the nation. Donald Trump silenced on Twitter and the inauguration. I’m getting fewer news alerts. I’m not looking at my phone as much. I don’t feel sort of, like, agitated on and compelled to investigate headlines like I did before those two events. Um, so again, like I’ve said three times already, uh, maybe it’s just me. So maybe this is a little therapy session. No, I don’t I don’t mean non profit radio would be therapy. If it is, I’m in a lot of trouble. I’m not getting my money’s worth. I I feel I feel a difference. I feel a difference in the in in Communist and increased Communists and decreased agitation. And maybe that’s the national temperature as well. I’m not sure, but I’m sharing with you what I’m feeling since those two things. And that is Tony’s Take two. Now let us return to peer to peer for 2021 with David Hezekiel. Let’s look forward then David has skill. What do you think 2021 is looking like you had some piece in Forbes that makes some predictions from powerhouse people in peer to peer. Lots of lots of, uh, liberation there. Powerhouses in peer to peer productivity and and and And what? Pastrami, pastrami and prodigious nous. So what do your engagement is one thing e talking about? I

[00:26:12.65] spk_0:
wish, tony that your listeners could see a visual right now because you can see that I’ve got a large crystal wall that I am looking into peering into because this is where I get most of my forecasts and predictions. But believe me,

[00:26:36.60] spk_1:
yeah, well, know that Forbes piece was based on lots of other people like non profit radio. I’m not I’m not the expert here. I’m just a bulletin board that you post things on my forehead. And then I put them out for our listeners Thio to pick up on.

[00:26:48.80] spk_0:
Yes, I didn’t put any of my predictions, but I will tell you that it was fascinating to dio to do this, so I don’t know what when this airs. Uh, but

[00:27:00.08] spk_1:
there the week of January 25th

[00:27:48.14] spk_0:
next week. Monday uh, I literally just stepped away from I work in the home office. I guess we all are sort of working in home offices now. And I just watched the inauguration. Yes, very touching. Ah, nde There was no, uh no messing around. No gilding the lily. There’s tough times ahead. And the, you know, vaccination program seems to be absolutely key to really being able to unleash the economic power off all sorts of activity. And this area is is no different because

[00:28:00.44] spk_1:
all the more actually Z originated has run, walk, ride. So you made very clear there is still an important in real life component to peer to peer fundraising.

[00:30:15.20] spk_0:
So when we get to the some of those prognostications in the past But we did a survey some months ago asking people what were they thinking was going to be the shape of their programs next year. The overwhelming majority were saying, Well, we’re hoping that we will have what what what have become the term has has become hybrid programs. They would like to have physical programs, but especially for the spring. I mean, you know, we’re coming up against the big traditionally many programs started in March in the warmer climes were very big in April and May, and the vaccination roll out is just not happening that fast. Eso uh there is the feeling that there may be the opportunity to not re constitute as okay, we’re gonna have 5000 people gathered together to do a major walk. But we may be able to say, Okay, well, certain of you, this will continue to be a virtual experience. But we also have an element of this where we’re perhaps organized much smaller experience, socially distant experience. Maybe you need to reach a certain level of fundraising and then you can come to a gathering that those combinations are called hybrids. And I think there’s going to be, ah, huge amount of that also because one of the thio, almost a person when I talked to speak people in this field to say the most maddening aspect of what’s going on is it’s so hard to plan because we just don’t know when the all clear will be sounded and we can go back to living is normal. So if you plan for ah hybrid with the realization that if things get better it could be more physical. And if things go to heck, it could be mawr or completely Virtual is the posture that most are taking. There’s some hope. One of the people that we interviewed was Jennifer Lee leads the peer to peer effort at the National and s Society, one of the major peer to peer fundraising America. And she is guardedly guardedly optimistic that in the fall there will be much more of a physical presence in these programs. Um, so that is one

[00:30:36.42] spk_1:
your hybrid and and hybrid, and I just built into that is, be flexible.

[00:32:39.94] spk_0:
Yes, The second thing that comes loud and clear is that virtual if your idea of virtual is just saying, well, we really can’t do anything, so just give that ain’t gonna cut it e mean there were certain that’s really just like asking for donation, which, of course, all of these groups do in spades. But if it’s a peer to peer program, it’s a very difficult thing to get a lot of people enthusiastic if there’s no there there. So a lot of investment needs to be made in making virtual, uh, in some way inspiring enabling groups to come together to have that feeling of community giving them props that bring the thing toe life such as we talked about with the L s associations. Example. Um, yeah. On then, we have a wonderful contributor who will be speaking at this This year’s conference. Nicole Dolan works for the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention. And she said one of the lessons she learned along the way and that they are working on very hard is you need to give people, uh, concrete things that they need to do. Give them assignments, sign up for this email, Come to this meeting, uh, post on social media. You know, be a part of what’s going on because your best supporters will react to that. And it’s much more fulfilling for them to actually get involved. Then if you just sort of give them a blanket. Okay, well, you know, go off and figure it out. That will not work. So are you.

[00:33:57.14] spk_1:
Are you, uh I’m having a deja vu moment right now. I’ve dreamed about you. Are you related? Do you have any? Yeah. Connection to Minnesota? No. Why? Well, I don’t know. Because of what I’m asking because of my deja vu experience. There was something related to Minnesota in in the dream that I had when you and I were talking. Uh, all right. I was hoping you could validate my dream, but all right, there was some There was some connection with Minnesota. And you in our conversation, maybe was just asking. I’ve been on the secretary. Alright. But I am. I am. It’s over now. It’s over now, so I don’t know where we’re headed. I can’t say, um the so I mean, the other advantage Thio keeping that virtual engagement is that you can you can bring in those folks that joined you in 2020 who could not have joined you in a real life event. So you don’t wanna You don’t want to just kind of, I guess, you know, move them to a strict campaign, you know, digital giving platform or or or channel, I should say, when their their initial engagement was around an event. So if you if you keep the hybrid and you stay flexible and you you work on engagement like you’re describing, um you can keep those people involved in a in an event fashion even though there may be hundreds of miles away from you.

[00:37:38.77] spk_0:
Yes, well, I think that the higher level, more sophisticated incarnation of this type of activity has always said that you work at segmenting. You don’t treat everybody as equal where all God’s Children and when you treat them all well. But your top 20% for example, of fundraisers. That’s where you know there’s sort of an 80 20 rule. They will raise the overwhelming majority of your funds, and you should be giving them a lot of attention. There’s a lot of people in the walk world, especially who come who show up where your T shirt to eat a banana, but actually don’t raise any money. And they feel like, Well, it’s a community activity and we wanna be involved were not fundraisers, Um similarly Paul Purty of the American Cancer Society, who is also speaking at our conference. He makes the point that he’s done a huge amount of experimentation and trying different virtual approaches, and one of their lessons is really think about this as an on boarding ramp for finding people who are passionate about your cause, and then you do the segmentation necessary to figure out how to keep them involved, perhaps in a virtual way, or whether they are good candidates for trying your physical event. When you can hold that well. Or maybe there will be a supportive of your charity, you know, completely different way. Maybe they could become great volunteers or maybe substantial individual givers. So this whole on boarding and shepherding, stewarding off, peer to peer and seeing it as an on ramp to building your funnel of of supporters is very important. And virtual will never go back to being sort of the very weak excuse of saying, Oh yes, we have a virtual program. But there was really no there there. It was just a way of saying, Well, if you live far away and you wanna be supportive of other people, you could say you’re a virtual walker. Now there are people, and interesting. We had a weapon or the other day featuring people from Good United who also worked with the American Cancer Society and had a wonderful speaker, Dan Thorpe, from there and what they They are using a whole mixture off using Facebook social media advertising to find people who would be interested in a geo particular geographic area at getting involved in a a squat challenge or a individualized walk or run challenge, et cetera, and using the Facebook milieu to get them involved in to get them fundraising. They had tremendous success with that. What they feel that most of those people will have to be will probably be kept involved by reaching out to them again through that social media connection they made. Two. It’s almost It’s a little strong to say this, but it’s almost like a bait and switch. If you try to say Okay, well, you’re a social media. Uh uh, you like to communicate this way. Now we want to take you off of social media and communicate with you via email and have you go to a physical event with a lot of other people, where you have not demonstrated that you necessarily want to do that

[00:37:51.42] spk_1:
radio meet people where they are. It not where you would like them to be and come meet you. Um, squat challenge makes my thighs tremble because I’ve been doing jump squats. It’s only my thighs. Don’t don’t get to accept, you know, just thighs trembling that stops there. Um uh, doing jump squats as part of my homework out.

[00:38:20.61] spk_0:
I’m impressed because I try to do Burpees Oh, my God.

[00:38:47.12] spk_1:
Things. Oh, and then do split, jump squats Those things are rough toward the end toward the end of a set. Oh, are a bunch of reps. I’m more like It’s more like standing on your toes instead of jumping like stand on your toe and squat squat So squat challenges I got a little this. I got a visceral queen. Visceral reaction when mentioned squat challenges

[00:38:48.28] spk_0:
trying not to use any untoward vocabulary again. I don’t want to scare you, tony.

[00:40:30.01] spk_1:
Well, you wouldn’t know my hyper sensitivities. Uh, if that was gonna be the case, we have to wrap up right now. It is a lot. I got more tony go from or much of issues. Time for our last break. Quote. There’s nothing as simple as dot drives. Our executive team meets once per week to sit down and go through our dot drives pipelines. It’s fun to watch them have a healthy dialogue and to see them get excited about their numbers rising toward their goals, you could feel this person’s excitement. You can feel her excitement at witnessing this dot drives has allowed us to take those key relationships and bring them to a deeper level. End quote. That’s Wendy Adams, director of donor engagement at Patrick Henry. Family Service is dot drives Prospect to donor Simplified. Get the free demo for listeners. There’s also a free month. You go to the listener landing page at we’ve got but loads more time for peer to peer for 2021 you got you got also your your thought Leaders in peer to peer had ideas and about not surprising. I mean, we hear this in a lot of a lot of realms. I certainly, uh um in foundation and even corporate fundraising as well. But collaborations be collaborative. Reach out, reach out across your community. Maybe it’s across the country. Be collaborative.

[00:40:43.41] spk_0:
Well, it s so funny that you mentioned that because I literally had a conversation yesterday with with one of the speakers for Thea upcoming conference. And what she was saying is that you know as much as there is, it’s

[00:40:46.61] spk_1:
not funny. David, this is all planned. There’s nothing funny about it. You got coming in. Think I didn’t. You know, You think I didn’t talk to the people you’ve spoken to in the past two weeks to find out about you? This is this. This doesn’t just come together. I’m a little I’m a little offended. I’m a little I’m disappointed. More than offended. Go ahead.

[00:42:18.70] spk_0:
Looking for the silver linings? One of the things that she had been particularly, uh, happy about Waas. That there was a lot of sharing. I mean, although many of us feel zoomed out of our minds, the fact that groups off people who knew each other but worked at different organizations were getting together We’re asking one another’s questions. Um, they were going to some some programming that we created in which there was a lot of sharing has really helped folks get through this very, very difficult, uh, period. So I think that there is collaboration, and for me, it’s such a delight to see, because when I started this group, there was such trepidation that if you went to a conference and you talked about how you held your event sarees, everybody would be taking notes about some sort of secret sauce that you might have and they do that. And then all of a sudden, all of these people who have been raising money for just throwing cancer were suddenly begun to become heart association people because because they did, they did X, y or Z, and

[00:42:21.14] spk_1:
his heart still still cancers ideas. And it’s all zero sum. And if you must be losing

[00:42:38.40] spk_0:
its so much, not zero sum if you’re doing it right, because people do have an affinity, unfortunately, often for your particular cause. And so, uh, this this spirit of collaboration has just been growing and growing and

[00:42:42.67] spk_1:
growing. Can you collaborate with if you’re If you’re in the in this peer to peer world who like who, Who could you be reaching out to?

[00:43:57.40] spk_0:
Well, I think that one thing to do, I think in any field that you’re in is to be looking at other programs, seeing if there’s aspects of what they do that you admire, um, and and being you know, it’s it’s it’s taking that important first step of reaching out to others to find out who they are. One of the things that’s been a wonderful part of what we’ve been able to build is a community. You know, sometimes even figuring out who that person is isn’t easy. When were physically together. Uh, we literally leave a lot of time for networking so people can talk to one another and can share, since we’re so even within our organizations often siloed. But we’re very siloed from other other folks. It’s why, when we produced this upcoming event, we’ve created a lot of opportunities for using breakout functionality to have small group discussions to have actually one on one discussions, because people are hungry for opportunities to talk one on another, and we don’t all need to be inventing the wheel in parallel. There’s a lot of things that we can help each other out with, Uh, that won’t take away from us, but will hopefully make you know. And these people are working towards goals of trying to fight disease, fight hunger. Of course, it is wonderful to see some of this Kumbaya spirit brought to life.

[00:45:15.59] spk_1:
Am I naive if I suggest that when we get back to in real life runs walk, run, run, walk, rides, whatever, whatever form it takes that a bunch of non profits in a community, we’re in a city could get together and host something together so that you know, if if my organization could probably only get 100 or 150 runners and walkers, whatever. But there’s another organization that could get 500 somebody else who could bring 75. And together we could get 2500 or 3000 or 5000 people Thio. And then we could have the synergy of working together with the local police to stop close the streets and they get the park permits, et cetera, and rent the banners that we need and the archways and the sound system. Is that Is that doable?

[00:48:22.57] spk_0:
Yeah, Well, actually, you you you raise a really interesting point and we’re seeing some of that activity already start in different ways. So, for example, in Maryland, there is the Almond Foundation, which is a cancer foundation actually started by the family of Doug Ulman, who is the used to be the head of Live Strong is now head of paella Tonia, which is a tremendous cycling fundraiser that happens in Columbus, Ohio, back in Maryland, the when the pandemic struck the Almond Foundation, which has had a long history of raising money in a number of interesting ways through peer to peer fundraising, decided to create an event, sort of the all of the institutional work that is necessary to create the online presence and the digital fundraising systems, etcetera. And then, uh, opened this to numerous Maryland based charities, and they could have their people plug into this program. And, uh, I don’t don’t totally quote me, but I’m remembering, right there was virtually no cost to the charities to participate, other than to defray the costs that Almond was taking on to create this platform for everybody. They gave a certain percentage back toe, and Ullman wasn’t competing with them to get supporters. So that’s one example. Another example and donor drive was very involved in setting that all up donor drive being a platform company that non profit use to raise funds. Another example. Event 3 60 is a, uh, a production company, primarily very involved with peer to peer fundraising, and they have created something they call the five by five K for good. They piloted this this fall in Denver, and what they did was there a lot of people who are avid runners who want to get out avid supporters of charity. And they created event where you could run over the 24 hour period. Five different five K’s So in Toto, if you did it, yeah, you could run a basically a marathon and they had a number of different charities. It was open to any charity, and again there was. It was sort of free to enter, and then there was a certain percentage that helped defray the cost. So that went on in in Denver this fall. Um, so there There are a number of those, uh, those efforts already underway, and it’s going to be interesting to see, you know, it’s collaboration is great. It usually takes some entity to take a bold first step and sort of create something that others can get involved

[00:48:33.05] spk_1:
with. That’s it. That’s the non profit. You just profiled the non profit radio listeners there, the bold ones you gotta be somebody’s gotta put a stake in the ground and say, Let’s Tze rally around this.

[00:48:44.45] spk_0:
Yeah, and it’s a wonderful way of sharing costs and sharing opportunities that any one might not be able to do by itself,

[00:48:53.81] spk_1:
right? Are you familiar with generosity? Siri’s? Yes. That

[00:48:56.95] spk_0:
was the other one. They actually I

[00:49:09.27] spk_1:
I used Thio. I used Thio. What’s it called? I didn’t I wasn’t their host. I was there. Uh, there M c. I was used to emcee the event. I probably am said I have a dozen in the New York Manhattan.

[00:49:13.60] spk_0:
Other people? Yes, I know them. And I I have not been in touch with them recently. I have a feeling that the pandemic sort of,

[00:49:29.95] spk_1:
uh I wonder because they were strictly e. I mean, they had a fundraising platform, but they were strictly real life events in exactly, also in Philadelphia. And they were trying to go beyond the Northeast. They’re just being just New York and Philadelphia. And

[00:49:34.97] spk_0:
they were attracting numerous numerous charities, uh, to be ableto

[00:49:39.81] spk_1:
Yeah, we have a dozen or so. Yeah, I introduced Steve Buscemi at one because he was really He’s from Brooklyn. So he was a visitor at one. We had somebody. The Brooklyn City Council? Uh, no. The Brooklyn, Brooklyn President, Borough President, President, President, book. That was a different event. Yeah, I did a couple of Manhattan a couple of Brooklyn, so I hope they’re still bound listeners. You could check out generosity Siri’s, because they were. They were looking to go nationwide on there. Pretty ambitious guys. David David, David Lind,

[00:50:11.47] spk_0:
L I N N.

[00:50:13.11] spk_1:
Lynn, David Lynn, right, David and Saul, David and Saul. So I was more in the background. David Lane, right? I hope they’re still doing well. But you could check out generosity. Siri’s Certainly if you’re in the New York or Philly area, because the I know they’ve done events there and I imagine they’re they’re smart and they’ll be coming back in 2021 2022. So

[00:50:31.53] spk_0:
I’m going to reach out to them

[00:50:47.36] spk_1:
generosity. Yeah, I will, too. All right, right. So there’s cause for optimism. Even though we don’t, you know, we got to stay flexible. We don’t know when that, uh, you know, when we’ll be ableto amass thousands of people together. But there are lots of opportunities to go beyond that. As as you describe

[00:51:54.86] spk_0:
20 was a very painful learning year on, you know, again looking for silver linings. Uh, lots of groups learned about things that they could do in less staff, because unfortunately, many groups had to lay off staff, um, quicker than they’ve ever been used to and stretching and using technology in ways that they talked about for a long time. But now that it was a necessity, Ah, lot of them have made some of those investments in technology that will stand them in good stead in the year to come. So I don’t think that this is gonna be a banner year, but I think that the learnings from 2020 will stand us in in better stead to do better in 2021 then hopefully come roaring back in 2022 Because I’ve been trying to figure out tony, you you gotta help me with this. There’s got to be smarter, much smarter guys than I who are figuring out right now and gals, okay, The economy is gonna come back. We’re gonna be able to travel again, et cetera. What are the depressed stocks? And I should be buying right now to make a killing the floodgates open.

[00:52:09.05] spk_1:
You’re asking the wrong guy. First of all, I don’t like guess to put me on the spot. That’s the first thing I’ll get past that. I’m willing to overlook it this time,

[00:52:16.72] spk_0:
but I’ll never do

[00:52:17.71] spk_1:
it. That’s why that’s why it’s been so many years since you’ve been back. I believe I remember distinctly. You did that six years ago. I remember the day I’m pretty sure was November 4th.

[00:52:26.26] spk_0:
It was probably your dream, but Okay,

[00:52:42.95] spk_1:
that was Minnesota. Now, that was strictly that was strictly a Minnesota thing. Yeah, but the other reason you’re aside from that, you know, if you look at my portfolio, you’d see you know, my my mantra is always buy high, sell low. So you don’t want stock advice from May?

[00:52:44.68] spk_0:
Well, I guess the two of us will be working stiffs for quite over because I’ve got a similar profile. But I do think

[00:52:54.03] spk_1:
I need some illicit income. That’s what I need. I need some of that came and came in high double money because I got I got too much of the income and not enough of the capital game.

[00:53:34.55] spk_0:
I think that when you know, as I said before, sort of like the all clearest sounded. There is going to be such a penned up demand to get together with other, has celebrate and to do the good work that people are so dedicated to that they have such an emotional connection with, uh that, you know, hopefully, maybe at the end of 2021 but certainly 2022 should be should should really benefit from that. And so this year, we’re going to be revealing at at our conferences we do every year. What the

[00:53:37.77] spk_1:
enough with Schilling of the conference. Now I’ll let you get away with it for, like, three times I said it. What was that? March?

[00:54:13.14] spk_0:
But we’re going thio and let Ugo available on our site. You don’t have to pay Teoh get it? What is the results of the 2020 study that we dio in terms of the top 30 programs? And that will be a very somber moment because it’s gonna be terrible. The numbers are awful, however, as any good sales person who’s ever had a sales commission plan knows. What you want to do is you want to join up when they’ve had a terrible year, because the next year that you’re working off of a much smaller base, and so any gains that you have are accelerated. So I’m hoping you

[00:54:19.41] spk_1:
go So apply that lesson to your stock market question. And now you’ve got your answer. There you go. I don’t know what to me. I don’t know what the answer is, but, you know, you get back to you, you have to take the next step on your own,

[00:54:30.48] spk_0:
will get together with David Lynn will find him, and he’ll tell us what you think

[00:54:34.80] spk_1:
of it On the microcosmic level. I mean, aren’t you dying? Thio have a dinner with friends

[00:54:39.01] spk_0:
again. Just answered a survey was sort of a fun survey talking about great, you know, kind of kooky things. And but what were the questions was what are you most looking forward to when this is over? And I said going out to dinner with friends?

[00:54:54.29] spk_1:
Yeah, absolutely. Hour and a half. No masks. Close table for four to

[00:55:00.60] spk_0:
food. Could be awful.

[00:55:04.94] spk_1:
Yeah, Yeah, we have to go to one of the remaining few remaining restaurants that that survived this thing. All right, Thank you very much. David. David has Shaquille. He’s got a bunch of shell companies one step ahead of the law trying. Tony, did I mention that

[00:55:18.62] spk_0:
the peer to peer forum is uh, march 1st through third.

[00:55:53.34] spk_1:
I’m not gonna say it now, So if you want, that’s a peer to peer forum dot com. If you want to do it on the business side, you’re more interested in partnering with businesses. Um, there’s engaged for good. They also have a conference engaged for good dot com and David is at Dave, not David. He goes by David. But I guess David David, David Cause must have been taken by some near do well considers himself important in the in the cause giving world. So he’s at Dave cause David has skill. Thank you very much. Real pleasure.

[00:55:56.14] spk_0:
Same here, tony. Anytime. Let’s not let five years go by until the next time.

[00:57:03.63] spk_1:
Well, you slipped up again this time by by putting me on the spot, which I said, I don’t like. So I will talk to you in 2028. Very good. Alright, David, Thank you. Next week, maybe it’s Kivi LaRue Miller. If not, she’ll be on soon. If you missed any part of this week’s show, I beseech you, find it at tony-martignetti dot com were sponsored by turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot c o and by dot drives Prospect to donor simplified tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant for a free demo and the free month Our creative producer is Prayer Meyerhoff shows social Media is by Susan Chavez Mark Silverman is our web guy, and this music is by Scots. Tony, Thank you for that information. Scotty. You with me next week for non profit radio. You better be big non profit ideas for the other 95% Go out and be great.

Nonprofit Radio for December 7, 2020: Your Annual Report As Marketing Channel & Project Management In Fundraising

My Guests:

Josh Kligman & Jeff Rum: Your Annual Report As Marketing Channel
You’re producing an annual report, why not make it less boring and more engaging? Why not make it digital? Josh Kligman and Jeff Rum show you how. They’re from Yearly.

Josh Kligman

Jeff Rum

 

 

 

 

 

Jonah Halper: Project Management In Fundraising
Jonah Halper wants you to apply project management principles as you raise money. He’s from Altruicity.

 

 

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Turn Two Communications: PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is our mission.

 

Dot Drives: Raise more money. Change more lives.

We’re the #1 Podcast for Nonprofits, With 13,000+ Weekly Listeners

Board relations. Fundraising. Volunteer management. Prospect research. Legal compliance. Accounting. Finance. Investments. Donor relations. Public relations. Marketing. Technology. Social media.

Every nonprofit struggles with these issues. Big nonprofits hire experts. The other 95% listen to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Trusted experts and leading thinkers join me each week to tackle the tough issues. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.

Nonprofit Radio for November 9, 2020: How To Work In Uncertainty & Low-Cost Fundraising Software

My Guests:

Gail Bower & Karen Eber Davis: How To Work In Uncertainty
A June study of nonprofits has lessons for now and our future. The election may be settled, but there are unknowns afoot: reaction to the election; the pandemic; a divided federal government; federal stimulus; racial reckoning; climate change. The study’s co-authors shepherd us. They’re Gail Bower at Bower & Co. Consulting LLC and Karen Eber Davis at Karen Eber Davis Consulting.

 

 

 

 

 

Chris Bernard & Amadie Hart: Low-Cost Fundraising Software
Chris Bernard and Amadie Hart, the co-authors of Tech Impact’s new software selection guide, talk us through: What these systems offer; how to compare them; and how to select the best one for your needs. Chris is from Tech Impact and Amadie is at Hart Strategic Marketing.

 

 

 

 

Listen to the podcast

Subscribe to get the podcast
Apple Podcasts | Spotify | Google Podcasts | Stitcher

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I love our sponsors!

Turn Two Communications: PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is our mission.

 

Dot Drives: Raise more money. Change more lives.

We’re the #1 Podcast for Nonprofits, With 13,000+ Weekly Listeners

Board relations. Fundraising. Volunteer management. Prospect research. Legal compliance. Accounting. Finance. Investments. Donor relations. Public relations. Marketing. Technology. Social media.

Every nonprofit struggles with these issues. Big nonprofits hire experts. The other 95% listen to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Trusted experts and leading thinkers join me each week to tackle the tough issues. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.
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[00:03:18.74] spk_0:
Hello and welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio. Big non profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. By the time you hear this, the election will be settled. It damn well better be. I hope you were okay. Going through it. I was immersed in the horse race and probably too much, which means I still am as I’m recording. But by the time you’re listening, it looks like it’ll be over. I hope we’re both OK. Be sure to take care of yourself, please. And others, I will do the same. Let’s each be understanding of what we and those around us have been through. It’s been a crisis, a trauma, and it’s time to start healing. I know there’s a lot of work and a long journey ahead. No doubt if we each take care of ourselves and have compassion for others, we’ll be starting that journey on the right foot. Let’s get started together. Is non profit radio still your favorite abdominal podcast? I just love that word. Why say weekly? When you can say abdominal, force your friends into the dictionary, I’ll start a campaign to replace the word weekly maybe not. No campaigns for a while. Oh, I’m extra glad you’re with me. I get slapped with a diagnosis of politico phobia. If you lobbied me with the idea of missing today’s show How Toe Work in Uncertainty. A June study of nonprofits has lessons for now and our future. The election may be settled, but there are unknowns afoot. The pandemic reaction to the election, a divided federal government, federal stimulus, racial reckoning, climate change. Need I continue. The study’s co authors shepherd us there, Gail Bauer and Karen Ebert Davis and low cost fundraising software guide Chris Bernard and Amidi Heart. The co authors of Tech Impacts New Software Selection Guide. Talk us through what these systems offer, how to compare them and how to select the best one for your needs. So stop asking, what’s the best system? Although I did Antonis take two. My November webinar were sponsored by turn to communications, PR and content For nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot c o and by dot drives Prospect to donor simplified tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant for a free demo and a free month here is had a work in uncertainty. It’s my pleasure to welcome Gail Bauer and Karen Ebert Davis to non profit radio. They are co authors of the study. What’s Really happening with non profit revenue? They’ll. Bauer is founder and president of Bauer and Co. Consulting LLC, a revenue strategy firm that helps nonprofits become self sufficient by developing reliable sources of revenue. Trained as a futurist, she studies where society is headed and what trends may impact her clients. Businesses Gail is author of the book How to Jump Start Your Sponsorship Strategy. In Tough Times, She’s at gale Bauer dot com and at Gale Bauer. Welcome, girl.

[00:03:47.14] spk_2:
Thank you. Hi, tony. Good

[00:03:48.39] spk_0:
to have you back. Thank you. Karen Ybor Davis and her firm, Karen Bieber, Davis Consulting Guide Organizations To discover propulsion tools to grow their profits and performance. She helps clients create dynamic partnerships and make an extraordinary impact. Her book is Let’s raise non profit Million’s Together. She’s at k e d. Consult dot com Karen, welcome to the show.

[00:04:14.26] spk_1:
Thank you, tony. It’s wonderful to be here.

[00:04:16.34] spk_0:
Pleasure. Pleasure. Have you both? Um, whoever wants to start, I don’t know with, uh, introducing the study and and a little about your timing and methodology. Who’s best?

[00:05:11.64] spk_1:
Karen. Go ahead. Sure about March this year we were looking at concerns and issues in the sector. Gail and I have been working together on different projects serving the sector for two years, and we realized that things were happening so rapidly. We didn’t really have a good handle on it, and we couldn’t go to meetings and meet someone and find out what was going on. So we said, Let’s go ask them questions And so we created this survey really curious about what was happening with individual income streams. There was this blatant, um, pictures of information and that things were just shutting down. All income was off and that yet that’s fine. But what was really happening? And from that, we put the survey out asking about individual income streams and what was happening. And the data was not surprising. About 125 people responded, but was fascinating to us, where the comments people made in the questions that were not multiple choices and that’s where we really have been still mining a lot of interesting things when I looked at it again, fresh, there’s new fresh things to see even though this data was collected in June.

[00:05:41.74] spk_0:
Okay? And Gail So I see. Ah, throughput of this is really the uncertainty that people were facing in. Well, you published in June. So I Karen, you said you were surveying what? I guess March, April May. I’m

[00:05:58.25] spk_1:
sorry. We surveyed in June, and then we came out in July.

[00:06:24.14] spk_0:
Okay, I see. So June, still early in the pandemic, Dale. Um, but uncertainty remains. And and now we’ve Now we’ve added the election to the pandemic and economic uncertainty and social justice upheaval. Uh, there’ve been more murders of black folks at the hands of police. So there’s Yeah. Uncertainty.

[00:06:25.31] spk_2:
Yeah, lots of uncertainty. When will there be a vaccine? When can we all get together again, et cetera, And all the other topics and all the, you know, all the details and sub issues of all of those that that still remain in our culture. So, yes, there’s a lot of uncertainty. There’s frankly, always a lot of uncertainty, but right now it’s at a fever pitch and times

[00:06:48.26] spk_0:
times five or six.

[00:08:45.54] spk_2:
Yeah, Exactly. And things were just shifting and changing so rapidly. It is really hard to get a handle on things. So I think one of the big differences between then and now when people completed the study and now is the biggest worry was Oh, my gosh, the pandemic. What does this really mean for us? You know, back in the beginning, you may recall people are thinking and we’ll be out of the office for two weeks and we’ll come right back. Well, now we know it’s gonna be more like a year and a half or so, um, we don’t really know. So now we’ve started to see people sort of settle in and and know that they have to continue operating. They can’t just stop. They have to continue operating, um, in the face of uncertainty. And so we’re starting to see people, you know, really? Take, I I would say one of three pathways count. I’m curious to see what you are seeing. And and tony, I’m sure you have an interesting perspective as well. But I think there are some people that have, uh, strategies from before that still have some merit. They might have had to update them or makes, um, you know, course corrections, but they’re still going strong with what? They’re what they’re doing. Um, some people and I’m talking about, in particular with revenue. Um, some people have had to make wholesale change, for example, organizations that are really dependent on in person revenue, like like concerts and, you know, performances and Gallas and things like that. It’s very difficult to be in in, you know, together and digital works to an extent. And then there are people that are really scrambling to figure out how they’re going to shift their revenue. Ah, lot of times, many of these, maybe your listeners, they run smaller organizations who may not have their footing. Yet they may not have developed repeatable, reliable revenue, which is really one of the hallmarks of being an unsustainable position. And so so this. This is a group that has to be really deliberate and thoughtful about their business model to make sure that they’re being creative. And they’re being thoughtful about the revenue sources that they developed. But they make sure that they understand how their business model functions so they take on the right

[00:09:15.84] spk_0:
forms of revenue. And Karen, I guess these these three sort of cohorts, maybe our sets of of of leaders, uh, emerged from those narrative comments that you were talking about.

[00:10:42.04] spk_1:
Well, we really saw that 0.3 kind of leaders, people who were still in a panic mode like Oh my gosh, and just kind of like whining. And it’s difficult in a survey because you’re taking a survey in any 15 minutes and you might have just had disastrous news. And so a little whining would be natural, appropriate, but the collection of the information and then there was these people who are kind of in this phase. We’re, like, really factual. This is is the tires of my car all flat? What am I going to do to fix it? And then this third group that was moving what we call the solving cells they were already moving into some like, Let’s try this. Let’s try that. So the e think in some ways we’re all we’re all those places, depending on what’s happening, we move through some of that, um, post election. Maybe we thought we were gonna have a plan, and all of a sudden it’s like, Oh, my gosh, how did this happen? Or where we at on Dhe then was like. Okay, now, this is what is what do I do with it? So it’s a begins to be a resilience model. The challenge is, is if you get stuck in any of those places if if you are just, you know, totally in the fax, we can’t operate. We can’t do it. We can’t that that’s a challenge, because you’re not gonna You’re not gonna make it. You’ve got to find some way to try to survive. You may not make it anyway, but trying something that makes logical sense, um is, I think, imperative.

[00:11:07.04] spk_0:
Alright. And that’s ideal for kicking us off with. With the last 25 or 30% of your your study is devoted to what? You know, how do we go forward? What? What’s the value of this info for your organizations? And by the way, let’s shout out where folks can get a copy of the study. Where is that? Karen? Okay, I’ll tell you what. I’m gonna talk to Karen. So, Gail, why don’t you look that up? That’s okay. Yeah, well, we want folks to be able to get this because we waken, uh, take off some of the stuff that I would like most to talk about, but there’s a lot more in the report. So, Karen, um, you the first thing you suggest is taking care of yourself, taking care of your organization. I’ve had other guests say the same thing, but it merits, you know, self care, organizational care. What, your ideas there.

[00:11:43.34] spk_1:
And And I would say part of that self care is recognizing you need more thinking time thinking

[00:11:44.10] spk_0:
is thinking is highly underrated. Yeah, terribly underrated thinking. Thinking is valuable,

[00:12:41.14] spk_1:
amazing and and define the place in time to say I am not gonna put out a fire for the next hour or whatever it takes. And I want to think about what it feels like. Maybe in six months. One of the re reading of some of the data is we were in June. We were so much right now. We were so much in the present. This is happening now and there was no there was no discussion of the election in June. There was no discussion off what the new year would bring, what we’ll be doing in 2021 that was six months away. Not all of us are into the future. But some of us should have been talking about it. So that ability to self care to take some time to think as well as toe recognize no one has been on this path before. No one has the answers. You don’t either. But you know your organization best and prioritize your brilliance about that.

[00:13:17.14] spk_0:
Okay? And organization Care to taking care of those who work with you for you, above you. Below you, you know? E feel like because it z things are so uncertain. Way need to take care of. We do need to take care of each other. You know, we have to go beyond the normal for some nurturing for some listening for some empathy, compassion. I feel I’m doing that. And I feel it in others to, you know, more. More more questions about How are you doing? How are you doing? You know, not just how are you? Like we used to Do you know before March? How you doing? You know, everything’s fine. Yeah, I’m good. Yeah. Yeah, more. I mean, there’s there’s more depth to that and and, you know, and beyond.

[00:13:38.84] spk_1:
Yeah, and in some ways, we have time we’re no longer running. We’re no longer commuting. Most of us are many of us. We are no longer running. Two meetings across town toe have lunch as a networking meeting. That would take three hours our day. And so we’re working more hours. There was an article in the Wall Street Journal this last week mentioning how many more hours people are working and it’s going to work on dhe yet we still have family obligations. So taking care of the people. Your staff, um, is really critical. I’m working with a group of CEOs, and the conversation they wanna have next is how to keep your non profit staff saying in the midst of a pandemic. So how do you help a staff member who has childcare full time at home?

[00:14:32.14] spk_0:
So, yeah, we need to be good to each other and understanding. Empathic compassionate. Yeah. Um, So, Gail, I didn’t mean to be the directive male testosterone burdening. But when I said look this up for you know? So, yeah, you give you homework while I was talking to Karen s. Oh, where can we find this study?

[00:14:36.54] spk_2:
I made a quick, short length. That’s not even that short but tiny u r l dot com forward slash revenue study results

[00:14:44.94] spk_0:
Okay, so it one more time,

[00:14:52.70] spk_2:
I put it in the chat box here to revenue a tiny URL dot com slash revenue study results.

[00:15:31.54] spk_0:
It’s time for a break. Turn to communications. They help you build relationships with journalists because of our relationship started and nurtured by turn to the New York community. Trust got to features in The Wall Street Journal. That’s the value of the pre existing relationships Turn to specializes in working with nonprofits. One of the partners, Peter Pan, a Pento, used to be an editor at The Chronicle of Philanthropy. The return hyphen two dot ceo Now back to how to work in uncertainty You’re you have ideas about revamping strategy.

[00:18:47.54] spk_2:
Yeah, well, so as I was starting to say, with with your business model, a lot of organizations are continuing with revenue forms that they had in this study. We found, um, interestingly, some conflicting information. Whereas some respondents found that individual giving was decreased, uh, or they expected it to decrease over time. Another group found that that was their shining light, that it was the form of revenue that was going to increase eso, you know? So I guess it’s sort of just depends where people are in their life cycles and where they are in their strategies and so on and so forth. But one of the hallmark mindsets that we saw that came from this are, as Karen said, the ones who had moved along the scale of resilience and who were taking a very positive mindset. Who were they believed all out in their mission and in their abilities to get the word out about their mission and all the, you know, all the good work that their organizations were doing and to think really creatively about how to move forward. And so, in thinking about a new organizations business model A Z, I mentioned earlier organizations need to be thinking about what forms of revenue have the most staying power now. And how might they want to expand the revenue? What other you know, are there other sources that could be coming into the fold? But they have to do it again very thoughtfully for, uh, for how the organization works. So a business model is not just revenue that comes in and expenses that go out. That’s a budget. Ah, business model is actually the system about how you know how the business side of your organization actually operates. So, for example, um, corporate sponsorship is a big piece of my expertise, and people call me all the time with questions about sponsorship and getting some help with that. And I’m always listening for the right conditions that are going to help them create success. And I try to guide people when I’m hearing conditions that won’t be successful. So, for example, every business model has some key activities key relationships that are important for success. Sponsorship, for example, requires an active marketing operation, a strategy, a set of operations, an audience to be successful. It requires staff and organizational competence, because if you don’t have anyone that can actually go out and talk to a corporation and you know, initiate relationships to develop them, then you know you’re not gonna have success there. And so it sounds like a pretty obvious peace. But, uh, you know, organizations are under a lot of pressure from the board members. Let’s try this. Let’s try that Somebody that I spoke to recently said Oh, well, you know, our board member thinks we oughta have sponsorship. And when we talked further, three organization doesn’t really have a marketing push. Uh, it’s maybe not even appropriate that they would have a consumer market being pushed. They certainly don’t have events that would be viable. Sources of revenue and the work that they do. It was very intimate, very personal. And so I just said to her, I’m not really sure that sponsorship is the right fit for you. She was relieved. She was relieved to hear that, because now her brain is freed up and she can focus on revenue sources that are gonna be the right fit. So we are all four. And Karen, I’m sure you would echo this. We’re all for people being creative. But don’t spend your wheels on creativity where you know, you have roadblocks right in front of you. So you have to really make sure that your business model is the right fit for any form of revenue that you’re gonna pursue

[00:19:22.57] spk_0:
anything you wanna add. Thio?

[00:19:26.94] spk_1:
Yeah. Tell on opposite story. Because because it really depends on who you are and what kind of value you could bring to the market. So looking for your revenue in terms of what is our value, how can we bring it? Who needs that value? One of the woman people I work with, who is the CEO? They had been doing a lot of educational events, and we see the little bit of sponsorship well, their their revenue for those has just gone up tremendously. They recognize that the rate is a medical related thing. That the doctors who people who are promoting different health cures and their industry could no longer reach patients directly except through them. And so their ability to capitalize on that restriction inside of doctors offices like payday for them on dhe, they’ve taken advantage of it. So what may not be your neighbor friends? Non profit solution may indeed be your solution, and that’s matching that value that you have. And now maybe you can see new value with the value of what people are seeking and making those connections.

[00:20:32.10] spk_2:
That’s a good point, I think, to some of the other issues that you mentioned tony. So the racial justice issues, for example, that’s another, uh, that’s another, uh, point of leverage because obviously many nonprofit organizations are really devoted to racial justice issues, you know? Well, even before the incidents, the death of George Floyd this summer and, um, organizations that may not have had that as strongly on the radar certainly are more interested in that now. And that is a point of overlap with the corporate sector. We’re all saying that this is a really important issue. So there may be opportunities to have work funded or to expand audiences in the and in the, you know, in the colors of community. Ah, commune communities of color. Eso that people more people are being attracted to these missions and corporate sponsors. Sponsors can benefit from that as well, and can help, you know, joined the cause

[00:21:51.24] spk_0:
again. Let’s stay with you for your next idea is just basically keep. Just keep asking. Uh, including for for requests, planned gifts, But keep on asking your folks for for support,

[00:21:53.04] spk_2:
right? So, yeah, I mean, Mawr and more organizations are, you know, communicating with donors and communicating with supporters throughout the year. And, um, you know, there there has to be ah, lot of emotional mo mentum without causing donor fatigue at the same time. So these regular opportunities to be in touch with donors and to be, um, you know, engaging them in the mission, engaging them emotionally. And what’s happening, um, is what’s gonna really help bring that donor to the fold? An

[00:22:30.45] spk_0:
individual individual generosity was something that you highlight in the in. Early reports of the survey, as as a shining moment, are shining experience for a lot of non profits that their donors have come through for them. But of course, you got to keep asking so that give them the opportunity to come through for you.

[00:23:59.24] spk_2:
Yeah, I think a lot of ah lot of organizations in the beginning, uh, sort of panicked, not seeing where their mission fit in the big scheme of the pandemic on I know, I had several conversations like this with executive directors and leaders and the nonprofit sector that, you know, we need organizations of all stripes. Right now, we still need the full panoply, the full infrastructure of non profit service’s to help, you know, continue making our society better because, you know, there is such a ripple effect from all of these issues, from racial injustice from the pandemic and, you know, health care disparities and so on and so forth. So we need all the non profit infrastructure justice importantly and therefore non profits have an opportunity to really update and update their messaging update the ways that they’re talking about some of these really topical issues and how their cause their mission is to attack or solve a certain portion of it and keep their organization in the spotlight. So it’s really important for this regular communication at the same time, while acknowledging that some people may not have the means to give at this time because, you know, we do have a you know, a problem with the recession. At the same time,

[00:24:07.81] spk_0:
you need to be understanding but still straightforward about what your needs are. Yeah, not not humble about it. Yeah, Karen, let’s go back to you for looking at risks. Uh, this it’s It’s sort of running through what we’ve been talking about a little bit, but just make it explicit, you know, looking at risks to potential revenue.

[00:24:27.44] spk_1:
Absolutely. I think everyone woke up and realized that their earned revenue wasn’t a sure thing was it was one of the first biggest learnings. Um, but they’re also going back to the donors that that donors were like the heroes of this because they showed you people loved you. Um, one of the useful things your listeners conduce oh, is to write down all the things that are worrying them and look at the ones that they really can control. Um, you know, they cannot control um, when we get the vaccine. I don’t think unless they’re variant vaccines on dhe, they can control a lot of things they can’t control when it will really be there. Special. Most favorite people will come out and come to their meetings again. We don’t know, but they can control how often they talked to those donors and what they offer them bring them and share and how they provide that value. So getting out and saying, My gosh, this whole list of things, it’s like, Oh, my gosh, it’s so scary. Well, a number of those you can’t do anything about, but the ones that you can are the ones you can focus on and and and getting real clear where you have leverage with your time and energy and effort, and then really, in terms of your revenue.

[00:25:31.54] spk_0:
Now, that’s excellent. You know, Look, focus on what you can control and, you know, obsessed privately about that which you can’t. But you’re you’re non profit. Needs not to be going down the path of, you know, What are we gonna do about when the vaccine comes out? You know, our Yeah, exactly. Exactly. All right. Um, let’s stay with you for a digital You. I think a lot of non profit have already figured out some of this, but there’s There may be more work to be done around enhancing your digital, um presents skills.

[00:26:04.74] spk_1:
Yeah. Yeah. Digital is gonna be with us. We are not going back. You know, I just don’t think every board’s gonna ever meet every time at once a month in person again, I think we’re gonna have selective. So we’re gonna have a hybrid world. And so we all need to have some growth in digital skills. And it’s well worth watching the zoom videos and getting getting up to date on those and getting some skills because you need to figure out how to do breakout rooms and poles and all those things. But that aside, digital is becoming one of the heroes of this experience to people are having events that were for their local people who could come in for the evening and comfort event. And all of a sudden, the people who are coming to events, it’s much larger in his national or statewide. And who knew that I was doing in Miami biz? Um, conference last week? And we have people from all over the state of Florida, and I’m thinking, Oh, it’s not Miami biz anymore. It’s statewide, And what does that mean? And who are you? And if you’re really good at digital, maybe that’s your revenue opportunity.

[00:27:06.74] spk_0:
Yeah, your events are no longer constrained by where you’re gonna host, huh? Where you’re going to rent a hotel ballroom or or by where your offices

[00:27:15.44] spk_1:
and your ticket prices might be very different.

[00:27:21.89] spk_0:
Yes, right, right. All right, Gail. Anything you want to add? Thio Digital Digital presence.

[00:27:39.49] spk_2:
Well, I just think that helping people focus on expanding their capabilities. Uh, and seeing you know, people may feel flummoxed about digital skills. Uh, e think I

[00:27:41.23] spk_1:
think you

[00:27:41.57] spk_4:
have been

[00:27:41.84] spk_2:
out to two ways e Karen around Karen. And

[00:27:46.75] spk_0:
don’t just pick your co authors. Pronunciation. Karen, you talk breaker.

[00:27:50.40] spk_1:
I know what she met.

[00:28:09.07] spk_0:
Okay, Perfect. Middle of the road. All right, I get about what part of the country are you in? Maybe that Z in Philadelphia. I’m from New York, New Jersey. I mean, I live in North Carolina now, but now, so that’s not the explanation. Yeah.

[00:28:09.77] spk_2:
Anyway, yeah, So people might be stumped about about gaining digital skills, But But if people could start to see that as an opportunity, I’m really an optimistic person. So trying to see some of these new changes in our world as positive as you know, new ways to communicate with people and that there are, you know, so many people figuring these technical, you know, technical skills out or these thes new capabilities out. So the goal might be, um, learning how to have new capabilities for the organization and continuing to expand resilience so that when you emerge from this period, whatever it is, however long it is, you’re stronger in that you have new capabilities. You’ve learned new ways to hold events or you learned new ways to market to people. I’m working with a client, right? now on really subsea financially expanding the way that they attract new people to the organization using all kinds of digital skills. And it’s really been fun. It builds on things that I already knew how to dio that they were sort of new to. But we’re all learning new things together about how toe how toe communicate with people when we can’t see them with limited budgets so that their organization can continue to grow The same organization also, um, expand. Like many organizations turned their in person event into a virtual one wants to have their virtual event in person next year. But they thought that there’s so much value about their virtual event that they’re going t o continue doing it. But for a very specific audience that may have less access to the in person one because of costs And

[00:29:56.41] spk_0:
probably so they have a digital component with camera camera, too, and live streaming

[00:30:02.64] spk_2:
exactly, exactly and and all kinds of other capabilities. So so it really you know, while this might be a difficult time and they’re all exhausted and they’re working so hard and doing so much, but by the time and there’s some other changes that we made digitally to that that we just realized. Yes, you’re like, Oh, my gosh, We’re gonna have all this new data. So? So making these commitments and these steps and he’s taking these actions now is gonna pay off later. So it’s, you know, we’re all slogging through and trying to find moments of joy through through this, you know, challenging time for everybody, but hopefully will all emerge stronger and with new capabilities and more resilient in the long run. And that’s the That’s the eye on the prize right now.

[00:30:48.84] spk_0:
Okay? No, Gale, you’re trained, is a futurist, and we’re recording on Wednesday, November 4th. So who’s gonna win the election?

[00:30:57.29] spk_2:
Futurist? The first thing futures learn is you don’t make predictions, okay? Yeah, exactly, But we

[00:31:06.02] spk_0:
already within the next. It’ll

[00:31:07.40] spk_1:
be a white male. What

[00:31:10.38] spk_0:
do you say?

[00:31:10.70] spk_1:
Yeah, it will be a white male

[00:31:12.43] spk_0:
male. Yeah,

[00:31:13.18] spk_2:
in their seventies. Yeah, hopefully

[00:31:18.24] spk_0:
the vice president will not be, um eso eso futurist. You don’t want to touch like the next 18 months. You have to go 18 months and out. Is that Is that like you have a boundary beyond within which you will not. Well, some some awareness or understanding off.

[00:31:36.84] spk_2:
Yeah, different futures focus on different time horizons. There’s some some futures that focus really long term. So, for example, there are colleagues of mine that might focus 10 50 years out and might advice, for example, depart Ah, highway department in a state that has a growing population so that they can figure out where to put highways. My focus tends to be shorter term because that’s what nonprofits really need help with eso the advice this week. Yeah, not this week. Yeah, look a little bit longer the next couple of years. Just take a look at all the all the trends that are happening and the impact of those trends. And, um and again, as Karen said, spend some time thinking, see what this might mean for yourselves and don’t get hung up about any one way or the other because the future hasn’t happened yet. Eso we wanna be thinking about all the possible futures and carve out your path where you want to go. But always stay alert. Toe all of these different trends and resilient Yeah, and be willing. Thio shift on a dime when you learn more information so that you are prepared for any threats and you have the opportunity to seize opportunities and you don’t get, you know, you don’t get caught under a nen coming wave that you hadn’t thought about. It just helps us some more creative and more resilient and more agile as we’re going through this.

[00:33:21.14] spk_0:
And you know that that sounds like a, you know, a lead into the to our sixth idea, which is considering new markets, new audiences. Um, So I’m gonna turn to Karen too. Sort of Take us out. And, uh

[00:34:04.23] spk_1:
Okay, So So it’s we kind of have referred to it in this conversation. People finding new ways. Andi, I think this is the crux of what the message is is what worked in January. Probably is never gonna work quite the same way again. And in some ways, that’s a good thing on and one of the people I work with, I am not going back. I’m not doing some of those things, so it’s an opportunity to shed some things on, then make room for the new possibilities. Who needs your value? Where can it be provided? How can you communicate that that that you have this value and that they should really invest in you to get it is really the the hub of finding new places.

[00:34:36.74] spk_0:
All right, that’s Karen Ibra Davis. She’s at K e d. Consult dot com and co author of the study. What’s really happening with non profit revenue is Gail Bauer, who remains a, uh, flummoxed futurist. She’s at gale Bauer dot com and at Gale Bauer study again is at tiny u r l dot com slash revenue Study results. Karen Gayle Thank you very very much for sharing.

[00:34:39.34] spk_2:
Thank you so much, tony.

[00:34:40.67] spk_1:
It’s been a pleasure.

[00:34:50.22] spk_0:
It’s time for a break. Tony is take two my webinar. I’m hosting a free webinar. Start your plan to giving in 2021. Yes, I’m hosting Kind

[00:34:55.08] spk_1:
of

[00:36:55.95] spk_0:
nice hosting my own, No longer subjugated to the will of the outside hosts. Know which I’m Of course, I’m always grateful for I get so many invitations, I don’t have time to host my own. But so at this time I’m hosting my own webinar. No, no more subjugation. Uh, it’s a quick shot. We’re gonna do this in 50 minutes. What plan giving is how to identify your best prospects, where to start your plan giving program, how to market your new program. And, of course, I’m gonna leave plenty of time for questions, which is my favorite. I enjoy the questions a lot, so I hope you’ll ask a lot. We’re doing this quick shot on November 19th. Thursday Thursday, November 19th at three O’clock Eastern. You can sign up for the Free Webinar at planned giving accelerator dot com slash webinar. That number again planned giving accelerator dot com slash webinar. I hope you’ll be with me posting my own, that is tony. Stick to now. It’s time for low cost fundraising software guide I’m pleased to welcome the co authors of Tech Impacts. Consumers Guide to Low Cost Fundraising software. Amid the Heart is a contract writer and researcher for Tech Impacts, Ideal Wear and president of Heart Strategic Marketing. She has a wide range of experience helping nonprofits assess their needs, select software to meet them and engage audiences and constituents. She’s at comedy Am a D. I. E. Chris Bernard is managing editor at Tech Impact. He’s a career writer and journalist with 20 years experience in newspapers, magazines, advertising, corporate and nonprofit marketing and communications and freelance writing. Tech Impact is at Tech Impact dot or GE. Comedy Chris Welcome to non profit radio. It’s good to have you.

[00:36:59.23] spk_3:
Thank you for having us, tony.

[00:37:02.73] spk_0:
Absolute pleasure. Chris. Let’s start with you. Please acquaint our listeners with Tech Impact.

[00:37:45.90] spk_4:
Sure, tech impact is a national non profit. We offer a variety of programs, and service is to other nonprofits everything from tech consulting software selection. Managed service is to our workforce development programs in Delaware, Philadelphia in Las Vegas, where we offer all sorts of educational opportunities for young people. We also have, since 2000 and 18, when we merged with Ideal, where we have an arm of the non profit that produces all sorts of publications and training for nonprofits around the country, most of them free of charge, including this. This publication we’re talking about today

[00:38:17.96] spk_0:
Now I used to refer toa ideal wear when I had Karen Graham on, she was the CEO of idea where, as the consumer reports of non profit software and she bristled a little bit, not really. You know, Karen didn’t get upset. I don’t know if she ever gets upset. She didn’t get upset at me. She bristled a little bit like a little pushback. Well, not quite. Uh, do you? Do you object to that? Do you bristle it? That that explains that whatever description of idea where

[00:38:20.51] spk_4:
you have been with ideal where since 2000 and six. Tony and we that is certainly accurate for one part of what we do. I think if anybody would argue that point, it’s only that we do so much more than just software reviews.

[00:38:35.22] spk_0:
Okay, Okay, Fair enough. Alright. I’m sure Karen explain that to me too. But because she bristled, I have to bring it up. So? So let’s let’s let’s dive into the title. So we know what folks are gonna be looking at and what they should be expecting. So how do you define low cost?

[00:38:54.22] spk_3:
Well, that’s one of the things that we did. Well, we first embarked upon the report over the years, we’ve always had fairly standard methodology for how we go about the report. And one of the factors that we do with the very beginning is decide. Okay, what is blow cost in today’s market? So in today’s market. We were talking with subject matter experts who represented people who work in non profits and work with the technology, as well as consultants who help nonprofits with their technology and decided that for this version of the report, $10,000 for a year’s worth of software is about the ceiling that we could have.

[00:39:38.12] spk_0:
Okay. And how about fundraising? How do you define fundraising versus C. R. M or donor management? Because this used to be called the guide. The low cost donor management software. Yes, we actually

[00:41:08.31] spk_3:
had a lot of conversations about that. Um, with all the systems that we have in here really run the gamut, some of them do call themselves C R M. Some of them do call themselves donor management systems, and some call themselves fundraising systems. And so we do set aside part of the report to talk about what we mean by each one. Um, so for the systems that were in the report, we needed them or to, um, really be the sole database for a non profit or have the ability to be the sole database for a non profit, um, and then let them do things like create online forms, a variety of online forms. Let them, um, creating collect data from email marketing campaigns. We did require systems in the report to be cloud based, and we also did require them to be able to, um, process online payments either natively or through an integration. Um, we needed them to be able to track fundraising metrics on the dashboard, um, and manage a report on both online on direct mail fundraising campaigns. So it’s a sort of, ah, lot mawr expensive than the systems that we looked at in previous versions of this report. Because in many ways, the work the nonprofits of I was doing in this area have really expanded a lot. And they’ve required systems and technology to keep up

[00:41:35.41] spk_0:
with that. You have 10 different functionalities that you measured. You measure all the system against I know, um, and that folks is just gonna have to get the guide. Obviously, we’re not gonna take off all 10 functionalities. Um, Chris, I’m guessing, uh, the following is not the right question to ask. What’s the best system? Uh huh. We try 5.5 minutes. We could just wrap it up. What thing You don’t Nobody has to read the guide.

[00:41:44.51] spk_4:
This is the fifth edition of the guide. And one thing that has not changed throughout the course of each generation is that we make a ZX clear as possible that there is no best system. This is not about ranking the systems against one another. It’s about teaching nonprofits what systems offer and how to compare them and how to select the best one for their needs. Because ultimately that is the best system. It’s going to depend on your specific needs,

[00:42:16.10] spk_0:
and you have very conveniently, I think, a dozen different use cases so that you can try to fit your needs into maybe one of those use cases, or maybe overlap a little bit like tiny but growing and prices critical midsize and want a system that grows with us. Meet easy, set up and use. No. And you have a dozen of those different use cases,

[00:42:50.50] spk_4:
right? That was one of the, uh, the features that comedy brought to this edition of the guide, where we’re always looking for ways to make it easier for the nonprofits in our audience to access the knowledge that’s in it. It’s a massive undertaking to put together, but it’s also a massive undertaking to read. Yeah, comparing that many systems against hundreds of requirements, criteria just results in a lot of data. And how do you make that data useful? So looking for sort of entry points for nonprofits, Ahmedi came up with the idea of coming up with use cases that were common to nonprofits in our audience demographic to help them understand how other nonprofits reusing the system, find the use case. That sort of matched in a reasonable sense what they were doing. And then that’s that’s sort of a starting point for them. Thio begin Narrowing Systems

[00:43:30.49] spk_0:
The comedy. This is the first guy that you participated with?

[00:43:35.31] spk_3:
No, actually, I did work on. I did several of the software evaluations from the previous version of this guide, and I can’t take full credit for the use cases and that we had a smaller, um, or more limited version of use cases in the last edition of the guide that helped, uh, divide up some of the systems or sort them into categories. But what we heard from people in the intervening years was That was one of the first things that they turned to in the last edition of the guide when they were trying to get their hands around what systems toe look at because they didn’t feel like reading all of the profiles. So realizing that that waas, um, the most useful entry point for non profits made it much more, um, it made it much more attractive as

[00:44:31.09] spk_0:
e made it more accessible. Yes. You know, these are the 44 or five systems that will suit best. This, uh, this use case, you know, And like I said, you know, times 12. So whoever is best for this, how do you think non profit could best use the guide, like Or maybe maybe what do we have? What we have to know in advance before we can get the most out of the out of the guide.

[00:45:02.59] spk_4:
I’m gonna let Ahmedi field that question, but I just wanna close the use case conversation by pointing out that not all the systems eso we picked systems to match each of the use cases, but depending on each organization, specific needs other systems that we didn’t choose for a particular use case might still be perfectly valid system for that use case, and it really comes down to specific needs. We just can’t drive home enough that this is the beginning of the conversation. And it should not replace due diligence on the part of the non problems themselves.

[00:46:49.68] spk_0:
Okay, Okay. You know what? I’m ready before we before we take on that. How best? Use it. Well, but I feel like we should just I just wanna take off a bunch of the I can’t mention them. I can’t name them all, But just so folks get an idea of what what products we’re talking about I just wanna I’m gonna sample from the table of contents. So black black Bart Boomerang e tapestry Every action Kila little green light nation builder Network for good Neon C r M salesforce salsa virtuous. Okay, so I just So people get an idea What? Just have some sense of what the universe is like that we’re talking in the abstract about time for our last break dot drives dot drives engagement dot drives relationships. Dot drives is thes simplest donor pipeline fundraising tool. They have made it customizable, collaborative, intuitive. If you want to move the needle on your prospect and donor relationships. If you want to get folks from prospect to donor, get the free demo for listeners. There’s also a free month. It’s at the listener landing page. Tony dot Emma slash dot We’ve got but loads more time for low cost fundraising software guide. So how should we? How can we best use this thing? What? This This thing, this guide, it took you like, 20 minutes. You know you thing, it’s like, uh, less time than this interview is. This conversation is the guy’s done? No. This, uh, in depth guide. What should we have in place or what should we be thinking about? Like before we take it on?

[00:47:09.26] spk_4:
Well, I think it

[00:47:52.08] spk_3:
follows along really much of the best practices in choosing any software system, not just, um, donor management or fundraising or C r. M. And the first thing that you dio is have do a lot of work internally about what it is that you do now, um, and what it is that you’re going to be doing in the future, Like what your goals are for fundraising and how the software can possibly help you meet those goals. So once you go in there, we have a full section that actually goes through the 10 different types of functionality that we review in the guide and talks about different questions that nonprofits can ask about things that they do. Um, that how it how it fits into, um, their work and so they can use that section to decide what it is that are the most important functions that a software package would do to meet the goals that they have, um, selected both presently and for the future. And then from there, they can prioritize that and then use those, um, prioritize functions to take a look at which systems do well in those functions. Which systems offer those functions? So while we have sort of the high level look at it in the in the pdf version of the report, the online version of the report actually goes into depth on every single function that is below the is part of the 10, um, divisions that we have so that self so that nonprofits can really look at the details and figure out which systems do exactly what and whether or not, it meets their needs.

[00:49:09.07] spk_0:
So the guide is that guides dot tech impact dot or ge slash forward slash donor hyphen management, hyphen systems and Chris. There’s much more than a PdF there. I mean, there’s certainly there’s a pdf version of the guide could go through that, but there’s a lot more on that site. A lot more robustness. Talk about what? What folks will find it that u R L

[00:49:58.27] spk_4:
Yeah, sure, we, as I mentioned before, this is the fifth edition of this guide, but we have probably put out more than two dozen consumers guides on different topics over the years, and it had long been a dream of ours. That idea where to make it even more useful to our audience with a digital version of the site that could be interactive that offered searchable sort herbal charts toe make it more user friendly to compare systems on. This is the first guy that we’ve been able to offer that, uh, digital site, which so it’s kind of a micro site version of the report, and we are adding functionality to it on a rolling basis as we’re able to so in the next week or two. We’re hopeful that we’ll be able to announce, um, added functionality to the comparison charts that let people just highlight which systems they want to compare in, which features they’d like to compare them against so that that’s coming.

[00:50:16.86] spk_0:
That’s just like consumer reports, just like you could do Sorry camera. You could do a head to head comparison or compared two or three on the criteria. The functionalities that are most important to you,

[00:50:28.35] spk_4:
right? And we have the common mission with consumer reports of educating people about purchases because this is a big, big purchase for nonprofits and thio that same point because there’s so much information in this report, and yet there’s still so much information we don’t cover. We’re also offering a companion training Siri’s, where one of our expert trainers is conducting live demos of 12 systems from this guide, and thanks to the generosity of Fidelity Charitable Trust, we’ve been able to make that Frito anybody who signs up while that Siri’s is already underway. All those demos are being recorded, so anybody who goes to the tech impact website and signs up for that training can have for free access to live demos or recorded demos of the 12 systems from this report.

[00:51:19.61] spk_0:
How did you pick those 12 question? Well, there are 12 use cases. I wow already know the answer, but I’m asking you,

[00:51:56.16] spk_4:
I’m gonna let Omni speak to this one in more detail. But we chose 12 systems toe line up with the use cases, not because they are the best systems, but because the it would be a little bit too much of a lift for us to do the detailed long reviews of every system out there. So we chose 12 that Air Representative off what systems can do in terms of meeting the needs of organizations for each of those use cases. How many do you want to add to that expound on that or clarify that?

[00:51:59.19] spk_1:
Yeah. So overall, we have 20

[00:52:01.16] spk_3:
three systems in the report on dhe. 12 of them, as Chris just said, were chosen to represent the 12 East cases that we have to select the ones from the use case. It wasn’t again the best system. Um, but it was a system that was highly representative off what you can do in a good portion of the use case. So, for example, the use case that we have for organizations that do a lot of, uh events is that we took a look at the ones that had strong events packages. Um, you know, uh, most of the systems that we looked at had either, uh, native or integration to be able to do some work on events. But there are some that really provide ah, lot of features around events. And so those were the ones that were in there and the ones that the one that we chose to represent the events category, um was, you know, a really good representative of that in a good representative. Overall,

[00:53:04.06] spk_4:
we get a lot of emails from people saying we’re looking at two systems. Neither of them are in your list of 12. What’s wrong with our systems? And we wanna We wanna make it clear that all the systems in this report are excellent systems. They all have different strengths and weaknesses, and that’s what’s going to guide people’s decisions. There are other systems that didn’t make it in this report. They’re also excellent.

[00:53:29.82] spk_0:
You say that you say that explicitly the report. Yeah, but they just didn’t meet your criteria for evaluation. Right?

[00:53:50.25] spk_4:
And people can read about the methodology by which we the methodology we used to find systems and how we narrow the list down on. We’re happy to answer questions by email, but it’s an important note that just because it’s not one of the 12 that we chose is representative To meet those use systems does not mean it’s not a good system, and that should not be a deciding factor. This is just an effort to educate people toe, help them start making decisions about what’s right for them.

[00:54:05.24] spk_0:
And Chris, those 12 videos are at the site that I read.

[00:54:27.94] spk_4:
Uh, no, I will put a link up there. But if you go to Tech Impact dot or GE and look at our training calendar, you confined that training on. Sign up for that and we will send you a link to all the different recordings that we’ve already done. A ZX well, Azaz, uh, invitation for the upcoming ones that have not happened yet. Okay, Okay. In fact, I’ll send you a link. You can post it on your page with this recording, if you like.

[00:54:39.54] spk_0:
Okay. Yeah, Thank you. I will. Um What else? We still got a few minutes left together. What else? You want folks to know about the guide? You’re unwilling to answer the question? What’s the best system? So that’s off the tape. That one’s off the table? Uh, no. What else would you like to know? What else would you like folks to know about the guide?

[00:54:48.74] spk_4:
I think you hit on a key point, which is that this used to be the consumer’s guide to low cost donor management systems on. For a lot of people who are familiar with that report, which has been out five times in the past, they may not realize that this is the same one because of the title change. So I just want to assure people that this is the same report. We’re just changing the title to be more in line with how the vendors and subject matter experts and users, a ZX well are talking about these systems.

[00:55:19.14] spk_3:
I also wanted to point out that it’s not the guide. While the primary focus of the guide are the reviews of the systems and the profiles that air in there, one of the things that we do put in there is. We take a look at trends and we take a look at how the marketplace has changed. And we do provide, uh, some advice for nonprofits who are in the process of selecting a system about, you know, some of the things that they should be looking out for and some of the things they should be thinking about. So I know it’s a long report. I wrote a lot of words, but that there are some good things in the front of the book material, so to speak, that can help sort of position the systems within the marketplace is the whole

[00:56:06.83] spk_4:
report of this size is a massive effort on. It can’t be done without the participate participation of a lot of people subject matter experts, consultants, but also the vendors themselves who are generous with their time for the demos and the fact checking on. We also couldn’t do it without the generosity of our sponsors. Which brings me to the point that we should talk just quickly about our editorial firewall. People will notice that some of our sponsors are also vendors of systems, but those of us who put the report together don’t know who the sponsors of the report are. That’s handled by Karen Graham in a different part of the building entirely. And we’re not aware of who the sponsors are until publication day. So one has no input with no impact on the other whatsoever.

[00:56:56.53] spk_0:
Do the sponsors know whether their system is going to be part of the guide?

[00:57:20.43] spk_4:
Not when they not not at the time of sponsorship. We have to reach out to them at some point when they become of, you know, when their system is selected, because they have to do the demos and everything. But there are Obviously it’s a limited constellation of vendors out there. All right, it’s tough to fund this kind of work, were grateful for the generosity of all our sponsors and advertisers who make it possible. But we have a pretty rigorous editorial firewall up to prevent any kind of impact from the sponsorship on inclusion in the report.

[00:57:56.03] spk_0:
Okay, we trust Karen Graham. She bristled, but you admonished me, could even go so far to say admonished, Um okay, should we, uh, I’m gonna read the u R l one more time Should we should we leave it there and encourage folks? Thio. Encourage

[00:57:56.70] spk_4:
them to sign up for the free training to see the demos. And if people do need additional help choosing software, if this is still too much of a lift for people to do on their own, which is valid considering the importance of a decision like this, that is something Tech Impact can help with. They can find that on the website as well.

[00:59:40.72] spk_0:
Assistance Assistance with selection. Yeah, okay, again the guide and the site that Chris described. Guides dot tech impact dot or GE forward slash donor Hyphen management Hyphen systems. How many Heart is a contract writer and researcher? Her company is heart strategic marketing, and Chris Bernard is managing editor at Tech Impact. Take impact dot or ge a median. Chris, Thank you so much. Thanks very much, Thank you. Appreciate it. Next week, A special episode. Adult learning with Nico Chin. If you missed any part of today’s show, I beseech you, find it at tony-martignetti dot com. Beseeches still good, but I am really liking abdominal abdominal May overtake Beseech I’m not sure were sponsored by turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot ceo and by dot drives Prospect to donor simplified tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant for a free month and a free demo. Our creative producer is Claire Meyerhoff shows Social Media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our Web guy, and this music is by Scott Stein. Thank you for that affirmation. Scotty, be with me next week for non profit radio. Big non profit ideas for the other 95% go out and be great.