Tag Archives: online fundraising

Nonprofit Radio for September 6, 2021: Turn Followers Into Donors

My Guest:

Adora Drake: Turn Followers Into Donors

Adora Drake has a strategy for converting your social media followers into donors. Let’s hear what it’s all about. Her digital marketing company and coaching practice is Adora Drake Marketing.

 

 

 

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[00:00:02.84] spk_2:
Hello and welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio big non profit

[00:01:43.74] spk_0:
Ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host of your favorite abdominal podcast. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d be forced to endure the pain of Kaif Asus if you twisted me around the idea that you missed this week’s show turn followers into donors. Adora drake has a strategy for converting your social media followers into donors. Let’s hear what it’s all about. tony state to planned giving in the pandemic era. We’re sponsored by turn to communications pr and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission turn hyphen two dot c o and by sending blue the only all in one digital marketing platform empowering non profits to grow tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant in blue. It’s my pleasure to welcome for the first time Adora drake to nonprofit radio She is a digital marketing strategist coach and consultant. She helps nonprofits feel inspired to take action, gain clarity in their marketing strategy and learn how to convert their followers into raving fans who want to be part of their mission with her unique coaching programs. Her company is at Adora drake marketing dot com and she’s at Adora drake on instagram. Adora drake. Welcome to nonprofit radio

[00:01:46.94] spk_1:
Hi, so happy to be here.

[00:01:52.94] spk_0:
It’s a pleasure to have you Glad you are. Yeah, well where are you from? Where you zooming in from.

[00:02:00.54] spk_1:
So I am actually born and raised here in Dallas. We’re just unusual now because there’s so many different people here in texas but I am actually Born and raised native here in Dallas Okay right If you

[00:02:08.69] spk_0:
Live there more than four years, you’re a

[00:02:10.09] spk_3:
native. You’re

[00:02:14.23] spk_0:
a bona fide. Your bona fide.

[00:02:15.65] spk_1:
Yes. Like generation Texan here. Okay.

[00:02:19.93] spk_0:
I got a lot going on in texas now.

[00:02:22.18] spk_1:
Oh, tell me about it. Academic

[00:02:23.95] spk_0:
wise. Legal wise now, just a Russian abortion wise just

[00:02:28.49] spk_1:
today. Oh my goodness. Right. I’m like, wow, this is a big melting pot of stuff. Yeah,

[00:02:34.05] spk_0:
I don’t do politics on nonprofit radio We can do that off line, but good

[00:02:40.13] spk_1:
lot going. You’re

[00:02:53.74] spk_0:
in the news texas is in the news. It’s not to me, it’s not all good. I’ll leave it there. All right. Um, so you have a way of helping our listeners turn there social media followers into donors. Isn’t

[00:02:55.79] spk_1:
that right? That’s correct. That’s correct. I hope it’s correct for that. Yes,

[00:03:00.49] spk_0:
I hope it’s correct because otherwise we’re done.

[00:03:02.81] spk_3:
Okay,

[00:03:04.57] spk_1:
absolutely correct. tony

[00:03:05.71] spk_3:
Okay.

[00:03:07.45] spk_0:
I got one thing. Right, so far.

[00:03:08.65] spk_3:
Okay.

[00:03:13.74] spk_0:
You call this your scale method. Okay. What, why don’t you outline the elements of scale and then we have plenty of time to go into each, each step

[00:03:22.34] spk_1:
separate, awesome, awesome. So scale stands for social media content, audience lead an execution and like you said, we’ll go into each part of that scale method and how you can use that skill method.

[00:03:36.94] spk_0:
Okay. And you’ve obviously seen success with this with nonprofits that you work

[00:04:00.24] spk_1:
with. Yes. Yes. Yes. So I work with a small nonprofits all the way to midsize nonprofits and I’ve used a scale method on them. The process is very simple to follow. Um, as long as you really stick to that scale method, I know you’re gonna see some, some really good results from getting people from your social media and building that are all the way into getting people to donate, getting those funds.

[00:04:03.46] spk_0:
Okay. Well small and mid sized shops. Those are our listeners. Yeah.

[00:04:07.91] spk_1:
So

[00:04:11.74] spk_0:
Perfect. All right. So, um, social media, right For us. Okay. What do you have your principles here? What do you like to see done here?

[00:05:00.74] spk_1:
So one of the things that I know a lot of non profits and even for profits getting mixed up is they feel like they need to be everywhere. And that’s not always the case. So the first thing you want to make for sure is that you really hone down on that persona and your target of who do you want to have, um, come into your, your nonprofit or follow your nonprofit and who is that potential donor look like? Because that’s going to be really important when it comes to choosing the right social media platform. Each social media platform has their own features. Um, they attract different types of audiences. And so it’s important if you don’t know who that persona is, you might pick the wrong one and focus your efforts on the wrong one. So number one is to really hone in on your target, Once you figure that out and you choose a social media platform, that’s when the fun begins because now, you know, that’s where my audience is and this is where I can start putting out that content.

[00:05:09.64] spk_0:
Okay, okay, before we get to the content. So you want folks to look ahead to what the future donor is going to look like so that they’re on the right social networks?

[00:05:39.84] spk_1:
Yes. You have to know exactly who you want to attract. And for those of you who have already, you guys already have an organization going, you need to just look at the people who have already actively been involved with you, like who are the people who come to your events, who are the people who register uh, for your webinars or whatever your fundraising events are. Look at those people and see where would they particularly be on social media, That’s where you want to start attracting people who are already interested in your organization and picking more people, just like those people.

[00:05:48.64] spk_0:
Okay. Right, Right. Makes sense. All right. So, um, you know, be a little specific about some of the, some of the platforms, like, you know why my, why might you choose instagram over twitter for instance?

[00:07:24.74] spk_1:
Well, they’re completely different. If you were gonna go if you’re more visual, you really need to show your audience, you know, some of the projects that you guys are working on, you want to make sure that you have really good chris pictures and things like that, that’s really where you want to go to something like an instagram or Pinterest um those are really like I said really visual, these are, people are gonna be scrolling really quickly and often before they see your caption or before they see anything else they see this huge picture of something you’ve posted and so it’s really important that you get that right. Um if you are going to be showing some really visual type of content now, if you’re going to be sharing more like informational content, then you might want to lean towards something like twitter, twitter is, has its own legal system of people who are interested in information, they’re sharing information, they want to follow information they want to like, and they often click off of twitter and go to your website. Often more often they would on instagram and so if you are an organization there that’s trying to get an event for instance, out there to your audience, twitter might be a better, a better platform for you. So you just need to look at the different features and then get an idea of where can I find my target audience and how can I better create content for them? What your video is a big thing now, you know, video, especially on the other platforms are trying to adopt more videos, just like youtube, but youtube is the king of video um but also the other platforms you can do short video. So if you teach something or show something, you know, for two or three minutes posted on instagram are posted on twitter. That’s another way to show how to get in front of the right people on those platforms.

[00:07:47.74] spk_0:
You haven’t mentioned facebook now, there’s a lot of disenchantment with facebook as organic reach has plummeted. They just want your dollars to expand your reach. What’s your, what’s your thinking on facebook?

[00:08:23.54] spk_1:
So when, when people think of facebook, they do think of facebook advertising because it is probably have the best advertising if you are going to start. But that it is really good for organic as well. There are a lot of different groups. So if you know for sure that your audience is interested in, let’s just say feeding the needy or something like that, it might be really good for you to create a group specifically around that because you can later use that group, uh, to give out your information or get them on your email list. And so there are some ways that you can organically benefit from being on something like facebook.

[00:08:24.92] spk_0:
So you’re, you’re saying better maybe on facebook to create a group devoted to your cause versus versus using your nonprofit page to put content out. Is that what you’re saying.

[00:09:46.04] spk_1:
Yeah, and the reason why you would want to do this is because people don’t like to feel like they’re being sold to it. I don’t want to feel like, you know, you guys are just gonna want to follow me because I’m, you know, I’m gonna give you funds, you want to really build a relationship and build interest around your mission. And so if you are, we’ll just use the homeless shelter. For instance, if you are, your mission is to serve the hungry or serve the needy, let’s say you make a group about serving your community and serving the needy. You get all these different people coming in, they’re really interested in this topic there. They serve their community. They’re gonna be more likely to want to come off of that platform or want to donate or want to come to your events because they are already showing interest from being inside of this group. Now, the difference between a group in a page, your page is specifically for your particular organization. So if you want to show something that you guys are particularly doing that week or you want to share your employees are doing keeping them in the note, that’s one thing. But that group is going to really keep people engaged because they’re already interested in this topic and you’re giving out information and they’re giving information and now you have a relationship. So when you get on social media is about building relationships, that’s, that’s where that social peace comes in and so you want to make sure that when you’re on there, that you’re building a relationship that way, when you ask for funds down the line, they’ve been knowing you, they they’ve been following you all this time. They’ve been engaging with you. They know for sure that you guys what you guys do and how you guys help.

[00:10:06.44] spk_0:
And are you saying that reaches organic reach, non paid is easier to achieve through a group than it is through a nonprofit page?

[00:10:15.64] spk_1:
Yes, absolutely. That’s because the reaches its a lot better when it comes to facebook. Um, you know, the reaches a lot better.

[00:10:22.60] spk_0:
Yeah. In the group

[00:10:24.11] spk_1:
in the Exactly. Exactly. And it’s a lot easier to give people, you know, into your group. And so once you’ve got people into your group, it’s yours. It’s your group. You can start collecting emails, you can start sending out, you know, particular information and of course they can go and like your business page, but it’s not it’s not the same as actually engaging in coming in and sharing videos and things like that inside of a group. It’s a little bit more personal.

[00:10:47.04] spk_0:
Okay. All right. So that that’s advice I hadn’t heard before that you’re, you’re more likely to get better reach with a with a group than with a page.

[00:10:55.46] spk_1:
Okay.

[00:11:03.04] spk_0:
Okay. Um, All right. So then the content that that belongs in whatever it is, there’s facebook group or instagram or you know, whatever platform you’re choosing, what how do you select the right content.

[00:11:29.34] spk_1:
So your content should be based completely off of the interest, which is usually your, you start with the messaging of your organization. People come and they follow you because they believe in your mission. They believe in what you guys have to offer and then you want to create content around that. So don’t switch and do something. If you’re talking about homeless, don’t switch and talk about something about the earth or something like that, you want to make sure you’re Strictly focusing on your mission. Then you want to use that 8020 rule, it should be 80% information, 80% sharing about your events and things like that. Then only 20% asking for donations and money. So very little bit of actual fundraising and more giving and actually engaging with people.

[00:12:59.24] spk_0:
It’s time for a break. Turn to communications. They’ll help you find your voice and get that voice heard in all the right places. So many of the places that you’ve heard of, like the Wall Street Journal, the new york times, the Chronicle of philanthropy, fast Company and market watch. Many others you’ve heard me recite through the weeks to help you find your voice and you’ll get your voice heard. Turn to communications. Your story is their mission turn hyphen two dot c. O now back to turn followers into donors. I like to empower folks within the nonprofit to um, create content on their own. Yeah, It’s not all just from the fundraisers or the marketing, communications design people, but you know, folks who are actually doing the program work. Maybe there shooting short videos or you know, etcetera, folks on the ground doing the work. What, how do you feel about that? You know, empowering folks on the, on the ground floor, uh, to create their own content.

[00:13:41.24] spk_1:
I totally agree with that tony because that’s where the real content comes. Like when you can look on there, let’s just use instagram. I’m scrolling, I’m looking and I see a picture of people actually handing out bags of food or they’re handing out there at the hospitals and helping people. And I’m seeing people on the ground doing things. Then I know that that organization is serious, right? I know that they’re actually out there on the ground and they’re not just some huge corporate where I don’t know where my money is going. So I think that that is a good idea to always have like you said, people on the ground actually making their own content and they actually can actually get to know your audience to. So when the data comes up, you know, you can actually see what are people clicking on and what are they commenting on? What are they saying And what type of things are they, are they liking? You know, so these are all going to help you down the line as you continue to great continent to really see by looking at your analytics.

[00:13:59.94] spk_0:
Right, okay, excellent point. I wanted to ask about analytics. The analytics vary. You know? Uh some some sites will give you more, you know, a play of some platforms. I should say like a platform like linkedin. Uh you know it gives you very little you might you might not be on you might not be on linkedin for for you know volunteer and donor relationships. But that’s just one that I’m most familiar with because I spent a lot of time there. So I know that they are particularly uh

[00:14:23.69] spk_1:
yeah I think about the algorithm.

[00:14:35.14] spk_0:
I mean about the uh the analytics unless you know you start paying for the pro the upgraded um upgraded packages but you know so you’re kind of at the mercy what platforms or what what networks do you see? You know are more generous with uh with the analytics versus less.

[00:14:45.14] spk_1:
Well let’s just let’s just start with what analytics you should be looking for. So one of the things that you want to look for is you know, not only just the followers but like how many lives you are getting? How many impressions you’re making? So that means that your content is actually being seen

[00:14:59.13] spk_0:
the real you want really metric. Yeah, vanity metrics. Like how many I’m not talking about

[00:15:08.74] spk_1:
that shallow. Right. And of course followers. That’s good to have that because you’ll see you know how many people actually following you

[00:15:12.87] spk_0:
wanted, you wanted trending in the right place. But that’s not the ultimate measure exactly clicks and shares and uh shares and comments etcetera. Much more valuable.

[00:16:10.84] spk_1:
Way valuable because it’s going to help you, even when you decide to run ads down the line, it’s going to help you decide, you know, which type of people actually click who, who is sharing, who’s coming to my website. So these are all in a little that you can look and use and then you can see like especially on instagram and facebook, they’ve got their demographics down to a science. You can actually start building demographics around that. So like I said, it’s going to help you down the line as you try to run ads. You know, what age clicks, what’s the gender? What are they most interested in? What other similar pages do they follow? These type of analytics that are going to help you really target that that person over and over and over again. So yeah, looking at those analytics is going to be key. The best. Like I said, the platforms right now that are really good at analytics or are the big three really twitter facebook instagram if you are on on Youtube, they have awesome analytics as well. I’ll tell you how many views you have, How many people have like your videos, how many people share your videos. So these are things that you want to see and collect that data and see like, you know, how can I find more people that I want to attract? How can I find these donors online?

[00:16:27.44] spk_0:
But Youtube doesn’t give you the demographics though, does it? Of of people who have been watching viewing.

[00:16:32.52] spk_1:
It

[00:16:49.24] spk_0:
does give you give you a job and age location. Okay. You too does Okay. Good. Alright. Alright. Um All right. Um So you’re I don’t want to go through these two quick, but let’s say, all right, maybe we’ll end up coming back because you got a lackluster host, you know? So sometimes times I think of things later on,

[00:16:53.31] spk_1:
All

[00:16:54.42] spk_0:
right, we’ll cut we may end up coming back, all right, but we’ll get through. Okay, So a is your audience go ahead? What’s what’s your what’s your advice around audience?

[00:18:36.74] spk_1:
Audience is mainly finding those people who are going to want to continue to follow you, gonna follow you off of the platform. And so one of the main things like I said is you’re gonna want to look for that persona and then you want to try to mimic that persona over and over again. Now, people are looking at vanity measures like, okay, well, I have a lot of followers, but there are specific followers that never leave you. They’re gonna always continue to follow and be there. And so when you go in on these platforms and you’re looking for these people and you want to make sure that you have that one persona down, and you go to these different profiles on there and you follow them and you engage with their content. And so a lot of people actually miss that they post things and then they leave or they posted and they maybe answer one of their comments on theirs, but they never go back to someone else’s or engaged with their posts. And so that’s a huge part of social media. Another thing, another thing with audiences being found, right, So you’ve got this great profile, how do you get found? Almost all of the platforms use hashtags. And so these hashtags are really important there, the element that are gonna help you be discovered by new people. And so it’s very important that you at least research 15 main hashtag um that you guys can rotate out so that you guys will be found if someone searches for that particular hashtag. So, for instance, hashtag social change. For instance, if you use that in your post, when someone types in social change, your post will be in that large list of uh directory where people can actually click that photo and see where is it coming from, that will lead them back to your profile. So, these are all things that you want to make sure that you have in order to build your audience.

[00:18:38.48] spk_0:
Okay. Right. So you want to you want us following folks who are maybe influencers that are following us. Be generous. Be generous with sharing their content, not just engaging with them around your own content.

[00:19:06.34] spk_1:
Yeah. And even if you’re not sharing your your on their profile, you’re asking them questions, you know, what do they do or what, why do they like, x, y, z, you’re just having a really good conversation with them and most like, I don’t want to come to your profile and see what you guys have to offer, and that’s how you get a true follower that I want to engage with, you, not just somebody who will be going in two hours. And so it’s really important that you engage with these people and build relationships.

[00:19:18.14] spk_0:
Okay, so the relationship building and the use of the right hashtags,

[00:19:19.88] spk_1:
that’s how you get discovered related

[00:19:25.14] spk_0:
to your work, should be, should you be creating your own hashtags or better to leverage off hashtags that are already existing, but others have already you, I mean there’s maybe hundreds of thousands of people already using an established hashtag, so it’s better to go that way or better to create your own and try to build momentum there.

[00:19:56.34] spk_1:
You definitely those 50 hashtag that I’m talking about, you do want to do a little bit of both, but mainly you want to use the ones that are already already being used because people are actively using them, they can actively find you now, once you build a bigger audience, of course you can use your own hashtag then you can tell your audience, hey, my hashtag is hashtag fedora and they’ll know to use that hashtag then. But when you are just starting and you’re just getting your marketing up, you want to use hashtag that are already being searched and already being used that way people can come to your profile and that’s when we’re, those impressions come in that we were talking about earlier, you get more impressions?

[00:20:19.49] spk_0:
Yeah, okay, okay, better to start with the, with the established,

[00:20:23.74] spk_1:
definitely. Yeah. So that you can get found. Yeah.

[00:20:28.24] spk_0:
All right, your l you’re always lead. Right, yep,

[00:21:37.74] spk_1:
yep. So that part in between the audience and the lead is super important. So it is the information that you give your audience that’s going to lead them on into your email list. It’s important to have an email list which a lot of non trump is either have an email list and they don’t use it or they don’t have an email this at all. I just feel like it’s not important, but you have to be actively building an email list because these are your particular raving fans that are going to continue to follow you even off of the social media platform, even though we know social social media is not going to disappear. Um you just want to make sure that you have your own particular people that you can consistently talk to, that you can consistently share with and so that between the a and the ill you want to have uh an opportunity to give them information in exchange for their email. Now, this can be a video, this can be a live event registration. This can be um, a pdf just giving them some really cool information about what you guys are doing or why it’s important to care about your mission. Like something of value that they can give you that valuable email because that email is going to help you down the line. That way, if you don’t, if they don’t see your post that day, at least they can check their emails now because they have you have them on the list

[00:21:48.84] spk_0:
I’ve seen or is that I think put up too much of a, of a barrier when they’re asking for that email and I’ll ask, you know, for maybe first name, last name. I’ve seen phone number.

[00:21:59.67] spk_3:
You know, this

[00:22:00.87] spk_0:
is all information. That’s very nice to have because you can write the first name and last name and phone number. You can probably research the person. But I think I think the, I think you’re losing more people because people don’t expect, you know, I don’t have to give up don’t give up my phone number and my address.

[00:22:15.72] spk_1:
Yeah. And you shouldn’t have to, you should get your white paper

[00:22:19.62] spk_0:
on on your work, you know,

[00:22:21.04] spk_1:
so Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. Asking for that type of information like your your email is very valuable to you anyway. Right. Because we don’t give our emails to everybody. We dont want spam, we don’t want people on our inbox. So when we decided to give our emails out, that’s already a big deal for us. And so it’s really important. Like you said to simplify that should just be a name and email. Nothing crazy and it should just be in exchange for whatever that value is really quickly. So we quickly get the information we need and then later on down the line if you need the name and address and all those other things, it’s because I registered for something, I registered for an event or I registered to come out and do something with you. But that’s later down the line and I know you

[00:22:59.94] spk_0:
like, like I’m happy to give email and first name.

[00:23:03.54] spk_1:
That’s perfect way

[00:23:14.94] spk_0:
this organization, you know, you can personalize my email you, my first name. You know, I might give up last name or I might just make up a last name but it gets beyond that when you get on

[00:23:16.96] spk_3:
that phone

[00:23:18.06] spk_0:
number, you

[00:23:29.64] spk_1:
know, I click away. It’s too much. It’s too much and you don’t even as a, you know, when you’re marketing, you don’t need that number. Most people don’t do calls like that anyway. I like I said ask for that down the line. If you know, you’re gonna need that. Um, you can ask for that during someone’s registration or something. But they’ve already expressed interest to you. They know you they’ve been following your content. They opened the emails, right? And so then, you know, okay, they’re comfortable with us. They can give us their phone number at that point.

[00:23:50.34] spk_0:
All right. Or if you want to do a text campaign, you can ask, you know, you want to opt in, you’ve been

[00:23:52.51] spk_1:
out of the option right on our email, do that the first one though, the first time you get them on there and don’t do that the first

[00:23:58.25] spk_0:
time it’s too much right.

[00:23:59.46] spk_1:
You would scare him off.

[00:24:01.66] spk_0:
They’ve been on the mailing list for a while and you know, we’re

[00:24:03.97] spk_1:
gonna that’s fine. That’s fine. You

[00:24:13.14] spk_0:
know what we’re gonna do a SmS campaign. So, you know, if you’d like to opt in, you know, here’s the place to give us your number or reply with or something. You know, exactly.

[00:24:18.56] spk_1:
You should always be simple as possible

[00:24:20.79] spk_0:
after you’ve already got some goodwill. I feel like

[00:24:55.74] spk_1:
Exactly. And since we’re talking about that tony we can talk about some of the metrics that you should look for in your email is especially like once you get them on their like, what do you do with them? And I know a lot of nonprofits get stuck there. So one of the things that you want to make for sure is that you’re consistent with your email. So don’t just take the email and they never hear from you ever again. Don’t make that mistake because oftentimes when we do that and let’s say event comes up three or four months down the line and we’re wondering why no one registered or nobody opened our emails. We have really low email rates. It’s because you’ve let them cold. Okay. So you want to be for sure that you consistently talking to your list and you’re consistently giving them information so you can still use the 80 20 rule. And I was telling you earlier,

[00:27:44.84] spk_0:
it’s time for a break, send in blue. It’s an all in one digital marketing platform with tools to build end end digital campaigns that look professional are affordable and keep you organized. They do digital campaign marketing. Most marketing software is designed for big companies and has that enterprise level price tag sending blue is priced for you, sending blue price for you, price for nonprofits, it’s an easy to use marketing platform walking you through the steps of building a campaign to try out, sending blue and get a free month. Hit the listener landing page at tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant in blue. It’s time for Tony’s take two planned giving in the pandemic era. That’s a webinar that I’ll be delivering graciously hosted by J. M. T. Consulting. It’s on Thursday September 30, 2:00 EST, naturally I’m gonna weave in my stand up comedy, keep this light and entertaining uh as well as informative, informative is important. We don’t miss the informative, but we’ll talk about it. But I will talk about what planned giving is, who your best prospects are, where you get started and how planned giving fits. In our pandemic era. You can go to J. M. T. Consulting dot com, click events and then click experts speaker series. They have a bunch of experts and me. But that’s how you make your reservation. JMT consulting dot com events and then expert speaker series. Or if you prefer, you could go to JMT consulting dot com slash events slash planned hyphen giving hyphen in hyphen the hyphen pandemic hyphen era hyphen with hyphen tony hyphen martignetti I I presume you could also just search JMT consulting tony-martignetti that might work also. But you choose your method, no judgments here is a judgment free zone. You choose how you want to make your reservation, it’s yours, it’s yours. I just hope you will. I hope you’ll be with me with me and jmT consulting thursday september 30th two o’clock eastern. That Is Tony’s take two. We’ve got boo koo but loads more time for turn followers into donors with adora drake

[00:28:34.04] spk_1:
and some of the main ways to get that really high open rate. It starts with the subject line. So the subject line should go straight to the point. It should be really quick and grab the intention of your reader and then once they click on that uh that email, the content should be helpful. It should be informative and it should quickly let them know. You know why they should keep reading. So that’s a little bit copyrighting their, uh, when you’re thinking about that. But if you have a newsletter, it’s a great place to put, you know, what are you guys coming up with? Why? Why should we care to be on your list? You know, especially when someone is a brand new person on the list. I like to create something that caught a welcome series. So I just kind of welcome them in. You know, introduce them. Let them know what the mission is, what we like to see in the future and things like that and kind of really get them into the organization and get them excited for being there. And as well as exchanging for some value. How

[00:28:44.27] spk_0:
long is that welcome series?

[00:28:46.44] spk_1:
It varies. Um, I usually have a minimum of seven emails. Um, and it’s just going to walk them through the entire first week that they’re on the list. And then after that you, you can go to just like once a week or something like that, but you want to make sure that you’re consistent at least once a week minimum,

[00:29:02.54] spk_0:
but initially you’re doing one a day, seven days. Yeah. People don’t object to that.

[00:29:25.74] spk_1:
No. And one of the things that I get asked all the time what they unsubscribe. Fedora if they unsubscribe, but you have to think of it this way. If they unsubscribe, then they’re not supposed to be there. Um, they’re not one of the people that are going to eventually donate to you. They’re not gonna want to follow. You know, you don’t saying so you’re kind of just losing deadweight. Kind of hate to say it that way, but it’s kind of dead weight and so you want to make sure that your, your list is lean. Um, they’re actually wanting to be there. They’re actually gonna open those emails because those are the people that are gonna donate or volunteer your time later down the line.

[00:29:40.52] spk_0:
That’s also going to help you with your email service provider.

[00:29:43.94] spk_1:
Yeah. Safety cost using uh,

[00:29:47.55] spk_0:
if you’re using mail chimp or constant contact or something. I mean if you have a huge list, but it’s un engaged. That that hurts, that hurts you. And they

[00:29:55.92] spk_1:
might, it does or

[00:29:58.28] spk_0:
your your email service provider or the recipients might end up might put you in spam even though the person asked for your email, but you have a big fat bloated un engaged list versus having to say you’re saying having a lien list it is engaged. That’s more likely to end up in an inbox than a junk box.

[00:30:16.22] spk_1:
Exactly. And that’s exactly what the goal is, especially when you’re creating an email list is to make sure that these people actually want to be there because these are your fans, you’re gonna go to later down the line when you do ask for donations. They already know you and they’re warm already. So these are warm leads

[00:30:30.24] spk_0:
and listeners, we’ve had guests on this. So you know, if you want to just search, go to tony-martignetti dot com and search email delivery ability, I’ve had shows on going into depth what a door and I’m talking about right now about the algorithms that companies you pay are using against. You have a big fat bloated and engaged list.

[00:30:52.99] spk_1:
So true. It does

[00:30:56.23] spk_0:
deliver ability. So you can hear shows specifically on that topic and how to avoid it. Um, we’re just touching on it now, but it is important your own companies that you’re paying could be hurting you.

[00:31:14.94] spk_1:
Yeah, I’ve also created a pdf just for you guys. If you guys want to learn the top five emails that I use on my email list of my clients list, you guys can go ahead and download that to uh, that’s gonna be in my website. Adora drake marketing dash non profit radio So you guys can go get

[00:31:24.97] spk_0:
that. All right. So, uh if this, if this podcast doesn’t return,

[00:31:30.72] spk_3:
you

[00:31:32.01] spk_0:
got some land, she’s got a landing page for us

[00:31:34.33] spk_1:
uh podcast. You guys are

[00:31:36.85] spk_0:
going to hear from the door drake again. This is gonna be the last time.

[00:31:39.34] spk_1:
Oh no,

[00:31:40.42] spk_3:
not Okay.

[00:31:41.73] spk_1:
No, I mean I hope not.

[00:31:42.99] spk_0:
But you set upon landing page you got metrics against us.

[00:31:45.70] spk_1:
Matrix. Matrix. Yes, that’s right.

[00:31:48.46] spk_0:
What did you say metrics what

[00:31:50.07] spk_1:
always have metrics. That’s right.

[00:31:51.73] spk_0:
Okay. Like you like the metrics maven. Okay.

[00:31:54.72] spk_1:
I like that. You know, I

[00:31:57.96] spk_0:
love alliteration. You can use Metro. Alright, so Adora drake marketing dot com. Hyphen dash dash dash hyphen non profit radio all one word. non profit

[00:32:10.67] spk_1:
All one Word. Yes. No spaces.

[00:32:12.74] spk_0:
Okay. And that’s where we’ll get your top five email. What subjects?

[00:32:26.74] spk_1:
It’s going to be a top five types of emails. So I’m going to tell you the types of emails that some of them was that series that we were talking about. I’ll tell you the types of emails that you can send out to your list. Keep them engaged but really to keep them engaged and wanting to donate at some point.

[00:32:30.79] spk_0:
Okay. Okay. And I just want to make something very, very clear. So when you’re welcoming someone to the list, they’ve they’ve taken your content, whatever it is, video or etcetera, whatever white paper etcetera. Uh, they’re new to your list. So you you send an email each day for the next week.

[00:32:49.04] spk_1:
Yeah. Now this is this is not hard as you guys think. It’s not me going on there every day typing up an email and this is something that you can set up an auto response. You can schedule this out. Right.

[00:33:01.43] spk_0:
I’m just making sure that you don’t find that? That’s too much in the beginning.

[00:33:33.04] spk_1:
No. And I don’t want you guys to be scared in thinking that even if you do something one a day that is too scary. I mean if anything it’s like having a conversation with a friend every day or talking to your mom every day. Right. She wouldn’t get tired of you. So why would someone who’s who’s following you and want to be a part of your mission? They wouldn’t get tired of you either. They just want to know more and more to And so the more you show up, it’s actually the opposite, the more you have people wanting to be there. So people who drop off, they were going to drop off at some point anyway because they weren’t really your target. And so I don’t want you guys worried about what they keep unsubscribing everyday. Well, that means you need to continue to keep growing your list with real people.

[00:33:48.94] spk_0:
Right. Right. Keeping that that lean but engaged list. Okay, Okay. And then your advice is at least once a week after that first week, minimum

[00:33:49.81] spk_1:
minimum, at least minimum. Yes. At

[00:33:52.68] spk_0:
least you said minimum. Yeah,

[00:33:53.90] spk_1:
Yeah, that’s fine. Yeah,

[00:33:56.67] spk_3:
I

[00:33:57.79] spk_1:
don’t know what I’m talking about. You got

[00:33:59.46] spk_3:
it at

[00:34:00.29] spk_0:
least minimum

[00:34:01.36] spk_3:
minimum

[00:34:02.86] spk_1:
minimum. Alright. You have it out. You gotta go in a

[00:34:06.95] spk_0:
minimum minimum of once a week after. Right, okay. Yeah. Because when you’re event comes up and nobody nobody RSVPs, it’s because you haven’t been keeping in touch the people forgot about, you know,

[00:34:19.77] spk_1:
seriously? We have our lives. Right. Right. Right. And you disembark as long as like who is this? And why did I even get on the list, you know, so don’t be gone too long. Make sure you stay in front of them, let them know what’s going on. And when you show up and they show you show up in their inbox, they’re going to know exactly who you are. You want to open it. So stay consistent

[00:34:40.34] spk_0:
and then you build that relationship up. Maybe you get their U. S. Mail address. Maybe you can you do a print annual report. Maybe you can send that to that. You wanted to send them a little swag. But take your time build a relationship over

[00:34:54.20] spk_1:
the relationship. You’re right, Tony. Alright. That’s the main key. Is that building a relationship piece,

[00:35:00.24] spk_0:
Right? Because we’re trying to turn them into donors for God’s sake.

[00:35:02.79] spk_1:
Yeah. We’re asking for money here.

[00:35:05.67] spk_3:
That’s the goal. So

[00:35:06.81] spk_0:
our volunteers could be, you know, it could be maybe committed

[00:35:09.46] spk_1:
the other time, which is really valuable. Right? Valuable. Also. Absolutely.

[00:35:12.91] spk_3:
All

[00:35:14.13] spk_0:
right. Go ahead with your E. For execution, please.

[00:35:47.44] spk_1:
So execution is the main part is when we’re asking for money. Okay, So we’re ready to get them from the list and we’re asking them to give us a certain amount of money um for our calls. And so all of these other elements that S C. A. And L. They all lead up to the execution and so how do you do this? You’re gonna want to make for sure again that you’re consistent with that email list and when you ask for the sale or you ask for the donation, they already have a relationship with you and you’re really clear on where can they go and donate? Um What’s the timeline? Do they need to get on a call with you and talk about this more? You’re really defining out, you know how can they go about giving their money? Um Do they need to you know have particular people there or whatever the at the C. T. A. Is you want to make sure that you’re really clear on this and that’s that execution execution piece.

[00:36:15.43] spk_0:
And how long would you say from someone first joining the list to to asking them to make their first gift? What what what time period should that be?

[00:37:26.33] spk_1:
Um this is gonna vary by by organization but if you’re looking at the analytics and you’re seeing that people are consistently opening things that consistently clicking on your newsletter and they’re coming to your website. That’s probably a clear sign that they’re really interested. Okay so if they’re more interested in you’re seeing a 40% open rate uh They’re clicking is about a 20% click rate then it might be you can probably asked earlier but if you’re seeing that they need a little bit more time and not quite opening up the emails um then you’re not quite getting a click like you want, you might want to space that add a little bit more. So I always advise minimum uh to keep giving 80% and only asked 20%. So if you’re giving for four weeks straight, just straight information maybe on the fifth week, you can ask, hey, would you like to donate to our calls here and this and that. So it’s just about giving and balancing out that making for sure that they’re comfortable with what you do. They kind of see where the money would go. And then once you’re ready down the line, you say, hey, we’re needed to raise money for this or your money would go towards this. Cause how would you like to donate? And this is the perfect time to get started before the holidays because this is the time that you can create all the content, right? You can get them really comfortable with you and let them know what your messages and messaging is. And then you just ask for a sales. So you have plenty of time between this time in december to start getting that going.

[00:37:38.33] spk_0:
Yeah, because we are right. We’re coming up on the fourth quarter of the very important fourth quarter. All right. So, so you’re looking for you, you think 40% open rate and 20% click rate. Those are those are good numbers.

[00:38:53.02] spk_1:
Yes. And so I was talking to someone earlier. She was like, well I don’t have a 40% open rate and that’s fine. The averages around 30-35% open rate. That 40 is just a really good engaged audience. So they’re actually opening it. And it’s probably because you have a really good subject line. Right? And so I like to say that if you can get around 40, that means you have a really engaged audience, they’re not cold. Um, and they’re warm. And so Anything below that between 30, 30 and 35, that’s average, but below 30 is kind of bad. So you might want to either clean up your list or you might need to, um, you know, change your subject and kind of see, so that’s that testing piece. And a lot of people, you know, don’t know that about market, but marketing is a huge area where you have to test and kind of see what works for you, what works for your organization. And so you want to test and see what kind of subject lines do my audience open? Are they opening them at all or where did they come from? What’s the information that I gave them exchange for the email? And am I consistently making content around that or have I changed up something that makes them not want to open the email? So these are all things that you want to look at when you’re building an email list because like we said earlier, you don’t want to have a big list of people who aren’t really engaged already. You have a list of like 100 people, but they’re really engaged. They’re gonna, they’re gonna, you know, give you those funds at the end of the day,

[00:39:05.42] spk_0:
when you say, clean up the list, you’re talking about dropping people off who are chronically un engaged, you know, they’re not not opening the not clicking.

[00:39:45.32] spk_1:
Yeah, exactly. It’s not gonna do you any good to have. It’s just literally vanity metrics at that point, before I clean up the list, I always just do you know a really quick check and say, hey, are you there? Or hey, would you like to continue to learn about X. Y. Z. If you get replies on those emails, you can keep those people on the list. The other people have not opened it or have not click anything. Those are used a clear sign that they’re not really, uh you know, people that you should probably keep on your list. And so before you clean them up, you can always just send out those quick little to emails that I just mentioned and kind of see, uh, you know, are you guys still wanted to be here? Or you can just drop those people who are not opening them,

[00:40:03.81] spk_0:
let’s make something clear. Just so there’s no listener that’s that’s got a question in their mind, uh the open rate that’s when someone opens, that’s opening your opening your email. Right? The open. That’s just that’s going from, you know, on your phone. That’s going from the little some little summary to tapping it to opening it up. And

[00:40:12.67] spk_1:
yeah, any time you open up email, that’s your open rate, your full

[00:40:15.45] spk_0:
message. Right? And then the click rate is just somebody clicks on anything in anything in the message.

[00:40:20.41] spk_1:
Usually you’re yeah, usually your newsletter, whatever link you have in there. So let’s say you have a link that leads back to your newsletter on your website or at least back to your blog or whatever is you have in there. It’s gonna catch that click and like you said, so that’s the click inside of the email,

[00:40:34.71] spk_0:
your call, your call to action

[00:40:36.40] spk_1:
called the action. Exactly.

[00:40:37.50] spk_0:
Someone. Okay. I just wanna make sure everybody understands the open right click.

[00:40:40.44] spk_1:
Ok. So those are the main two that you guys want to look at when you guys are running email marketing campaigns and those are the main things we look at. Two is how high those rates are because that tells me if my content is working or not.

[00:40:53.81] spk_0:
All right. So that’s the scale method. Um as I, as I thought might happen, I did think of a few things now require us to go

[00:41:02.81] spk_1:
back. That’s

[00:41:13.21] spk_0:
the lackluster host, like I said, that you’re stuck with going back to the, to the platforms, the social media. Yeah. Um let’s talk about ones that are no longer emerging, but they’re newer slack. WhatsApp Tick tock is their value there for nonprofits? Or does it does depend on who your, what your persona looks like as to whether you’re on one of the newer platforms.

[00:42:07.70] spk_1:
Yeah. So if, if you’re going to join one of those, you really do need to make sure that your audience is over there. So if you are targeting, you know, teenagers or younger people, then you might can look into something like a Tiktok, right? But if you’re targeting, you know, wealthier donors who are over 60, they probably won’t be over there as much. Not that they won’t be over there is that they won’t be over their majority. And so you want to look at a platform where they’ll be like facebook or linkedin. Right. And so it’s gonna, like you said, go back down to that persona. But you know, when you’re thinking about which platform, if you want to be on and what you want to target? Look at, you know, where would these people be? What is that demographics that we talked about and that’s going to help you decide which one is going to, you know, work best if that platform doesn’t work, you’ve just been using it for like two or three months and you’re not really seeing much change. Maybe you should try another platform. So it’s again, that testing and making for sure that you understand? Where is my audience before you give up.

[00:42:20.10] spk_0:
Are you seeing nonprofits on Tiktok? Do you have?

[00:42:23.18] spk_1:
Honestly, I have not, I haven’t, I have not. You know what? I have seen a few on. What’s the other new social media platform? It’s like an audio only kind of platform. I can’t think of it right now.

[00:42:36.17] spk_0:
Oh, I think I’ve heard of this to uh, yeah. All right.

[00:42:39.41] spk_1:
I don’t know. You know what I mean? Right. Yeah. It’s just audio only. I’ve heard some nonprofit starting to do those because it’s kind of like podcasts and so that might be a really cool option for people if if you have a really good viewership, you want to turn them into listeners and that might be an option for you.

[00:42:56.20] spk_0:
Okay. Okay, slack. Is that is their value in uh, nonprofits on slack.

[00:44:04.89] spk_1:
Yeah. So slack is usually used to communicate which you can communicate with, you know, your volunteer. So that’s more like an internal type of software. You can kind of get in there and engage with people in your organization. So we can talk about that a little bit too. Like how do you kind of keep people engaged in inside of the organization? So something like a slag or Asana that’s going to help you really track your projects. Right. So these are, these are gonna be helpful for making for sure that those projects move along, uh, through the pipeline. So, uh, let’s say you guys are having an event and you want to start marketing it four months ahead of time, That slack kind of platform will enable you to put each team member in there that you guys can communicate, upload um you know, marking materials, schedule out those emails and things like that inside of that slack platform, so that’s what that’s used for and other ones are like a sauna or teamwork and things like that. Those are all kind of work on that capacity. Also when it comes to social media, which I talked, we had mentioned earlier like you don’t want to be glued to your social media right? So there are there are Softwares that can actually help you schedule out your content so you won’t actually have to be there every day at five o’clock scheduling on your content. So these platforms are things like you know, sprout social hubspot um plan only that you can actually upload your content and ahead of time and then schedule things out so that you don’t actually have to be there. All you have to do is come in still for about 30 minutes to come in and engage and making sure you answer questions and comments and things like that. So there is some pieces of automation that you can use

[00:44:35.89] spk_0:
Dora, what was the third one you said hubspot? I know I know sprout social and what was

[00:44:40.05] spk_1:
the social and what is called plan early and that one, I used a lot for instagram, for scheduling on instagram. Post

[00:44:46.39] spk_0:
plan, could you spell it for us?

[00:44:48.29] spk_1:
It’s called plan early. So it’s P L A N O L Y.

[00:45:00.69] spk_0:
Okay, cool. Thank you. All right. No listeners to be able to find it. Okay. Um you know, you got a little Dallas texas accent, so I wanna make

[00:45:02.80] spk_3:
sure,

[00:45:04.29] spk_1:
I don’t know I had next sent to someone said it the other, we got like, really

[00:45:07.51] spk_3:
got

[00:45:37.49] spk_0:
a little one man, I’m from new york. Uh how obvious is that? Just a little So, you know, I just wanna get folks to be able to hear through it. You talk about the subject line. What about, you know, uh lots of folks um encourage listeners to use that, that subheading uh right below the subject, like that summary that you see on your phone, you know, you get like 100 50 characters below the subject line. That can be used creatively also to encourage people to open. Right?

[00:46:11.08] spk_1:
Yeah, definitely. Um it can definitely be used to, but but mainly it is going to be the subject line record. That’s that’s what’s gonna make me click it and then the actual content inside of your email is gonna be the most important, but if you want to add, let’s say I’m having a contest or something like that and I want to make sure that people understand, you know, what, what they can expect when they open the email, then I might add a little bit of context inside of that secondary subject line that you’re talking about. Um, it’s not the most important, but it is, you know, something that you can add a little bit of extra information if you don’t have enough information in your subject line. Okay.

[00:46:20.18] spk_0:
Uh, why don’t you uh, story it’s story time. Did you tell the story of uh, you know, some non profit uh, that you know, maybe not, you know, step by step to the scale method, but nowhere you saw, you saw things where things are moving, you start to get some traction, saw some success converted to focus the donors and tell us a good story.

[00:47:47.28] spk_1:
Yeah, so one of the non profits I just recently worked with, they were uh mid sized non profit in boston and what they focused on is helping disadvantaged minorities find jobs. Um, they also were involved with feeding uh, their local community and one of their major uh, academies that they were going to try to open up was just to help younger teenage students to come in and learn how to volunteer and learn how to get back to their community and be really good students. And so they were trying to push that act that academy and they didn’t know how to do that. So most of their marketing was still done the old school way. So they were getting out there, you know, going to these different uh, local churches, going to schools and things like that on foot and not necessarily, uh, utilizing social media, they have been around for about 15 years. So they did have an email list, but they weren’t really using it outside of, you know, just letting people know like tomorrow we’re gonna be doing an advantage at X, Y. C. And so when they brought me in, they were like, hey, how do we uh, you know, really build some interest online and so that we don’t necessarily have to rely on doing these old school methods all the time. And so one of the first things I took a look at was that s of the scale method, which is their social media, which is almost non existent. Um, they have maybe one account, but it wasn’t used for like four years. So

[00:48:00.23] spk_3:
that

[00:49:52.47] spk_1:
is non existent. Yeah, I was like, okay, what’s this? So we really have to start almost from scratch their built their, all of their platforms, uh, to the point where people were actually following, we could actually, you know, see the analytics of them leaving the platforms and clicking their websites. We did get people onto their email list and then I taught them, you know, kind of what I was discussing here. Like how do you nurture those people now that they’re on your email is like, don’t just leave them hanging or don’t just let them know the day before the event, Like, hey, it’s tomorrow because you probably won’t get as much engagement. So I taught them how to use content inside of their email lists and how to, you know, get people interested before these type of events happen or before you, they want that call to action to happen so that they can really start seeing well, okay with this organization is really cool because they really do help their community. Um, or one of the, it was funny because during my time with them, one of the main uh, directors, he had an emergency outside when they were feeding the hungry that was actually featured on the news. And so I was like, hey, this is perfect for social media just to show that you guys, you know, not only you guys out there on foot, but you guys, you know, care about your community even when an emergency happens, you’re going to step in and so that just makes it just makes you look good as a brand and you can share all these types of things with your audience because they care to know it right. And so I walked them through the whole process, like you said, trained their team how to do this. So if you have an organization and you are, you know, you’re wanting to be a little bit more hands off. I do have the opportunity for you to, you know, come into my programs and do that. But they use that program where I kind of came in, set up all of their automation. So they don’t have to be glued to things and they can really focus on the mission of the organization. And so when I left them, all of their team was trained. They have the automation is in place and so they’re on their way now to, to bring in a lot of money less than I checked with With them up there in Boston. They had brought in about 50,000 into that new academy that I was talking about. Um, and that’s gonna be really focused, like I said on on these students this year, on how to make them really good students and make them want to study, make them want to volunteer and things like that.

[00:50:07.36] spk_0:
Okay. And that $50,000 was largely from the relationships that got built

[00:50:55.36] spk_1:
relationships in ways that we just talked about. Exactly exactly, strictly relationships really because you know, once you get them on the list, you got, you know, warmed up. A lot of people are asking questions as I was running a lot of their socials at the time. So I got to see people ask questions about, you know, how can I get involved or what do you guys do or how long have you guys been around? And that is a really good way to, you know, meet prospective donors, you know, get him on the list and share that information. Uh, one of the directors there, she also had a radio show. So she would do things every morning. Uh, let’s say on on Wednesday at nine o’clock, she would, you know, give her information. And I said, when I first came in I was like, okay, you’re doing this radio show. But what if I’m not listening at nine o’clock Eastern time because I’m here in central time. Alright, Am I never gonna see the show? And she was like, well, I don’t, I don’t know what to do. So I taught her how to repurpose that content. So where she can share it on her social media, she can also share that on her email list and more people get to see, you know what they’re doing up there.

[00:51:13.66] spk_0:
Okay, that’s a great story.

[00:51:14.93] spk_3:
All

[00:51:16.16] spk_1:
right, we’re

[00:51:19.14] spk_0:
gonna leave it

[00:51:19.49] spk_3:
there Drake

[00:51:38.26] spk_0:
actually, Dordrecht, digital marketing strategist, coach and consultant, you’ll find her at Adora drake marketing dot com if you want to hit the listener landing pages she set up for us. It’s a test now. So Dora drake marketing dot com. Hyphen non profit radio No spaces,

[00:51:40.96] spk_1:
no spaces. Thank

[00:51:43.12] spk_0:
you very much. Terrific ideas. Thank you.

[00:51:45.46] spk_1:
Thank you guys. It was a pleasure being here.

[00:51:47.86] spk_0:
Our pleasure, my pleasure, my pleasure, well, our pleasure to listen, my pleasure to talk with

[00:51:52.61] spk_3:
you

[00:52:25.05] spk_0:
next week, effective fundraising that’s Warren Mcfarland’s new book and he’ll be with me if you missed any part of this week’s show? I Beseech you find it at tony-martignetti dot com. We’re sponsored by turn to communications pr and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission turn hyphen two dot c o. And by sending Blue, the only all in one digital marketing platform empowering non profits to grow. tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant in Blue,

[00:53:01.55] spk_2:
our creative producer is Claire Meyerhoff shows social media is by Susan Chavez. Marc Solomon is our web guy and this music is by scott steiner. Thank you for that. Affirmation scotty you with me next week for nonprofit radio big non profit ideas for the Other 95%. Go out and be great. Mm hmm. Mhm. What

Nonprofit Radio for June 5, 2020: Don’t Get Played By The Product Demo & Facebook Fundraising Data

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Rubin Singh: Don’t Get Played By The Product Demo
We’ve all watched in awe as the cursor flies across the screens of a demonstration. Nine months later we’re scratching our heads. “They made it look so easy back then.” Get insider tips from Rubin Singh, who’s led hundreds of sales demos. He’s CEO of OneTenth Consulting. (Part of our 20NTC coverage)

 

 

Nick Burne, Julia Campbell & Maureen Wallbeoff: Facebook Fundraising Data
This 20NTC panel feels your frustration over Facebook not sharing donor data. But they also admonish that you can’t ignore the value of Facebook fundraising. They bust myths, help you overcome the challenges, reveal how to thank and engage your fundraisers and steer you clear of pitfalls. They’re Nick Burne from GivePanel and consultants Julia Campbell and Maureen Wallbeoff.

 

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[00:00:11.54] spk_0:
Okay. Hello. Welcome to tony-martignetti non

[00:02:30.78] spk_1:
profit radio. Big non profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. I’ll have something to say about George Floyd and racial equity in Tony’s Take Two. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d be forced to endure the pain of Ballon O prostatitis if you pissed me off with the idea that you missed today’s show. Don’t get played by the product demo. We’ve all watched in awe as the cursor flies across the screens of a demonstration. Nine months later, we’re scratching our heads. They made it look so easy back then. Get insider tips from Ruben Sing, who’s led hundreds of sales demos. He’s CEO of 1/10 Consulting. This is part of our 20 and TC coverage and Facebook fundraising data. This 20 and D C panel feels your frustration over Facebook not sharing donor data, but they also admonish that you can’t ignore the value of Facebook fundraising. They bust myths, help you overcome the challenges, reveal had a thank and engage your fundraisers and steer clear of pitfalls. There. Nick Byrne from Give Panel and consultants Julia Campbell and Maureen will be off tony Stick to be The change were sponsored by wegner-C.P.As. Guiding you beyond the numbers. Regular cps dot com by Cougar Mountain Software Denali Fund Is there complete accounting solution made for nonprofits tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot ceo Here is don’t get played by the product Demo. Welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio coverage of 20 and TC. That’s the 2020 non profit Technology Conference sponsored A 20 D. C by a Cougar Mountain Software Denali Fund. Is there complete accounting solution made for non profits tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant Mountain for a free 60 day trial. My guest now is Ruben Singh. He is CEO of 1/10 Consulting Ruben. Welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio. Thanks

[00:02:38.40] spk_2:
so much, tony. Glad to be here.

[00:02:48.54] spk_1:
Pleasure on pleasure. I’m glad that we could work this out virtually. And I know that you are well and safe outside Baltimore in Maryland goods, your topic is don’t get played by the product. Demo, Exclamation mark! If you’re shouting this from a mountaintop, don’t get played by the product. Demo. You’re an insider you’ve done How many? Hundreds of product demos?

[00:03:02.44] spk_2:
Yeah, definitely in in the hundred’s. But the thing is, I’ve been on all sides of it. I have, ah, delivered demos. I have been on the the the customer side or the prospects of receiving demos, and I’ve also coordinated them on behalf of my customers. So I felt like I had a lot of good experience and perhaps some insider tips and tricks toe offer.

[00:03:22.57] spk_1:
Okay, there is There is some deception in these in these demonstrations.

[00:03:40.46] spk_2:
Well, you know, I wouldn’t quite say deception. It’s a spectrum, Really, Uh, some things I have some practices I’ve seen over the years have ranged from you, maybe a little questionable to mislead it, and then some of it has been deceptive. But, you know, honestly, tony Yeah, it’s a little tongue in cheek. I I don’t want to imply, especially the non profit sector, that these that these sales reps are being dishonest in any way. I think most of them have great intentions. But what I really think that there’s a handful of tips and tricks and practices that folks can use to really make sure they’re getting the most out of their demos.

[00:05:07.37] spk_1:
Okay, My my recollection of these as a consult. So I do plan giving consulting. And I’ve gotten some demonstrations for profit from products as a as a as an observer for on the client behalf. Um, and then together we make a decision, but my memory of them is that the cursor is flying around the screen. It started non stop. And then at the very end of a 30 minute demonstration, Do you have any questions? Well, I probably had questions from screen number two about 90 seconds into the thing, but I’m flummoxed now. I’m overwhelmed by the by the movement by by the screens flying around. I can’t remember my question. I I think I had one, but I’m not positive of that. I need to I need a I need a drink. I need to calm down, because the thing just went so damn fast, you know? Um, all right, so that’s that’s probably on the negative end of the spectrum again. Not suggesting deception, but it just goes so fast, you know? Shoot. All right, So where should we start? I mean, you have tips for preparing before the demonstration starts. Yeah,

[00:05:12.64] spk_2:
Well, what you just described is a very common situation. And I would say where the biggest gap is I’ve seen where customers have come back to me and said, You know what? Everything looks so seamless and looks so, uh, you know, so nice and shiny and so quick and easy in the demo. But that’s not the product we ended up with. The biggest reason for that is, in my opinion at least, is how you come into that demo. How prepared you are. If you simply just walk in, let the sales rep do their thing and just, you know, as you and just wait to be wowed and impressed. You’re very likely going to end up disappointed so that one of the first points that I really bring up in, uh, my talk was to present some use cases to really think to yourself, what are the four or five things that we must have on Day one when our new system is live, as well as one of those four or five things that are working terrible right now in our current system, those are the areas we want to focus on, Let’s draft up our use cases. Let’s get very specific examples, not yes or no questions and provide that to the sales rep account executive ahead of time. That way, you’re not really focusing on the fluff. You’re not focusing on the bells and whistles. You can watch that stuff on YouTube. You’re really focusing on those areas that are going to be critical for you to be successful.

[00:06:24.34] spk_1:
Okay, Anything else we should be thinking about as a team before we before we view this extravaganza?

[00:06:30.66] spk_2:
Yeah, definitely the prep that you do up front. You know, I kind of alluded to this that you doing your homework? A lot of these products that you see out there, especially in a non profit technology side. There’s demos available. There’s demos available on their websites. You know, maybe you need to download a white paper. There’s demos available on YouTube. Eso, you know, watch those demos do your homework. Don’t just wait to the demo. You know the facilitated demo before you see it for the first time. That way, you can really understand what the potential pain points are again. Also, there’s many different organizations out there that do independent studies on the various donor management C r M systems eso. So that might be a place as well as other other applications. So do your homework. Understand where the weaknesses are already a prom. That way you can focus on their those areas in the demo. So the team or the pattern I really focus on here is move away from the demo just being a presentation and really try to make it a working session with your sales rep. Eso you’re really working through this scenarios and not just sitting back and watching can presentation.

[00:07:29.58] spk_1:
Okay, Yeah, you’re focusing them on on where your pain points are, what your must haves are and not just getting a generic description of, you know, a lot of times, you know, if you if you end up meeting this, then we have this component and and we have this feature to you might not end up needing it, but I just want to acquaint you with it. You know, that that’s really irrelevant.

[00:07:52.71] spk_2:
That’s right. And so those were some things that you could ahead of time, you know, even during the demonstration itself, there’s certain things that you want to look out for, You know, again, the yes, no questions. Do you have all into your management? Do you have events management? Do you have playing? Giving the answer is always gonna be yes to a Yes. No question. We had a If you can always repurpose, you know, certain functionality to make it fit A particular scenario. So I try to encourage your my profit, remind my customers that’s gonna move away from that and really give a specific example. Hey, you know, I do a lot of events and I sit at the desk during our gala and I need to register people when they come in the door and also have the ability with the check and check out process to enter a new attendee. Show me how I can do that and that that could be one of the use cases that you present ahead of time. So again it gives it gives very specific things. Another thing that I suggest is is be careful about those words of integration and compatibility. Um, because everyone is integrated, you know, especially I deal a lot with Salesforce and everyone claims to be integrated with Salesforce but that integration it could mean anything. It could be a plug and play out that takes 10 minutes. Or it could be, Ah, it could be a separate third party solution that you need with 1/3 party consultant to integrate it. So all that falls within the category of integration. So you want to be very clear when someone says, Oh, yeah, we’re compatible with such and such or were integrated with such and such. What exactly does that mean? And how does it look?

[00:09:57.04] spk_1:
Okay, that’s interesting. Yeah, I don’t think most people know that. They just they say, Oh, it’s integrated. Okay, that’s awesome. It’s time for a break. Wegner-C.P.As Things are moving fast. The Senate passed a bill on paycheck protection program loans that extends the covered period from eight weeks to 24 weeks. You need a place to keep up with everything that we’re being hit with. Financially wegner-C.P.As dot com Quick resource is and blawg now back to don’t get played by the product demo. I should have given you a chance to shout out what? What’s the work at 1/10 Consulting.

[00:10:27.99] spk_2:
Oh, well, we, uh we do everything from strategy we work exclusively with nonprofits. We do strategy, work. We do implementation of C R M. Systems all the way through change management and user adoption. So we take a slightly different approach in the sense that we, uh it’s not really just the technology that we focus on. We really try to make sure that the people, the process, the strategy, the data, everything is aligned. Because if one of those pieces were missing, you’re not you’re not gonna be happy. So as a consulting practice, we try to make sure all those are aligned to help help move missions

[00:10:35.81] spk_1:
forward. What’s the significance of the name 1/10 Consulting. What is that? Does that mean?

[00:10:55.56] spk_2:
Yeah. You know, in the six faith, there’s a, ah principle or a concept of thus fund we call it, which is giving 10% of your your income, your time to the community into the greater good. Um, and in my early years of starting this practice, I worked with a lot of faith based communities. Um, and as I was implementing donor management systems for churches and synagogues and masa, I started noticing that this concept of 10% or 1/10 of your income. Er, and giving back was was such a central component of every one of these faiths and every one of these faith traditions. Eso to me, it was it was nice. It was this unifying principle. And and so that’s kind of where 1/10 comes from that the 1/10 really represents this this treasure. And, you know, I’m hoping 1/10 consulting helps helps that 10% really realize its full

[00:11:36.74] spk_1:
potential. So before you recognize this commonality, what were you, Reuben sing Consulting? What were you before you were 1/10

[00:11:43.75] spk_2:
before 1/10 I have worked for, um I worked at a non profit sector, but also in CR ems for over 20 years. So prior to 1/10 I was with an organization called Round Corner. In their non profit technology sector. I was vice president of digital transformation, and, um, and they actually have been acquired by Salesforce. But that was the time I realized that I don’t want to be tied into one particular product and really want to be able to look at things more holistically that way. Started.

[00:12:14.94] spk_1:
Um, let’s go back to ah to advice you um, you know, part of what you ah talk about is tough questions to ask way at that stage, or is there more you want to say leading up to it? But you you, uh you take it where where we need to go,

[00:13:44.97] spk_2:
right? Right. Yeah, I think you know, as far as the tough questions that we covered, some of them the integration, the interoperability. Okay, I think another thing we talked about with terms, not just the yes, no questions. Also, when it comes to things like, Do you handle soft credits? Do you handle plan giving? Do you handle solicitors again? The questions the answers will always be Yes. And although, you know, matching gifts, workplace gifts, these these air something that all non profits due in some way, shape or form. But you want to make sure that your impression and your understanding of it is the same as the sales reps because I’ve noticed a lot of gaps in that area as well. Another couple tougher questions that I always like to get into is asking this question of what exactly is has been upgraded in this demo. So I’ve just seen it Time and time again, tony. Where, uh, you know, again, you’ve seen this great demo. And then when you come back and say, Well, these air, like, archaic looking Web forms can’t show these to my donors, and then they come back and say, Oh, yeah, you just need to upgrade to the next forms package or, oh, if you’re going to send more than three emails, you have to say you have to upgrade to the next email package. So the demo has been filled with all these add ons and upgrades, but you’re kind of getting something different, you know?

[00:13:47.33] spk_1:
And so you bought that you bought the base model, but you test drove the, uh, the SLX expanded, uh, 16 cylinder version.

[00:14:01.74] spk_2:
Exactly. And I often, for example, a few years back I was, uh, family. We were purchasing home, and we wanted a new home, and we were looking all these model houses, and I know some people really like to see these beautifully furnished homes with great interior decorating. And I was just like, Can I just see an empty house? You know, I want to know what I’m getting. I get thrown off, I get distracted by all this. You know, Do you have some sort of, you know, house that’s being built, That that’s the same model that I could look at. And so I kind of looked at demos the same way. Do as little as possible, you know, and And don’t customise too much. Don’t add on anything. I want to see how close my use cases worked with your out of the box product that way. Ah, comparing apples down.

[00:14:39.06] spk_1:
Okay, Okay. So you can actually ask them to demo a specific version that you’d be most likely to be buying without whatever add ons, plug ins, upgrades, et cetera.

[00:14:51.31] spk_2:
Yeah, and it really should be easier for the sales rep to to prepare for that on and really have them. You’re focusing less on customizing and focus more on the use cases that you provided them. Okay. And I will tell you, you know, this not all sales reps or account executives will be receptive to this. And some of them might say, Oh, this is too much work. Or where they might look at your use cases and say we’re clearly not a fit, which is not a bad thing either. At least you know upfront. Yeah. The sales reps that I think are really good. And some of the ones I’ve worked with they would love something like this. They would love the client toe, give them a list of use cases. Give him some very specifics That way, they’re not guessing either. Ah, and the session is going to be a lot more fruitful when both sides

[00:15:34.44] spk_1:
are prepared. OK, OK, Reuben Weaken, spend some more time together. If you have more suggestions,

[00:16:04.52] spk_2:
you know, I’d say that there’s there’s probably one other suggestion that I would, uh I alluded to this at the very beginning on I think it kind of sums up. The whole point is when I talked Teoh sales reps and want to prepare them for a demo, I even tell them up front. You know, we’re not really interested in the demo. We’d like to have a working session and just even using that term, it changes the paradigm, and it really changes the relationship. They’re between yourself and the vendor. Eso even just something as simple as recommending that we’re calling it something different. The sales right will come in a little bit more prepared to work with you and really try to work through those use cases. Eso the more you can move away from the canned, you know, bells and whistles, presentation and Maurin toe a meaningful conversation on your use cases, the more happier you’re going to be with the end product,

[00:16:38.54] spk_1:
okay? And I guess if you get any if you get any pushback or objection from the from the sales rep about converting this from a demo to a work session, that’s a red flag about whether whether you want to purchase their ah, against purchasing their their product and continuing with the conversation with them.

[00:16:47.75] spk_2:
Absolutely. I mean, you know, we’re talking about on profits here, and, you know, obviously funds are always limited, and you want to make sure that you’re making smart decisions on where that money goes. So, like I said, a nonprofit sector, that’s the sales reps I’ve worked with their usually very much in line with this thinking. Um, so so but yeah, if there was any objection, that’s definitely red flag. In my opinion,

[00:17:10.04] spk_1:
you have ah, you have a resource at the on the 1/10 consulting site

[00:17:17.24] spk_2:
Yeah, yeah, you know, and we’re really bummed about that. The conference, the NTC conference being canceled. So what we did is we went ahead and I recorded the session that I had planned to deliver at the NTC conference, Um and ah ah. And have uploaded that recording to our website www 0.1 temp that consulting. Um, it’s there in the blog’s section. And you know, I would also suggest that that blawg section does have a lot of other resource is, you know, if you’re interested in grant management and what products are out there or if you’re trying to figure out what might be the CIA RAM solution for you, we have several articles free webinars on other insights that folks are welcome to take a look at

[00:17:56.84] spk_1:
Okay. And the full the full conference. Ah, this presentation is there. That’s correct. Okay, is 1/10 dot consulting. That’s correct. Oh, I didn’t know. I didn’t know dot Consulting is a, uh Is it available for those called extension?

[00:18:17.13] spk_2:
Yeah, it’s available. Signed, signed up for a couple years ago and definitely opens things up. T create the name that you want, so yeah, www 0.1 temps that consulting, and we’ll take you right

[00:18:29.14] spk_1:
there. Okay, It’s in the block block section. That’s right. All right. Ruben saying he’s CEO. 1/10 Consulting, Um, in Maryland, outside Baltimore. Rubin. Thank you very much. Thanks very much for sharing.

[00:18:35.14] spk_2:
Thank you, Tony. I appreciate your time.

[00:21:12.05] spk_1:
My pleasure. Thanks. And thank you for being with non profit radio coverage of 20 and TC. We need to take a break. Cougar Mountain software, Their accounting product Denali is built for non profits from the ground up. So you get an application that supports the way you work that has the features you need and the exemplary support that understands how you work. They have a free 60 day trial on the listener landing page at tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant. Now time for tony Stick to George Floyd. It’s a recorded murder. I am skeptically optimistic that the United States will deal this time with its institutional racism. If we’re gonna have a chance that that we each need to be the change we want to see, there’s no waiting for political leadership. They’ll get dragged along after we the people, start the conversation at our level. That needs to happen and I would like to help. Next week, non profit radio will have a special episode devoted to how to start the racism and white privilege conversation in your office. It’s a long journey. It begins with a single step. We each need to be the change we want to see. Start with me next week. That is tony Steak, too. Now, time for Facebook fundraising data. Welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio coverage of 20 NTC 2020. Non profit technology conference with me now, our Nick Byrne, Julia Campbell and Maureen will be off. Nick is founder and CEO at Give Panel. Julia Campbell is author, speaker and teacher at J. Campbell Social Marketing And Maureen will be off is digital strategist and technology coach with practical wisdom for non profit accidental techies. Welcome, everybody. Nick. Julie. Morning. Welcome. Welcome, city pleasure. I’m glad we’re able to work this out. I know you’re each well and safe on. I’m glad to hear that. Everybody’s okay. Um, we’re talking about Facebook. Fundraising your 2020 topic, uh, for NTC is best kept secrets the getting and using Facebook fundraiser data. Julia, you’ve been talking about Facebook fundraising for so long we had you on?

[00:21:16.09] spk_3:
Yeah, last two years ago

[00:21:18.57] spk_1:
Was the the last year or two years ago. Um, you’re gonna have toe. You have to find a new gig.

[00:21:23.62] spk_3:
I know. Well keeps changing

[00:21:26.41] spk_1:
this this one trick things.

[00:21:27.84] spk_3:
And now I found neck. You’re like my Facebook fundraising soulmate, so

[00:21:32.14] spk_1:
that’s right. So I’m going to start with you, Since I know for a fact you’ve been doing this thinking about Facebook fundraising a long time. Um, what the problem is, Facebook doesn’t share. Right? We lamented the last year or two years ago, you and I.

[00:22:42.13] spk_3:
Yes. So I Yeah, it was in New Orleans, Um, 18 ntc with and I did the first session on Facebook fundraising tools, and it was when they had just come out and I had mental health, America and the Polaris Project with me because they were kind of just slaying it with Facebook funders and raising thousands of dollars. Like Nick likes to talk about that magic money that comes down when you turn on the tools. But the number one this was two years, the number one quandary and problem, an issue that nonprofits had and still have is this issue that you don’t get the information of the contact information for everyone that makes a donation, even if it’s not to you? Necessarily. It’s to someone else’s birthday fundraiser. So our entire philosophy and the three of us are all on the same page, and we talked about it. We have talked about this a lot is that you’re missing the point. If you focus on the data that Facebook gives you, there are ways to get the data and the content information for your fund raisers. The people that are raising money for you that are stepping up and saying I want to donate my birthday. This is a cause that I really care about right now. Everyone come together, raise money. Those are the people you need to focus on. And I think Nick made an amazing amazing point earlier this morning when we were talking. I love that point where you don’t want to clog up your Sierra Room in your database with the data of all these donors who don’t even want to hear from you anyway because they haven’t elected to hear from you. They didn’t really box

[00:23:27.81] spk_1:
their connection here, person they’re connected. The person who is running the fundraiser?

[00:23:32.51] spk_3:
Yes, exactly. Exactly. So get around this. We need to get over this hump. And Nick can also talk a lot more about that. And Maureen can

[00:23:40.82] spk_1:
too. All right, So you don’t want to focus on what we don’t have.

[00:23:44.34] spk_3:
Yes, there is a

[00:23:44.95] spk_1:
possibility that they might be, uh, uh, interested in engaging with you and your cause.

[00:23:51.81] spk_3:
Maybe,

[00:23:52.45] spk_1:
But you don’t want you don’t focus on that possibility. Want focus on what we do have is that

[00:24:31.94] spk_3:
Well, yeah, there’s kind of two ways to look at it. One is Do you want un discretionary? Do you want to, um, totally on un discretionary funds? Do you want free funds that you could do with whatever you want to do with coming in? No one telling you what to do? What? They’re not earmarked. Do you want that kind of money? Do you want exposure to a brand new audience? Or do you want to focus on the fact that I gave $5 to Maureen’s birthday fundraiser But I only gave because of Maureen? I’m not really interested in animal rescue yourself. Hung up on getting my email, but we got to stop with that.

[00:24:33.41] spk_1:
OK? All right. Well, Nick, Julie obviously teed you off. So why don’t you give us your overview?

[00:24:39.94] spk_5:
Yeah, I mean, I think, like like Facebook. Call it social fund raising. And I think that’s the key, right? It’s social. It’s it’s enabling people who love your cause who want, like, support your mission to go out and raise money from their family and friends. And if if organizations and nonprofits just treat it like direct mail or something, right, it’s not social, and so you have to you have to go with it. And so there’s this myth that, you know you can’t get the data. Yeah, Facebook don’t share the data. That is true. But actually, we’ve pion eight near two ways that you can get a lot of fundraiser data. You’re not going to get the data of every single donor that gives to every every single fundraiser on Or do you want to clog your sierra em up with that information, right? Because they’re not gonna convert on email or direct mail like less than 2% of them opt in. When Facebook asked them to hear from you. And that’s a good sign that they gave to your t their friend or their family or their loved one. Not Teoh your cause. So go with the flow. Don’t fight Facebook. Use it for a CE, much as we can possibly use it for. It’s a fantastic fundraising

[00:25:50.14] spk_1:
tour. Okay, Nick, what’s out in your background? You have You have a projector on your ceiling projecting that onto the wall.

[00:25:56.43] spk_5:
So that’s Michael. Jordan told me to read the quote. It’s a bit it needs to be bigger, right? But Michael Jordan quite. It’s a Michael Jordan quote. So is Michael Jordan

[00:26:05.70] spk_1:
Reed. It go ahead.

[00:26:20.05] spk_5:
It says, Uh, I’ve missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I’ve lost almost 300 games 26 times. I’ve been trusted to take the winning shot and missed. I failed over and over again in my life, and that is why I succeed.

[00:26:25.02] spk_3:
I love that

[00:26:26.76] spk_1:
additional. Okay. Is that that’s not a projection from your ceiling onto the wall, is it?

[00:26:31.26] spk_5:
That is one of those decals things.

[00:26:34.15] spk_1:
Okay? You’re very, very high tech. If you’ve got one

[00:26:38.12] spk_5:
E say it’s like a hologram,

[00:26:41.29] spk_1:
right? Exactly like It’s a

[00:26:42.77] spk_5:
commercial reality. It’s argument is not really there.

[00:26:50.94] spk_1:
It’s one of those lights that shines in front of a restaurant on the sidewalk. Where is it coming from?

[00:26:52.25] spk_5:
A car, guys, it’s,

[00:26:53.94] spk_1:
uh uh OK, Marine. You want toe? Er, why don’t you add to the overview and get helping us get started?

[00:28:30.69] spk_4:
Sure. I think that, you know, part of what Julia and Nick are alluding to has been around for a long time when you think about peer to peer fundraising generally. So I’ve helped a lot of people over the years with either live physical events, that’s a five K or a bike or walk or D i y peer to peer fundraising events and organizations, generally speaking, do not do anything with the donors who give to those team captains or those participants. The data does go into their C. R M because somebody’s made an online gift and is part of that text stuff. The date is getting sucked over, but they’re not trying to convert those people. But for some reason, people feel very frustrated about the inability to get the $5 donor into their database and is Nick and Julie have both said. You’re paying attention to the glass half empty. You need to shift your mind, pay attention to the information you can get and cultivate those relationships. Um, we and fundraising think a lot about the lifetime value of a donor, right? It’s just like it’s ingrained. And whether you were formally trained in the stuff or not is all around us about who’s valuable, Who do I spend time on and who I don’t. And Facebook turns that like a 45 degree angle. And it can be awful hard to get your leadership on board with ignoring donors just really what we’re telling people to dio. Those aren’t the folks that you should be paying attention to When it comes to Facebook fundraising, it’s the fund raisers themselves, not the people who were actually giving. And that could take some conversation at your board level or your your executive or sea level Um, inside your award that it is. It is not the way it’s always been, and you have to be cool with that and give

[00:29:00.80] spk_1:
it a try.

[00:29:01.75] spk_5:
Can I just jump in, jump in and just come off the back of the no Yeah, yeah. On anarchism. So polite, right?

[00:29:21.14] spk_1:
No. Yes. You’re not sure what I was? What I was going to say, Maureen, before I was interrupted was e. I could see how clearly. Yes. Take a drink, Nick, please. I can see why your company’s practical wisdom.

[00:29:23.34] spk_4:
Yeah, like

[00:29:30.74] spk_1:
your wisdom for non profit accidental techies. All right. And I saw you checkered with Donald Techie. Okay, so So we’ve gotta persuade our vice president, CEO and board, Maybe. I mean, the board may not be involved in what we do. Ah, fundraising campaign on Facebook or not. But at

[00:29:43.83] spk_4:
least these leaders, you

[00:30:05.28] spk_1:
persuade some people in the chain that we should be focusing on the five people a year who hosted us hosted a fundraiser for us on Facebook. Or it might be more than five, But but not not the 500 who gave at the rate of 100 each to to those to those five fundraisers. Ones who created the campaign’s not the wardens who donated to the campaigns.

[00:30:32.38] spk_4:
Okay, wait a few rooms about Facebook. You know, sometimes people have negative feelings about Facebook and that can you know, dr their business practices and where they’re choosing to invest their time. And what we’re what we’re here to say is Evaluate, evaluate, test it. Is it gonna work for your organization or not? And

[00:30:32.57] spk_1:
it

[00:30:32.68] spk_4:
probably is. So, you know, get ready. Get ready for that

[00:31:05.04] spk_1:
time for our last break. Turn to communications. They’re former journalists. So you get help getting your message through it is possible to be heard through the headlines. They know exactly what to do to build relationships with the journalists that matter to you. They are themselves former journalists. Those great relationships will lead to great coverage. They’re a turn hyphen to not CEO. We’ve got but loads more time for Facebook fundraising data. Nick you not because you interrupted, but Julia said earlier that you had some tools that we can applying here. You want to acquaint us with something?

[00:32:40.83] spk_5:
Yes. So my background as a digital fundraiser, we got into this early when client we saw the problems of the clients were having with data on. We started doing everything like, manually with spreadsheets and reaching out to fund raisers one of their time on Facebook, that kind of thing. And we just decided Look, this is crazy. We’ve got to build a tool to help that fast forward 18 months later, and we’ve got over 100 nonprofits in seven countries using give panel on What we do is we basically help organizations take the power back from Facebook? That’s kind of what we do. Like Facebook are getting a lot out of this, and that’s great. They’ve given us free tools. It’s free to use no platform cost, no technology costs, nor even any credit card fees, Right? So Facebook have given us something great. We know that they benefit, but our job is to leverage that tool as much as we can get a gun and leverage it for their advertising model on to keep them employees happy and like it’s a great thing that they’ve given the world. But it’s upto organizations toe to take the power back. And so we do that by helping how organizations Steward Steward their fundraisers get the data from their fundraisers on do you know, see graphs and dashboards and all that kind of thing. So it’s kind of the missing tool that Facebook haven’t given Facebook’s base books. No interested, necessarily in kind of building the best tool for charities, their customers, the end user on. So they’ll always be a gap where people like me will want to service the non profit. Right? OK, that’s what we

[00:32:43.61] spk_1:
do. Okay. Thank you. Julia party. Your description says how to identify who launches Facebook fundraisers. Is that Is that something that’s difficult to dio Julia?

[00:32:54.64] spk_3:
Yes. So Facebook is not going Teoh tell you when someone launches fundraiser and they’re not going to tell you who has necessarily launched a fundraiser. So you do have If you’re small organization and you’re not using a tech tool like give panel to help you, then you are going to have to figure that out. You’re gonna have to constantly be looking at your fundraisers and constantly trying to figure out and identify where the campaigns are. But that is absolutely crucial even for a small organization to dio to thank people especially, and give them the tools to sort of have already in your maybe on your website toe have a little bit of a tool kit. Maybe it’s a one page document with tips for fundraisers to really elevate their campaigns because we know nobody was born a fundraiser. No one’s born knowing how to fundraise. And if someone’s trying to raise $200 for their birthday, it’s a win win. If they can succeed because they’re gonna feel great and it’s going to be an amazing legacy for them and they’re gonna be really excited, and then you’re gonna build that relationship with them because you helped them. So, yeah,

[00:34:06.96] spk_1:
so how do we identify if we don’t have a tool? How right? Go to Facebook O. R. And find who’s doing this for us.

[00:34:14.09] spk_3:
I’ll turn that over to net cause there’s a couple ways.

[00:34:25.07] spk_5:
Okay? Yes. So Facebook. When you signed up to Facebook giving tools, you get a tab on your fate on your non profit Facebook page that says fundraisers. So you can see fund raisers that have raised more than $50 in that list. The problem is that you over about 70 60 to 70% of your fund raisers don’t reach $50. There’s a lot. There’s a lot of big fundraisers, but there’s also a lot, a lot of small fundraisers.

[00:34:41.89] spk_1:
All right, so you’re not going to capture the smallest ones. You won’t be able to say thank you to them. Maureen, what do we do? Once we have identified the people who have have launched these fundraisers for US

[00:35:35.06] spk_4:
micro appreciation, I’ll use next term. You have to find small ways to recognize and appreciate the effort that these fundraisers air making, no matter how much or how little they’re raising for you. Facebook is the great equalizer in that everybody sort of knows what everybody is doing, and your fundraisers expect it. They expect you to be paying attention. They expect you to thank them and acknowledge them all within the tool, you know? Yeah, you certainly want to try to get enough information and their permission to move them over onto your email list so that they can learn more about your organization. They can be more empowered to fundraise more for your get otherwise involved, but, you know, sending a message. Knicks got a great program where people send a tiny little gift like a like a pin, a piece of swag that in your non profit they have sitting around It’s pennies. Teoh access it a diner to to mail it out, and then that person has a tangible thing that is reinforcing that relationship. They knew that I did it. They took a minute to say thank you. They actually gave me a thank you gift. And so every time an opportunity comes up in my personal life for me to start a fundraiser, I’m gonna go back to that organization and show my loyalty.

[00:36:20.11] spk_1:
And what can we do to encourage these fundraisers, whether it’s birthday or or whatever, How can we? How can we be promoting that idea to To our constituents?

[00:36:34.41] spk_4:
You do have to promote it. Radio promoting Julia, which I

[00:37:28.28] spk_3:
guess you have to be proactive rather than reactive. So sure, setting up the tools and registering for Facebook payments. Make sure you’re you know I’s are dotted and your T’s are crossed and your registered and you have all the tools set up. But it’s just like with the Donate button on websites 5 10 years ago. If you just put it on your website and don’t tell anybody, then you can’t just expect the donations to rolling as much as they could. You really have to be proactive. So advertising it, telling people this is an exciting new way. It’s effective. It’s safe Facebook doesn’t take any fees, kind of dispelling the myths and misconceptions out there around Facebook fundraising showing people examples of other fundraisers that have occurred, giving them the tools like, um, giving them photos, giving them videos, giving them text, explaining to them here the top five things to do when you start a Facebook fundraiser. Here’s what to do when you hit your halfway point but actively encouraging people. I’ve seen it in a welcome email sequence. Actually. Ah, lot of nonprofits. When you sign up for the email issue, make a donation. I’ve seen them encourage you in their little sequence. Say, to make a bigger impact. Would you be interested in setting up a Facebook funders or force? Put something on your website? Put something in your email signature. Do a Facebook live. You know, you really have to look at it as all hands on deck promoting this.

[00:38:06.00] spk_1:
What do we know about the characteristics of people who are most likely to do this? Are they necessarily the under 30?

[00:38:13.12] spk_3:
I don’t know, Nick. You might know that we

[00:38:15.41] spk_5:
we don’t have any demographic information. What we do have is that its acquisition, actually, this isn’t for something for your existing supporters donors as much as it is people who are getting noted, verified a week before on Facebook, a week before their birthday. Hey, do you want to set up a birthday fundraiser? And then they’re searching for breast cancer? They’re searching for arthritis. They’re searching for dunk cap, you know, whatever they want, their passion about what they want to give to. So 90% of our client data From what the studies we’ve done our new to the organization. They’re not people that were already on the database. So this is acquisition and its huge. We have clients that have 30,000 fundraisers a month. I mean, when you get it right, it’s by big.

[00:39:05.70] spk_1:
I’m surprised to hear I’m surprised to hear its acquisition. I didn’t expect that at all. We’re committed donors who thought of you on their birthday. You’re saying they’re thinking that their birthday is coming up and they’re looking for a cause?

[00:39:39.52] spk_5:
Yeah, that’s like So my my wife lost unfortunate, lost her mom to breast cancer two years ago. She wasn’t she just fighting breast cancer and shows the 1st 1 that came up on what we’re seeing is as more nonprofits get on Facebook, the slice of the pie is getting thinner and thinner, so you need to get in early is growing, but so is the adoption. And so organizations that go on it two years ago did very well. It’s not the birthday. Fundraising is slowing down is the fact that actually more organizations are jumping on because they’re seeing how successful it is.

[00:39:46.57] spk_1:
Okay, we’re gonna start to wrap up, Julia. I’m gonna give you ah, a shot and then never go to Maureen for the final. What do you want to leave people with? Maybe how to get started. Whatever final thoughts.

[00:39:59.52] spk_3:
Well, if you’ve not started yet, go to social good dot FB dot com and see if you’re eligible to register. It’s not open in every single country yet. And some tools air open in some countries and some are not. But the very the second thing I would dio is understand that this can Onley augment and enhance what you’re doing. What we’re saying is not to completely replace everything that’s working. I’m not saying Onley to face with fundraising and throw out your direct mail, which is what people are hearing. I think sometimes when I talk, I’m not saying that. I’m saying this is gonna enhance. And like Nick just said, it’s a way to acquire new people that are passionate. That could be even more passionate about your cause. Because everyone’s already on Facebook all day already. You know, there’s millions. Billions of people on Facebook is the leverage, the tools and do the best you can with what you have.

[00:40:55.84] spk_1:
Okay, Marine, would you wrap us up, please?

[00:41:31.71] spk_4:
Sure. Um I would say, Don’t let the perfect get in the way of the good, you know we can. We’re very terrible about snow. Sometimes in non profit culture. We take a really long time to think about things. A really long time to change gears. This is a time for action. Even if the world wasn’t dealing with the pandemic, it is a time for action for nonprofits. Try something having experimental frame. Get buying from your leadership, but try it. Try it. You really have nothing to lose. How’s that?

[00:41:38.24] spk_1:
Would an impassioned plea Yes, that Z from from Kit God, that’s Marine will be off digital strategist and technology coach with practical wisdom for non profit accidental techies. Also, Julia Campbell, The

[00:41:47.02] spk_3:
Penis of your voice over Any time you talk

[00:41:49.93] spk_1:
work what it is. The company right?

[00:41:52.11] spk_4:
It absolutely is

[00:42:10.80] spk_1:
way. Non profit. Accidental techies. Julia Campbell, author, speaker, trainer, author, speaker, teacher and trainer. Well, teachers Train right, Jay Campbell, social marketing and Nick Byrne with Any at the end. Founder and CEO Give Panel Marine and Julia and Nick. Thank you so much for sharing with us.

[00:42:15.43] spk_3:
Thanks, tony. Thank you.

[00:43:41.52] spk_1:
Stay Well, I’m glad we were able to work this out and thank you for being with tony-martignetti non profit radio coverage of the virtual 20 NTC workshops sponsored by Cougar Mountain Software. The Knowledge Fund. Is there complete accounting solution made for non profits tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant Mountain for a free 60 day trial. Thanks so much for being with us next week. The special episode on the racism conversation and more from 20 NTC on the regularly scheduled show. If you missed any part of today’s show, I’d be sent. You find it on tony-martignetti dot com were sponsored by wegner-C.P.As guiding you beyond the numbers wegner-C.P.As dot com. But Cougar Mountain Software Denali Fund is there complete accounting solution made for nonprofits tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant Mountain for a free 60 day trial and my turn to communications, PR and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen two dot ceo Ah, creative producer is clear. Meyer off Sam Liebowitz Managed stream shows Social Media is by Susan Chavez Mark Silverman is our rep guy. This music is by Scots You with me next week for not profit radio Big non profit ideas for the other 95% Go out and be great

Nonprofit Radio for August 30, 2019: Online Major Giving & Online Adversity

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Adam London, Carrie Rice & Anneliese Davis: Online Major Giving
Do you have web forms for your major donors? Our 19NTC panel hashes the pros and cons of automating major giving and—if you decide to expand to online—how to work around the obstacles. They’re Adam London at Project Donor Love; Carrie Rice from Carrie Rice Consulting; and Anneliese Davis with Rahab’s Sisters.




Burt Edwards: Online Adversity
How do you maintain personal and organizational values when people are screaming at you in the social networks? Burt Edwards, our panel of one from 19NTC, shares strategies and systems that keep your staff, supporters and social ambassadors safe when they speak out online. He’s from Friends of the Columbia Gorge.




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Transcript for 455_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190830.mp3 Processed on: 2019-08-31T18:57:44.018Z S3 bucket containing transcription results: transcript.results Link to bucket: s3.console.aws.amazon.com/s3/buckets/transcript.results Path to JSON: 2019…08…455_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190830.mp3.155990547.json Path to text: transcripts/2019/08/455_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190830.txt Hello and welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d suffer the effects of Psycho in Drusus if you hard into me with the idea that you missed today’s show online. Major e-giving. Do you have Web forms for your major donors? Are 19 ntcdinosaur. Hash is the pros and cons of automating major e-giving. And if you decide to expand toe online, how to work around the obstacles there? Adam London at Project Donors of Carry Rice From Carrie Rice Consulting and Annalise Ed Davis with Ray ABS Sisters and online Adversity How do you maintain personal and organizational values when people are screaming at you in the social networks? Bert Edwards, Our panel of one from 19 NTC shares strategies and systems that keep your staff supporters and social ambassador’s safe when they speak out online. He’s from Friends of the Columbia Gorge on Tony’s take to your board’s role in planned e-giving responsive by Wagner CPS Guiding you beyond the numbers wagner cps dot com By koegler Mountain Software Denali fundez. They’re complete accounting solution made for non-profits tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for non-profits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to dot CEO. Here’s online Major e-giving Welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 NTC. You know what that is? It’s a 2019 non-profit technology conference. You know that we’re coming to you from the convention center in Portland, Oregon, and at all of our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at Act Blue Free fund-raising tools to help non-profits make an impact. What you don’t know is that my panel now is seated with me. And they are Adam London carry Rice and Anna Lisa Davis. Adam is founder of Project Donors of Carrie is non-profit consultant carry Rice consulting and Anna Lisa Davis is the executive director at Rehabs Sisters. Welcome altum each of you. Thank you, Tony. Thanks. Thanks for joining us. Your session topic was 21st century major e-giving creating an effective online major gift program. I thought this was interesting. I don’t I don’t see much about online major e-giving program. So that’s what caught my attention to this. Why I invited you to come. I like to start down The end is the person down? The end sometimes feels at least at least part of this, although they’re not. But sometimes they feel so we’re gonna start with Lisa. Um What? What? What are the possibilities? Just like headline over a big, big picture. What are the possibilities here online, Major e-giving. Well, we’re a very small organization that didn’t really start doing fund-raising in an intentional way until I came on board is the first staff member a year and 1/2 ago. And so, working with carry on, Adam, they’ve helped us think creatively about how we engage people online without having a huge development staff or a lot of board members who could go out and talk to Major Gibbs. Okay, So you moved it online or you didn’t move it online. You started it online. We started a major give program is native online. It is okay. And you work with Carrie? I did. Yeah, we did. We do. Absolutely. She did a wonderful board treat for us last year, and then it grew into this project. No surprise, Carrie, uh is this a trend that I’m not aware of. Are you seeing Maur? We arika program. We’re starting. We’re starting the trend. Yes, we It was more like an area where we saw the But there was a hole out there, which was that there are people who, for example, in an in person ask if you let’s say you’ve done all the research, you’re ready to make the ask for 25 $6100 whatever it is that if you then get a pledge from them, you have to go home, get in envoys, right attack, get a return envelope and so forth and do all these things to make the donation. Whereas in this way someone says, Yeah, that’s it. $100,000 sounds great. And you say, Well, if you want, you can fill out this form right now and get your frequent flyer miles right now on your black card, you know, and boom, it’s done. So that was something that people started saying, like, That’s a really good idea on Ben also being able to directly using direct mail or using email to be able to contact people who are major donors in Anna Lisa’s case, they’re just now figuring out what a major donor is and what their capacity is, but figuring out what that number is and then being able to direct people to a different form. It’s not a poor form and a rich form, it’s just an unlisted folk. Are you directly? Yeah. We’ll get to the details. Okay. Adam. What? What? What’s? Ah, Product dahna loves rolling This You have online Major e-giving Also Sure. So project dahna Love is an agency in San Francisco. We design and build custom websites on reporting a Pardon me. Oh, you’re okay. You’re not a non-profit. I’m not a non-profit. Okay? Project dahna love sounds like Okay, Okay. I’m sorry I interrupted you expect so? Yes. We built we design and build custom websites and reporting tools for non-profits. We have a particular interest in donation forms in optimizing and customizing donation forms to make them to get maximum conversions out of them. And we also interested in bringing in modern U ex practices and also leveraging the organization’s data to really improve their fund-raising online. Okay. Okay. Um, so what’s the, uh Well, I guess including for rehab sisters this is This is the beginning of your major gift program. You’ve just been doing fund-raising, you said, for a year and 1/2 for him for amore mature organization that’s got a well established major gift program. And let’s say you know our listeners, Aaron Small, a midsize shop. So let’s say they define a major gift as $10,000. Okay, And of course, they have giving $1000 level. There’s a society for that, etcetera. But they define for their fund-raising major gifts $10,000. Carrie. What would what would be the advantage to looking at an online major gift program for them? What would that look like? Well, the first thing is, we have very passionate and strong views about recurring gifts. So if you were someone who considered yourself prepared to give $10,000 is a one time gift, there’s a pretty good chance that you’re willing to give $1000 a month. So I just raised your gift 20% and now you can split it up into $1000 a month, which fits into your monthly budget. So it’s kind of ah, different way of thinking, but it’s just right right there off the top. By encouraging the recurring gifts on the major for on the form it gives people the opportunity to actually give us give someone a little more. So what’s new then, is that we’re offering someone the opportunity. Thio make a $10,000 gift online. And then I understand we’re trying to convert them to Stainer, but we’re we’re offering higher levels of giving online. That’s crap. In the exhibition, which case over 5000 you’d have to send a check or transfer stock. Exactly. Exactly. And in the case of an organization like rehab sisters, they use a fairly small, less robust donation platform. And so we kind of had to pick. Are we going to encourage one time gifts or we gonna encourage recurring gifts? And so, in this particular case, we chose Onley monthly gifts and to make it on Lee a major gift sustainers level period because that was the best thing to do with the software that was available in this situation. And Elisa, What kind of outcomes are you seeing? What kind of interest are you? Feedback getting any feedback from donors? Well, we’ve just started rolling it out with our supporters. We have been Typically, we’ve had very low, you know, like a $15.20 dollar a month sustainers kind of program on. And now we’re being able to go out and ask folks for us, Would you do $100 a month? We could just click right here and get you signed up. And people like the convenience of being able to do it right then and there. Um, and it just it kind of speed the process along because again, being a one person shop for everything I am, the less follow-up I have two. D’oh! After that particular meeting, the better, much, much better. It’s time for a break. Regular C P A. Is they have a new wagon are on September 10th. Leaders Guide to Understanding, not for profit financials, CEOs, board members, directors You don’t need accounting details that’s not necessary for you, but a realistic and basic understanding of financial statements will boost your decision making. You’ll find it at weinger cps dot com. Quick resource is and upcoming events Now back to online major giving. Adam What? What is your advice around streamlining this process that we’re talking about. Carrie was talking about trying to get recurring gifts. That’s definitely part of it. But the biggest thing probably is segmentation, actually, with all fund-raising segmentation critical, but particularly when we’re talking about major gifts online. Firstly, we want the major gift for more forms to be something that is hidden from the main navigation. So this is something that you are only directing your major givers to via email or doing it in person or by direct mail. Okay, And then what is that? Well, because the first reason is that there’s no very graceful way to have a donation landing page that says, You know, big money Year little money here, Onda. Also, if you have a single donation form that has both very large suggested mounts in the thousands of dollars on more typical 29 2150 that’s a confusing situation for anyone who lands. There is a small donor. Those large amounts might make you think, Well, that’s my $50 gift. Even worth it if they’re asking for $5000 okay. And if you’re at the high end right, you’re feeling like, why am I? Why am I on the same page is the $25 Don’t exactly. Yes. Do they really need this? 5000 different? There are $25. So putting them, making sure that these two populations get into donation forms that are targeted at the amount you expect them to make you see. And then you can also have multiple donation forms. There’s another great aspect off doing this online because if you’re able to segment your don’t know major donors more finally into high high level donors, high mid owners, et cetera, then you can have separate donation forms for each of these segments or separate donation forms for campaign or things like that. Okay, okay, um, from your session description, you you talked about using Is it events? As an in person asked Carry, you were describing? The person asked earlier. What about that events? How does that look? Like so at an event? So let’s say you’re having a reasonably priced, for example, like a gala or something, that 100 t it’s $10 a ticket, Um, and then you have ipads set up around the room and, oh, are you have interns or assistants who are able to go around from table to table and say, You know, instead of filling out this pledge envelope like you’ve seen those pledge envelopes in the middle of the table, please take a pledge of open fill it out. But if someone came up to you and said they’ve got a tablet in here you go. I’m gonna hand it to you right now. And I’m not going to show you the $15 to $75.1. I’m going to show you the Esso We’re going around to the tables. The tables are saying What Anyone What exactly What is that look like? You’re saying what? I would like to make a gift tonight, Right? Exactly. Exactly. And then just say I have a really easy way. And then I like to be somewhat playful for it and say, you know, you could have your frequent flyer miles by tomorrow. Yeah, You know, just just being able to say, like, just do this right here, right now and boom, you’ll get an instant Thank you. That has a photograph and an impact statement. And then I know for rehab sisters, they send ah, hand written, personalized Thank you Card. A little bit later in the future, but they get that instant gratification. All right, So, Annalise, that you’ve done this at events or an event? Not yet. That’s good. Sign. Coming. Coming. Coming up. Okay, okay. They’re just really good at thinking people. I just know that from personal. All right, so then you just So then the person with the was working for the organization, Just asked, how much would you like to donate? Right. So they’re going to show them a major donor level. So again, like, let’s say it’s $200 a person, and so you’ve got on the sheet on the form, you know, 500 a 1025 105,000 and fill in the amount you want. And then they look at that and they can say, What can I give $100? Yes. Can I give a million dollars? Yes, but we’re we’re prepping them. Were prompting them to be thinking OK paid $200 to come here, and I was planning on giving something anyway. And this is like this super super simple way to do it. All right, So if it is ah, $200 a ticket gala. Where would you start the ask string? What would your advice speak? Ah, well, I would say get them drinking. First way to talk about the time I just wear hearing that. Yeah. So 20 and physically, You know, on the donation form, what would you start the ask string with the with the numbers be mount. What amount would you start? No, that’s particularly gonna depend on the whole matter. Ask. Yeah, it is okay. Making me feel like I don’t know what I know I’m feeling. I just I didn’t know. You thought I meant what? Where, like what time in the program. Okay. Yeah, really? You can’t generalize of its $200 ticket. Would you start the ask string up to 50 or 505 100 or something like that? Yeah. Um I mean, we are still in the early stages. We’ve just It’s only been less than a year that we’ve been doing this so we don’t have a huge number to look at me. Oh, yeah. We think it really depends on the organization. And we want to work with the executive director, the development director, maybe even the board to get an idea of what feels like they’re normal. Okay. You want to look at the donation history of the organization to see what kind of major gives that? Got what? The average major can build the US base it more visible on a e-giving history of the organization, like medium givers. Then the ticket price. Okay, Okay. I take the simple minded approach. See, my fund-raising is all the consulting out. It was all planned e-giving So we’re not talking about these events, you know? We’re not gonna sign your way. Have an attorney in the corner preparing wills or way Do it through legalzoom if you want. You know you can, you know. So I’m not doing event based play e-giving fund-raising. Right? But on the major gift form, there could be a little box there that says I am interested for sure, Absolutely. But I’m you know, I’m not running fund-raising at events as planned giving, but I’m not saying Of course, I I’m the evangelist for plan giving with that without the religious overtones. I mean, I’m always put it on your envelope flaps. Put on your business cards. Put in your email signature included in your will ask how? Yes. Absolutely Another great point about these. I guess. I was just trying to justify myself minded suggestion of basing it on the ticket price. Okay, Go ahead. Adam. I’m sorry. Yeah. I wanted to say another great point about doing this online is that you can also integrate these online forms into a more traditional major gift. Ask situation. Living room. Explain that. Oh, yes. So you could make the couple has decided No point in waiting. Exactly. Like if you’re online form works well with mobile devices, which you definitely should do. Then you can bring a tablet to a meeting with major donor. Sure. And then when they’re ready to make the donation instead of writing the check or getting a promise to make a donation, you can actually have them get the credit card to make the donation, right? Would you like to do it right now? No pressure, exactly. But if you like, we could We could do it right now. And you can have your frequent flyer miles tomorrow. And I think that free and Elisa, that’s gonna end up being a good fit for your board members. For example, Yes, absolutely. Um and Adam, I was I was thinking about in my previous life before I did grassroots non-profits and I did a large asks from major donors up. I had one asks situation where the CEO insisted that after the person who made the $100,000 commitment, she had to get their credit card right then and the only thing I had in my purse was a valet ticket. And so we wrote her credit card for $100,000 gift with the back of a valet ticket. And so this approach altum sophisticated, sophisticated, secure, right, right. That’s an interesting policy, CEO Yu, That is not a little pressure for ah, gift officer. You you have to get the credit card. She was She was closer. She was all right. She is a bold woman. Thanks for your commitment. Let’s do it right now. I mean, I’m saying, let’s offer to do it right. Rather not use our tablet. You’re welcome to mail you a check or we never even pull out the tablet in the first place because you just know that that’s not the right person based on the conversation, even still in their eighties. And they’ve already told you three times that they never made a single purchase online. They’re certainly not gonna make their $50,000 gift. Exactly your tablet. Okay, of course. Okay, uh, we’re all learning here. I’m trainable. Treatable. Um, let’s see the event. That’s really interesting about the events. Um, you also talked about how to create the forms. Adam, any more advice on the you can share on the details of the form I love. Of course. I love the plant Giving checkoff. Sure. So thank you for that. As I said, segmentation is key to this. You want to have a separate home for the major gift form and then ideally have different major gift forms, different giving levels or different segments that you’ve identified within your major donors? You definitely, especially on a major gift for model. Give formers, Really? But these sort of things become more important as the money goes up. You want to form to look like the rest of your organization’s website. That’s a place where a lot of non-profit forms. Unfortunately, full down is you’ll find a great, well designed website, good information, easy to navigate and then you reach the donation form and it looks nothing like the rest of the site. It’s a default site. It’s a default donation form for whatever vendor they have for their online donation. For so finding an online donation form that you can make it look like your sight. We can get a CZ much control as you can. Over what information you’re asking. Four. So you’re not asking, you know, forcing people to enter the phone number, for example. Things like that. Yes. You want to control, You want it to look like a form. And you definitely wanted to work well on mobile devices. Yeah, we’re past the mobile mobile mobile optimization discussion. Oh, yes. We just know that everything everything, including your donation form and needs to be optimized for a tablet and phone. OK, we’re past that. Oh, yes. We still but we still have to bring it up. We start, we do have to bring it up. Unfortunately, yeah, we still dumpster full way still remind people that over 50% of peep people today are using mobile first, so it’s only gonna go up from here. It’s not going to go down. Okay? Okay, and at least I’m feeling bad about you over there. But you don’t. You don’t have a lot of experience just rolling this out. So, uh, what do you Anything you wanna say that is related to what, Uh, Adam and Carrie, You’re saying, uh, you want to contribute? I mean, just beyond. From what? We were just talking about it for a small shop, Something like this is a really handy tool toe, have. Like I said, you don’t have to worry about doing as much follow-up. And you’ve got something in your back pocket. You can pull up and you don’t have to use a valet ticket. So wrinkled valet ticket. It’s a good point is you don’t necessarily need to have a huge budget to get started with this. Very good. That’s implicit in what we’re saying. Yes, we identify rehabs as one employee. No, but thank you for making one and 1/2 now, right? Oh, no. Technically, we’re both part times 11 tone. Oh, yeah. All right. So But thank you for making explicit Adam. Absolutely right. This is ideal for small shops, right? There’s a lot of online donation tools that do have reasonable donation forms that you can work with to integrate NTS site, make it look reasonably like inside and then use those to get started with. Of course, you know, spending more money lets you have more flexibility in terms of what the form is ensuring into personalization for each individual, which could be very powerful. And what Adam was saying earlier about where you send people online because our support has typically come from volunteers who give very small amounts transition we’ve gone through now where we’re going out into the community and getting much larger gifts. Volunteers. I’ve been really worried about how volunteers are gonna feel like, Is there $15 gift not valued anymore? That’s if they see all these hyre options. Statham’s point of having segmentation of dahna donation forms so that one caps out at 7500 right? Okay. In the ask string. Yes, I was I was implicitly It was implied that I didn’t know what I was talking about. Uh, obstacles. You have a little discussion about obstacles, challenges to this on how to overcome them. Carry well, having having had the opportunity to work with Anna Lisa and her board as it was going through a transition, and a new board was coming on where there were, in particular people who were coming on that had a lot of non-profit experience. We having the board’s support for something like this when it was very possible when we proposed this to Anna Lisa that her board could have said like, What do we need for with a major gift form? We’ve only been, you know, But she has an incredibly supportive board. And so, making sure that you have boards support and that they understand why you’re bothering to do this is a key component of it. It’s not just about the staff and the donors being happy, but it’s also about making sure that, well, that that everybody gets it and that the board supports it. What would you say it was? Your, uh, we’re putting you in hypothetical. Now you’re in a board meeting, and, uh, they’re saying exactly, that would mean online donations, for we have meetings. We have. We have We have two little bigger organization. We have, uh, we have two full time fundraisers. What we eat online donation form forward. Who’s this consultant who brought this consultant to this meeting, right? Exactly. Don’t go that far. Yeah, well, yeah. No e. Everybody is grateful for consultant. Why would anybody about a consultant, But just not to your face. What would you say to that room? Reluctant board. I would say this is the in the improv. The yes, and you know, this is Yeah. Everything you’re doing is great. We’re not telling you to do anything different. We’re just giving you an additional tool to use. And so if, for example, I were stewarding someone and things have been going really well and I’m ready to send them an email solicitation that I can put the hyperlink to the major gift form. Same thing with a direct mail piece. Same thing with a conversation, whatever. But I can. I can build that as being a norm for those donors, but it’s really up to the officer of how they’re going to use it again. Annalise doesn’t have the opportunity to have someone who’s going to be dedicated to using this, but she also she’s very sophisticated with her online users, so she’s gonna be ableto go in and change. The amounts are at another form or do those kinds of things on her own on Dhe. And then if she ends up with a development director and in the not too distant future, then that person can say, OK, wow, amazing. This organization already has this tool set up for me. I’m gonna see where it’s appropriate to use it to persuade the board that is just another tool and uses that at their discretion when the relationship is right or the boardmember right? Yeah, I also hear that it’s a future facing thing that this I think that online major fund-raising is going to be more and more standard as time goes on. I mean, where were based in San Francisco. There are plenty of young households with an income over 300,000 who don’t really use checks for anything. Yeah, so there’s plenty of people out there who are willing to make major gifts online for cash using cash either. But you’re right that as they mature, it’s gonna it’s just gonna that trend is just gonna continue. Yeah, I was with somebody, uh, they were nephew and niece, probably under 30 at the time, and we were coming back from a restaurant and they were locked out of their apartment. And the building owner sent the representative. But it was late, So there was a $50 service charge t open the lock, and neither one of them had the cash and they couldn’t, and they got into the apartment, you know, he did let them in and they couldn’t find their checkbook. I mean, I know exactly where my checkbook is, and I always carry cash. But neither one of them had either have to fry 50 bucks for the surface for the midnight service call to get them into their apartment, to not find cash or a cheque book inside that couldn’t find it dollars back? Uh, no, that’s still a point of contention. And as a result, I did not send a birthday gift this year. Um, don’t Don’t mess with me. I bailed him out. If it hadn’t been for me, the guy would not have let them in. What they have done, gone to an A t. M. Maybe they couldn’t find the debit card. They couldn’t find the checkbook for guns. And I know exactly where my checkbook in my top dresser drawer. Right, But um, you know, if you had a, uh, habit If that vendor if that the person that was sent out had the square, then they could take the person’s credit. Unsophisticated. That’s where things were going is that I want to be able Thio Just go on my phone and be like, 0 $50 to Tony, $50 Bhuvan, you know, And so why not take that to these other levels of? It’s just that’s how they’re used to doing things, you know, they go on Amazon and, you know, uh, Adam and I were interviewing someone. At one point he was talking about how she walks around her house with her phone, and when she notices that she needs something, she literally just goes on. Amazon places in order. And then later in the day, she’ll place another order like it’s just it’s her pendant. She just orders things one at a time. So why not make donating that easy to, you know, as close to an e commerce site as possible without being an e commerce site? Unless you’re like you, said one of the enterprise sized non-profits, who really can make this a robust program and as rehab sisters grows, you know, they’re looking at their own donor-centric management software and saying, Oh, well, this has certain limitations on it. As we grow, we can change products and find something that’s gonna allow the monthly gifts and the the onetime gifts in a way that works best. Yeah, All right, You know what? That’s Ah, perfect wrap. That’s a perfect conclusion. We’re gonna leave it. There they are. Adam London, founder of ah, Project Donor Love, which is not a non-profit sultan. See, Thank you. Carry Rice non-profits, Consultant also carry rice Consulting and Anna Lisa Davis, the executive director of Rehabs Sisters, thanks to each of you. Thank you so much. You’re welcome. And thank you for being with Tony martignetti non-profit Radio coverage of 19 NTC. All of our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools help non-profits make an impact. We need to take a break. Cougar Mountain Software Here’s a quote We use Denali Fund for non-profits. It’s easy to track how much is in each fund. That’s fairly simple to use and the training is very helpful and thorough. Customer service has been responsive and caring. That’s Laurie D. From a church and also a quote all the features of a sophisticated fund accounting system at a reasonable cost. That’s Kim T. From Lawrence Township, and this is all about Cougar Mountain software. They have a free 60 day trial on the listener landing page at tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain. Now, time for Tony. Stick to your board’s role in planned e-giving. Um, there is a video on this, of course, as there is, uh, there are all the all the critical subjects facing mankind. I’ve got a video on all of them and this the week it’s your boards, giving in your boards role in planned e-giving steps up at first. Um, first blush, let’s say, um, their own personal gif ts They need to be committed to the organization to the extent that they included include your organization in their will or some other state plan. And that’s reasonable to expect because they are your highest level volunteers. There you’re insiders there fiduciaries if legal duties to your organization and, um, their duties go beyond legal, including fund-raising support, and how can they ask others if they haven’t done it themselves, and that’s one of the other roles that they can fill. Once they have included you in their state plan, then they could be asking others their peers on the board, other volunteers, major donors. They could be encouraging other planned GIF ts from those folks hosting events, introducing you to other people. They could combine those that could host an event in their home and invite some of their friends to find out about more about your organization. There’s a lot that you’re bored can do around planned e-giving, and you find me, uh, saying more about it, flushing it out on my video, your boards rolling. Planned e-giving and that’s at tony martignetti dot com. That is Tony’s Take two now online adversity. Welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 NTC. You know that’s the 2019 non-profit Technology Conference in Portland, Oregon, at the Convention Center on day three of the Conference three like gum in puberty and all of our 1990 see interviews are brought to you by our partners. That act Blue Free fund-raising tools to help non-profits make an impact with me is Bert Edwards, He’s communications director at Friends of the Columbia Gorge. Burt, Welcome. Thanks. Tony is great to be here. It’s good to have you back. Thank you. We think it was We think it was about three years ago. It ntcdinosaur? Yeah. San Jose Sense sense in San Antonio was sent. No sandals. I’ve got my hands. Okay. Okay. It was That was either 15 or 16. We’re not sure. All right. It’s good to have you back. Uh, you’re session this year is Social Security combating fake news, triaging twitter, trolls and dealing with digital distractions. A lot of injuries. I start out. Why do we need this session? I don’t think we need to think. Well, well, I’ll give you well, Put it this way. What do you feel like? Non-profits. Need to know that they don’t about managing trolls and digital distractions. Well, there’s actually a interesting background history for how this panel came to be. And so this panel was one of a couple panels that the end tem team had picked out as a community session as far as a topic that they wanted Thio speak about, uh and so I ended up getting in contact with Amy and ash and, uh, worked with them to kind of put together the concept. They actually connected me with my first panelist, Ken Montenegro, whose on the End 10 board and then can we were kind of fine time for include tuning, so to speak, the topic because we really want to make a discussion. He suggested that we reach out to actually the keynote speaker idiot who was able to join us. So it really kind of came together as, ah, community topic. And it’s something, sadly, that all non-profits they’re dealing with these days we’re gonna talk about how to keep your staff, your supporters and social ambassador’s safe. When they’re talking about your organization online, where they’re putting themselves out as the face of the organization, how do they stay safe? Um, and then you had a group exercise to What was that? So basically, instead of eso when Kenan mediating and I were chatting instead of ah, doing power point, we decided we really want to have a discussion with the audience. And as we don’t have ah, we wish we did have a magic box that we could give her everyone to deal with trolls and digital distracters these days, we thought instead, we share some lessons that we’ve learned and then have a discussion for people to share other things and have a conversation. Um, so that overall was the challenge. So the first exercise we did was I actually walked through an example, something that happened to me, which was a case of every day you come into work on one of my colleagues came to us with our social listening report, and all of a sudden someone was tweeting at us and accusing us of stealing a photo online. They hadn’t e mailed to reach out that we had bought the photo inappropriately off him. They were just calling us and our CEO of photo geever. And they started then tagging media out, saying that this organization and this person stole our photo. Um, and that and so actually I talked a little bit about the situation I then asked. We then had a discussion with members are argast as far as how they would have handled. It was interesting. I got some suggestions for what we ended up from, actually, some things that we didn’t end up doing, but it would be interesting to try. Well, that’s all flush out a little bit. So what? Well, first, what did you do? What did you do? We? Well, what we did was after we looked into it. What it turns out is that the photo we had bought was from 1/3 party photo vendor. The photographer at some point had had a falling out with, and I don’t remember the outlet, and I won’t. I won’t use their name. Sure. At some point, she had had a falling out with that group. She had taken her photos down. And so all of the organization, because there was a number of non-profits. Our non-profit had bought that photo to do some work on Syria, and they were the number non-profits had bought that photo. She either did a similar thing as far as kind of threatening them on Twitter. Or she’s kind of set, like, kind of a legalistic sort of Ah, season desist. Yeah, yeah. Um So we tried to find a way to actually engage the person in a conversation that we didn’t have a contact information. We sent them a GM. They did not respond. So at that point, I came up with two plans. One was We decide to go ahead and take the photos down, because when we take photos, even though we had about the photos legally, But we take that very seriously, Andi, that we couldn’t engage with the dialogue with the person that was that was the least passive resistance. And as the alternative, what I had prepared to do was to engage her on my personal Twitter account so I could deal it, escalate the situation as far as it wasn’t our institutional social media accounts and her and said it would be metoo communications director talking thio this unhappy for did she end up engaging with you as an individual? Well, actually, when we took the photos down, she thank the New York Times. Although the New York Times didn’t contact us about stealing on her photos, Um, and then she stopped. So I didn’t have to face-to-face D’oh! Okay, Okay. What were some of the suggestions you got in the session? How to deal with it? You know, we got a really interesting suggestion that I didn’t think of it, and someone suggested that we should have taken a photo of the receipt that we had and put a note on Twitter saying, Hey, we’re sorry that you’re concerned we actually bought this legally. Here’s the receipt and that’s interesting approach might have been kind of antagonistic. A cz um, her tweets were fairly hostile, so it might have worked. Come. It’s hard to say whether that would have egged her on the other challenges. It was consuming a lot of our time, okay? And that was one thing that we had were after is an issue. Even if you’re in the right, it may just be easier to fold. It’s not. It’s not that big a deal. Maybe it’s not worth fighting a battle over. Exactly. And that was one of things that we talked about at at the session is when do you make that make make that judgment call? Because I mean, like, for me, it’s like I really want to protect my staff of my colleagues, Um and so being accused of wrongly steal a photo for me, I took very seriously and also photo rights. I mean, I also take really seriously, but in this case it was consuming a lot of bad with knowing me. But the personnel manager social media accounts. And that was something again. We discussed this faras while you might want to fight, it distracts you from your mission. And so, in this case, making making the situation go away so we could get back to our work. I wonder if it’s worth saying Thio tweeting that, uh, wait, We’re out of respect for the photographer. We’re taking the question of question about photograph down. But we want our supporters. We want you to know that we did legally buy it. I don’t know if at that point you would put a photo of the receipt, the invoice paid invoice, whatever, or just say we have a paid invoice. But in the interest of fairness and whatever, you know, we’re just gonna We’re just gonna fold it. We’re just gonna take the photo down. But we want you all to know that the accusation is not right. I like that approach because it’s very transparent for your other users who might be on wondering about what aboutthe presumption is. If they take it down, then they’re in the wrong right? So you’re saying No, that’s not the case. We’re willing to take it down out of just simplicity and fairness. But we’re not. We’re not in the wrong here. Exactly. Another thing about your approach is that I, like is also is a chance for us organization to restate your values, which is a photography rights is really important. Electoral property is a treasure exactly and way don’t violate that way. Have a receipt if anyone wants to see it. Well, you know, the mos or something like that. We have an invoice. Okay. Eventually, I said we could learn. We learn from the crowd. Of course. Um what else? What else? Uh, what other types of situations did you talk about? Our might non-profits encounter? You know, one thing that came up that was interesting. This is hard for me. It’s a communications director, but one of my co panelists brought up the point that, you know, sometimes you might need to push back on your communication staff or have a dialogue about Why are we Why do we want to broadcast this information as sometimes? Maybe there’s a reason that point information out and and sometimes not. And she was talking about. So here’s an example. When she was when she was talking. It made me think back from from the past. So when I was working at the US Institute of Peace, I remember we were meeting with our colleagues in the religion in Peacemaking Initiative, and they were doing some really great work on D. U S Institute. He’s being a taxpayer funded in front organization, and it was really important for the public know what they’re doing with the taxpayer dollars. And so we’re trying to come up with ways to put out more information about what what the religion priest make initiative was doing the challenges. A lot of the facilitation is that they were doing overseas the people in the participants who would come those inter religious sorts of conversations. Often they would come at their own personal risk. And so we were chatting with our colleagues in one of our colleagues, said, I understand, and I agree. We need to talk more about the work that we do. But if we accidentally, for instance, talk about put the participants of a recent workshop that they had had in Nigeria, those participants and even parts of their family’s lives could be at risk, and the outreach value, you just isn’t worth it. And so that was actually a good conversation that we had with the program stuff. I mean, we were able to come up with a middle ground on one of those being that we would have a conversation and some things that they did. We’re just too sensitive. And even though it would be great to talk about them, we just wouldn’t know the risk that we made a mistake. And then someone got hurt because he never want that to happen. And so that was one thing that came up. And I thought that was a good conversation as Faras again engaging your communications and outreach people to think about what you’re putting out and why, and if you really need to put it out there or not, how about from the audience? Did, uh, did, um, challenges arise or situations arise from the audience that you remember that you can share? Yeah, there was an interesting question that came up. Um, I’ve encountered this a little bit as well, and it was a challenge about when you’re working in a coalition or with partners with other non-profits, and it’s a sensitive issue and or you may have information about services or constituents that’s sensitive. How do you deal with that? Particular Because Or Tasers have different levels of mean. Non-profit will be vastly different size and resource is on. They might have different approaches. Thio. How they deal with with privacy and or And that was that was interesting conversation that one member of the audience raised because it was something they were dealing with, and they just kind of want to talk through it. And so that was nice for that person. Will that kind of talk about what they were going through? Not only the panelist, but other folks and nines were able to offer some thoughts and suggestions. So where did you hear What are some of the suggestions? Well, actually, that I want listeners toe learn from learn from what you learned. Well, actually, it was interesting. That was partly where this where we went into discussion about thinking about what information you need to put out. Uh, there were several suggestions that members the lions had, as faras secure systems that you can use Thio thio trade information as far as if it’s sensitive, not necessarily using the normally mall or even, for instance, Google docks are very popular within the non-profit community. But that type of information is probably bad for a Google doc, because it’s really hard. I don’t know exactly who has access to a Google doc s o. We talked about some obscure ways, Thio to trade information, which and share information which I thought were useless. Um, and some services people actually exchanged business cards so they could give information to each other. Um, offline. So why do you say that about Google docks? It’s it’s hard to know who who has access to it. What’s the concern there? I think the challenge with Google docks and we use that a lot is I mean, once the link is out, I mean often is in a way, I was gonna share. You don’t know who’s okay. Yeah. Okay. So just making sure that your partners are having the same sort of care for the sensitivity and protection of your data that you are a time for our last break Turn to communications, PR and content for your non-profit. They help you tell your compelling stories get media attention on those stories and build support for your mission. They’re into media relations, content, marketing, communications and marketing strategy and branding strategy. You’ll find them at turn hyphen to dot C E o. We’ve got butt loads. More time for online adversity. We still have a good amount of time together. Burghdoff. So what else? Uh, what? Uh, I’m hoping there are other situations and how they got resolved or what the discussion points were around them. That people suggestions that people had another. You got another situation? Yeah. Um, so one situation that was that was discussed. Waas Ah, there was a participant that noted that they had a challenge with having their social media feeds actually being mined and that information being used against them. So they went they actually had folks that looked at their personal Facebook and Twitter accounts on dhe, then use the information to insinuate themselves into their circles and actually did some things that were disrupted in regards Thio. They would have people sometimes show up at events that they found out their social media. Um and, um, that would reach out to people to be other people. Yeah, these imposters was that it was not asking the name of the organization, but was at a high profile organization that did some kind of provocative, controversial work that that they’re their individual members of the staff would be stalked like that. So the person in that case was working on a pretty controversial issue. Um, that was in the news. So I won’t I won’t say which justifies the action, but I’m trying to figure out what the motivation is. Just embarrassment trying embarrass somebody who stands for something that the stalker disagrees with. Cancerversary. Okay, They really were looking to disrupt the work that that person was doing on Ben and the tire network. And frankly, frankly, that throw them off. So but it was really on the ground. Everybody organizing work. So, um, which which made that even more challenging, Cause I mean, you’re out in the field, and all of a sudden you have this disruption of Yeah, Who is this person? So what the organization do, or what was the conversation around it? Well, that was interesting, because one of things that that person had taken away from the experiences eso es. They’re more careful about, um about what they put out on social media. So, for instance, I mean, personally, personally, right? So the consciousness that raised their much more careful what they personally put out on social media, they’re much more careful now in regards Thio, if they’re working on a, uh, organizing or Abssi activity overseas, as far as even just noting that they’re gonna be over there just even a casual, you know him at this diner, that sort of a photo that that sort of checking to make sure, for instance, gee, attacking is off when they’re taking that when they’re taking photos. Um, so it really changed the weather. That person kind of relates to social media, and that was someone who had really grown up, as far as you know, being an active social media users. Faras I come here with my friends and we’re having this. We’re hanging out here, we’re going to be there. I mean, that really changed the way that they they interacted. Just gonna walk in through that. Well, it doesn’t have to be circumspect about their own Facebook and Instagram posts. Tweets you had a part of the session was strategies for keeping your staff your volunteers safe. So maybe think of Ji attacking, having them in their personal posts turn Geo tagging off. What else? What other strategies you got for keeping us all safe? You know, one thing that we talked about and we did a little better serve a cause. I mean, most organizations have, like, a social media policy that kind of think about how you talk on social media. One thing a lot of organised don’t have. Although when we did a survey of surprised more Cokes did have it is having a policy in place, eh? So that if you have a member of your staff that is being harassed because of who they are on social media, So, for instance, this is had walked through our CEO at my last job because we had a lot of experts that spoke out on a lot of issues in regards to humanitarian and development that could be controversial. Um, and if one of our experts was out speaking, and all of a sudden they were personally attacked, even maybe docks and I just kind of walked our CFO. So what could we do? As far as what we’ve prepared as faras if they need like personal security to be able to help them out, or if they might need to. Stella stay in a hotel room for a couple of days. It’s like they’re just walking through some scenarios, hopefully things that would never happen. But when those things happen, things start moving really quickly. So having like actually HR policies to support, like your staff, they’re speaking on social media because if you’re asking your staff to go and put themselves out there, they’re they’re both speaking their personal capacity. But they’re also there a za person. You just need to make sure that they’re that they’re taking care of. So we talked a little bit about that. I was actually what were some of the policies that came out of this? I was really surprised to see how many non-profits I have actually thought about that. I think that’s interesting difference between from now and a couple of years ago when I had talked with colleagues and most folks didn’t have that, um, and a number of folks ice that that actually their admin in HR people. They either it had, like practices or plans in place to be oppcoll Thio help folks out. Um, and that’s where some of those practices of this practice get the detail. We drill down to the details. Yeah, I think so. So one of them actually is making sure it’s over. Example. When we’re talking about a security issue well, making sure that there’s actually like an emergency fund that you could dip into that sort of a case emergency fund your person is working remote e-giving on. But there’s there’s access to cash for an emergency. Well, even the organization as faras if if someone has a personal security problem that there’s that there’s a fun that you could tap into the organization level, right? Okay, right, because, I mean, you can have the policies that, for example, like if, like if a staff member get stocks and that you’ll put them up in a hotel, etcetera, etcetera. But if you don’t actually squirrel away like an emergency fund, a rainy day fund at your organization, so when that happens, you actually can’t pay for the hood. The motel may need a new car, a different car for the time being in a new place to live temporarily. So making sure that the money the money that the money is actually there. And that was one thing hearing from folks that organizations are moving to that next step. Um, some organizations are actually so a lot of humanitarian rittereiser will have a security team that will work with people on on security trainings. And some of those organizations have now started doing Social Media’s security training, which I think is a prudent thing to do. Yeah, so it was positive Thio here that, um so there’s actually been a lot more progress than over the past couple years. Then I might have imagined, just from consciousness has been raised. There’s a lot of headlines on dhe, particularly the organizations that are provocative, doing controversial work. They know they’re at risk, you know, they’re they’re staff is at risk. And the volunteers, I mean, a centrist. In fact, I was doing a little research before the panel. So the Pew Research Center did a study in 2017 and four out of 10 adults have they found, have experienced some sort of online harassment. And if you look at folks 18 to 29 the number jumps up to 67%. Holy cow, 2/3. 2/3 of some kind on Hein harassment attacks from 18 to 29. Yeah, that’s that’s amazing. And so that’s why my God, everybody, that you’re growing up with it now. It’s like the tooth fairy. All right, Um, that was another 67 minutes together. You got any more hope? You do. You know the story or policy you mentioned hr. But also PR session describing Talk about PR policies. What you got for? Yeah, Speaking on the communication side, I think, and like with the photo example that we talked about coming up with ways to be transparent, but also to try the de escalate, uh, questions and again, thinking about one thing as far as if you’re gonna talk about something, can you talk about it after the event or the activity has occurred. So that way your folks air out of whatever activity or if they’re overseas, that there in his own unconference actually out of the zone of conflict, and then they talk about Okay, so that’s that’s one thing to think about on the on the communication side. I’m having a so have assisting have for social listening is super important. These days so you can get information real time. I recommend most organizations to no only track your key channels. But if you have colleagues that air speaking in a professional capacity or semi professional capacity just to keep an eye on again just in case something happens that way, you’re able to zsystems situations online can estimate really quickly. It’s been out of control within a couple of minutes. Come closer to the Mike Burns. Thank you. Yeah, I think another thing to keep in mind is when you’re listening, yeah, doing they’re listening And then keep in mind like the old philosophy is don’t put anything, don’t post anything that you don’t want to see in the New York Times. Yeah, if you want to see it as a headline, he don’t post it in here. I mean, one thing that I think a lot of folks forget is that remember the press really probably won’t call you beforehand before like grabbing skin grabs and running because we’ll just assume that it’s, uh, for general attribution. So so that’s so as an as an example for folks that actively worked for the press is just good for them to keep in mind and do, like a little bit of training. So, as example, a couple years ago, when I was living in Virginia, I was having a hard time because I owed the state of Virginia $1 income tax, your scofflaw troublemaker and the system. How is the state can operate without your dollar? Well, exactly. And the system is not set up online to pay $1. Okay, It was driving me nuts as far as I was. Like, I would drive down the Richmond, but it would cost me more and gas. And I was gonna like post on social media. How frustrated. I could just send a check. Well, ultimately, I did send the check because I called the apartment revenue. Uh, ultimately, like checking the stamp was the easiest way to do it, cause even they were confounded. And there was a point when I was so frustrated, almost like, put some post on social media about how ironic and funny that I really want to pay my $1 for the Commonwealth of Virginia. But the system set up, so you really can’t. Okay, Who wants to be delinquent for tax for $1. But then I realized I have a number reporters that followed me professionally and probably my place of work really doesn’t really want that to be in, like, a news story on so that the case is far. Is this kind of You just have to be slightly careful in anything you put on social media courses. It’s this kind of public works. So it’s good to have just swallowed that one that you pay your dollar. I did all right. But I did. Thank you, but I don’t live in Virginia, but I traveled. Virginia, I traveled 95 virgin. So next, no storm will be grateful. But the plow is there on gasped Onda, the driver behind the wheel of courtesy thanks to your dollar doing doing the right thing. Yeah, I want this in the penny rolls. But I thought that costume or in FedEx, you wanted to give a little stick to it. All right, I see. Um, tell us one more story. We got about another two minutes or so. Yeah, so, actually, this is gonna go back into the wayback machine on, and this is kind of early story, but this is an example with PR. But one of those strange days that you know, your computer wasn’t working. And so I went to my colleagues on the I t t. These aren’t so strange anymore. Sometimes I wonder extreme, which is which happens more often. Andan they looked on the server, and they actually like this is you have actually have a real problem. They were So they were recited on. And so they started playing around service and okay. And now we wait, what? The issue is, um, problem server. You had a bunch of e mails backed up. Now you should be good. Unfortunately, I then started getting a flood of emails, Um, and all in French, or at least 95% of them in French, um, went back to the times like, Oh, my God, what’s happening? So they went back and changed what? They changed on the server. And I don’t have to speak French. Fortunately, like I took Spanish and Japanese and high school in college. But I had colleagues that did who told me I probably wouldn’t have one to read most of the e mails. And so what it turned out was was that, um we were going to be having an event in a couple of weeks and bringing a leader from Africa. I won’t say which one who is quite controversial s. Oh, my email box had been targeted by Abasi campaign, and my colleagues on the I T team found it as they were talking about this new tool about the date myself that they thought they could find that solution in the new tools Google. All right. And But that was a That was an interesting case, as far as it was just It was a French advocacy group that was opposed to the speaker. You’re gonna be having a driven. And I was doing and I was press lead on the event, so they had targeted my evil boss. So, um, so that was that was interested. You handle it? Well, it was you. You talk back to these people, do you engage them? You try or we didn’t, uh, in that case, I mean what we came up with A So we posted something on our website explaining why we hadn’t invited the person why we thought dialogue was important. Uh um I mean, back in those days early like way. Still working on making it a lot by fax a Zara’s with the press. So put in a statement on the website was the easiest thing to do because it wasn’t like one good distribution point. We didn’t. But we did add a note into our email newsletter again, that kind of going a longer point in the newsletter, explaining this is why we hadn’t invited this person. This is why we think it’s important from speak. We understand people disagree, but we encourage you to come. But that’s a case also, where I was seeing the number of emails that they got that I got to say that they ended up getting in and getting more security for the We had no problems. Way did have some protesters that came and spoke out, but I mean, that’s actually was good. That was a dialogue that we really want wanted to have. Okay, properly managed. It can become an opportunity. All right, we’re gonna leave it there. He’s Bird Edwards, communications director at Friends of the Columbia Gorge on this is Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 NTC 2019 non-profit Technology Conference, all each of our 2019 interviews is brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools to help non-profits Make an Impact Thanks so much for being with us next week. New Power With Henry Timms If you missed any part of today’s show, I beseech you find it on tony. Martignetti dot com were sponsored by witnessed e. P. A. Is guiding you beyond the numbers. Regular cps dot com By koegler mathos Software Denali fundez They’re complete accounting solution made for non-profits tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for non-profits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to dot c e o our creative producers. Claire Meyerhoff. Sam Liebowitz is the line producer. Shows Social Media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our Web guy, and this music is by Scotts. Dine with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit Ideas for the other 95% go out and be great. You’re listening to the Talking Alternate network. You’re listening to the Talking Alternative Network. Are you stuck in a rut? Negative thoughts, feelings and conversations got you down Hi, I’m nor in Sumpter potentially ater. Tune in every Tuesday at 9 to 10 p.m. Eastern time and listen for new ideas on my show yawned potential Live Life your way on talk radio dot N Y C. I’m the aptly named host of Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other 95% fund-raising board relations, social media. My guests and I cover everything that small and midsize shops struggle with. If you have big dreams and a small budget, you have a home at Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Friday’s 1 to 2 Eastern at talking alternative dot com. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking store business. Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested? Simply email at info at talking alternative dot com Are you a conscious co creator? Are you on a quest to raise your vibration and your consciousness? Sam Liebowitz, your conscious consultant and on my show, the conscious consultant, our awakening humanity. 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Nonprofit Radio for October 26, 2018: HTTPS & Does Your Website Suppress Giving?

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Ben Byrne & Katherine White: HTTPS
Do you need the security of HTTPS for your website and how easy is it to start implementation? Probably and quite. Our panel is Ben Byrne with Cornershop Creative and Katherine White from Kanopi Studios. (Recorded at #18NTC, the Nonprofit Technology Conference.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

Rachel Clemens: Does Your Website Suppress Giving?
Rachel Clemens is concerned that your website is holding you back from raising all the money you can. Are you confusing donors? Overloading them? She’s chief marketing officer at Mighty Citizen. (Also recorded at the Nonprofit Technology Conference.) It’s website day!

 

 

 

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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, i’m glad you’re with me. I’d be hit with strep. Oh, simba, leah if i had to read that you missed today’s show working virtual we talk through the issues encountered when managing remote staff technological, generational, emotional measurement, recruiting and retaining. Our panel is heather martin from inter faith family and alice hendricks with jackson river. I was recorded at eighteen ntcdinosaur non-profit technology conference and map your data to your audiences. Feed your folks the data they crave. Courtney clarke and david mask arena have identified five audience types and their data needs she’s with forum one and he’s fromthe conrad and hilton foundation that’s also recorded at eighteen. Auntie si, tony, take two who’s on first, we’re sponsored by pursuant full service fund-raising david driven and technology enabled tony dahna slash pursuant capital p well, you see, piela is guiding you beyond the numbers. Wagner, cps dot com bye! Tell us attorney credit card processing into your passive revenue stream. Tony dahna slash tony tell us and by text to give mobile donations made. Easy text npr to four, four, four, nine, nine, nine. Here’s working virtual welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of eighteen ntc non-profit technology conference twenty eighteen we’re coming to you from the convention center in new orleans second interview of the second day of our coverage all our ntcdinosaur interviews are sponsored by network for good, easy to use dahna management and fund-raising software for non-profits my guests right now are heather martin, ceo of inter paid family, and alice hendricks, ceo of jackson river. Heather alice, welcome. Thank you. Welcome to non-profit radio. What have you wanted to be here ? How’s ? The conference going for you ladies ? Great. Have you done ? Yeah. Excellent. Okay, great. Next one. That goes good. Superlative. Have you done your session yet ? We did. We were on yesterday morning. Okay. So, it’s all relaxing now ? Right now, we’re just partying. Drinks last night. Exactly. Okay, all right. Your workshop topic is working virtual attracting and managing the best talent. I’m sure we have stats on how many organs non-profits have virtual employees. Or at least what the trends are. It’s it’s obviously growing. It’s really growing wouldn’t be here. And not only in the nonprofit world in the for-profit world as well, and especially in tech. Yeah, okay, absolutely it’s becoming it because of the technology that can enable easily to work from home, your chat technologies, videoconferencing, it’s become a thing and everyone is doing it now on exploring whether it works for their organizations a lot. Let me dive into the word, everyone not to quibble with you at all, but i was thinking generationally, are there fifty and sixty some things that are comfortable working, being virtual ? Not well, maybe we’ll get to whether they’re comfortable having virtual employees. They will get to that. My voice is cracked like i’m fourteen get that, but how about being virtual employees themselves ? Are they comfortable ? I’m over fifty, so include myself in that ? Are we comfortable doing that ? Or, you know, i think it actually depends on the organization and it’s really dependent on the organization making the employees comfortable, and so i’m not sure i don’t know if you have any stats, but i don’t know from an age perspective, there’s a very good question about an older generation being comfortable having virtual employees under the managing them, however, as being the virtual employee, i think it’s all about how the organisation sets it up. Okay. Excellent. All right, so that there’s promised them for those fifteen. Sixty something ? Absolutely. Okay. Okay, let’s, talk about it. Since since we’re skirting around it, how about comfort or discomfort with having employees being virtual when you’re over fifty ? So i again, i i think that there might be an age discrepancy in the comfort, but i also think it’s just personality, and i’m finding that when i talked to a lot of people who are looking to work virtual and they’re asking me, what can i do to go to my manager, my supervisor and quote unquote, sell them on me working virtually my answer to them is find out what the resistance is. There is part of the resistance as we’ve always done it this way i need to see my employees to know that they’re working. And how do you get around that ? Some of the key things that we talked about in our session are setting very clear goals and making sure that those goals are being met. But let’s, go to alice talk to flush out the gold. Gold setting a little. Yeah, i mean, i think that there’s not that much difference in terms of goal setting in terms of accountability for delivery, bols, that you’re supposed to be doing so used that the real issue is communication making sure you have a structure where there’s frequent communication and proof that you’re doing the delivery ble. So you’re measured not on a punch clock style of i get to work at nine. And i leave at five. And therefore i must have worked during that eight hour period you’re measured based on what is the work you were set out to do. And did you actually do that work in the time period ? I said i would do it. So if you’re a project manager are working on a program area you work with your you work with your supervisor on here, the things that i’m going to get done at a particular time. And if that’s not done that’s ah, that that could be a concerned that’s a problem, but that’d be a problem in the non workplace too, but rather than time. It’s mostly based on work product. Okay, okay. So that should apply even if you don’t have any virtual, i think one of the things we found is that working virtually is this, or managing virtually is the same as managing in an office. But you just have to be much more intentional about what you’re doing. Much more intentional about your communication, understanding that you’re not gonna have that water cooler conversation, that someone’s not going over here. Something and understand where you are in a project and b ready to communicate with those people who are not physically in the office. But the management and the psychology of the management is very similar. Okay, it’s, very valuable, you know, and make explicit. Yeah. How about attracting people, teo a virtual or attracting the right talent so that we’re comfortable that they’re gonna work in this work environment ? What do you, what you thought ? Well, there’s. Two thoughts on that that i have one is what one is that your talent pool is the entire country or world, should you see fit ? And there are wonderfully talented people in places that aren’t in the city or town in which your organization is located, and it gives you this ability to recruit from a wide place. And you can also hyre incredibly talented people from who have a wonderful life style. In a less cost of in my organization, we have people who live in a lower cost of living state than washington, d c where were based, and that allows me to provide a living wage and for my employees in that. But the other thing is just you, when you’re recruiting, you have to be very mindful of the interview process, and i think one of the things we talked about in our session was helping people figure out who these folks, how well they’ll respond to working virtually how do you do that in an interview ? Yeah, who’s best with that, heather so so some of the things that that we recommend, some of the things that we recommend is number one, we use technology as a tool to enhance communication in a virtual environment. So sometimes you’re using video comp, renting just for a regular meeting, and you’re talking through instant messenger and there’s other ways you’re using technology. So in the interview process, i always recommend that people use the technology that you’re going to require those employees to be using during their job if they can’t do an interview on skype or zoom or appearance and it’s very uncomfortable, it’s not to say that that might not be a good employee for you, but you have to be aware that there might need to be some training or development on that tool for them and no going. Into that is important when you’re hiring that person, and if you see generally a discomfort with technology that’s a pretty big red flag, or or or a red flag that you might need to overcome or that person’s not right for the position, and then the other question is some positions just don’t lend themselves to working virtually, and you have to be aware of that when you’re hiring also what are from ? Well, one of the easiest ones that we look at it if you’re an office manager and you’re managing the physical office days, it’s really difficult to be virtual when you need thio notice that there’s a crack in the ceiling where the vendor needs toe, you know, deliver something and be their way. We don’t have a tool for measuring the coffee level. Zack remotely happen. And now there’s an app for that you can probably it’s time for a break pursuing they’re e book is fast non-profit growth stealing from the start ups. They want you to see this because they’ve taken the secrets from the fastest growing startups and applied those to your non-profit it’s free as all the pursuant resource is, are you accustomed to that ? Come on, it doesn’t even bear saying it’s on the listener landing page that’s at do you know where tony dahna slash pursuant capital p for please now back to working virtual or any others that stand out to you ? I think it depends on the industry and what the job you’re doing. If you’re someone who does intake or you have to be there to welcome people into the office, you need someone physically there. There may be hybrids where sometimes people could work in the office and sometimes people could work from home. And i think thinking this through before you moved to a virtual environment or virtual job for that specific role is ki you can’t just say, ok, tomorrow we’re just gonna go virtual zoho alice, how do you how do you create this environment ? Gonna be hospitable ? Toe virtual ? I mean it’s all about culture. You have to create a culture where everyone is communicating well with each other, where people know what the expectation is on response times of communication has got to start at the top. It has to start a willingness that you absolutely to accommodate virtual employees. Okay, so it starts there and how does that how does the ceo trickling down ? You adhere to it. So rather than walking from my office into someone else’s office and telling them what i think they should know that maybe two other people who aren’t physically, they’re also need to know i will do that on a slack channel, for example. So i’ll use an instant messenger chat program, and i’ll put them all on the channel and talk to them all together at once, even though you were the mark, even if that’s the situation. Yeah, because it requires amount of discipline because you don’t want to leave people out. The interstitial conversation that happens at the water cooler can also be done virtually and that’s pretty important, too. Okay. All right. We’re going to get the tools you mentioned. Slack, slack channel. Is that that it’s ? All okay, okay. A chat. It’s. Simple chance a chance. A chance for you. You’re over my head, but i’m trainable. Alt-right i could be a virtual employees trust way. Mind of some technology challenges there, but we could get there. I’ll be there immediately. Got the radio stuff ? Yeah. I’m very good at that. I mean, i got knobs and everything in front of buttons and all. I don’t know what they do. Okay, what else ? Uh, anything else about creating the environment, making inhospitable ? I think some of the things that seem or some of the other things are making sure that your remote employees have the tools, whether it’s, the technology or even a monitor to go along with that laptop that you’ve given them because some some people who go into a new job, they’re given a laptop, they say work from home and it’s not as easy as just is your home office conducive and being able to help them think through what are the things that they need to set up in a virtual environment to make them successful and effective at what they’re doing. We talked about it a little bit about security and knowing what the security measures are. You can’t go into a coffee shop and work from your computer. Number one. Are you on the y fire you on the public wifi ? Are you on a virtual private network ? Are you using your hot spot ? You’ve to go the bathroom and your computer’s sitting in starbucks do you leave it there and ask the person next youto watch your computer while you go to i mean, we set policies around these things, especially in organizations that have a lot of regulations on data and accessibility for their information. These are things you have to think about when you’re creating a virtual environment. Okay ? It could be hip, baby what’s the credit card p c m p c i b c i okay, what do you do when you’re at starbucks alone ? You’re on you’re on a vpn virtual private network ? Yeah, you have to go the bathroom. You gotta close up. You use the diaper changing table in and you pull it down in the restroom and put your laptop on that. Take care of your business. Okay ? It’s ? Very. You know, i love the ditty gritty. This are listen, i mean, we’re all about real life here. Way need detail. You need clear policies around policies that people sign and everyone is very well aware of what the security policies, our protection use of technology. You said the company’s versus your pride, your personal technology home versus away from home. Okay, all right. Help me out here. Getting else what else belongs all this ? What else belongs in our policy ? Well, so there’s, we’re talking about there’s communication policies. How ? I mean, one of the things that we found when we first started having more virtual employees. We started as an in office, evan was in the office, and as we grew into different communities, we had employees in different cities and states than our headquarters were located in and things like when i sent an email, i just need you to acknowledge that the email resent if you’re in the office and i send you an e mail and you haven’t responded, i could walk into your office and say, hey, you get my e mail even if you’re not ready to respond to it. I know you’ve gotten it, and by five o’clock that day, i’ll get an answer when someone’s virtual and you send an e mail, you have no idea if it got lost, did it go into their spam and you have to get some kind of communication with one quick got it. So we said a communication policy that says if i asked you something or requested something, you send an email back saying, i got it, and i’ll get back to you by wednesday period the end it’s all set, and so that that you need to be very much more aware of those types of things and other community way have communication policies that go along with that. Okay, alice, you want teo or policy statement ? I mean, the security, i think, is the most important, you know, the email security, the hacking potentials. You know what happens also, when someone is let go, the lockout procedures, they have access to all of your systems, and they’re, you know, in north dakota somewhere to coffee shop, you have to shut down all of their access to things. So all of that needs to be planned at the level in the company. What are you going to do and how you handling staff with remote devices ? Can we do this if we don’t have a dedicated staff person ? And we don’t have a dedicated staff person ? Yes, face-to-face so the family says the answer is yes, okay, because are you know, we’re small and midsize non-profits in this audience, listeners. So you you on board someone with technology when they leave, you do the same thing on lee with a virtual person, you don’t physically have them there, and so you have to do the same thing you would do if someone was in the office, but make sure you couldn’t do it while they’re not physically there. How did they get your computer back to you ? Do they fedex it to you ? Are you going to go pick it up somewhere if they’re not there ? And so just those types of things need to be thought through, okay ? No. Excellent. I love the policy statement details because this is stuff you have to think through, and then alice to your point, has to be activated, implemented on from the top absolutely can’t just have a policy and ignore it. You know, if if it’s the ceo hyre it’s a sea level person whose whose distant you know, they too have to say, i got your e mail and i’ll get back to you by wednesday, everybody has to play by the same rules. There shouldn’t be exceptions or any accommodations or anything else. Yeah. Okay, um, how about let’s talk about some of the needs that your remote staff has we’ve been talking about managing the office ? What what special needs to the people ? But we only see a couple of times a year that’s a great question, okay ? I mean, i think they way it took that long, they need community, they need a partner, they need a buddy, they need to know that they’re not all alone. I’m so frequent meetings daily standup calls on dh heather’s organization native oppcoll standup called well, it’s a it’s, a phrase for a daily time when you just spend fifteen minutes sort of roll going around the company’s saying who’s doing what that day or our a team, if you’re working on a project together, you know everyone’s together on either a video chat or a conference call, or it could even be during us dahna slack channel or a skype group or a google hangout, or any type of technology that people can come together for a period of time. The more frequent that happens, the more connected they feel, and there is an issue of feeling lonely, it’s not that you’re just going off on your back room and typing all day long on your own, you need to be part of a community and part of a team. And the technology helps enable that. And heather’s organization there’s you do ? What is it a buddy ? So anyone who is new who comes on board there’s a couple things we do one is, no matter what level you’re at, you come to boston for a couple days, toe on board. You actually see physical people that’s probably essential. It’s, really ? It was one of like he learnings when i started working virtually is to know that there’s a physical person and a physical space or just seeing meeting someone face-to-face gives you much more of a connection to them immediately. The other thing we do is when we hire people we kind of give them we give them a partner. So we hyre associate director her in l a and we put them with the associate director in atlanta. This is not a mentor. This is not a supervisor. This is someone you can ask the dumb questions too. Like, how do i get my expenses paid ? Or i’m sure they told me this during orientation, but i don’t know what. To do about x, y and z and just having that person that you know you can go to is critical, especially when you’re by yourself in an office or in your home, and you’re trying to go up the learning curve of starting a new job. Okay ? All right ? What else ? Uh, anything else to be a empathetic to our remote employees again, this is a typical management. I would say this you should be doing this any time is just everyone’s intent is good. Assume that is good and there’s a good intent all all the time. That could be that that that’s going to have implications for chatting any female ? No, you can’t you’ll never hear the well, not never, but most of the communications you’re not going to hear the inflection in the person you don’t see the sometimes you don’t see the physical, you don’t see the physical, you don’t get the inflection, and so before you jump into anything or someone sent and i get this all the time and sends me an email and says i need blank, well, that could be taken in so many different ways. Are you demanding something from me did ice not get you something there’s so much in just those three words ? And so my first thing is tio okay, they have good intentions. Let me follow-up you need blank by when ? What is this for ? Get mohr information, they’re not now. They could be like you haven’t done something, i need it now and could be screaming it could be screaming at you with the default is the default is not do that and what we do actually, as we have everyone’s created communications charter that says how they like to be interacted with. And so i understand if you are one of these people who sends very short emails, i also have the flipside where someone sends me seven paragraph emails to describe one thing. And so if i understand how you interact, i could read that email with that understanding, not teo immediately assume that you’re yelling at me in the e mails. Excellent. Okay, very valuable. Are anything else ? Anything else to be supportive again ? Empathetic to the remote employees if we covered it, recovered it ? But i want to make sure we’re the only other thing i can think of is definitely getting together at least once a year with the whole team culture building wants that, yeah, it’s tough, it’s, tough in a non-profit environment where you’ve got a very tight budget, but we have prioritized and all in person meeting in boston, so we’ve got staff in california, in chicago, in atlanta and philadelphia. We make sure that we try in our budgeting process to bring everyone to boston for two days during the summer, not only for good brainstorming and thinking and strategy conversations, but also so they can connect with each other and have that community and build that in person conversation and feel comfortable with each other, and you feel like once a year is sufficient, you know, if i had the budget to do it more, i want a little longer, but all of that, yes. And so you have to take it for one of the that the tools that we talk about is the airplane. I mean, yes, it’s expensive, but it’s a really helpful tool to really get past some of the boundaries that are put up when you don’t actually physically meet in person. Alice, do you have a virtual employees also ? Jackson river, thirty thirty. Thirty. Revoting entire organization is ritual. Oh, my god. Okay, where’s, the is there a physical office ? There is a physical office with three people in washington d c yeah, but so we all behave as if were virtual. And there are many days that i don’t go into the office so in it. So you know, it saves a lot of money and transportation costs. It stays dry cleaning bills for everyone. It saves child care expenses. If you know it’s a very great way to have a lifestyle. Because yu yu have that flexibility, there’s also downsides to it. There are days that i wake up in the morning at six a, m and check email and all the sudden it’s too. And i haven’t eaten breakfast yet. And then i’m until six at night. So you know it’s a the same type of work-life integration needs to happen in a virtual environment as well as a physical office space. You know, you need to know how to take a break. You mentioned saving childcare expenses. So so the the remote employee it needs to be understood that the remote employee may not be immediately accessible right for a quick, you know, for for a last minute way gotta talk right now. So i think it’s about have something going on that is going to hold him up for ten or fifteen way try and make sure that people have adequate coverage to do their job during the day, the hours that they need to work. So we have a lot of employees that are at thirty hours a week because they want to spend more time with their families. Um, older children can be met at the bus stop and take care of themselves for a few hours in the afternoon, but the expectations of performance are still there. You know, we’re pretty high street standards of that, you know, we don’t want you to be distracted from your work. He managed the west coast versus east coast. Well, what is the west coast people have to do ? The westfield people have to start at six a m local time. I think a lot of people do different policies on that. Our policy is that you work for the day that work the business day in the time zone in which you live. So it’s, sometimes hard if we’re dealing with europe and the west coast at at the same time because the time zones i don’t overlap is, well, every boy’s in europe, we don’t have employees in your body to have clients in europe. So it’s ah it’s a situation where we have to manage that, but there are organizations that have west coast people working east coast, ours you have that way don’t have explicit policy that you work those hours, but we ask people how early on the west coast, how early would you be willing to have a meeting ? So we will not set meetings with some people ? Some people are early morning people and they would rather work from seven to three rather than nine to five, and so we’ll work with your schedule individually and so we so there are some meetings i will have on the west coast is seven o’clock in the morning, but that’s due to that person willing to do that, we have a few minutes left still let’s talk about some of the tech tech tools back-up that was i gotta ask you about slack. But what ? Black dot com how ? Do we find it or what you do for us ? Blackbaud comets, how you find it, you know, it’s it’s equivalent to skype or there’s google chat any type of chat software where everyone can log into and then there’s you can make groups in them. So the term for a group in slack is called a channel. And in our organization we have a channel for one of the channels is named lunch and if you’re going to be away for twenty minutes are going to lunch. We just take we just like everyone who’s in the company on that channel and say, hey, stepping away for a bit, i’ll be back in half an hour so we are all know it’s almost a cz though you would see me walk out the door, you know, and i instead of walking out the door i’m just telling that channel what’s happening there’s channels for each project also. So slack is a good one. Scott argast black is already a verb. Just like someone you’d like someone it’s a verbal. You skype someone you trust someone. Do you remember a well, instant messenger ? That that was a one man was that you could use that well, i was. But okay, so slack for for chatting. A quick, quick chat about document sharing is simple google docks or something better. It’s a simple a school back and microsoft has a great year. We have this product microsoft’s one dr sharepoint microsoft suite has has a document sharing software. Ah, cloud based saving system skype is now skype for businesses and integrated with it. And so we’re using that in the office and then there’s there’s a ton of independent ones out there. And it’s, whether it’s, videoconferencing or it’s document sharing or it’s chatting there’s a ton out there. And i think it could be overwhelming. And for us it was evaluating what was best for our organisation and what our upper management was able. Teo use we talked about this before is modeling the behavior you want from your staff and so getting upper management on board was key. So one of our project management software we use a sauna, and we’ve tried three or four of them and our ceo like hassan, and so if she was going to use a sauna, we’re all going to use this on you and so i think that’s really important. It’s got to be easy to use and work for your organization. Calenda ring simple is good calendar ring, yet you have any other tools besides google calendar ? We’re using outlooks calendar. Yeah, okay. Microsoft again. Yeah. All right. I think what other categories we need. Teo a video chat video is really important to scrape. A couple couldn’t do one on video with skype you khun duvette dio with google hangouts, but any time you can actually have an opportunity to see someone’s face and most of the calls we try to do as videos on dh, we find that that works really well. River again, the sense of community and if you can’t get together, that’s almost the next best thing and video has come a long way. The technology is more seamless than ever before, and so at least you’re seeing the person you might not get all of the nuance of the physical that that’s in the room. But you can see it in emotion or you can see a reaction to something which is super helpful or their cat walking of the cat we could get a lot of pets walking in front of the camera while people are on video that’s gonna be a lot of fun to talk about cats, but, you know, you have thirty virtual employees. You have fun doing it. I mean, oh, it’s awesome. Oh, it’s completely awesome is i love it. And well, you know, the best thing is that that people have really formed strong relationships with each other, they when you ask them what they like most about working here is they say each other, they say the people i’m here because i have connected relationships with other people on the team and to be able to create a culture where people feel connected to each other in a remote environment is is like, that’s the thing i’m most proud of, anything we’ve ever done, it doesn’t have to do their software product or what we’ve done to impact non-profits is the fact that we’ve had a culture of people that have had a wonderful time working and doing productive, impactful things. Jackson river always had a largest proportion of employees virtual from the beginning, when the beginnings and the culture to start about about it in the family way started as a two and a half person organization in the same way got to probably about eight to ten people in the office. And then our growth took us into different cities and communities. And that’s when we became virtual because of the growth, and so were probably half in the office in boston. And then half of our staff is outside and there’s one or two people in a city by themselves. We’re gonna leave it there. Excellent. Very much. Thank you. Alright. They are heather martin, ceo of interfaith family and alice hendricks, ceo of jackson river. This interview sponsored by network for good, easy to use dahna management and fund-raising software for non-profits. And this is tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of eighteen ntc ladies. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Way. We need to take a break. Wagner, cps. Do you need help with your nine ? Ninety or your brooks ? Are your brooks or your books of those books ? And brooks properly managed ? Well, i could help you with the books. Eyes financial oversight in place so that your money isn’t going to fly out the door over the brook talkto wagner, partner, eat huge tomb. I’ve gotten to know him. I trust him. He’ll be honest about whether wagner is able to help you. You know where to go. Wagner, cps dot com now, tony steak too. I was at the lou costello statue in paterson, new jersey. Remember lou costello of abbott and costello and who’s on first. So what’s the connection, i hope, you know what’s on first is you’ve got to know that i mean who’s on first. Now who’s, what’s on second. I don’t know’s on third. I hope you know what i’m talking about. The connection is you gotta have some sense of history because this this comedy routine and the abbott and costello you they were from the forties, and if you want to be really successful, implant giving and you going to be actively talking to planned giving donors, you need to have some sense of history from the forties or fifties and vietnam. My video is that tony martignetti dot com now it’s time to map your data to your audience. Nces, welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of eighteen ntcdinosaur the twenty eighteen non-profit technology conference day two we’re kicking off our date to coverage with courtney clarke and david mask arena all of our eighteen ntcdinosaur views are sponsored by network for good, easy to use donor-centric software for non-profits courtney clarke. Hello. Hello to you. Welcome. Let me give you a proper introduction. David, you could say hello. Hello, david. Mastering it from the convent and hilton foundation introduced himself. All right, david happens to be the digital communications manager at the conrad hilton foundation. And courtney clarke is managing director of user experience forum one. Welcome. Good morning. Thanks for having us kicking off. Thanks for kicking off with us. Hey, happy to be here. You’re workshop topic is data and audience connecting to create impact. Okay, let’s, start with you. David. What do you think ? Non-profits aren’t getting quite right in this subject. Like, why do we need this workshop ? To be honest with you, tell you, please beyond yeah, don’t wear really blunt with the arika there’s a lot of data collection that’s happening in the nonprofit sector, but people don’t really do anything with it. There’s like a statistics where it’s like a very, very small percentage of non-profits you do something with data ? And, you know, for example, there’s so many data points that in any day, that non-profit collectibe we have overload, i mean, really was data over there’s like there’s, like this just beautiful dash was like, what do we do with this ? You have to stay close to michael, okay ? All right, so we’re overloaded. So courtney, what we’re trying to do and have you had your workshop yet ? Yes, we had it yesterday, so you’re on the downside. Yeah, this is easy for you. So what you were doing and then ? And what we’re going to do now is trying make sense of data that well don’t feel overloaded. Well, it’s, it’s mostly around communicating data and really being clear about who your audiences are when you’re doing that cause we have identified five different data, sort of consumers or data people who will consume your data, but they all need different amounts of information, different formats. So for example, like a data consumer, this is like an interested person in the public. Maybe they’re a news consumer. They don’t have a lot of domain knowledge always, and they don’t have a lot of data skills, so what, you’re giving them is going to be very different than, say, a policy maker or a date. A producer. Okay, someone who’s more in depth in the details of it already knows, has has a yeah, you’ve identified let’s. Take it from there. We’ve identified five different audiences. Is that right ? That’s ? Different, different types of audiences. Okay, what are what are the five ? We should start there. Yeah. That’s okay, what ? Five ? I’ll start. Okay. The next one. So data consumer two and then three e before there’s a ping pong tournament here. But we’re not. We’re not going out today. Okay, fair enough. So first is i mentioned the data consumer. This is i hate it when people say general public, because here you’re not really targeting everyone in the whole world. So let’s be a little bit more specific news consumers, people who are already interested a little bit. Okay, okay. Like i said, not a lot of dough mean knowledge. Not a lot of data skill. What you’re calling this group the data consumer. So this is the person you’re like scrolling through your news feed you’re looking at your phone. Ahn, do you see an instagram ? Post or something on facebook, or even in the press in the news. And what do you see ? You see an infographic that’s, simple right language that’s easy to understand. The point is very clear. That’s for the data consumer. They don’t have a lot of power, but there are a lot of those people. Okay ? Hey, name another one. The next one is the data actor. So this is who everybody is targeting. This is decision makers, policymakers on dh. These folks may have some domi. Knowledge may have a lot of durney domain knowledge, but they don’t have time. So even if they do have dana skills, the ability to analyze and understand massive amounts of data didn’t have time to do that. They have analysts who are helping them do that sort of thing. But very important people. They have the staff, they have the cloud. They have our policymakers decision. Is that right ? Yeah. Okay. Okay, david, just give us our remaining three. So, of course, to consume someone has to share it. So you got a date ? A promoter. So these were the bloggers he got you get the journalist. The advocacy for folks. This software developers, the entrepreneur. So these people are the ones who are, like projecting that data out there so that the consumer and the actor be able to see that. And then you have the analyst, which is very, very important a lot. You missed this one too. It’s, like now i have all these data is beautifully being shared out being read, who in a way is a domain expert, this staffer that’s going to be able to analyze and help advice, what to do with the data. And then finally, the researcher you got, you know, these air, the phd folks, these are you know, i was talking about like jin ho was their learning officer, that comet and hilton foundation she’s a researcher, and we recently did a site visit nairobi, kenya, for one of our grantees, shopko shining hope for community and they have rich, rich data they’re collecting around there, committing kibera and compare, by the way, is the largest of informal settlement in africa and think about, like, a size of, you know, central park in a compressor that seven thousand people and there’s so much data that they’re collecting about the community and helping them with their health care and, you know, with an education and such and community services in the way when she’s taught dana, she was just, like, drooling all over it. But she’s, like, i want to do something that and she’s such an academic she just wants to, like, basically designed something around it. So these air, like the data modelers is with the academics of phd folks that will help let’s take the data to a new level. Alright, much so our audience is small and midsize. Yeah, non-profit twelve thousand. So we’re talking a lot of people there in small, small and midsize shop. Yeah, they need to identify which of these audiences they’re talking to some some may never be talking to to the researcher, right ? Or the or the data actor. They might not be doing lobbying, so they may not be. So you have to identify which audiences you’re talking to, right ? You guys hear me ? Okay. And your headsets ? Yeah. Yeah. Okay, good. I don’t hear myself too well, but as long as you hear me, ok, you have to identify who you’re talking to you and then okay, so so i guess we’re going to get through now there are different data needs different ways of conversing about data with data to each of these different audience that’s right ? You don’t have that, right ? Yes, we’re mapping needs and method to the five different audiences and the knowledge that they have tio and the time, right ? So i mentioned the policymaker. They may have some expertise. They don’t have time right on time, don’t time like the researcher. Whereas the researchers, like, get out of my way. Just give me the spreadsheet, all query my own database, okay ? And then also in the spirit of being totally honest, so they have to be honest with yourself who you’re going to deliver the data to, like. If it’s your board, it’s your board and it’s. Okay, you know, and some people are like, oh, this is only for one very specific orders and that’s. Good, you know, because they’re being very, very honest with yourself. Okay, very good. So let’s, start with the ones that are most likely for a small and midsize not to be talking. So certainly data consumer. Yeah. That’s your nose. Your nose could be your donors. I know you’re not calling your donor’s, maybe even just board members. Okay ? Data actor. Maybe it could be any decision maker that could be your board as well. It could be. It could be your boss. It could be somebody who is influencing budgets influencing programming. This is the person who has the power to make a change. So it’s therein you figure out which ones were going teo so they’re they’re in data promoter. That could be a journalist. Yes. Right. So that’s potential. The analyst remind me. What’s what’s the likelihood of a small mid size shot talking to the analyst sometimes yeah, for smaller medium non-profit portable. Forget it. Yeah, yeah. Bonem altum but scale that xero scales up now we’re not going right. We’re not going treatable, but let’s, just talk about it, okay ? I think what i think what’s different, though, for smaller midsize non-profits is that the people listening may be the ones doing the analysis themselves. They may not have a supper analyst. Okay. Yeah, and many came from currently hilton foundations. They get smaller foundation. And a lot of us were multiple hats. So someone might be liberta both, but yet, yet they still move every important. Okay ? They’re all in. Okay ? Yeah. All right. So what do we do for the data consumer ? How do we have a retailer to that audience ? Yeah. They’re a couple of key things. That’s. What we need. Yeah. So one is use plain language when you’re communicating to them, they may not know who you are, what you do, why it matters. Plain language is really key. Sometimes people get a little too marketing me. Sometimes they get a little too research. E you need to be able to say what you want to say in a really simple visual with some simple language like you’re talking to your friends. Yeah, we were at a dinner party. You’ve got ten seconds to explain what this is and what matter-ness schooling for. Graphic. That will do it for you or something like that, right ? Or even just like a data point point. Okay, we got to take a break. Tell us, for pete’s sake, think of the companies you can refer and start asking them that’s the first step. Well, actually, the first step is watching the video. Then you start referring the companies and talking. To them, you’ve heard the testimonials from the charity’s. You’ve heard the testimony from the companies. It’s. Time to get that long stream of passive revenue for yourself. Start with the video. That is the first step video. Is that tony dot, m a slash tony tello’s. Now back to courtney clarke and david mask arena from eighteen. Ntc what’s. The summary. Yeah, and a couple of that with something you mentioned visually could be motion. Could be a visual visualization of data. It could be a story. It could be a video that couples with the data because just it’s. Just a lot more impact for when you, when you when you pair it, but okay, let’s, start to make sense. Your data consumer is gonna be a lot more interesting story then your analyst or your research eggs ? Absolutely. And during our session yesterday, there are people in the audience who talked. We talked a lot about how we paired data with stories because the narrative makes it so much more riel, it elevates the people that are actually being affected by this data. So there were some great stories about that. Okay, okay. Back-up let’s, go to the well, anything else about the consumer ? I mean, this is this is this is probably our largest constituency. Yeah, so i think the other thing is to be clear about what action you want them to take because your data should support that action don’t just and and actually that came up from an audience member yesterday who said people weren’t being moved by the data and so that’s why they started pairing it with stories and once somebody gets hooked and they feel those heartstrings being cold or they feel that passion rise that’s when you gotta capitalize and be really clear what the action is, whether it’s donating, volunteering on asking for more information yeah, signing up for the male daughter, give us your new gives your email yeah, and think about the safety step back a little bit this like you have to identify goal, like whether you’re trying to accomplish with this data set and it would help you help you with to decide like what to share in how to share that welfare that’s always important place to start gold. What was the purpose of this, exactly what we’re trying to move people and then we try to move people to do and then be clear about exactly called. Okay ? That’s, right ? And the goal is the hardest part. Frankly, knowing the goal is the hardest part. It’s on so simple, but it’s like that ask why five times you got to get to the real root of why you’re doing this. All right ? We’re talking about our actor actor. Okay, refresh my recollection, who’s, this decision makers, policymakers, people who are going to make the change that you want, sir. Yeah. Okay. Okay. How do we talk to these people that data. So the format is briefings sometimes it’s in the form of a press release. They need, like, think about a policy maker who has a staff and maybe they have to vote on a bill or make a decision. The staff member is the one who’s calling non-profits calling agencies and saying what’s happening in my district around this topic. So being able to slice your data by topic and location is really valuable to these folks and getting this summary out and again the action. What ? Why does this matter and their actions going to be different than the consumer ? Usually you’re looking for a decision, a vote, something exactly what you want to say more about the actual, i think something that’s adjustable something that if you could package it for them, like staying here, the key takeaways from this a swell, you know, think of this, like, you know, you know, working the communications team. And, you know, we provide press kits for people. And if you could provided that, you know, so so they could easily digest and help, um, guide them through the decision making process, i think will be the key. Okay. Yeah. Okay. And i guess also keeping in mind you you may not be talking to the principal. Yeah, right, right. It could be a staff staff, something. Usually it is so it’s. Gotta be it’s. Gotta be so your your urine for always going through someone to the decision maker way don’t love that. Right ? Twice removed, twice removed from your there once removed from your data. Yeah, it happens. I mean, that’s what ? Any communication, though. Anytime you’re putting something out, somebody could take it. Andi at their own commentary around it. That’s what ? The data promoter that’s a that’s a benefit in a risk, right ? Because they could date a promoter could be multiplying. Your audience is your audience, but they could be putting their own message. They could be manipulating the data in a way that may not be true to it. But, you know, were you everybody has had, you know, that journalist didn’t get the quote quite right ? Yeah, you are taking over simplification exactly. If the press often has to do to make something interesting to readers, you know, put in a headline. Yeah, yeah, and the promoter should also think about, like, segmenting looking if they could do, like, a more targeted in a way, like, if they know specifically that they’re going to try to communicate. Teo, i think they’ll be the key as well. And you get to know your trusted data promoters, right ? You know, the journalists or the bloggers are the advocates who you trust, who you align with the messaging around. So identifying those folks or maybe you don’t know them and you do a little research and you find out who you are, where, wes, you need to know within your sector who the influencers are. Absolutely yeah, i get a little bit of research. Goes a long way. Yeah. Back-up how do you feel about the standard press release ? Since we’re talking about the audience of promoters, we’ll be sending it to either of you have, ah, opinion on press releases. Are they outdated there ? Some school of thought that press release is dead. But it’s it’s still being used is using it. You’re still using journalists say they ignore them. Yeah, andi, and honestly goes back to relationship building, you know, like in communications, that our primary key is build relationships with with journalists. So when our press release passes through their deaths, they’d be able to, like sick. Oh, let me take a look at this and then dig deeper into the story for us. Just a little more let’s. Talk about building a relationship with a journalist before you want them. Tio, take some action for you to write about you in to quote you on that day’s breaking news. Yeah. How do we build that relationship when we don’t have a need ? But, you know, we want to be in front of the person. Yeah. I mean, honestly, like i just it’s a good old fashioned relation building, you know, you have called them, reach out them email and called, you know, like you have no agenda, but i mean, this marketplace exactly you often cover way. Have coffee, exactly. What a concept. I mean, like, i’m also part of communications network conference, just another communications based non-profit unconference and a lot of journalists attend that and it’s a great opportunity, this plate, this form and ten is a another great form to meet people like i would add to that you need to be you need to understand that audience and you need to be curious about they have their own set of requirements that they’re trying to meet. They’ve got an editorial calendar there. Boss has told them what topics to focus on. They’re looking for. They need they need to youto help them connect the dots. So maybe don’t start with the ask, understand what they’ve been working on for the last month. What stories ? What topics ? And then being able to which, which, by the way, does not mean ask them what have you been writing me out ? It means doing your research before you do the outreach, so that you know, so that, you know, you’ve shown that, you know, you show that you’ve taken the time to know what their beat is exactly not just asking you what do you write about lately ? Well, it’s in the paper buy-in there dubai it’s on it’s, on the site, in the research, and then and then what are you working on next or what’s ? The story you’ve been dying to write that you haven’t had the chance to there’s always a good answer for that and there’s a great conversation starter, especially like imagine putting yourself in their shoes, you know, like someone just roundly wants to have coffee with you, but you have no idea who they are didn’t even do any sort of research like and, you know, you have very, very busy schedule, and you have multiple crowdster headlines like we just need to remember they’re people tio don’t waste their time any more than you would waste. Teo spend the time with a potential donor. Exactly ask them what you’re worth. You’re not gonna ask them things that you want to know already write, write, write what is it about our work that he loves ? Well. I’ve been giving to you for fifteen years, i think it’s, probably in my e-giving history, you know, don’t waste people’s time exactly, but but it is important to build relationships with exactly these influences. Okay, i would add to that there channels are largely on social media. If you talk to any journalists, they spend all their time on twitter. So if your twitter gene is not great it’s time it’s time. Learn what hashtags there using. Follow those channels, see who they’re following. See what they’re talking about. A great way to do research on also how to start to engage early on, even if it’s just observing. Okay. Okay. Very good. Okay, so i want you. I want to spend more time on that. I want to check my mike. Want to make sure that everything is good here. Okay, a little insecure about the way i sound. I don’t know. I sound you don’t sound good to me, it’s. Not okay to you, though, right ? It’s ? A little soft. Like i can hear myself. Really ? I could hear myself, teo. You don’t hear me. According to richard it’s. Not as clear. Yeah, in-kind okay. And give. Myself a lot more volume. All right, now, my too loud. Ok, it’s. Good. Allright. Thank you. Time for our last break. Hoexter give quote, i compared a bunch of companies in my search for it hoexter donate company and text to give is the best hands down. They have b been beyond helpful. I can’t imagine anyone doing this better exclamation mark end quote that’s lauren bouchard from global commission partners in clermont, florida. Satisfied ? She is with text to give you will be, too for info text npr to four, four, four, nine nine, nine. We’ve got several more minutes, and here they are for map your data to your audiences. Let’s, continue the analysts. Right. Data analyst. Refresh our recollection. David who is this ? So this is the data expert this’s. The staffer that’s or consultant ? That would help be a read data. Okay, and analyze it for you, like they be in a foundation. Now. I like the way i sound better. Okay ? Like they’d be a foundation program, officer. It could be. Is that an example or no, i’m not necessarily. I mean, it could be a learning officer for the foundation meeting the one. Who’s like analyzing all the learning and data sets. Ok, he could be a data manager, you know, within an organization. Where would you ? Where would you put a program, officer out of foundation ? Someone who’s evaluating your grant proposal. Where ? Where would they fit in these audience ? Most like, i mean, it’s a little bit of both between the consumer and the actor, to be honest with you, because they’re both a decision maker. So they’re going to read the data and they’re also going to get this just like, okay, this is how my program is going and here’s how i’m going to act upon it. And here’s how i’m gonna adjust my strategy with it. Okay ? Yeah. All right. So, let’s, go back to the analyst. How do we, uh, david ? You keep going. What do we do with this ? How do we talk to the analyst with our data ? Go. No. Gosh, just give it all to them. Honestly, rod, they love him. They loved it. They love spreadsheets there. Said if they see a string of numbers, imagine like matrix type of thing. They’re like oh, my gosh, this is habit. Okay, okay. Yeah. It’s that simple ? Well, they have, i would add that they usually have the domain a knowledge. Do you think of a policy maker ? They haven’t education expert on staff or they may have an expert in international relations it’s that person who knows the domain quite well and feels comfortable digging through the data and furthermore to add to that, too is like if he providing which your goals and what your strategy is for and what they’re trying to provide the otherwise they’d be able to help you got guide you through the breeding process say more about that ? Yeah, what shit a little bit, so think of him like, you know, like, if i’m like, if i am se the heather communications in the foundation and i’m like, i’m gonna talk to a data analyst we’re trying to accomplish x can you help me read through this day that what types of data sets can leave first collect and what’s up days says comey can provide so they’ll be able to accomplish that goal, then they were able to narrow down because otherwise they could they could. You stand in any sort of ways, but if you provide some sort of direction or gold. They’re able to, like filter things a little bit better for you. Okay, yeah, very good. Really good. And our last left audiences the researcher buy-in courtney yeah, the researchers are get out of my way and give me this red sheet they the like they may scan through your infographic, your visualization, your query tool. But really, they’re going to build their own query tool. They’re goingto grab that they’re the ones who are in sequel making pivot table like they’re doing all of it. Okay, we have jargon jail on twenty sequel i think people will know, but i’m going to pivot table. Alright, excel itself. Okay, sorry, i’m taking a data analytics class so i’m learning this stuff, so i’m excited to be able to talk about it just dropping, dropping top, but, yeah, i imagine you’ve got an excel table that is so large that you can’t open it x l can’t open it. That is what these researchers are are working in and they’re very comfortable working in and they’re the ones who may even be collecting data as well as analyze sing it for themselves, so think of it like a like a layer deeper than unless they got analysts who may rely also some visualizations. And of course, like a deep amount of pressure. But these guys are like they’re just like neck or forehead, deep of like numbers and data, and they want to do everything themselves. Yeah, yeah. So one one important thing here we have worked on a number of data projects and for non-profits or foundations any group who wants to attract many of these audiences, the keeping with researchers is you have, like, the get data page or sometimes we’ll put it in the footer and it’s, like, just download the excel spreadsheet because i keep saying it, but you got to get out of their way. Just give them what they want, okay ? Okay. We have, like, another minute and a half or so do you have tools ? And, uh, in your description, you mentioned choosing the right data tools. Any tools we can introduce briefly that you like, i mean, to be honest and this is like, tio, you get off being out of keeping it will be really hash tag riel here, please place if you’re old website have google and alex installed. I mean, you’d be surprised how many webs are out there and smashing non-profits believe that twenty nine, twenty nine percent of them are using do or not. Okay, okay did not have google and licks and police bare minimum do that and they said, like have i think the fun ? Nothing is like have goals, you know, before it was like before you venture into the day the world ? Yeah, there is there’s a great study that every action did called the state of non-profit data. And you can it’s from twenty sixteen. But it’s a great read a page i recommended. Okay, we’re gonna leave it with we’ll leave it there without recommendation. All right, all right. They’re courtney clarke, managing director of user experience at forum one. And david mask arena digital communications manager at the conrad hilton foundation. Courtney and david. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Pleasure. This interview along with all of our eighteen ntcdinosaur views sponsored by network for good, easy to use dahna management and fund-raising software for non-profits. Thank you for being with non-profit radios coverage of eighteen ntc next week the buy-in bitches getting buy-in from your leadership. If you missed any part of today’s show, i beseech you, find it on tony martignetti dot com, responsive by pursuing toe online tools for small and midsize non-profits data driven and technology enabled. Tony dahna slash pursuant capital p well, you see, piela is guiding you beyond the numbers. Bradunas cps dot com by tello’s, credit card payment processing, your passive revenue stream. 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