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Nonprofit Radio for October 4, 2019: Beyond Local & Online To IRL

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Emma Togni: Beyond Local
We’re talking about scaling your community. Want to go regional? National? Global? Stay online or move to IRL? My guest from 19NTC is Emma Togni with Social Techno. This is our last of 32 19NTC interviews.

 

 

 

Amy Sample Ward

Amy Sample Ward: Online To IRL
Amy Sample Ward continues our convo and focuses on in real life community building. Drawing on NTEN‘s experience, she has strategies for growth and local empowerment, and shares resources. She’s our social media and technology contributor and NTEN’s CEO.

 

 

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Hello and welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit Radio Big non-profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d get slapped for the diagnosis of trypanosomiasis if you infected me with the idea that you missed today’s show beyond local We’re talking about scaling your community. You want to go regional, national global, stay online or move to in real life. My guest from 19 and T. C is Emma Tony with social techno, and this is our last of the 30 to 19 ntcdinosaur views and online to i r l Amy Sample Ward continues our convo and focuses on in real life community building. Drawing on intense experience, she has strategies for growth and local empowerment and shares. Resource is she’s our social media and technology contributor and intends CEO Tony’s take two planned giving thievery responsive by witnessed e. P. A. Is guiding you beyond the numbers. Regular cps dot com Bye Cougar Mountain Software Denali fundez They’re complete accounting solution made for non-profits tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turn to communications, PR and content for non-profits your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to dot CEO and here is beyond local. Welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 NTC. That’s the 19. That’s 2019 non-profit Technology Conference. We’re at the convention center in Portland, Oregon. All of our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at ActBlue free fund-raising Tools for non-profits to help them make an impact. But I’m right now with Emma Tony. She’s a marketing manager at social techno and, uh, welcome, Emma. Thank you. Thank you, Tony. Does it have you? Andi, your topic is creating global communities online and in real life. So we’re talking about scaling groups. So you might have a local group. Might be a tech group. Might be a healthcare group for chess playing or dog walking. I don’t know. You have a community, local community somewhere. And we’re talking about scaling that you might not go global, but maybe you’ll go statewide from town or national to st. You wantto You wanna help us do that? Yeah, s o in Texas. We are actually a global community. So we round in Italy, as social tech knows essential enterprise. The text of global Network program. So actually we are. We have been scaled by a tech soup and precisely in, especially in Italy, we have different kind off communities. We are building up in the third sector. Um, for example, we gather people from different sector. We didn’t the non-profit one that help and we enable collaboration and relationship with between these kind of people. And we help to connect this people with other organizations abroad. So we really believe in the power off connecting people around the world. And we do this via, for example, train activities or out of events we do in Italy as well as in the Europe will get a chance to dive into the details. But you’re doing this both online and in real life. Yeah. Where you based in Italy were busy. Milan, You’re in Milan. I have spent a little time there. I flew in and out of that. Malpensa is the airport. Yeah, but I’ve spent a couple nights in Milan. I know, but I’ve been to really I’ve been totally five times. Uh, from Rome. Naples, way down South Georgia. Toto, which is in Calabria, of course. Vonette Cia, Forenza Bland Palermo. Ging quit arika. Yeah. Come back, durney. I have I will again. But I have been back many times. There are other places to visit to after I think they have to be more egalitarian about my my international travel. You spread it out a bit. Um Okay, So, um, how do we get started? I suppose we let’s ah, let’s say because more likely for our listeners, Aaron Small and midsize non-profits. So it’s more likely that there let’s say their local or they might be statewide and they want to go from they want to go to statewide if their local or national you know, if they’re if they’re statewide, how do we How do we get started? We have this ambition. Now what do we have? How do we channel our ambition? Thio, meet our goal to be statewide national. I would say Let’s start from your mission. If your mission is, um is strong enough and it’s it’s scalable. Let’s say so. If you have a mission that could be actually spread it around the world. So stuff from that and ask yourself what’s the best? The best way to scale this mission around the world. For example, in tech soup, we do have the mission off building a bridge between no profits and the technology and to empower non-profits in the use of technology with air. Well, they’re on a mission. So beginning from these, the statement we were like, What’s the best play to the best way to, you know, to do these two actual to deliver these mission around the world is to be partner off local s social enterprises around the word. So actually, the Texas back-up program is round by social enterprises. Locally, look for look for local partners. Exactly. Get started. Exactly. So our claim is they need these global and so we are. So they need is the need for technology and the use off a technology from the non-profit secretaries is something that it’s global, but only the local enterprises, Maybe they do have that knowledge about the non-profit locally, that is, that enables the tax up to, uh to run their their mission locally. Okay, so they have the knowledge off the territory, the knowledge off the third sector in the nation. So this is the model that we use. So think about the mission and the better as well. The business model that can fit. Because, of course, there’s gonna be local expertise. Yeah, you know your scale. It’s it’s expertise in a in a nation, my example. It’s local. It’s expertise a little broader in your state or in other states, um helps to have that buy-in and on dat knowledge of culture then and also because you’re your topic and we’re talking about in real life. So ultimately, we want to get not just from online communities. We want we want to be meeting face to face. And if you have local partners, you’ll have maybe some brick and mortar. Or at least you know where you can gather. You know you’ll have those local contacts. Yeah, for example, we do have a known online platform that we share with the older partners off tax, which are more than 70 in 230 plus countries in the world. So we have this platform in common, but actually, when it comes to real life, we really rely on the initiative of the single partner in the nation. So, for example, in Italy, we do a lot off local events around around Italy to help non-profits to get access to the technology as well as food and wine events. Absolutely absolutely Happy hour thing. Part off the key important meeting in the morning after hours. Exactly Good. Yeah, it’s a good way to networking actions, so you need in person over food and drink. It’s time for a break. Witness C P. A’s They had a wagon are on September 25th. It was exempt or nonexempt. Forget it. You missed it. But you do know that you still need to classify your employees correctly. So don’t worry. You got nothing to worry about because you watch the archive. You goto Wagner cps dot com Click Resource is and recorded events that simple. Now let’s go back to beyond Local Let’s see what else we talked about flexible of programs, programs that adjust to the local culture. How do you, um, how do you think about that? And you met you make those adjustments and have that kind of flexibility. When you’re you’re a global organization, you’re there. So there is an umbrella organization. There’s gotta be some structure, but you want to be flexible enough to accommodate other other cultures to how do you balance those? Yeah, for example, tech soup. Global rounds tax, of course, is mainly online. So and we decided to go for these models. So we do provide courses online, but as well as in person. So because in Italy will are a small country, right. So we have the possibility off also for the location where we are small, small, but beautiful. Exactly. So we are the capability to reach out to people, to gather people in a room and to deliver workshops and also in tailor made courses and train activities in house like we go to the non-profit and we hold workshops on their premises. So, you know, disease are kind off. Um, this is the way we scaled program, which is international, about the courses. And we adjusted to the specific reality off the Italian lorts sector. Now, tech soup also needs to manage language language barriers. Now, in my example, we’re not gonna have language barriers, Although somebody from the north might not understand someone from the South. But that’s more mindset, I think, than language and language. But in your case, how do you overcome barriers of language for an international organization? So we partners off tax super. We have the zoning platform where we all work together in on. Actually, the off course. English is key to collaborate, but also all the materials, the tool kids, the marketing materials as well that we share our translator localized by the single partner. Also because, um, it’s not not not only a matter off translating the words, it’s some better off finding the right communication words for your audience. Because if you talk about, for example, digital transformation, you have to, ah, took with the words off your audience. So it’s not only a matter off translating from English, it’s a matter off getting the same wavelength off your audience. So it’s on this kind of work. Okay, okay. So well, there again, you have your local partners think valuable for that. Um, so tech soup has, uh, they have their social events as well? A CZ. You want to keep it social too? I mean, aside from the learning the learning environments, do you have just purely social events as well? Is that valuable? Yeah. In Italy, we do a lot off local events with our donor partners, For example, you know, Google Airbnb. Microsoft s so big brands, Um, and the in-kind off events locally that we we host our training activities mainly. So we have we Our mission is to build capacity and digital competences your sector. So we do. Do you have some social events also that are not training oriented? Just pure social? Um, yeah. Networking events with some began NGOs are ampules in the in Italy yet, you know, to spread the voice about tax soup to build strategic partnership and relationships with some non-profit organizations in the territory s Oh, yeah. We do have also live events on Facebook as well, because it’s a It’s a community, which, where, um, that it’s built on online and offline. Is there also? Ah, you know, people Facebook. Facebook is annoying. A lot of people I see, I actually see. I see a lot of people moving to zoom video over Facebook live. I’ve done that myself. But I’m not just using myself as an example. You got the idea from a lot of other people. Okay, Who? I’ve, um I just I just see getting away from Facebook live. I’m invited to fewer Facebook live events, and I’ve been invited to more zoom events in the in the past year than had been in previous years. Yeah, this is a good example off and not a scalable tool. Because if I if I you would do ah Azuma event in Italy, they wouldn’t understand even what zoom is maybe no. So they must use use the tool for prom M peels in Italy are eyes facebook. So you need to ask yourself, Where is my audience? You’re internationally. Zoom is not exactly so. You need to ask yourself Where is these? May be a great idea. Maybe we do use, for example, tools that are not used by at the other impurities in Italy. But not because we are enthusiastic about the tool is that means that it’s used from from Iran. So I really have to be humbled to ask yourself, Where is my union’s? Am I willing to reach out to them where they are, where they’re very good point? Yeah, you’re right. Zoom is not international. And Facebook. Facebook is a big advocate of zoom. Yeah, but absolutely right. Good point. Thank you. Um, you also made another point about corporate sponsorships. If you’re going abroad or you’re just going beyond your own communities. I’ve been saying, um there may be a sponsorship opportunities for for your events in the places where you’re expanding too. Yeah. Could you mentioned Airbnb and, uh, Microsoft? Yeah. Or, for example, with Amazon web services. We did our road show, which is actually international. So we started over in in Italy. It’s basically our train activity about all the services off Amazon for the non-profits. Um, so we started in Italy, and they got enthusiast about this this kind of event. So they scaled in the UK and in Australia working alongside with the local Texas partners. So this is on. This is a good chance to get funding for, for an event, get the non-profit trained about that digital tools and make everyone happy. Another possibility. Overlap between doing international work and maybe and going national is time zones. How do you How do you overcome internationally? You can have 12 hours difference, but nationally, you know, if you just if you’re going from your state to the country just three hours difference, but that can That can make a difference. How do you What’s your advice for overcoming time zone differences, We plan ahead. So if we have to work with the U. S colleagues, for example, we plan Thio, you know, to make the actions Radi before you know the time zones. Um so actually, we we use a lot off tools for project management. A share with the colleagues. Ah, lot off. You know, also teamwork, um, tools that help us to keep up to date with the medical leagues. So, yeah, we really rely on these kind of tools, like slack or yeah, So we leave that. Okay? Yeah. I live on a little more about having things ready in advance. What do you mean, there? Eso? Because we have a lot off that lines, for example, for launching a new product for launching a new program which is international. So we are alerted by the US colleagues, and then we plan ahead or our actions so that when they when they say we go live on this day, we are already we are ready to be to be live. Um, you talk some about threats of closing civic spaces. I don’t know if that could happen in the U. S. It seems like anything could happen these days, so I’m not gonna discount that possibility. What? What? One of the problems there first. Before you get to what? What you do too, to try to help prevent that. But what problems do you have about closing of civic spaces? Um, we don’t have these big issue in Italy, to be honest, but we are experiencing Ah, great reform off the off the third sector, which is like shrinking the power off non-profit toe, make a greater social impact in terms off hyre toe toe, make the, for example, some restrictions, some fines as well a taxation. They are getting higher and higher. So you know these These are little adjustments to the low that actually prevent ah, no profits to have the freedom to act finds for what? For purposes finds for what reason? Because And the main finishes suppression. What’s the What’s the reason? Yeah, The main issue is they want to get rid off the little organization that the head doesn’t have, ah, social impact. So the little months made up off 1 to 2 people, they want to structure them as an enterprise or as our structure impute so they don’t want to have a long tail off the sort of sector, saying that there are billions off non-profits that they have just the label. But they don’t do actually something impactful. Back-up uh, what’s telling What’s the reaction among the third sector in Italy? Thio. Making operations more efficient? What’s the reaction? There is a lot of buzz. Ah, and also they are forced to publish, like a balance sheet off their activities and our social impact kind of assessment. So we expect super. We’re trying to help them to a bill this kindof assessment off their activities to be published online. There is a really a blurriness around this topic in Italy now because the reform is not published like formally now. So we’re still waiting for, you know, news and updates from the government. So this is a government agency that would yeah, coordinating all this data elearning on deciding which organizations can continue non-profits and which have to be enterprises incorporated as enterprising. And it’s becoming also like a requirement to be, um, at a certain point, digital s o. They are calling the third sector to be digital transformed, you know, So because this is our kind off our requirements from the low so way are trying to, you know, work with work week with the no profits toe. Get them trained. Is that Is that a change that could be legislated? Cannot be Yes. We all should be using technology smartly. It makes us more productive. But is that is that a change that could be give you created by government? Fiat Yeah. Okay, I get to I give you Ah little example. For example, now in Italy, it’s ah, it’s a low to make the voicing Onley digitally and Elektronik Lee so can’t have paper invoice anymore. No, no, no, no. For commercial. This is for companies also not just for the company itself, for from the small medium and large enterprises. So if your name Asmal our medium impose, you have to be ready for the electronic invoicing. So this is a trick, right? So you if you don’t have some digital skills or technology competences, you’re not ready to deliver the service. So this is an example Floor Yeah, s So what is the little what? What is the little, uh, a little past each area? How did they How did they take of the fruit flavored order on the corner. How did they How did they comply with this? I’m not sure they are involved in this kind of legislation, but for sure, the medium big M peels and enterprises are, for example, we as a social enterprise. We do deliver Elektronik invoicing now. Well, yeah, next to tech soup can I’m worried about All right, So you’re not so smart s o. So maybe it’s not the smallest businesses, or they are like, I suppose you just have three or four people. Family, family? Uh, yeah, family business on the corner. Uh, they are they covered by this way are 10 to 15 people in Texas, Italy. But we are, um, coping with, ah, lot off appeals. And we have the, you know, the donation program and the all the services. So we are absolutely involved in this in-kind off legislation because smaller non-profits are encompassed by that. Okay. Uh, no, you’re very interesting. He’s from the word. Pardon me news from from either in the world. Do we still have another five minutes or so together? What? What else? What else would you like to share on this topic? that we haven’t talked about yet. Um, for example, I’d like to share the fact that I would like to scale this kind of vivendi and 10 in Italy. Son was wondering if it’s feasible, actually, because it would be really interesting for the third sector in Italy to have this kind off initiative. And so, yeah, you doctor and 10 about that. Not yet. I knew some some off the text Super advisory board. The stuff easy involved in the intent is helping. Intend to plan this out? S Oh, yeah. Let’s see. Let’s see. I went to a I went to a fund-raising conference in Italy. I spoke at a fund-raising conference. Um, it was, uh, first of all, it was festival del fund-raising. Wow. Do you know it is their most probably five years ago or so? What’s the name of the man who runs the radio? Dellaccio Melinda. Melinda. You know Valerio durney? Well, he was teaching a columbia for a couple of years. Is he’s busy back home in Italy now, or Yeah, New York. No, no, no. He’s anything. You know, I met him when he was teaching at Columbia. Yeah. Valerio invited me Valerio. Melinda? Yeah, like this. We have friends. So he he holds a really interesting event about fund-raising. So we have the first of all. Yeah. Yeah. Still seal were sponsor off the this kind of event of sex of Italy. And also, we were trying to do the same four months off land about but about technology, so it would be really interesting. Okay, so there will be a intend Italy. So you know that I would come, I would come and I could talk about podcasting. Yeah, I heard there was a very popular podcasting workshop here. I could do a podcast in workshop there. Have how to start a podcast. I could actually. Oh, yeah. At the festival del fund-raising. I was talking about my other work, which is planned. E-giving. It’s a It’s a form plane. Giving fund-raising would Wouldn’t Wouldn’t be good for a tech soup. Confident I could totally do my other. My other friend in Italy is, uh, where this goes way back. My first trip in Italy. His name was Mario Bootsy. He’s not You don’t know Mario, but he’s from Milano, actually is from Wow. But But this was my first trip to Italy was in 1990. Notes. I graduated from law school. Was that 19 2098? No. When did I graduate from law school? In 1989 to 92? I graduate in 1992 So let’s go back to 1992. You were very young. Then Mario, Bootsy and I met. We were sitting next to each other at the We were there to see Aida at the Baths of Caracalla in Roma. So he’s a He was a bartender. He was a bartender in Milano, but he was on. It was August. He was a foregone stow the August vacation time. I’m not saying that for you listeners, you don’t know if argast Oh, is. It was for a ghost. Oh, so he was on vacation in in Roma. Um, I bought a ticket there, Aida at the Baths of Caracalla, which, of course, operated live operating room. It was a four or five hour production. There were live animal, there were camels and tigers and well, it’s the desert. Maybe the Warren Tigers. But whatever, there were camels. There were camels on the stage and Mario boats and and there were two intermissions because it’s so long. Mario Boats and I I spoke just a little bit of Italian poker, and he spoke even less English. But he and I carried on so well during the intermission, we had drinks together and then we walked back. He we left and we walked back. I walked back to my stay Attila pin pin Cioni on, uh, he was going back to wherever he was staying in Rome for his vacation time, but we got along famously for well, like a five hour production in another hour and 1/2. Walker’s because a long walk And I thought, You know, if the two of us Me and Mario Booty the new law student, the new law grad from I’ve been to law school through law grad from the U. S. And the bartender from Milano and we could get together this way and neither one of us has treyz translators. I thought, you know what a way to bridge differences over over Aida Karnak Ala was created because of me. Then community and I, we were in touch for a while, and then we’ve fallen out of touch instead. But But I still number his name? Mario. Bootsy. You have to come back. Oh, I’ve been okay. All right. I guess usually I let my guests wrap up, but I just Did you take the last few minutes encourage boards of encouragement? Um, stimulation, You know, what would you like to close with? Um, I would like to to tell to older non-profit sector around the world to be courage enough to take all the, um, their mission and their competences within the organization to strive to do the best to make our social impact, which is, ah, related to their territory specifically. And don’t forget to death globally and go global. All right. She is Emma Tony, marketing manager at Social Techno. And you are with Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 2019 ntcdinosaur profit Technology Conference. Emma, thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you, darling. Thank you, listeners. Very, very gracious. And all our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools to help non-profits make an impact. Thanks for being with us. We need to take a break. Cougar Mountain software designed from the bottom up for non-profits. Simple to use phenomenal support. Can you say that about your accounting software? Have you got accounting software? You’re not still using Excel spreadsheets? I hope not. Please don’t tell me that. Cougar Mountain. If you’re in any of those situations where you can’t say yes to all those things or you’re still using spreadsheets, check out Cougar Mountain. They have a free 60 day trial. You’ll find that you know where on the listener landing page at tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain. Now, Time for Tony. Take two. I was accused of being a thief. Um, this was by a niece years ago who did not trust me with her aunts Jewelry. This is back when I was a nem ploy e a director of planned e-giving. What she said to me was just incredible. Um, she was, uh, she was trying to ask. She’s actually trying to curry favor with me because she wanted me to reduce the university’s interest. I was working at the University of the time, interest in an estate, and she was a beneficiary of the state. So if if I was willing to accept less for the university, she would have got more um it doesn’t work that way, but she didn’t understand that on dumb. Amazing. So she went so far as to accuse me of being a thief. And you just have to check out the video. Thio, Hear the full story? That’s with Peter Heller. He hosted me on Heller Consulting Group Video. Siri’s. You’ll find the video, though, on my site at tony martignetti dot com. And that is Tony. Take two. Let’s do the live love. It’s gotta go out If you’re listening live The love goes out to you wherever you are If you’re in New York, New York if you’re in Beijing Uh, who else checks infrequently? Oh, of course. Bangalore, India. We’ve heard from recently, uh, California. Often checking in, um, New Jersey, Yes, North Carolina. Wherever you are listening live The love goes out to you. So glad you’re with us. And the podcast Pleasantries. You gotta have it. Can’t If you’re gonna live us in love, You got a podcast. Pleasantries. You can’t have one without the other. So the pleasantries go out too. That’s where the vast majority of our audience those over 13,000 people listening each and every week. Amazing it really is amazing. I don’t know. Sometimes I wonder why Why you stick with this? But I know you’re not leaving because it’s good value. That’s why. So the podcast Pleasantries going out. Thank you for being with us at whatever time you listen. However, we fit into your weekly or monthly podcast scheduling pleasantries to you. It’s my pleasure to welcome back Amy Sample Ward. You know Amy Sample word. She’s our social media and technology contributor and CEO of inten. Her most recent co authored book is Social Change Anytime, Everywhere about online multi-channel engagement. She’s that Amy Sample War Dot or GE And at Amy R. S. Ward. They are, of course, for Renee. How are you? Any simple word? I’m good. I’m good. How are you? I’m doing very well, Thank you. Glad you’re with us. Back. Back with us. Yes, I It is always fun. OK, good, very state that very clearly so very clearly and emphatically. So it must be unless there’s somebody twisting your arm to say, Say, fun, tell him it’s fun, but it’s not because you’re in. You’re in Oregon and I’m in New York, so it’s not me doing that it must be someone else. Um, well, no. I do wish that we could coordinate for on in person, not at the NTC. Like back in New York in the studio recording for one of these? Yeah, You missed getting to go because it feels so much more official than just talking to you on the phone right now. You know, they’re with headphones on and a big microphone. That’s like, the proper way to do it. Yes, you do. Yeah. Andi, we’re in a new studio where two studios from the last duty or you were in with me. We’re not now. Yeah, we’re in a new studio. Just Ah, just a couple weeks. But this is my first recording in the new studio and tomorrow’s show we’re recording on Thursday. Of course, tomorrow’s show will be the very first, very first full show in the studio, so Yeah, well, when you’re in New York, you let me know and we’ll we’ll do our best to work it out. Okay, I will. Okay. In the meantime, let’s talk, uh, trans nationally, Um, and, uh, Emma. Emma, Tony was just talking about my burning my burning question. From what she said, Is there gonna be on ntcdinosaur Lee because she wants one? Well, I appreciate that He does. And I appreciate this is so important to you that you consider it a burning question myself. Course. Didn’t you clearly want to go back to Italy? I would look exactly, exactly right. Fund-raising present involved. L fund-raising was wonderful. Is there gonna be in it will be an NTC, which she called in 10. But we know everybody does that, but she means ntcdinosaur Is it gonna be one in Italy? 2020 2021. Uh, well, we have plenty of NTC contracts for 2021 22 contracting 23 right now and 24 later this year. All of those locations are in the continental U. S. And 10 you know, has a office in Portland. So we as staff, are always trying to petition Andrea unconference director to let us go to Hawaii for NBC. We haven’t done that quite yet. We haven’t. We haven’t won her over. You know, we do get a number of folks request stains, even if it isn’t the NTC as the NTC. But at least requesting that N 10 convene events in other parts of the world and that the US is super awesome. It’s great that people really trust and enjoy the events that we put on at this point. You know, we have kind of a two sided coin to this for the NTC. It just has not made sense for our mission and our Gail and how many staff we have to try and go outside the U. S. For our other programs where they’re delivered online. And that is definitely something that folks do actively participate in from all over the world. We have folks who gotten their professional certificates from us, for example from, um, Switzerland and Canada and the all over. So we know that those programs are easier for us to scale in that way. But the NTC hasn’t yet. However, I and other staff often support convenience elsewhere. Whether we’re on, you know, planning teams are we helped recruit speakers or we ourselves travel there to speak. So the end 10 the in tennis that we can contain as individuals gets to go to other places. But so far on the docket, there is not an empty seat. Aly and very sorry. Okay, I understand. This is this is why you’re a CEO. So so diplomatic and eloquent. If somebody asked me that question and I was in your job well, first of all, I would never get hired. I could never be a jump. But assuming I was in some hypothetical world, my answer would be No, no, no, no. Plan to go to Italy. We’re not. You know, it’s We normally have around 20 countries outside the U. S. Represented at the MTC, and we often prioritized some portion of our scholarships for international participants because we know that the cost burden for them to come from very far away is so much higher than folks within the continental U. S. So we we recognize and really appreciate that there is a really international community for intent. It isn’t just us spoke, of course. Um, yeah. Okay. So, so diplomatic. So you know that I’ve ever been called, Have Now you have now. Yeah, I I’m gonna yet save this recording, and I think I’m beautified. I know you pretty well. You know what? We’ll talk every week, but I think I know you fairly well. I think your diplomatic. Yeah, I’m Bonified. My opinion destroyed already. Um, so related to the end. 10 work, of course, is Ah, a big part of the intern. Work is local real time events that you have scaled throughout the country, and I think even aren’t you Also is there Aren’t there in 10 events in in London, too? Yeah, they’re in 10 events. In-kind the U S or international. Exactly. So, yeah, that’s our That’s our topic. Um, what do we, uh, What’s what’s your What are your thoughts on what you heard? And yeah, I mean things that I was talking about that Not that I don’t think she doesn’t agree. Just that you two didn’t get into details. And now I get the benefit of going of going. Second is the idea about localizing that content, you know, making it you’re talking about, like not just translating from English to another language, but really making sure it’s relevant to folks in that area and something that we’ve found a lot is you can’t You can’t say toe a whole network of local groups, right? Like tomorrow we’re talking about this topic because even the topic isn’t gonna be relevant in every single space. Right? Or the way folks talk about that topic may be very different. And I’m sure you experienced this in fundrasing work to write, like, some people are going to call a certain thing by a different term. And if you tell everybody this is the term we’re using, there’s going to be certain pockets of the community that just don’t even care because they don’t realize you’re talking about the same thing. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Uh, terms, um, and just sensibilities. You know how you would go about fund-raising in one part of the country is very different than how you might do it in the Northeast, where people are often considered brash and too forward has to be more genteel in other parts of the country, like Midwest. I’m thinking probably south to I haven’t worked there, but yeah, absolutely. So, um yeah, that Andi, you’re right. We do. We sort of just touched on that, But the local sensibilities and that’s the advantage of local partnerships. I mean, you need to you need to rely on them as much as they’re relying on you for some support, right? And I think that kind of relationship and roll piece is what makes her brakes programs like this right. Organizations see themselves as having the role of making decisions, letting all of those folks on the ground know what the decision is and they’re there to implement it. That’s not motivating for them, but also it’s not going to be reflective of those local communities, right. So organizations already doing this type of work or trying to move towards this type of work really need to recognize that their role is meant to be the aggregator of what’s happening those groups and not the decider of what happened in those groups. Of course, that’s not to say, like all of your community groups can just run amok and do whatever they want Theirs, of course guidelines and hopefully lots of shared values and principles and purpose to why these groups are meeting and really focusing on that shared purpose will make sure the topics they bring up for what they want to d’oh with their group kind of stays in the right realm. But it then gets to be in their control and as the organization you’re there to aggregate it lifted back-up make sure it’s profiled, and that even goes, as far as you know, talking about tools. And I would love to hear your take. I know you were talking a little bit with them about Facebook live. I also have seen far fewer Facebook live. Um, invite your organizations using that, Um, so we can talk about that in a second, but just along the same lines as an organization, it’s not gonna work. If you tell everything, will group. You have to use the book live for your event because there’s gonna be groups that maybe are really small and only have a few people, and none of them know how to do that. And it’s better that that group is meeting than that group is trying to spend their time figuring out how to broadcast their meetings. Right? So not saying every single person, regardless of your location and contacts and topic, needs to use Facebook lives. But, hey, if you want to and you are able to stream, here are a few different tools. You know, you mentioned Zoom, for example, something that we do it intended. We say you get to use and 10 zoom account right like you don’t even need to try and pay for it or figure it out. We will just let you log in and host your event, right? So making it accessible and then folks can choose Oh, for us. Like we do know how to use Zoom. We know how this works. We’re going to do it. And another group could use Facebook live. Another group doesn’t have to use anything, you know, And recognizing that that means as the organization, you’re not going to get to see the event on dhe. They not every single group on your Web site is gonna have a little video link, and that has to be okay, right? There has to be, um, expectation that not every single group is gonna look exactly the same. It’s gonna have all the same content gonna have all of the same outlets and that that doesn’t mean the program isn’t successful, right? No, it’s not very hard because we’re used to having, like, a very perfect spreadsheet that says, like, Yes, yes, yes. All these groups did this, right? So having all the groups have different way they operate, makes it harder to evaluate. And that’s our problem is the organization. It’s not the program’s problem. Yeah, Yeah. Excellent. Okay. You raised a couple things. Uh, we’re gonna that we’re about to take a break. But I see an analogy with this in years ago when we used to talk about should should the community allow public Facebook comments, you know, are in any of the public networks I see in an analog to that. And then also, I want to talk some more about what kind of support a lot of the larger organization can offer. Thio local whatever they’re called. Chapters, affiliates groups, however, but we got to take this. Take this break, all right? It’s our last break. Turn to communications, PR and content for your non-profit. They help you tell your compelling stories and get media attention on those stories and build support for your work. You can count on them. This is what they do. Media relations, content, marketing, communications and marketing strategy and branding strategy. You’ll find them a turn hyphen to dot ceo. I’ve got butt loads more time with Amy Sample Ward. So yes. So I see. I see this analogy to I guess it was eight years ago or something? Whatever. Seven years ago, we’re talking about public comments. What if people say things that we don’t like? Um, you know, I’ve seen analogy out. There will be things we don’t like all day long, but the fear that you know, the fear going into this that it would be it would be anarchy. And, well, you know, uh, we won’t be ableto moderator. Should we Should we delete, you know, et cetera. So I sort of seeing an analogy to that. Those conversations we used to have back and I guess the dark days of social, the social networks. Well, you know, this might TF some of the conversation you want to have about resource ing, but I think the the biggest investment that organizations need to make in a program like this, where you’re gonna have distributed community groups of some sort, running some type of programming that you’re not present for is to invest in whoever those organizers are gonna be. The more they feel like an extension of the organization and actual leaders of this program, the more they’re going to feel comfortable and confident managing those types of reputational risk in person. on your behalf, right? If they feel like they’re just here to implement something and you know the organization sent them this saying that says Okay, go to here. Here’s the contact at the venue. We’ve already picked the venue. You didn’t even get to pick that, you know, And they’re showing up. Well, they’re not really filled with a bunch of responsibilities, right? So they’re not going to take it upon themselves to say, Hey like that we’re not having that conversation here. Or that’s not feedback that we’re having in this room, you know, whatever. But if you are really invested in them and building them up as the ambassadors and leaders of this program, they will be able to kind of carry that forward for you in person. And that’s the best safeguard you could build empowerment, empowerment you want. You want to empower your local leaders like and, as I was saying earlier, relying on them to but empowering them what, what some other kind of support. I mean, you mentioned a platform support. That’s that’s valuable, although, like you said, some groups might just want to meet. Maybe they only want to meet in real life. Maybe they’re tired of whatever they do or, you know, I mean, I think it’s also a good recognition that not all events format are great for streaming my right. Ah, an event that, you know, maybe in the summer, instead of having a speaker of the event. It’s a networking social. Nobody wants to be on video, just watching a bunch of people who were having to write. Recognizing that one piece of support we often find ourselves providing to Organizer’s is help this kind of mixing things up and having different formats and actually knowing, Ah, great deal about how you just put on events, right? So that we are a resource for them. Any time where they say, Okay, we don’t have a speaker lined up. Should we just cancel anything you don’t have to cancel? There’s lots of different event for months, but don’t have a featured speaker here, Like, you know, let’s open the kind of metaphorical binder and go through it together, right? So, being experts internally again, not so that you are prescribing, requiring the way that organizers do there that you are then, like the Event Planner Dictionary. For them, it’s super, super helpful and probably the number one thing that organizers in our programs like that call on us for all the time. The very first thing I thought of when you and Emma started talking with something that you and I have talked about a number of times, including, you know, insert. However many years ago, we first started doing these segments and that the if an organization is already taking the time to build up a program, why not build those resource is into tool kits and templates so that organizers don’t even have to bother emailing or calling you to ask for that help. Right? There’s a tool kit that says, Here are three event formats that don’t have a speaker, right? And they could just be like, Oh, phew! Okay, let’s choose one of these, you know, for next month. Since we don’t have a speaker. Whatever building up ready to use resource is is I mean, I could never recommend it enough. You’re already doing that work. You probably already built the template. You just keep it on your computer instead of putting it somewhere where all the organizer’s can access. Okay. Excellent. Yeah, right. the work is done. Just share it way, right? Yeah. Yeah. And we’ve talked about that in terms of identity. And, um what else? What else should be what? It zoho obvious that I can’t think of them. I don’t do this, but what else should be shared like that? Like like meeting temple? Well, yeah, that’s definitely like event formats and that kind of thing. Honestly, the things that we have, especially new Organizer’s folks who are just coming in into that role, but often times in a new city, right? Not that they’re new to that city, but it’s a new city for the program or our new location for the program. The things that they really really benefit from our templates for e mails because that’s where they get to start learning the tone and the personality of the program, right? They’re not expected to know that off the bat and be ableto, you know, send emails out to the local list and everything without just on their own, already knowing that giving them templates like, Hey, here’s the first message that you could send out that says, Hey, we’re starting a group and we want to do a survey of what folks want locally. Amglobal latto. Or here’s a email template for when you have an event scheduled in your, you know, sending it out to put on people calendars. And over time they’ll stop needing those things, but really just definitely something you already have. Right now we have every man we’ve ever sent, so just pull out some of those example. Emails kind of make them generic, right? Like in all caps, City name or whatever. But that’s a huge reverse that folks really have taken a man’s job in our program because it just saved them a lot of stress thinking they’re going to say the wrong thing on Dhe. We interpret that is them really caring right and wanting to make sure that they’re representing and 10 the best they can. And so we want to take that pressure off them and to say, Here are templates and it’s okay to use the gifts and, you know, do what you want to do, have fun with the group because that’s really how we want our kind of brand to be extended, and that takes a lot of pressure off. So basic emails events format and then things like, How do you find a venue and how do you get a local sponsor? Because oftentimes, at least in our experience and our programs, the folks who become organizers are there because they really love the people in the content of the meetings, not because they’re very experienced or even enjoy, like the hustle around town of like High. Will you give us $100 high? Will you donate some pizza? Hi. Can we meet in your office? You know, that’s not the fun part of organizing. And so tips and resource sheets that say, You know, many cities have these types of venues Coworking faces library e-giving them kind of ah, starter kit of where to look for reverses and venues is also really helpful. And we’ve found that’s one of the tools that folks organizer’s like to contribute back thio and add their ideas. So then the next time an organizer is looking at it also has ideas from from other organized. All right, all right. We met at the local museum, and it was fabulous, and they even included a brief tour of the collection and yeah, yeah, Okay. Yeah, learning from each other. Of course. Wonderful. Um, you mentioned Facebook live vs Zoom. And you wanted a want to flush that out a little more, I think. Yeah, I was just curious what you have, what? Your experience that has been. I know that you know that you did some tests with Facebook live? Yeah, it’s difficult. Yeah, I think the 1st 1 failed. Technically, technically. And I have an excellent social manager, Susan Chavez, who are happy to shout out. But there was some button radio, you know, some radio button wasn’t selected right or something. And the thing failed. Um, yeah. And and she knows what she’s doing. No, but yeah, she missed something in the back end. Set up Facebook. So I’m not not through with Facebook. Yeah, And then when we did do it, we did do a live segment. Um, it got some attention. It didn’t didn’t get as much as I would have liked, but some of that may be our own fault in, uh, doing sort of last. Well, maybe not last minute, Like the hour, but not allowing ourselves enough promotion time. That’s what I mean. And just and from the technical side. I much prefer Zoom. The damn thing is just so much easier. There aren’t a whole right. There isn’t a dozen radio buttons you have to configure correctly to get a get a live stream going. It’s all in the background. You pick a few things in settings and very few, and you could be up and running. And it has the auto invitation e mails. And I’m very impressed with Zoom. And you must be due because you said you offer it, use it and you offer it to local local groups for for nothing. Yeah, we’ve been using them. I mean, we used hang out. Um, Skype. We use lots of different things for lots of different purposes, you know? But, um, we just offer you some validation. We have the same experience with Facebook live. I think we tried it two or three times and basically every time failed. One of the time I stopped stopped in the middle of the video and we had to, like, log back in again even though it was broadcasting. So, you know, like maybe five people watched it. But riel reflection there is just like we were saying before. Really choosing the tool based on what you’re doing into the people are and sound like them is working for you. You know, for us we always feel like, you know, are we being so like dodgy by having these kind of boring community calls where we expect people to, like go to our website and say they’re coming and get a link and, you know, have it be kind of like a traditional webinar experience. But when we’ve done things like, you know, Facebook live and whatever else and they’ve been well promoted, there’s like five people there, but for our community calls where we’re doing them in our kind of traditional way of sending emails out and people go to the website and register that they want to come and log in at that very specific time. There’s, like 60 70 people on, so why I feel bad that that’s not working right and why try and go use some shiny Facebook tool that clearly doesn’t work. It’s not very sure it’s very tarnished by now. And if N. 10 which formerly had the word technology in its in its name, can’t figure this out and has a live stream stopping in the middle because of it. I think that that speaks a lot. And I also have seen I’ve been I’ve been invited recently to a lot more zoom events or just meetings just just one on one meetings or or three person meetings on Zoom. Then I have Facebook life. We just have. We have, like, a minute or so left before we have to end already. Um, what are the other recommended tools? Can you can you just take off a couple? Mmm, Other tools. You know something that we don’t know how much we’ve really talked about it, cause it’s not necessarily a social media tool, but it is something that we see the organizer’s really, really relying on. And that’s can va, you know, can yeah, can before for art. Yes, So, like a really lightweight version of photo shop. And what super helpful about it that also has social media templates. So, like these are the dimensions for a Facebook header image that you know all of those pieces. So for Organizer’s, it’s a super easy tool to use, you know, to like change up their promotional materials and make you know images to attach to their tweets to promote an event and that kind of thing. Can you Okay, I give you 30 seconds. Can you take off one more? One more. Quick. Good. Valuable resource. Mmm Mmm mmm. Oh, my gosh. Not under pressure. Uh, got it all graceful under pressure. You know, I think the other thing I was gonna add it’s not a technical tool, but is just a reminder is that you don’t need thio. Put all of the advice into practice because you have a very formalized, already launched program. It may just be that you wanna host across your city a bunch of house parties, right? All of these same kind of pieces of advice and tools and suggestions apply to that same contact, So don’t feel like the whole conversation was only for big international program. This is for anybody that’s trying to decentralize. You’re content in your work. Awesome. That’s a very, very apt ending. Thank you so much. Amy. Sample Ward Amy, Sample word dot or ge And at Amy Rs Ward. Always a pleasure. Thanks so much for sharing, Amy. Yeah, Thanks, Tony. Uh, my pleasure to so long. Next week, Jean Takagi will be with me for the hour on recruiting your board members. If you missed any part of today’s show, I beseech you, find it on tony. Martignetti dot com were sponsored by Wagner. C. P A’s guiding you beyond the numbers regular cps dot com But cook a Mountain software Denali fundez They’re complete accounting solution made for non-profits 20 dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for non-profits, Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to dot CEO A creative producers. Claire Meyer off Sam Liebowitz is the line producer shows social Media is by Serbs and Chavez. Mark Silverman is our Web guy, and this cool music is by Scott Stein with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit Ideas for the other 95% Go out and be great What you’re listening to the Talking Alternate network. You’re listening to the Talking Alternative Network. Are you stuck in a rut? Negative thoughts, feelings and conversations got you down. Hi, I’m nor in Sumpter potentially ater tune in every Tuesday at 9 to 10 p.m. Eastern time and listen for new ideas on my show yawned potential Live life your way on talk radio dot N Y c aptly named host of Tony martignetti non-profit Radio Big non-profit ideas for the other 95% fund-raising board relations, social media. My guests and I cover everything that small and midsize shops struggle with. If you have big dreams and a small budget, you have a home at Tony martignetti, non-profit Radio Fridays 1 to 2 Eastern at talking alternative dot com Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business. Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested? 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Nonprofit Radio for August 30, 2019: Online Major Giving & Online Adversity

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Adam London, Carrie Rice & Anneliese Davis: Online Major Giving
Do you have web forms for your major donors? Our 19NTC panel hashes the pros and cons of automating major giving and—if you decide to expand to online—how to work around the obstacles. They’re Adam London at Project Donor Love; Carrie Rice from Carrie Rice Consulting; and Anneliese Davis with Rahab’s Sisters.




Burt Edwards: Online Adversity
How do you maintain personal and organizational values when people are screaming at you in the social networks? Burt Edwards, our panel of one from 19NTC, shares strategies and systems that keep your staff, supporters and social ambassadors safe when they speak out online. He’s from Friends of the Columbia Gorge.




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Transcript for 455_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190830.mp3 Processed on: 2019-08-31T18:57:44.018Z S3 bucket containing transcription results: transcript.results Link to bucket: s3.console.aws.amazon.com/s3/buckets/transcript.results Path to JSON: 2019…08…455_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190830.mp3.155990547.json Path to text: transcripts/2019/08/455_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190830.txt Hello and welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d suffer the effects of Psycho in Drusus if you hard into me with the idea that you missed today’s show online. Major e-giving. Do you have Web forms for your major donors? Are 19 ntcdinosaur. Hash is the pros and cons of automating major e-giving. And if you decide to expand toe online, how to work around the obstacles there? Adam London at Project Donors of Carry Rice From Carrie Rice Consulting and Annalise Ed Davis with Ray ABS Sisters and online Adversity How do you maintain personal and organizational values when people are screaming at you in the social networks? Bert Edwards, Our panel of one from 19 NTC shares strategies and systems that keep your staff supporters and social ambassador’s safe when they speak out online. He’s from Friends of the Columbia Gorge on Tony’s take to your board’s role in planned e-giving responsive by Wagner CPS Guiding you beyond the numbers wagner cps dot com By koegler Mountain Software Denali fundez. They’re complete accounting solution made for non-profits tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for non-profits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to dot CEO. Here’s online Major e-giving Welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 NTC. You know what that is? It’s a 2019 non-profit technology conference. You know that we’re coming to you from the convention center in Portland, Oregon, and at all of our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at Act Blue Free fund-raising tools to help non-profits make an impact. What you don’t know is that my panel now is seated with me. And they are Adam London carry Rice and Anna Lisa Davis. Adam is founder of Project Donors of Carrie is non-profit consultant carry Rice consulting and Anna Lisa Davis is the executive director at Rehabs Sisters. Welcome altum each of you. Thank you, Tony. Thanks. Thanks for joining us. Your session topic was 21st century major e-giving creating an effective online major gift program. I thought this was interesting. I don’t I don’t see much about online major e-giving program. So that’s what caught my attention to this. Why I invited you to come. I like to start down The end is the person down? The end sometimes feels at least at least part of this, although they’re not. But sometimes they feel so we’re gonna start with Lisa. Um What? What? What are the possibilities? Just like headline over a big, big picture. What are the possibilities here online, Major e-giving. Well, we’re a very small organization that didn’t really start doing fund-raising in an intentional way until I came on board is the first staff member a year and 1/2 ago. And so, working with carry on, Adam, they’ve helped us think creatively about how we engage people online without having a huge development staff or a lot of board members who could go out and talk to Major Gibbs. Okay, So you moved it online or you didn’t move it online. You started it online. We started a major give program is native online. It is okay. And you work with Carrie? I did. Yeah, we did. We do. Absolutely. She did a wonderful board treat for us last year, and then it grew into this project. No surprise, Carrie, uh is this a trend that I’m not aware of. Are you seeing Maur? We arika program. We’re starting. We’re starting the trend. Yes, we It was more like an area where we saw the But there was a hole out there, which was that there are people who, for example, in an in person ask if you let’s say you’ve done all the research, you’re ready to make the ask for 25 $6100 whatever it is that if you then get a pledge from them, you have to go home, get in envoys, right attack, get a return envelope and so forth and do all these things to make the donation. Whereas in this way someone says, Yeah, that’s it. $100,000 sounds great. And you say, Well, if you want, you can fill out this form right now and get your frequent flyer miles right now on your black card, you know, and boom, it’s done. So that was something that people started saying, like, That’s a really good idea on Ben also being able to directly using direct mail or using email to be able to contact people who are major donors in Anna Lisa’s case, they’re just now figuring out what a major donor is and what their capacity is, but figuring out what that number is and then being able to direct people to a different form. It’s not a poor form and a rich form, it’s just an unlisted folk. Are you directly? Yeah. We’ll get to the details. Okay. Adam. What? What? What’s? Ah, Product dahna loves rolling This You have online Major e-giving Also Sure. So project dahna Love is an agency in San Francisco. We design and build custom websites on reporting a Pardon me. Oh, you’re okay. You’re not a non-profit. I’m not a non-profit. Okay? Project dahna love sounds like Okay, Okay. I’m sorry I interrupted you expect so? Yes. We built we design and build custom websites and reporting tools for non-profits. We have a particular interest in donation forms in optimizing and customizing donation forms to make them to get maximum conversions out of them. And we also interested in bringing in modern U ex practices and also leveraging the organization’s data to really improve their fund-raising online. Okay. Okay. Um, so what’s the, uh Well, I guess including for rehab sisters this is This is the beginning of your major gift program. You’ve just been doing fund-raising, you said, for a year and 1/2 for him for amore mature organization that’s got a well established major gift program. And let’s say you know our listeners, Aaron Small, a midsize shop. So let’s say they define a major gift as $10,000. Okay, And of course, they have giving $1000 level. There’s a society for that, etcetera. But they define for their fund-raising major gifts $10,000. Carrie. What would what would be the advantage to looking at an online major gift program for them? What would that look like? Well, the first thing is, we have very passionate and strong views about recurring gifts. So if you were someone who considered yourself prepared to give $10,000 is a one time gift, there’s a pretty good chance that you’re willing to give $1000 a month. So I just raised your gift 20% and now you can split it up into $1000 a month, which fits into your monthly budget. So it’s kind of ah, different way of thinking, but it’s just right right there off the top. By encouraging the recurring gifts on the major for on the form it gives people the opportunity to actually give us give someone a little more. So what’s new then, is that we’re offering someone the opportunity. Thio make a $10,000 gift online. And then I understand we’re trying to convert them to Stainer, but we’re we’re offering higher levels of giving online. That’s crap. In the exhibition, which case over 5000 you’d have to send a check or transfer stock. Exactly. Exactly. And in the case of an organization like rehab sisters, they use a fairly small, less robust donation platform. And so we kind of had to pick. Are we going to encourage one time gifts or we gonna encourage recurring gifts? And so, in this particular case, we chose Onley monthly gifts and to make it on Lee a major gift sustainers level period because that was the best thing to do with the software that was available in this situation. And Elisa, What kind of outcomes are you seeing? What kind of interest are you? Feedback getting any feedback from donors? Well, we’ve just started rolling it out with our supporters. We have been Typically, we’ve had very low, you know, like a $15.20 dollar a month sustainers kind of program on. And now we’re being able to go out and ask folks for us, Would you do $100 a month? We could just click right here and get you signed up. And people like the convenience of being able to do it right then and there. Um, and it just it kind of speed the process along because again, being a one person shop for everything I am, the less follow-up I have two. D’oh! After that particular meeting, the better, much, much better. It’s time for a break. Regular C P A. Is they have a new wagon are on September 10th. Leaders Guide to Understanding, not for profit financials, CEOs, board members, directors You don’t need accounting details that’s not necessary for you, but a realistic and basic understanding of financial statements will boost your decision making. You’ll find it at weinger cps dot com. Quick resource is and upcoming events Now back to online major giving. Adam What? What is your advice around streamlining this process that we’re talking about. Carrie was talking about trying to get recurring gifts. That’s definitely part of it. But the biggest thing probably is segmentation, actually, with all fund-raising segmentation critical, but particularly when we’re talking about major gifts online. Firstly, we want the major gift for more forms to be something that is hidden from the main navigation. So this is something that you are only directing your major givers to via email or doing it in person or by direct mail. Okay, And then what is that? Well, because the first reason is that there’s no very graceful way to have a donation landing page that says, You know, big money Year little money here, Onda. Also, if you have a single donation form that has both very large suggested mounts in the thousands of dollars on more typical 29 2150 that’s a confusing situation for anyone who lands. There is a small donor. Those large amounts might make you think, Well, that’s my $50 gift. Even worth it if they’re asking for $5000 okay. And if you’re at the high end right, you’re feeling like, why am I? Why am I on the same page is the $25 Don’t exactly. Yes. Do they really need this? 5000 different? There are $25. So putting them, making sure that these two populations get into donation forms that are targeted at the amount you expect them to make you see. And then you can also have multiple donation forms. There’s another great aspect off doing this online because if you’re able to segment your don’t know major donors more finally into high high level donors, high mid owners, et cetera, then you can have separate donation forms for each of these segments or separate donation forms for campaign or things like that. Okay, okay, um, from your session description, you you talked about using Is it events? As an in person asked Carry, you were describing? The person asked earlier. What about that events? How does that look? Like so at an event? So let’s say you’re having a reasonably priced, for example, like a gala or something, that 100 t it’s $10 a ticket, Um, and then you have ipads set up around the room and, oh, are you have interns or assistants who are able to go around from table to table and say, You know, instead of filling out this pledge envelope like you’ve seen those pledge envelopes in the middle of the table, please take a pledge of open fill it out. But if someone came up to you and said they’ve got a tablet in here you go. I’m gonna hand it to you right now. And I’m not going to show you the $15 to $75.1. I’m going to show you the Esso We’re going around to the tables. The tables are saying What Anyone What exactly What is that look like? You’re saying what? I would like to make a gift tonight, Right? Exactly. Exactly. And then just say I have a really easy way. And then I like to be somewhat playful for it and say, you know, you could have your frequent flyer miles by tomorrow. Yeah, You know, just just being able to say, like, just do this right here, right now and boom, you’ll get an instant Thank you. That has a photograph and an impact statement. And then I know for rehab sisters, they send ah, hand written, personalized Thank you Card. A little bit later in the future, but they get that instant gratification. All right, So, Annalise, that you’ve done this at events or an event? Not yet. That’s good. Sign. Coming. Coming. Coming up. Okay, okay. They’re just really good at thinking people. I just know that from personal. All right, so then you just So then the person with the was working for the organization, Just asked, how much would you like to donate? Right. So they’re going to show them a major donor level. So again, like, let’s say it’s $200 a person, and so you’ve got on the sheet on the form, you know, 500 a 1025 105,000 and fill in the amount you want. And then they look at that and they can say, What can I give $100? Yes. Can I give a million dollars? Yes, but we’re we’re prepping them. Were prompting them to be thinking OK paid $200 to come here, and I was planning on giving something anyway. And this is like this super super simple way to do it. All right, So if it is ah, $200 a ticket gala. Where would you start the ask string? What would your advice speak? Ah, well, I would say get them drinking. First way to talk about the time I just wear hearing that. Yeah. So 20 and physically, You know, on the donation form, what would you start the ask string with the with the numbers be mount. What amount would you start? No, that’s particularly gonna depend on the whole matter. Ask. Yeah, it is okay. Making me feel like I don’t know what I know I’m feeling. I just I didn’t know. You thought I meant what? Where, like what time in the program. Okay. Yeah, really? You can’t generalize of its $200 ticket. Would you start the ask string up to 50 or 505 100 or something like that? Yeah. Um I mean, we are still in the early stages. We’ve just It’s only been less than a year that we’ve been doing this so we don’t have a huge number to look at me. Oh, yeah. We think it really depends on the organization. And we want to work with the executive director, the development director, maybe even the board to get an idea of what feels like they’re normal. Okay. You want to look at the donation history of the organization to see what kind of major gives that? Got what? The average major can build the US base it more visible on a e-giving history of the organization, like medium givers. Then the ticket price. Okay, Okay. I take the simple minded approach. See, my fund-raising is all the consulting out. It was all planned e-giving So we’re not talking about these events, you know? We’re not gonna sign your way. Have an attorney in the corner preparing wills or way Do it through legalzoom if you want. You know you can, you know. So I’m not doing event based play e-giving fund-raising. Right? But on the major gift form, there could be a little box there that says I am interested for sure, Absolutely. But I’m you know, I’m not running fund-raising at events as planned giving, but I’m not saying Of course, I I’m the evangelist for plan giving with that without the religious overtones. I mean, I’m always put it on your envelope flaps. Put on your business cards. Put in your email signature included in your will ask how? Yes. Absolutely Another great point about these. I guess. I was just trying to justify myself minded suggestion of basing it on the ticket price. Okay, Go ahead. Adam. I’m sorry. Yeah. I wanted to say another great point about doing this online is that you can also integrate these online forms into a more traditional major gift. Ask situation. Living room. Explain that. Oh, yes. So you could make the couple has decided No point in waiting. Exactly. Like if you’re online form works well with mobile devices, which you definitely should do. Then you can bring a tablet to a meeting with major donor. Sure. And then when they’re ready to make the donation instead of writing the check or getting a promise to make a donation, you can actually have them get the credit card to make the donation, right? Would you like to do it right now? No pressure, exactly. But if you like, we could We could do it right now. And you can have your frequent flyer miles tomorrow. And I think that free and Elisa, that’s gonna end up being a good fit for your board members. For example, Yes, absolutely. Um and Adam, I was I was thinking about in my previous life before I did grassroots non-profits and I did a large asks from major donors up. I had one asks situation where the CEO insisted that after the person who made the $100,000 commitment, she had to get their credit card right then and the only thing I had in my purse was a valet ticket. And so we wrote her credit card for $100,000 gift with the back of a valet ticket. And so this approach altum sophisticated, sophisticated, secure, right, right. That’s an interesting policy, CEO Yu, That is not a little pressure for ah, gift officer. You you have to get the credit card. She was She was closer. She was all right. She is a bold woman. Thanks for your commitment. Let’s do it right now. I mean, I’m saying, let’s offer to do it right. Rather not use our tablet. You’re welcome to mail you a check or we never even pull out the tablet in the first place because you just know that that’s not the right person based on the conversation, even still in their eighties. And they’ve already told you three times that they never made a single purchase online. They’re certainly not gonna make their $50,000 gift. Exactly your tablet. Okay, of course. Okay, uh, we’re all learning here. I’m trainable. Treatable. Um, let’s see the event. That’s really interesting about the events. Um, you also talked about how to create the forms. Adam, any more advice on the you can share on the details of the form I love. Of course. I love the plant Giving checkoff. Sure. So thank you for that. As I said, segmentation is key to this. You want to have a separate home for the major gift form and then ideally have different major gift forms, different giving levels or different segments that you’ve identified within your major donors? You definitely, especially on a major gift for model. Give formers, Really? But these sort of things become more important as the money goes up. You want to form to look like the rest of your organization’s website. That’s a place where a lot of non-profit forms. Unfortunately, full down is you’ll find a great, well designed website, good information, easy to navigate and then you reach the donation form and it looks nothing like the rest of the site. It’s a default site. It’s a default donation form for whatever vendor they have for their online donation. For so finding an online donation form that you can make it look like your sight. We can get a CZ much control as you can. Over what information you’re asking. Four. So you’re not asking, you know, forcing people to enter the phone number, for example. Things like that. Yes. You want to control, You want it to look like a form. And you definitely wanted to work well on mobile devices. Yeah, we’re past the mobile mobile mobile optimization discussion. Oh, yes. We just know that everything everything, including your donation form and needs to be optimized for a tablet and phone. OK, we’re past that. Oh, yes. We still but we still have to bring it up. We start, we do have to bring it up. Unfortunately, yeah, we still dumpster full way still remind people that over 50% of peep people today are using mobile first, so it’s only gonna go up from here. It’s not going to go down. Okay? Okay, and at least I’m feeling bad about you over there. But you don’t. You don’t have a lot of experience just rolling this out. So, uh, what do you Anything you wanna say that is related to what, Uh, Adam and Carrie, You’re saying, uh, you want to contribute? I mean, just beyond. From what? We were just talking about it for a small shop, Something like this is a really handy tool toe, have. Like I said, you don’t have to worry about doing as much follow-up. And you’ve got something in your back pocket. You can pull up and you don’t have to use a valet ticket. So wrinkled valet ticket. It’s a good point is you don’t necessarily need to have a huge budget to get started with this. Very good. That’s implicit in what we’re saying. Yes, we identify rehabs as one employee. No, but thank you for making one and 1/2 now, right? Oh, no. Technically, we’re both part times 11 tone. Oh, yeah. All right. So But thank you for making explicit Adam. Absolutely right. This is ideal for small shops, right? There’s a lot of online donation tools that do have reasonable donation forms that you can work with to integrate NTS site, make it look reasonably like inside and then use those to get started with. Of course, you know, spending more money lets you have more flexibility in terms of what the form is ensuring into personalization for each individual, which could be very powerful. And what Adam was saying earlier about where you send people online because our support has typically come from volunteers who give very small amounts transition we’ve gone through now where we’re going out into the community and getting much larger gifts. Volunteers. I’ve been really worried about how volunteers are gonna feel like, Is there $15 gift not valued anymore? That’s if they see all these hyre options. Statham’s point of having segmentation of dahna donation forms so that one caps out at 7500 right? Okay. In the ask string. Yes, I was I was implicitly It was implied that I didn’t know what I was talking about. Uh, obstacles. You have a little discussion about obstacles, challenges to this on how to overcome them. Carry well, having having had the opportunity to work with Anna Lisa and her board as it was going through a transition, and a new board was coming on where there were, in particular people who were coming on that had a lot of non-profit experience. We having the board’s support for something like this when it was very possible when we proposed this to Anna Lisa that her board could have said like, What do we need for with a major gift form? We’ve only been, you know, But she has an incredibly supportive board. And so, making sure that you have boards support and that they understand why you’re bothering to do this is a key component of it. It’s not just about the staff and the donors being happy, but it’s also about making sure that, well, that that everybody gets it and that the board supports it. What would you say it was? Your, uh, we’re putting you in hypothetical. Now you’re in a board meeting, and, uh, they’re saying exactly, that would mean online donations, for we have meetings. We have. We have We have two little bigger organization. We have, uh, we have two full time fundraisers. What we eat online donation form forward. Who’s this consultant who brought this consultant to this meeting, right? Exactly. Don’t go that far. Yeah, well, yeah. No e. Everybody is grateful for consultant. Why would anybody about a consultant, But just not to your face. What would you say to that room? Reluctant board. I would say this is the in the improv. The yes, and you know, this is Yeah. Everything you’re doing is great. We’re not telling you to do anything different. We’re just giving you an additional tool to use. And so if, for example, I were stewarding someone and things have been going really well and I’m ready to send them an email solicitation that I can put the hyperlink to the major gift form. Same thing with a direct mail piece. Same thing with a conversation, whatever. But I can. I can build that as being a norm for those donors, but it’s really up to the officer of how they’re going to use it again. Annalise doesn’t have the opportunity to have someone who’s going to be dedicated to using this, but she also she’s very sophisticated with her online users, so she’s gonna be ableto go in and change. The amounts are at another form or do those kinds of things on her own on Dhe. And then if she ends up with a development director and in the not too distant future, then that person can say, OK, wow, amazing. This organization already has this tool set up for me. I’m gonna see where it’s appropriate to use it to persuade the board that is just another tool and uses that at their discretion when the relationship is right or the boardmember right? Yeah, I also hear that it’s a future facing thing that this I think that online major fund-raising is going to be more and more standard as time goes on. I mean, where were based in San Francisco. There are plenty of young households with an income over 300,000 who don’t really use checks for anything. Yeah, so there’s plenty of people out there who are willing to make major gifts online for cash using cash either. But you’re right that as they mature, it’s gonna it’s just gonna that trend is just gonna continue. Yeah, I was with somebody, uh, they were nephew and niece, probably under 30 at the time, and we were coming back from a restaurant and they were locked out of their apartment. And the building owner sent the representative. But it was late, So there was a $50 service charge t open the lock, and neither one of them had the cash and they couldn’t, and they got into the apartment, you know, he did let them in and they couldn’t find their checkbook. I mean, I know exactly where my checkbook is, and I always carry cash. But neither one of them had either have to fry 50 bucks for the surface for the midnight service call to get them into their apartment, to not find cash or a cheque book inside that couldn’t find it dollars back? Uh, no, that’s still a point of contention. And as a result, I did not send a birthday gift this year. Um, don’t Don’t mess with me. I bailed him out. If it hadn’t been for me, the guy would not have let them in. What they have done, gone to an A t. M. Maybe they couldn’t find the debit card. They couldn’t find the checkbook for guns. And I know exactly where my checkbook in my top dresser drawer. Right, But um, you know, if you had a, uh, habit If that vendor if that the person that was sent out had the square, then they could take the person’s credit. Unsophisticated. That’s where things were going is that I want to be able Thio Just go on my phone and be like, 0 $50 to Tony, $50 Bhuvan, you know, And so why not take that to these other levels of? It’s just that’s how they’re used to doing things, you know, they go on Amazon and, you know, uh, Adam and I were interviewing someone. At one point he was talking about how she walks around her house with her phone, and when she notices that she needs something, she literally just goes on. Amazon places in order. And then later in the day, she’ll place another order like it’s just it’s her pendant. She just orders things one at a time. So why not make donating that easy to, you know, as close to an e commerce site as possible without being an e commerce site? Unless you’re like you, said one of the enterprise sized non-profits, who really can make this a robust program and as rehab sisters grows, you know, they’re looking at their own donor-centric management software and saying, Oh, well, this has certain limitations on it. As we grow, we can change products and find something that’s gonna allow the monthly gifts and the the onetime gifts in a way that works best. Yeah, All right, You know what? That’s Ah, perfect wrap. That’s a perfect conclusion. We’re gonna leave it. There they are. Adam London, founder of ah, Project Donor Love, which is not a non-profit sultan. See, Thank you. Carry Rice non-profits, Consultant also carry rice Consulting and Anna Lisa Davis, the executive director of Rehabs Sisters, thanks to each of you. Thank you so much. You’re welcome. And thank you for being with Tony martignetti non-profit Radio coverage of 19 NTC. All of our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools help non-profits make an impact. We need to take a break. Cougar Mountain Software Here’s a quote We use Denali Fund for non-profits. It’s easy to track how much is in each fund. That’s fairly simple to use and the training is very helpful and thorough. Customer service has been responsive and caring. That’s Laurie D. From a church and also a quote all the features of a sophisticated fund accounting system at a reasonable cost. That’s Kim T. From Lawrence Township, and this is all about Cougar Mountain software. They have a free 60 day trial on the listener landing page at tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain. Now, time for Tony. Stick to your board’s role in planned e-giving. Um, there is a video on this, of course, as there is, uh, there are all the all the critical subjects facing mankind. I’ve got a video on all of them and this the week it’s your boards, giving in your boards role in planned e-giving steps up at first. Um, first blush, let’s say, um, their own personal gif ts They need to be committed to the organization to the extent that they included include your organization in their will or some other state plan. And that’s reasonable to expect because they are your highest level volunteers. There you’re insiders there fiduciaries if legal duties to your organization and, um, their duties go beyond legal, including fund-raising support, and how can they ask others if they haven’t done it themselves, and that’s one of the other roles that they can fill. Once they have included you in their state plan, then they could be asking others their peers on the board, other volunteers, major donors. They could be encouraging other planned GIF ts from those folks hosting events, introducing you to other people. They could combine those that could host an event in their home and invite some of their friends to find out about more about your organization. There’s a lot that you’re bored can do around planned e-giving, and you find me, uh, saying more about it, flushing it out on my video, your boards rolling. Planned e-giving and that’s at tony martignetti dot com. That is Tony’s Take two now online adversity. Welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 NTC. You know that’s the 2019 non-profit Technology Conference in Portland, Oregon, at the Convention Center on day three of the Conference three like gum in puberty and all of our 1990 see interviews are brought to you by our partners. That act Blue Free fund-raising tools to help non-profits make an impact with me is Bert Edwards, He’s communications director at Friends of the Columbia Gorge. Burt, Welcome. Thanks. Tony is great to be here. It’s good to have you back. Thank you. We think it was We think it was about three years ago. It ntcdinosaur? Yeah. San Jose Sense sense in San Antonio was sent. No sandals. I’ve got my hands. Okay. Okay. It was That was either 15 or 16. We’re not sure. All right. It’s good to have you back. Uh, you’re session this year is Social Security combating fake news, triaging twitter, trolls and dealing with digital distractions. A lot of injuries. I start out. Why do we need this session? I don’t think we need to think. Well, well, I’ll give you well, Put it this way. What do you feel like? Non-profits. Need to know that they don’t about managing trolls and digital distractions. Well, there’s actually a interesting background history for how this panel came to be. And so this panel was one of a couple panels that the end tem team had picked out as a community session as far as a topic that they wanted Thio speak about, uh and so I ended up getting in contact with Amy and ash and, uh, worked with them to kind of put together the concept. They actually connected me with my first panelist, Ken Montenegro, whose on the End 10 board and then can we were kind of fine time for include tuning, so to speak, the topic because we really want to make a discussion. He suggested that we reach out to actually the keynote speaker idiot who was able to join us. So it really kind of came together as, ah, community topic. And it’s something, sadly, that all non-profits they’re dealing with these days we’re gonna talk about how to keep your staff, your supporters and social ambassador’s safe. When they’re talking about your organization online, where they’re putting themselves out as the face of the organization, how do they stay safe? Um, and then you had a group exercise to What was that? So basically, instead of eso when Kenan mediating and I were chatting instead of ah, doing power point, we decided we really want to have a discussion with the audience. And as we don’t have ah, we wish we did have a magic box that we could give her everyone to deal with trolls and digital distracters these days, we thought instead, we share some lessons that we’ve learned and then have a discussion for people to share other things and have a conversation. Um, so that overall was the challenge. So the first exercise we did was I actually walked through an example, something that happened to me, which was a case of every day you come into work on one of my colleagues came to us with our social listening report, and all of a sudden someone was tweeting at us and accusing us of stealing a photo online. They hadn’t e mailed to reach out that we had bought the photo inappropriately off him. They were just calling us and our CEO of photo geever. And they started then tagging media out, saying that this organization and this person stole our photo. Um, and that and so actually I talked a little bit about the situation I then asked. We then had a discussion with members are argast as far as how they would have handled. It was interesting. I got some suggestions for what we ended up from, actually, some things that we didn’t end up doing, but it would be interesting to try. Well, that’s all flush out a little bit. So what? Well, first, what did you do? What did you do? We? Well, what we did was after we looked into it. What it turns out is that the photo we had bought was from 1/3 party photo vendor. The photographer at some point had had a falling out with, and I don’t remember the outlet, and I won’t. I won’t use their name. Sure. At some point, she had had a falling out with that group. She had taken her photos down. And so all of the organization, because there was a number of non-profits. Our non-profit had bought that photo to do some work on Syria, and they were the number non-profits had bought that photo. She either did a similar thing as far as kind of threatening them on Twitter. Or she’s kind of set, like, kind of a legalistic sort of Ah, season desist. Yeah, yeah. Um So we tried to find a way to actually engage the person in a conversation that we didn’t have a contact information. We sent them a GM. They did not respond. So at that point, I came up with two plans. One was We decide to go ahead and take the photos down, because when we take photos, even though we had about the photos legally, But we take that very seriously, Andi, that we couldn’t engage with the dialogue with the person that was that was the least passive resistance. And as the alternative, what I had prepared to do was to engage her on my personal Twitter account so I could deal it, escalate the situation as far as it wasn’t our institutional social media accounts and her and said it would be metoo communications director talking thio this unhappy for did she end up engaging with you as an individual? Well, actually, when we took the photos down, she thank the New York Times. Although the New York Times didn’t contact us about stealing on her photos, Um, and then she stopped. So I didn’t have to face-to-face D’oh! Okay, Okay. What were some of the suggestions you got in the session? How to deal with it? You know, we got a really interesting suggestion that I didn’t think of it, and someone suggested that we should have taken a photo of the receipt that we had and put a note on Twitter saying, Hey, we’re sorry that you’re concerned we actually bought this legally. Here’s the receipt and that’s interesting approach might have been kind of antagonistic. A cz um, her tweets were fairly hostile, so it might have worked. Come. It’s hard to say whether that would have egged her on the other challenges. It was consuming a lot of our time, okay? And that was one thing that we had were after is an issue. Even if you’re in the right, it may just be easier to fold. It’s not. It’s not that big a deal. Maybe it’s not worth fighting a battle over. Exactly. And that was one of things that we talked about at at the session is when do you make that make make that judgment call? Because I mean, like, for me, it’s like I really want to protect my staff of my colleagues, Um and so being accused of wrongly steal a photo for me, I took very seriously and also photo rights. I mean, I also take really seriously, but in this case it was consuming a lot of bad with knowing me. But the personnel manager social media accounts. And that was something again. We discussed this faras while you might want to fight, it distracts you from your mission. And so, in this case, making making the situation go away so we could get back to our work. I wonder if it’s worth saying Thio tweeting that, uh, wait, We’re out of respect for the photographer. We’re taking the question of question about photograph down. But we want our supporters. We want you to know that we did legally buy it. I don’t know if at that point you would put a photo of the receipt, the invoice paid invoice, whatever, or just say we have a paid invoice. But in the interest of fairness and whatever, you know, we’re just gonna We’re just gonna fold it. We’re just gonna take the photo down. But we want you all to know that the accusation is not right. I like that approach because it’s very transparent for your other users who might be on wondering about what aboutthe presumption is. If they take it down, then they’re in the wrong right? So you’re saying No, that’s not the case. We’re willing to take it down out of just simplicity and fairness. But we’re not. We’re not in the wrong here. Exactly. Another thing about your approach is that I, like is also is a chance for us organization to restate your values, which is a photography rights is really important. Electoral property is a treasure exactly and way don’t violate that way. Have a receipt if anyone wants to see it. Well, you know, the mos or something like that. We have an invoice. Okay. Eventually, I said we could learn. We learn from the crowd. Of course. Um what else? What else? Uh, what other types of situations did you talk about? Our might non-profits encounter? You know, one thing that came up that was interesting. This is hard for me. It’s a communications director, but one of my co panelists brought up the point that, you know, sometimes you might need to push back on your communication staff or have a dialogue about Why are we Why do we want to broadcast this information as sometimes? Maybe there’s a reason that point information out and and sometimes not. And she was talking about. So here’s an example. When she was when she was talking. It made me think back from from the past. So when I was working at the US Institute of Peace, I remember we were meeting with our colleagues in the religion in Peacemaking Initiative, and they were doing some really great work on D. U S Institute. He’s being a taxpayer funded in front organization, and it was really important for the public know what they’re doing with the taxpayer dollars. And so we’re trying to come up with ways to put out more information about what what the religion priest make initiative was doing the challenges. A lot of the facilitation is that they were doing overseas the people in the participants who would come those inter religious sorts of conversations. Often they would come at their own personal risk. And so we were chatting with our colleagues in one of our colleagues, said, I understand, and I agree. We need to talk more about the work that we do. But if we accidentally, for instance, talk about put the participants of a recent workshop that they had had in Nigeria, those participants and even parts of their family’s lives could be at risk, and the outreach value, you just isn’t worth it. And so that was actually a good conversation that we had with the program stuff. I mean, we were able to come up with a middle ground on one of those being that we would have a conversation and some things that they did. We’re just too sensitive. And even though it would be great to talk about them, we just wouldn’t know the risk that we made a mistake. And then someone got hurt because he never want that to happen. And so that was one thing that came up. And I thought that was a good conversation as Faras again engaging your communications and outreach people to think about what you’re putting out and why, and if you really need to put it out there or not, how about from the audience? Did, uh, did, um, challenges arise or situations arise from the audience that you remember that you can share? Yeah, there was an interesting question that came up. Um, I’ve encountered this a little bit as well, and it was a challenge about when you’re working in a coalition or with partners with other non-profits, and it’s a sensitive issue and or you may have information about services or constituents that’s sensitive. How do you deal with that? Particular Because Or Tasers have different levels of mean. Non-profit will be vastly different size and resource is on. They might have different approaches. Thio. How they deal with with privacy and or And that was that was interesting conversation that one member of the audience raised because it was something they were dealing with, and they just kind of want to talk through it. And so that was nice for that person. Will that kind of talk about what they were going through? Not only the panelist, but other folks and nines were able to offer some thoughts and suggestions. So where did you hear What are some of the suggestions? Well, actually, that I want listeners toe learn from learn from what you learned. Well, actually, it was interesting. That was partly where this where we went into discussion about thinking about what information you need to put out. Uh, there were several suggestions that members the lions had, as faras secure systems that you can use Thio thio trade information as far as if it’s sensitive, not necessarily using the normally mall or even, for instance, Google docks are very popular within the non-profit community. But that type of information is probably bad for a Google doc, because it’s really hard. I don’t know exactly who has access to a Google doc s o. We talked about some obscure ways, Thio to trade information, which and share information which I thought were useless. Um, and some services people actually exchanged business cards so they could give information to each other. Um, offline. So why do you say that about Google docks? It’s it’s hard to know who who has access to it. What’s the concern there? I think the challenge with Google docks and we use that a lot is I mean, once the link is out, I mean often is in a way, I was gonna share. You don’t know who’s okay. Yeah. Okay. So just making sure that your partners are having the same sort of care for the sensitivity and protection of your data that you are a time for our last break Turn to communications, PR and content for your non-profit. They help you tell your compelling stories get media attention on those stories and build support for your mission. They’re into media relations, content, marketing, communications and marketing strategy and branding strategy. You’ll find them at turn hyphen to dot C E o. We’ve got butt loads. More time for online adversity. We still have a good amount of time together. Burghdoff. So what else? Uh, what? Uh, I’m hoping there are other situations and how they got resolved or what the discussion points were around them. That people suggestions that people had another. You got another situation? Yeah. Um, so one situation that was that was discussed. Waas Ah, there was a participant that noted that they had a challenge with having their social media feeds actually being mined and that information being used against them. So they went they actually had folks that looked at their personal Facebook and Twitter accounts on dhe, then use the information to insinuate themselves into their circles and actually did some things that were disrupted in regards Thio. They would have people sometimes show up at events that they found out their social media. Um and, um, that would reach out to people to be other people. Yeah, these imposters was that it was not asking the name of the organization, but was at a high profile organization that did some kind of provocative, controversial work that that they’re their individual members of the staff would be stalked like that. So the person in that case was working on a pretty controversial issue. Um, that was in the news. So I won’t I won’t say which justifies the action, but I’m trying to figure out what the motivation is. Just embarrassment trying embarrass somebody who stands for something that the stalker disagrees with. Cancerversary. Okay, They really were looking to disrupt the work that that person was doing on Ben and the tire network. And frankly, frankly, that throw them off. So but it was really on the ground. Everybody organizing work. So, um, which which made that even more challenging, Cause I mean, you’re out in the field, and all of a sudden you have this disruption of Yeah, Who is this person? So what the organization do, or what was the conversation around it? Well, that was interesting, because one of things that that person had taken away from the experiences eso es. They’re more careful about, um about what they put out on social media. So, for instance, I mean, personally, personally, right? So the consciousness that raised their much more careful what they personally put out on social media, they’re much more careful now in regards Thio, if they’re working on a, uh, organizing or Abssi activity overseas, as far as even just noting that they’re gonna be over there just even a casual, you know him at this diner, that sort of a photo that that sort of checking to make sure, for instance, gee, attacking is off when they’re taking that when they’re taking photos. Um, so it really changed the weather. That person kind of relates to social media, and that was someone who had really grown up, as far as you know, being an active social media users. Faras I come here with my friends and we’re having this. We’re hanging out here, we’re going to be there. I mean, that really changed the way that they they interacted. Just gonna walk in through that. Well, it doesn’t have to be circumspect about their own Facebook and Instagram posts. Tweets you had a part of the session was strategies for keeping your staff your volunteers safe. So maybe think of Ji attacking, having them in their personal posts turn Geo tagging off. What else? What other strategies you got for keeping us all safe? You know, one thing that we talked about and we did a little better serve a cause. I mean, most organizations have, like, a social media policy that kind of think about how you talk on social media. One thing a lot of organised don’t have. Although when we did a survey of surprised more Cokes did have it is having a policy in place, eh? So that if you have a member of your staff that is being harassed because of who they are on social media, So, for instance, this is had walked through our CEO at my last job because we had a lot of experts that spoke out on a lot of issues in regards to humanitarian and development that could be controversial. Um, and if one of our experts was out speaking, and all of a sudden they were personally attacked, even maybe docks and I just kind of walked our CFO. So what could we do? As far as what we’ve prepared as faras if they need like personal security to be able to help them out, or if they might need to. Stella stay in a hotel room for a couple of days. It’s like they’re just walking through some scenarios, hopefully things that would never happen. But when those things happen, things start moving really quickly. So having like actually HR policies to support, like your staff, they’re speaking on social media because if you’re asking your staff to go and put themselves out there, they’re they’re both speaking their personal capacity. But they’re also there a za person. You just need to make sure that they’re that they’re taking care of. So we talked a little bit about that. I was actually what were some of the policies that came out of this? I was really surprised to see how many non-profits I have actually thought about that. I think that’s interesting difference between from now and a couple of years ago when I had talked with colleagues and most folks didn’t have that, um, and a number of folks ice that that actually their admin in HR people. They either it had, like practices or plans in place to be oppcoll Thio help folks out. Um, and that’s where some of those practices of this practice get the detail. We drill down to the details. Yeah, I think so. So one of them actually is making sure it’s over. Example. When we’re talking about a security issue well, making sure that there’s actually like an emergency fund that you could dip into that sort of a case emergency fund your person is working remote e-giving on. But there’s there’s access to cash for an emergency. Well, even the organization as faras if if someone has a personal security problem that there’s that there’s a fun that you could tap into the organization level, right? Okay, right, because, I mean, you can have the policies that, for example, like if, like if a staff member get stocks and that you’ll put them up in a hotel, etcetera, etcetera. But if you don’t actually squirrel away like an emergency fund, a rainy day fund at your organization, so when that happens, you actually can’t pay for the hood. The motel may need a new car, a different car for the time being in a new place to live temporarily. So making sure that the money the money that the money is actually there. And that was one thing hearing from folks that organizations are moving to that next step. Um, some organizations are actually so a lot of humanitarian rittereiser will have a security team that will work with people on on security trainings. And some of those organizations have now started doing Social Media’s security training, which I think is a prudent thing to do. Yeah, so it was positive Thio here that, um so there’s actually been a lot more progress than over the past couple years. Then I might have imagined, just from consciousness has been raised. There’s a lot of headlines on dhe, particularly the organizations that are provocative, doing controversial work. They know they’re at risk, you know, they’re they’re staff is at risk. And the volunteers, I mean, a centrist. In fact, I was doing a little research before the panel. So the Pew Research Center did a study in 2017 and four out of 10 adults have they found, have experienced some sort of online harassment. And if you look at folks 18 to 29 the number jumps up to 67%. Holy cow, 2/3. 2/3 of some kind on Hein harassment attacks from 18 to 29. Yeah, that’s that’s amazing. And so that’s why my God, everybody, that you’re growing up with it now. It’s like the tooth fairy. All right, Um, that was another 67 minutes together. You got any more hope? You do. You know the story or policy you mentioned hr. But also PR session describing Talk about PR policies. What you got for? Yeah, Speaking on the communication side, I think, and like with the photo example that we talked about coming up with ways to be transparent, but also to try the de escalate, uh, questions and again, thinking about one thing as far as if you’re gonna talk about something, can you talk about it after the event or the activity has occurred. So that way your folks air out of whatever activity or if they’re overseas, that there in his own unconference actually out of the zone of conflict, and then they talk about Okay, so that’s that’s one thing to think about on the on the communication side. I’m having a so have assisting have for social listening is super important. These days so you can get information real time. I recommend most organizations to no only track your key channels. But if you have colleagues that air speaking in a professional capacity or semi professional capacity just to keep an eye on again just in case something happens that way, you’re able to zsystems situations online can estimate really quickly. It’s been out of control within a couple of minutes. Come closer to the Mike Burns. Thank you. Yeah, I think another thing to keep in mind is when you’re listening, yeah, doing they’re listening And then keep in mind like the old philosophy is don’t put anything, don’t post anything that you don’t want to see in the New York Times. Yeah, if you want to see it as a headline, he don’t post it in here. I mean, one thing that I think a lot of folks forget is that remember the press really probably won’t call you beforehand before like grabbing skin grabs and running because we’ll just assume that it’s, uh, for general attribution. So so that’s so as an as an example for folks that actively worked for the press is just good for them to keep in mind and do, like a little bit of training. So, as example, a couple years ago, when I was living in Virginia, I was having a hard time because I owed the state of Virginia $1 income tax, your scofflaw troublemaker and the system. How is the state can operate without your dollar? Well, exactly. And the system is not set up online to pay $1. Okay, It was driving me nuts as far as I was. Like, I would drive down the Richmond, but it would cost me more and gas. And I was gonna like post on social media. How frustrated. I could just send a check. Well, ultimately, I did send the check because I called the apartment revenue. Uh, ultimately, like checking the stamp was the easiest way to do it, cause even they were confounded. And there was a point when I was so frustrated, almost like, put some post on social media about how ironic and funny that I really want to pay my $1 for the Commonwealth of Virginia. But the system set up, so you really can’t. Okay, Who wants to be delinquent for tax for $1. But then I realized I have a number reporters that followed me professionally and probably my place of work really doesn’t really want that to be in, like, a news story on so that the case is far. Is this kind of You just have to be slightly careful in anything you put on social media courses. It’s this kind of public works. So it’s good to have just swallowed that one that you pay your dollar. I did all right. But I did. Thank you, but I don’t live in Virginia, but I traveled. Virginia, I traveled 95 virgin. So next, no storm will be grateful. But the plow is there on gasped Onda, the driver behind the wheel of courtesy thanks to your dollar doing doing the right thing. Yeah, I want this in the penny rolls. But I thought that costume or in FedEx, you wanted to give a little stick to it. All right, I see. Um, tell us one more story. We got about another two minutes or so. Yeah, so, actually, this is gonna go back into the wayback machine on, and this is kind of early story, but this is an example with PR. But one of those strange days that you know, your computer wasn’t working. And so I went to my colleagues on the I t t. These aren’t so strange anymore. Sometimes I wonder extreme, which is which happens more often. Andan they looked on the server, and they actually like this is you have actually have a real problem. They were So they were recited on. And so they started playing around service and okay. And now we wait, what? The issue is, um, problem server. You had a bunch of e mails backed up. Now you should be good. Unfortunately, I then started getting a flood of emails, Um, and all in French, or at least 95% of them in French, um, went back to the times like, Oh, my God, what’s happening? So they went back and changed what? They changed on the server. And I don’t have to speak French. Fortunately, like I took Spanish and Japanese and high school in college. But I had colleagues that did who told me I probably wouldn’t have one to read most of the e mails. And so what it turned out was was that, um we were going to be having an event in a couple of weeks and bringing a leader from Africa. I won’t say which one who is quite controversial s. Oh, my email box had been targeted by Abasi campaign, and my colleagues on the I T team found it as they were talking about this new tool about the date myself that they thought they could find that solution in the new tools Google. All right. And But that was a That was an interesting case, as far as it was just It was a French advocacy group that was opposed to the speaker. You’re gonna be having a driven. And I was doing and I was press lead on the event, so they had targeted my evil boss. So, um, so that was that was interested. You handle it? Well, it was you. You talk back to these people, do you engage them? You try or we didn’t, uh, in that case, I mean what we came up with A So we posted something on our website explaining why we hadn’t invited the person why we thought dialogue was important. Uh um I mean, back in those days early like way. Still working on making it a lot by fax a Zara’s with the press. So put in a statement on the website was the easiest thing to do because it wasn’t like one good distribution point. We didn’t. But we did add a note into our email newsletter again, that kind of going a longer point in the newsletter, explaining this is why we hadn’t invited this person. This is why we think it’s important from speak. We understand people disagree, but we encourage you to come. But that’s a case also, where I was seeing the number of emails that they got that I got to say that they ended up getting in and getting more security for the We had no problems. Way did have some protesters that came and spoke out, but I mean, that’s actually was good. That was a dialogue that we really want wanted to have. Okay, properly managed. It can become an opportunity. All right, we’re gonna leave it there. He’s Bird Edwards, communications director at Friends of the Columbia Gorge on this is Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 NTC 2019 non-profit Technology Conference, all each of our 2019 interviews is brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools to help non-profits Make an Impact Thanks so much for being with us next week. New Power With Henry Timms If you missed any part of today’s show, I beseech you find it on tony. Martignetti dot com were sponsored by witnessed e. P. A. Is guiding you beyond the numbers. Regular cps dot com By koegler mathos Software Denali fundez They’re complete accounting solution made for non-profits tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for non-profits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to dot c e o our creative producers. Claire Meyerhoff. Sam Liebowitz is the line producer. Shows Social Media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our Web guy, and this music is by Scotts. Dine with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit Ideas for the other 95% go out and be great. You’re listening to the Talking Alternate network. You’re listening to the Talking Alternative Network. Are you stuck in a rut? Negative thoughts, feelings and conversations got you down Hi, I’m nor in Sumpter potentially ater. Tune in every Tuesday at 9 to 10 p.m. Eastern time and listen for new ideas on my show yawned potential Live Life your way on talk radio dot N Y C. I’m the aptly named host of Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other 95% fund-raising board relations, social media. My guests and I cover everything that small and midsize shops struggle with. If you have big dreams and a small budget, you have a home at Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Friday’s 1 to 2 Eastern at talking alternative dot com. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking store business. Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested? Simply email at info at talking alternative dot com Are you a conscious co creator? Are you on a quest to raise your vibration and your consciousness? Sam Liebowitz, your conscious consultant and on my show, the conscious consultant, our awakening humanity. 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Nonprofit Radio for August 16, 2019: Manage Your Programs With A CRM & Co-Learning For Your Programs

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Jake Grinsted, Leah Kopperman, Kai Williams & Medha Nanal: Manage Your Programs With A CRM
The right CRM can help you run day-to-day program operations: track client relationships and outcomes; host trainings; manage certifications; organize transportation; and more. Our panel was recorded at 19NTC and they’re Jake Grinsted from Simply 360; Leah Kopperman with Keshet; Kai Williams at The International Wildlife Rehabilitation Council; and Medha Nanal from Top Cloud Consulting.





Debra Askanase, LaCheka Phillips, & Kevin Martone: Co-Learning For Your Programs
This 19NTC panel encourages you to look at a more collaborative training culture, which pushes the bounds of who is the educator. They’re Debra Askanase at Oracle NetSuite Social Impact; LaCheka Phillips with TechSoup/NGOsource and Kevin Martone from JCamp180.





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Transcript for 453_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190816.mp3 Processed on: 2019-08-17T15:38:37.521Z S3 bucket containing transcription results: transcript.results Link to bucket: s3.console.aws.amazon.com/s3/buckets/transcript.results Path to JSON: 2019…08…453_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190816.mp3.32272577.json Path to text: transcripts/2019/08/453_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190816.txt Hello and welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit Radio Big non-profit ideas for the other 95% on your aptly named host. I’m firing a listener. Steph Marie p. Left this iTunes review on March 11th 2018. Quote content is great. Okay, but universal. No. Gator cancels everything preceding it. Tony often chastises his guests or asks a question and then bulldozes them When they reply, it can get awkward and off putting. For example, a guest started off a response with good question, Tony. And he admonished the guest for saying that rude and weird. End quote. Steph, Marie P. Get off my show off. I want you to stop listening. I do not want you to be listening to my words. You don’t get me. I am in no way going to try to explain me to you because it would be over your head. You don’t have a sense of Well, maybe you do have a sense of humor. I’m not gonna go at home now. I’m not gonna go there. Maybe you have a lovely sense of humor. But you don’t share mine or you don’t even get mine. Let you don’t have to share it. You just have to understand it and you don’t. So I want you off the show. So here’s what I would implore you. I beseech you to do first. Unsubscribes Don’t stop yet. Don’t pause and stop yet. I want you to go. Whatever platform you’re listening is probably iTunes. That’s where your review was. Unsubscribes unsubscribes. Okay, now then you have to do that. Come back. Hit. Stop Not pause because we’re stopping. Stop and go away. Do not listen to this show again. Next thing I know, you’ll be chastising me because I’m lewd and weird to imaginary interns. You don’t get me and you never will. Please stop listening, Steph. Marie P. Get off my show. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. Now that Steph miree P is gone. I can say that with enormous confidence I’d be hit with favoritism if you beaned me with the idea that you missed today’s show Its program day manager program with a c. R m. The Rite CR M can help you run day to day program operations, track client relationships and outcomes. Host training’s manage certifications, organized transportation and Maur. Our panel was recorded at 19 NTC and there, Jake Grinstead from simply 3 60 Leah kopperman with Cash, Chi Williams at the International Wildlife Rehabilitation Council and Meta Channel from Top Cloud Consulting and Co. Learning for Your Programs. This 19 ntcdinosaur encourages you to look at a more collaborative training culture, which pushes the bounds of Who is the educator. They’re Deborah askanase at Oracle Met Sweet the Sheik, A. Phillips with Tech Soup, NGO Source and Kevin Martin from J. Camp 1 80 on Tony’s Take two Living Trusts Responsive by Wagner, C. P A is guiding you beyond the numbers. Regular cps dot com By koegler Mountain Software Denali Fund Is there complete accounting solution made for non-profits tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for non-profits, your story is their mission turned hyphen to DOT CEO. I feel so much better. Burden off my shoulders here is manage your programs with a C. R M. Welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 and T. C. You know that it’s the 2019 non-profit Technology Conference. You know that we’re coming to you from the convention center in Portland, Oregon. What you don’t know is that I am now with Jake Grinstead, Leah kopperman, Chi Williams and Meta Channel, and their seminar topic is not just for fund-raising anymore. Managing programs With C R M zsystems You also know that all of our 19 NTC interviews are brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools to help non-profits make an impact. Let’s meet the panel. They are again Jake Grinstead. He’s founder of simply 3 60 Leah kopperman, director of data and C. R. M at Kesha Chi Williams is the executive director at the International Wildlife Rehabilitation Council, and methanol is seated furthest from me. And she’s the principal at Top Cloud Consulting. Welcome. Happy to be here. Have all four of you. It’s a big panel, but way can accommodate Absolutely. Thank you. So I’m not sure is this is this, uh, let’s start down at the end with the metal. Is this is emerging, or is Am I just not aware that your C R M database can be used to manage programs? You’re welcome to say that I’m just not aware. Yeah. So it has been around for a while, but definitely in the nonprofit world, it is an emerging awareness that it can be used for a program metoo management. Okay. And what, Metta, Let’s stay with you. What do we need to have in place so that we can do this way? Just need us, C r m databases that it, or are there other things we need to have? No. So you have to have the right kind of serum because not all CR ends in the market right now are capable of supporting program data. So you need to have right tools and write features in the Sierra system to support this. Okay, Right kind of cr M. Okay. Uh, so we’ll come back to that because we have 1/2 an hour together. Um uh, let’s see. Hey, why don’t you sort of give us Ah, a headline and a lead? Uh, that anything more? You could say that to introduce us to this. Yeah, I think that while using serums for program management and it’s itself not new, it’s much more broadly recognized. My organization, I felt like even just four years ago, Coming on working on ours for five years ago, people were like, That’s Syrians are for fund-raising. And I’m like, No, this makes sense. This is how it’s gonna work for us. And I had this vision and I was able to find the people that work with, but it wasn’t a conversation anyone else was having. And now I go into a session and everybody’s like, Let’s talk about program management. So are you a pioneer or early adopter? Early A doctor. I think the pioneers were way before me. All right, All right. Leo, what’s the advantage of doing this? Well, I wanted to also remarked that the organization that I’m with Kesha we’ve been using C r. M to manage our program since 2012. So we were really early adopter Warren earlier. You weren’t. You sure you want a pioneer? Why can’t I personally wasn’t I was not with Kesha and 2012 with the organization. I would I would say so. Yeah, I think so. Okay. That’s not a scientific survey statement. It’s just got gut instinct. Think so? Okay. Yeah. Um, Lee also credits herself with being That makes it sound like nobody else believes it. I believe I do believe it. Teaching me how to sign a sign up for a Twitter. He had a start. My account on Twitter. Now we have Susan Chavez is my mind that the show and my company’s works from works as our social manager. But she was not the social manager in 20. We’re not sure where this 2014 or 15. We’ll have to look at what it will say. Joined. Right? Right. My name’s has joined it, I’m sure was maybe Susan can tell us. Okay, maybe she’ll look, I know it was not 16. I know. I’ve been on longer than 16. Okay. Uh, okay. And, uh, Jake, what’s the advantage to doing this? What? Why? Why? Why not just do it Separate different management for our programs? Sure. I think there are a few advantages of having a serum for non-profits programs, and one of them is allowing for more time for your program staff to really focus on what they do best. Focus on their passion, focus on why they were hired, and that’s to actually manage the programs that they have. So having a non-profit serum allows you to cut some of the administrative overhead that doing doing this type of work with multiple different systems, maybe on paper, maybe an excel, maybe in different databases. By bringing that together, you make it a lot simpler and cut down on that time. But what if the comparison is with ANAP location? That’s that’s designed for program management versus managing your program through the C. R. M? So I would argue that if it program is designed to manage your sorry if application is designed to manage the programs, it quite well might be a program crn that’s probably see around. We should probably back-up is giving you Siara here, Jake Constituent Relationship management. So it’s any application that helps manage the relationship that your organization has with your constituents and your constituents might be the people you serve in the fund-raising world. Obviously, it’s the donors and the people who help support you. But in the programme world, it’s those the people that are involved in your mission might be volunteers. It might be the people use serve. It might be others involved with whatever your mission is. All right. All right. So So since I got I gotta go, Leo. Because with grand grand, I’m sorry. I gotta go to Chi because of the grand theatrics that you gave Jake, I have to go back to you. So what are we? Wait, What are we talking about? Are we not talking about, Like, salesforce and razors edge yet for program management, right? We are we talking about Exactly. I would say that Razor’s edge doesn’t really support program blackbaud other blackbaud tools. D’oh! We’re talking about service. We are talking about a fund-raising C r m being used for a, uh, just just a c r M serum that theorems air, not natively just for fund-raising. Those xero ends there for any constituent management, although some are designed very much for fund-raising like Razor’s edge. But sales force. And that’s the reason my order, when we were doing all of our evaluations of many serums, they were out there in 2013. We ended up choosing that one because it was more of a platform that we could use for program management, Um, versus something that was just set up for fund-raising. But CR rims are for everything. I would argue that if you did not have a program cr em, you’re probably using sheets of paper or spreadsheets. That’s really the alternative. Okay. Okay. Well, that’s exactly what medicine to you have to have the right kind of cr m. Yes. Yeah, it’s time for a break, but, uh, Sam didn’t tell me. Now he did. Wagner CPS. They’ve got a free webinar on August 21st Fair labor standards act nuts, bolts and updates. Now, today is August 16th. So the odds of anyone listening live or archive, which means anybody, because that’s only two ways you can listen, if you could just say theon of anybody listening doesn’t matter. Live our archive. You’re wasting syllables here, Thea. Odds of anybody listening on August 21st are slim to xero. So watch the archive. Um uh, it’s a wagon or yeah, we call these waiting to call these things. These wagoner webinars webinars. So this wagon R is the Fair Labor Standards Act. Calculating regular rate of pay and overtime pay for employees or for yourself that counts. You count to understanding, paid versus unpaid time and a lot more. You’ll find this wagon are the archive thereof. At wagner cps dot com, you click resource is and then recorded events. Let’s do the live list or love. I feel like doing it early today. Um, starting native, starting domestic, I should say not. Maybe not native but domestic. Ah, Sacramento, California on Hollister, California and Tampa, Florida. And those were abroad will get their Hammond, Indiana, special Live listener love after Hammond, Indiana. Franconia, Virginia. Franconia, Alcohol Franconia. Know whether it is, um uh, no, that’s Peru. That’s abroad. I wish she would organize his better. Sam. Really? You could do a better job for me. What kind of support is this? It’s unbelievable. I don’t have interns or don’t even get producer support. So also all jumbled up between domestic and abroad. I gotta figure it out. Salt Lake City. All right, That’s, um I guess he would consider that domestic. Yeah. Salt Lake City, Utah Live. Listen, love. After you do New Bern, North Carolina Live love to the new burns. Ah, Hell’s Kitchen, New York. I love I love that Hell’s Kitchen shows up as a separate entity. It’s not New York, New York, it’s Hell’s Kitchen, and that’s the only neighborhood in New York where that happens. We don’t get we don’t see, um, Nomad or Dumbo or Upper East, but Hell’s kitchen specific. I love that. I admire that. How do you How do you do that helps get you probably even know what I’m ranting. I don’t even know what I’m talking about. Um Raleigh, North Carolina. Live love out to you as well. Cool. That’s a Carolina today. Um, Now let’s go abroad With which had a better organized list from Shanghai. Doesn’t do by continent during Times Hemisphere released. You could do atmosphere. That’s only four of those. For Christ sake, you could do atmosphere. It’s only four of them. Shanghai, Shanghai, China Showing how you with us often. Thank you so much for that For that loyalty. NI hao Ni Hao and Seoul SEOUL, South Korea Also so such loyal, loyal, live listener love the soul Annual haserot comes a ham Nida Mexico CITY, Mexico Witnessed our days when a star dies. Mexico City and Tehran, Iran. You’ve been checking in occasionally. Now, Tehran. Thank you for coming back. Um, our keep. Ah, Peru. That would be Ah, put yours up. Portuguese now? No, the only spanish. So I ve been a star days When a star days for arctic quip Peru Thank you for being with us. Um, that’s everybody abroad. And, uh so live lister, love. Thank you so much for being with us and the podcast pleasantries. Because we have over 13,000 people listening in the time shift and the pleasantries go out to you wherever we fit into your schedule. I’m grateful pleasantries to you, and we know that we are minus one. Where ah, 13. Like 13,500 minus one from now. Going forward. Not just this week. I’m not going to say her name anymore. Uhm And so why did I wait till you may be wondering why that we tell today this review from, uh, that person was march 11th 2018. I don’t check that often. I don’t I don’t look at the reviews like every month even, uh, but I have seen it. I have. I’ve seen it long before today. I just was ignoring it in the past. And then the last time I saw it, I don’t know. Whatever it was a month or so ago, it annoyed me. So So that’s why that’s why uh, no, I haven’t been annoyed for for these 18 months since March or something of last year. But I’ve been annoyed for the past week, a month or so, and now I’m over it. Therefore, we’re moving on to Ah, what we’re doing. We’re continuing, of course, with Jake Grinstead, Leah kopperman, Chi Williams and methanol talking about managing your programs with Sierra. One of the fundamental differences is that in fund-raising CR M in fund-raising world, right, The kind of fund-raising data that every organization maintains is fairly typical. So whereas for programs, that is a huge where I d And so your CNN system needs to be able to store and manage all those different kinds of data, that’s a prerequisite to be used as programs. Okay, Okay. Uh, so you were just backing up a little asking about, like, different kinds of Syrians. I’ve certainly worked in social service agencies where in the past they’ve had what’s called a case management system and that really is what the social service frontline staff would use to manage the clients that they work with. So that’s really very parallel Thio, the kind of idea that we’re talking about a program management system and the advantage of not having a separate program management system and a separate fund-raising system is often there’s overlap between who your constituents are, and somebody who participated in one of your programs may very well end up becoming a donor or somebody who participate. Somebody who’s a donor may become a volunteer, and if you’re managing your volunteer program and you’re managing your client base through the same system, then you have up to date information and email addresses. Postal address is interests, etcetera, and so you can use it both for the client and and for the fund-raising. All right, so I think I’m trainable here. But let’s make sure so you can have a generic C R M that will manage fund-raising and Andi program operations trainable. I would take this a step further and say, In addition to what Leo just said, your program crn might often be very helpful to your development. Your fund-raising department. There are so many times where your fund-raising team are going to need to ask the program team for certain statistics and reports and data about the programs that they run because they’re gonna need that for their grants and etcetera to do their fund-raising. And so if the data is in the same place. If everyone’s using the same tool, the same crn the development staff would be able to have access directly to the reports and the information about the programs that are being run without having to tie up program staff. Time to actually pull those that information separately. That’s another advantage of bringing those things together and what xero. OK, OK, in your program description. Have you done your program already? You have your on the downside. It’s great. Okay, um, nobody came with a glass of wine in the bar is open, even my drink. Okay, Jake, that is not water. I guess that’s vodka. Leah has a metal bottles. We don’t know what’s in that. Two women down the oak. That is already finished. I think I That’s Jim, not water. Alright, So good. I’m glad I’m not hindering the fun and excitement part of social part of 19 nineties E for any of you. Okay, so in your program, in your session description, you take off a whole bunch of things that can be run through a c. R. M. Tracking client relationships and outcomes run training’s manage certifications, organized transportation. Is it worth taking through. Is there enough to say about each of these about how the C R M should can be used to do each of those things? Or is that too much in the weeds? The way that we handled the panel was each of the four of us did like a case study, where we talkto sort of soup to nuts how we use our serum to manage one particular thing. I don’t think there’s enough time here to run through, but that that is how we handled it in case studies. My brief. I don’t know if you’ve got a little example of how shit uses when it might be helpful for sure so way. But we can. We could do brief examples. So you each have a different CR M doing something different. Yeah, because because all the organizations that we are working with or at our do different mission and Jake you’re the consultant here. No, I actually 36 from the founders simply for 60 were actually creating a C. R. M that is designed for programs. That’s why we started something for 60. I work from non-profit where we found it frustrating that we couldn’t find a good program. Cr m. And so with that organization I actually started and founded simply 3 60 to do that to fill that need. Okay, so in the session, I actually talks about one of our founding clients s O, That I use that as a case study and represented them talking about how having a program crn for them has been so helpful thing. American Camp Association of New York and New Jersey. Okay, Okay, I’m willing I’m willing to hear the case is from each of you, But you realize that we don’t have 75 minutes. So So I know on dhe. I appreciate that you aren’t all nodding, is it? But what happens when you start talking? You get into your stage hit, and all of a sudden you’re three minutes. Story becomes 12 minutes, and then we’re out of luck. So I have to cut off everybody else, and everybody will be pissed off at you. And they’ll wonder why they didn’t go to the drinks instead of coming here. Should have drinks. Why? I waste my time here because they didn’t get to tell the story. So everybody gets, uh, okay, so we’re 13 minutes. We’ll make this the longer sessions as 27 figure. We spent a minute bantering, so we’ll go to 28 which is about 15 divided by four. I’m impressed with math, but I haven’t finished it yet. 15 divided by four is less than four. It’s like three minutes and 1/2. So everybody gets about three and 1/2 minutes. I’m gonna I’m gonna try my best. All right? So everybody gets three minutes and 30 seconds on Duh. At the three minute mark, I’m gonna let you know that you only have 30 seconds left and we’re gonna hold you to this s o I since I feel bad. That meta is sitting at the end doesn’t have a devoted Mike. And I feel second bad for, um, for Kai, who also is has to share my So let’s start at the end. With Metta, you have three and 1/2 minutes to tell the story at, um top cloudgood. The top cloud consulting shared in the Okay. Get closer to the study of one of the clients I work with. The organization worked in the areas of health and wellness. They programs such as individual and group therapy for physical humans on wellness programs. So before I started working with them, they were managing their data. Alden spreadsheets. It was spread all throughout the organization with all the program teams. Every time that the team’s wanted to pull any kind of report, they were pulling that out of individual spreadsheets and manually formatting into the desert former and that was taking them days. Thio create a report. So number one it was a giant waste of organizations. Resource is on number two. Everybody knew that pulling the report was like pulling teeth, so they were not even using reports as much as they should. So after we moved there, they tied to the Syrian system. The reports were quick, instant, instantly available up to date, not for five days old on the organization started using reports as a feature much more frequently because it was available so much more easily. That’s so concisely I didn’t get to give you a warning. Uh, you’re here a little more You want to say Okay, tell our stories, and maybe, maybe maybe maybe the host will develop some questions. You black lackluster. Who’s No? No, you still get your three minutes? You still get your three? What? I say three and 1/2 actually. Three minute warning. He’s cutting it down, so I don’t know, You know, meta exceed XL, but you could be You’re welcome to be lackluster. Please. OK, eso I work with the International Wildlife Rehabilitation Council. We provide training and resource is on wildlife rehabilitation. We have membership. We have classes, we have certification. We have a practicum. We use our serum to manage all that often. It’s the same people doing all of that. And then maybe they have an extra $5 they’re helping us out with the $5. Or maybe they’re volunteering for us. So we get to see all of that before we have C R. M. We had an old system and we actually lose data. Wait, hold on. I’m sorry, Amy. Sabat Ward, Stop distracting the guest on top of radio. You had your chance. You had your shot. Just distracted CEO of intent is distracting, distracting Leah and J everybody making this wave on camera. All right, I’ll spot you an extra 15 2nd All right? Yeah. So before we had our modern serum. We were losing data like we have a registration that would get lost because the system in between one server and the computer, it would just disappear. So we have people showing up for classes and we have no record of them. Really. A lot of issues with trust, all sorts of problems. So with the modern serum were able Thio one have everything in one place. I know to trust our data. We haven’t come directly from our website into our system. We’re able to track our measure, tracked measurements, assessment of how the students are doing, how they’re engaging with us. It’s It’s quite an interesting set up, Andi, I guess I want to mention one interesting thing we found as we talk about our case studies because they’re all very different. You know, I’m contracting with hosts and doing sending certificates to students and all the stuff that happens in between there. But we found this similar framework. We are all even though our products are very different. The steps we need to go to are very similar and so we’re hoping to kind of create some data models for other non-profits to dues to be ableto have program management CR ems. And how are you? How are you collecting that? Well, I’m working with a couple of different groups on that, but user user studies just people. It’s really just people like the four of us getting together and walking through these scenarios and saying, Oh, okay. This flows into this, which is this, and this is always an assessment piece. Even if you might not call it assessment. This is your registration, your enrollment, something that sort. This is your program piece. Oh, this might be an add on. If you have a case management your assessment might be Did they find a resolution? But there’s these really core similarities, and so I’m excited to see where that goes. Okay, I appreciate that. You actually did accept my admonition. Thio keep things concise. Haven’t given a three minute warning yet. Okay, now, Leo, don’t blow it, okay? I’ll do my best. Really? Okay, so So it kiss it. We air the LGBT Q Jewish organization in the US, where national and focus on our mission Shin is too have full inclusion of LGBT Q Jews in Jewish life and one of our programs that we do is where we train the leaders of Jewish organizations to have more inclusive environments for sorry for Jews who are participating. And it’s not the water over the vodka. So we that we do in sort of regional programs and we do a year long program, say, in Chicago, where the Jewish Community Center and the bunch of synagogues and the, uh, I don’t know if there’s a Jewish community foundation. Whatever the Jewish organizations are in the area, they all commit to this year long program and we offer them training and help them set goals to make their organizations more inclusive. And we provide them with coaching services over the course of the year and the way that our Sierra Miss and then at the end of the year, they you know, sort of report back to us through a survey about, uh, how they felt about being participants. And so the way that we manage that program with our serum and we happened to use sales force is that we way use existing data in the sales force. Instance toe understand what communities might be the next ones to offer a program in right Well, look, we’ll see. OK, we have enough people, maybe in Cincinnati, that maybe that’s the next community. Well, where will offer a program? And then we can do marketing using that C R M to the all the Jewish professionals working in Cincinnati and and advertise the program and reach out and say, We’re going to be running this and will you enroll? Then we have a sign up process where organizations will sign up and add the that information about their organizations baseline measures of where their organization is at in terms of Do they have gender neutral bathrooms? Do they have a new LGBT clue of LGBT affirmative group in their community? Do they have a bullying policy? You know, all these different kinds of measures. We asked them up front when they fill out the form and they tell us where they are, is a baseline. And then they, during the program, set a bunch of goals. Those all their goals go into our serum and then our coach has access to all those goals and works with them over the course of the year. Two. Help them reach those goals. All those girls also populate a dashboard that we have in the serum, that our executive leadership can look at any time and see 80% of the current leadership project. Participants are you know, they have started on 40% of their goals. They are still waiting to start on 10 and they so we can see they can see the progress without having to ask anybody. That’s just there in the dashboard. And our fund-raising team can also use that to make a case to a donor because it’s just right there in front of them. They can log in any time and do that so and then at the end they do a survey and we and we find out one of the things we want to do is change mind set, openness, three minute warning, okay. And we want to change the mindset of the participating organizations. So we asked them at the end did they see new opportunities for LGBT inclusion in their communities. And one of our measures is what percentage of organizations reported that and we have about 80% of our participants reporting that they did see new opportunities for inclusion. So it’s been very successful all right, Jake. So yes. So one of my founding clients, the American Camp Association of New York and New Jersey. They are an affiliation of summer camps in the United States, and their mission is to help in rich lives through the camp experience. So they help train camp staff. They help parents figure out which camps to send their children to and just generally promote the can’t summer camp experience in United States. Um and so I want to touch on another potential benefit of a program serum that we haven’t been touched on already. But we haven’t properly articulated yet, which is the benefit that it can give to constituents themselves. So the people who are actually benefiting from the program can really benefit from their organization having a program xero. And I’m gonna give you an example of how at the American Camp Association of New York and New Jersey, they have this amazing program. This wonderful lady there named Rene, who is in charge of helping parents find the right summer camp for their children. And she works oftentimes one on one with parents to help them find the camp. It would be good for them and so what we were able to do once we had all of the camp, all the member camps that are affiliated with this organization into a program. Crn we were able to start exposing that information on their website directly and gave parents a chance to go to the website, fill out a form as to what their children might be interested in. You know how long the camp should be, How much it should cost nb be able to actually search for summer camps right there on because they had now this one see Iran, where all of their camps were together. They could trust that the information that was e-giving that was being given out on the website would be accurate to these parents. So then parents could actually indicate that they were interested in the camp camps, then had a member’s portal through the sea Iran that they could log into on dhe. Then camps could see which parents had indicated their interest. They could also now register for training events. They could basically take advantage of all the benefits that the was giving them. So by using simply 3 60 in this case, they were actually able to give both their member camps and the parents that they served better access to their own information to the information is in the system and better serve them with the programs that they have. Can anybody else site benefits to the those they’re serving constitutent people themselves? Well, maybe not people, but the environment. The what? I like Jakes. He didn’t say it, but he has one aboutthe texting. Oh, sure. So another organization I’ve worked with has they run programs for kids, toe, get kids out into the countryside for the summertime incredible organization on. And they they have bus loads of children that get on the buses at the Port Authority. But you work for me, work for any schools, or is this all play time for this is this is a thing. So what happened is I was in college in London and I found, became a counselor to summer camp, and that was it. Camp was like the rest of my life. I was obsessed with this. So this organization runs five summer camps, and the kid’s got on buses. They went out to the countryside, but then, when the buses came home There was often this situation where parents might be late to pick up their children or they didn’t know exactly when the buses would arrive. Maybe the buses would come early. And so, by using a program, Sierra and we suddenly had this ability to send out mass text messages. Two parents, as the buses were sort of a narrow waves. Often, arroway whatever and say, Hey, just so you know, your child’s on their way home, Can’t wait to see you. Please make sure your at this place at this time and that we hadn’t even anticipated that this could be something we could do with a program. Xero. So what we actually talked about in our in our session was this idea that there are sometimes these unexpected benefits as well on dhe. This was a great one for us. Yeah, you’ve been You’ve been listening for a while. You have a question, But you have a question you like to ask. Oh, okay. You know what? I’m gonna shut you out. What’s your name? Joanne. Joint. Crabtree joined Crabtree from Washington from Washington non-profits in Vancouver, Washington State of Washington. So Joanne missed a session not just for fund-raising anymore managing programs with the arm zsystems and came here to listen to this. 30 minutes, 30 minutes. Short version. Thank you, Joanne. Thank you very much. Check out non-profit radio. We have way. Have lots of good panels. Not This isn’t the only one we do lots of good stuff. Thank you, Joanne. Okay, Um, we just have Yeah, okay. Anybody else want to shout out? Ah, a constituent benefit. Because I think that we’re here for the people or the environment or the animals. We’re, you know, we’re serving anybody else Want to shout out a constituent benefit, but has to be in, like, 30 seconds? Okay, Get much closer in one of the organizations that I worked with the program data and fund-raising data was separated on the program. Later was once we combined the two systems and brought the program later into the CIA room along with the fund-raising data, it’s suddenly help. The organization will stop, get along with each other much better, because previously, there was a lot of this manual data exchange between the two teams and the teens were frustrated, like concentrated, questing and not receiving the data that they want benefit not only to the recipients, but to the provider’s as well. All right, we got to leave it there. Thank you so much. Thanks, Tony. Oh, my pleasure. My pleasure. Thank you’re welcome. They are Jake Grinstead, founder of simply 3 60 Leah kopperman, director of data. And see our Emmett Cash Guy Williams, executive director of the International Wildlife Rehabilitation Council. And Mitya Nadal, principal at Top Cloud Consulting. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for being with Tony martignetti non-profit Radio coverage of 19 NTC. Thank you, Joanne. Joanne Crawford. Thank you. Are our audience member for the panel. And of course, all our panels are brought to you by our partners. That act blew in while we’re here in 1990 Sea ActBlue free fund-raising tools to help non-profits make an impact. Thanks so much for being with us. Need to take a break. See how Sam gave me the proper proper See when I get good support, the show runs. If I could just get decent support from everyone, we need to take a break. Oh, I said that host sucks. Cougar Mountain software, Cougar Mountain software quote We use Denali Fund for non-profits. It’s easy to track how much is in each fund fairly simple to use, and the training to be helped the training to be very helpful. I need an intern so bad, so I have somebody to blame for this ship. Copy. It’s unbelievable, and the training is very helpful and thorough. Customer service has been responsive and caring. End quote. That’s Laurie D. Oh, God, Lord, he’s from a church. I’m sorry. I don’t know if Laurie Listen, Um, another quote. All the features of a sophisticated fund accounting system at a reasonable cost. End. Quote. That’s Kim T. From Lawrence Township Cookie Mountain software. That’s what this is all about. They have a free 60 day trial. You’ll find that on the list in our landing page at tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain. Now time for Tony’s Take two living trusts. You start your plan giving program with charitable bequests. That’s definitely the place to start. You’ve heard that mantra many times from my lips. If you want to go further and you don’t have to, you could just stop with requests and have a very respectable, planned giving program. But if you want to go further living trusts or revocable living trust. That’s an excellent next step. It’s easy for everybody to understand, for you and for your donors. My Living Trust video is at tony martignetti dot com, and that is Tony’s Take two. Let’s do a live listener love update since we did it early Now more people have checked in Ann Arbor, Michigan is with us. New York, New York, New York. See, I’m sorry you can’t be in Hell’s Kitchen in New York, New York If you were in Hell’s Kitchen, you would have got you. We got shouted out as Hell’s Kitchen, but you’re elsewhere. Just New York, New York. But glad you’re with us. Live, love to you. And also Osaka, Japan, Japan. Checking in. Thank you, Konnichi wa and young son, South Korea. On your haserot comes a ham Nida. Thank you for joining us Live love to all of our live listeners. And now it’s time for Cole earning for your programs. Welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit Radio coverage of 1990. See, that’s 2019 non-profit Technology Conference. We are in the Convention Center in Portland, Oregon. All of our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools to help non-profits make an impact with me Now our Deborah askanase, Latika Phillips and Kevin Martin. Seated next to me is Debra. She’s the social impact manager for capacity building programs at Oracle. That Sweet Shikha is a program manager at NGO Source and grantmaker. Success four. NGO Source and grantmaker maker Success at Tech Soup, NGO Source and Kevin Martone is technology program manager at Jay Camp 1 80 a program of the Harold Grinspoon Foundation that was the longest I’m out of breath already with dellaccio sources into Kevin is a program, but he’s not the foundation, but he’s a program Oracle Met Suites. Two words. I’m exhausted already. Introductions. OK, your program topic was Reinvigorate your programs through multi directional learning. Let’s start with down the end. Kevin Martin, Please let’s define our terms. What are we talking about? This multi directional learning? Great. So Avery jargon e-giving drug in jail on non-profit radio. It will get the three of you out of jail in our session. We definitely We started pretty early explaining what that actually meant. So Okay, so I’m not the only one I know So So, um, really, the the session in this topic is really about his, you know, Traditionally, sessions are one way there’s someone on stage, whether it’s a lecture or in a webinar or some other training’s environment, who all the knowledge is going from that person who’s the expert to the audience. The learner, right? So multi directional is. I’m not assuming that that person has all the knowledge in the room that instead you’re embracing the fact that everyone in a training program has knowledge and expertise. And so you have learning from learning toe Lerner, Lerner, the teacher and teachers. So it’s all different direction, really, So So can I expect to pay less for conferences in the future. And I’m part of the training staff. I should be Compton right Free hotel E. Get free airfare. Compton. That would be good. I’m teaching. I’m in the audience, so it’s still hard work. It’s hard work. Thio create facilitated session that does multi directional, But I’m in the audience. I gotta work hard too. I should be to learning more my voice just alright, theoretical. I’m learning more. All right. Um, Jessica, why don’t you help us? Uh, bring us into the topic little bit. Give it like a headline in the lead. So why we needed this session? Well, we definitely needed the session. I think that it’s time to begin the show organizations how how to turn traditional events into something that is Maur engaging something on opportunity for everyone to contribute to these different solutions. And I was needed for organizations non-profit or for-profit. But I was as to be a part of it because I attended two different multidirectional events through next week. Oracle build a thon events of four NGO sores and in that in those opportunities for me because they were multidirectional and because it wasn’t just someone just giving me information. Given my team information for us to download and and to turn around and apply, I was actually with a team of people I was learning at the same time they were learning, and my goal throughout this whole process was to basically eliminate the time or decrease the time living in time. But decrease the time that I was spending on a billing for NGO source. And when I started this process, it took me over 30 hours a month. So process building for our team. And because of the multi directional opportunities with nets with Oracle, I’ve been able to get down my building process to less than 10 hours. Now, had I been in just a one on one session with another person, it probably would have taken me a lot longer to get to where I am now. But we had we working in teams, and so we’re all learning we were all contributing to this process. So that’s how that’s how I see it working. And I think that if we begin to we non-profits begins to look at what we’re considering. Traditional events, for instance, Webinars and think of ways that how we can actually turn those upside down to have Maur engagement to have more involvement from everyone. One. Okay, Debra, um, this sounds to me like anarchy. Why not? Why not gonna be a free for all? Well, trouble, trouble. It always sounds like gold, but it isn’t. The session was designed with the belief that everybody in the room has the answers. Right. So you walk into whatever you’re designing, whatever programmer event you’re designing with this theory that at the end of it, everyone’s experience is so much more enriched because his answers aren’t coming from the quote unquote experts. They’re coming from the people who are also doing the work out in the field or living the experience. And they have just as much validity with what they have to share as others. So a good facilitator. You have more of a facility, Kevin. Kevin was getting to this. You have more of a facilitator than a presenter. There can be some presentation elements. Like a good facilitator has figured out how to make the experience a shared facilitated latto next-gen facilitate these. I have facilitated you. Have you facilitated or just attend? Have Kevin Martin still three facilitators here? Well, as well as attendees in Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. I’m focused on. Yeah, one step at a time. I know. I just stands multiple. We all can learn from each other and you multi directional. All right, is co learning the Is that just a synonym for multi directional or is co learning something different? Anybody? I would say it’s elearning. It’s similar. Um, so yeah. All right, so we’re expanding the idea of who’s the present? We’re gonna learn from elearning elearning for everybody. Um, the advantages. I made them clear. We all have something to contribute. Not only the person on the lectern, but we all Okay, so should we talk about how to organize your next staff training? That’s so so that so that it can be co directional slash multi directional slash red, amber green. Kind of learning. I don’t know what traffic lights. No way. Like our next staff training. So I remember our wedding too small and midsize non-profits. That could be just two people. They’re called learning all the time, but let’s say it’s university. Some Let’s colleges, universities, hospitals call mid size. They’re doing lots of staff trainings. They have faculty meetings. They have dr meetings. They have, uh, other provider meetings. Learnings. Training’s right in service. We can We can use this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. At our session, we actually have people to read is I’m just nothing. All right. Even though I suppose the, uh but all right, I’m stuck in the old model like I’m a dinosaur. I mean, an anachronism. Um, the person at the I’m gonna put in health care setting. But the person on stage has her master’s degree in nursing degree. She has a master’s degree in nursing. She’s got an MBA, and staff is all you know. They’re the B s ends and the R ends. No masters degrees. We still should not all be learning from the person with the MBA and the Russian downstage. And we should also be we not all should be learning from the person with the MBA and the master degree in nursing. Doesn’t she have the most into a part in the room where we’re just all a bunch of B s ends and our ends? I would say that well, number one, there is still a place for the traditional, right? There’s gonna be times where somebody is the expert who’s coming in, and the goal of that session is to get their knowledge to other people. But in the example that you just gave, those are ends who were in the crowd they have experienced in the field. And so some of that experience might be helpful to add to what the expert is saying may potentially in more theory, where’s they have more on the ground experience so they can share that with each other and with the presenter. And like never says that enriches everyone’s now the thing that was a bad example. Also that ahead of the training right, there’s this belief. The expert often has the belief of what the people in the audience want to learn. And so there’s work ahead of the training, with Cole earning as well where you can ask people. Well, what would you like to be happening in the training? And what would you like to get out of the training? And I believe that’s a piece of it, too. That’s multidirectional where that their their direction is coming from their audience. Okay, okay, let’s start with Jessica because it’s been a while since you got a chance, Doc. So we’re going to set up this staff in service training? Um, let’s keep it in the health care vicinity. What we wear. Deborah’s just saying lead. There’s lead time preparation time. How do we get started setting up our next staff training this way? Um, great question. And we did talk about this in our session I raised for I feel like for great points. Okay, They were they were not ego problem. It’s good thing we stuck you in the middle. So s so to get started. My recommendation was the number one. It’s the first of all. Think of the roadblocks. What roadblocks do you think? Well, actually, let me if I can rewind just a bit, I’d say that the number one step would be to discuss what is the goal? What is the overall world coming together? What is what do we want to get out of this? Okay. And then from from that, then start to think about what are some of the roadblocks that would actually hinder us from turning this traditional event into a multi directional. What are some potential role blocks? And then I said that we need to think about the time, the time. That is gonna the time that is going to take for this to happen. What are the time restrictions for this? What time needs to be invested in the beginning? Because I know. And for me, when I participated in the opportunities with Oracle Net suite, there was so much time invested into our team beforehand. I mean, at least 10 hours, and so that’s something to think about. You know? Are you willing to invest that time and then distributing that, distributing those responsibilities? And then I say that we need to think about what are some of the disadvantages actually of flipping and event, because there could be, You know, as Kevin said, there is definitely still a place for those traditional events. So we have to think about that. And then, of course, what are some of the advantages? So I think once you map out those four things in addition to the goal, I think that’s definitely a great a great start. So in the instance where we are having a you said, that’s a staff meeting and we’re gonna have something. So then again identify what is the goal? What are we trying to learn? And then, I think, identify people within the community who have some experience in that they may not be an expert, so to speak, but they have a lot of experience, and so I think that that’s also helpful. And then there. I think that it’s also helpful to have people who may not necessarily have hands on experience, but they do have some knowledge of what we’re talking about, because then they also have, uh, some, you know, they’re able to make some type of contribution. Okay. Okay. Uh, Debra, what are what are some of the potential roadblocks that mentioned might exist? Thio Converting your training thio, multi directional, multi directional multidirectional. Debating what the training is, of course, will be different road blocks ahead of time. There’s the time that you put into it by redesigning, rethinking, getting out of your space that you’re used to thinking about. I think that’s hard. It’s also it can be challenging to get buy-in from your organization for this new kind of not only just programming event, think about like a fundraiser that you’re having. How would you incorporate it multidirectional in that If there’s a near some training element of that, it can be challenging to get some buy-in. The other roadblocks that ah, that could happen is so you have the multi directional training and it turns out the other directions are not so interested in contributing right. What happens then? I think that that’s very real. That has never actually been my experience Does That has never actually happened. But you do have sometimes less participation than you would desire. For example, time for our last break turn to communications, PR and content for your non-profit. They help you tell your compelling stories and get media attention on those stories, as well as build support for your work for your mission. They do media relations, content marketing, communications and marketing strategy and branding strategy. There a turn hyphen to dot CEO. Finally, a sponsor message that was uneventful. Chase got butt loads more time for Cole earning for your programs. I want it. Well, I’m gonna go to Kevin and I want to talk about some of the crew’s some of the advantages of doing this aside from what we’ve already identified a few times, everybody learning from everybody else. And there’s so many different perspectives in the audience, and we bring all those perspectives in What are there other psycho social advantages that we haven’t talked about? Whatever. I mean, I would say things you just talked about are the main advantages. But I know those are off the table. Yeah, so for in terms of our attentions fan, I think I know leaving a lot of sessions and helping with managing conference conferences. Phones come out pretty early in a lecture. And so, by having these multi directional options where you stop speaking from the stage and you give everybody option the top talk and share it gets them back engaged in the energy level gets up often in the session. That seems to be the other big. Yeah, I could see different voices. I mean, I know when I speak, I have not done go learning, of course. Not sure that I ever will. But big ego ego problems, you know, But, um, irrespective. So what I’ve done so far, You know, I noticed attention perks up when I start asking questions. I started asking, and I don’t I don’t like to leave questions till the end. I take questions. So I guess I should say, When I start accepting questions, people start raising their hands. There’s different voice, you know? Said, Let’s start popping up the other. The other half of the audience wakes up, you know, I’ve got results to speak of it. That was funny. Labbate would have to sleep off the street. Nobody, nobody, nobody Just take it seriously. I probably I could see I think that is true. I could see that. At least they weren’t using their phones way. You know, I just point I do see voices or, you know, people broke up with other voices are heard throughout the room in questions. Yes. We’re gonna mention think about the traditional weapon off. Right. And you were right. And you can see your analytics. Where, like, Oh, look at all these people. They’re not Actually. Live your weapon on what you can’t say. You can see. So if you can think of turning the webinar upside down dafs multidirectional learning, I suspect the engagement will go away. Okay. Okay. Um, time limits time. Need other Latika. Talk about that. Okay, let’s let’s go to That’s our preparation. So where do we go now? It’s a day off. Are we in day of way. You know what? There was one thing some, uh mentioned pulling. You talk about pulling in advance, finding not only what you want to learn, but whether whether people will participate, can you? Let’s talk about how do you find out whether people will actually participate? So you don’t end up one U unit directional when it’s you intended go. Directional defendant Multi direct depends on what it is for the build with on events that we run, for example, we make it really clear. First of all, we assign a team captain on the net sweet side. And then we assign a point of contact on the non-profit side. And we say at the end of this event, you will have to present not the employees but the actual non-profit customers so that they present their learnings to the other customers and we sort of designed the day. So there are no surprises. It’s really clear this is what’s going to happen if you’re participating in it. And so I think you complain. I mean it that way, where everybody walks in with a showed expectation of what’s gonna happen. Okay, Okay. I was envisioning an event that’s different where it’s not all everybody presents at the end. But we’re the role learning from each other during Kevin run by an event like that can happen. Okay, How do you make sure that audience members are gonna participate in the way I just described? I think I mean, it’s well liked. Ever said it’s definitely part of its preparation. So like there’s actually a book called The Art of Gathering by Preah Parker. And she talks about the meeting or the training or whatever the gathering is. Starts as soon as you invite someone and yours should be spending time preparing them to let them know So, for example, there’s a there’s a communications training that I do. And in one of the first communications I have with any of those participants, I asked them to send a photo of themselves. And I’m very clear. I’m saying, when we do webinars when that photo shows up, that means you have to speak. And so it’s like you’re gonna get called on. And so it’s sort of prepping them to say It’s not just me talking. You have to be ready. T share your experience. And so there’s little steps like that you could do in advance to just prime them for when they get there that they’re gonna be speaking and not just listening. Okay, Okay, what do you do? Anything. Anything different in terms of preparing the audience? E. I think that it’s also good to identify everyone’s role. So if we are looking at the model that we’ve talked about teacher, teacher, the Lerner, Lerner, the teacher and learn it’s a learner. But even within that, I think that rolls should be defined for day of plain that a little bit. So when we participated in the build a thon, it was very important for us. Well, for me, toe have a note taker. There was so much information being exchanged, and it was just impossible to gather information to retain it and also apply it all at the same time. So there was one person that we designated to be one that was actually documentation. So that way, when we leave, we have steps. We have everything documented for the future and to move forward. And I also think that it’s important to identify who is actually going to be. If it’s if it’s an event set up where you can actually begin to apply and move forward with action steps at that time, that I think it’s important to have who is going to be that person? Luckily, we were able during the building down to actually go live with a lot of the different things that we were building, you know, we didn’t have to wait for testing. We were able to go live with that. But it was important to identify who was gonna be that person. Also, to identify who’s going to be in charge of accountability and follow-up. Because once we leave here, then then what happened? So it’s important to know what the next steps are. And did this actually work? Was this really beneficial? And it’s hard to really? Well, I was going to say it’s hard to tell day of for me. I I knew at that that day of the building time that this was very beneficial for my team. I just knew it. But you actually really see the results weeks and months after the fact. So the follow-up is very important. So just identifying rolls and who’s doing what, even though we’re all learning and we all have the answers. But then how else are we contributing here? All right, all right. So we go to a day off now. Okay. Let you go. Stay with you. What? What is this? What does it look like? Day off is It’s like this is the room, like, start with the room. Is it set up the same way with a traditional seminars. Yes, it set up the same way it could actually be set up in and broken off into groups that I don’t really think that there is a right or wrong way to set up something like that. I think that if it is set up in a traditional, for instance, classroom style or meeting south, I think that you can also even incorporated a workshop section where people actually kind of break off. So I think that that’s fine. I don’t think that the way that this set up is that Okay, that was a question. Well, it was interesting to me. I’m a newcomer. Yeah. In our session, they were in the traditional meeting style set up. And when we asked them to do some of the breakout work, right, the co learning, we thought we said, Turn to the person next to you. We said sorry. Away from the like, turn to the person next to you. And instead they all said, Well, can we just get up in form groups based on what we want to talk about? And they did. Oh, yeah. Okay. Well, anarchy way. Well, let’s just go with it. Well, yeah. Community wants it. We’re supposed to hold it. It’s supposed to be supposed to be learner, too. What did you say? Audience to learn a teacher. I was wondering if you’d said no. You lose all your bona, fide, all your credibility Credibility. Yeah. No, it was so much fun, to be honest, I don’t know. I’m lecturing. We’re doing it my way. Um, okay. What else? What else do you want to go, Debra Day of? Tell me about what they have. Looks like we still got a few more minutes. Why don’t you want to give me a model? Work with her? You wouldn’t listen. General Health care. Mom, Your healthcare mind your model. Our nurses, nurses training day on on infection prevention, post surgery. So a couple of key pieces start with sending expectations. Make sure you have different voices the day off, and then make sure that there’s time built in for the teacher. Loner, loner, loner, loner, teacher. Right. So if you start with setting the expectations that setting up the room at the beginning, what’s gonna happen is structured time now, as Lucia was describing. But is it always where there’s structured time for the cold learning or you can’t just raise your hand and say, I have a point that I had used my downstage hand again. I have a point that, uh, that I want to make to the group. It doesn’t work like that. I think that’s informal elearning if you want to set it up for sort of formalized elearning that I do think we need some structure. Okay, Yeah. And so once you set up the day and then perhaps you’ve set the stage for what is actually gonna happen. So maybe there is a little bit of a training for 15 minutes. In the beginning, that’s like, this is the information you have to know. And then and then the important pieces. Well, how are you going to take that and add to it by the goodness of the intelligence of the people in the audience? And you have to build. You have to bake that in in some way, whether it’s an activity and there’s lots of great books on, like how to plan these kinds of activities where people learn from each other, um, or whether it’s an ideation exercise right and people spitball ideas. And then they turn to each other and talk about them. And then they iterated again, whatever it is. So that’s their learning from each other. And then at the end of the day, there has to be some way in which the learning is consolidated. So there’s the learning, Frito, that happens, happen stance in different groups. But then they have to learn from each other. Like, how did the groups each develop? And how did they exchange of information with each other? So you have to You just have to organize it. Facilitated is there Is there a resource that you gave out or that we can refer people to their white paper? Awesome, Reese. Okay, what is it? Tell us. Where can we find I? Actually, the first name that I can’t That was the multi multi directional bingo card. Okay, I know. It’s just basically a It’s a chart. And we, um we list 88 different traditional events, and then we have every every dynamic teacher to learn a learn a teacher Lerner, Lerner and so in the chart, the goal was to have the participants took him. Plead how feels different exchanges are happening for each one of these different traditional events. And so, yeah, we do wear working. Listeners find that it’s on. It’s in the collaborative, knows that it is in the collaborative notes. So you go to end 10 dot or GE go to the euro in the 19 multi-channel half, and then you know you’re well, we’re in 1980 CEO, and then your your session hash tag is multi path. Okay? And that’s where this resource is. That bingo card called a bingo card anymore. It doesn’t look like you find only because we were using that as our as our game as I workshop piece help the because depends to begin to start rebuilding their events. All right, we’re gonna leave it there. We’ve identified the resource. We’ve defined what the anarchy looks like. So I encourage you do not have the ego that I have and actually attempt this. Try this because we can all learn from each other. You couldn’t learn from each other. There wouldn’t be podcasts. That’s what much Give your altro out your outro. Deborah askanase, seated next to me is social impact Manager for capacity building programs. at Oracle Net. Sweet Machiko Phillips, his program manager for NGO source and grantmaker success at Tech Soup, NGO Source and Kevin Martin is the technology program manager for Jay Camp 1 80 which is a program of the Harold Grinspoon Foundation. Thank you so much, Thank you. Thank you so much. Thanks to you for being with Tony martignetti non-profit Radio coverage of 19 NTC. All are 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners Act Blue Free fund-raising Tools to help non-profits make an impact Thanks for being with us next week. Another good one. No firings. If you missed any part of today’s show, I beseech you, find it on tony martignetti dot com Responsive by Wagner c. P A is guiding you beyond the numbers. Regular cps dot com by Cougar Mountain Software The Knowledge E fundez They’re complete accounting solution made for non-profit tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for non-profits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to dot CEO. Our creative producer is Claire Meyerhoff. Sam Liebowitz is the line producer. Shows social media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our Web guy, and this music is by Scott Stein be with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit Ideas for the other 95% Go out and be great. You’re listening to the talking alternate network. You’re listening to the Talking Alternative Network. Are you stuck in a rut? Negative thoughts, feelings and conversations got you down. Hi, I’m nor in Sumpter potentially ater. Tune in every Tuesday at 9 to 10 p.m. Eastern time and listen for new ideas on my show Beyond potential. Live Life, Your Way on Talk radio dahna N Y C. I’m the aptly named host of Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other 95% fund-raising board relations, social media. My guests and I cover everything that small and midsize shops struggle with. If you have big dreams and a small budget, you have a home at Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Friday’s 1 to 2 Eastern at talking alternative dot com. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business. Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested? Simply email at info at talking alternative dot com are you a conscious co creator? 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Nonprofit Radio for August 2, 2019: Inconceivable: That Metric Does Not Mean What You Think It Means & Google Analytics & Google Optimize

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Kirk Schmidt & Wes Moon: Inconceivable: That Metric Does Not Mean What You Think It Means
Take a fresh look at fundraising metrics with Kirk Schmidt and Wes Moon. Kirk is with STARS and Wes is from Wisely. (Recorded at 19NTC)





Colleen Campbell & Jeanne McCabe: Google Analytics & Google Optimize
Learn terminology and best practices for these applications. Should you trust your data? Which reports do you need? What about testing and optimizing? We cover it all with another 19NTC panel: Colleen Campbell from Firefly Partners and Jeanne McCabe at the Center for Reproductive Rights.





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Transcript for 451_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190802.mp3 Processed on: 2019-08-03T15:14:35.193Z S3 bucket containing transcription results: transcript.results Link to bucket: s3.console.aws.amazon.com/s3/buckets/transcript.results Path to JSON: 2019…08…451_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190802.mp3.941763266.json Path to text: transcripts/2019/08/451_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190802.txt Hello and welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, what an incredible 450th show last week. I hope you were with us. I’ll say more in Tony’s Take Two, and I’m glad you’re with me today. I’d be thrown into up pal Mona Riotous if I saw that you missed today’s show. Inconceivable that metric does not mean what you think it means. Take a fresh look at fund-raising Metrics with Kirk Smith and West Moon. Kirk is with stars, and West is from wisely that’s recorded at 19 and T C. And Google Analytics and Google optimize learned terminology and best practices for these applications. Should you trust your data? Which reports do you need? What about testing and optimizing? We cover it all with another 19 ntcdinosaur Colleen Campbell from Firefly Partners and Jeannie McCabe at the Center for Reproductive Rights. Attorney Steak, too. 450th recap were sponsored by Wagner, C. P A’s guiding you beyond the numbers. Wepner cps dot com by Cougar Mountain Software Finale Fund Is there complete accounting solution made for non-profits tony dot m, a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for non-profits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to DOT CEO. Here are Kirk Schmidt and West Moon Inconceivable Welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 1990 si. You know what that is? That’s a 2019 non-profit technology conference where at the convention center in Portland, Oregon, and this is ntcdinosaur Bridge is non-profit radio coverage and all of our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools help non-profits Macon Impact. My guests now are Kirk Schmidt, director of Foundation Analytics Systems and operations at Stars. And he’s seated next to me and West Moon co founder and C e o c 00 of wisely welcome. Thank you. Thank you, Kurt West. Welcome years. Some session topic is inconceivable. That metric does not mean what you think it means. Of course, with the first thing we need to find out is who is the Princess Bride Fan? Who is that? Both of us. Both of you. All right. Top five movie for both of us. Top five. Okay. Okay. Um Of course, inconceivable is Now. What? What’s the name of the Wallace Shawn character? Who says Inconceivable all the time? What? Zini, Vizzini, Vizzini. He’s the bad guy. And Mandy Patinkin is Inigo Montoya. And he says, I don’t I don’t think that word means what you think it means. Is that Do I have that right? Is it? Yes. Okay. In concert. I mean, I know that’s where it’s from. Did I say the line correctly? Yes, but the But the line he’s most most famous for is my name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die. That’s right. He’s looking for the man with six fingers on his right hand. Who’s, you know, Christopher Guest? What’s that character’s name? What’s that? Was Christopher Guest character’s name? Yeah, the six fingered swordsman. Yeah. No name in my mind here. God. Five. You can’t remember. I can name all the top I can have. The six fingered man. Yeah. No, he’s got a name. I think it does. Because the prince the prince calls and doesn’t call him six fingered man. Prince called him. All right. Could be I am Devi that Thank you. Wait. Okay. We can have that by the end. All right. Inconceivable that metric doesn’t mean when you think it means. Um, Wes, I like to start furthest away. Why do we need this topic? Why do we need this session? Um, metrics which drive a lot of decision making in charities across the country are used improperly. Metrics are used improperly. OK, Quite often. So you have. You have a metric, uh, that tells you something. And if you don’t understand how that’s being used, it is going to be used incorrectly. Context matters. Okay, West. Anything? I’m sorry you want I’m sorry, Kirk. Anything you want to add to that? No, I think really, The what we’re trying to do is advance the sector past metrics that have been used for decades. Two things that are more robust and Maur accurately reflect what we’re trying to do with it, which is decision making to better fundrasing. Okay, so tradition is often a mistake made more than once. Right? Okay. What is your shorts? A T shirt related to this topic. My shirts wearing a T shirt for those who don’t have the benefit of the video wearing a T shirt. What’s the context of the shirt. So So it’s Ah, it’s a little data joke. And it says there’s two types of people in this world. Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. OK, that’s clever. All right, way have an answer to the president. Because the characters Ruben Ruben Wright Ruegen. Okay, I’m top five for both of you. Neither one knew. Count. I don’t think I knew that wasn’t an all right. All right, All right. Um okay, so we need to take a fresh look at fund-raising metrics. There’s a lot of mistakes being made. We need to correct things. Can we go into detail about what some of these mistakes are? I’m sure we can. Sure. So So when we get started, when we did this talk, I mean, I mean, part of it was really to find out what individuals in the audience tend to measure and really talk about those measurements and whether the worthwhile. But of course, we had our own examples. Top one being average gift. Average gift is one of those metrics that is used everywhere. And it is quite often an incorrect measure For most of the things that we try to use it for okay. Is that deeper than because averages skewed by out liars that I mean, that’s the main reason, right? So So because of the out liars, we’re using that. But But then you know where you would go to medium gift? That’s right, Median. Or you know that we talked about other ones, like trimming the average or using a winterized average way. Got jog in jail in radio for sure. You got to find this so so winterized average effectively. What you’re doing is you’re taking an outlier value. Um, and you’re you’re winterizing it. Basically, what you’re doing is you’re saying so. So take $500 for example, anything over $500 you now count as $500. So you’re taking the average and you’re basically acknowledging that, Yes, there are major gifts, but I don’t know what those major gifts they’re gonna be year to year. So you’re including them because they’re important account. But you’re not including the size of that. Yeah, the magnet, right. Counting them as a data point. Correct. And how do you Is it too technical to explain how you decide at what point you cut off and start wins arising. There are a lot of different ways, some, some arm or robust statistical means. Some could be just intuition going. You know, we’re just get cut this off in 1000. But either way, you feel that’s more accurate than average. Absolutely gift. Absolutely. Okay. It’s certainly more predictive on when you think about average gift. Uh, one of the reasons why we really care about it is, let’s say you, as a fundraiser, are being asked to raise average, get by 10%. There’s a couple ways you can go. You get one astronomically large gift and be done so that way. And we like, we like to call it the Brute Force method, which is under the Giant with a a big rock. He’s gonna he’s gonna course one person to make one large gift. Okay, Another way to do it would be to get your entire cohort to increase the size of their gift by just 10% and we call it the masterful way on, and we’re you know, that’s that sword play. The last way isn’t good for a charity. And if you took all your small donors and just eliminated them from your program. You’re giving up a lot of money. Your average would rise substantially. Hit those low wallet that low wallet. Quadrant him out. Eliminate the Miss donorsearch way. Call that the inconceivable method Inconceivable met the inconceivable method. But you know where we see this and fund-raising is stuff. Did you raise the average gift? Yes, I also saved money and direct mail. That’s right, well, and we see it quite often with retention rate, right, like there will be organizations that try to raise retention rate. And the inconceivable method of doing that is to cut off acquisition. It’s time for a break. Wagner C. P A’s. They’ve got another free webinar. On August 6th. It’s developing high impact grants. Improved your grants, we search and writing. You’ll find it at Wagner cps dot com. Click Resource Is and upcoming events. Now that’s only a couple of days away. I know that you’ll probably miss it live, so watch the archive. Wagner cps dot com Quick resource is and recorded events Now back to inconceivable. That metric does not mean what you think it means. Okay, I’m sorry. I’m hearing this for the first time. Say that again. I know it’s simple, but you got to say it again. So if you want to raise your retention rate, we know the first time ever. Really low retention. So cut off the equity. We know it’s only 25%. Yeah. Stop inquiry. Right? And so is that the right thing to be measuring fundraisers on? Okay. And fundraisers are literally measured on that. Yeah. Yeah, attention. Okay, what’s better than what we identified? What is better than retention rate? It’s not necessarily what’s better, but it’s It’s more about segmentation or or developing cohorts. Right? So we do want to measure first year donors separately from the rest of your database, and you might even want to separate further in terms of multi use your donors, those who are lapsed so on so forth. Okay, okay. This is fun. This is fun. Let’s identify some or another one that’s miserable. Been around too long. Well, not not valuable. Well, part of the problem, too, with some of these is Sometimes they were put in in other formulas for other metrics. So we talked about lifetime valuers estimated lifetime value S o f p fund-raising effective in this project defines estimated lifetime value a very particular way, and it uses average gift in the numerator. And it uses the attrition rate, which is based on your attention rate in the denominator. So and so So, basically, you’re finishing This one is bad. So So you’re overestimating your average gift, right? Because because of what we talked about before and you’re underestimating your attrition because you’re not counting your first your donors and so your lifetime value looks really big. And the problem is, when you’re using that to decide whether you want to acquire Donor comparing it to the donor acquisition cost, you’re going to believe you’re going to make more money than you will. In fact, you could believe that you’re making money and you are, in fact, losing money. Yeah, Yeah, it’s inconceivable, right? Exactly. All right. All right. This is very good. Um, let’s not. Yeah, um, we got others. Another exam is just what the session was. Examples between you brought some and the audience contributed. Was that the whole session? Effectively? I mean, we started talking about metrics in general, on dhe some good, some Something’s no like the importance of knowing the difference between the leading metric and a lagging metric. All right, we have to go there yet. Can we Can we do another dinosaur Metric? One more dinosaur matter and we do one more before we go to leading versus lagging. Mmm. When maybe you got one from the audience that you remember. I didn’t think. Now there weren’t a lot of dinosaur metrics on there. I think when we went through them, it was Maur is more talking about. What are they used for? And are they the right metric for what you want? Okay, way covered that. I think we way hit the main ones, like overall retention rate, lifetime value, an average gift, all of which are used to make business decisions. Uh, there are other metrics, I think, as you start to dig deeper, that may or may not have good effect on decision making, but they’re not used ubiquitously. All right, All right. So we hit the big three, we hit the big three. Okay, let’s go to leading versus lagging. So, what’s what’s the, uh we need to understand what the difference is. So go ahead. Explain it, Kirk. Sure. So so a lagging metric is effectively something that you learn at the end of a period of time. Where is the leading metric? It’s something that is changeable over time, and you can use it to you when you look at what it is. You can then make adjustments to it to get to, ah, better value, and then they will help inform that legging metric. So a really good example would be the number of donors you have at the end of the year. That is a lagging metric, right. Uh, so how do you find out how many donors you’re gonna have at the end of the year? Well, if you know your acquisition rate, you know how many people you’re you’re tryingto you attempt to acquire. And if you know what your retention rate is, knowing how many donors you had at the end of last year, then you can predict what the number of donors are going to get than the end of this year. So then you can adjust things. Do you do make changes to your acquisition rate or how many people you’re acquiring? Do you? Do you embark on stewardship ventures, money retention to retain donors so you could actually make adjustments that way. Okay. Okay. Um, why do we need to know? How does this fit into the bigger picture in any different way? Or this is just leading versus lagging this. How does this help us? Overall? West? Yeah. You always want to be able to walk back your goal. So let’s say, are the fictitious charity that we’re using today. It was a fire. The fire swamp trust. Okay. And the fire swamp trust is saving. Rodents of unusual size is also far a argast want from also from Princess Bride. Okay, so they needed to raise $100,000. So to get to $100,000 on they wanted to do this using mid level giving. So gifts of 1000 to maybe $10,000 in order to secure those we know. We know some things. We know that you have to talk to donors and you have to move, take them through moves, management or a pipeline. So what’s a good leading indicator and figuring out are we going to be able to reach $100,000? Well, we know that we need to have people to actually talk to donors, and we need donors to talk to, Uh and we have a lot of metrics in our history that say getting someone to qualify if they’re in my portfolio is about 25%. So we have some conversion rates between our stages on. We know that it takes about five actions or five interactions with that donor to move people through each of the different stages. So a leading indicator in getting to that $100,000 would be having 20 donors to talk to and taking 100 attempts to talk to those donors will produce one gift. So that means that if if you walk that back, this is where we we like thio abuse. Leading indicators. If you walk that back, you know that if the gift team isn’t taking enough action, that that needs to be adjusted because you will not hit your target. And that’s how we like to look at leading and lagging Lagging would be how much money came through the door today. In this particular case, context is really important. Could do it like week by week, and absolutely you should in fact you have to, because that’s how you’re gonna know whether how you doing time versus goal? Sure. And whether you need to, in fact, walk back and change one of those variables that once you have control over. Exactly. Okay, Okay. Leading versus lagging. What else we got? Well, I mean, we did talk a little bit about the future, right? And in terms of, you know, we’re at this point where we can do a lot of this manual work in terms of figuring out what are lagging. Indicators are figuring out what our leading indicators are. But what what’s coming in terms of technology in terms of how processes air computed and and what will that look like? And kind of How do we get there? All right, we’ll talk about it. Well, um, I’m in the business of machine learning for charities. Um, we’re doing a lot of leading indicator work on making using those leading indicators to predict what a donor will do next. That is one good example of what the future may look like around a prediction. So when you think of what are the variables that you’re measuring thio, maybe it’s proprietary. A couple happy to share. We have about 75 variables way we don’t have time. Didn’t they fit into three transactions? Eso previous donation is obviously one of the biggest predictors of what will happen on, and that’s not new. That’s that’s old news. I would say your best customers. Your most recent customer. I learned that in the eighties you have information about a donor, which would be, you know, Tony D’oh! Do you care about this organization to attend events? These types of things where you live economic status on then the last piece would be Theo interactions between you and the church. So those three pieces together allow us to be pretty predictive on what’s the value of your next gift? What your likelihood to make that gift on. That’s one example of what the future may look like of in the charitable sector. There’s some very interesting things happening around. Kids help phone in Canada. They are doing sentiment analysis the organization kids help phone. Okay, great organization. They help at you at youth risk krauz at risk Youth. Thank you. In crisis I am listening. You’re testing me? Yes, I waas you passed So the sentiment analysis that will predict if a call needs to be escalated. For instance, is this a very serious call? And they can do that in real time because computers can absorb more variables. Any human on bacon do that at scale. It sort of automate sort of that intuition around using metrics. So we use metrics to inform our decision in inform for good decision making an intuition. Computers could do that at scale now. Okay. Okay. Um, you had something in your description that said, uh, recognizing data. That may be problematic for some metrics. Did we talk about that data? Well, Rita points that might be that comes around, saythe out liars with average. All right, so that’s gonna throw it off. Okay, way learned that yet? All right. The lights have gone off in, uh, in the exhibit hall. Uh, and he’s 19 ntcdinosaur non-profit Radio perseveres never actually have our own lights. You shall survive long. They don’t turn the power off. We could still record, and we could still see each other, So non-profit radio perseveres. I’m not sacrificing a 30 minute segment in 18 minutes because the ambient light out okay. Um okay. Integrating better analytics into your organization’s reporting. Better analytics for your accusations, reporting move. Kind of that subsumed it, Really? And everything we’ve said, Absolutely. That’s pretty general one. But you’re holding out on us because we got more time together and you do the 75. We’ve only done, like, 17 minutes and you get 75 minutes with the view up for the for the NTC audience. So what do you not giving up? Well, I’ve got a German name, so I’m efficient. I’m going cheating, cheating of radio listeners. I’m not gonna have it. So what else did you talk about? Or maybe talk about in more detail that you haven’t yet revealed here? So what we did is we, uh the audience gave us a number of metrics very early on that they used to measure. And the nice thing is, we got metrics from all sorts of all sorts of business units that aren’t necessarily fund-raising. So, you know, we talked a little bit about, you know, impressions and click through rates and things like that. From a marketing standpoint, there were a few few that were very much program delivery, So people were talking about you know, the number of unique clients that they served or things like that. So what we did is we We spent some time going through some of those metrics and really talking about, you know, what is this measuring? Is it a leading indicator? Is it a lagging indicator? Is it both on dhe then? Going through that? Okay. So unless your host comes up with a 20 minute well, 10 minutes worth of variables that metrics that I’m that I’m preserving and committed to and then you analyze them rattle look well, well, we I mean, we we were, Unless that happens, if we one good example. Actually, I was I knew something. Would you dug enough? You’re holding out. But I’m not giving up. There’s nothing more to talk about. It talk about. Go ahead. There is S O. The audience is a little more varied than we expected. We thought it would be Omar fun fundez rating focused audience. But there’s a lot of operational folks in there. Uh, and that was intriguing to me. And we heard a number of cases where they were tracking like, number of days we have of operational funds in the bank was a metric that they looked okay. So let me give me, give the uninitiated a shot at that number of days. Number of days, days of money we have in the bank. Never heard that metric before. That sounds pretty granular like hopefully, it’s hundreds. No hope, the numbers hundreds of days. I was getting the impression it was not 100 today. Oh, maybe this is an important one. I mean, it’s like six. Well, first of all, that person needs to be networking for a job. A tte, the career center. Aaron NTC. If it’s six or below number of days, I don’t know, something just sounds weird about it. But But if you’re a tiny organization, maybe maybe this is keeping the lights on. It’s hard. I mean, from a business standpoint, it’s really about your cash flow, right? Like if we were in the for-profit business world, what we would be talking about is, is what is our cash flow? And and can we maintain it right, So so absolutely. It’s a really interesting stat from from a a charity Stemple, and she’s got such a scarcity mind to it. But if you’re in that. But if that’s you, yeah, all right, I can’t really get into controller. That’s looking. Oh, OK, yeah, yeah. As opposed to the fundraiser, right? Yeah, that’s the person who should be getting it right. Looking for a new job. If it’s the fund raiser knows that it’s 6 30 you get you’re in deep trouble. If anything, it’s a good good thing for somebody to be looking at. It’s just a matter of who. Hopefully that same organizations looking at receivables. Sure, we got We got this number of gifts in the pipeline, and typically these. This number will come through from our prospect list. So as far as you, as as we dug in a little bit on this indicator, which the number of days left is, in my opinion, still a lagging indicator, it is not a leading indicator. It is just a yard marker to say. How much time have we got left to make that a leading indicator? We then need to know how is that changing over time, for instance, so week over week, month over month, year over year, how how’s your cash flow or your days left in the bank changing over time. So if every day you look at the stat and it is still six days, then you can expect that this is actually reasonable case and that you have regular money coming in and you need to then keep walking back to get to the point where if you miss a day of doing something important that you know about it because six days from now you don’t wanna have to turn out the lights, right? So that is the exercise that that we preach about getting to those leading indicators that are your business drivers. I think one of the other important things I mean, I mean days left to somebody to some degrees is a bit of a leading because because you kind of have some some semblance of you know is the time to panic. Yes, it is. Um, and we talked about how context really matters in terms of leading indicators and lagging indicators, right? So for a stewardship person whose job it is to retain donors, retention rate might be a lagging indicator, right? They’re going to do a number of stewardship measures like, how long does it take to receipt and thank a donor on there. They’re going to try to adjust those as they go through to try to reach a good retention rate. Whereas a development officer might use retention rate to determine how many donors that there will be at the end of the year s O. So, depending on the context, depending on your job, what might be a leading indicator for one person? Maybe a lagging indicator for the other. Okay, I got your Yeah. I can’t really, uh, do a follow up question. But I understand that context matters absolutely the exact same number. Yeah. The last the last topic that we covered off was around cohort. And we haven’t talked about cooperating with you yet. Okay, s So I think I think it’s a good topic. Okay, courting is that we just have, like, two minutes left. Oh, no. Oppcoll super important cohort, please. The most important thing. All right, go ahead. Uh, you need to group people together. You know, birds of a feather segmenting segment here, Eddie would ntcdinosaur birds of a feather, right? Whether it’s knitting or stamp collecting and and that that becomes the basis of all your metrics and you only want a cohort to the point where, uh, you can still use it. So you can You can create too many segments on and have an unusable amount of data s o. You can’t consume it. You can’t produce on it like specific marketing appeals. Andi, we talked about using gift type. How someone was acquired. Eso a monthly donor has very should not be in the same cohort as a one time gift donor and a lot of these very basic things. Uh, but setting up your cohorts the right way so that their operational and usable and predictive eyes key. And that’s what I’d summarize in one minute. Okay, Okay. That was an excellent summary. I was thinking of, You know what would be a worthless cohort since we’re talking about bad, bad, like dinosaur data? Bad data. Um, age. Uh, I had some valid thoughts, as you were as you were talking. Explaining it, um, age could be, Could be a valuable cohort, or it might not. Right. It might not mean anything to average gift, but it might mean a lot to, um, potential donors to the plan giving program. Well, it might not mean something in particular cases as well. Like you might have a case where let’s say you’re an international charity and you find that certain American donors react a certain way to two things that you do. And donors in a different country who seem to have the exact same profile work completely different, Right? So So sometimes you’ll find that cohorts work in some places and don’t in others. So really, it’s about repeated testing and really, really looking to see what works in what cases? Okay, okay, West. I’m gonna give you the wrap up to this. Inconceivable the metric that does not mean that metric does not mean what you think it means. What do you want to leave people with, Oh, care about your metrics and always walk them back to their source. How, like, why’s that metric important? Take every step, break every step down and go right to the source for that leading indicator looks with leaving. Look for that leading into court indicator. Okay, that was West Moon, co founder and CEO of Wisely and sitting next to him is Cook Schmidt, director of Foundation Analytics Systems and operations at stores. Thank you very much, guys. Thank you. Thank you. Pleasure and thank you for being with Tony martignetti non-profit Radio coverage of 19 NTC As the lights are dim, the hall is quiet, but non-profit radio perseveres. All of our ntcdinosaur 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at act Blue Free fund-raising tools to help non-profits make an impact, we need to take a break koegler mountains software maintaining separate accounts for each fund-raising daily expenses and reporting to the board are all a challenge. That’s why Cougar Mountain created Denali Fund. It’s your complete accounting solution specifically designed for non-profits. They have a free 60 day trial. You can get that at the listener landing page. Tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain. Now time for Tony’s take to the 450th show last week. It was amazing. And when I say it was, what I mean is, I feel it will have been amazing. Awesome. I’m looking 10 days ahead and I’m telling you what happened a week ago, which is not hard for me to say, you see, because I know who will be on the show, and I know how good they’ve each been in the past, individually and collectively. Of course, no point critiquing them as individuals when they will have been and in fact were part of our whole troupe, but not quite, in fact, actually infection, which is close to fact in the existential sense. They’re the same. So when I say they were, I mean that they will have been. And in 10 days they were in fact have been. You can watch the recap video of Our Foreign, your 50th show at tony martignetti dot com, which will have been done after the 450th show. And that is Tony’s Take two. Now it’s time for Google analytics and Google Optimize. Welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 and T. C. We’re kicking off our day three coverage is the final day of the convention, the conference and we’re coming to you from the conference from or Portland, Oregon at the convention center. So it’s a conference in the convention center. Make that three beginning of the beginning of the ending day. All of our 1990 CIA interviews are brought to you by our partners at Act Blue Free fund-raising tools to help Ma non-profits make an impact. My guests are Colleen Campbell and Jimmy McCabe. Colleen is seated. Closest to me. She’s a senior digital strategist at Firefly Partners. Jimmy McCabe is senior digital producer at the Center for Reproductive Rights. Colleen, Jeannie. Welcome. Thanks for taking time on Day three unconference. How’s your conference going Going? Well, uh, Day three is always a little hard ones. A little tired, but hanging in a little bit. Have you done your session, then? Oh, yeah, it was yesterday. Thank goodness. Okay, that’s why we picked today to talk to you. Okay. I think that’s why um so your your topic is let your day to do the driving Google analytics and optimize for non-profits. Um, Jeannie. What? What was the reason? Why do we need this session? What are non-profits need to know? Big picture. We got playing time to go into the details. Well, how many do you want to answer the big picture? Because you’re the architect of our presentation. But I will. I will tell you what the center uses, um, data to how we use data to make decisions. Um, I can’t speak for other non-profits. That’s what that’s all. Okay, you are overviewing the headline. Yeah. So you know, our session was really focused on as the title says, Let your data do the driving. So we told a story about you know, first, how do you get good reliable data in Because, you know, that’s really the fundamental steps Way walked folks through some of the things about how to set up your Google analytics to get really actionable data and get to a point where you can trust your date up. Then we focus our middle section of our presentation talking about how do you interpret and understand what are some of the right reports toe look at, you know, not just sort of looking at numbers and pages, but really understanding what’s going on in your digital ecosystem. And what can that what story can that data tell you? And then ultimately, what do you do with it? So not just getting the data and looking at it, but then devising a plan for testing and optimizing. Okay, um and these are this is using Google analytics and Google optimize. Yeah, it was really fascinating that I would everybody in the room at our session yesterday. Use Google Analytics. All the hands went up and maybe a handful raging for 45 folks we’re using optimized, Which is that the final piece of that puzzle of getting the data, understanding it and then using it? Okay, so we’ll spend a decent amount of time on optimized since that sounds like that’s what people are at least familiar with. Are you Are you familiar with Google optimizer? Should we should be back up and explain it a little bit? I am not. You want to do an overview of optimized? We’re gonna let Let’s not go into detail. Now we’ll get to it, but tell us what it does. But what optimizes the tool that Google rolled out not that long ago that allows you to use a visual editor to basically run a be creative tests on your front end. So in other words, if I have, if I want to know if this picture that picture performs better, I pull that page into Google optimize. I send 50% of my traffic to the page with this image and 50% to the page with the other image and Google optimized reports back on your conversion Thio, you know, let you know which one is performing better. Okay. Does that make sense? Yeah, and it’s a new tool. Or roll that out. I can’t remember. It’s recently free. Used to actually be a painful. And Google within about the last year have really open it up as part of a free sweet. So, um, you know, especially for non-profits Google Analytics 100% free. Yeah, you know, optimize that natively integrates with 100% free. And then even when you roll in, you know the Google ad grant in that part of that ecosystem. It’s a really powerful sweet of free tools. So the son of reproductive rights uses all of those Google tools. We have analytics, and we run AdWords advertising or they call it Google Ads. Now, I think with our Google Google grant, and then we recently started using optimized to try to up optimize literally, are our donation pages. Specifically, we’re not seeing the conversion we want, all right, and we’ve had a couple of panels on Google ad grants or Google ads. I thought it was called that grand, so I’m not sure, anyway. Michelle Hurtado, the head of whatever it’s called. Google was here. But I just learned through the content of the conference, I learned that they had changed the name from AdWords to Google ads, which so, Iet’s Google ads with grants. So if you’re a non-profit, you can have a grant. Right? So that’s $10,000. Okay, We didn’t do a session on that. Okay, we’re done with that now. We have yet, And like I said, we have the head of Google and grantspace Google ads. Way still don’t know the head of a co-branding problem is that they do. Yeah, well, I introduced her as something, and she didn’t object. So whatever the hell it was, it was right at the time. If it’s changed since then, 24 hours. All right, let’s get focused on what works. Great. Okay, you have some Now. I was just drawing from your session description. You have some best practices for for analytics and optimize Okay on. Do you have some Google Analytics terminology? Sure, if needed. Okay. You know, But then Colleen, you kicked us off with trust your data. What reports to look at and then testing and optimizing. So we got plenty to talk about in the next 20 minutes, right? Okay, Okay. Not a problem. So let’s start with some of the best practices for for analytics at Lena’s. We’ll weave them together since they they natively integrated analytics and optimized. Jeannie, why did you have a good idea for a best practice for either analytic list? Like a list of about 10 way? Don’t have our notes in front of you, but I can remember most of the top to the top three or four. What do you like? Well, I feel like it’s a little hard to explain without looking at it, but, um uh, you want one best practice we talked about. It’s setting up multiple views in Google Analytics. So, um, you have the ability to set up basically a test view, um, and then a mass review for your data. So it’s kind of like having a staging site on productions. I, um and we use views at the centre Thio create separate analytic views for our different language sites. So we have, um of you. We have our main website is reflective right side and Google Analytics. We set up a view for our Spanish pages are Spanish site, which is the same you are all about to Spanish language. Um, and then our English pages that we have a master view, which which combines all of them. What is Analects do for you on those two different pages? Well, with a view you’re able to then see, you don’t just isolate the audience for those pages and see where they’re coming from and what they’re doing, as opposed to, you know, having them all mixed up right away. The numbers being aggregated specific slice. Yeah. Okay, Colleen, a practice past may be the one optimized aural analytics. Yeah, as you mentioned, you know, I kind of went through our top 10 checklist, but I think the most important fundamental piece is having your goals and your conversion tracking set up. You’re not really going to be able to get valuable data and look at those reports and understand your r a y or, you know, run meaningful experiments without having that measurement in place. So, you know, our advice to folks was Look at what are the most important calls to action on your site and make sure that you’ve got goals that are actually configured in your analytics to track line to those those calls. Action s O for the center for Reproductive Rights. For example. You guys, um, you know, focus on email acquisition, tracking your donations within your analytics and getting that actual transaction data. Um, I think those are pretty common to toe lots of folks and lots of non-profits. Also the action alerts on your site, you know, Did someone actually complete that action? Right. Right. And then, Jeannie, I know one that’s a little bit more unique to you is actually tracking pdf downloads as well. Yeah, we have a narc way. Have extensive archive of publications, but also case documents and, uh, legal cases. Yes. So this interview, we’ve really introduce our Yeah. Since then, everybody writes, we we do a lot of litigation in the states, and we have for 25 years. So, um, we have ah long history of case documents that you can access through our website, and we don’t really know who’s engaging with them without setting pdf way. We set a goal and Google Analytics for pdf downloads, which is applied to those dahna. Pdf documents are for all of our casework. It’s hard to explain, but it was understandable. I think there’s there’s lots of you know, of those conversion goals that are common to any organization. I think the other you know, Big One from that Top 10 checklist is making sure that cross domain tracking configured in your Google analytics, which is a little bit of, ah, you know, obscure concept. But basically most sites you’ve got your primary domain, you know, reproductive rights dot or GE. But your online forms, like your donation form of your action alert, probably live in a different domain that’s hosted by your tool provider. So when someone comes to your website, you know that’s registered as a page, you and your Google analytics. But then that user clicks that donate button. They’re going to that domain where that form is hosted. And if you don’t set up that cross domain tracking analytics is gonna count, that is two different sessions. Oh, okay, so it’s a big thing. We’re, you know, Yeah, getting that fundamental data, make sure it’s right and make sure you can trust it. That’s really, you know, get your goals in place, make sure that you’re tracking configuration is tracking her whole ecosystem. Okay, I got one practice, but wait, I would like to do one for optimized. Got anything for Google? Optimize. I mean, that’s what I was gonna mention. I pee filtering, though, for Google analytics for us. Just one more quick note. You can, um can filter out from your mess review and Google Analytics filter out traffic that’s coming from specific. I p s like, like your own office. Perhaps eso are all of our legal assistance use our website extensively to do legal research on our cases. And so all of that traffic would be, you know, would show up on Google analytics if we didn’t filter out our own I p address. So that’s an important one. Google optimized. No, that’s it is there Are there really best practices? I’m just getting used to using it. And it’s really actually quite simple. Like the Google Analytics is super complicated compared to duvette optimize Google optimizes like a tool like I don’t know, it just feels really easy. And I almost feel like how are the best practice? Well, how would you answer that? That’s encouragement to use it. Yeah. Yeah. Do you have a best practice way could move on. We’re not gonna believe this thing. Yeah, I just think. I mean, I think it’s interesting because they do work as a suite of tools. So once you’ve got those fundamentalism place for optimized army for analytics, you can really layer on top, starting to use optimizing really smart ways. Okay, so, optimizers much simpler, right? I think aside from the use of it, the one thing that you know before you before you make an experiment and optimize the one best practice would be like, have a thesis have a plan. Um, you identify an issue that you wanna fix or you know, you want to improve conversion on your one time donorsearch. What do you think? You have to, you know, kind of have a thesis of like, Well, what do you think the issue is that it’s causing conversion to be low on what might make it better and make a hypothesis. And then, um, you know, do your A B tests and see how it goes. But I have a plan to just kind of willy nilly test this or that. You know, have a strategy. Good advice Okay, time for our last break turned to communications, PR and content for your non-profit. They help you tell your compelling stories and get media attention on those stories to help you build support. They do media relations, content marketing, communications and marketing strategy and branding strategy. You’ll find them at turn hyphen to DOT CEO, and we’ve got butt loads. More time for Google Analytics and Google Optimize. Let’s let’s go to reports. You mentioned that Colleen is one of the one of the triumvirate of your urine. 1/3 of the triumvirate of your your presentation. Which reports Do you like it? And another reports that you find in your clients paying attention to that aren’t really ones they ought to be looking at. Welcome to say, Don’t do this as well. So when it comes, understanding the reporting inside Google analytics to figure out what I should be testing, I always, you know, kind of tell the story about inlets. Could do a great job of telling you who’s my audience, right? There’s a whole slew of of reports in there that will give you a breakdown. A demographic information show you geographically where they’re coming from My other favorite report is really spending some time on your mobile report and understanding how much of your traffic is coming from desktop vs mobile devices and tablet things like that. So you know, there’s that whole suite of report that can tell you who is my audience, right? Jeannie? Were some things that you guys have learned. Maybe even from looking a little bit at those reports. First, we are looking at audience reports while I look at the audience reports and g et to see, um, what countries people are coming from, where a global organization And so um, we have We have regional offices through Latin America, India, Africa, Europe and I looked to see what countries in those regions are visiting our sight. See what’s interesting to them. Also, what languages people speak to visit our site. So that’s all an audience demographics. Okay, if you’re if you’re national or regional non-profit, can you get the same breakdown by state? Yeah, you can really drill down there. You can see a global map. You can see a country specific map. You could see a metro specific and even drill into like a zip code goes down does. It s so if you’re a local or regional and you want to understand what counties a lot of my traffic is coming from, you know, it’ll drill down to that. You This is a fundamental question. But do you You can figure that in Google analytics, or is that part of the authoritatively part of the reporting in analytics? So you configure your analytics, and then all of those reports are available to you, and they got some really great data visualizations and really easy to understand. Okay? And this specific report is called, What? These are all in the audience section, and that’s specifically the geographic report. Okay, another one. Really? Well, I was really the real time reporting. It’s fascinating to me. So Google who wanna would accept the option Thio you’ll see on the side real time reporting. And you can see you can actually see visually who is on your website at this moment and, like, drill down into, you know, New York state, like where you pull them up, get your email a little stock ary, I think. But I love it so you can see visually where you know visually, where where people are accessing your sight from right now. And then you can watch where they go on. You’re saying that’s called real time. Real time reporting? Yeah. What section is that? Real time. Let’s go. Okay. Yeah, I think the other the other part of you know what before. What do you do with that? What do you do with that? No, I don’t do anything. I didn’t like it. I don’t do a lot with it. You know, what we were talking about yesterday is real time reporting is actually a good way to test that. All of your pages Air firing the tracking tag. So, in other words, like you can use or you could do-it-yourself. Why? So you can hone in on your own person, right on real time reporting. And, you know, on this, you know, on this browser over here, you clicking around to different pages and then you can see that those pages air firing and smart I still get goose bumps when I see that the web just works that fast. E I still doing? I still do. When? What’s one? I like the check. Just Oh, I mean something so simple. But it just amazes me still, because I didn’t grow up with this. I mean, I know I know it exists, but it’s so basic. It’s embarrassing. But I’ll say it. I’ve embarrassed myself. Falik times on this show. Nobody listens to it anyway, so it doesn’t. Nobody listens to this show, so it’s just gonna be the two of you. Um, my dad, my dad even stoploss you make a calendar entry. I could do a count on my desktop on Did I go to my phone? And there it is. I mean, I think it’s amazing that the damn thing works that fast. I mean, I know it’s just incredible or you make a mistake in your credit card, and it’s like it’s instant. You’re trying to buy something instant invalid. Invalid credit card number. Check. Your expiration date is invalid. And how does it How does it cross check their facts like watching me real time and put the wrong digit, and it just gives me a chance to say it’s a hit. Enter and then it’s like it just knows instantly. Indication before, right? No. Okay, so say I still I still get amazed that planes flying. So that ability. That’s like suspension ideology. They don’t understand my things. I don’t understand. I don’t really know how the calendar entry goes from my laptop to my phone instantly. I know it. I can count on it. I don’t know how it works. The access database, don’t you? You ruin the charm of the web for me. You’re ruining it. You’re killing it. Don’t want to know about databases. Table more reports. One of the report’s due. Like Colleen, I interrupted you was interrupted for a worthless digression. Listeners are customs are our list. Well, if we had listeners, they’d be accustomed to my would be familiar with them right now what we’re gonna say, You know, you could spend all day kind of nerd and out or being big brother, figure your audiences starting a neighbor. Then there’s the whole section of reporting of understanding where they’re coming from, which kind of really gets into that our lives. That’s critical. That’s really where the referral sources Yeah, acquisition is the section and Google Analytics. You want to look a little acquisition, huh? Tells you what you are elves they’re coming from or it’ll give you a breakdown of like all the channels, so you can see right next to each other. Who’s coming from social media? Who’s coming from email? Who’s coming from organic search versus paid search. But you can drill in then and see what Web sites are coming from. You know, if they’re coming from a direct link, where did that directly come from? And then you use what’s called UT ut m familiar with the way eso we talked a lot about way we talked a lot about you. Tm codes in our presentations. People want access that information online. We have to play with the art I will trying to very succinctly. But, you know, I’m kind of I kind of ramble. So maybe you have a T l d armors. You know, when it comes to you, T m’s, I say, You know, uh, analytics is gonna give you that break down of channels, and it knows and does a good job of understanding that it’s coming from social or it’s coming from direct traffic. But Google doesn’t know on its own that it’s actually coming from email. So there’s a little bit of extra work you got to do if you want to track your email traffic effectively, and that’s those UT M codes that genies talking about, which are sametz tre parameters that you add on the end of your morals in your email that you send out What is your team stand for? Do we know? Is it from Universal tag Manager? But the codes And you know, actually, Google has it. This is this is in the system For years that I’ve been using you. Could you go search whatever you are, you are all generator you TMU Earl generator or something. Right now it’ll come right up and you can plug in like your campaign name, your source, your medium and the girl that you’re gonna be placing in your email or whatever and Google’s But all the upend, all of the parameters are variables to the ends that you can get your tracking you, Earl, you could drop in your email. It makes it really easy. Okay, so I think the other important thing about it, it’s really great to understand where your tactics coming from, but it becomes even more powerful when you combine that with those goals and conversions. We talked about because then you can see not only how much come traffic is coming from social media versus email, but how much of my raising from those channels how many people are actually taking action on my site? Maybe Social Media does a better job of getting people to take action alerts and respond online actions. But email does a better job actually getting people to donate. So having your conversion data next to that channel data is really sort of where the power is that I think the opportunity to find out what maybe not working or what’s unexpected. Where do I want to run? Some experiments and some Tyson optimized. So it’s about mining that data to really figure out what you want. A test. Okay, Okay. I used the report that I use the most. It’s just simply now we find out the one used the most Well, wait kind of working our way through the sidebar here. So we got audience acquisition. I was gonna start talking about content. Just another used most. Well, we’re going. We’re getting there we go. Which way, Jeannie? Now we know where they came from. Who they are now. We have to know what geological thought problem. Now we got to know what they’re doing on the site, right? Yeah, there’s these buckets. And as you can understand now, so they are You know, where they came from and what are they doing? That’s the site content. So I spend most of my time in St content reporting, which is seeing what landing pages people are coming in on. What’s the next page? They’re going to look at how much time they spend on certain pages. I look at, you know, it’s a page is getting a ton of use. Where did that traffic come from To get to that page? Um, so I know what the path Waas, um and I and I use it really Jin form or content strategy team. What content is of most interest? I look at fight search reports within there. I see what our top landing pages are every week. So we know if it’s something way, have some really specific, literally like a 12 year old, uh, reports, reports and documents that that get tons of traffic through Google search. And it’s interesting to see what people are interested in that we haven’t even we don’t even have updated content on the way. Can I talk to editorial team and say, Like, way need to revise that cerini to publish some new information on this subject. I’m gonna I’m gonna move us along testing, testing and optimizing because we just have three or four minutes left. So what’s, uh, what we need to know? Way just slide in our presentation that said, Optimize all the things right? No, but I think there’s there’s tons of opportunity out there, and hopefully you are mining that data to figure out what that is. But I’d say your donation form is prime real estate for testing, looking at and understanding what your top landing pages are on your site and what you can maybe test there to drive more action. What’s the right headline on that page? What’s the right imagery? What’s the right layout for that page? So, understanding from your analytics, what are those top landing pages and then identifying the elements on the page to actually run some 80 times, testing all different elements whether you have a photo or video with Dexter’s button color, all this? Yeah, everything. And then, in addition, to the elements on the page. Optimize allows you to do what’s called a redirect test. So if you have a CT A on a page, right, whatever, let’s call it a total. Okay, sorry about that. So you’re called action is donate right? But you wanna test, you know, one very different donate page from another day against another donate page. It’s not like a simple element changed. So you you can say through optimized like send 50% of the people who click on this button to this experience and sent 50% of this experience. And let’s see which experience performs better. So it’s a different type of test. It’s not just an element. It’s it’s literally using two different different experiences. Yeah, great example. Anyone who works in fund-raising has probably had the debate about what works better. Ah, form. That’s one step with all the fields on the page or a multi step donation form. And my answer is you gotta test it for your audience. There’s no there’s no one answer for everybody. Okay? Okay. Uh, was there another minute and 1/2 minute? Got about a minute left? What? Uh, you’re loving this No, it’s not among my worst injuries. Bottom third. You know, it’s valuable information. I’m just kidding. I’m just kidding. No. Good answer. Um, what, uh, what would you like to leave people with a guy like our son? And we got 32nd. Now that I just wondered. 30 seconds messing around. What? I’ll give it to you, Colleen, because you’re the You’re the consultant. Steven, you see the global picture of this? What would you like to leave our audience with? Yeah, I mean, I hope we did an all right job kind of painting the picture of how you get that data in how you understand it and then what to do with it. But I think when it comes to testing an optimization, you know people immediately everyone knows. And there’s doing that peace around a B testing in my email. And people understand the importance of testing their social media ads. But I think people all often overlook the importance of testing pages on your website. So I think, you know, with the suite of tools from Google that are all free again and really accessible and easy, you have, you know, the power inability to do. And even without help from consultants like, yes, we’ll be starting a Web site redesigned soon without your help, actually, and optimizing all the things you’re hearing the inside track on the client relations right? Brandraise shit right now. All right, So they are calling Campbell, senior digital strategist at Firefly Partners and J. McCabe, senior digital producer at the Center for Reproductive Rights. Thanks to each of you, thanks so much for having us. And thanks to you for being with Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 NTC. All of our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at Act Blue Free fund-raising Tools to help non-profits make an impact. Thanks for being with us next week. Getting buy-in and moving forward tech committees that work in two weeks. On August 16th I wanna let you know I’m firing a listener at the top of the show. If you missed any part of today’s show, I beseech you, find it on tony. Martignetti dot com were sponsored by Witness E. P. A. Is guiding you beyond the numbers. Regular cps dot com by koegler Math and Software Denali Fund. Is there complete accounting solution made Ford non-profits tony dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for non-profits, Your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to DOT CEO. Our creative producer is Claire miree off. Sam Liebowitz is the line producer shows Social Media is by Susan Chavez Park. Silverman is our Web guy, and this music is by Scott Stein here with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit Ideas for the other 95% Go out and be great. You’re listening to the talking Alternate network. You’re listening to the Talking Alternative Network. Are you stuck in a rut? Negative thoughts, feelings and conversations got you down. Hi, I’m nor in Sumpter, the potentially ater tune in every day, Tuesday at 9 to 10 p.m. Eastern Time and listen for new ideas on my show yawned potential Live Life Your way on talk radio dot N Y C. I’m the aptly named host of Tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other 95% fund-raising board relations, social media. My guests and I cover everything that small and midsize shops struggle with. If you have big dreams and a small budget, you have a home at Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Friday’s 1 to 2 Eastern at talking alternative dot com Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business. Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested? Simply email at info at talking alternative dot com Are you a conscious co creator? 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Nonprofit Radio for July 12, 2019: Your Crowdfunding Campaign & CRM + Email + Website

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Moshe Hecht: Your Crowdfunding Campaign
Most crowdfunding campaigns don’t make goal. What are the common denominators for failure and success? Moshe Hecht answers all, and shares his organizational readiness checklist to get you prepared for success. He’s chief innovation officer at Charidy. (Recorded at 19NTC)





Isaac Shalev: CRM + Email + Website
You’ll learn more about the people engaging with you when your CRM, email and website are integrated and talking to each other. We’ll leave you with a plan for getting these technologies together. My guest, also from 19NTC, is Isaac Shalev, president of Sage70.





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Transcript for 448_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190712.mp3 Processed on: 2019-07-15T12:28:32.797Z S3 bucket containing transcription results: transcript.results Link to bucket: s3.console.aws.amazon.com/s3/buckets/transcript.results Path to JSON: 2019…07…448_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190712.mp3.945783280.json Path to text: transcripts/2019/07/448_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20190712.txt Hello and welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit Radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d turn pseudo referees if you made me sweat with the idea that you missed today’s show Your crowdfunding campaign. Most crowdfunding campaigns don’t make goal. What are the common denominators for failure and success? We she Hecht answers all and shares his organizational readiness checklist to get you prepared for success. He’s chief innovation officer at charity that’s recorded at 19 NTC and C R M plus email plus website. You’ll learn more about the people engaging with you when you’re C R M E mail and Web site are integrated and talking to each other. We’ll leave you with a plan for getting these technologies together. My guest also ferment 19. NTC is Isaac Shalev, president of Sage 70 Attorneys Take two. Show number 450 were sponsored by Wagner. C. P A’s guiding you beyond the numbers regular cps dot com by koegler Mountain Software Denali Fund. Is there complete accounting solution specifically for non-profits tourney dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turn to communications. Full service, strategic communications and PR turn hyphen to dot CEO. Here is your crowdfunding campaign. Welcome to Tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of 19 NTC. That’s the 1920 19 non-profit technology Conference. We’re in Portland, Oregon, at the convention center. All of our 1990 seasoned reviews are brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools for helping non-profits to make an impact. I’m joined down by mushy Hecht. He is the chief innovation officer at charity. That’s with a D. On his topic is why your crowdfunding campaign might fail and how to avoid it. Welcome, mushy. Thank you. Thank you, Tony, for having me on the show. It’s a pleasure. Pleasure. Um, what’s the work at the charity? So we are a crowdfunding platform and consulting service. So we help non-profits run their e-giving days crowdfunding campaigns, and we do the entire back office service for them. So we’ll give them the platform, and then we will give them a a team of marketing specialists and fund-raising consultants to help them succeed in their crowdfunding campaigns. Okay, so your first step in making sure your crowdfunding campaign doesn’t fail might be to engage charity. That’s right. Oh, man. What a free from I just give you 30,000 listeners, and I’m not gonna charge you. You didn’t ask for it, so I’m not going. Um, okay, it should be pretty simple. You got a lot of ideas around. Reasons why these things might I’m over modulating. Why these things might fail. Um, give us some some stats. Most do. Bye fail. You mean not make goal, I presume. Let’s define our terms. So that xero Yeah, that’s a great That’s a great way to start. So yeah. Okay, so the industry would would, you know, measures it by, you know, you set a campaign goal, and then you don’t reach your campaign goal. And that has about a 2/3 of campaigns. Don’t succeed across crowdster have very broad metric. If you go a little deeper into it’s a personal cause. Crowdfunding campaigns success rate is actually much lower than that. We go into non-profits or a little bit hyre. You’re going to creative creative campaigns for businesses and products. They’ll be somewhere depending What platform? Some Some state, 44% success rate, somewhere lower. Um, it’s not great. The success rate is not great and mostly judged by reaching the goal. Now, in our talk, I spoke about a different metric, which is probably more accurate and more helpful metric to of what failure means. Okay, so if you think about and you try to zone in and what did the essential difference between let’s go modern crowdfunding and, you know, just a classic fund-raising. Okay, so before modern crowdfund e-giving at some really great ways to fund-raising direct direct No, you know, you know, face-to-face solicitations, events, andan, even email marketing as of late and social Media Marketing has a laser all great tools to fund-raising to get in front of people into engage and solicit donations. I would, um, I in my view and in my experience, essential core difference of why you would okay, do a crowdfunding. I mean, if you got all those other options, is that when you when you set out to do a crowdfunding campaign, Essentially, what you’re trying to accomplish is to hit a tipping point that the campaign the crowd from the campaign will be so effective that it reaches a threshold. And over that threshold, it reaches a certain Momenta Mme that you don’t need a push it anymore. And it has a life of its own, right? So think about some of the most popular crowdfunding campaigns that we don’t know about what we call us when we, uh, you reach a you reach, um, you have your pioneers, you’re early adopters, and then you reach early majority. That’s right. Tipping point. I’m glad. Yes, Malcolm. So it’s it’s funny mentioned that my entire talk was actually is based on sort of the narrative that we’ve created through for the presentation to make it a little bit, you know, easier to understand is I based it on the Mountain Gladwell book. Oh, on the on the fundamentals. And that book came out in 2000 19 years later. The fundamentals of that book are still very true and can be used as an analogy for what it takes to reach a tipping point. And that’s really what you’re setting out to do, because otherwise just go to classic other ways. Just why put in the work in the effort to try to do a craft in-kind every single Exactly. You gotta start using direct mail to get people to donate to your crowdfunding campaign. Just write a letter, a solicitation letter, eggs. Every single dollar is a struggle, right? So the possibilities is really what you know of this, you know, uber connected world, this World wide web of goodness and kindness that we live in the possibilities of hitting, attempting a tipping point of having the campaign go well beyond your own abilities to take on a life of its own is really what we’re trying to accomplish. So I would say that there’s actually if you use that metric as as as failure, it’s actually a lot more than 2/3. It’s just that that’s hard to measure. Weight have to be really do granular analysis of what can I get? Lots of campaigns and how they trended and over over what beer time. Okay, but yeah, if you apply that measure, I’m sure it’s. But it’s not much worse, less less than 1/3 succeeding Okay. Ah, so what are what’s the best way to? We just dive in and say, What’s the number one? Well, I I thought of something. After all, what’s the number one reason campaigns failed, So there isn’t one reason. And number one number one, what’s the top reason? It’s gotta be a top reason. So mote many of you. Well, what I would say. Probably a top if I had to choose. The top reason is a lack preparation. I’m asking you, like a lack of preparation and the infrastructure set up right in for up front. Okay. What we do, What do you need to do up front? Very good. So you’re getting me through the top? Didn’t you see the questions I gave you before? So, Tony, tell me, um, it’s time for a break. Weather, cps, their accountants. You know what they do. For goodness sake. You’ve heard me say this. You know what CPS do? C p a. Certified public accountants. Do you need one? Do you need a firm? You need a couple, whatever you need. You know what they do? Check them out first at wagner cps dot com. And then you know what to do after that. Pick up the phone, talk to you. Eat duitz. Doom the partner. He’ll tell you whether Wagner CPS can help you. Regular cps dot com Now back to bushy Hecht and your crowdfunding campaign. So that’s actually a good question. Once the number one reason, Yeah. Lack of preparation, I think, um, people they see so we see a lot of graph looks easy, right? It looks like a kn accident. Do it. Do a do a 32nd selfie video. I go on to kickstarter or go fund me. What? According to you, what? What? My intentions are what my goal is what I’m raising money for. And, uh, and then and then people just come like we thought about web sites in 1990 to build it, and everybody will come to it. Not gonna happen. Yeah, doesn’t happen. So there are, um, a few core ingredients that need to go. It’s a new set of we’re talking about upfront, prepped on infrastructure. And these are I would say, these are fresh tools that non-profits need to learn. Okay, um and maybe individually, some of them are, you know, classic tools. But combining them together is really where the magic happens. The glue that brings them all together, that creates that, you know, sort of velocity That helps a campaign take off those two and these air. And I say they’re fresh tools, because there, you know, they’re the these are part of this is possible. I believe that. You know, we hear a lot of saying, like, you know, don’t try to do a, you know, ice bucket challenge for your organization, right? It’s just not realistic. And that’s actually, you know, if if consultant would tell you that I would say the streets looking out for you, he’s not trying to set you up for you. No unrealistic expectations. But I have a bit of a different view in the way my experience on what might what? What I do for a living is we actually work to reverse engineer a an ice bucket challenge and say, What were the ingredients that went into the ice bucket challenge even though it happened by accident again? Okay, organically. It’s not like someone came together. All right, we’re gonna raise under $50,000,000. We’re gonna get the entire world plus the president down. Bill Gates, everything. Here’s the plan. Follow blueprint. Do it. But l s had some things in place. Well, they’re so there. So not with not with this intention. I would say it doesn’t like that so I would say we’ll study. It doesn’t matter. Meaning whether the things happened by accident or they happened with intention. Doesn’t matter. Just tell me, what were those that they were in place? No, no, I understand that. Yeah, I agree. Yes. So they’re making it clear that they didn’t set him up with the intention of exactly Because that’s country what you’re talking about. Yeah. So? So what we’ve done is what was already so number one, Let’s go through a mountain labbate. Okay, Number one is the power of the few. Okay, so we know about you know, the power few 80 20 rule When it comes to fund-raising grayce absentee money is coming from 20% to you people. 20% of ah, you know, 20% of your people should be giving 80% your money, right? And we use this says as a methodology for fund-raising. Rarely do we use it as a methodology for involuntary engagement and for soliciting people to become ambassadors and influencers for your organization. Where we say Okay, well, if we’re trying to get to the message, we should just engage with the mass masses. But the reality is is that it works the same way with volunteer engagement. Getting people to advocate for organization is first, find the power of the few. Find the power of those. The column, the the influencers, your power. Your have power on social media. Exactly. So so glad. Will breaks it down into into into three different types of people. Connectors, mavens and sales people. Right. So today we call them influencers, right? And they but influencers have varying degrees of these attributes, you know? So Ah, connectors like you going to a party. And you’re like, you know, how’d you get here, Laura? You know, she, uh, Lauren bradunas. She invited me to You walked through the room. Heroes at Laura basically was, like, had something to do with everyone invited to the party. Right. You’re going to a conference in Portland, you know? Oh, you have to meet Laura. She’s gonna be there. You gotta meet Tony. You gotta get on the show. You know, everyone’s on his show like these air connectors. That’s not a hypothetical. No, no, that’s that’s really you’re connected. And you’re also maybe even be a maven. Maybe even a sale of herself. Disgusting. You’re made in first. Everything I don’t want to say I’m a whore. Everything. Oh, my God. There’s a lot of Yeah, So there’s a lot of obviously that there’s crossover at some people. Could be like a professional something, And they’re also a bit of a connector. But essentially, it’s influencers. Right? But influencers, you know, today we know the Miss Influences, and they’re like, OK, instagram influencers, they sort of They become formalized and formulated into an actual career. Right? But it’s not just the professional way. Gotta move this long. You have a lot of tips were only on the 1st 1 so number. So you know what? No, I do wanna go deeper on this before before we leave it, but I’m directing you that we got, uh I wanted to get specific. What do you do with these influences first? First you gotta identify them. There are companies that I can help you sort through your all your social contact if you give them your email. Maybe charity does that. I don’t know, but you get enough of a free promotion. I’m not gonna let you say whether you do it or not. Maybe you do maybe you don’t go to charity dot com. She could find out beyond that. So you’ve identified your influencers? What do you do it before your campaign? You You Well, you empower them to be a springboard and a messaging board for your organization. So say you’re a school, okay? And you identify, um, an educator in the community, right? That who’s a maven in the community, which happens to be a parent, right? And you, you you engage with that person and say, Listen, we’re doing the campaign, and we’re raising money for this in this new program. And you happen to be a professional in this program and love for you to get onto a video and talk about like, Yes, this program really deserves the funding that is being asked for. And among all the noise that’s happening through all the solicitations and asking this is going to rise to the tide because you’re getting that trust and that gravitas from this professional who’s going to bring your message to the forefront. So you want to identify them? You want to empower them, engage with them and ask them to become advocates for your campaign. Now, if and their first. So they’re really carrying the message forward, right? The connectors are like just by just by posting it on Twitter today or posting on instagram or putting it on a whatsapp group, they’re naturally connecting or they’re going to an event, right? The mavens air giving you no weights and trust to the conversation. Salespeople are creating persuasive reasons why you should give and should give Maura and give even more. You line these people of strategically, you could have a much greater chance of success. All right, How much? How far in advance? Great question. So it happens in in-kind. Took 14 minutes for questions. Wait. Another 10 maybe 12 5 Feel generous it How far? So we do it, so we do it in stages. So what’s really important with crowdster radcampaign is keeping the momentum going. So you don’t want to, you know, start preparing a campaign several months before, and then you lose interest in you lose momentum, right? Because you want to complain. It’s like a plane taking off, right? So they’re usually the first people that you would reach out to you before you go public before you go public, right? so you’d reach out to a couple weeks before a couple of weeks before you know if I’m dealing with a squid newsome with university. So it would be like, let’s say, two months before the campaign and you want to. You want to give them preparation? Won’t have them prepare their message. You want to have them, you know they’re gonna go out and they’re going to speak on behalf of the school. They have questions. They’re gonna I want to, you know, you know, curate and really define their message. Probably university. That’s a bigger bureaucracy to so some of their messaging may have to be approved, but sizes smaller midsize shop. Well, College University could be a mid size small shop. You don’t need to be two months out in advance. We’ll give you an example. Influencer. Yeah, so I’ll give you an example. We did a campaign we ran a campaign for Why you in New York University and this was three years ago. We’ve done one recently also, but the 1st 1 that we did of slogan was I m y you and Lin Manuel Miranda was actually a honorary graduate of Achieve University. So We engaged with him for a video several weeks before, But then the video only launched the day before. So it’s about lining up that strategy. Decided that would be a nice shot. Exactly. I shot started every every campaign’s not gonna have a Lin Manuel Miranda. But that’s, you know, kind of an example of someone finding people who have that broad appeal and that broad network to be able to, you know, take your message further. All right. Um, what else do we have to have in place? Yeah, in advance. So them the were only on the in advanced stage. We’re not even into the way. Have 10 minutes left. So the second thing is really, really second thing is really taking messaging. Very serious. So we’re still in the preparation we’re so ever. So I’ll tell you, Tony. Oh, everything. Everything happens in preparation. Okay. If you know what I always say that once your campaign starts, it’s already over. There’s nothing you can do about it once it starts. You know, once it starts, you just if you’re waiting to it for to start for to be successful, you’re gonna lose all your friends. Okay? Yeah, because you’re just gonna be harassing people, like throughout that radcampaign beating down the door for wait. We don’t want that. That’s not that’s not the outcome that we’re trying t. Okay, It all happens before I really wanted thio off. Okay? Yeah. So the second thing is just taking your messaging very seriously. Um, and Gladwell talks about it compares it to, like, you know, the stickiness factor. You can have good messaging. Are you gonna have missing that actually sticks, right. So taking, going to the depth of your cause and your appeal and really defining the truth in the essence of what you’re trying to say. But then churning that into a bite size, you know, congest oppcoll message that has that has legs, okay. And a message that is going to be memorable easily. Big headlines will be able to, you know, the think different, open happiness. You know, those type of messaging, it works wonders in crowdfunding. And it’s so important because you know, the distance between your message and your conversion is actually really, really close. You know, you’re going on on social media and you’re saying, you know, getting to the core of an organization, Really? So getting to the heart of organization and making a real beautiful, you know? Well, well, well positioned. Ask right. You can see it conversion instantly. Be just moments instantly. And that’s what’s important, right? So 20 years ago, when you had a great man, you’re doing a billboard. You couldn’t really measure the results in the conversion of the building. Well X amount of eyes walking down next month. Today, messaging is so much more critical. You can’t mess with that because it’s like there’s so much you can gain with a better message. People are going to see some that’s really gonna be compelling. They’re gonna take action. You’re gonna have feedback immediately, instantly. And that’s also good with testing. So you can text messages. You contest the messages, you can tweak messages. Okay. Messaging? Yes. 30. Glad we’ll talk about the power of context. Okay, so context is that the timing is the right environment. The right moves, you know, it’s social. Are people prepared for it? Right. So on a practical level, you know, the do’s and don’ts of timing. And so you know, you know, for for ce que no for typical organization you want to think about. Okay? December’s a great month. You know, you’re on fund-raising. I want time up and lead my fund-raising My my crowd from the campaign to happen You’re in Line it up with your and fundez latto content. It should be leveraged year and fund-raising thing. Right? Um, if you are a religious organization, it should be before the holidays tied into tight to the holidays where people are in the mood of e-giving worth tied around Christmas for people in the, you know, in the in the giving season. So timing is really, really important. And then in the don’ts, you know, timing around Passover? Exactly. Yes. The Passover is coming up soon. It’s a great time. We have a lot of campaigns happening. Be Christmas. Just a Catholic name. Yeah, I was trying pandering. You’re pandering. Necessary called you out here. Listen. Martignetti sounds Catholic. Culwell call at Christmas. Go ahead from New York, Jewish or Christian? Celebrated Christmas. You know, it’s everywhere. You can’t get away from it. You know, I heard that, um my kids are still wondering why they don’t have a Christmas tree. That they’re not getting it um, it’s just everywhere, you know. Um, you know, it’s interesting on it. Before this company I work for my brother started a virtual currency company. This was 2012 Virtual what? Virtual currency. Currency 1012. No. One way ahead, Right. Guys got back. It was where he was just too much of a vision or way ahead. Right? So you’re talking about and there’s actually I’ve been in the last six months I’ve actually seen already three businesses that have almost the exact identical business model. Tow what we what he what he created and what we were trying to create that genius. Brilliant. Nothing bad timing right through these other three of taking off other’s movements. There’s a whole ecosystem today. Virtual currencies go today, so timing is really, really important, you know? Are you coming out with your message? Where than even the environment is ready for it? Look at that. Remember the immigration campaign that you don’t let your brother listen to this? Yeah, sure. Does he know I really wrote that rodeo? How I wrote about this kind of threw him under a bus. You know, zoho thing for him, you know, it’s it’s, it’s he’s a genius, you know? He’s, you know, he’s too smart. It’s got no time, no time, no good. You can’t invent the car now. Exactly. You remember the image of the campaign that Facebook krauz from campaign that raised like $35,000,000 for, you know, for for the immigration organization in D. C. Was a 35,000,000 crowdster. It was a $35,000,000 crowdster. That organization, before that campaign struggled to reach $1,000,000 a year fund-raising. They didn’t even have a budget of more of $1,000,000. Here they are, the timing with the entire immigration fiasco that’s that’s going on. Someone launches a campaign on their behalf, or they launch shevawn exactly sure who launched it within weeks. $35,000,000 from tens of townspeople. And and you should. You know it’s not about being an ambulance chaser. You don’t want to take advantage of situations but should be looking out for you. That’s that’s grabbing a hook Exactly. If there’s immigration news and you’re in the immigration space, I think if you don’t grab a hook, your risk being irrelevant, and I’ve had guests who have said that, and I believe it myself. I just I just repeat everything. Guess yeah. Bring smart. Don’t have any knowledge of your own. I have a good memory. All right, let’s move on. Really? Have a couple minutes left, like three or four. So more things. More things. Preparation. Mushy, please. So I’ll tell you. Great. So So you have your So let’s say you lined up all these ingredients, right? And you you line up your power of the few. You get your influences lined up to really help you can. You got amazing messaging, right? And then you have the timing’s perfect. You get even a little setup, right? Roger. And for what you’re missing right now is it’s not enough. No, no, not sufficiently. You’re missing. You’re missing. What you’re missing here is velocity. Okay, so think take up. Sorry about that. Take a plane. Take off. Right, Guys, watch one off. Yeah, take a plane. That’s mine. I put mine on airport road airplane mode for you. Uh, if I could get the same courtesy put in his pocket, but he still didn’t put it. Still did not know. You only gave me 30 minutes and going in airplane mode, yet just took in his pockets. It’s still gonna vibrate. All right, So take a plane, right? It has to reach a certain speed within a certain amount of space. Was a certain amount of time actually living velocity velocity on and lift and lift in the upper wings and believe that teacher above pressure below. So all that scientific stuff, But the point is that you need thes things to happen within within a specific amount of time for us to be able to create that combustion for it actually take off right field to hit the tipping point. Yeah. Okay, So, um, I’ll give an example of what things? People we see that people are usually doing wrong they can improve on. Is that, you know, yesterday had to come from at my talk. I asked someone like you who’s been involved in a crowd from the campaign dahna peer-to-peer of campaign, for example. And one person Me. Okay. And I said, Well, tell me how it went in these and she said, Well, they called me out, they sent me an email and then there was an event, anything, and they said you know, would you take on a campaign a page to raise $3600 for the organization. Right? And she said yes. Okay. And then when was the end? When was the organ it? When was the campaign culminating? Four months. So is the worst words four months of her life. Okay, so you need a much less time than you think you do, right? You think more time equals more money? No, no, no, it doesn’t. Less time equals more money because, you know, people are just inundated with so much information. And if you if you have the right ingredients to motivate the person to say yes, I’ll give right with by telling them, you know, whether you let’s say you put a matching component on the campaign right where you said in this and limited amount of time, your money will be matched, right? Right. Or you put it. You have a certain goal that you have to reach within a certain amount of time, that urgency, their impact recognition with everybody’s gonna be recognized. The campaign. You have all those ingredients and you have the right man. You have the right people pushing it and the context is right. You need very, very little time to actually take off. The majority of our campaigns happen in 24 36 hours. Millions are being raised in 24 3rd toe with weeks of preparation. So if you want to hit a tipping point, you can’t have, you know, miles of runway. You’ll never take off. You just drive right off the runway, and that’s it. So shorten the runway and and and prepare the ingredients that you need, as we just mentioned. But that should be all be done in the maintenance hangar. Exactly playing now, in case that wasn’t obvious. Yeah, you’re feeding off, Tony. We feel about each other is done in manufacturing. I mean, you go way back, but it’s done in maintenance, maintenance and cleaning. Yes. Okay. All right. All right. Uh, give me another minute. You got, uh, Can I? Yeah. You got one more thing. I want to wrap it up. Dahna without mentioning charity dot com. Can you Can you summarize or you want to give another tip? You know, listen, I’m here today, and I don’t do a lot of the conferences, but it’s it’s It’s fantastic to be to be here. I think the Auntie unconference is really nice, you know, some of their like way big. And there’s not a lot of you know, too big to have conversations and too small. I think this is a really, really nice sized dent. Unconference. I’ve met a lot of wonderful people here, a lot of people doing a lot of innovative stuff in this space. It’s it’s encouraging to be here to see a lot of people, you know, working towards the same goal. Yeah, all right, we’ll leave it there. Thank you for having actually. Don’t don’t walk away yet. Your your phone is Your watch is buzzing. He’s monisha Hecht. He’s the chief innovation officer at charity. C H a R D y. That’s enough shout outs for that, and you’re with Tony martignetti non-profit Radio coverage of 19 ntcdinosaur 2019 non-profit Technology Conference, Portland, Oregon All of our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our Partners Act Blue Free fund-raising tools to help non-profits make an impact. Thanks for being with us. We need to take a break. Cougar Mountain software maintaining separate accounts for each fund-raising daily expenses and reporting to the board are all challenging. That’s why Cougar Mountain created Denali fund-raising osili Fund, a complete accounting solution specifically designed for non-profits. You know, like the Park Denali. They have a free 60 day trial at tony dot m. A slash Cougar Mountain Denali, of course, is also a mountain, but it’s Ah park in a mountain Denali fund that m a slash Cougar Mountain. Now, time for Tony’s take to the 450th non-profit radio is July 26th. Yes, we’ve been at this nine years times 50 shows. There you go. Who’s gonna be with us? Scott Stein, of course. Live music. You gotta have Scott and his 88 singing. Ah, our theme song. Cheap red wine Live in the studio. Um, of course, our creative producer, Claire Meyerhoff, live in the studio. Call ins from all our contributors. Giveaways? Yes, giveaways. I’m sure we’ll have cure a coffee. The coffee owned by the dentist that provides dental care for coffee growers and coffee workers. As you buy their bags of coffee, they’ll be there. A sponsor of the 450th will be giving away some bags of cure coffee. Always great fun. Um, we’ll have some some comedic thing. It’s too early to tell you. Don’t You don’t need to know at this point if I told you you’d forget anyway, So just be tuned in for the 4/50 and you’ll see what we’re doing. We’re giving away and, uh, what we put together. All right, that’s it. That’s Tony’s. Take two Now here is C. R M plus email plus website. Tough. Welcome to Tony Martin. Non-profit radio coverage of 1990. See, that’s the 2019 non-profit Technology Conference coming to you from the convention center in Portland, Oregon. All of our 19 ntcdinosaur views are brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools to help non-profits make an impact with me now is Isaac Shalev. He is president at Sage 70 and his topic is solving the C r M plus email plus website equation. Isaac. Welcome. Thanks very much for having me, Tony. A real pleasure. You have a real radio voice. Good podcast voice. I should start one you have right now. You have one already, right? I’m cheating. I do. I’ve been podcasting for a few years on a totally different top shot out your podcast. What is it? My podcast is called on board games, and it’s about board games. Eso head overto on board games dot net to check it out. Okay, Wonderful. That that’s obviously a part time passion of yours again. Yeah, I I design board games on the side. You designed them. I was gonna ask you, Do you talk more about classic or contemporary games? We mostly talk about contemporary games. We talk about the games industry, which is exploding these days, and we feature interviews with industry guests and talk about what’s happening at conventions and things like that. That’s what’s fabulous about podcasting. The niche niche, a board games podcast. Yeah, you could go all the way down the rabbit hole in a podcast. And there’s somebody down there listening, doing it. Yes, whatever it is. Yeah, all right, Uh, let’s do our equation. So what? What’s the problem here? Well, I think it’s an opportunity, really. More than a problem of the opportunity is to be able to know more about the people who are engaged in your mission. Whether that’s donors who are coming to your website to learn more about you or who are reading your emails because they want to know more about the work that you’re doing, um, or whether it’s program participants who you want to track as they go through your programs. You want to be able to wherever somebody touches you, no and track and engaged, which means you need a database that can store all that engagement information. But you also need connections between where the engagement happens. Right when you send an email, you need to know who opened the email in order to track that they opened it and cared about it. Same thing with the Web. When somebody visits your website, you want to know that they came and what they clicked on that’s gonna help you communicate with them about the parts of your work that they care most about. So that’s the promise of C. R M. When it’s integrated with email and with the website. The technical challenges enormous, though, because these are different systems by different vendors and different underlying technology, and making them connect is not trivial. So we’ve spent the last 15 years working on this and we’re getting there. We’re getting closer and closer each year. Are the vendors cooperating with each other? I think that over time we’ve seen a few cycles of how this kind of works. So initially we had a lot of unbundled services. You had your website on your website was I mean, even think about the pre WordPress days, right? When when people were spinning up websites on bear code. Um, and you had databases that didn’t even talk to the Web. I mean, if you were working with earlier versions of razors at your donor perfect, they didn’t have any connection to the Web. But all that’s changed a lot. Now they’re all in one systems. You know, Neon is a vendor that’s pretty popular in that space that provide content management systems as well as email marketing platforms as part of the core CR M database offering. But you can still do it. Lots of other ways and enterprise solutions are often more of a Let me pick of the best in breed for each service I want and then integrate through AP eyes, Um, and that can be very powerful, but it’s challenging, not on just the technical level, but on the training you need to train staff to be able to use multiple different systems. And you need governance. You need somebody to oversee how different systems connect and make sure that the right pieces of data move to the right place is a lot to this. All right, well, that’s what we called it. An equation, you know, were straightforward. There’s some math ap eyes. Let’s just make make that clear. We have jargon jail on non-profit radio. You’ve trapped me in. So I didn’t drop you. I was your for your You’re free falling every rolling. I walked right in and slammed the door. Okay, I know that in a p I was like, It’s a call from one to another, but you you don’t know what it stands for. You can define it better than I can. So, uh, a p I is a way in which one system defines how it wants to be spoken to buy another system. So when you use an A p I, what you’re doing is you’re sort of saying I want to move information like your name and your email address from my website, where I captured it in a form to my C R m so that I can see if maybe you’ve been a donor and I can add engagement record, I can add a touchpoint to your record. So my cr m will say, Oh, that’s great. If you want to pass me information, send it to me in a file that looks like this, right? So send it to me within column one Put the name in column to put the email and package that into a you know, an extra accept ostomel far, whatever it is. And send that to me. That’s basically what an A p I is. It’s how to structure data so that you can move from one system to another stand for something. Yeah, it stands for automatic program interface. I believe I’m not sure about the A Okay. Program interface makes sense. Yeah. Okay. Um, is there an advantage? Thio open source versus proprietary in terms of the three working together. If if you’re all open source, are you more likely to have compatibility? Oh, um or not. I don’t think that, uh, you necessarily will have more compatibility. What’s true is that open source products worm or committed to an open standard s o. They were more committed to offering AP eyes that allows data to move in and out of systems. And there were a lot of and there remained a lot of vendors who don’t yet have fully open AP eyes. In some cases, like blackbaud has been spending quite a bit of time developing their sky a p I that promises to allow open access. But the reality is that if you’re sitting in Razor’s Edge seven, it’s hard to move data in and out because there aren’t really open AP eyes. So yes, if you were in an open source system, you probably had access to open a P eyes on at least one side of things. I think generally that modular architecture, that idea that the product that I’m building should allow data to move in and out has become more broadly embraced no matter what, and open source products have faded, I think, in their relevance to the non-profit space over the last few years, So C v. C R M is no longer ah leading C R M product in the market without sails. For Salesforce’s open source business sales forces of proprietary proprietary yes, sales force is owned by the Sales Force company. I know, and I heard somebody say that it was open. Source. Sales Force has open AP eyes So let’s let’s define the difference here. Open source means that the coda that the product was written in is available to anyone like Firefox. Right? Mozilla makes Firefox. Mozilla’s an open source, right? So you can take that code. You can do whatever you want to it. You don’t have to pay anyone for it on. That’s what open source means. Sales force, on the other hand, has open ap eyes. Which means how could that I could? No. Course not. You have to report sales for separation. Yeah, All right, So So, yes, but you do want to look for that, but you do want a little lackluster. Sorry, I’m the only one. It’s Tony martignetti now, probably. Unfortunately, not somebody else’s not greater. You’re stuck here. Okay, so, yes, maybe was open a p I Maybe that’s what I misunderstood. Well, the trick is also that you have to be really concerned about the word ap I because there are, um a lot of folks out there saying we have a p eyes and they’re not wrong. They do have a P eyes, but they may not be opening all of the different tables in the database to you. So you may wanna track information in your c r M that you can’t pull from another system. Because, for example, um, you might have an email system where you can pull whether a person opened a specific email on whether they clicked on a specific email. But maybe you can’t pull which email they unsubscribes from. That’s just not an available thing to pull from there a p I So you’ve got some functionality. But when you made the decision oh, they have an A p I. Let’s use them. You might not have been aware of the limitations. S o a. P. I doesn’t mean all the data can move easily, and you really need to explore and make sure by examining the AP I documentation to dive down. Yeah, to know that it’s going to share with you the with your other system, the information that you’re expecting to carry over, right? I mean, you can imagine a donor system saying they have open ap eyes. So you could pull everybody’s name and email address, but not how much they donated. That’s not super helpful, But you could still describe it as an open A P. I Okay. Okay, good. Thank you. Straighten me out, Trainable. Stick with me. But I’m training. Um uh, learning about. See, the databases of records, FBI’s integration methods, Um, a plan for getting these technologies to talk to one another. So we have. Have you done your session yet? I’ll be doing my session tomorrow. Okay. But it’s a repeat. I did it last year. You did? No, I didn’t capture you last year. No. No. Yeah, yeah. I was doing a session at the time that you offered to me. Okay. You really gotta schedule. Maybe I invited you and you turned me down. That’s possible, too. Way invite. More than we can refill. It’s possible. It’s possible. I’m glad to be here this year. Yeah, I’m glad you are to thank you for coming this year. Well, I’ve been listening for a long time, so I think I’m excited. Thio have a chance to be on the other end of the mike. Thank you. Glad. Um, Okay. So Well, what only one with just a little bit about the fact that you’re you’re you’ve been listening for so long and gratified to be a gift. A guest. What? Well, I was I was gonna suggest that we talk a little bit about how, um today the need for integration is even greater because our stakeholders expect us to know everything right. When you come to an organization, you expect them to know whether you’ve been to an event or whether you were engaged in a particular cause. There’s just no separation from from the perspective of the donor of, ah, stakeholder between the different departments within an organization, you know, you call it, and a lot of that expectation is driven by what we are experiencing e commerce for sure. Very smart companies like Zappos, Amazon on and maybe even buy some smart charities that have raised the bar. So now we’re expecting I mean, why don’t you have the same? You have access to the same technology they do if you’re willing to invest in it. So the bar is hyre, you know, step up your game absolutely and fairly right in that we came preaching the importance of working with each individual and segmenting our communication so that everyone feels a personal connection. And if you’re gonna talk that game when the donor calls, you better know who they are. And that means that you need someone at that phone in front of a terminal where they can type in a name and see the full view of what this person has done with your organization. So the stakes are rising in terms of being able to do this and the means by which we do it keep multiplying, right. We have Maur and more channels. So it used to be that we were just doing direct mountain. We did email. Then we did text to give. And now we have ah peer-to-peer platforms. We have so many more ways in which we’re engaging. And usually it’s another vendor. It’s another system. It’s another database through which we add this functionality and a couple of years go by and some CR M pulls that functionality in and you get increased functionality within your core system. How are we gonna make this happen though you have? You obviously have to have expertise to do this. Thio, have these cross platform communications. So 11 tip, one big tip. Here’s if you listen to nothing else in this interview. I want everyone to walk away with this one big idea. Have a network map. A network map is a map that shows all the different systems that you have and arrows pointing to which system pushes data into which place. And this doesn’t sound that complicated. And the reality is, it’s not hard to do. You list all your systems and then you draw your arrows. And when you’re drawing your arrows, just indicate whether it’s an automatic move of data or whether it’s manual. Are you downloading the spreadsheet and uploading it to a new system? That’s manual. Is there an A P I. Is there an integration that does it without you having to do anything automatic? Just make that map, and now you have an opportunity, right, because now you can see where your manual processes. Maybe there’s something you can do about that where your automated ones and also you know, you you don’t want to trip over yourself. You can create loops right where one system updates the next one, the next one and the next one, and then they circle back and making a map avoids that trouble. So that’s the first step in thinking through a problem like this is make the map and figure out what’s in the middle. What’s your database of record? Where you gonna collect all that data? And if you don’t have one, that’s your first mission. Oh, if there’s nothing at your core if you don’t have a database of record, if you don’t have the place where you keep all the data, you really don’t have a way to centralize time for our last break. Turn to communications. Full service Strategic communications and PR for non-profits Turn to helps you tell compelling stories. Advocate for your cause and make a difference through media relations, content, marketing, communications and branding strategy. They’re at turn hyphen to dot CEO not dot com that CEO now here’s back to, but loads more time. Of course, for CR M plus email plus website, there’s there’s some new methods for dealing with kind of cross platform stuff. You’ve got all these tools and you’re trying Thio to be able to see he threw it through and across all of them, so you may have heard folks talking about data, warehousing, data, warehousing is it? Sounds kind of, I don’t know, futuristic in some ways, but futuristic in the most boring way, right? We don’t get flying cars. We got data warehouses, but a data warehouse is basically pouring every other database that you have into one big database. But you don’t have that database do anything, right? So in other words, just doesn’t delivery males. It doesn’t do any transaction. You can query from it right on. And so then you can query across all your different systems. And so you say, Find me the person who received these three e mails who donated at least $100 over the last year. And who cares about owls and they live in New Jersey. Perfect. Right. And I can, even though that data lives in multiple data. Very right. But if you can make that query right, then you can send that email that says who gives a hoot. And that person in New Jersey is gonna open that email right now. You’ve sold me on the value of a data warehouse. How do you create such a thing? Well, data warehouses are created mostly with open source tools. Actually s o. A lot of times you take a my sequel database and you use a P I’s to pull in data from all your different systems. Sometimes you have to download stuff and upload stuff. There’s data extraction transformation and loading process is E. T ells that go along with that? But the key is that you need and I say key because it really is about what’s called a primary key in a database. Every line every row in that database is represented by a unique identify. Something has to be unique, right? And the trouble is that everything that has the nation’s my information systems degree from Carnegie Mellon it’s paying off. Also antiquated. But you know, as antiquated as it is, that was true in 8429 week. Identify where each row right and when there is such a unique identifier than you can really make the magic happen. The trouble is, when you push three different databases into one, each database had its own unique identifier. So you Tony martignetti are 1 28 in this database and your 3 96 in that database in your 4 25 donordigital base. I’m in the employee database, right. So we need to create 1/4 unique identify in the warehouse that identifies you across those three systems. So there’s some work to do. And that’s why we recommend that non-profits do work with experts around this because data warehousing can be complex to get off the ground. But it has incredible returns in terms of transparency, invisibility of your most valuable data across multiple systems. So this means that you don’t have to take everyone’s favorite system away from them or the system that you just spent a whole bunch of money implementing. You don’t have to get rid of it because it doesn’t integrate with that system. You can keep everyone working with the tools they love while still creating transparent information and reporting for decision makers. OK, I’m gonna guess that sage 70 will, uh, will help you with this. So what’s age 70 will do is help you assess your digital infrastructure. What are all the tools that you’re using? Are they well integrated? Do you have the right staff and skills to leverage them? A lot of times you know, the trouble that you have is not your tool doesn’t work. The trouble that you have is that strategy. You’re not sure what you’re trying to achieve or how to measure it, or it’s that skills. You know what you’re trying to achieve. You just don’t have the people who can do it or they’re structured poorly. You’ve got them scattered across different departments and they’re not effective and you need to centralize them, whatever it might be, The tool itself is usually relatively far down the list, and that’s because we’re in 2019 and we’re lucky. A lot of the tools have gotten a lot better. There’s been a lot of feature convergence, so any tulani CR m you pick is gonna have a lot of the same features. And it’s less about nailing the tool and much more about understanding what you wanted to achieve, making sure your staffed for it, making sure that the data is traveling through each system the right way. So that’s what saved 70 helps with when you actually want to build the thing. They’re specialists to build that thing. This folks here, um, right here it ntcdinosaur recommend everyone talked to a fracture is a great partner in this O Matic. If you’re on razor’s edge is another great partner for this s o there folks out there who specialize in setting up your data warehouse. And it’s a process I really, really recommend that you get expertise for Ah, but ah, start with strategy, though. Figure out what’s trying to do. Right? Right. What? Why? Yeah. What’s our goal? Yeah, what’s our purpose? And which information do we need to raise the visibility of? Because one of those, one of the worst things that you can do is build a warehouse that lets you see everything and then try and look at everything. No. You gotta look at the five things that matter most. What else you gonna talk about tomorrow? Well, I think we’re gonna talk on the agenda. Well, we’re gonna talk a little bit about the, uh the different ways that vendors offer this kind of integration. So there are all in one vendors that offer you a lot of different tools under one roof. And that’s great because it’s easy to train staff in that you see familiar screens over and over again. The data on the back end is integrated, so they’re really effective. However you trade Cem flexibility, you may prefer a different email tool, but the vendor doesn’t have that. They haven’t all in one, so you have to stick with them. You might go with, you know, totally the opposite. On end of the spectrum, you might go with a platform, whether that sales force or dynamics where you ca NBA build whatever you want on this kind of core foundation, and that gives you tremendous flexibility, you can build whatever you want. It also gives you a lot of costs and challenges your skills because you can build anything if you have the money for it in the know how. Um, should you build anything that’s usually ended? Question. And there’s the maintenance of the of the custom. Build right, and you have to budget not just for the maintenance, but here’s the real l tricky one. When you build a custom system, nobody can train you in it, but you, so you have to now build a training capacity to continue supporting your system. This isn’t you know. I’ll say this over and over again. We spend too much time thinking about what it’s gonna cost us to buy our tech tools to build our tech tools to maintain our tech tools. We should be spending twice that much time thinking about how to acquire the right staff, howto retain them and how to train them to use our tools. That’s the hard part. I mean, so many people non-profits have tremendous passion and tremendous skillsets, but not often great technical skillsets. That’s part of what a successful non-profit needs to learn how to do is in bed strong skillsets in technology in their staff and be willing to invest. You have to be invested in it either either through staff or or outside help, right? I mean, you know the old joke, right? What happens if I You spend all my money training my staff and then they leave? Well, what happens if you don’t spend the money training your staff and they stay? I haven’t heard that joke. I don’t know that one. I haven’t heard that. All right, E. I wish we had a laugh track. Have an awful on trains. I’m not sure it would have been too loud. You have a good, hearty laugh yourself. That’s all right. Um, okay. We still have another couple minutes together. Uh, what else are you gonna? I don’t know. You know, based on your session description, I feel like we’ve covered everything, but we can’t have covered it all because we haven’t spent 75 minutes together. Well, we certainly haven’t. I think that, uh, one of the tricks that you have to really, uh, ask yourself is Do I pursue a C r M driven strategy? And this is something that I want every small non-profit listening to think hard about because, you know, I sat with the client ones and they were talking about how they wanted to put everything in a c r M. And what should we do? And I asked, How many donors do you have that you communicate with? And they said 500. And I said, That’s a wonderful number. You don’t need to C R M. You need a telephone. 500 donors call two a day, right? There’s your not at a point where you need the scale. And therefore you shouldn’t hamper yourself with the You know what a system is gonna tie you to, uh, there’s another small non-profit Smallish. I mean, talk about 30 employees. So not tiny. Um, but, uh, 30 employees couple $1,000,000 in revenue And they you’re using sales force, which is, by the way, fair, very challenging for small organizations to use effectively. But they had really the cleanest salesforce implementation I’ve ever seen. Data was hygienic. It was kept well, they had a sale sports admin on staff. They had another part time sales force person who really did a great job of pushing all of their donordigital and all of their program stuff into sales force. They were running every program out of sales force. And I kind of wanted to actually have a panel tomorrow about managing your managing using a c R M. To manage program. Yeah, yeah, it’s It’s certainly part of the promise of sales forces you can cross from donor to constituent tow program participants, and they made it work. However, however, there there’s a but there’s a big but lurking at the end of this one, which is that even though they were doing such a great job of that whenever they wanted to spin up a new program and they’re young enough that they’re still spinning up new programs and thinking of new ways to solve their problems. Whenever they wanted to spend up a new program, they got stuck. They got stuck in a six month sales force development cycle. We have a new program. How are we gonna administer it through sales force? We need to create new forms we need to create new business logic. We need to test it right. We need to go through the process of implementing this program into sales force. That’s really slow. You can’t sew a small organization. One of its advantages is agility and flexibility. When you take on a bigger than your class system, you may sacrifice some of that agility. Eso, you know, in our advice to them, was not to get rid of Salesforce, right? Our advice to them was, and this is crazy. But our advice to them was spend the first year of every programme in Excel and I know right, I’m a tech consultant telling you Excel is good for things, but iterated rapidly be able to be flexible. Don’t tie your data into hard relationships. Admittedly, you lose some of the benefits of structure data. It’s true. But what you gain is the ability to figure out how it’s gonna work for real. And once you figure that out, once you have some process maturity, right and you figured out what the right way to do it is, then go to Salesforce, right? Then put it into your sales force. So that’s something that I really want folks thinking about lean startup principle. That’s right. Start, start lean. You’ll learn your pivot if you need to. And then when you’ve got something that’s a year old and and proven mean, the program may not even take off right. You could spend more time in sales force development than the life of the program. Conceivably right. So when you’ve got something that you know you’re gonna stick with and you know what data capture, um, then spend your time and money on your sales force. Implementation? Yeah. Don’t overbuild your infrastructure. I mean, it’s the same idea is certainly out of the outside. It’s that same idea that you know, uh, if you’re gonna build a public space and you want to know where to put the walkways, what do you do? You wait. You wait and see where the path. Yes, yes. So it’s the same ideas and favorite. Figure out where you’re going to get a lot of bang from your infrastructure investment. Where is it going to really pay off for you on? And it’s a little bit, I think, counter to how we sometimes think about this, where it’s become so de facto that Oh, you’re gonna need to C R M and you need to see our strategy. It’s not clear to me that you need to C. R M strategy. It’s clear to me that if you want to keep track of your most important stakeholders, you’re gonna need a method for doing so. And if you have enough of them, a C R M is probably the method. Okay, okay. Give us a wrap up than solving the C r M plus email plus website equation. Well, the first thing I should say is, don’t forget, carry the one is there. Is there a solution to this equation? Yeah, I think there is a solution to the equation on, and it starts with understanding what your goals are. If you really do communicate to people. If you’re an advocacy, Oregon. You really do a ton of e mailing in a ton of segmentation. A ton of personalization, then? Yeah, you need your C r m and your email and your website to talk to one another and just not. Not just that. You need your social integrated and you need your pita pema integrated and you need your text messaging. So, yeah, that’s your core business is communicating effective segmented messaging in order to inspire actions. So it makes sense that you use that infrastructure. But that’s not gonna be the case for every non-profit. So understand. Visualize what advantage, what benefit you want out of this, and that’ll help shape your investment. What you want into this? That’s one. The second thing is, you solve this problem with the right people more than you solve it with the right tools. Invest in the right people. Whether that’s advice from consultants or whether that staff and their expertise and skills, that’s where you’re going to get the biggest force multiplier the right people. All right, Isaac shall live. He is president at Sage 70 helped us solve the C R M plus email plus website equation. I thank you very much. Thanks, Isaac. Thank you, Tony. Great to be here. Pleasure. Thank you for being with Tony martignetti non-profit Radio coverage of 19 and T. C. All of our interviews at 19 ntcdinosaur brought to you by our partners at ActBlue Free fund-raising Tools to help non-profits make an impact. Thanks so much Being with us next week, it’s the week before the 450th show. If you missed any part of today’s show, I beseech you find it on tony. Martignetti dot com were sponsored by Wagner. C p A. Is guiding you beyond the numbers weather cps dot com But Cougar Mountain Software Denali Fund is there complete accounting solution specifically for non-profits 20 dot m a slash Cougar Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, full service, strategic communications and PR. Turn hyphen to dot C o ah creative producers Claire Meyerhoff Sam Leibowitz is the line producer producer. The show’s show schnoll Media is buy shoes in Chavez. Mark Silverman is our Web guy and this music is by Scott Stein be with me next week for non-profit radio Big non-profit ideas for the other 95% go out and be Greek. You’re listening to the talking alternate network. You’re listening to the Talking Alternative Network. Are you stuck in a rut? Negative thoughts, feelings and conversations got you down. Hi, I’m nor in Sumpter potentially ater. Tune in every Tuesday at 9 to 10 p.m. Eastern time and listen for new ideas on my show Beyond potential. 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