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Oppcoll hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, i am very glad you’re with me. I’d bear the pain of mass toid itis if i had to hear you say tony, i missed today’s show reach the rural and marginalized osvaldo gomez reveals lessons learned as he used online mobile and cloud technology to improve healthcare outcomes in hard to reach communities. He’s, technology director at upleaf we talked at ntcdinosaur non-profit technology conference hosted by the non-profit technology network and ten and discovery visits thes one on one meetings are critical to your prospect research maria simple, our prospect, research contributor and the prospect finder make sure you’re getting the most out of them. She also shares her recommendations for summer conferences throughout the us that will help your prospect research on tony’s take two important legal stuff responsive by opportunity collaboration that working meeting that unconference on poverty reduction that will ruin you for every other conference. Here is osvaldo gomez from auntie si. Welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of the non-profit technology conference it’s day two were hosted by intend the non-profit technology network and we’re in austin at the convention center. My guest is as valdo gomez he’s, technology director for upleaf. Welcome, osvaldo, thank you for having me, it’s. A pleasure. Your topic is using technology and online communication to reach rural or marginalized populations. Excellent that’s, a riel niche topic before we before we get into it, and we have plenty of time to do that let’s, define the rural and marginalized. How do you consider those? So i think that the most important thing is to understand that. There are lots of populations that could be considered rule. Remember, analyzed the most. The most obvious one is hispanics. There’s, obviously a language barrier. There’s ah, you know, on documentary me grant. So are other circumstances that by default, you assume that it’s a somewhat marginalized population, then when you add up hispanics that live in rural areas, then they kind of have the double warming. Okay? We’re very hard people who are very, very hard to reach exactly online. Kind of off the grid. You all right? Do they have? And this is really dangerous. Got nowhere generalizing about lots of different populations. Exactly. But we’re talking about the hispanic population because the work was with the hispanic access foundation. Yes, correct. Okay. All right. So how can we with with recognizing that were generalizing? Yes. They didn’t have mobile devices largely. So that was very interesting for us to learn. When we started working with the project, we realised that the the word three things that could help us first is online communication. Because because you are it’s, a nationwide effort, it’s really hard to get to everyone in person. And there was a grassroots component to it also yes, there were. I don’t want to take you off your way have plenty of time don’t want and so they it was hard to get to everyone in person and they was also expensive to get to everyone through attritional media. If you do tv it’s very expensive. So the obvious choice was to go online. Okay, online number one. Exactly. Then the next one is mobile devices and mobile devices helped us. No, no, not just in the front and just, you know, because people like you are saying there’s a high incidence of smartphone use there is there’s there’s good penetration? Yes, even among the marginalized in rural. There is this ok and then but it didn’t also didn’t on ly helped us there. But it also helped us in the back in for us to actually run the operation. So when we were doing aggress receive into then it made sense to have the staff that was running the event using in their case it was ipods and using a mobile device because it allowed them to do data entry on this part. Okay, so for the back end also there was that there. Was online. And then is there a third of that is yes. Oh no eso so we said online communication and we say mobile devices, the third big part of this was clouds services, okay? And that is kind of the perfect pair for mobile devices, because then you have this holy infrastructure of this whole team on a national level connected and connected are low cost, which was really important because obviously it’s a non-profit it’s, not unlimited funds. And so those three things were the ones who allowed us to really reach this population. And what we proved with this project was that using online communication, mobile devices and cloud services, you can effectively reach rural or marginalized populations at a national level with a very small core team on a low budget. Alright, very exciting. I love i really i love the niche so let’s dive into it. What were the first steps? So what we did was essentially use a whole host ofthe tools to get to do to do this. We didn’t discard mass media. Well, let me ask you first, what about assessment? Determining where the people are, what they’re levels of connectedness are well, that was easy. There’s there’s a lot of information about distribution of hispanics and in our presentation, there’s a very cool map that shows you the share of the population for county that is hispanic. Ok, so there’s this’s and this is all in the us exactly, and and that the census is of the first go to place, and then it’s very easy to flag where to go, but in their case what they did, because obviously this has to be funded, so they had to prove the concept. And so they started in houston with one community, and when it went really well there, then they expanded to five communities and then more and more, and then four years later, they’re reaching eighteen states in the united states. Obviously, the goal is to get toe all state offgrid taken incremental with a community and then a bunch of states which is that’s a big leap on praveen eighteen states exactly and it’s very important to prove to the donors that the money’s will spend that you’re doing a good job, and so they’ve been doing that very effectively, and i think that the those eighteen states have bean chosen based on you know where you’re going to have the biggest impact. Of course states like texas, california winning first, how were they able to measure? And we can go? We can come back to this later on just you’re just sort of overview. How were they able to measure outcomes or definitely had an impact? The biggest tool that they used was a sales force system on this system was what the field team used. We’re on their ipods on the field, and it was what the people in washington had also available in this system runs the entire operation. And so everything that happened if you attended an event that data was entered, if there was ah, say that ran on your show that was logged, and ultimately once you put once you do all that data entry and in a decentralized way so that every user does their part, then because you have an integrated system, it all comes together, and then you can report on it more effective. Okay, so so the outcomes were points of contact. That was one part of it. The other thing was, first of all, we would do we still do post event surveys, so we collect data from people, and we collect data from the speaker about how the event went, how what you learned, and we kind of tried to gauge whether they actually learn the talking points of the okay. All right, so it was more than just a contact. But what was learned exit from the contact of the event, exactly. The other thing that we did make love sense they’ll think what it was a huge population study to evaluate whether not only they learned because there’s through three stages for for behavior to change, you have to have knowledge about, you have to know that there’s a problem, you have to be motivated to change, and then you have to have access to the resources you need to change. And we’ve been addressing all three but to be able to prove that the last one, the access and the action took place and we need it to we needed to do a study. So we did, and we proved that when you were able to educate people through a grassroots event with a community leader that they trust and kind of build that knowledge and create the position of risk. For example, we did a one big part of what we did was cancer, breast cancer and colon cancer prevention. Yeah, i was going to ask you about what some of the messages were, but go ahead, we’ll get to that. Yeah. And so for that you have to actually make sure people got tested screened exactly. Eso this study allowed us to prove what the success rate wass and, you know, out of all the people that attended this event that received the information, the motivation and was made available resource is for them to go get tested. How many actually did get this all right? And the results were very good on dso we’ve bean just building on that and improving over the years to make sure that that we reach us many hispanics as we can. Okay, really cool. And of course, you mentioned sales force. You’re doing this on a low budget sales force, of course, donated except for non-profits i think it’s up to ten licenses, i believe. Yes, that right salesforce’s free for non-profits. Well, the first and licenses are donated, and then you get a huge discount for the one after that, okay, it’s huge on for these organization in particular. So far, they’ve received three hundred three, six thousand dollars worth of donations part of that or most of it from sales force. But a lot of that also from google through the google non-profit program they run google ats donated by ghoul okay, one hundred percent you’re tuned to non-profit radio tony martignetti also hosts a podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy fund-raising fundamentals is a quick ten minute burst of fund-raising insights published once a month. Tony’s guests are expert in crowdfunding, mobile giving event fund-raising direct mail and donor cultivation. Really all the fund-raising issues that make you wonder, am i doing this right? Is there a better way there is? Find the fund-raising fundamentals archive it. Tony martignetti dot com that’s marketmesuite n e t t i remember there’s a g before the end, thousands of listeners have subscribed on itunes. You can also learn maura the chronicle website philanthropy dot com fund-raising fundamentals the better way so let’s, talk about some of the tools that were used, so we’re we’ve we’ve touched on sales force. Yes, dribble used ripple. Yes. That’s that’s a quaint listeners, maybe more, probably more familiar with word preston droop a lso. Explain what dribble is drew police, a condom management system platform and it’s being used very widely. The white house website is built on drew people really and so it’s, very popular and very robust and it’s amazing the nuggets you can learn on non-profit radio. The white house platform is not is not word press or even customized. It’s ah, droop a little bass. Yeah, all right. And so there was non-profit radio. I’ve been telling you for years. Listen to me. Listen to osvaldo. And so the main thing is, whenever we chose the technology was is it open source? Or is it donated or discounted? Because no, the savings are remarkable and so do people was what we used for the front end sales force for the back end. But then they also because this is a distributed team throughout the country. They needed to be able to claret. And so again with a google for non-profit. Program, they were able to get google maps for free and so their e mail their calendar, they can do hangouts and collaborate and and also have a share, dr using google drive and so using all of these tools, they’re able to stay in touch, to stay connected on to coordinate. And this goes not just to do the core team in washington, but they also gave ipods to the field team to the community and faith based leaders in the community so that they could stay connected with this network. So they expanded their teams through volunteers essentially very, very effectively, through the use off the mobile of isis on the clock services and, of course, online communication to distribute the information. All right was was was more of the communication mobile based than than online because because there’s a greater penetration of mobile devices than there is desktop and laptop computers. So what we try to do is i mean, i guess i mean mobile native or was it was a more online and then mobile mobile optimized exactly that’s the that’s the the key because of cost it’s very for non-profits it tends to be prohibited. To have a nap for every platform. Especially when you have to. Do you know it’s andre for so many different devices. And so web apps or web solution’s make more sense. Okay, okay. Let’s, turn to the grassroots component of this. Because that was important. A huge yeah. Very important was not just online with, i guess local community organizations that are trusted in the low in the local place. Exactly. And trust that he’s a key word. Because, you know, an undocumented immigrant is probably not going to trust on outsider to come and tell them. Let’s. Let’s, gather you all in this room right now and talk to you. And so being able to reach them through the church that they attend, or through the community center in their community that they already trust. And the people eating there that they already trust andi, instead of having an outside and talk to them, have the leaders that they already know talk to them about the specific topic was very, very, very important. So the organization try to engaged these leaders on dh. Right now, the network is two thousand people strong throughout the united states about more. Than two thousand leaders throughout the united states are connected to this organization engaged by this organization and participate and lead these events that are happening as we speak that’s, the hispanic access foundation. Yes, we’re all the messages about rest in colon cancer. Well, that was part of it. The address they have for areas there’s, education, there’s, health, of course, and the kid. The cancer project, is an example of that. There’s also finance on dh. There is the environment, and the reason why these four are important is because in the case of finance, what, what they realized this. You have to help people improve their lives throughout, if, if there’s, no money, there’s, no health, and so being able to. And the main thing for for immigrants is. Being in the numbers being in the statistics and so submitting your taxes, even if you’re undocumented is huge because if at any point in time, in future there’s immigration reform, you have to have that history that you’ve bean reciting innis they file your taxes compliant for years exactly all right, all right, and that’s a huge thing because there is no tradition in america of doing that. So educating people that in the united states you do have to file tarsus taxes regularly is a big deal. What were the outcomes you were measuring in thie environment, part messages. So the thing about the environment is that when you pull hispanics, they’re all very aware of it. They were aware that you have to preserve the environment, that climate change is important, but many times, even though they want to a lot of hispanics living or been city in urban areas, and they don’t really get out much besides a lot of doing a lot of work and so being able to create a world, especially among the youth, that all these national parks are available to you that you have to take care of them if you go to a national park you take care of. It was very important because he created this more well rounded. How did you measure citizen? How did you measure the impact of those national parks announcements? So the idea is beyond announcements we actually organized tours and took people there. And so the post, sir, the post even survey was very important to gauge how how many people numbers attended the tours and what they’re what they learn and how they felt. Definitely excellent. Excellent. And what about on the education side? Were the messages there? There was a lot about making sure that the people can, first of all, with those very interesting price about distributing books two, two hispanics and creating their habit of off reading of learning. So so that was a big part of it. But i think that the most important take away is that it is possible that a non-profit with a low budget, a small team can really use thes three tools online communication, mobile devices and cloud services to reach very hard to reach populations effectively. Yeah, excellent. All right, now we still have a good amount of time left. So tell us were there any other tools besides the a dribble sales force and and the google maps that were that were important? Yes, so they’ve used a whole whole host of things. So one one, because this is all valuable, i mean, even if you’re not trying to reach rural and marginalized pompel definitely in terms of low cost, valuable, you know, really helpful tools for for non-profits we’ll definitely yes, whatever whatever work you’re engaged so well, what else was valuable? So they important thing i think we think sales force the top exchange what the application store that they have is very important because there’s a lot of free it’s, a sales force petition store, the ap exchange, okay, okay, and they having these aps available for free was huge because it allowed us to expand the infrastructure and do more things than what the course ellsworth system can do at a very low cost. The most important one for them was project management, and you can imagine running in national operation with a bunch of volunteers spread throughout the country, how hard it could be if you don’t have the system in place to manage every little to do and organize things and so there’s a free up in the ap exchange called milestones, pm milestones milestones piela all right, there’s, a free program management tool that you can just installing your in yourself was application and having it in one system was huge. There are others that are there’s. A lot of you know is outstanding to me because first of all, sales force is free. First ten first, ten licenses so let’s do. Our audience is small and midsize non-profits excesses him. They probably don’t need more than ten licenses, but anyway, but then there’s a deep discount beyond that. But then the then the everything in the ap exchanges free. Well, not everything but a lot of it, but just wanted this project management, which is again called milestones being ostomel p m free, so free sales force and then free add on and obviously valuable because it’s, managing a project of two thousand volunteers across eighteen states, exactly really outstanding. What what other tools can you share? So the other thing that we did was looking for whatever was donated, open source or discounted and so in terms of email marketing, very good. Response has a at that point, when we started, i think they’ve changed a little bit recently, but they had this donation program that you would get the first ten thousand emails for free and so for them it made sense to start without because it gave them a in an instant saving, even if they had to pay for the extra write emails he gives them gave them just like socials gives you this instant push, and so but the beauty of it is that it integrate two cells were so they could go toe one place and do everything they needed to do so. Vertical response there’s an app in the exchange from vertical response that allows you to integrate it into cells. Whores it’s remarkable that’s outstanding these air this a great great resource is really alright. I’m adding vertical responsible list now that’s that’s um that’s! Excellent! What else could please more? What else should we use? Share don’t don’t hold back with tools are there so i think that they being able to when you, when you combine all the key tool that i think it’s very important to understand that they would didn’t exist. A few years ago is this mobile devices in the case, in their case, the ipod and they they had ei paso were connected to a cell network so they could be moving around and doing that entry. But even if, even though it’s not donated or free having a tool for a relatively low budget that you can distribute two people, you know, remote for them to work remotely is huge and being able to use all of the other tools sales for his google labs and all this stuff through this device really empowers people on what we saw was, you know, a pastor that’s, sixty years old and had never had access to a device like this, getting training and having so much enthusiasm for learning to use this tool and then realizing that it really helped them, even if it was a little scary at the beginning, it really helped him do what he wanted to do, which is help people. All these people, they’re not any for the money, obviously. So they really want to help people. And when you give him a tool that allows them to help more people, they just love it. Love that of the story of the pastor let’s spend a little time our last couple minutes on lessons learned on the the and the grassroots level, so we talked a lot about the digital onda technology side let’s talk about the the personal side, the people side of the grassroots work, some lessons learned there, yes, so the key thing for us was don’t go it alone, partner, and the profits are very good at doing that partnering, but in this particular case, it’s key because you can’t go into a community that is already a little off the grid and pretend to be an outsider and be heard and access people, and so being able to to go to get to these community through people they trust was very, very, very important. Now, these people also need to be able to trust you as an organization. And so a lot of the work that the spending explanation did was reaching out to these pastors, getting them into a room on dh, showing them everything that was in the works. Everything that we’re doing, this is our this is even how we’re handling data. This is how we’re handling privacy if we collect data from an undocumented immigrant, we’re not sharing that with anyone and creating that trust between the organization and the leader was important because if the leader trusts you, then the committee trusts you and i think that’s the biggest takeaway from this there there vouching for the larger organization exactly local leaders are vouching for exactly they’re putting their name on the line. And so they want to know that you are really for real trust critical both between the organization and the leader and the leader and and the people. And then you’ll get the third you get the third leg of the triangle between the people and the organization, exactly, little by little. And then okay, well, then i would say, and then the messages will be trusted except by little. Sounds like there’s something there? Yeah, so? So even so, we’ve been at it for a few years on dh. What we’ve seen is that you go in the first time pastor or the priest, in some cases, partners with youand brings people in and educates people the first time the attendance might not be. You might not feel the room the next time you do, on the following time, then they they asked for, and i think that there’s a real need for information people just don’t really they don’t feel comfortable asking for it. Yeah, all right, but but they they open up? Yes. Okay, we have another like minute and a half or so. What else? On the personal? The grassroots organizing side. Other other lessons there? Well, the other thing is don’t be afraid to use technology. This story about the pastor that was kind of scared of the beginning. It was very easy for everyone at that point to say, well, let’s, just not do that let’s go to back to paper latto pencil on paper, but that has a huge cost over the long term, especially for you to actually measure impact and don’t and so don’t don’t not being afraid off putting people out of their comfort zone and telling them let’s, do this let’s do it together and it’s okay is important. And i think that that was a big lesson for for me, because a technology guy, i thought, everybody, we’re going to say, just say, yeah, sure, that’s it, andi, wasn’t it? Took some convincing but beeper system because ultimately, once they get used to it, then it becomes something that they can’t work without. Oswaldo gomez, technology director for upleaf very inspiring story that’s outstanding. Thank you very much for sharing. Well, thank you for having me at my pleasure. This is tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of the non-profit technology conference and t c twenty fifteen. Thank you so much for being with us love the story that he shared lots of valuable information, even if you’re not trying to reach the rural and marginalized, but just about free and very low cost resource is excellent. One let’s do live listener love and let’s start abroad. Seoul, south korea always with us gratefully. I’m very, very grateful. Anya haserot soul guangzhou, china ni hao, we’ve got jakarta, indonesia very glad you’re with us live listener love to jakarta and tokyo, japan also very frequent listeners. Konnichi wa in bangladesh, we’ve got listener in dhaka i’ve been there. I spent a day in old dhaka but spent several days in ah in the capital generally welcome dhaka and also in brazil. Camp in ious live listener love how about domestic ridgefield? New jersey. My dad used to teach in richfield ta ta ta ta ta ta. Instrumental music in the elementary schools in richfield, new york, new york. Thank you very much for being with us. Cranford, new jersey, hubert, north carolina and oxford, maine. And i believe oxford main maybe. Read stockman. He was tweeting that he is listening in maine that maybe read live listener love main north carolina, new jersey, new york. Thank you very much for being with us. Tony stayed too. And the open movement coming up. Uh, pardon me. The discovery visits air coming up. See, i need an intern so i could blame someone when i make a mistake like this. Tony’s take two and discovery visits coming up. Where’s the intern to blame. But first i got to talk about opportunity. Collaboration. It’s ninety three percent sold now. It’s, thea unconference in x top of mexico for non-profits around the world grantmaker zoho social impact investors, venture capitalists, academics and companies. If you’re working to reduce suffering anywhere in the world, you need to be at o c. There are no plenary speakers. There’s no power points. Every session is in a circle. Obviously collaborative three hundred fifty people and there’s lots of time. Deliberately set aside for meeting each other. I was there last year. I’ll be there in october. I did get my reservation in opportunity. Collaboration dot net. The video this week is a new entry in the non-profit radio knowledge base. Important legal stuff. Jean takagi. You know who he is? Our legal contributor and the longest running contributor to non-profit radio uh, four years. He’s been with me four years. He’s, the principal at the non-profit and exempt organizations law group in san francisco. That’s his, you know, that’s, part time gig. But most of the time he spends with non-profit radio he’s been with the show. As i said four years and i chose the best stuff from his four years. And i added it to our knowledge base. And the video is at tony martignetti dot com that’s tony’s take two for friday tenth of july twenty seventh show of the year. You also know maria simple she’s, the prospect finder, a trainer and speaker on prospect research. Her website is the prospect finder dot com. Her book is panning for gold. Find your best donor. Prospects now, she’s. A diet of dirt, cheap and free. You can follow her on twitter at maria simple. Welcome back, maria. Maria so i give this screen here. How are you? Where you been? What’s going on there? What do you think? That’s? Too much that’s. Too much. I had myself on mute while you were doing on minute announcements there. Sorry about that. Um, i’m glad you’re with me. Welcome back. Absolutely. Thank you. Pleasure. We’re talking about discovery visits today. These, uh, he’s let’s, define the discovery visit. And then once you explain why you think they’re so critical, the prospect research well, you know, as prospect, researchers, unfortunately, we don’t have access to every little piece of information that would be useful for you. As you’re thinking about cultivating or soliciting someone so actually sitting down face to face with a donor is going to yield so much insight about what motivates them, why they love your organization and potentially yield larger gifts for you down the road. I blogged this a while ago, and it may be one of the first times that you and i met online because you commented on it. But i don’t think you were on the show at this point. But i blogged the value of face-to-face meetings and i was not. Diminishing prospect research online and all through all the resource is that you and i have talked about from chambers of commerce and libraries toe online resource is wasn’t diminishing those, but yeah, the value that you get from having lunch with someone i happen to like doing it over meals, but whether it’s over meals or a meeting in their office or a site visit to your place, those could be great buy-in you just pick up so much just by talking to somebody for for an hour? Yeah, yeah, and and definitely even in the body language alone. So you start steering that conversation in a certain direction, and you see people getting uncomfortable or fidgety or ah, in the opposite way, if maybe they start leaning in and leaning forward and looking like they’re really engaged with with what you’re talking about, perhaps a new program that you’re looking toe launch and get funded, all of that can yield so much great information for you. Sometimes it could be a little awkward. You hear things that you, you’re not sure how to document, and we’ll talk about the importance of doing that, like, you know they don’t really like the ceo or your boss? You know, are there glad that you’re at the lunch with them and not this other gift officer? Yeah, and you do have to be careful about that. How you document that? Because, you know, a donor does have the ability to walk into your organisation at any time and say, let me see what donorsearch crowds you have on me. So you think you would want to document it in as a subject in an objective manner i should say objectively think of yourself as a a nen vested gate of reporter, right? When you’re trying to write down what the comments were so you might, you know, just right, you know, they did not seem particularly interested in the new x y z program and period end of story. Now we’re talking about the documentation it’s critical to save this in your hopefully have a cr m database, right? A donor database, cr m someplace this has tio this information you know, it’s what we call, i guess institutional memory, right? And you’re not going to put me in jargon jail for that? Are, you know, that’s a pretty straightforward one. Okay, i don’t join you for a while if you as a development officer or is an executive director, sit down and have a conversation with someone, and then you decide to leave the organization a year later. Ah, and then the new person takes over and goes in and has a visit with this long time donor sort of starts asking that same set of questions that donor’s going to kind of look at him like, don’t you already know this? Because i’ve already talked to your predecessor about what my interests were, etcetera. So you really do need to make sure that you are taking, you know, the time and it’s time well worth, you know, spent just documenting what happened during the conversation. What were the critical point? What were the things that need to be followed up on? You know, maybe it’s a timing issue, maybe they say, well, you know what? This is a really bad time for my family right now, but in two years we feel that our finances will be in a different situation, you’ve got to get that documented and that’s an ideal example of one of the many, many things that you’ll find out from talking to somebody that you’ll never find online or any other resource is it’s talking, you gotta you gotta drop people out and and they love your work, otherwise they wouldn’t be meeting with you, so they’re happy to talk about what it is they love how, how their situation can impact your organization. I mean, positively or negatively, you know, like you’re saying, this is not a good time for us, you know, we just had a downturn in my business or from death in the family or, you know, whatever i mean, stuff you’re not going to find out anywhere else than talking to people, you’re absolutely right. And, you know, one of the interesting things, too, is you sometimes when i’m having conversations with with a non-profit maybe it a networking event or at a conference or something, and i’ll last generally how is your fund-raising going and then steer the conversation towards you know, well, you know, when was the last time you had a chance to meet with who you would consider to be your top ten donors? And they kind of look at you like, uh, am i supposed? To be regularly meeting with donors. Oh, boy. Yeah. That’s ah, that’s yeah, that’s where the person in charge of development needs to be stewarding and managing up the, you know, the sea level people and that maybe that’s only one person may be the ceo is executive director is all there is but that, you know, yeah, yeah, you’ve got to be managing up and making sure that these relationships are nurtured with your your most important donors, your most important volunteers as well. Yeah, and if you don’t have the time to do it as a staff member, get your board involved. This is a perfect role for a board to get involved in. Even your board members who say, i hate to ask for money. I’ll do anything for this organization. Just don’t make me ask for money and it’s so simple for them to just go in and have it it’s really a conversation, you know, you can provide them with, you know, prompt them with a list of questions that they might consider asking this individual. But it really is a conversation all about discovering what is this donor-centric about why are they giving any? Money to you at all when you know when did they start and, you know, where do they see themselves going with your organization? As a consultant? I do hardly. And, you know, i don’t i don’t meet with donors and potential donors alone ever and very few of the visits that i am on our discovery visits, you know, where we don’t know the person all that well, but when i was a director of planned giving at a couple of colleges, i should do these all the time, and i remember my head’s spinning with oh, i don’t remember that, but i’m trying to stay in the conversation, too, but you can’t take notes while you’re having lunch, but i remember my head swimming over my gosh, i can’t remember that and that. Oh, and this news about his sister and that relationship, you know? Oh, you know, but there’s so much too, and you get back to the office and you just have to spill it all out, and i agree with you, i usedto have ah, client who said never write anything about someone with potential donor or donor at anybody boardmember that you wouldn’t want them to read basically the same standard you had when you said someone could come in the office any time and ask what you have on them. That’s fine, you know, today with with technology having advanced right, i’m hoping that people who were in those positions that you were holding at that time in the plan giving departments and so forth are using their smartphones and the recording feature not to record the conversation, but afterward, one the meeting has ended, and you’re getting back into your car or getting to a quiet place, you know, in, you know, a different space or something like that. Just data dump it right in by voice because you can speak a lot faster. Most people can speak much faster than they can write or type, so why not just get it in that way? And then if if you needed to, you know, use a transcription service of some sort to then get it into a print format and then edited from there, i think you know, that could be a particularly great way to use technology. Yeah, great. Cool tip. I like that. You’re right. You can dump into a voice memo excellent. I also like your idea of using board members for this purpose idea we’ve we’ve talked about it, but good many times, but good to mention that also, this is ideal for board members for organizations that have a prospect research person, do you think that these contact i’m going to call them contact report? Because as we used to call him at the colleges, right? Should they flow through the prospect researcher? Or should they go right into the c r, m database and then it’s a prospect researchers job follow-up and read them? How does? Because the prospect researcher is the the focal point of a lot of this, the prospect activity? How should this info get to the to that person? Well, you know, it really again depends on the size of the department and the type of cr m that you’re using and who has access to it because some will allow you no board members to have access and others won’t. So then clearly, if it’s your boardmember that needs to be providing the information in many cases, they’re not going to have access two, uh, to that database, so don’t need to get it to that prospect, researcher some other way. If it is ah development officer who does have access to the database. And i do recommend that they inserted directly themselves. If it’s a small organization, if it’s a larger organization with multi level, then, you know, you would want to make sure that there are certain procedures in place for me. No, but certainly the prospect researcher in some way, shape or form should be alerted that there’s been an update to that record in case there’s, you know any additional updated information that they need to provide? Yeah, right. It could be a simple is ah, niu new email address or you are. Whatever a new relationship. Um, i know in the in the colleges where i worked which bigger organizations that the prospect researcher was the like. I said the focal point, and they would pull out something from a prospect research report that would say, oh, you know, i should. This is consistent with this other contact report that i read for this other person done by a different gift officer. And these two need to be talking to each other for whatever reason that was always that was always the done through. The prospect researcher i don’t know is that it makes sense to you. Yeah, yeah. Does absolutely. And i can tell you that, you know, having attended various conferences in the past that are, you know, attended by prospect researchers. They would love to be on every one of these donordigital covering visits, making sure that the right questions get asked and so forth. Okay, so this should be from training there, maybe maybe training the gift officers by the prospect researcher. When again, when it’s an organization that has prospect research. I understand a lot of listeners. Organizations. Problem. May not. But if you do, should there be some training that the prospect researcher was doing for the gift officers? Yeah, absolutely. There should be some sort of training. And in terms of not only what they confined online, if they needed to find some information quickly. What are some of the go to resource is when they’re out on the road, etcetera. But also you know what? Air the typical questions you should be sitting down and asking of every single donor and prospect and, you know ah, good development. Officer, this should really be intuitive and second nature for them. But if there’s somebody fairly new in the role, or if it’s an executive director who is, you know, that that’s, it that’s the only person there is no development officer. Oh, and perhaps they’ve been so very used to running an organization, and on the day to day management of the organization that they really haven’t gone down the road of, of getting trained on, you know, how to ask the right questions to elicit the responses we need to move this prospect forward. We’re gonna go out for a break. Marie and i will keep talking about this a little bit. And then she also has, um, unconference dates coming up this summer. That would be valuable for your prospects, research or stay with us. Like what you’re hearing a non-profit radio tony’s got more on youtube, you’ll find clips from stand up comedy tv spots and exclusive interviews catch guests like seth gordon. Craig newmark, the founder of craigslist marquis of eco enterprises, charles best from donors choose dot org’s aria finger, do something that worked, and levine from new york universities heimans center on philantech tony tweets to, he finds the best content from the most knowledgeable, interesting people in and around non-profits to share on his stream. If you have valuable info, he wants to re tweet you during the show. You can join the conversation on twitter using hashtag non-profit radio twitter is an easy way to reach tony he’s at tony martignetti narasimhan t i g e n e t t i remember there’s a g before the end he hosts a podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy fund-raising fundamentals is a short monthly show devoted to getting over your fund-raising hartals just like non-profit radio, toni talks to leading thinkers, experts and cool people with great ideas. As one fan said, tony picks their brains and i don’t have to leave my office fund-raising fundamentals was recently dubbed the most helpful non-profit podcast you have ever heard. You can also join the conversation on facebook, where you can ask questions before or after the show. The guests were there, too. Get insider show alerts by email, tony tells you who’s on each week and always includes link so that you can contact guests directly. To sign up, visit the facebook page for tony martignetti dot com. I’m dana ostomel, ceo of deposit, a gift. And you’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Got more live listeners in san francisco, california live love going out to there now podcast listeners and affiliate listeners. Did you think i forgot? How how could you live? Listener love always is accompanied by podcast pleasantries and affiliate affections very grateful to all the podcast listeners wherever, whatever device, whatever you’re doing love having you with us and all those affiliate listeners in the many stations across the country affections out to r am and fm affiliate listeners perish the thought that i would forget podcast pleasantries and affiliate affections. Maria, any last thoughts you want, leave us with on discovery visits and before we move teo unconference ideas. Well, you know, really, just to figure out what what is a donor’s? Why, right? That that’s, what you’re looking to get to understanding there? Why, um, to the heart of why they’re investing in your organization and, you know, try and use that language when you’re speaking with them, you know, why are you investing in us? What? What motivates you to continue supporting us? What do you like best about our non-profit? And you know what? Can we actually improve? So try and really elicit some good conversation from them and, you know, you’ve probably heard that old adage tony asked them for money and they’ll they’ll offer you advice and asked him for advice, and they’ll offer you some money. So, you know, it’s a great way to get people engaged in your organization, so don’t be afraid to start those conversations, even if somebody proposes something or says something a little bit on the negative side, take it as constructive criticism and look for areas of improvement. Yeah, you’ve got to hear the negative and a lot of what you’re what you’re suggesting comes out organically, you know? I mean, the person knows that you’re there to talk about the organization, you know, they talk about politics or hopefully you keep politics off the table. I always think that’s a bad idea for these kinds of visits, but yeah, they’re talking about the organization that’s, what the two of you have in common, so, you know, a lot of that stuff just gets elicited. I love this program, or i didn’t understand this or i didn’t know you’re doing this thing, but i just read about it in the newsletter and you know that stuff. Uh, i mean, you’re right ask if it’s not coming out, but a lot of times, it just happens organically because right that’s what you have in common. That’s what? You share, right? Right. All right. So, uh, you gots unconference ideas for us? Prospect researchers like to meet during the summer. Yeah, absolutely. So the biggie for prospect researchers is the international conference that happens every summer for apra, which is the association of professional researchers for advancement. And this year, the conference takes place in new orleans. Metoo and it’s going to be july twenty second to the twenty fifth, and they actually also have a new researchers symposium as part of that uh, they have a full day symposium just for new researchers. So this is a great way to get i think, you know, a full day in ah dedicated to a newbie. And, you know, if you’re just getting your feet wet in this whole thing about prospect research, that might be something well worth while attending. Are you going to the international conference? I will not be going this year. I’m actually attending other conferences, but you know, this one is definitely if you’re thinking about prospect researchers this truly is the one to consider. You know there are fall conferences that you know, we just missed a few conferences that are more regional. So, like in new england, there’s, an organization called nedra, the new england development research association, they they had a conference in april was not researchers look okay, let’s not look backwards, let’s go forwards, but but the good thing about it is that some of those organizations will still put the presentation’s in power point on the website so still perhaps worth just checking into even if you book market for next year. If you’re in those regions, certainly something to think about seeing what what have they shared from the past conference cause you might be able to just do a little, you know, your own online learning are these all apra chapters that we’re talking about? Yeah, yeah, they really are there. They’re more regionalized chapters of research association years ago, i spoke a couple of apra chapters, i think in new york and new jersey years ago, back when i know i’m not even sure i was consulting at the time, maybe more than twelve years. Ago, but glad they’re still around. Okay, what else? What else you got besides the international? Also coming up in arizona? There’s going to be a false symposium on the topic of campaigns and that’s going to be held november fifth through the sixth in tempe, arizona, so that might be one to consider and also in california, they have several events going on. The california advancement researchers association has several things on their website, so i’d be glad to share some of these links on your facebook page, if you like and then people can check them out and if they’re in those regions and see if they want to attend. I love it. Why did you do that? As a comment to the takeaways that’ll be posted around four o’clock eastern today? Sure. Okay, that’s outstanding. We still have another minute or so left. What’s ah what’s going on in? Oh, i’m sorry. Are there other conferences or that you got it? That’s covers it. You know, i think because several have already passed. Those were the ones that i really found that i thought, you know, were sprinkled throughout in different places that you might consider going. Tio okay, sounds good. Tell me, uh, yeah, now we just have about a minute or so, right, sam? So what what’s going on in your world, what you’re seeing among your clients in our last minute, you know, well, i’m definitely seeing a tick up in activity, capital campaigns and so forth. So, you know, it’s great to see that that good news came out with e-giving yusa numbers, and i think that that generally just kind of buoys people a little bit and their spirits. So i am seeing more activity and more research request because of these larger campaigns and the need to research some of these high net worth individuals before visiting them. So in general, i think it’s it’s all good news, okay, i’m glad you’re optimistic looks. You’re so upbeat. Andi, you’re going to be back with me in two shows on july twenty fourth for the two hundred fiftieth show. Yes, you’re going to here in the studio. Cool. I will. All right, looking forward to it would be nice to have you institute a sze yu were not made a cz we would say in latin i’m fluent in latin is a worthless skill, but thank you very much. Good to see you. Good to talk to you. Thank you. You’ll find her at the prospect finder dot com and on twitter at maria simple. Next week, two interviews from the non-profit technology conference walked to work, walking as part of your work day as an integral part of your work day, not a break from it with beth cantor and re to sharma. Also keep current after launch. Farrah trompeter and kira marchenese help you keep your sight current after a redesign in two weeks as i was just talking about july twenty fourth, two hundred fifty of show five years of non-profit radio, we’ve got giveaways, music with scott stein comedy a new sponsor i’m going to introduce and much more going on two weeks, july twenty fourth, two hundred fiftieth show be with us if you missed any part of today’s show, find it on tony martignetti dot com opportunity collaboration with world convenes for poverty alleviation, an outstanding unconference that will ruin you for every other conference opportunity collaboration dot net, our creative producer is claire miree off sound. Liebowitz is the line producer shows social media is by susan chavez. Susan chavez dot com on our music is by scott stein yeah, thank you, scotty, for that information with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Go out and be great. Buy-in what’s not to love about non-profit radio tony gets the best guests check this out from seth godin this’s the first revolution since tv nineteen fifty and henry ford nineteen twenty it’s the revolution of our lifetime here’s a smart, simple idea from craigslist founder craig newmark insights orn presentation or anything? People don’t really need the fancy stuff they need something which is simple and fast. When’s the best time to post on facebook facebook’s andrew noise nose at traffic is at an all time hyre on nine am or eight pm so that’s when you should be posting your most meaningful post here’s aria finger ceo of do something dot or ge young people are not going to be involved in social change if it’s boring and they don’t see the impact of what they’re doing so you gotta make it fun and applicable to these young people. Otherwise a fifteen and sixteen year old they have better things to dio they have xbox, they have tv, they have their cell phones me dar is the founder of idealised took two or three years for foundation staff to sort of dane toe, add an email address card it was like it was phone. This email thing is right and that’s, why should i give it away? Charles best founded donors choose dot or ge somehow they’ve gotten in touch kind of off line as it were on dh and no two exchanges of brownies and visits and physical gifts. Mark echo is the founder and ceo of eco enterprises. You may be wearing his hoodies and shirts. Tony talked to him. Yeah, you know, i just i’m a big believer that’s not what you make in life. It sze, you know, tell you make people feel this is public radio host majora carter. Innovation is in the power of understanding that you don’t just do it. You put money on a situation expected to hell. 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