Big Nonprofit Ideas for the Other 95%
Sponsored by GE Grace corporate real estate services.
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Conversations with Marc Ecko, Craig Newmark & Naomi LevineFirst, thoughts on branding–and other business lessons applicable to charities–from Marc Ecko, founder of the very consistent brand Ecko Enterprises.
Then, Craig Newmark, the founder of Craigslist and CraigConnects has ideas about simple communications and knowing when to stop talking. I interviewed Marc and Craig at the NextGen:Charity 2011 conference.
I close with Naomi Levine, executive director of the Heyman Center for Philanthropy and Fundraising at New York University. Last May, at a reception for my show, we talked about professionalizing fundraising and enhancing its stature; the role of trustees; government oversight; motivation for small charities; and the future of the charity community.
Top Trends. Sound Advice. Lively Conversation.
You’re on the air and on target as I delve into the big issues facing your nonprofit—and your career.
If you have big dreams but a small budget, tune in to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.
I interview the best in the business on every topic from board relations, fundraising, social media and compliance, to technology, accounting, volunteer management, finance, marketing and beyond. Always with you in mind.
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Here is the link to the podcast: 082: Marc Ecko, Craig Newmark & Naomi Levine – Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.
Also, all of these video interviews are available on my YouTube channel.
- Nonprofit Radio Interview with Marc Ecko, Founder and CCO of Marc Ecko Enterprises
- Nonprofit Radio Interview with Craig Newmark, founder of CraigConnects and Craigslist
- Nonprofit Radio Interview with Naomi Levine, Executive Director, George H. Heyman, Jr. Center for Philanthropy and Fundraising
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Hello and welcome to the show it’s tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host it’s friday, march ninth, twenty twelve i certainly hope very much that you were with me last week because what you would have heard was b f d board financial dilemma. What do you do for board members who can’t read your balance sheet? The authors of the board members easier than you think guide to non-profit finances answer that andy robinson and nancy wasserman explained why understanding finances is critical so boardmember is, preserve your good work and protect themselves. We helped your board achieve financial literacy this week. I’ve got three conversations all pre recorded with marc ecko, craig newmark and naomi levine first thoughts on branding and other business lessons applicable to charities from marc ecko, founder of the very consistent brand echo enterprises, then craig mark the found of craigslist and craigconnects has ideas about simple communications and knowing when to stop talking. I interviewed mark and craig at the next-gen charity conference last year, and we closed with naomi levine, executive director of the heimans center for philanthropy and fund-raising at new york university last may, at a reception for my show, she and i talked about professionalizing fund-raising and enhancing its stature. The role of trustees, government oversight, motivation for small charities and the future of the charity community. In between. Those segments, at roughly thirty two minutes into the our tony’s, take two. Something different this week of a vintage standup comedy clip from july two thousand eleven. Of me, this show is supported by g grace corporate real estate services. And i’m very grateful for their support. Right now, we take the break. And when we return conversation with marc ecko, stay with me. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way. Look forward to serving you. Is your marriage in trouble? Are you considering divorce? Hello, i’m lawrence bloom, a family law attorney in new york and new jersey. No one is happier than the day their divorce is final. My firm can help you. We take the nasty out of the divorce process and make people happy. Police call a set to one, two, nine six four three five zero two for a free consultation. That’s lawrence h bloom, too. One, two, nine, six, four, three, five zero two. We make people happy. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com welcome back. Right now, i have a conversation prerecorded with marc ecko. Hope you enjoy this. Welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of the next-gen charity conference were at the tribeca performing arts center in downtown new york city. With me now is marc ecko, founder of eco enterprises. Specifically, we’re gonna talk about some of his board leadership on ah, with ticket, a children’s home, sweat, equity, education and every loop he’s sort of a founder of each of those and is on the board. We’ll talk a little about that. And also his presentation today on how we make people feel at next-gen marc ecko, welcome. Thank you. Why don’t you tell us what the work it ah, tick of a children’s home is it’s ukraine? Yeah. Tick. The children’s home is in odessa, ukraine. It was kind of my first entree experience in tow. Philanthropy. I kind of say it’s like we did probably the first hostile takeover of an orphanage in ninety seven. There were no casualties. Not that i know of. And certainly not the orphans of the kids. But maybe some of the prior funders o k could be for the good. Yeah. It was in the end, it netted out really well. But that was my first kind of deep touch experience. Where got toe apply my marketing sensibility. Ah, kind of operational sensibility to things on a not-for-profits sector. Um, and i got the kind of i r r if you will, the return on investment emotionally of being able to see what the dollars were doing on the ground and the touch and feel with, like the kids that that provoked me tow want to come home and you have something that was ah, you know that i could have more of ah, instant feedback loop on ah, as getting to odessa the frequency of that it was quite hard. And i still i obviously go, you know quite frequently, but the operators really on the ground, they’re the ones that are on the day today. So i, ah, started investigate the education sector, um managed to become a boardmember of ah, big picture learning, which is an alternative high school program. Alternate high schools all around the country. Great operators of, i think, one of the best reimagined high school program in the country. And i won that i don’t think it’s enough credit for it. Ah, but that provoked me to launch sweat, equity, education and sweat equity. Education is ah, and its core design. Ah, curriculum development programme where i was taking the access that i had in in the consumer product industry and kind of making it open source to the eu space. So how do you teach kids to the open hyre versus teaching them to the test? What did that look like like, for instance, could ah, ah, young kid in high school, high school age really was our core focus of cohort. Um what? What is that? They need to know to be a footwear designer in our industry. And what are the information management tools? And how would you measure success? And, you know, not stuff that you would abstractly touch, but, you know, practically touch. So it was kind of, you know, one part reimagining vocational education and another part just kind of increasing the relevance meter on considering products on dh tying that to jobs directly to job. They’re designer, et cetera. Yeah. For where watches fission products, you know, as a consumer product guy, um, that was always the coolest parts of my learning. And then my continued learning in life is that when you idea it’s something you have that you germany an idea, the idea comes back, you know, typically in the way of package or a box. And because that idea’s a sample and the samples all wrong and problem solving to get it right, where were you wrong? And where was the, you know, on the manufacturing side? Wrong. And how do you manage that information loop? And how do you home that? What kind of efficiencies can you get it learned from that so kind of, like, really demystifying my industry? Ah, inside of a curriculum product. So let’s, talk about some of your your board service because you want to tie your work to the to the audience and maybe their relationship with board members. Um what? What do you see? The shortcomings that you have become aware of in the in the way that the the executive director’s or, you know, administrators of the of the non-profits you’re on in the way they relate to our use, their board members. What advice do you have around that? Well, i think today you know, i think the next generation of charity is is ah, is to not think of yourself like a charity. You know, my great experience around sweat equity education was moving from who was, you know, an organization that was run by an executive director kind of classic form e d um, slightly academic. Ah, really good person. Ah, really, really, really good person. But the orientation was an operational. The orientation was muchmore kind of entrenched in the kind of the kind of seeing the world this flat from an operational point let’s talk about let’s talk about having developing this operational perspective. Just have a few minutes that that partly that part laid into me reset, restructuring the organization so that we had a c o o and we’ve reconfigured the organization to get someone out of business to kind of come in. And ah ah, operationalize and bill deficiencies in the organization was a big that’s, a big learning experience for me and one that i think has been ah, very fruit phone is informed. Ah, you know, other boards that i sit on in the non-profits check on dh. How have donors reacted to that at the organising some donors it’s interesting, you know, i’m someone i’m completely self made, so i take every dollar that i spend very seriously. Ah, i don’t have build gates money, but i certainly i think, for the percentage of my net worth and how much i’ve given up from work-life pay over the last decade has been it’s ah it’s been significant, so i take my spends very seriously, and i think there’s some donors to the orientation might be on the foundation side where they’re not necessarily personally stroking the check i mean personally, but rather from a foundation. So they’re an executive at a foundation or from high net worth individuals who, you know, it’s it’s kind of like a loss leader for them. So some folks have ah, don’t like that kind of business orientation, they get threatened by it. They kind of are nostalgic for a certain structure and modeling, which was that that model is coming out of date exactly. And so those are not donors that are relevant to my efforts. Yeah. Ah, and i try to get with like minded folks folks that want to try to ah, build efficiencies and ah! And build ah, you know, i don’t want to say the b word because it sounds maybe a little bit ah, and pathetic a latto being in the philanthropic space, but building the business of charity. Yeah, okay, now. And it takes a certain kind of rigor that we could extrapolated from operating business is to make them run more efficiently if they’re going to be small, medium size. We have just about a minute or so left before i know, i know you have to go and but while you were on stage, you made a point of talking about how how we make people feel. Yeah, and i was thinking of does i was listening to you. I was listening, i was think about donors how we make donors feel about they’re they’re giving, but can you share what, some what you shared on stage? Yeah, you know, i just i i’m a big believer that’s not what you make in life. It’s, it’s. You know, tell you make people feel i think, when when you die that’s what people? Remember, you know, it’s the that’s, the magic and building kind of real authentic connections between peoples i think putting an emphasis on the touch in the field and the and the and the kind of emotional stickiness because that’s what drives and motivates people to kind of want to show up the next day and the next day, you know, ah, brand is really nothing but ah, a fancy way of kind of saying, ah, you know, i’m going to build the the easiest solution to get people to understand my values if they are those folks are my consumers or people that work for me or people that don’t know me, like, within an instance, you know, it’s kind of a little bit like in this maybe a little bit, maybe egomaniacal, but a little bit like believing that you are building a religion and ah, you know, when you think about what steve jobs or walt disney did in terms of the religion of their brands, it’s very easy to become indoctrinated so like a fair manager, and if they operate in the name of apple on the ground, you don’t need jobs in the room to kind of channel that energy and that’s what great brands do good, they kind of informal culture oh! And they inform culture of leadership, clarity of message concensus. Ah, and ah, you know that that in order to build those often in the non-profits back sector, the ones that do get over that hump, they manage to do that are the ones typically have a much larger scale. It’s very hard to do that without kind of the powder to take it, you know, to scale. So, for instance, let’s say a united way is a very effective, you know, um, you know, uh, organization terms of building its brand saved the children. Okay? Ah, well known, but even a smaller organization, i could still have this kind of effective leadership. And, uh oh, there’s, no doubt sharing of culture. And now you there’s no doubt, there’s no doubt, i think it’s but, you know, it’s kind of just pierced its appear like it’s a numbers game, right? Like, the more it’s, hard to scale, a brand that no one knows, like, you know, kleenex, right? But you don’t know, like, you know me nick’s, right? Like, if i said, oh, i used me next you’d be like what? You don’t mean so there’s ah, you know ah. What? I think it could be said for that and i think an an an anecdote for folks in the non-profit space. They need to go around and find other like minded organizations and, you know, should i see this all the time you just came from aa? You know, big summit and ah, get out the vote groups like all around the country and from the rock, the vote, folks toa much smaller kind of local regionalized groups that are more maybe focus around a demographic or a region of the country. But you know anything that they could share and create a kind of an umbrella around to kind of create that scale. Right? I often say to two non-profits to check their charities at the door, check their brand rather at the door. And one of the great ways for them to grow is to find like minded organizations that are willing to kind of operate under the same name. Ah ah ah, if you find, you know it’s kind of odd to me that, you know, i just came from a two day summit where i met someone on the west coast that’s trying to do is get out the vote, play with a digital platform and then someone on the east coast trying to do it to get out the vote play with a digital platform it’s kind of like, aren’t you? Isn’t there some burr dunaj run done and sees here? So even if you like used, we could probably take make-a-wish you guys operate on the same basic digital, like the digital tools, and you guys could re label like white, label them or or be powered by your brand? But how do you build those efficiencies when you’re operating in-kind of small silos and very fragmented co-branded helps give cover and, you know, often the you know, there’s, there is strength in numbers and strength in that kind of alignment of missions, so ah, i feel like that’s. What? Ah ah lot of its one of the achilles heels of the of the non for-profit sector marketa, whose founder echo enterprises. He has just a short time. So we have to wrap. This is tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of the next-gen charity conference. Coming to you from tribeca performing arts center, lower manhattan. Mark. Thank you very much. My pleasure. Thank you, thanks for saving. Thanks. They didn’t think the tubing getting demanding things. You’re listening to the talking, alternate network, waiting to get me to thinking. Cubine are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam lebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Hi, this is psychic medium. Betsy cohen, host of the show. The power of intuition. Join me at talking alternative dot com mondays at eleven a. M call in for a free psychic readings. Learn how to tune into your intuition, to feel better and to create your optimum life. I’m here to guide you and to assist you in creating life that you deserve. Listen every monday at eleven a, m on talking alternative dot com. Are you feeling overwhelmed in the current chaos of our changing times? A deeper understanding of authentic astrology can uncover solutions in every area of life. After all, metaphysics is just quantum physics, politically expressed hi and montgomery taylor and i offer lectures, seminars and private consultations. For more information, contact me at monte m o nt y at r l j media. Dot com talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. No. Welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent right now, i have my interview with craig newmark, the founder of craigslist and craigconnects from also neck from nextgencharity conference last year hears that. Welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of the next-gen charity conference two thousand eleven at the tribeca performing arts center in downtown manhattan, and joining me now is craig newmark. Craig is the founder of craigslist and craigconnects greg, thank you for taking time today. Hey, i’m glad to be here. It’s a pleasure to have you craigconnects is ah fairly new venture but you and i talked about it on the show maybe six months or so ago. How has it been evolving? It’s been working out pretty well on a personal basis. It’s help me focus what i want to do in the sense of what causes i should be supporting what group size should be supporting in support of those causes, that kind of thing. It’s helping me better understand how tow really do an exceptional job of supporting some specific non-profits also finding ways for non-profits tto help themselves with the eventual aim of getting very large numbers. Of people connected to social media. All right. And so what have you been learning from the personal perspective in terms of how you should be or how craigconnects should be supporting non-profits well, there’s a bunch of small lessons, okay, one of the one of the most difficult is haven’t finding ways quiet ways to get people in the same space non-profits in the same space to actually talk with and work with each other collapse been a tough one. I’ve also ah realized in a deep way how difficult it is often for small, effective non-profits to be really bad getting the word out about themselves, since often they don’t know how to deliver a good, tight elevator pitch and that’s a bit of a computer industry cliche. Nevertheless, they need to be able to talk about themselves and real quick and tight. So how is craigconnects helping with the collaboration and also helping non-profits deliver their own message? Well, in those specific examples, it’s mostly me speaking directly across people in different groups in terms of what they’re doing, i’ve devoted most of that energy to groups which support military families and veterans um, but very recently and i really mean, last couple days i’ve been starting to devote that now intensely two groups who believe in the future of journalism and that one way to restore trust to news media is to start checking the facts again. S o u mean investigative journalism investigative journalist plays a role, but the idea is that often a politician, for example, will make a statement to a reporter. The reporter will know that he’s being lied to and the reporter should have within relatively easy reach. Someone is check the facts, and it can then challenge the politician is needed um, and in terms of ah non-profits supporting themselves are really helping themselves to convey their own message. Doesn’t that still have to be an elevator pitch, but conveying, ah, cohesive mathos message? What is your advice there? Where you see shortcomings? Well, basically, the idea is that a speaker on behalf of a non-profit or pretty much any organization just has to clearly identify what they’re doing and just try to get it out there in about forty five seconds and then keep repeating until they can do that if they don’t know how to, they need to. Ask someone for help in terms of that craigslist foundation, in fact, does teach that and it’s a boot camp, but that’s only available maybe once or more year. The idea is it’s a matter of applied common sense if you’re doing something and if you’re good at it, you just have to be able to boil it down and to articulate the gist of it really fast. And then no one to stop talking. Yeah, okay, that i was gonna ask you something else. But now that you just said, you know, when to stop talking overselling can be a problem. Yes, it’s quite possible that i’ve just spoken with some folks who had a difficulty knowing when to stop difficulty. No england tio? No, when they were over selling something. Okay. And so how do we, uh, do you have any advice about knowing when to stop or should we be practicing this in front of others? How do we stop? People? I’d say practice in front of people who will be slightly unkind. You okay? Because you need friends who are good enough friends to let you know what you may not want to hear. Yeah, don’t. We learn a lot when we’re challenged when, when we’re told, you know, that’s not quite right sometimes the only way you learn is from people who like you enough, teo tell you, when you’ve gone a little too far, that applies, not lucas speaking, but in my case, my sense of humor. Okay, i won’t ask you to try it out, but but no, but it’s it’s absolutely true, we do learn when we’re when we’re challenged on dh challenge in a good way. Yeah, no so craigconnects is focused mostly on aid for military families you mentioned there. There are other categories of not sure all right craigconnects is working more than one, any one particular area with military families and veterans, but there’s also areas like water and sanitation, micro finance, peace in the mideast. One big area just beginning to be explored is ah helping out those groups which measure the effectiveness of non-profits because there’s a lot of non-profits who do a lot of good but there’s also a substantial number of non-profits hoo ah, tell a good story, but never really get anything done. No outcomes. Another area is this whole idea of restoring trust to the news to news media by restoring fact checking i mean, i’m not in that business and i’m not going to tell him how to do their job, but i want news i can trust again. One area unannounced on the site is voter protection. There are people actively seeking to disenfranchise various groups, young old latinos and other minorities. We’re in america and the effort to to disenfranchise people needs to be stopped. You mentioned the sights or the organizations that evaluate charities or rate charities that’s the guide star helping groups like guidestar, charity navigator is that is that the population that’s exactly right? Guidestar in charity navigator have been around a long time. They’re good at looking at financial effectiveness. They’re moving towards measures of accountability, transparency and then eventually measuring just how good a charity is that serving his client population. I’ve had ken burger on the show ceo charity navigator, and we’ve talked about jerry navigator two point oh, and then what’s coming in three point of the outcomes assessment that’s the deal now for the here and now there’s something called great non-profits stud organ that’s user reviews for non-profits kind of like what yelp does that’s a hero now, and i really do encourage people to look at it and then to write in their own little reviews of non-profits they know something about for charity’s listening if they would like tio if they feel they fall within the missions that craigconnects is working with, how do they go about getting getting the your attention? Well, if you go to craigconnects that or ge there’s a connect link and that’s how to submit something, we need a little bit of a break because we’ve been successful enough to get to be overwhelmed with requests, okay? And let me just ah, closing moment ask you generally what? What what are you planning to share this afternoon with the with the next-gen audience? Basically common sense stuff? They’ve asked me to talk about things i’ve learned doing craigslist in craigconnects that maid apply to people in general, like the craigslist business model ultimately is doing well by doing good in meant that when making it a new company, i decided to step away from a very large amounts of money, not altruistic. Itjust means following through his stuff i already believed in and another founding principle. I think craig was just simplicity, just a little about that. Well, yeah, insights, orn presentation or anything, people don’t really need the fancy stuff, they need something which is simple and fast, all right. Craig newmark is the founder of craigslist and craigconnects craig you very much for being a guest. Thanks, mom. My pleasure, then mar. Pleasure having you. This is tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of the next-gen two thousand eleven conference at tribeca performing arts center in new york city. I want to thank craig, mark very much for sitting for an interview and also market go. Right now, we take a break when we returned tony’s, take to a clip from my standup vintage clip from my stand up stay with me. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Are you feeling overwhelmed in the current chaos of our changing times? A deeper understanding of authentic astrology can uncover solutions in every area of life. After all, metaphysics is just quantum physics, politically expressed hi and montgomery taylor and i offer lectures, seminars and private consultations. For more information, contact me at monte m o nt y at r l j media. Dot com are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com dafs welcome back, it’s. Time for tony’s, take two. I’ve been doing stand up comedy since july two thousand eleven. Here is a vintage clip from july two thousand eleven. I did this set at gotham comedy club in new york city. Here it is, durney. When i was in seventh green, i had a terrific krauz lisa magic and i chose the moment to ask her to go steady. To be our seventh grade dance. I can still smell that high gloss varnish on the gymnasium floor. I was there in my powder blue leisure suit. The contrast ing thread on the lapel. I saved my last dance released. Lisa saved her last dance for albert moran. The pain of watching that spectacle when they parted buy-in walked up to lisa. I got close to her mind, hands were sweating, my chest pounding. I got so close, i put my hands on her shoulders in the middle of the dance floor, and i asked, monisha would you go steady? With all her seventh grade charm and sweetness, she said, you are standing on my dress. Years later, albert and lisa, man. Then, sadly, they separated and divorced. Dahna attorney. And i handled that divorce. Handup lisa has been paying the press waiting that is tony’s take two for friday, march ninth, two thousand twelve, the tenth show of two thousand twelve. There is more of that exact that clip mohr that set, i should say on my blogged at tony martignetti dot com right now i have my interview with naomi levin she’s, the executive director of the heimans center for philanthropy and fund-raising at new york university from last may at a reception that i hosted for my show here is that interview. Naomi levine is the executive director of the george h heimans junior center for philanthropy and fund-raising at new york university. For twenty two years, she was in use, senior vice president for external affairs and helped raise over two and a half billion dollars for the university. She is a graduate of columbia law school. She was previously the national executive director of the american jewish congress. Now she is special advisor to the president of venue, and she chairs the board of the edgar bronfman center for jewish student life and the tab center for israel studies. Please join me in welcoming mrs naomi levine. Mrs levine, what do you see as the non-profit role for our society? Let me put this in a kind of perspective that i always used. I don’t think that most people in our society recognized the importance of the non-profit world in our civil society, if you close your eyes for one minute and look at the skyline of new york city, do you hear me? Yeah, you will see that if you took away lincoln center, the hospitals and why you, fordham, columbia and all of the other universities, medical centers, cultural centers, theatres, dance a group, you will see that this would be a very different society, and most people really don’t think about that when they think of the way we all run. They think a government, they think of the corporate sector, and they don’t think of the non-profits but why is that? That that means non-profits are not fulfilling their work in spreading their the message of their good works? I mean, do you think the blame falls on the non-profits for people not being aware, i think i would suspect so let me lead into that as we progress in our conversation because the truth is, i’m not really sure i know that most people don’t realize it and what they don’t realise moore is not one of those organizations could exist without fund-raising they require financial support, and yet do you know a shingle mother who will say to their child, you know, dear, when you grow up, i want you to be a fundraiser. Nobody says that my own mother, my own mother in the last years of her life, when she was living at a place called cat a house in the bronx, i would come to visit her and she’d say to me now remember, when we go down for lunk, if someone asks you what you do for a living, tell them you’re a lawyer, not a fundraiser. She was embarrassed at her law review daughter was raising money. People think of it as selling cookies for the girl scouts, and you ask me why it is that i must tell you i’m not sure, but one thing i am sure if you let me adjustment, just put that on the table is that unless fund-raising is viewed as a profession, a legitimate profession that has talked within? The university not with in all kinds of organizations that provide courses, but within the university, it never will be given the kind of status that it deserves. Dentistry at one point was nothing. You went to an apprentice, yet you learnt how to pull a tooth. That was the end. Lawyers like john adams of your read his book. You know, he was an apprentice in a law office. But once causes were given within universities and got to stamp a university academic approval, they became professions. And the reason i created the heimans center is that i really want to see people take cautious, learn and make this area a profession that even my mother would be proud of you so that’s, hard to go. Let me tell you and you make a very good point that i don’t know any fundraisers who it’s. For whom? It’s. The first career. You know, in my office we had a big staff and we had people who were from every discipline around. They were from journalism, from archaeology, from everything in the world. Nobody studied. And yet if you think about it, i know that i learned an enormous amount. During those twenty five years and every time i prepare for a class, i learned more, i confess to you, i never spent time with my staff talking about ethics. What did we talk about? We talked about what you go, how much money where’s the money, etcetera. Yet when i started to prepare the course on ethics and red doug white’s book on charities on trial and a few other things, i said, you know, that’s, a very important area, and i should learn about it because if you don’t know the law and you don’t know the ethical component and you don’t know board governance and fiduciary relationship, you’re going to get in trouble. That’s perfect and doug white was a guest on my show, talking about his book about ethics, but so now we’re talking about the fundraiser and fund raisers, and you’ve just made a great transition. How about the role of the trustees? What? What are they trustees heir not really fully aware of their roles, don’t you think with respect to the organization, trustees are also fund-raising is if you sit on a board because it’s a nice, prestigious thing to do and it looks good in your obituary in the times it is a wrong reason to be on a board boards have responsibility. They have the responsibility to keep their organization financially secure. That means boardmember sze have to be fundraisers also, you know, larry tisch usedto have he was the chairman of gnu during the time that i was vice president and he had a very simple and crash way. I assume of running his board. He used to say to me, look, we’re not harvey, we’re not princeton. When i put someone on the board, they not only have to be dedicated, decent people committed toe hyre read, but they have tai run my board by the three g’s that people have to give money, they’re not a big amount, but give something to show their commitment to. They have to help get money, and if they can’t do that, they should get off the board because boards have responsibilities. And when you talk about a boardmember they have to be, they have to understand their responsibilities, fiduciary, legal, come to meeting, to read and order to report. Read a budget report there are a whole list of things if this was a class that i could list for you that boards have to do so. The relationship between the fundraiser and a boardmember is really a very close one. What was number three? You said he had three, three, three requirements, money get money there, you get off the moca or get off the board. That was number three, not in a harsh way. I’m not suggesting you tell your boards that i’m telling you you have to try to persuade them to give and then had people onto your board that will shut an example. I never suggested it toe fund-raising they come in and get rid of their boardmember you’ll be in trouble. On the other hand, you have tohave board training on the sarbanes. Actually, the corporation board have been instructed to do that to a close are instructed to give board training, training aboard and what their responsibilities are. Doug and i and and ruth ellen reuben is here. We go around to different boards were invited to talk to them about their obligations under the law federal law state law i venture to say if i went around this room today and most of your fundraisers air sit on board, you would not know a ll the laws that are involved in fund-raising state and federal. I learned that on lee when i started to teach i did not know that when i was raising money. Don’t you think that the trend also is that this is only gonna get worse at the booth state and federal level? That oversight from those levels of government is going to just increase among among non-profits i don’t like the fact that you used the word worse in my book, i would say that’s better, more, more. I know you advocate for even greater oversight. I know you do far more oversight and far more regulation. It is an area that everybody thinks so. We don’t have to regulate the non-cash offiicial very good people. The red crossed of good things university how dare we suggest that they be regulated more. Let me tell you that there is a cz much mismanagement, excessive salaries, all kinds of conflict of interest area occur in the nonprofit world that a car in a profit within the nonprofit sector fights your advocacy of deeper oversight. The non-profit schecter buy-in it’s. Not eager tohave. More regulation. I will confess to you on my staff and friends know this for seven years i have gone up to albany fighting for one lousy bill. One bill that would say that if you’re hired as a professional fundraiser, you should take one course in the a clutch of your entire career in law, ethics and board governance. I think you should do that. And every year it gets through the senate and assembly up in albany and then the non-profits come up and they argue against it in their mind. It’s a slippery slope. You’re going to start regulating your going to stock with more rules. We don’t want that. And the governors who don’t want to start up with such good organizations as the heart association of the red cross, they vito and it drives me insane. Ken berger is going to be a guest on my show in in july. I think. It’s the july first show, the executive director of charity navigator what do you see is the role of charity navigator and similar rankings ratings of charities. Well, i think that anything that helps a donor get on understanding of an organisation is a good thing i’m not in a position to discuss the details of those organization, but i know if their organizations around that help it donor-centric stay and more about the organization in my book that’s fine, more disclosure, more honesty, more open dealings, more accountability, all those words and now on the table when i started in fund-raising i’m a very old person, i’m eighty eight years, so i have lived through different parts and different segments off fund-raising the fund-raising world, and in the beginning, you never heard such words. I never heard such words, but now you hear it more amore schnoll organizations like that play a role onda, of course, it’s controversial because the role that they play helps define what people decide to look at. And of course, donors now are more interested in looking at outcomes, and that becomes very difficult latto measure donors are also interested in, um, percentage of budget that goes to program versus administration, but for some charities, it could be very legitimate toe have a very high percentage going to administration because they’re doing things in, but if they’re going abroad and doing things on the ground in, you know, in other continents, i have always been very conservative. I believe that when a person gives money, not more than thirty five percent maximum should go for overhead and a russian gulf of the program. Now there may be exceptions, and you may be right, but by and large, i think that people should feel comfortable in knowing that the book of their money goes to the project that they want to support. Now there are exceptions, and i think that when you sit down with the donor, like we used to have to sit down with someone who gave us two million dollars for a chair, we had to explain that some of that would go for the over head of that school. You’ll have to be able to explain it, but we never never spent more than thirty five cents of thirty five percent that was maximum mr tisch required even less on, you’ll have to be very open and honest about that talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Hi, i’m carol ward from the body mind wellness program. Listen to my show for ideas and information to help you live a healthier life in body, mind and spirit. You hear from terrific guests who are experts in the areas of health, wellness and creativity. So join me every thursday at eleven a, m eastern standard time on talking alternative dot com professionals serving community. This is tony martignetti aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio fridays one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication, and the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office needs better leadership, customer service sales or maybe better writing are speaking skills? Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. If you’re in the new york city area, stop by one of our public classes or get your human resource is in touch with us. Website is improving communications, dot com that’s improving communications, dot com improve your professional environment, be more effective, be happier and make more money. Improving communications, that’s. The answer. Talking. The audience for the show is small and midsize non-profits the tagline is big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent, what would you like to leave small and midsize charities? With what message for small shops, elections? You’re not different because how you raise money for a big organization and how you raise your trish more fundamentally are not different when we teach courses in our heimans center we, my approach is at the principles of generic, and they involve developing relationships if you know your fund-raising you know that last year, out of the three hundred three billion dollars, it was raised about eighty three percent when you include request come from individuals and individuals will give to small groups, and i’ll give to big groups, so the rules on how you raise that money, the art of the ass is the same. In a little group, you use the same technique to get twenty five dollars, as you will use to get a million dollars, it is developing a relationship, knowing howto ask knowing how to devise your mission statement, knowing the process and the rules and fund-raising knowing what you’re bored should do and that should be and knowing the ethical issues, whether you’re dealing with a little group or a big road, which harder with a little good bye don’t knock it you also perhaps will you social medium or with a little girl? I’m not sure i’m no expert on social media we brought on to our staff of the heimans center last year, marcia vanik she’s, an expert, and she has tried to persuade me that things like facebook and twitter and all that stuff have some value. I am totally illiterate there, but i respect the fact that the coming generations will use it more, particularly the small organizations, and i tell the small organizations, don’t ignore your financial status. Be sure if you can’t afford an audit, at least have very strict rules and how your money is handled. Doug white’s book has a whole list of cases in which organizations big and small got into terrible trouble because they weren’t careful and how they handle their finances. And that is true in little groups as well as big rooms, and that doug white book is charity on trial and that but that goes back to the trustees relationship and trustees obligations even for us, even for a small shop there’s a board and maybe a board of only three or four people, but they have the obligation to be aware of the things that you’re talking about under the law. Whether you’re a big organization are a little charities bureau, which is the hand of the attorney general in the state of new york will look atyou and look atyou carefully and don’t make mistake. I’m not here selling doug’s book i couldn’t give any i’m not interested in that. The only reason i pointed out is that it has in it the cases that are very important for you to understand, and you have to know all the people that got in trouble. Let me give you one example, the american red cross during the nine eleven tragedy, they got in a lot of money, and they used a whole bunch of it for the purpose that nine eleven required that a little bit of money he left over the director of the red cross, one of the most terrific people in the field used that money for the blood drive. She didn’t put it in her pocket. She was fired. Why was she fired? Because the law says if i take money from you for a and i use it for b you’re wrong. I have to use that money for a unless i write to you and i say to you, do you mind if i use it, etcetera? So they’re a little things like that that if you were a fundraiser in this room or a boardmember you have to be very sensitive to whether you’re a little gay root for a big room. We have just a minute or two left. What is it that concerns you most about the charitable sector over the next couple of years? One to two years? Where? What do you think about most what keeps you up at night? Well, i think that competition is very it’s going even increase and the government are cutting back drastically. And so on the shoulders of the non-profits we have to provide for the help that the poor need the abused women or the st joseph’s, full kitchens and all the social services that keep our society going. There’s a book that somebody called claire got eonni road that has wonderful. Chapters on how capitalism could not exist in this country on regulated capitalism without the help of the non-profits we provide the helpful the people that fall between the cracks in our society, and i worry that with the government cutting back and the competition the way it is it’s going to be hard and hard and harder also europe which never was here before, is now facing the situation where their governments are cutting back. They never had a non-profit sector, they relied entirely on government support. Every university in europe is supported by the government. Oxford cambridge is so bone, everyone now oxygen has an office in new york, cambridge has an office in new york and everyone overseas we have more people in our class is now trying tto learn fund-raising from europe, asia, china, every place that’s going to give you a great deal of competition, and so i don’t spend nights worrying about it, but i am certainly concerned about it, and i would hope you find may end that i’m too old to see the end of it, but i would like to see fund-raising fundraisers given the recognition that they deserve and huge. Haven’t you in this room have that obligation to be proud of what you’re doing to make certain that when you work in any agency, people know that without you, that agency is going to close that? This is a dignified profession, and you have to carry that flag. Naomi levine is the executive director of the george heimans center junior junior center for philanthropy and fund-raising at new york university. Thank you very much, mrs loving. Do we have time for where i think you have time for maybe just one or two is your question? Go ahead. Carol weaver, please just shout it out. I’ll repeat it. Go ahead. What do you think about in-kind fundrasing coming together to create a voting we are. Your economy, i i’m told of if we bound together issues way could be a voice in already for your force, which of course, i’m very hyre and for other things, like maybe creating a bank for non-profits you know, i think it’s the variance say, when you make a finger together, you make a fist way have concerned with go ross the industry could we not consider, and i can’t think of a better well, but there are s o the question is generally about how the non-profit sector could organize to be a more cohesive voting bloc now, but their organization like independent sector, you know, so there’s that what else would you like to sell? Well, i can say is most of those organizations are run by their executives, as most organizations are in the average member plays a very minimal role in your right. If the average member played a bigger role and then insistent, i’m sure you think then you would have more effective involvement in albany and other places, but you have the organizations around there’s, a million of them it’s just said in my book there, not doing anything, uh, along the lines. And i think that should be done, yeah, does independent sector is that one of the groups that opposes broader on government oversight, so nobody should fortuny chelation hearts of then that would be, yes, doug white does, even though you panned his book, doug white support, sir, we’re gonna have dug it up for rebuttal after this. Is there another? Is there one more question? If we have time before mrs levin leaves? All right, please join me in thanking her again. Naomi living. And my thanks to naomi levin and her team at the new york university heimans center next week, it’s feared more than death, not the dentist public speaking lori krauz public speaking and presentation skills coach will help you through the fear of your next appearance in front of an audience then scott koegler, our tech contributor, will introduce us to pinterest pinterest dot com the skyrocketing social media property what’s in it for your non-profit keep up with what’s coming up sign up for are in sad or email alerts on the facebook page, like the page you can listen live our archive for i carve listening, go to non-profit radio dot net and that’s where you’ll find our itunes paige, if you are an itunes listener, if you’re if you’re getting this podcasts and subscribing, could i plead with you to goto non-profit radio dot net and leave a review there on the itunes? Paige? I know you don’t have to go backto. Listen, i know you get the podcast automatically, but if you could, i’d be grateful for a review at non-profit radio dot net the following is a public service announcement because i have a soft spot in my heart for belmar, new jersey do you need dental care? Visit the offices of hannah pole dental care in belmar on friday, march twenty third to receive free dental services. Everyone is welcome, regardless of where you’re from, care will be offered on a first come, first served basis. For information, call seven three two six eight one two two two, five that is organized by dentistry from the heart. The show is sponsored by g grace and company. Are you worried about the rising cost of rent for your organization? Do you need a plan for real estate? You’re non-profit owns g grayson company will give you and your board a full analysis. George grace has been advising non-profits on their real estate decisions for over twenty five years. 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