Eric Saperston: Mr. Wake Up Excited, Go To Bed Fulfilled, Returns
I had to have Eric Saperston back. After the October 17, 2022 show with him, I got more positive comments than I remember for any guest. This time around, he shares how important nonprofit volunteering has been in his life, the joy he gets from coaching, what he’s learned from his series “Three Things,” and more.
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Transcript for 626_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20230206.mp3
uh tony Such a treat to be back. Thank [00:02:33.95] spk_0:
you. I’m glad you are. I know our listeners are uh folks, folks loved your, your appearance a couple of months ago and uh how to have you back to talk a little more Aloha, you remind, just reminding folks, you’re, you’re in Hawaii on a farm where, where in Hawaii, [00:02:41.73] spk_1:
I live in Maui Hawaii and uh I live um [00:02:48.35] spk_0:
I [00:02:48.57] spk_1:
like to tell people I live in the, where the garden of Eden meets Willy Wonka [00:02:54.32] spk_0:
and why is that? Where’s [00:02:56.03] spk_1:
the Willy Wonka? [00:02:57.84] spk_0:
I [00:03:25.09] spk_1:
live in the most remote part of Maui on 100 and 80 acre organic farm with just uh it’s a food forest essentially, so we can walk around and there’s papayas and there’s mangoes and there’s lychee and there’s Ramadan and there’s coconuts and there’s just so much food and so it’s, it’s like the garden of Eden. We, you know, we have waterfalls and then, and then we can walk around and, and and pick something right off off the tree and it’s like, wow, these snows, berries take like taste like raspberries and it’s just, it’s just, you know that, that’s the Willy Wonka part is just being able to walk around and just pick incredible, unique fruit right off the right off the land and put it in your mouth and it’s just, it’s magical. [00:03:59.53] spk_0:
Alright, I’m visiting, I’m visiting. Uh let’s start off with what we wrapped up with the last time we did, we uh we were talking about your your your three things, your three things series, Where’s that stand? What’s going on with that? [00:04:09.19] spk_1:
You know, thank you for asking. You know, the three things has been a real um uh like I said, I would say my new journey, my first journey was bridging the gap between young people and elders and calling up really wise people when I was in my [00:04:17.50] spk_0:
twenties [00:04:20.89] spk_1:
And that led my 30s. And then now I’ve been thinking about, well I guess this is a kind of a funny story when I was on the Today [00:04:25.95] spk_0:
show [00:04:27.07] spk_1:
promoting my movie [00:04:28.98] spk_0:
uh when I was on the Today Show and then there was Good Morning America. Uh then there was then it was morning joe and of course I did uh I did Rachel, you know, he just Rachel, I did Rachel, I did Lawrence, you know? [00:05:37.89] spk_1:
Uh well I was just saying when I was on the Today Show and uh my parents had watched the segment and my father had said, you know, it seemed like you were on there for a long time, you know, that was that was a pretty long segment, how long were you on there? And I said I was on there, I think six minutes in total. And my dad said, oh you better start thinking about how you want to spend your other nine minutes of your 15 minutes of fame. And so I’ve been thinking about those nine minutes a lot and that is the the the evolution of the I guess the the opportunity for me to step out again into the international stage here is um things and it’s been so fun. We started off, it’s been an organic process, I think I started three things maybe 11 years ago where I started interviewing people um [00:05:41.99] spk_0:
strangers [00:05:43.21] spk_1:
and walking around and we travel around the world and I’d walk up to strangers on the street corner and to say excuse me, can I come up and talk [00:05:49.45] spk_0:
to you? [00:06:28.63] spk_1:
And that was always really exciting just to walk up to strangers and uh and see if we couldn’t befriend them and then some people would be a know that many people were yeses and then we would put a camera on them and I’d ask them a series of questions that were three things questions at that time. It was really centered around uh what are three things your father taught you or what are three things your mother taught you or what are three things that you share with your younger self or what are three things you’ve learned about communication or just random questions that I would ask people and they would drop in and share these really poignant heartfelt. Uh we were we were we were doing it before humans of new york, but it was very much like that idea of just dropping into the humanity of people [00:06:38.69] spk_0:
and that [00:06:57.00] spk_1:
we did. We’ve got uh we’ve got thousands of interviews and I think we’re gonna turn that into an art exhibit and interactive art exhibit at some point. Uh and then that evolved into we had a wonder summit uh in san Diego, where we brought 65 people from around the world to come together for this uh weekend party, which was caused creative night, more wonder in each other’s lives. And as an opening for that experience, we we had all our friends, we took three things questions and we put them in a little hat and we had everybody [00:07:11.00] spk_0:
pick a [00:07:31.07] spk_1:
three things question out of the hat. And uh and then as a as a as an exercise for the for the weekend, everybody was was charged with the opportunity to go talk to everyone at the event and ask them their three things question. So if your question was, what are what are three things you’ve learned from making the mistakes? Uh and my question could be, what are three things I’ve learned about getting lost. Uh and then I’d go ask everybody my question. You go ask everybody your question throughout the entire weekend. Then at the end we had a closing circle and then [00:07:48.22] spk_0:
everybody, they [00:08:15.58] spk_1:
got a chance to share what their question was and what they learned from asking 65 people. Uh and and it was phenomenal. Everybody gave many ted talks about leadership, communication, intimacy, relationships and everybody got to share because they got to poll all these, the collective wisdom of everybody that was there and then share the commonalities, which was phenomenal. And then, um, uh, the pandemic happened and I was just prior to the pandemic, I was working on a series called Legends by the Fire, where I was interviewing iconic legends by a campfire. We had interviewed steven Tyler from Aerosmith and Weird Al Yankovic, who just got uh, got a movie out that’s doing really well. Uh, and we interviewed Kenny Rogers, I’m a big music guy. So we interviewed these guys as pilots, [00:08:41.97] spk_0:
essentially [00:09:13.57] spk_1:
before he died. And it was awesome. And then the pandemic hit, and when the pandemic hit, you know, that that idea kind of fizzled on the, on the fizzled out. And then zoom happened as you know? And with zoom technology, it was incredible. I can zoom out and speak to people all around the world. And so I just pivoted and started calling up really extraordinary visionaries and pioneers and champions of industry and asking them a three things question. So we’ve created a series that’s really designed to extrapolate wisdom quickly from extraordinary people and that’s what we’ve been doing. And it’s been phenomenal. We’ve interviewed so many incredible people? And we’re coming out with our first season at the end of this quarter, [00:09:28.84] spk_0:
what what’s a uh, what’s a Sapper Stone take away from all these thousands of three question interviews, What what have you, what have you gleaned about strangers? [00:09:43.79] spk_1:
You know, it’s so fun. I won, I’m an optimist and I’m able to [00:09:49.55] spk_0:
talk [00:09:50.25] spk_1:
to people and just reassure them, create a safe space. [00:09:56.30] spk_0:
Are you, I gotta ask you, are you, are you optimistic at the beginning of every new year? [00:10:06.49] spk_1:
You know, I’m about domestic every day, the new year. The new year doesn’t really matter to me much, You know, I’m not a new year guy, I’m not a holiday guy, I’m not, I’m not to me every day [00:10:15.38] spk_0:
and [00:10:15.94] spk_1:
I know it may sound like a platitude, but I, you know, I grew up, my father, my father had a stroke when he was 20 [00:10:21.83] spk_0:
eight [00:10:22.59] spk_1:
and he was, [00:10:23.95] spk_0:
he, yeah, [00:10:48.11] spk_1:
he was the main breadwinner in my family and a superstar. And when, when he lost his ability to be himself in the way he envisioned himself to be and became bitter and angry. It just as a, as a child growing up in that environment, it just, it taught me to live every day, like it’s my last and so I’ve just, I’ve been doing that for so long. Um, yeah, I, I think that’s, that’s a big part of it. So I’m I’m an optimist by nature and I think one of the, I guess, what have I learned from asking people three things questions, [00:10:58.27] spk_0:
I [00:10:59.04] spk_1:
think as a guy who has been a professional interviewer and and has has has conducted thousands of interviews at the beginning. [00:11:07.87] spk_0:
I [00:11:08.11] spk_1:
would write really elaborate questions uh paragraphs and then sit or stand in front of somebody and read the paragraph. And by the time I had read it, I mean everybody was lost and forgot what the [00:11:20.65] spk_0:
question was. [00:11:22.12] spk_1:
And so I learned right away that brevity is great. And then I started uh writing tighter questions and then um then I realized that [00:11:32.85] spk_0:
by [00:11:33.13] spk_1:
asking a single [00:11:34.89] spk_0:
open [00:12:19.99] spk_1:
ended question, I would only get so much information was like what’s one thing you’ve learned about leadership or what’s one thing you’ve learned about communication and then people would share. And that was really cool. But it would it would it would meander on and it was very hard to follow sometimes the plot and by asking people a three things question it adheres to the basic tenants of storytelling. It has a set up a conflict resolution, a beginning, middle and an end. So what I realized by asking people three things questions, it really makes all of us sound smarter because we’re able to consolidate our ideas in a very powerful form that is universally gettable and [00:12:20.27] spk_0:
you share something uh I don’t know, shocking, most interesting that uh clever that that you heard from all these thousands of folks. I love the idea of talking, I love the idea of just talking to strangers what [00:12:36.92] spk_1:
strangers are? My my favorite, I mean strangers, just that, [00:12:40.88] spk_0:
you [00:12:45.28] spk_1:
know, there’s, there’s um I guess the big takeaway frustrate, I’ll do to strangers and then I’ll talk about one of my latest three things interviews with, with legends. That [00:12:53.05] spk_0:
thing about [00:12:56.61] spk_1:
strangers is that I at the very core essence, I think of who we are as humans, we want to relate, we’re relating creatures and we’re just waiting for somebody to, to create the right [00:13:10.81] spk_0:
container [00:13:39.60] spk_1:
for us to share our heart with one another. And I really believe that. So I would walk up to some, the coldest or titus or frustrated people and I’d also walk up to some of the most joyous and bubbly people and both categories of folks, just when given the chance to really ask a sincere earnest question and because I genuinely want to learn from this person, all the societal fear kind of melts away quickly and people drop in and it was incredible to watch people that I’ve never met all of a sudden just start crying or tear up or be emotional about something. And it’s, it’s like, [00:13:57.20] spk_0:
um it’s [00:13:58.36] spk_1:
like medicine, I guess in a way, good medicine, I would walk by somebody and just be able to ask [00:14:04.27] spk_0:
them [00:14:05.15] spk_1:
question. It felt like they were waiting their whole life for somebody to ask them and then they would just jump in and deliver something that was poetic and impactful, um, share share, [00:14:18.01] spk_0:
share something [00:14:32.56] spk_1:
I interviewed uh this elder man, um That that was at a mechanic shop and uh and I said what are three things that inspire you to live and wonder? And [00:14:36.58] spk_0:
um the first [00:14:37.48] spk_1:
one he said was childbirth? Uh the second one is that he was in the back of his car with his daughter driving the car with his daughter and his daughter went into labor uh and then he had to stop the car and deliver the baby in the back of the car, which was really incredible. And then [00:14:58.52] spk_0:
then he [00:14:59.02] spk_1:
said family, [00:15:01.08] spk_0:
and [00:15:31.61] spk_1:
then he started to break down and cry because he and that daughter were estranged and they haven’t been speaking in years. And then then as this really amazing masculine man just, he cried and then you could just see on camera he’s just swallowing that pain and then just holding himself back into his body and then saying, Those are my three things. [00:15:34.13] spk_0:
It [00:15:34.30] spk_1:
just got back into composure, but it was, it was like in the moment watching it, it was we we call it an emotional burp. It just, it just popped up without like it just, it bubbled up out of him and he couldn’t control it, it was just a moment in time and we’ve had many of those. So that was that was extraordinary. [00:15:54.36] spk_0:
My [00:16:03.78] spk_1:
right now, one of, one of my interview guests Pat Simmons is out on the, he’s the he’s in the band called the Doobie Brothers and they just got inducted into the Music hall, [00:16:07.03] spk_0:
All [00:16:07.37] spk_1:
of their out on their 50th anniversary tour, selling out venues all around the world. Uh they’re incredible, he’s the guy that wrote the song, Oh Black Water keep on Rolling, Mississippi Moon, won’t [00:16:20.60] spk_0:
you keep [00:16:21.57] spk_1:
on shining right, he’s awesome. And I I interviewed him and I said, Pat, what are [00:16:26.68] spk_0:
three [00:16:36.14] spk_1:
things you’ve learned about songwriting? And he said, well number one, keep it simple. Number two, [00:16:37.89] spk_0:
write [00:16:43.75] spk_1:
about what, you know, Your own experience and three don’t bore [00:16:44.70] spk_0:
us get [00:16:49.46] spk_1:
to the chorus and I just thought man, that’s such a good lesson for all of us in communication and leadership and all that is just, you know, keep it simple. Talk about what you know, and don’t bore us get to the point, [00:17:21.86] spk_0:
how about your your speaking, you do a lot of you do a lot of key noting and other other types of speaking. What what what what do you love him? What do you love about that kind of work talking to big audiences? [00:17:55.70] spk_1:
You know what I like about talking to big audiences is Well, first it’s I I hold speaking with such reverence, you know, you know, even you and I right now I feel like the way I visualize what we’re doing is you and I are in a teepee right here, there’s a fire between us and you’re a chief and I’m a chief and and you have the talking stick and then you graciously give me the talking stick and we pass the talking stick back and forth and and I, I, whenever I’m invited to give a speech in front of a big audience, I feel like it is such an honor, I mean to, to, to be given the talking stick and to to be given time, I think that’s probably another thing that I value so much is [00:18:09.85] spk_0:
that [00:18:10.98] spk_1:
the one thing uh that after interviewing thousands of really successful, extraordinary people, the one thing, we don’t have enough of his time and we’re all fighting that clock and so I’m just so committed to not, not wasting people’s time. And so when somebody says, hey I want you to come and give a speech in front of an audience, it’s it’s a huge responsibility to make sure that I’m providing value because people are giving me [00:18:39.91] spk_0:
their time, [00:18:47.63] spk_1:
It’s a big, big, big, big request, so getting in front of an audience like that I find um uh intimidating, exhilarating, [00:18:50.72] spk_0:
um I [00:18:52.11] spk_1:
still get nervous backstage and then um I walk out there and [00:19:00.00] spk_0:
and [00:19:00.25] spk_1:
feel like you know, all the people that I’ve met interviewed, you know, jimmy carter billy, crystal Henry Winkler, Jack Canfield, my angelou on and on and on that, I feel like what gets me out there in front of all those people is I, I just visualize [00:19:19.75] spk_0:
all [00:19:20.20] spk_1:
these people that gave me their time knowing how precious time is. They gave me their time and shared their life lessons and their wisdom. And then I feel like I’m a conduit. I get bridged the gap. I get, I get to share all this wisdom that I’ve learned with an audience to help them on their journey [00:19:41.54] spk_0:
and and I think [00:19:42.86] spk_1:
that’s what pushes and drives me to do that. [00:20:49.41] spk_0:
It’s time for Tony’s take two. I saw on Twitter, the average attention span is nine seconds and I thought that’s enough time for my mother to create guilt. I’m coming over for dinner. Can’t you stay for the night? I’m coming to stay for the night. Can’t you stay for the weekend? I’m coming to stay for the weekend. Take me on a cruise. I’m taking you on a cruise. Can’t you move back home? I’m moving back home. Let’s get cemetery plots. I’ve been doing that bit recently to open webinars and I thought I would share it with you. It’s that simple. That is Tony’s take two. We’ve got boo koo but loads more time for Mr wake up excited. Go to bed fulfilled returns with Erik Sabiston. So you’re at both ends of the spectrum. You talked to individuals, strangers alone and you talked to big audiences thousands, I guess hundreds, at least write thousands of thousands of folks. You’re comfortable in both you and that was that was that [00:21:05.79] spk_1:
was one of my visions when I was in when I was growing up. I just, I I always thought [00:21:11.94] spk_0:
that that [00:21:29.13] spk_1:
one of the things that I wanted to be in my life and thought that this would bring my life joy and opportunity, pretty and adventure was to be the kind of person who can talk to everyone that that to me was really important. I remember uh watching the movie and reading the book Willy Wonka and there was for some reason it’s a very small detail, but it caught my attention as a child and that was the Wonka elevator. And when charlie gets in the elevator with Willy Wonka and and he says push any [00:21:52.83] spk_0:
button. [00:22:38.15] spk_1:
And because what’s magical about this elevator is that it doesn’t go up and down it goes anywhere you want to push it so you can push any button, it’ll take you there. And I remember that metaphor and I thought communication and language is so important and talking to people is a portal into everywhere. And so I can talk to people on the street that are strangers. I can talk to President of the United States, I can talk to rock stars. I can talk to people who are in the kitchen washing the dishes. The more people that I can talk to, the more fulfilling my life is uh, and and that’s been true for me. I’ve, I’ve really enjoyed meeting all kinds of people and they bring such uh uh laughter and levity in life to my journey. And I’m so grateful for that skill. And I wish everybody had that. I want everyone to have that skill where we remember that we’re relationship oriented and to, to, to risk talking to another because you never know where that conversation is gonna take you. [00:23:21.78] spk_0:
We’re relationship oriented. Yes, treating people like uh, simple golden rule a lot of times. It sounds cliche, but you know, to treat people like you’d like to be treated, you’d like to have them treat you. But uh, I see it lacking in so many corners of our culture that I don’t think it is, it’s not cliche. I think it’s, it’s relevant um relationship. [00:23:36.04] spk_1:
I just interviewed a a hospice nurse and [00:23:36.85] spk_0:
it was phenomenal [00:23:38.05] spk_1:
talking to [00:23:38.64] spk_0:
him. [00:23:39.62] spk_1:
And one of the things I’ve been a hospice nurse, his job is to [00:23:42.65] spk_0:
help shepherd [00:23:44.27] spk_1:
people, you know, that are dying uh [00:23:47.47] spk_0:
to [00:23:47.68] spk_1:
the next next place, you know, and [00:23:49.79] spk_0:
and and help the families to help [00:24:08.55] spk_1:
all of it. Yeah. And it was really cool. I said what’s the greatest lesson? You know, I’d ask them three things questions and right now I’m not thinking, I can’t remember the first two, but I remember the third point and that was that he was saying that that the golden rule, [00:24:11.74] spk_0:
he said was [00:24:17.15] spk_1:
a rule that he believes is outdated. And I thought, whoa, that’s pretty strong statement, the golden rule of studying world religions. Every world religion has some version of the golden rule written in their sacred transcripts that is do onto others as you would like done unto you. And that’s been a big guiding principle that many of us have been taught throughout our lives. And it’s it’s a it’s a great guiding principle [00:24:43.49] spk_0:
and he [00:24:43.92] spk_1:
was saying that it’s outdated and even Assumpta tiv and I thought wow this is bold, what do you mean by that? And he said, look I’m here helping people that are dying and if I do onto them as I would like done unto me, I might put a pillow underneath their knees or I might grab a cloth [00:25:03.75] spk_0:
and [00:25:36.11] spk_1:
put it on there because I think wow, this is what I would want, I want to, you know, a cold cloth on my forehead and what he’s learned is what he’s calling the platinum rule which is to do onto others is they would like done unto them that way. It’s not presumptive, it’s not, it’s not, it’s not me thinking I know what’s best for you. It’s me actually taking time to check in with you and say, hey how can I be of service to you and then offer that value? I thought that was really insightful. So given Given given no no rule where there’s takers and people that are not cool, okay, I like having the golden rule as as a good guide post and then I think if we’re thinking about advanced leadership and communication skills, I like this idea of the platinum rule doing onto others as they would like done unto them. I think that if we get more into that realm uh then we’re really uh building a very cooperative and caring society. [00:26:08.74] spk_0:
Are you a musician? Eric play an instrument? I do [00:26:09.77] spk_1:
love music. What do you play? [00:26:13.21] spk_0:
You [00:26:13.39] spk_1:
know I play uh I play the guitar, the drums, uh the shaker. Uh I always thought it’d be fun. You know all these cool people start all my friends that are rock stars, you know they they’re a lead guitarist and they start a band or they could even be the bass players, start the band, maybe even a drummer that starts the band. But I always thought I wanted to be the guy that started the band being the egg shaker. [00:26:37.09] spk_0:
I [00:26:37.15] spk_1:
always thought that’d be a that I thought that’d be a fun way to start a band. What do you do? I’m the egg shaker. [00:26:42.49] spk_0:
Is the shaker. Is that the is that the instrument? That’s wood and has all the beads around it. Is that the shaker? [00:26:48.26] spk_1:
Yeah there’s so many different, yeah there’s so so many different versions, you know I just [00:26:57.13] spk_0:
hold it a little closer hold it closer to the mic when you play your [00:26:59.81] spk_1:
shaker. [00:27:04.91] spk_0:
Yeah like [00:27:05.32] spk_1:
that that’s a shake [00:27:07.32] spk_0:
is your guitar very far away. [00:27:11.29] spk_1:
Yeah that’s not near me at this [00:27:12.75] spk_0:
moment [00:27:15.62] spk_1:
itself on music. You know you know, one thing I, one thing about music is [00:27:19.76] spk_0:
it [00:27:58.54] spk_1:
really is the universal language is the guy that studies language and, and wants to connect with people. Uh, it’s, it’s, we were in Morocco and just rolled up in the, in the souks there and some Moroccan guys playing guitar and singing, which you know, I don’t even know what he’s singing and uh, you know, Sarah and I are walking by and I have a shaker in my bag and all of a sudden just stop getting next to him and start shaking and all of a sudden there’s a crowd of people and we’re making music together and smiling and laughing and hugging and it’s just, it’s, it really is. It’s uh, I think the two universal most powerful things we, we can do is smile. I think smiling is a universal language that transcends everything and, and welcomes people in. And I think uh, singing and playing music is another one that just creates community instantly. [00:28:16.51] spk_0:
Know what I love about smiles. Even through the pandemic when everybody was masked, you could tell if somebody was smiling at you. [00:28:25.16] spk_1:
Yeah, the eyes, [00:28:35.27] spk_0:
the eyes get a little squinty and you could just, and maybe they wrinkle a little bit around their temples and the face exposed enough of the smile around the, around the mask that you could tell when people were smiling at you. I always like that. [00:28:44.62] spk_1:
Me too. That’s a sweet visual, [00:28:54.55] spk_0:
You’ve done some work with nonprofits for nonprofits. What what’s, what’s been the impact of that work [00:28:58.23] spk_1:
on you? [00:28:59.10] spk_0:
You on, on you, not on the nonprofits, on, on eric [00:29:20.33] spk_1:
on me. I, you know, I started so young. I’m really grateful for my family having a value of service. And yeah, I started really young volunteering for camp and then volunteered for the special olympics being a coach. And then [00:29:25.37] spk_0:
when I [00:29:26.21] spk_1:
was in college, I ran the volunteer center, got invited to [00:29:31.25] spk_0:
carry [00:29:32.05] spk_1:
the olympic torch. Uh, ended up becoming [00:29:36.13] spk_0:
a vista [00:29:42.99] spk_1:
volunteer, which is like the current AmeriCorps volunteer. Um, yeah, you know, I think, I think the, [00:29:46.22] spk_0:
the big [00:29:53.72] spk_1:
takeaway for volunteerism for me is that beautiful adage. Today I met a man [00:29:55.37] spk_0:
who [00:29:56.00] spk_1:
had no shoes and he complained [00:29:59.84] spk_0:
until [00:30:23.51] spk_1:
he met a man who had no feet and I think that has been such an impact for me that just being in the volunteer community. Uh, it works on so many cylinders, you know, to, to be of service, to make a difference to remember how grateful I am for my life and all the blessings that I have. Um, [00:30:24.54] spk_0:
it’s, [00:30:43.59] spk_1:
it’s, it’s meaningful work. It’s just, it feels so meaningful And um, you know, that’s a big thing I learned on the farm. The farm culture is, is, uh, we always talk about the difference between consuming and contributing, You know, that’s a great question to ask. Are we consuming more than we’re [00:30:47.68] spk_0:
contributing? And [00:30:49.20] spk_1:
we’ve become a very consuming culture? Give me give me take, I want I need this is my right, this is and and all that is, [00:30:58.66] spk_0:
it [00:30:58.84] spk_1:
doesn’t bring us closer and it doesn’t build [00:31:02.28] spk_0:
um cooperation [00:31:17.40] spk_1:
or inspire civility. It’s it’s it’s the opposite. And I think if we walk around in our lives showing up anywhere in our lives and ask ourselves this question, how can I help? [00:31:20.26] spk_0:
And that [00:31:21.28] spk_1:
uh is just a beautiful question just to ask, how can I help? How can I help in this moment? How can I help in this moment? How can I help in this moment and to be people that are of service always. So I for me, I think probably now I I’ve conflated, I don’t see myself volunteering anymore. I don’t, I just see myself being of service everywhere. I can [00:31:53.76] spk_0:
you do a lot of executive coaching too. And so how do you how do you see yourself in service to, to those folks? [00:31:57.31] spk_1:
You know, my executive coaching career started [00:31:59.74] spk_0:
with [00:32:08.47] spk_1:
not I was studying speech communication in college and emphasis on leadership and one of my assignments early was I had, I had worked with the United Way in SAN Diego at the time and [00:32:17.12] spk_0:
the [00:32:17.46] spk_1:
Ceo, the guy was running the United Way there in SAN Diego I had offered as one of my thesis papers to do a communication audit [00:32:27.81] spk_0:
with him [00:33:20.12] spk_1:
and that was the beginning of my journey where I went in and I interviewed and studied the Ceo and asked him what was his mission, what was his vision, what are his guiding principles, what are his commitments, what are his values? And then identified essentially what his um rudder was to his boat uh and what his, his, what what what pushes and what pushed and drove him to be who he was, what was the sum total of his character. And then we figured that out. And then I created a survey that would then go test who he says. He was like the assignment for me is to to make sure that what we’re saying and who were being is in alignment. And so I got a chance to go interview his wife, go interview, his colleagues, go interview people on the board, go interview his son and then be able to go check [00:33:30.26] spk_0:
in [00:33:31.03] spk_1:
and go, okay, this is what this person says they value and then what’s [00:33:35.15] spk_0:
the experience [00:33:36.97] spk_1:
that people who are in that person’s life have of them and is what they’re saying about who they are in alignment with what people’s experience of them are. And it was absolutely fascinating to be able to go come back and report back to this person the blind spots in their life. That’s one of the things that I’ve learned so much by talking to wise people is [00:33:59.49] spk_0:
that there [00:34:49.59] spk_1:
is what we know, there’s what we don’t know and then there’s what we don’t know, we don’t even know it because we don’t even know it. And it’s that blind spot that we don’t know is the thing that will trip us, prevent us from getting the promotion, will have the husband or wife wake up one morning and say I’m leaving. It’s it’s just it’s the part of us that we just I can’t see who I am to you. I can only I’ve got my own perception of who I am. I’ve got my values, I’ve got my principles, I think I’m being this particular way. I convince myself of being this particular way and then I walk through the world. And if I the only way for me to get access to this quadrant of what I don’t know, I don’t even know, I don’t even know it is to be able to to ask others to contribute. And um that reminds me of one of my early interviews with the president of coca cola Donald Keogh who and I you know the most powerful ceo in the world with the most recognizable brand in the world. And I had asked him what separates those who achieve from those who do not. And [00:35:05.68] spk_0:
uh he [00:35:06.85] spk_1:
said what separates those who achieve from those who do not is in direct proportion to one’s ability to ask others [00:35:12.74] spk_0:
friends [00:35:51.81] spk_1:
help. And I’ve always thought that was just so significant. We’re a culture that that is afraid to ask for help or we think asking for help is a sign of weakness and it’s actually a sign of strength. And this exercise is asking the people in our lives for help to give us feedback on what what’s their experience of me? I know that you know with my romantic partners there, you know, um I can tell her all day long, I love you. I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you. But it doesn’t really matter that I’m telling her I love her. What matters is what’s her experience of me and is her experience of being loved by me. And that’s what this exercise does is it gets it taps into the experience that other people have, not just what I believe it is. And so these that was the beginning of my coaching journey where now I’ve done thousands of them and recommended to everyone, every executive or anybody that’s listening to this [00:36:08.80] spk_0:
podcast. All [00:36:32.90] spk_1:
of us can use a linguistic chiropractic adjustment from time to time and uh have have opportunity to just check in check in about who we are, what we are. What are the principles, What are the values, What are the the beliefs that we’ve been carrying that govern our lives? And let’s just check in and make sure that they’re still relevant that we didn’t inherit them from people that we don’t really actually value any more. Their outdated get really clear about who we are and what we stand for and then let’s go test that. Let’s go, let’s go talk to people in our lives to give us feedback. And what we talk about in my coaching clients is that language is either in the on position [00:36:49.27] spk_0:
or [00:36:51.41] spk_1:
the off position and we want to switch our switches from the off position to the on and this communication audit definitely gives us a chance to a get access to our blind spots, be able to then recognize that they’re there and then choose powerfully to switch them from a negative place to [00:37:09.35] spk_0:
a place [00:37:11.00] spk_1:
that serves us better. [00:38:21.14] spk_0:
It’s the gap between our own perception of ourselves and others perceptions of us. That is what it is, what it sounds like and uh, that, that quote from the ceo of co coco of coca cola that uh, the ability of one to succeed is in direct proportion uh, with their ability to ask for help. I, I put that in a nonprofit radio sizzle reel uh, kind of a teaser reel because I, I think it’s such a simple bit of wisdom. Um, and it was gleaned from your hundreds of interviews on the, in the VW microbus journey, which is, which we talked about a couple of months ago and which of course is chronicled in the film, the journey. Uh, so I, that that bit of wisdom has stayed with me since we first met in 2000, whatever it was 10 or 11 or something like something like that. Um the ability of the ability to ask for help, you [00:38:21.94] spk_1:
know, as a, as a, as an entrepreneur, it helped [00:38:25.83] spk_0:
me, you [00:38:26.02] spk_1:
know, I have been able [00:38:27.79] spk_0:
to, to [00:38:28.77] spk_1:
make things in the world [00:38:31.30] spk_0:
that [00:38:35.38] spk_1:
essentially, I’m not supposed to have made [00:38:36.50] spk_0:
them because [00:38:37.69] spk_1:
I don’t have the skills to do [00:38:40.65] spk_0:
it. [00:38:41.62] spk_1:
And I think that’s what prevents so many people from accomplishing [00:38:46.37] spk_0:
uh is that [00:38:48.07] spk_1:
People wake up one morning and say, I’m [00:38:50.30] spk_0:
gonna, [00:38:51.27] spk_1:
I’m compelled, [00:38:52.86] spk_0:
then I’m [00:38:53.25] spk_1:
gonna go do this thing, I’m gonna eradicate this injustice, I’m gonna go write [00:38:58.38] spk_0:
this [00:38:58.92] spk_1:
book, I’m gonna make this movie, I’m I’m gonna go do something really extraordinary. And after the initial buzz of making that declaration, they go tell some of their community [00:39:10.50] spk_0:
about it. [00:39:11.18] spk_1:
And then their community out of love says, oh, you want to do that thing. Well, [00:39:18.07] spk_0:
did [00:39:19.38] spk_1:
you study [00:39:19.97] spk_0:
that? [00:39:22.34] spk_1:
No, Oh then you probably can’t do that, or you know, do you have a bunch of money? No, you [00:39:29.49] spk_0:
probably [00:39:30.41] spk_1:
can’t do that. And you know, for my, my, I studied speech communication and I was telling people, I was going to make a film and they’re like, well, [00:39:38.67] spk_0:
did [00:39:41.43] spk_1:
you go to film school? No, well [00:39:42.88] spk_0:
then you can’t [00:39:46.04] spk_1:
make a movie then. And so there’s a lot of people that will [00:39:48.75] spk_0:
put a lot of [00:40:01.50] spk_1:
doubt and insecurity in somebody’s vision because their, their credentials or at the time that they’re talking about, it doesn’t match what it is that they want to make. And this idea of asking for help is just it’s it’s a bright light and a dark world. It just it’s a it’s a it’s a compass that that that gives somebody a chance to move from one place to the next. And that is that I was able to [00:40:17.85] spk_0:
make, take a [00:40:18.21] spk_1:
movie and not only make a movie, I was lucky to make an award winning film that has touched and inspired millions of people around the world and because I was willing to ask [00:40:27.33] spk_0:
for help, [00:40:37.31] spk_1:
that was the only reason why it happened. I had a good vision. I knew my story, I was willing to do the work. And the only way to make a movie at that time for me was to enroll Disney and to enroll Billy Crystal and Roland Jaffe was an Academy Award winning director, took me under his wing and it buys me and Henry Winkler, you know, the great actor and Fons and producer and director I had and and Michael Greer, who is an award winning editor, edited the film and [00:40:57.29] spk_0:
so [00:41:32.89] spk_1:
many people helped me make it into an awesome film. I’m I’m just 11 guy, but it took a whole village to make it happen. And if I wasn’t willing to ask for help, it would have never happened. And so that’s why I think it’s so profound is that anything you and I and and the listeners we want to create in our lives. It really comes down to having a clear vision of what it is we want and then go seek out people, why is smarter uh and ask for help. And I’ve discovered that that people [00:41:34.07] spk_0:
want to help [00:41:35.56] spk_1:
people find value and joy and their life’s purpose gets illuminated when there’s an opportunity for them to contribute and help. Another [00:42:03.17] spk_0:
eric’s Epperson is keynote speaker, leadership and communication coach. He’s got that award winning film, the journey. You’ll find it all at eric Sapper Stone dot com Erica. Thank you very much again. What a pleasure! What a pleasure! [00:42:07.65] spk_1:
You know, a rising tide lifts all boats. Thank you so much. I was a privilege to be here on your show. It’s a privilege to be your friend and I know you all these years and I’m grateful that we get to stay connected uh and and uh and and keep keep popping back into each other’s life, [00:43:08.20] spk_0:
genuine pleasure indeed. Thank you very much ERic Next week. Inflection points in your non profits growth with Brooke richie Babbage! If you missed any part of this week’s show, I Beseech you find it at tony-martignetti dot com. Our creative producer is Claire Meyerhoff shows social media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our web guy and this music is by scott stein, Thank you for that. Affirmation Scotty B with me next week for nonprofit radio big nonprofit ideas for the other 95%, go out and be great.
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[00:02:10.54] spk_0:
Hello and welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio big nonprofit ideas for the other 95% I’m your aptly named host of your favorite abdominal podcast. Oh I’m glad you’re with me, I’d be thrown into encyclopedia Fauria if I saw that you missed this week’s show. Mr wake up excited, go to bed fulfilled returns. I had to have Eric Sapperstein back after the October 17, 2022 show with him. I got more positive comments than I remember for any guest this time around. He shares how important non profit volunteering has been in his life, The joy he gets from coaching what he’s learned from his series, three things and more on tony steak to guilt here is mr wake up excited, go to bed fulfilled returns. What a pleasure to welcome back Erik Sabiston to non profit radio there were so many comments the last time he was here just a couple of months ago that I had to have him back. He’s in such high demand though that I couldn’t get him back as soon as I wanted him back but he’s very gracious and he is back and I’m very glad he’s Erik Sabiston, he wants to know if you’re waking up excited and going to bed fulfilled. He’s successful Meeting magazine’s top keynote speaker, executive leadership and communication coach, director of the award winning film the journey which is in my carefully curated DVD collection. I don’t just let any movie in there. He’s also the best selling book, live in wonder. He’s host of the hit series three things which we’re gonna talk about and you’ll find him all at eric Sapper Stone dot com. Welcome back my friend,
uh tony Such a treat to be back. Thank [00:02:33.95] spk_0:
you. I’m glad you are. I know our listeners are uh folks, folks loved your, your appearance a couple of months ago and uh how to have you back to talk a little more Aloha, you remind, just reminding folks, you’re, you’re in Hawaii on a farm where, where in Hawaii, [00:02:41.73] spk_1:
I live in Maui Hawaii and uh I live um [00:02:48.35] spk_0:
I [00:02:48.57] spk_1:
like to tell people I live in the, where the garden of Eden meets Willy Wonka [00:02:54.32] spk_0:
and why is that? Where’s [00:02:56.03] spk_1:
the Willy Wonka? [00:02:57.84] spk_0:
I [00:03:25.09] spk_1:
live in the most remote part of Maui on 100 and 80 acre organic farm with just uh it’s a food forest essentially, so we can walk around and there’s papayas and there’s mangoes and there’s lychee and there’s Ramadan and there’s coconuts and there’s just so much food and so it’s, it’s like the garden of Eden. We, you know, we have waterfalls and then, and then we can walk around and, and and pick something right off off the tree and it’s like, wow, these snows, berries take like taste like raspberries and it’s just, it’s just, you know that, that’s the Willy Wonka part is just being able to walk around and just pick incredible, unique fruit right off the right off the land and put it in your mouth and it’s just, it’s magical. [00:03:59.53] spk_0:
Alright, I’m visiting, I’m visiting. Uh let’s start off with what we wrapped up with the last time we did, we uh we were talking about your your your three things, your three things series, Where’s that stand? What’s going on with that? [00:04:09.19] spk_1:
You know, thank you for asking. You know, the three things has been a real um uh like I said, I would say my new journey, my first journey was bridging the gap between young people and elders and calling up really wise people when I was in my [00:04:17.50] spk_0:
twenties [00:04:20.89] spk_1:
And that led my 30s. And then now I’ve been thinking about, well I guess this is a kind of a funny story when I was on the Today [00:04:25.95] spk_0:
show [00:04:27.07] spk_1:
promoting my movie [00:04:28.98] spk_0:
uh when I was on the Today Show and then there was Good Morning America. Uh then there was then it was morning joe and of course I did uh I did Rachel, you know, he just Rachel, I did Rachel, I did Lawrence, you know? [00:05:37.89] spk_1:
Uh well I was just saying when I was on the Today Show and uh my parents had watched the segment and my father had said, you know, it seemed like you were on there for a long time, you know, that was that was a pretty long segment, how long were you on there? And I said I was on there, I think six minutes in total. And my dad said, oh you better start thinking about how you want to spend your other nine minutes of your 15 minutes of fame. And so I’ve been thinking about those nine minutes a lot and that is the the the evolution of the I guess the the opportunity for me to step out again into the international stage here is um things and it’s been so fun. We started off, it’s been an organic process, I think I started three things maybe 11 years ago where I started interviewing people um [00:05:41.99] spk_0:
strangers [00:05:43.21] spk_1:
and walking around and we travel around the world and I’d walk up to strangers on the street corner and to say excuse me, can I come up and talk [00:05:49.45] spk_0:
to you? [00:06:28.63] spk_1:
And that was always really exciting just to walk up to strangers and uh and see if we couldn’t befriend them and then some people would be a know that many people were yeses and then we would put a camera on them and I’d ask them a series of questions that were three things questions at that time. It was really centered around uh what are three things your father taught you or what are three things your mother taught you or what are three things that you share with your younger self or what are three things you’ve learned about communication or just random questions that I would ask people and they would drop in and share these really poignant heartfelt. Uh we were we were we were doing it before humans of new york, but it was very much like that idea of just dropping into the humanity of people [00:06:38.69] spk_0:
and that [00:06:57.00] spk_1:
we did. We’ve got uh we’ve got thousands of interviews and I think we’re gonna turn that into an art exhibit and interactive art exhibit at some point. Uh and then that evolved into we had a wonder summit uh in san Diego, where we brought 65 people from around the world to come together for this uh weekend party, which was caused creative night, more wonder in each other’s lives. And as an opening for that experience, we we had all our friends, we took three things questions and we put them in a little hat and we had everybody [00:07:11.00] spk_0:
pick a [00:07:31.07] spk_1:
three things question out of the hat. And uh and then as a as a as an exercise for the for the weekend, everybody was was charged with the opportunity to go talk to everyone at the event and ask them their three things question. So if your question was, what are what are three things you’ve learned from making the mistakes? Uh and my question could be, what are three things I’ve learned about getting lost. Uh and then I’d go ask everybody my question. You go ask everybody your question throughout the entire weekend. Then at the end we had a closing circle and then [00:07:48.22] spk_0:
everybody, they [00:08:15.58] spk_1:
got a chance to share what their question was and what they learned from asking 65 people. Uh and and it was phenomenal. Everybody gave many ted talks about leadership, communication, intimacy, relationships and everybody got to share because they got to poll all these, the collective wisdom of everybody that was there and then share the commonalities, which was phenomenal. And then, um, uh, the pandemic happened and I was just prior to the pandemic, I was working on a series called Legends by the Fire, where I was interviewing iconic legends by a campfire. We had interviewed steven Tyler from Aerosmith and Weird Al Yankovic, who just got uh, got a movie out that’s doing really well. Uh, and we interviewed Kenny Rogers, I’m a big music guy. So we interviewed these guys as pilots, [00:08:41.97] spk_0:
essentially [00:09:13.57] spk_1:
before he died. And it was awesome. And then the pandemic hit, and when the pandemic hit, you know, that that idea kind of fizzled on the, on the fizzled out. And then zoom happened as you know? And with zoom technology, it was incredible. I can zoom out and speak to people all around the world. And so I just pivoted and started calling up really extraordinary visionaries and pioneers and champions of industry and asking them a three things question. So we’ve created a series that’s really designed to extrapolate wisdom quickly from extraordinary people and that’s what we’ve been doing. And it’s been phenomenal. We’ve interviewed so many incredible people? And we’re coming out with our first season at the end of this quarter, [00:09:28.84] spk_0:
what what’s a uh, what’s a Sapper Stone take away from all these thousands of three question interviews, What what have you, what have you gleaned about strangers? [00:09:43.79] spk_1:
You know, it’s so fun. I won, I’m an optimist and I’m able to [00:09:49.55] spk_0:
talk [00:09:50.25] spk_1:
to people and just reassure them, create a safe space. [00:09:56.30] spk_0:
Are you, I gotta ask you, are you, are you optimistic at the beginning of every new year? [00:10:06.49] spk_1:
You know, I’m about domestic every day, the new year. The new year doesn’t really matter to me much, You know, I’m not a new year guy, I’m not a holiday guy, I’m not, I’m not to me every day [00:10:15.38] spk_0:
and [00:10:15.94] spk_1:
I know it may sound like a platitude, but I, you know, I grew up, my father, my father had a stroke when he was 20 [00:10:21.83] spk_0:
eight [00:10:22.59] spk_1:
and he was, [00:10:23.95] spk_0:
he, yeah, [00:10:48.11] spk_1:
he was the main breadwinner in my family and a superstar. And when, when he lost his ability to be himself in the way he envisioned himself to be and became bitter and angry. It just as a, as a child growing up in that environment, it just, it taught me to live every day, like it’s my last and so I’ve just, I’ve been doing that for so long. Um, yeah, I, I think that’s, that’s a big part of it. So I’m I’m an optimist by nature and I think one of the, I guess, what have I learned from asking people three things questions, [00:10:58.27] spk_0:
I [00:10:59.04] spk_1:
think as a guy who has been a professional interviewer and and has has has conducted thousands of interviews at the beginning. [00:11:07.87] spk_0:
I [00:11:08.11] spk_1:
would write really elaborate questions uh paragraphs and then sit or stand in front of somebody and read the paragraph. And by the time I had read it, I mean everybody was lost and forgot what the [00:11:20.65] spk_0:
question was. [00:11:22.12] spk_1:
And so I learned right away that brevity is great. And then I started uh writing tighter questions and then um then I realized that [00:11:32.85] spk_0:
by [00:11:33.13] spk_1:
asking a single [00:11:34.89] spk_0:
open [00:12:19.99] spk_1:
ended question, I would only get so much information was like what’s one thing you’ve learned about leadership or what’s one thing you’ve learned about communication and then people would share. And that was really cool. But it would it would it would meander on and it was very hard to follow sometimes the plot and by asking people a three things question it adheres to the basic tenants of storytelling. It has a set up a conflict resolution, a beginning, middle and an end. So what I realized by asking people three things questions, it really makes all of us sound smarter because we’re able to consolidate our ideas in a very powerful form that is universally gettable and [00:12:20.27] spk_0:
you share something uh I don’t know, shocking, most interesting that uh clever that that you heard from all these thousands of folks. I love the idea of talking, I love the idea of just talking to strangers what [00:12:36.92] spk_1:
strangers are? My my favorite, I mean strangers, just that, [00:12:40.88] spk_0:
you [00:12:45.28] spk_1:
know, there’s, there’s um I guess the big takeaway frustrate, I’ll do to strangers and then I’ll talk about one of my latest three things interviews with, with legends. That [00:12:53.05] spk_0:
thing about [00:12:56.61] spk_1:
strangers is that I at the very core essence, I think of who we are as humans, we want to relate, we’re relating creatures and we’re just waiting for somebody to, to create the right [00:13:10.81] spk_0:
container [00:13:39.60] spk_1:
for us to share our heart with one another. And I really believe that. So I would walk up to some, the coldest or titus or frustrated people and I’d also walk up to some of the most joyous and bubbly people and both categories of folks, just when given the chance to really ask a sincere earnest question and because I genuinely want to learn from this person, all the societal fear kind of melts away quickly and people drop in and it was incredible to watch people that I’ve never met all of a sudden just start crying or tear up or be emotional about something. And it’s, it’s like, [00:13:57.20] spk_0:
um it’s [00:13:58.36] spk_1:
like medicine, I guess in a way, good medicine, I would walk by somebody and just be able to ask [00:14:04.27] spk_0:
them [00:14:05.15] spk_1:
question. It felt like they were waiting their whole life for somebody to ask them and then they would just jump in and deliver something that was poetic and impactful, um, share share, [00:14:18.01] spk_0:
share something [00:14:32.56] spk_1:
I interviewed uh this elder man, um That that was at a mechanic shop and uh and I said what are three things that inspire you to live and wonder? And [00:14:36.58] spk_0:
um the first [00:14:37.48] spk_1:
one he said was childbirth? Uh the second one is that he was in the back of his car with his daughter driving the car with his daughter and his daughter went into labor uh and then he had to stop the car and deliver the baby in the back of the car, which was really incredible. And then [00:14:58.52] spk_0:
then he [00:14:59.02] spk_1:
said family, [00:15:01.08] spk_0:
and [00:15:31.61] spk_1:
then he started to break down and cry because he and that daughter were estranged and they haven’t been speaking in years. And then then as this really amazing masculine man just, he cried and then you could just see on camera he’s just swallowing that pain and then just holding himself back into his body and then saying, Those are my three things. [00:15:34.13] spk_0:
It [00:15:34.30] spk_1:
just got back into composure, but it was, it was like in the moment watching it, it was we we call it an emotional burp. It just, it just popped up without like it just, it bubbled up out of him and he couldn’t control it, it was just a moment in time and we’ve had many of those. So that was that was extraordinary. [00:15:54.36] spk_0:
My [00:16:03.78] spk_1:
right now, one of, one of my interview guests Pat Simmons is out on the, he’s the he’s in the band called the Doobie Brothers and they just got inducted into the Music hall, [00:16:07.03] spk_0:
All [00:16:07.37] spk_1:
of their out on their 50th anniversary tour, selling out venues all around the world. Uh they’re incredible, he’s the guy that wrote the song, Oh Black Water keep on Rolling, Mississippi Moon, won’t [00:16:20.60] spk_0:
you keep [00:16:21.57] spk_1:
on shining right, he’s awesome. And I I interviewed him and I said, Pat, what are [00:16:26.68] spk_0:
three [00:16:36.14] spk_1:
things you’ve learned about songwriting? And he said, well number one, keep it simple. Number two, [00:16:37.89] spk_0:
write [00:16:43.75] spk_1:
about what, you know, Your own experience and three don’t bore [00:16:44.70] spk_0:
us get [00:16:49.46] spk_1:
to the chorus and I just thought man, that’s such a good lesson for all of us in communication and leadership and all that is just, you know, keep it simple. Talk about what you know, and don’t bore us get to the point, [00:17:21.86] spk_0:
how about your your speaking, you do a lot of you do a lot of key noting and other other types of speaking. What what what what do you love him? What do you love about that kind of work talking to big audiences? [00:17:55.70] spk_1:
You know what I like about talking to big audiences is Well, first it’s I I hold speaking with such reverence, you know, you know, even you and I right now I feel like the way I visualize what we’re doing is you and I are in a teepee right here, there’s a fire between us and you’re a chief and I’m a chief and and you have the talking stick and then you graciously give me the talking stick and we pass the talking stick back and forth and and I, I, whenever I’m invited to give a speech in front of a big audience, I feel like it is such an honor, I mean to, to, to be given the talking stick and to to be given time, I think that’s probably another thing that I value so much is [00:18:09.85] spk_0:
that [00:18:10.98] spk_1:
the one thing uh that after interviewing thousands of really successful, extraordinary people, the one thing, we don’t have enough of his time and we’re all fighting that clock and so I’m just so committed to not, not wasting people’s time. And so when somebody says, hey I want you to come and give a speech in front of an audience, it’s it’s a huge responsibility to make sure that I’m providing value because people are giving me [00:18:39.91] spk_0:
their time, [00:18:47.63] spk_1:
It’s a big, big, big, big request, so getting in front of an audience like that I find um uh intimidating, exhilarating, [00:18:50.72] spk_0:
um I [00:18:52.11] spk_1:
still get nervous backstage and then um I walk out there and [00:19:00.00] spk_0:
and [00:19:00.25] spk_1:
feel like you know, all the people that I’ve met interviewed, you know, jimmy carter billy, crystal Henry Winkler, Jack Canfield, my angelou on and on and on that, I feel like what gets me out there in front of all those people is I, I just visualize [00:19:19.75] spk_0:
all [00:19:20.20] spk_1:
these people that gave me their time knowing how precious time is. They gave me their time and shared their life lessons and their wisdom. And then I feel like I’m a conduit. I get bridged the gap. I get, I get to share all this wisdom that I’ve learned with an audience to help them on their journey [00:19:41.54] spk_0:
and and I think [00:19:42.86] spk_1:
that’s what pushes and drives me to do that. [00:20:49.41] spk_0:
It’s time for Tony’s take two. I saw on Twitter, the average attention span is nine seconds and I thought that’s enough time for my mother to create guilt. I’m coming over for dinner. Can’t you stay for the night? I’m coming to stay for the night. Can’t you stay for the weekend? I’m coming to stay for the weekend. Take me on a cruise. I’m taking you on a cruise. Can’t you move back home? I’m moving back home. Let’s get cemetery plots. I’ve been doing that bit recently to open webinars and I thought I would share it with you. It’s that simple. That is Tony’s take two. We’ve got boo koo but loads more time for Mr wake up excited. Go to bed fulfilled returns with Erik Sabiston. So you’re at both ends of the spectrum. You talked to individuals, strangers alone and you talked to big audiences thousands, I guess hundreds, at least write thousands of thousands of folks. You’re comfortable in both you and that was that was that [00:21:05.79] spk_1:
was one of my visions when I was in when I was growing up. I just, I I always thought [00:21:11.94] spk_0:
that that [00:21:29.13] spk_1:
one of the things that I wanted to be in my life and thought that this would bring my life joy and opportunity, pretty and adventure was to be the kind of person who can talk to everyone that that to me was really important. I remember uh watching the movie and reading the book Willy Wonka and there was for some reason it’s a very small detail, but it caught my attention as a child and that was the Wonka elevator. And when charlie gets in the elevator with Willy Wonka and and he says push any [00:21:52.83] spk_0:
button. [00:22:38.15] spk_1:
And because what’s magical about this elevator is that it doesn’t go up and down it goes anywhere you want to push it so you can push any button, it’ll take you there. And I remember that metaphor and I thought communication and language is so important and talking to people is a portal into everywhere. And so I can talk to people on the street that are strangers. I can talk to President of the United States, I can talk to rock stars. I can talk to people who are in the kitchen washing the dishes. The more people that I can talk to, the more fulfilling my life is uh, and and that’s been true for me. I’ve, I’ve really enjoyed meeting all kinds of people and they bring such uh uh laughter and levity in life to my journey. And I’m so grateful for that skill. And I wish everybody had that. I want everyone to have that skill where we remember that we’re relationship oriented and to, to, to risk talking to another because you never know where that conversation is gonna take you. [00:23:21.78] spk_0:
We’re relationship oriented. Yes, treating people like uh, simple golden rule a lot of times. It sounds cliche, but you know, to treat people like you’d like to be treated, you’d like to have them treat you. But uh, I see it lacking in so many corners of our culture that I don’t think it is, it’s not cliche. I think it’s, it’s relevant um relationship. [00:23:36.04] spk_1:
I just interviewed a a hospice nurse and [00:23:36.85] spk_0:
it was phenomenal [00:23:38.05] spk_1:
talking to [00:23:38.64] spk_0:
him. [00:23:39.62] spk_1:
And one of the things I’ve been a hospice nurse, his job is to [00:23:42.65] spk_0:
help shepherd [00:23:44.27] spk_1:
people, you know, that are dying uh [00:23:47.47] spk_0:
to [00:23:47.68] spk_1:
the next next place, you know, and [00:23:49.79] spk_0:
and and help the families to help [00:24:08.55] spk_1:
all of it. Yeah. And it was really cool. I said what’s the greatest lesson? You know, I’d ask them three things questions and right now I’m not thinking, I can’t remember the first two, but I remember the third point and that was that he was saying that that the golden rule, [00:24:11.74] spk_0:
he said was [00:24:17.15] spk_1:
a rule that he believes is outdated. And I thought, whoa, that’s pretty strong statement, the golden rule of studying world religions. Every world religion has some version of the golden rule written in their sacred transcripts that is do onto others as you would like done unto you. And that’s been a big guiding principle that many of us have been taught throughout our lives. And it’s it’s a it’s a great guiding principle [00:24:43.49] spk_0:
and he [00:24:43.92] spk_1:
was saying that it’s outdated and even Assumpta tiv and I thought wow this is bold, what do you mean by that? And he said, look I’m here helping people that are dying and if I do onto them as I would like done unto me, I might put a pillow underneath their knees or I might grab a cloth [00:25:03.75] spk_0:
and [00:25:36.11] spk_1:
put it on there because I think wow, this is what I would want, I want to, you know, a cold cloth on my forehead and what he’s learned is what he’s calling the platinum rule which is to do onto others is they would like done unto them that way. It’s not presumptive, it’s not, it’s not, it’s not me thinking I know what’s best for you. It’s me actually taking time to check in with you and say, hey how can I be of service to you and then offer that value? I thought that was really insightful. So given Given given no no rule where there’s takers and people that are not cool, okay, I like having the golden rule as as a good guide post and then I think if we’re thinking about advanced leadership and communication skills, I like this idea of the platinum rule doing onto others as they would like done unto them. I think that if we get more into that realm uh then we’re really uh building a very cooperative and caring society. [00:26:08.74] spk_0:
Are you a musician? Eric play an instrument? I do [00:26:09.77] spk_1:
love music. What do you play? [00:26:13.21] spk_0:
You [00:26:13.39] spk_1:
know I play uh I play the guitar, the drums, uh the shaker. Uh I always thought it’d be fun. You know all these cool people start all my friends that are rock stars, you know they they’re a lead guitarist and they start a band or they could even be the bass players, start the band, maybe even a drummer that starts the band. But I always thought I wanted to be the guy that started the band being the egg shaker. [00:26:37.09] spk_0:
I [00:26:37.15] spk_1:
always thought that’d be a that I thought that’d be a fun way to start a band. What do you do? I’m the egg shaker. [00:26:42.49] spk_0:
Is the shaker. Is that the is that the instrument? That’s wood and has all the beads around it. Is that the shaker? [00:26:48.26] spk_1:
Yeah there’s so many different, yeah there’s so so many different versions, you know I just [00:26:57.13] spk_0:
hold it a little closer hold it closer to the mic when you play your [00:26:59.81] spk_1:
shaker. [00:27:04.91] spk_0:
Yeah like [00:27:05.32] spk_1:
that that’s a shake [00:27:07.32] spk_0:
is your guitar very far away. [00:27:11.29] spk_1:
Yeah that’s not near me at this [00:27:12.75] spk_0:
moment [00:27:15.62] spk_1:
itself on music. You know you know, one thing I, one thing about music is [00:27:19.76] spk_0:
it [00:27:58.54] spk_1:
really is the universal language is the guy that studies language and, and wants to connect with people. Uh, it’s, it’s, we were in Morocco and just rolled up in the, in the souks there and some Moroccan guys playing guitar and singing, which you know, I don’t even know what he’s singing and uh, you know, Sarah and I are walking by and I have a shaker in my bag and all of a sudden just stop getting next to him and start shaking and all of a sudden there’s a crowd of people and we’re making music together and smiling and laughing and hugging and it’s just, it’s, it really is. It’s uh, I think the two universal most powerful things we, we can do is smile. I think smiling is a universal language that transcends everything and, and welcomes people in. And I think uh, singing and playing music is another one that just creates community instantly. [00:28:16.51] spk_0:
Know what I love about smiles. Even through the pandemic when everybody was masked, you could tell if somebody was smiling at you. [00:28:25.16] spk_1:
Yeah, the eyes, [00:28:35.27] spk_0:
the eyes get a little squinty and you could just, and maybe they wrinkle a little bit around their temples and the face exposed enough of the smile around the, around the mask that you could tell when people were smiling at you. I always like that. [00:28:44.62] spk_1:
Me too. That’s a sweet visual, [00:28:54.55] spk_0:
You’ve done some work with nonprofits for nonprofits. What what’s, what’s been the impact of that work [00:28:58.23] spk_1:
on you? [00:28:59.10] spk_0:
You on, on you, not on the nonprofits, on, on eric [00:29:20.33] spk_1:
on me. I, you know, I started so young. I’m really grateful for my family having a value of service. And yeah, I started really young volunteering for camp and then volunteered for the special olympics being a coach. And then [00:29:25.37] spk_0:
when I [00:29:26.21] spk_1:
was in college, I ran the volunteer center, got invited to [00:29:31.25] spk_0:
carry [00:29:32.05] spk_1:
the olympic torch. Uh, ended up becoming [00:29:36.13] spk_0:
a vista [00:29:42.99] spk_1:
volunteer, which is like the current AmeriCorps volunteer. Um, yeah, you know, I think, I think the, [00:29:46.22] spk_0:
the big [00:29:53.72] spk_1:
takeaway for volunteerism for me is that beautiful adage. Today I met a man [00:29:55.37] spk_0:
who [00:29:56.00] spk_1:
had no shoes and he complained [00:29:59.84] spk_0:
until [00:30:23.51] spk_1:
he met a man who had no feet and I think that has been such an impact for me that just being in the volunteer community. Uh, it works on so many cylinders, you know, to, to be of service, to make a difference to remember how grateful I am for my life and all the blessings that I have. Um, [00:30:24.54] spk_0:
it’s, [00:30:43.59] spk_1:
it’s, it’s meaningful work. It’s just, it feels so meaningful And um, you know, that’s a big thing I learned on the farm. The farm culture is, is, uh, we always talk about the difference between consuming and contributing, You know, that’s a great question to ask. Are we consuming more than we’re [00:30:47.68] spk_0:
contributing? And [00:30:49.20] spk_1:
we’ve become a very consuming culture? Give me give me take, I want I need this is my right, this is and and all that is, [00:30:58.66] spk_0:
it [00:30:58.84] spk_1:
doesn’t bring us closer and it doesn’t build [00:31:02.28] spk_0:
um cooperation [00:31:17.40] spk_1:
or inspire civility. It’s it’s it’s the opposite. And I think if we walk around in our lives showing up anywhere in our lives and ask ourselves this question, how can I help? [00:31:20.26] spk_0:
And that [00:31:21.28] spk_1:
uh is just a beautiful question just to ask, how can I help? How can I help in this moment? How can I help in this moment? How can I help in this moment and to be people that are of service always. So I for me, I think probably now I I’ve conflated, I don’t see myself volunteering anymore. I don’t, I just see myself being of service everywhere. I can [00:31:53.76] spk_0:
you do a lot of executive coaching too. And so how do you how do you see yourself in service to, to those folks? [00:31:57.31] spk_1:
You know, my executive coaching career started [00:31:59.74] spk_0:
with [00:32:08.47] spk_1:
not I was studying speech communication in college and emphasis on leadership and one of my assignments early was I had, I had worked with the United Way in SAN Diego at the time and [00:32:17.12] spk_0:
the [00:32:17.46] spk_1:
Ceo, the guy was running the United Way there in SAN Diego I had offered as one of my thesis papers to do a communication audit [00:32:27.81] spk_0:
with him [00:33:20.12] spk_1:
and that was the beginning of my journey where I went in and I interviewed and studied the Ceo and asked him what was his mission, what was his vision, what are his guiding principles, what are his commitments, what are his values? And then identified essentially what his um rudder was to his boat uh and what his, his, what what what pushes and what pushed and drove him to be who he was, what was the sum total of his character. And then we figured that out. And then I created a survey that would then go test who he says. He was like the assignment for me is to to make sure that what we’re saying and who were being is in alignment. And so I got a chance to go interview his wife, go interview, his colleagues, go interview people on the board, go interview his son and then be able to go check [00:33:30.26] spk_0:
in [00:33:31.03] spk_1:
and go, okay, this is what this person says they value and then what’s [00:33:35.15] spk_0:
the experience [00:33:36.97] spk_1:
that people who are in that person’s life have of them and is what they’re saying about who they are in alignment with what people’s experience of them are. And it was absolutely fascinating to be able to go come back and report back to this person the blind spots in their life. That’s one of the things that I’ve learned so much by talking to wise people is [00:33:59.49] spk_0:
that there [00:34:49.59] spk_1:
is what we know, there’s what we don’t know and then there’s what we don’t know, we don’t even know it because we don’t even know it. And it’s that blind spot that we don’t know is the thing that will trip us, prevent us from getting the promotion, will have the husband or wife wake up one morning and say I’m leaving. It’s it’s just it’s the part of us that we just I can’t see who I am to you. I can only I’ve got my own perception of who I am. I’ve got my values, I’ve got my principles, I think I’m being this particular way. I convince myself of being this particular way and then I walk through the world. And if I the only way for me to get access to this quadrant of what I don’t know, I don’t even know, I don’t even know it is to be able to to ask others to contribute. And um that reminds me of one of my early interviews with the president of coca cola Donald Keogh who and I you know the most powerful ceo in the world with the most recognizable brand in the world. And I had asked him what separates those who achieve from those who do not. And [00:35:05.68] spk_0:
uh he [00:35:06.85] spk_1:
said what separates those who achieve from those who do not is in direct proportion to one’s ability to ask others [00:35:12.74] spk_0:
friends [00:35:51.81] spk_1:
help. And I’ve always thought that was just so significant. We’re a culture that that is afraid to ask for help or we think asking for help is a sign of weakness and it’s actually a sign of strength. And this exercise is asking the people in our lives for help to give us feedback on what what’s their experience of me? I know that you know with my romantic partners there, you know, um I can tell her all day long, I love you. I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you. But it doesn’t really matter that I’m telling her I love her. What matters is what’s her experience of me and is her experience of being loved by me. And that’s what this exercise does is it gets it taps into the experience that other people have, not just what I believe it is. And so these that was the beginning of my coaching journey where now I’ve done thousands of them and recommended to everyone, every executive or anybody that’s listening to this [00:36:08.80] spk_0:
podcast. All [00:36:32.90] spk_1:
of us can use a linguistic chiropractic adjustment from time to time and uh have have opportunity to just check in check in about who we are, what we are. What are the principles, What are the values, What are the the beliefs that we’ve been carrying that govern our lives? And let’s just check in and make sure that they’re still relevant that we didn’t inherit them from people that we don’t really actually value any more. Their outdated get really clear about who we are and what we stand for and then let’s go test that. Let’s go, let’s go talk to people in our lives to give us feedback. And what we talk about in my coaching clients is that language is either in the on position [00:36:49.27] spk_0:
or [00:36:51.41] spk_1:
the off position and we want to switch our switches from the off position to the on and this communication audit definitely gives us a chance to a get access to our blind spots, be able to then recognize that they’re there and then choose powerfully to switch them from a negative place to [00:37:09.35] spk_0:
a place [00:37:11.00] spk_1:
that serves us better. [00:38:21.14] spk_0:
It’s the gap between our own perception of ourselves and others perceptions of us. That is what it is, what it sounds like and uh, that, that quote from the ceo of co coco of coca cola that uh, the ability of one to succeed is in direct proportion uh, with their ability to ask for help. I, I put that in a nonprofit radio sizzle reel uh, kind of a teaser reel because I, I think it’s such a simple bit of wisdom. Um, and it was gleaned from your hundreds of interviews on the, in the VW microbus journey, which is, which we talked about a couple of months ago and which of course is chronicled in the film, the journey. Uh, so I, that that bit of wisdom has stayed with me since we first met in 2000, whatever it was 10 or 11 or something like something like that. Um the ability of the ability to ask for help, you [00:38:21.94] spk_1:
know, as a, as a, as an entrepreneur, it helped [00:38:25.83] spk_0:
me, you [00:38:26.02] spk_1:
know, I have been able [00:38:27.79] spk_0:
to, to [00:38:28.77] spk_1:
make things in the world [00:38:31.30] spk_0:
that [00:38:35.38] spk_1:
essentially, I’m not supposed to have made [00:38:36.50] spk_0:
them because [00:38:37.69] spk_1:
I don’t have the skills to do [00:38:40.65] spk_0:
it. [00:38:41.62] spk_1:
And I think that’s what prevents so many people from accomplishing [00:38:46.37] spk_0:
uh is that [00:38:48.07] spk_1:
People wake up one morning and say, I’m [00:38:50.30] spk_0:
gonna, [00:38:51.27] spk_1:
I’m compelled, [00:38:52.86] spk_0:
then I’m [00:38:53.25] spk_1:
gonna go do this thing, I’m gonna eradicate this injustice, I’m gonna go write [00:38:58.38] spk_0:
this [00:38:58.92] spk_1:
book, I’m gonna make this movie, I’m I’m gonna go do something really extraordinary. And after the initial buzz of making that declaration, they go tell some of their community [00:39:10.50] spk_0:
about it. [00:39:11.18] spk_1:
And then their community out of love says, oh, you want to do that thing. Well, [00:39:18.07] spk_0:
did [00:39:19.38] spk_1:
you study [00:39:19.97] spk_0:
that? [00:39:22.34] spk_1:
No, Oh then you probably can’t do that, or you know, do you have a bunch of money? No, you [00:39:29.49] spk_0:
probably [00:39:30.41] spk_1:
can’t do that. And you know, for my, my, I studied speech communication and I was telling people, I was going to make a film and they’re like, well, [00:39:38.67] spk_0:
did [00:39:41.43] spk_1:
you go to film school? No, well [00:39:42.88] spk_0:
then you can’t [00:39:46.04] spk_1:
make a movie then. And so there’s a lot of people that will [00:39:48.75] spk_0:
put a lot of [00:40:01.50] spk_1:
doubt and insecurity in somebody’s vision because their, their credentials or at the time that they’re talking about, it doesn’t match what it is that they want to make. And this idea of asking for help is just it’s it’s a bright light and a dark world. It just it’s a it’s a it’s a compass that that that gives somebody a chance to move from one place to the next. And that is that I was able to [00:40:17.85] spk_0:
make, take a [00:40:18.21] spk_1:
movie and not only make a movie, I was lucky to make an award winning film that has touched and inspired millions of people around the world and because I was willing to ask [00:40:27.33] spk_0:
for help, [00:40:37.31] spk_1:
that was the only reason why it happened. I had a good vision. I knew my story, I was willing to do the work. And the only way to make a movie at that time for me was to enroll Disney and to enroll Billy Crystal and Roland Jaffe was an Academy Award winning director, took me under his wing and it buys me and Henry Winkler, you know, the great actor and Fons and producer and director I had and and Michael Greer, who is an award winning editor, edited the film and [00:40:57.29] spk_0:
so [00:41:32.89] spk_1:
many people helped me make it into an awesome film. I’m I’m just 11 guy, but it took a whole village to make it happen. And if I wasn’t willing to ask for help, it would have never happened. And so that’s why I think it’s so profound is that anything you and I and and the listeners we want to create in our lives. It really comes down to having a clear vision of what it is we want and then go seek out people, why is smarter uh and ask for help. And I’ve discovered that that people [00:41:34.07] spk_0:
want to help [00:41:35.56] spk_1:
people find value and joy and their life’s purpose gets illuminated when there’s an opportunity for them to contribute and help. Another [00:42:03.17] spk_0:
eric’s Epperson is keynote speaker, leadership and communication coach. He’s got that award winning film, the journey. You’ll find it all at eric Sapper Stone dot com Erica. Thank you very much again. What a pleasure! What a pleasure! [00:42:07.65] spk_1:
You know, a rising tide lifts all boats. Thank you so much. I was a privilege to be here on your show. It’s a privilege to be your friend and I know you all these years and I’m grateful that we get to stay connected uh and and uh and and keep keep popping back into each other’s life, [00:43:08.20] spk_0:
genuine pleasure indeed. Thank you very much ERic Next week. Inflection points in your non profits growth with Brooke richie Babbage! If you missed any part of this week’s show, I Beseech you find it at tony-martignetti dot com. Our creative producer is Claire Meyerhoff shows social media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our web guy and this music is by scott stein, Thank you for that. Affirmation Scotty B with me next week for nonprofit radio big nonprofit ideas for the other 95%, go out and be great.
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