It’s a mistake to focus on your donors’ legacies in your Planned Giving fundraising promotions.
Years ago I was accused of being a thief. The donor’s niece didn’t trust me with her aunt’s jewelry. Peter Heller of Heller Fundraising Group, hosted me in his Outrageous Fortune video series to tell my story.
In talking to donors and potential donors to your Planned Giving fundraising program, it helps to be aware of the history and culture those folks grew up with in the mid to late 1900s. At least be curious about that period. Start with Abbott & Costello.
My thinking about mom’s death has evolved. Also, shots of my neighborhood, post-Florence.
Video: You Will Join This Club
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Me: 5-Minute Marketing for Planned Giving
The best person to reveal my wildly simple Planned Giving promotion tips is me.
Maria Semple: What’s Fair Game?
Info you find on LinkedIn about a potential donor belongs in your report on the person. What about Facebook and Instagram? What if the tidbit is embarrassing or compromising, but valuable to your org? Should you friend prospects to learn more? Maria Semple walks us through the ethical conundrums. She’s our prospect research contributor and The Prospect Finder. (Sounds much more interesting than the first segment.)
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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, i’m glad you’re with me. I’d become fei broke calcification if you hardened to me with the idea that you missed today’s show five minute marketing for planned e-giving the best person to reveal my wildly simple plan giving promotion tips is me oh boy, i don’t know what i’ve gotten into, but i’m here and what’s fair game info you find on linked in about a potential donor belongs in your report on the person. What about facebook and instagram? What if the tidbit is embarrassing or compromising but valuable to your organization? Should you friend prospects tto learn more about them? Maria semple walks us through the ethical conundrums she’s, our prospect research contributor and the prospect finder this sounds much more interesting than the first segment and ah, much easier sarrantonio take two planned giving timing we’re sponsored by pursuant full service fund-raising data driven and technology enabled, you’ll raise more money pursuant dot com, and by we be spelling super cool spelling bee fundraisers we b e spelling dot com all right, well there is not a guest to welcome because, uh, i’m it, um, it’s a little awkward, because although i do a ton of speaking training this, you know that i don’t know, i think it’s very different that’s on a stage, people expect to hear me because i’m in the program it’s not like i just walked in, but i have crashed a few conferences, but they never up on stage. It hasn’t been successful yet, but those aside, you know, i’m in the program i mean, i mean, alright, i’m in today’s program it’s been booked, i’m booked for the spot, but the show is never been me sharing, you know, for, like, for a full segment. What? What i purport to know about planned e-giving or charity registration. You know, i filled in from time to time. Ah, guest is lead or a segment ran short maybe a pre recorded thing man short. And so i would fill in for, like, five minutes or seven minutes or so think is probably the most, but this is, uh this is a different one. This is different experience. Andi, i’m ah, i’m a little nervous about it. My voice just cracked like i’m a fourteen year old. Um all right, well, i mean, i certainly capable, but it feels weird that’s what i’m saying, it just feels different. This is not my typical venue for me to be speaking without having somebody to talk to. Let me just do a little technical detail first, sam is the facebook shared on facebook live shared on the non-profit radio page, can we, uh because i don’t want it just on my personal pager doing facebook live today? I don’t know if maria simple is going to do facebook live on her end, but you’ll you’ll certainly be hearing her when when it’s her turn. But look at me. I’m already rushing to the second segment already know this is this is okay. Not yet. Not yet. Maria, hang on. Okay, so you want to share the facebook live to the non-profit radio page so that it’s called tony martignetti non-profit radio. Okay, i have to do it on mine. Okay, so ah, i apologized, teo, podcast listeners for ah, for this. You know, just give me a little technological moment, okay? I’m in my facebook. Ah, i see. Live what? Ah, sam’s. Gonna say, i’m gonna take my phone and take care of that and of course, you know, we’re gonna get to the five minute marketing tips. Just hold your horses. You’ve got a nerve, you know, nervous guest. Okay, sam is going to take care of that. So five minute marketing i haven’t expanded version of this that i have done at conferences runs on for ninety minutes or so you’re not getting that version. Don’t we’re going to keep to the toe? Keep to the hour. Okay, but, you know, i mean, if you want me, tio training your conference. I love teo. I love to speak just this is today’s a little weird. So so here’s what? I ah anticipate we’re going to cover very briefly. What plans giving is we’ll make sure everyone’s on the same page with that. What kinds of non-profits benefit? Like what? What do you need to have in place before you can start your plan giving five minute marketing. Okay, on dh. What? The radical revocable planned gift are that that we’re going to be talking about marketing for and there’s a lot more plan giving beyond revocable but that’s what’s going to talk, you know, which is like scratching the surface, you know? Well, it’s, not bite off too much. I want you to get going with plant. E-giving and it doesn’t have to be in depth. So we’re starting with the revocable, and then we’ll get into the marketing tips, which is the bulk of book of our time. Okay, i’m feeling a lot more comfortable but it’s still also a little weird now, it’s like fifty, fifty instead of like ninety ten on the weighted to the weird side now, it’s like fifty fifty okay. Plan giving this’s a method of giving that is long term, involves the donors consideration of their long term plans. Their state plans a retirement plans very different than asking a donor, too, right? A fifty dollar check or even a half a million dollar check or a five million dollar check. These thes gif ts involved more personal considerations of family on dh. How your charity fits into their much longer term plan. And then, typically, these are cash to your organization when the donor dies. So again, long term, if you get a sixty or sixty five year old to include you in their will, they’ve got a twenty five, thirty, thirty five year longevity. So long term. You need to have this long term view of fund-raising. Your board needs to have that. We’re going to get to that board support. But this is not the type of giving that is going to pay the five year capital plan. Or or, you know, any kind of immediate immediate budget needs that you have. This is long term fund-raising. I want to stress that the outset that this is not on ly for your wealthy donors, i mean, the five minute mark in tips i’m going to be giving you these these quick ideas, these air, we’re going to be doing these for all your donors. We’re not getting into discriminating by age, um, because these are easy tips. So i want you to know that these are ideas that are appropriate for any donor-centric to get to this is not on ly for your wealthy donors and all of plant that applies to all of planned e-giving people are very modest means can be terrific planned give prospects i literally mean, if they have been giving you fifteen dollars, a year and they have been doing it for many years, like twelve of the past fifteen years, or eighteen or nineteen or twenty years of the past twenty, they are great plan giving prospects. This is not playing e-giving is not only for your wealthy donors, please take that away and that does not applied on ly to what we’re talking to about today. All of planned e-giving people have very modest means, very modest can include you. In their state plan, the smallest plan to gift i’ve ever seen was a thousand dollars in someone’s will and that’s very rare that i’ve seen that only a handful of times in twenty years. Thank you seventeen twenty years i’ve been doing plan giving only seen a couple seen that a couple of times the average charitable bequests in which you’re gonna be talking about a lot about will’s requesting a will, the average is around thirty six to thirty seven thousand dollars is the average bequest, so please take away planned giving is not on ly for your wealthy donors. Um, we’re going to ah, i just got, you know, we’re going to take our break now, and when we come back, then we’re going to get into what you need to have in place, what kind of non-profits benefit what these revocable gifts are that we were talking about and the marketing tips stay with me. You’re tuned to non-profit radio tony martignetti also hosts a podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy fund-raising fundamentals is a quick ten minute burst of fund-raising insights published once a month. Tony’s guests are expert in crowdfunding mobile giving event fund-raising direct mail and donor cultivation. Really, all the fund-raising issues that make you wonder, am i doing this right? Is there a better way there is? Find the fund-raising fundamentals archive it. Tony martignetti dot com that’s marketmesuite n e t t i remember there’s, a g before the end, thousands of listeners have subscribed on itunes. You can also learn maura, the chronicle website, philanthropy dot com fund-raising fundamentals, the better way. Welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent since people joining us because that voice again joining us on facebook live. I gotta gotta shout them out. J frost hello. Thank you. Interesting subject. You’ve had me. Uh, jay, didn’t we set something up there? I speak about this. Or maybe i did charity registration for you, but j, are you running for congress? I heard that. I don’t know if it’s true. Let me know if you are running. I admire that very much. If you are. If you’re not, i, uh i still admire you, but you’re a little more lackluster than if you are running. Jackie likened jackie, laken maria and and that’s it okay, so far so far. Ok, cool. Thanks for being with me on facebook. All right, let’s, get into which organizations benefit right now. By the way, i feel much more comfortable now. Now. It’s like ninety five five in my comfort in this format, speaking alone. All right, so what do you need to have in place? You need to have individual donors? If you are strictly grant funded government funded fee for service funded, then you don’t have any potential for plan giving. You need to have individual people e-giving from their pockets and that’s distinguished from people who get you corporate gifts from their employers. That’s different you need to have people giving from their pockets, maybe it’s just your board. I hope all your board is giving from their individual pockets. They certainly should be. Lots of guests have made that case over the years, but, you know, it’s limited to the extent that you have individual donors, if you have lots of people who give individual gifts and great that that is a prerequisite also some longevity i’d like to see at least five years in an organization, because what are we asking the donors to do put you in their will or their other long term plans? Retirement said retirement or state plans inherent in that is the belief that your organization is going toe outlive them. And even though there’s, great passion and even fury sometimes around, you know, new organizations, they’re going to live forever. Your donors don’t may not have the same confidence probably don’t that you do when you’re a brand new organization, so i’d like to see at least five years that gives some confidence that your organization will survive the people who make these plan gifts for you some depth to i’d like to see more than just ah, founder and one or two people, same reason longevity, you know, you might have small potential again. Maybe just you’re bored if you’re just a founder and one or two people. But ah, outsiders is going to be much harder to persuade outsiders that you will survive them if ifit’s a tiny organization just a few people. The long term view of fund-raising i explained why before this could be thirty years waiting for cash to come to your organization. So you need to have a long term view of fund-raising um, and you’re bored metoo needs to understand that building endowment, i hope every knows what endowment is just in case endowment is that fund that you never spend the principle of you only spend, eh? Well, you may not. You only spend income and you may not even spend all the income you have a very good year in your returns, you know, in eight or ten or twelve percent year because non-profits are typically conservatively invested, you’re probably not spending that eight or ten percent, you’re spending a lot less like half of that because they’re going to be years when we turned your lower but that’s the purpose of an endowment isto live perpetually live forever. Hopefully, you’re never spending more than income and plant giving is perfect for building endowment because so many plan gifts are unrestricted and they could get put into that endowment fund, and even a lot of the restricted ones can go to endowment of creating endowed funds for aa program of yours. Ah, scholarships or popular if it’s ah, you know, if it’s some kind of school college, anything you know, really a donor could endow just about anything programmatically, as long as you are willing your organization’s willing to continue that program. So plan giving very good for building endowment. That board support. I mentioned any new initiative. If you’re gonna start planned giving, you need to have the board on board and aware of the long term nature of these kinds of gifts six months into this, you don’t want to boardmember complaining, we haven’t recognized any cash. You’re spending time, even if you say it’s only five minute marketing and but where’s the cash you don’t want that so set the expectations correctly at the outset, but your board members know again long term could be twenty, thirty years for some donors until the cash is received by your organization and any type of mission. I really don’t care what you do if you’re saving animals the sky, trees, educating, feeding, sheltering what else can we be doing? You know any of the charitable missions, anything religious, anything, social service, cultural museums. I worked in the north buried, um, you name it. Anything charitable, it doesn’t matter. Everything i’m going to sixth explain applies for you fund-raising across all charitable missions guaranteed um snusz cj frost in answer didn’t answer whether is going for congress. All right, maybe he’s not. Oh, not yet. He says. Not yet. Okay, well, getting there? Yeah. It’s easy for me to say. Why did you do it? Tony? Martignetti plant giving. So when we are ah, yes, this is this has come up for me a lot. Sexism. I want you to avoid not giving women the attention that they deserve in planned e-giving this goes back to january two thousand eleven, you can go to tony martignetti dot com could see the block post. Just just search sexism. A tony martignetti dot com. You’ll see the post i did and one of the comments. So what i’m what i’m quoting now from is from a comment not me surprise, not quoting myself. There were women who said that they had dropped hints, left messages, sent emails or boldly said something about a state planning and planned e-giving two non-profits that they had been supporting and this was more than one woman, it was one comment or talking about friends of hers, and they have been ignore it. I don’t know how that could possibly happen that is gross negligence and oversight just don’t don’t ignore women. I mean, they have money and they live longer than men, so a lot of men are giving the money to the women. But even if they didn’t, even if they had a shorter life span, they’re still half the population, women have wealth, and they want to support non-profits, so i don’t know how these hints, messages and bold statements could possibly be ignored. Don’t let that happen in your office, it’s gross. All right, we’re moving now to the what what types of gifts i’m talking about. The revocable plan gifts the three. I want to focus on our charitable bequests, that’s, a gift in your will. I got more detail on that living trusts to type of trust that people set up is not charitable purpose. It’s not set up for charitable purposes, but you could be a part of it and being named a beneficiary. Okay, those are the three revocable gifts that were focusing on today. There’s, a ton more you, khun do cracking again, oppcoll sip. Pardon me. Ton more you can do with planned giving, but oppcoll um, i’m only focusing on three things today that these three revocable gifts cherokee, facebook live says yes, we do. Tony yes, women have money and they want to give it don’t ignore them. All right, so these are the three revocable gifts that i’m focusing on because, you know, it’s only a half an hour now and now i feel like i don’t give myself enough time she’d done the whole show. Maria simple, you’re out, you’re out. I’m going out for sixty, all right? No, no, uh, let’s. See? And i want you to know that you can have a very, very respectable planned e-giving program just by focusing on these three revocable gifts, your organization may not be big enough to go any further, and that is fine. And you can have a really respectable, successful plan giving program if you just focus on these three types of gift. Well, you’re already feeling like i’m going to run out of time. All right, all right. So please take that away along with its not only for your wealthy donors. Please take away that you could be a very successful planned giving shop just focusing on these three revocable gif ts absolutely you’re bigger. You want to go further? Absolutely, andi, i worked a lot of organizations that do but also work with a lot that don’t all right. This charitable bequests again, it’s a gift in somebody’s will it’s the most popular kind of planned gift by far, you can expect like seventy five to eighty percent of the gifts that you get to be gifts by will. Why is that? Lots of reasons people don’t have to tell you that they’ve done it? It’s private, we always asking we always want people to tell you because you want to be able to say thank you, but they don’t have to, they can change their minds. This national statistic is like four percent of people change their minds after they put a charity in a will so it’s highly highly unlikely, but you don’t want to be in that four percent. You’ve got to treat your donor’s well and it’s comforting to donors to know that they can change their minds because that’s why a lot of donors don’t tell you because they feel if they do. Tell you, they then have an obligation not to change their minds. We all know that that’s not true. You can change your will anytime you want. I cut my wife out routinely every couple days. There’s. Nothing left for her, but u s so it’s comforting to your donors to know that they can cut you out, even though it’s highly unlikely. But it’s a reason that’s another reason that gift by will are so popular because it’s comforting to donors to know that no lifetime cost this is money that comes out of your state. Lots of people have charity they’re supporting, they wish they could doom or than they can while they’re living. I’m in that situation, but they can do for you cracker voice again. They can do for you mme, or they could do more for you in their state so that maybe their ultimate gift has to be for a lot of people again, remember modest, modest means donors of modest means. They wish they could do more, but they can’t, but that’s an advantage in that there’s no lifetime cost to these. Okay, that’s really? Pretty much all i want to say about requests. No, except for do they get a charitable deduction. Doesn’t matter because these are people who love your love. Your non-profit they’re already donating to you. These are the kinds of people who’re gonna include you in their will. So the charitable deduction, the estate tax deduction who knows what the state of it is going to be in the future? We have no idea, even within the next couple weeks and months, let alone twenty, thirty years from now. But that’s not the primary motivation for most planned gift it’s not that it’s, not the state tax deduction, so don’t worry about it. Okay? The other one, we won’t talk about his living trusts. As i said, it’s set up um, teo, not for charitable purposes. They set it up. People set it up for expedience to get get things out of their state faster. It works because there’s not a court supervised process like if if like it isn’t with a will called that you might have heard this probate process jargon jail, but the probate processes the court supervising the distribution of your assets after your death and by the way, i was death, you know that some people like to i don’t kind ofyou from eyes passing demise. The fact is, you know, we’re going to die and that’s ah that’s, just a part of planned e-giving and when i’m not saying, when you talk to a donut, you’re saying, when you die, we want you in our will we want to be in your will i’m not saying that, but between professionals, you know we can we can say death so that’s what probate is that court supervised process and the assets will get to ah teo ball beneficiaries quicker through a living trust and that’s typically white set up what’s your part in it. The trust has to say what happens at the donors at the death of the person who creates the trust. That’s, your donor has to say what happens. Ah lot goes to my husband, children, husband, wife, children, grandchildren, your charity khun b also one of those beneficiaries at the person’s death you could be named that’s. What? That’s what the value of the living trust is and the third one recovering is the name the beneficiary that’s? Just i’m gonna stop calling out my voice cracks that’s. The last one. I’m calling out the name beneficiary. Anything that has a death benefit. Think of life insurance, that’s, the most common example. You’ve got to decide where the death benefit is going to go, when, when, when you’re where’s, the money going to go most of it goes to husbands, wives, children, grandchildren. But maybe there’s a percentage for your charity. Five percent. Ten percent somebody can carve out. We always say family comes first. But after that, how about a small percentage for for our charity? But going beyond life insurance, some retirement plans, iras four oh, one case for three. B’s cept the small, small employer pensions. Some commercial annuities have death benefits. Some checking and savings accounts have ah, on brokerage accounts have have death benefit metoo them. So anything that has a death benefit your charity can be named all right now we’re getting into the actual five minute marketing tips that i have let’s start with events, drop a few speaking points into remarks were already hosting the event is not a plan giving event but any kind of gala. Any event where your c always speaking that’s probably everyone get them to say something about planned giving. You just need a couple of sentences. This’s. Not even well, i was gonna say not even a full paragraph, but two sentences. Khun b paragraph this is not even a full minute literally. I’m excited. We’ve kicked off a campaign to encourage you to remember us. You know, the organization in your will, it’s, very simple to do and secures our work long into the future. For instance, you know, then you can name a program or something that could be that could be endowed. I was talking about earlier, perpetually, or you could just, you know, rattle off program that you have. You know, you can support any of our great programs. You want more information? Talk to there’s a director development in the corner, you know, you know her. Talk to me. Talk to whoever it is. That’s it it’s like three, four sentences, quick it’s not the main part of the event by any means. Just we’ve kicked off a campaign. That’s a little news hook. It was something interesting kicked off this campaign. Love for you to be a part of it. It’s so simple you couldn’t tao any of our great programs support any of our great programs in the long term. Please talk. Teo. Whoever it is a t end of the program that’s it. I didn’t even spend a minute. Good thinking. I’m gonna run out of time. I should have we’re simple, you’re out. Um okay, five minute marketing was teo. So moron events pretty a program. You already printing a program for pizza? Put something about plan giving in the program. Put a little mention, you know, i’m the evangelist for plan e-giving without the religious overtones of evangelism, but you know, you’re doing the program. Same thing we’ve kicked off a campaign. I’m like dictating it to just start writing. We kicked off a campaign to encourage you to remember us in your will, it’s, so simple to do, secures our work long into the future. Your attorney is going to need our legal name, address and tax id. Here they are. Boom that’s it. Can you put that in your program? But you can or, you know, if you don’t even wanna go that much, just say we kicked off a program. Talk too. Whoever it is, whatever the contact person is. Please. I would love to talk to you today. Get something in the program again. Not spending any more money. You’re already producing programmes anyway. Kayman sample ward is on social media contributor and the ceo of and ten the non-profit technology network out in the prophet oregon. Yes. Wonderful. Welcome, amy. Well mmm. So many. I can’t name them. Uh, not that many more. A couple more. We gotta live. Listen, love too. That’s coming later with second segment. Okay, um okay. That’s it for events again. You not spending any more money already producing the program? Say something. You put something in your already speaking put in a couple of dropping a couple sentences. Oh, my gosh. Print channels. You doing newsletter? Or whether it’s print or email put in a sidebar with the same thing we’ve kicked off a campaign love to have you participate it’s so easy all you need is our two included to include us in your will. Well, you need your legal name, tax id and address. Here they are. Boom! Drop that into a sidebar on any whether it’s print or digital your annual report. Whether you do a printer digital say something about planned giving, innit? Also now i know some organizations i know are getting away from naming donors. I’ve learned that that’s in their annual report, it was always so cumbersome, you get the misspellings and i got so embarrassing the wrong levels. But if you’re naming them, if you’re naming donors in the annual report include your plan giving donors any direct mail you might be doing joppa buckslip in, you know, that’s, a book of your buckslip two third of a page, you print three and page drop it in the same thing that i’ve been talking about kicked off a campaign love to have you participate all your attorney needs is our legal name, tax id and address here they are boom drop that in it’s a third of a page doesn’t cost any more doesn’t increase your postage um, while you’re doing that while printing on direct mail printing envelopes on the envelope flap the flap that you’ve got a print, the envelopes anyway a checkoff box send me information on including your or the name, of course in my will we’ll check off everybody reads that everybody sees the envelope flap so easy i think i gotta wrap it up down i say, sam nods all right, so, uh well, time flies. Holy cow. It’s amazing. This show is out of control. What a show! Um, okay, that’s, five minute marketing for planned giving and what’s fair game with maria simple is coming up first pursuing acquisition campaigns. You need more donors, new donors, it’s their next free webinar on acquisition campaigns getting your new donors what works to inspire that first gift. They’ll have lots of examples actionable strategies which i love you know, i’m always drooling down with guests. I don’t know if people get annoyed but durney bluhm welcome on facebook. Cool. Thanks for joining me. Um, i know people get annoyed. I know listeners. Don’t have guests do but drilling down to actionable steps? I don’t like vagary, i don’t like ten thousand i mean sometimes ten thousand feet, yes, but then we got to drill down. You got to start it. You start high level but then we drill down to tactics. Who actionable steps that’s what i love and that’s what pursue is going to have in this in this webinar that’s? Why they’re that’s, why they sponsor non-profit radio for pizza and so s so now where do you go to register gnome or pursuing dot com click resource is took their bernard no that’s out. Don’t do that. Go to the custom, earl. They have a landing page for non-profit radio listeners. They stepped up their game so we’re stepping up. We gotta step up our game and i need listeners to go to this landing page. So, tony dot m a slash pursuant with a capital p please. In bentley, it matters. You gotta have the capital p in pursuing tony dahna slash pursuant that’s where all the pursuing registrations are going to be from now i’m for now provoc radio listeners i announce our three fifty that they pursuing has, uh, renew their sponsorship. So grateful for that, tony that m a slash pursuant capital p for the acquisition campaign’s web in arts on august thirty first, but if you can’t, oh, it doesn’t really matter, because if you can’t watch live, sign up there on that landing page and then you’ll get an email that tells you when the archive is up. But if that happens within forty eight hours of the live, so if you can’t make the r live watching archive, sign up and you’ll get an email tells you how to watch the archive. Tony dahna may slash pursuant, we’ll be spelling. Please watch the video. See what a fun night of millennial fund-raising looks like that can be yours. This could be your fun night it’s devoted to you it’s not so there was some confusion. Some people thought it was a bunch of charity’s one night. No, we’ll be spelling hosts this for you, for your charity, a night of live dance comedy, um, music, live music and spelling and fund-raising for your organization, this could be cool for any millennial supported organization. If you’re trying to acquire millennials on dh encourage them in get them activated or if they’re already supporting. I don’t know. Uh, i know any sample or do you still on? I don’t know. I don’t want anybody on the spot but intent should consider ah, we’ll be spelling. Um, okay, so check out the video. We b e spelling dot com and then talk to the ceo alex career. You know, he’s a nice guy. He was on the three, fiftieth. Just pick up the phone and talk to him. We be the spelling dot com. Now time for tony’s. Take two and, uh, plan e-giving what do you know? What a coincidence. See how this show is orchestrated? This doesn’t just happen. This is a thought goes into this. Or you could say i have such a limited before that the topics have to coincide because i got so i got so naturally that’s going to come up have to sound the same show. No that’s, not the case planned giving the timing does not matter. I want you to get started with plan giving using those five minute marketing tickets i gave you. And it doesn’t matter when you get started. It’s not, you know. This is informational it’s educational it’s not write us a check. Now you know it’s, our it’s, our annual campaign it’s not like that this’s informational stuff educational donors are going to do it on their timetable, but you’ve got to stop start marketing and promoting the idea. That’s okay, so it doesn’t matter when you start so today’s friday for the live listeners yourselves, the weekend maybe take monday to talk to your ceo tuesday should be starting five minute marketing tips in plan e-giving that’s what i would say so give yourself till tuesday on dh for people listening podcast and of course, our affiliate listeners. So that’s, give yourself three days and then on the fourth day on the fourth day, he said you should begin plan e-giving that’s when the light comes, i don’t think it was the fourth day, but i’m not. I’m not steeped in genesis, okay, the video if you need more promote if you need any more encouragement than that, you could watch my video promote planned giving your timing doesn’t matter. It’s at tony martignetti dot com that is tony’s take two. Maria simple has been patiently waiting. You know her? Aside from a patient waiter, she’s, the prospect finder she’s, a trainer and speaker on prospect research. Her latest book is magnify your business tips, tools and strategies for growing your business or your non-profit she’s. Our doi end of dirt cheap and free ideas. She’s at the prospect finder dot com and at maria simple and she’s on the phone. Hello, maria. Hello, tony. How are you today? I’m doing great. My voice krauz i said i was gonna do that, linda, like kowski joined us. Hello, linda. Jackie liking says hello from noven health. Hello, jackie. I wish you were coming to the beach. She bagged out on me. Um okay. Maria? Yeah. It’s good to talk to you. Last time was very brief on the three, fiftieth that’s, right? That’s, right? And so now we’re plugging ahead to your for four hundred shell, right? That’s? Correct. It’ll be july twenty eighteen. Absolutely. In the meantime, way want to talk about ethics and what’s what’s fair game. What? You deal with this every single time you’re doing an assignment for a client, right? Yeah. Yeah. That’s. Right, tony, i mean, you know, when we’re talking about prospect research and we’re thinking about all the various tools that we have available to us as prospect researchers, you know, we have to think about what’s available in the public domain because that’s, the thing that’s going to be really important, keep in mind that a donor has the right to come in at any time and asked to see what information you may have compiled on them. So you want to make sure that that you’re always using sources that are available in the public domain. So where we kind of get into some gray areas are in the area of social media sites? Yes, okay, and i think that’s a very, very good test never put anything in your c r m database that you wouldn’t want a donor to read, i think that’s a good test. What do you think? Yeah, yeah, and and i think even even in the way that you’re writing up your reports, try and think about it as an investigative reporter trying not to put subjective statements in there, even if they may have been sort of subjective statements that you might have heard, you know, through the grapevine from volunteers or board. Members or whatever about somebody’s lifestyle or their marital status or whatever it may be, you know, try and just put a statement in there, you know, like whatever the couple divorced in x y z, day ten, you know, leave it out that i don’t think anybody would take offense to that very objective. A bunch of people just join us on facebook. So i got to tell you that we’re talking about the ethics of planned, of, of prospect research and what’s appropriate to be documenting and finding about potential donors. And i want to welcome michael zeller, attorney in north carolina. Just charlotte just hosted an outstanding fiftieth birthday party. Oh, my god. Michael, that was outstanding. You know, i know that. You know, i feel that rob maker. Good to see a rab. Welcome. And dahna gillespie dahna collectibe rivera, but i know it. I know. He’s dahna gillespie. Welcome. Um, okay, so but there can be great value in the end. What you find in social media, of course. I mean, people put a lot of stuff on social and their privacy settings are typically, i think, generally not set the way they want them. And but so there can be a lot of prospect research gold in in the networks, right? Yeah, that’s, right? So, you know, what i thought we might do is just sort of talk about sort of the top three networks for a couple of minutes, like the linked in facebook and twitter and may be trying to figure out, well, what types of information can we glean on dh? Should we be cleaning it? Should we be using it? You know, even if we were stumble upon it, that doesn’t necessarily mean that you put it into this. C r m r we’re into a written report. Yeah, okay, it’s, anarchist, but that’s way could do it that way. I’m just you know, i was thinking of some of the things that you could find out. I mean, you can find out about divorce, right? You know, i’ve had friends, i’ve had two friends who were posting about suicidal, suicidal thoughts, you know? I don’t know probably a lot of people see that, but i mean, that’s very disturbing, but does it belong in a prospect research report? Maybe i don’t know, maybe if you’re looking for that plant. Gift let’s not go there. I’m just kidding. Ae okay, i’m gonna let you off the hook. But it’s, good let’s go over that. We’ll skip over that. Okay? You know and and the words very sensitive stuff. Okay, so you want to you want to start with it? Works. All right. Let’s start with now to me, linked in to me, anything on linkedin is fair game in a prospect research report is that is that is that am i overstating and my oversimplifying? Yeah, i think that anything you find on lengthen, especially since lincoln has what they call a public profile that is out there it is searchable on google. It will come up on page one of google’s search results. If you if you google your prospects name, they’re linked in profile is going to be there. So yes, indeed, anything that you find there is going to be a public domain, and this is sometimes very valuable information. You’ll be able to find out, you know, their longevity at various companies. Maybe some of the companies that they’ve been associated with may have been for for a long period of time. Maybe they’ve got some. Stock that they’ve accumulated from within that company so you might want to think about steering the conversation in the direction of appreciated securities. Okay, okay, but we wear what we want to focus to on the ethics. So so basically, linkedin is do you consider linked in to be wide open? Yes. Okay, absolutely. Okay, i don’t see any ethical questions around anything that people might find in linked in. No, not not what they might find, but the ethical question might come in as to how you as the prospect researcher or the executive director of the development staff using length in how you might have your own privacy setting set up in such a way that, um, you know what other people can see once you’ve looked at their profile, right? So you have three choices on lengthen. You either have people know that you’re looking at there, profile your face, your title and where you work, right are going to follow you everywhere on linked in that headline and a picture so that’s full transparency when you have your privacy settings set up that way, that means they get to see you’ve been looking at them. And you get to see who’s been looking at your profile, but lincoln has two other privacy settings. One is sort of a semi private where, you know, you could be a management consultant in x y z industry in new york city area. Or you could be anonymous when you’re in one of those two modes, then people will not know that you’ve been looking at their profile. Okay? And we have covered this before. You know, this is what i consider fully dressed topless and naked. That’s. Right? Okay. All right. Uh, look, i got a chuckle out of maria. Simple she’s. Probably the only one that’s. Okay? I amuse myself. People should know. You know, if you don’t think i’m funny, i’m amusing myself that’s the most important. And i forgot to shut out joan pel xero i’m sorry, joan. I skipped over you. I scrolled up and then i lost you. Joan pills her on facebook. Thanks for so much for being with us. And also ralph asante and, uh, and mary and mary michalowski joined. Hello, mary. Thanks for joining us on facebook. I might do this more often. This is cool. Um all right. So ethically linked in safe now, let’s, go, teo. Ethical conundrum, where you want to go next, all the anarchist, i’ll give it to you where it’s, like, you want to know what network that let’s talk about facebook, okay, so wide open, okay, yeah, i mean, that’s, the network where people are really sharing about their family, their pictures wait, no, this so what? What do we do with what do we do if we find something that we believe is compromising, like let’s, say, a divorce that that maybe they don’t want the organization to know, but maybe that’s? Just what that’s, just one example, but compromising, but valuable to the organization. How do we deal with that? Again, i think go backto original statement if it’s going to if it’s going to jeopardize your relationship with that donor or that donor prospect, i think you leave it out of the conversations, you leave it out of the c r, m u leave it off of written reports, so if you could just sort of have that is your bellweather, i think it will serve you well, okay, okay, and also you’re your organization might have social media guidelines in place, so check that out first as as your you know, you may have certain guidelines that you, as an organization have decided upon. So if that is the case, anybody knew that you’re bringing into the organization should be aware of the social media guidelines both in terms of how they’re going to use social media for are on behalf of the organization, but there may also be, you know, standards of conduct that they’re expecting a view is an employee’s so again, default back to that statement and default back to your own bellwether your instincts if it feels like it’s going to jeopardize that relationship, don’t put the info in there also apra the the professional association for prospect researchers has a statement on ethics, and we’re going to talk about that after the break. So if your organization doesn’t have, you know, you might be a small organization without a social media policy as it relates to prospect research, apra can can help you out. We’ll get to that, okay, i like you’re like you’re like, you’re guideline, all right, we have just a couple minutes before a break, like a minute and a half a minute what’s the next network you want to talk about? Was it twitter waken talk about twitter that one probably won’t take long. You know, twitter is one of those social media platforms that people might be using, especially these days with regard to their politics, so the weather yet, and that might be important for you to know about depending on what type of organization that you are. So, again, if if knowing someone’s politics is important, you know, maybe checking out to see if they’ve got a twitter feed might be something you want to check out. Okay? Seems like you, twitter, you’re less likely to find something compromising it’s possible, but less likely to find. Something compromising on it. Okay, let’s, take a break. When we come back. I got, of course, i got live. Listen. Love podcast, pleasantries and affiliate affections, naturally, but also will get into the apra ethics ethics statement little about that, and we’ll see what else we had to stay with us. Like what you’re hearing a non-profit radio tony’s got more on youtube, you’ll find clips from stand up comedy tv spots and exclusive interviews catch guests like seth gordon. Craig newmark, the founder of craigslist marquis of eco enterprises, charles best from donors choose dot org’s aria finger, do something that worked neo-sage levine from new york universities heimans center on philantech tony tweets to he finds the best content from the most knowledgeable, interesting people in and around non-profits to share on his stream. If you have valuable info, he wants to re tweet you during the show. You can join the conversation on twitter using hashtag non-profit radio twitter is an easy way to reach tony he’s at tony martignetti narasimhan t i g e n e t t i remember there’s a g before the end he hosts a podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy fund-raising fundamentals is a short monthly show devoted to getting over your fund-raising hartals just like non-profit radio, toni talks to leading thinkers, experts and cool people with great ideas. As one fan said, tony picks their brains and i don’t have to leave my office fund-raising fundamentals was recently dubbed the most helpful non-profit podcast you have ever heard. You can also join the conversation on facebook, where you can ask questions before or after the show. The guests were there, too. Get insider show alerts by email, tony tells you who’s on each week and always includes link so that you can contact guess directly. To sign up, visit the facebook page for tony martignetti dot com. I’m dana ostomel, ceo of deposit, a gift. And you’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Welcome back and i feel like starting with the with the shoutouts, teo, to our listeners, i’m going to start with facebook, but i don’t because it’s a fairly new formats only second time have dahna facebook live, so thank you, everybody on facebook! I believe i have shouted out everybody who joined us. Thank you for being there. Can i ask you to do? Ah one or two things like it and share it like it and share it. I think we know how to do that. I’d be grateful on facebook. Thank you very much. Live listen, love, we’ve got two in germany, guten dog, multiple. So multiple germany and seoul, seoul, south korea, always checking in so soul you’ve been on our minds, obviously a lot on your haserot comes a ham nida coming back into the u s, tampa, florida woodbridge, new jersey, matthews, north carolina and staten island and new york, new york, multiple new york city. Thank you. Multiple manhattan, new york appreciate that staten island. Thank you for being with us. Love it only to burroughs i don’t know. Queens, brooklyn, bronx. All right. Next time we have had a show way had a couple shows. Where was all five boroughs? And then, of course, the podcast pleasantries over twelve thousand listeners. Listen, that’s, why? You know, i don’t know if you put two and two together. It takes me over seven years to do that. But that’s, why? We have such loyal sponsors because there are over twelve thousand people listening to the podcast. So you know how grateful i am because it makes the show so much more fulfilling when there are sponsors, you know, helping me out. Basically mean that how else can i say it? So thank you for listening. You are attracting the sponsors to the show, and i do mean attracting the ones i announced it on the three fiftieth coming up. Wagner, cpas, that’s the only definite one. And i said there may be another one and there may still talking them, but they’re coming to me. So thank you, that’s over twelve thousand podcast listeners each week pleasantries to you and the affiliate affections to our am and fm station listeners through out the country. I’m not sure where you are, but what am i saying? I know exactly where you are and i even know when each station puts me in their schedule. Us, i prefer the us, puts us in their schedule, someone our block during the week, and i’m glad that on on your station, it could be saturday morning might be tuesday night, whenever affiliate affections to our am and fm listeners. Thank you for being with us, thanks to your stations for carrying non-profit radio multi-channel amy’s have award will love that were multi-channel we’ve been for years, and now we get into channel, i’ve discovered facebook only took me seven years, cutting edge, cutting edge what we call a pioneer. Yeah, right. Um okay. So, maria simple. Thank you for being patient again. The patient prospect. Researcher. Thank you. A lot of gabbing today. I’m off on tangents. All right? I feel like a facebook pioneer. I know. I know you’re not giving yourself enough credit. You’ve. You’ve been on facebook for a long time, it’s. Just that you’ve not been using this brand spanking new life from large. Yeah, mother it’s quite brand spanking new, but thank you. Thank you for you. That’s the point. Thank you for driving home that point and character chicken master just joined karen. Welcome on facebook. Good to see you. Thanks for being here. Okay, so we’re talking about the ethics of prospect research. Oh, my god. There’s tons more. How come they don’t show up on my phone? Because why? Oh, they’re in a group. That shit. Oh, my god. There’s! Hundreds. Well, dozens more scores, more than dozens scores more. Uh, okay, i don’t think i should do all those. But thank you. If you’re on facebook and i did not shut you out from from beth granger toe. Harriet steinberg to melinda roth. Epstein to eric mendelson. Thank you for being with us. Thank you so much. Thank you. Okay, so i maria i’m all right. So where do we go from here? Let’s talk about the apra s o apra aperribay pr. It started out as the american prospect research association. Then it became the association of professional researchers for advancement. Now, it’s just apra. So they’ve done to me that’s an abandonment of roots. They’re just apurate. Apurate. Apurate doesn’t mean anything to me probono actually ready haserot along they’ve been after all along i know what stood for different things. It’s i don’t know. I object to this rewrite of history like next it’s going to be we’re gonna be taking down statues of george washington and thomas jefferson in-kind i was around, i was around when they made that shift. And this this is the reason for it. They used to be just the american prospect research association. But now the association really envelope people from all parts of the world. So they wanted to be able to, you know, have that reflective of their their membership base. So now it’s, the association of professional researchers it’s like aarp. They don’t want to be the association. Of retired american association of retired persons anymore haven’t been for years. It’s history rewrite. I don’t mind change, but when it benefits me but it never does that’s why the world has to change without my consent i don’t know what this is, what i don’t i don’t grasp all right, let’s talk about their code of ethics anyway, so they have this ethical code and it does relate to social media specifically so right. So one thing i see is a balance for trying to balance the individual’s right to privacy with the needs of the institution that i like doing that. Yes, he did. And really, it is. It is very, very important that that that balance is capped for sure. Okay, yes. So drilling down on that. What about friends? They have they talk about. Should you be a friend to potential donors? People, you’re researching that’s a no, no. Right on. Yes. In terms of the essex statement that apple put forth that that that is correct, they would really recommend that you do not friend were really enter into a personal relationship with prospects or donors. Now lincoln could be, you know, a completely different platform, right? Because now we’re talking about a business social platform. Okay, right? All right, so but no friend. What about what? This seems like middle ground. What about following somebody on twitter? If you’re a prospect researcher, yeah, i mean, i think that that would be okay to be a follower on twitter because, you know, they’re again twitter feeds are very public, and so, you know, i don’t think there’ll be any issue. They’re okay, but you need to disclose who you are, that’s also in the statement in these guidelines, you need to disclose that you’re a prospect researcher for the organization. Do you need to say that? Um, well, you know, sometimes people will individually have ah, personal twitter account so that i feel the only twitter account that you’re following people from them, then you know, that is it, you know? So i think you have to start looking at your staff and determining, you know which staff members are on twitter hour? Is that the organization that it’s going to be a follower of that individual on twitter and again? It’s two very different to two very different things. Okay, okay, what about corroboration if you find something on a social network, is there an obligation as a prospect researcher to corroborate it from us from another source, or, like almost like a journalist or no? Yeah, if you can, absolutely ah again, is it personal versus business information? That’s going to probably make a difference in terms of what you’re going to try and source in terms of corroboration. But if you know you are, i’m thinking about having somebody make a major gift to your organization and you stumble across something on social media that gives you an indication that this might not be the right time to make that because you might have seen something going on on somebody’s personal facebook feed. You might just double check with you, noah boardmember that knows them well or something like that and just ask, you know, if they know anything about the timing is still a good time to talk to that individual. Okay, maria simple. We gotta leave it there. You’ll find the apra social media ethics statement at apra home dot or ge a after home dot org’s maria sample. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me. My pleasure. Absolutely. You’ll find her at the prospect finder and she’s at maria simple. You should be following her on twitter. If you’re not latto it’s your life, okay, next week, talking about risk your institutional funders. That’s going to very interesting. Plus, amy sample ward returns, and you gotta let me know what we’re doing. If you missed any part of today’s show, i beseech you, find it on tony martignetti dot com. Responsive by pursuing online tools for small and midsize non-profits data driven and technology enabled and by re be spelling supercool spelling bee fundraisers, we b e spelling dot com, more sponsors to come, our creative producers playing meyerhoff sam labor, which is the line user, shows social media, is by susan chavez, and this very cool music is by scott stein of brooklyn. Be with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Go out and be great. What’s not to love about non-profit radio tony gets the best guests check this out from seth godin this’s the first revolution since tv nineteen fifty and henry ford nineteen twenty it’s the revolution of our lifetime here’s a smart, simple idea from craigslist founder craig newmark yeah insights, orn presentation or anything? People don’t really need the fancy stuff they need something which is simple and fast. When’s the best time to post on facebook facebook’s andrew noise nose at traffic is at an all time hyre on nine a m or eight pm so that’s, when you should be posting your most meaningful post here’s aria finger ceo of do something dot or ge young people are not going to be involved in social change if it’s boring and they don’t see the impact of what they’re doing. So you got to make it fun and applicable to these young people look so otherwise a fifteen and sixteen year old they have better things to do if they have xbox, they have tv, they have their cell phones. Me dar is the founder of idealist took two or three years for foundation staff, sort of dane toe add an email address card, it was like it was phone. This email thing is fired-up that’s why should i give it away? Charles best founded donors choose dot or ge somehow they’ve gotten in touch kind of off line as it were on dno. Two exchanges of brownies and visits and physical gift. Mark echo is the founder and ceo of eco enterprises. You may be wearing his hoodies and shirts. Tony, talk to him. Yeah, you know, i just i i’m a big believer that’s not what you make in life. It sze, you know, tell you make people feel this is public radio host majora carter. Innovation is in the power of understanding that you don’t just put money on a situation expected to hell. You put money in a situation and invested and expect it to grow and savvy advice for success from eric sabiston. What separates those who achieve from those who do not is in direct proportion to one’s ability to ask others for help. The smartest experts and leading thinkers air on tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent.