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Nonprofit Radio for August 16, 2021: Virtual Events & Design For Non-Designers

My Guests:

Evan Briggs & Gwenn Cagann: Virtual Events

Evan Briggs and Gwenn Cagann share their lessons from 25 virtual galas, which include takeaways for your next hybrid event. They’re both with Wingo NYC.





Josh Riman & Mike Yamagata: Design For Non-Designers

Wrapping up our 21NTC coverage, it’s a crash course in good design, covering fundamentals like color, type and hierarchy. Step outside your comfort zone with Josh Riman and Mike Yamagata, both from Great Believer.





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[00:00:10.74] spk_5:
Hello and welcome to tony-martignetti

[00:00:13.06] spk_4:
non profit

[00:02:17.44] spk_1:
Radio big non profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host of your favorite abdominal podcast. Oh and I’m glad you’re with me. I’d get slapped with a diagnosis of interception if you blocked me up with the idea that you missed this week’s show virtual events. Evan Briggs and Gwen Sagen share their lessons from 25 virtual galas which include takeaways for your next hybrid event. They’re both with wing go N.Y.C. and designed for non designers Wrapping up our 21 NTC coverage. It’s a crash course in good design covering fundamentals like colour type and hierarchy. Step outside your comfort zone with josh, Lyman and Mike Yamagata, both are from great believer. This week’s conversations are from 21 NTC and they wrap up our coverage of the conference and tony state too, sharing really is caring. We’re sponsored by turn to communications pr and content for nonprofits. Your story is their mission turn hyphen two dot C O and by sending blue the only all in one digital marketing platform empowering non profits to grow. tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant in Blue. Let’s get started. Here is virtual events. Welcome to Tony-Martignetti non profit radio coverage of 21 NTC, you know what that is. It’s the 2021 nonprofit technology conference. We’re sponsored at 21 NTC by turn to communications Turn hyphen two dot C o with me now from wingO N.Y.C. our Evan Briggs and Gwen Sagen Evan is digital fundraising and client engagement manager and Gwen is director of special events fundraising. Welcome Evan. Welcome, Gwen.

[00:02:23.64] spk_2:
Thank you. My

[00:02:25.41] spk_1:
pleasure. Uh, why doesn’t one of you? Uh, well, I’ll pick otherwise everybody was so polite. You work together and nobody will talk and then I’ll end up having to pick anyway, So, Gwen, uh, since you’re both from window N.Y.C. why don’t you acquaint us what lingo does.

[00:03:00.44] spk_2:
Thank you. Wingo is a small fundraising communications and design firm. Um, we have and call ourselves a boutique because we’re so small. We’re 12 people and we specialize in working with nonprofit clients, although we do have some corporate clients, but nonprofit clients that work in the social justice sector. Um and that’s probably about 70% of what we do and the remaining 30% or arts and conservancies and we help nonprofits with their individual giving and major donor fundraising and their special events.

[00:03:14.34] spk_1:
All right. And we’re gonna talk about special events. Um are where are each of you in each of you? In N.Y.C.

[00:03:21.94] spk_4:
I am in new york city.

[00:03:23.84] spk_1:
Okay. Where where what

[00:03:25.64] spk_4:
part? Um in Manhattan Health kitchen specifically.

[00:03:28.26] spk_1:
Alright, 9th and 10th of

[00:03:30.39] spk_4:
What? In between 9th and 10th on 49,

[00:03:52.14] spk_1:
Lot of good restaurants. Uh, 9th of from like 43rd and 44th up to like 55th or so, roughly 50, maybe 53. Some a lot Outstanding restaurants all along, 95. I’m envious of your food choices. There’s everything from Afghan. The Zimbabwe is on 9th. I think there was like 10, 12 blocks or so.

[00:03:58.44] spk_4:
Yeah, exactly. And it’s like almost feels like europe now with all the outdoor dining, they’ve completely shut down some streets and it’s just quite lovely.

[00:04:07.40] spk_1:
Right, right, so not ninth that they didn’t close. 9th of though, have they?

[00:04:11.10] spk_4:
Not 9th at but the side streets

[00:04:20.84] spk_1:
that go off of it. Right, right. We need folks need ninth, they have to get to haunt tunnel every day, Lincoln Lincoln, I should say in your neighborhood Lincoln tunnel every day. Gwen all right, so gwen, you’re an outlier, you’re not an N.Y.C. Where are you?

[00:04:24.94] spk_2:
Um I am actually, although I, when I’m in the city, you know pre pandemic in Boerum Hill Brooklyn. Um and right now though I’m writing out the pandemic in Jackson Wyoming, we have a small family place out here and I came out for a week vacation when things went isolated and haven’t left.

[00:04:44.94] spk_1:
Yeah, the week vacation that, that hasn’t ended yet in over

[00:04:47.72] spk_2:
a year in the great outdoors.

[00:04:49.84] spk_1:
Yeah, cool. So your window, your window Wyoming?

[00:04:52.84] spk_2:
Exactly and we have a window India to right now one of our graphic designers is based in India where she was writing about the pandemic and so we’re worldwide.

[00:05:06.84] spk_1:
Okay, that’s strictly N.Y.C. alright, your Boerum Hill. So you live in Boerum Hill. Yeah. Remember the park slope food co op by any chance

[00:05:13.62] spk_2:
know, but a couple of my colleagues are half of us live in Brooklyn and yeah, so I know it’s changed a lot during the pandemic with the work hours and such, but what a great place.

[00:05:57.74] spk_1:
It is a great place and I’m still a member. I live on the beach in north Carolina. I’m still a member of park slope food go up. Uh you know, they suspended the, they suspended the work requirements for the whole year. Now, they’re just slowly getting back into the member work requirement, but it’s optional for several months. And you know, I don’t know when I’ll be back up, but uh I maintain my membership in the go up because before that you could bank your shift, you could do, you could work a bunch of months. Uh you could work a bunch of shifts like in a week or even in a months and have them for subsequent months for many, many months. So I never lived

[00:05:58.31] spk_3:
in a community.

[00:06:27.74] spk_1:
It’s a great, it is great community park slope food co op shout out. I’m gonna be one of the most distant members. I mean north Carolina, you know, it’s not, it’s not easy to get there, but it’s, I keep my membership, it’s still worth it. All right, so we should be talking about your N.Y.C. you’re not your window N.Y.C. topic, you’re 21 ntc topic, which is a virtual events for the masses inclusive and interactive gatherings, Evan, what what is this all about? You’ve got uh you did like window did like 25 virtual galas in 2020. What you’ve got lessons for us.

[00:07:21.34] spk_4:
Yeah, we um, we quickly pivoted to uh throwing virtual events for our clients. A big part of our business, pre pandemic was was in person events, big Gallas and even smaller donors cultivation events and our firm learned quickly how to transform that experience into a virtual experience. Um, and we’ve had great success and continue to have great success um, with the, with the virtual events. Um you know, we create a space virtually on a platform where folks can gather and interact and have a really sort of intimate moment with, with the charity and we’ve found that fundraising has met or exceeded all of our, all of our goals um, for each of our clients and yeah, it’s, it’s something that we think is here to stay and you know,

[00:07:31.69] spk_1:
why is that why are virtual events going to continue when we can return safely to in person events?

[00:07:37.84] spk_4:
Um, I think people just learned that there’s, there’s so much benefit to having a virtual event. Um

[00:07:43.63] spk_1:
you know,

[00:07:44.32] spk_4:
one of the most obvious reasons is that so many people can, can gather

[00:07:47.87] spk_5:
um from

[00:08:17.54] spk_4:
all over the world and you know, the, we suggested to all of our clients that they make these events free to join um and then still offer sponsorships and other ways to donate. One of the big moments that we always have in each of our virtual events is what we call our live ask. So there’s still a moment where, you know, at a typical gala, there’d be a paddle raise or live auction. We’ve adapted that to a virtual moment and you still feel that energy and get to, uh, you know, have a night of successful fundraising with, you know, sometimes up to 1000 people, sometimes more.

[00:08:48.94] spk_1:
Okay, Alright. So remaining remaining relevant virtual events and uh, so I gather you have a bunch of, a bunch of ideas, like some new, I don’t know, maybe their new best practices or tips tools, strategies for successful virtual events. Is that, is that right? You’re gonna share a bunch of what you learned, how we’re going to bring in some, uh, inclusivity as well. Do I have that?

[00:10:17.94] spk_2:
Yeah, I’ll jump in here. I mean, you know, add on to what Evan said, um, that inclusivity by making it open to a broader range of people, not only your major donors that could afford that $500,000 dinner ticket when we were in person, but also everyone staff clients, People that benefit from the work of the non profit organization, really just reinforce all the positive things about your organization’s community. So the major donors feel great because they’re actually getting to interact with, as I said, some of the people that are benefiting from the programs and you know, it hits home in a really different way. You also get to grow your list. So all of those and we’re saying that, you know, somewhere between twice as many and three times as many people register for these events as you would get in the room. So let’s say you had a 400 person gala at Chelsea piers, see the dinner, you could get a, you know, 800 people registered for your event, usually about 70% of those actually tune in that evening. Um those are 300 new people, you know that you can, you know do some research on prospect with them if they come to the event, they now know about your organization, and so you know it’s a great way to grow your list, it’s really hard to grow your list in in real life, it has been traditionally and so that’s when big benefit in addition to this, just community feel and people really getting to know your organization and be interactive with it.

[00:10:27.99] spk_1:
All right, Gwen, let’s stay with you, let’s get into some ideas that you have about producing successful events. What should we start with?

[00:13:46.24] spk_2:
Yeah, I mean, one of the biggest things is with virtual events is to be creative, there is no one cookie cutter way to do it for all in our opinion, you know, we do, Evan can talk later about some of the platforms we use if that’s going to be relevant to this conversation, but you know, we have a platform that works, but it’s really flexible for whatever program the client wants to put on and, you know, we highly recommend not just translating, you know, speakers at a podium to the virtual world. We want to make it much more engaging and exciting, fast paced dynamic. Um and so one of the biggest things we like to do is a little bit of what we’re doing today, have your speakers in conversation, and that could be honorees in conversation with someone who would traditionally present them in the world world, but it doesn’t even have to be that formulaic or formatted. It can be um an honoree in conversation with an expert in the field of what, you know, let’s say you’re doing immigration or foster care work, who are those experts in the field, let’s work them in because that’s a big part of what your audience is going to be engaged in hearing from. Obviously if you can get some celebrities, it’s wonderful. Um we do find that we’ve been able to get yeses for more celebrities in the virtual world than we did in the real world. I think part of it is because um even though there’s an event day that we stream on this event, we do pre record most of it, that’s the, you know, behind the scenes real life um reality. Um we primarily do that because we want to ensure a seamless experience. Um and prerecorded can still be totally relevant, totally topical. Um you know, during the heights of the pandemic and the craziness of the previous administration, we did end up when there was some, something crazy in the news, we did end up re recording, say um an executive directors piece, very, very close to the event because something relevant happened that, you know, we don’t want to be tone deaf about. So anyway, pre recording really helps as well. And then it helps again with those high profile people, whether they be on res or donors, um you know, who you want to get speakers or celebrities because um you know, you can do it around their schedule. Um also we just find that some very many of these high profile people who may have had just insane travel schedules, you know, our were more available and certainly, you know, had such a big urge to get back. So that was a big piece of it. Um the other um thing that we highly recommend is to share the record and share the event. You know, use it more than event day. You can either, you know, distribute it via your blast on your website through um, you know, as the full piece, which is great to do, but then also, you know, create some video clips um and share those unsocial and wherever you can for the relevant audiences. Uh and then I guess the last big piece and and maybe this should be a whole section of conversation today is looking to the future and hybrid event. So you know, depending on when you want to fit that and we can talk about that as well.

[00:15:28.54] spk_1:
It’s time for a break. Turn to communications. They help nonprofits like your nonprofit tell compelling stories and gain attention like attention in the Wall Street Journal, the new york Times, the chronicle of philanthropy and lots of other outlets. You’ve been hearing me name, Turn to communications. Your story is their mission turn hyphen two dot c o. Now back to virtual events. I love the idea of recognizing that you’re honorees and celebrities are so much more available for a virtual event and pre recording to, to present during the event. Um honorary, honorary timing can be a bet. Yeah, I’d love to be your honoree, but you know, I’m gonna be in new Zealand that week so I, I can’t do it. But you know, you could record from new Zealand or we can record from your home six weeks in advance. You know, it’s very good, very good point. Maybe that’s obvious it’s probably obvious to those of you who are doing events. Uh, I’m a lay person. I’m just, I’m learning this for the, for the 25 minutes or so that were together. So you spend your time studying this. Um, is that all the, the Evan, is that, is that all the strategies be creative pre record, you know, try to leverage celebrities, celebrity availability, honoree availability, share. Repurpose. Uh We could talk maybe about hybrid any any other tips though before we move onto platforms and resources.

[00:16:27.74] spk_4:
Yeah I mean one thing just to add on to the prerecorded tip is you know we do also Sprinkle in um some some live moments and you know and we and we do that strategically so we do reinforce that feeling that this is happening live throughout the event. And then you know we often will have our live moment directly in the middle or in the first half sometimes we’ll open up with a with a live em see that’s another great tip for a virtual event is to to have an EMC who can tie everything together, who’s really energetic um who can end you know can also interact with guests as they’re chatting. Um That really uh we found that the chat is crucial which is um which is why the platform is so so important when producing a virtual event. You know, we uh made a decision not to do our events on our most of our events on zoom because people are you know a little zoomed out and zoomed fatigue.

[00:17:08.54] spk_1:
We’re gonna we’re gonna get we’re gonna get to the platform. Um but the interesting it sounds like you need some you need an M. C. With a little higher higher capacity because all the moments are not gonna be scripted ideally because like suppose there’s a technical glitch, you know you want an EMC who can make fun of it be flexible not get flustered because you know they have to do a little tap dance for for a minute or two while you figure out the back end problem or something. So it sounds like you need a and see a little more uh yeah bring a little more to the game. Yeah that’s

[00:17:45.14] spk_4:
that’s ideal. I mean we you know we’ve also worked with with folks who aren’t professional M. C. S. And part of window service is we are day of support so we on that back end are all on a conference call you know in a headphone in the M. C. S. Ear in case one of these you know glitches happens or we need to communicate something or you know we just had a $75,000 gift. Um So you know really another beautiful thing about ritual events is that they really are you know opportunities for everyone, you don’t have to have a professional EMC does help you know but not required.

[00:18:19.74] spk_1:
It sounds like great fun. I would like if you if you ever if you ever need of an M. C. I would love to do something like that. Uh You seem great. I would love it. I love the flat. I mean I’ve done improv, I’ve done stand up comedy but I’m not trying to give you my resume but it just sounds like fun, it could be great you know, there’s a great energy and you got the producers in your ear, helping, you know, coaching through and, you know, and then you you’re on your wing it for a couple seconds, or like a great gift announcement, Whoa, you know, bring that person up, whatever. All right. Um All right, so what’s the, what’s this cool platform? That’s uh supersedes zoom.

[00:18:28.94] spk_4:
Well, there’s, you know, there’s a number of platforms, The one that we’ve been using primarily is called demio. Um it’s

[00:18:29.69] spk_1:

[00:19:07.54] spk_4:
demio demio D E M I O um it’s very intuitive, it’s beautifully designed. You can customize it. The chat function is, you know, very easy to use and fun, you know, it’s not it’s not hidden. You can use emojis, that’s another great thing for this. Um for the chat is the use of emojis or GIFs, um, ways to express an emotion, right? You can also tag people um, so you can speak to them specifically. Um and we’re seeing that, you know, more and more of these platforms are popping up and increasing and that interactivity element more and more, but Demi has been our preferred platform

[00:20:08.74] spk_2:
and the other real important, really important reason. We started with demio and then just Evan and our other team members do a lot of research. Probably weekly on what tuck has changed, you know, should we stick with this or try something else and they keep reinforcing that, this is the right one, but what I was going to say is that there’s a real ease of registration for people, you know, for guests coming to the event and that was really important to us. Well in the beginning zoom was you know, sometimes if you didn’t have the latest app you wouldn’t have the audio or you know it was difficult, I know zoom is really smooth out, but still this is easier than the zoom app, people literally put in their name, their email address, they get a unique link to click on reminders, come to them a day ahead, three hours ahead, 15 minutes ahead, they click in there in and the unique link is nice too, because then you don’t have to worry about someone getting in and zoom bombing or what have you, so you know it really is sort of a great gatekeeper, gatekeeper and really easy to use and then for those producing the event um what we don’t want to forget is that it’s incredibly great for uploading our content, switching between live and pre recorded um going to that live text to pledge moment that have been referenced, so you know, there’s some real advantages to delivering a seamless event as possible.

[00:20:41.84] spk_1:
Gwen, would you just reinforce it please and just spell demio again?

[00:20:45.12] spk_2:
Yeah, I d like dog e m I O demio

[00:20:49.52] spk_1:
alright, thank you, thank you.

[00:21:13.44] spk_4:
And one thing I will, I’m sorry, I will just say is that sometimes what we’ll do is tack on a zoom after party to radio events. So to me is sort of like the main event. This is when you go and you see and you hear and you fundraise and then, um, we, you know, even auto directs people to the zoom afterparty. If that is something that you’re planning, um, where folks can actually get on camera and see each other, we can, you know, do a toast. We’ve done dance parties. Um,

[00:21:55.84] spk_1:
you gotta move on. That’s cool. I love the idea of the after party though. Cool. And after party for virtually all right. Um, you know, we’ve had, I’ve had a bunch of guests from ntc talk about inclusivity. Uh, so I’m gonna, we’re gonna, we’re gonna pass that part with the three of us. But I would like to talk about communicating with these new supporters, Gwen, that you said, you know, you could end up with hundreds of folks that wouldn’t have attended your, your, your in person event virtually obviously because they can come in from all over the world. Uh, we just have a couple minutes more left. So what’s your advice around engaging folks who are new to your organization? First time was is this terrific demio based event.

[00:23:45.94] spk_2:
Yeah, exactly. Well, what we are finding to that many of these new uh, guess, you know, become donors that night they donate in the text to pledge, which is just the first step. And so of course the biggest thing right away is acknowledging and thanking and then, um, which happens right after the event. Every donor to the text to pledge and to the event. You know, anyone who’s, who’s donated any amount, um, pre or at and then post event when we do send out the full event recording, we do give another opportunity to text to pledge. And then, yeah, it’s the thinking. It’s just the ongoing blocking and tackling and cultivation. So, you know, we would add those people to our clients email list. We would include them in our newsletters are ongoing e blast. Um, I will say, you know, we would recommend that the organization screen and rate their new donors like, you know, a traditional, you know, fundraising approach. Let’s take a look at these people owe somebody gave us $1,000 that night. If they give us 1000, there’s probably a lot of capacity there. Let’s do a little more research. And for anyone who’s a real real major donor, um, they should get thanked more personally. So maybe the executive director reaches out after the event and thanks them or you know, has a virtual coffee with them down the road. But you know, just slowly inappropriately. You know, seeing how interested they are in the event and see how you can engage them down the road both as a donor, maybe as a board member, maybe as a volunteer. If your organization has a lot of volunteer opportunities, but you know, just to engage because they came and they got involved.

[00:23:50.14] spk_1:
Can you say a little more going about what to do maybe in the the days following the event that that first, that first follow up opportunity, can you drill down a little more?

[00:24:12.64] spk_2:
Yeah, exactly. We highly recommend a post event. He blessed the exact day after or you know, if for some reason you did an extra day um, within within a couple of days of the event to thank everyone for coming, share the full event, recording with your list. Anyone who both signed up to come but didn’t tune in and are your list of who didn’t sign up to come because now you can see it right? People are busy and while we are experiencing an increased number of people joining these events, there’s obviously a lot of people that just can’t on a given day. So you know, that post event d blast is really important. And again, to give one more opportunity to give to the event and support the work and then sending those, thank you an acknowledgement letters that actually are, you know, the official tax letter that people can use in their, in their tax taxes, um, with any donations that have been made. And then just, you know, I’m going um, can be staying in touch with donors. Um, you know, we recommend that, um, that people use e blast, you know, at least you know, monthly, um, and social posts to stay in touch with donors and then ideally maybe a quarterly newsletter. And then if it’s appropriate, if you can segment your list enough, even some special donor communications a couple of times a year to those most major donors that are a little more inside re

[00:25:26.15] spk_1:
okay. Okay.

[00:25:27.94] spk_2:
And when we can get back into it cultivation events, you know, we love having, you know, pre pandemic and we’ve actually got a couple tentatively scheduled for the fall. You know, that would be outdoor. You know, like a person who has a building with a rooftop, you know, invite, you know, a small group of people to gather and hear from the executive director of the program. People about what’s new and what’s been going on with the organization. We feel like there’s a lot of pent up demand for that.

[00:26:02.14] spk_1:
Don’t feel the events don’t feel the events. All right. Evan. We just have a minute or so left. So why don’t you just leave us with some last minute motivation,

[00:26:39.84] spk_4:
um, motivation for virtual events. I would say do one, do one, do one. There’s, you know, the world is really your oyster. Um, start with developing a run of show that is less than one hour. That’s, that’s the time that we, um, recommend. And just think about the story that you want to tell and then the folks that you want to tell it. Um and you can, you can produce a virtual event on any budget um and you know, do it within three months even less. Um it’s something that you won’t regret and it will live in perpetuity.

[00:26:58.84] spk_1:
All right in perpetuity. Well nothing is better than that. That’s Evan Briggs client and digital fundraising and client engagement manager at window. N.Y.C. along with Gwen, Socgen, Director of special events fundraising also at wingo, N.Y.C. Evan and Gwen, thank you very much.

[00:27:07.77] spk_2:
Thank you. Thank you so much. tony pleasure all you about EMC

[00:30:35.54] spk_1:
Yeah, wait, let me get to my art show for our audience. Thank you for being with tony-martignetti non profit radio coverage of 21 Ntc were sponsored by turn to communicate, we should be sponsored by window with all these shout outs but we’re not. We’re sponsored by turn to communications turn hyphen two dot C o. It’s time for Tony’s take two sharing really is caring who can you share? non profit radio with may I make a suggestion Ceos Executive directors board members, non profit radio has proven to be valuable for these folks, I hear the feedback from them in this way it sparks conversations, it stimulates thinking, it broadens perspective, gives you something to think about. Maybe even and to talk about and then maybe even act on in your non profit so these conversations these thoughts often start at the leadership level so that’s why I’m saying ceo Executive director board member uh, I think last week’s Show is a perfect example of that. The performance improvement. Talking about the 360 assessments, 3 60 feedback ideal for leadership to think about as a method of performance improvement for for a team. Um, this week’s show, this week’s show more of an example of something that someone in leadership would share with the folks on their team that it’s appropriate for. So virtual events. Um uh, goes to the folks who are thinking about working on, not just thinking about, but who work on events. The design for non designers. If that applies in someone’s organization then they’re likely to pass it on that you know, every every shop can’t afford a design, a designer or design team certainly or even necessarily freelance consulting to help with design as you will hear my guests josh and mike say so in that case it’s leadership passing on segments, conversations that are appropriate to the folks that they’re right for. So C E O s executive directors, board members, they are terrific listeners. They get value from nonprofit radio do you know someone in one of those positions that you can share? non profit radio with, I’d be grateful if you do please sharing is caring, thanks very much for sharing. non profit video That is Tony’s take two now it’s time for designed for non designers welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio coverage of 21 Ntc the 2021 nonprofit technology conference were sponsored at 21. Ntc by turn to communications turn hyphen two dot C O. With me. Now our josh, Lyman and Mike, Yamagata, they’re both from Great Believer. Josh is founder and president. Mike is art director. Welcome josh. Mike Welcome from Great Believer.

[00:30:38.84] spk_0:
Thank you. Thanks tony

[00:30:40.17] spk_1:
My pleasure. And josh welcome back to a nonprofit radio

[00:30:43.74] spk_3:
Happy to be back to timer.

[00:30:53.14] spk_1:
Yes, we’re talking about the design designed. Your session was designed tips for the non designer. I’m actually gonna start with you mike as the designer as the art director, we can actually do this. We can, we can instill some some degree of design in people in like less than half an hour.

[00:31:05.44] spk_0:
We can. It is possible. Yes. Uh, there’s just some fundamentals and you just have to know it and where you go.

[00:31:22.04] spk_1:
All right, we’ll see where we go. Right. My extent of my design is symmetry. That’s all I know. That’s all I can do. If you go to my yard outside my yard, it’s symmetric. Uh, if you look at my, I don’t know, you look at my furniture, it’s symmetric. Um, when I draw something, it’s a house with a roof and there’s a window on each side of the house, so straight symmetry.

[00:31:33.81] spk_3:
No chimney.

[00:31:34.99] spk_1:
Maybe you could help me? Part of me was that josh?

[00:31:38.03] spk_3:
I said no chimney on that house.

[00:32:00.34] spk_1:
No, because that would be a said, well, I have to put it right in the middle. Usually a chimney is off the side so that would mess up place metric get all right. Um, All right. So let’s go to the non designer josh. I mean, you’re not, you’re the, you’re the chief of this, uh, uh, design company, but you’re not necessarily a designer. You you feel confident to that we can do this.

[00:32:27.94] spk_3:
I do. I’m the ultimate non designer because I started the design agency and I have no design expertise or experience or clout of any sort or kind. Um, mike is nodding and it’s very true. And this session is for people who work at nonprofits who did not intend in starting about non profit to do design work. Maybe they’re Occam’s associate or they work in the marketing department. And suddenly one day someone says, hey designed this flyer design the social media graphic and they’re like, I don’t really know where to start, but our our session is about how those people actually can be designers and they can learn some pretty straightforward basic fundamentals to improve their design and to improve it. Starting today after they listen to this session.

[00:33:08.54] spk_1:
Absolutely. We’re gonna take a day to give some thought to the session to the podcast and then uh, start, start the day after, start the day after you listen. And of course, you know its design tips for the non designer. It’s not great design for the non designer. So, you know, this is not like those ads, those early Photoshop adds years ago, I’m dating myself but you know, take a Photoshop course and you’ll be a great designer. We’re not we’re not advocating that Photoshop even still exist. Mike, is

[00:33:12.22] spk_0:
this still a thing? Okay.

[00:33:16.74] spk_1:
All right. So, um let’s start with some fundamentals. I feel like we should start with the art director. What are some design fundamentals

[00:33:52.14] spk_0:
of course? Um first one, I talk a lot about graphic design in general. It’s all about visual communication, Right? So that’s the whole point. So you want to create strong uh design which equals strong communication, getting your message and ideas across effectively and clearly. And you need a few things to make that happen. And a few of the things that we talked about our session were four design fundamentals. Those are color typography, white space and hierarchy. So those are four of the building blocks. You know, there are more, we thought we’d start with those and I can talk a little bit about them if you want me to or

[00:33:59.64] spk_1:
Yeah, it’s a little it’s a little about each one. Yeah, just like we’re gonna

[00:35:14.54] spk_0:
build on these. Yeah, exactly. We’re building the building blocks. So color used to draw attention, communicate emotions, ideas, meetings without any text at all. So colour is a really powerful tool. Um typography, it’s just the style or appearance of text. You use typography to establish strong visual order. Also known as hierarchy. Readability. Accessibility. Especially for the visually impaired, you want to have strong typography and it balances out the overall tone of the design. Then there is white space which doesn’t mean white space, it means negative space. Right? So the space between the elements, you actually want to use white space as a design element. It helps with readability, prioritising content. Um kind of leading your eye from A to B. And then hierarchy is actually a visual technique where you’re putting all those three fundamentals together to create visual order. So it helps the user go from A. To B to Z. And it navigates you through everything. So hierarchy is kind of like um once you get all these three fundamental together you put those pieces together and then you get hierarchy. So those are the four fundamentals.

[00:35:34.54] spk_1:
I feel like I get I get I I see bad hierarchy uh like all the times you see a piece you don’t know where to read how to read it or you know or how to say the word that they made up or something? You know, there’s not enough visual clues to guide me through this new word or the peace generally like do I read up here or is this more important on the side or you know?

[00:35:39.74] spk_0:
Okay. Exactly. And that’s actually called cognitive overload, where your eyes don’t know where to

[00:35:44.92] spk_1:
look. It takes

[00:35:45.87] spk_0:
so much in, you know you only have so many seconds to retain it and then poof, it’s gone. So then you lose it, you know? So that’s the answer. So

[00:35:58.54] spk_1:
uh so now josh, how do we apply these fundamentals to our blank screen that were expected to come up with? Should we, should we design a sample piece? Should we be working with a, should we talk about a hypothetical piece or should we not do that? How do we, how do we apply? What what might just explain?

[00:36:12.63] spk_3:
Mm That’s good. That’s the ultimate question. I think it kind of depends what level of a designer you are. If you’re someone who’s already done some design work for your non profit, you’ve made a flyer, made a postcard, made a social media graphic. You can kind of look back at the design work you’ve already done through the new lens of colors. You know, Am I using too many colours typography? Is there a nice contrast here between the Fonz? I’m using um white space. Is this work? I’m doing too crowded. Is there no room to breathe and that all ladders up the hierarchy? Like mike was saying. So I think if you’ve done some work, it’s kind of time to do a little audit and look back at what you’ve done. I’m sure you’ve gotten better over the years, but there’s still probably room for improvement to communicate your message even more clearly.

[00:37:18.73] spk_1:
Let’s talk about some of the colors. What what some of the colors mean to me, red is anger or you know, but I’m the symmetric guy, so don’t pay no attention to what I say. I’m just, I’m just a lackluster host here. Um, say say either one of you, uh say something about some some basic colors and what they evoke.

[00:38:16.42] spk_0:
Sure, absolutely. I mean colors it’s tricky, right, because colors red represents danger. Stop. You know, it’s a cultural thing. So it’s, it gets tricky there. What we’re trying to focus on more is um, sometimes designers use formulas, so they use complementary colors which colors are opposite of each other on the color wheel or analogous colors, which colors are that are paired next to each other on the color wheel. Uh one of the really nice tips we like to say is use monochromatic colors. So what does that mean? That just means using one color, but changing the value or saturation, so light to dark or the intensity of that color. And before you know it, you can use one color and spread that into four or five different colours. Uh, so if you’re looking at, you have your own brand guidelines, let’s say you only have a certain amount of colors or you can really get a lot of mileage out of using one color. So those are a couple of things we’d like to use. But yeah, color can definitely use to draw the attention to bullseye into an area to lead each other areas. But we like to start with the basics. So yeah, those those formulas really help people.

[00:38:28.42] spk_1:
Let’s start with some or talk about some of those brand guidelines as you just mentioned it. And that was, that was part of your, your session. What are these?

[00:38:37.92] spk_3:
I can take that one.

[00:38:40.92] spk_1:
it’s your non, you know, non designer. So you need to jump in whenever you can talk about something.

[00:38:45.01] spk_3:
I know a bit over here. Probably

[00:38:57.22] spk_1:
resented by everybody at the agency. Right? You have no guy even Why is this guy leading us? All right. I’m trying to cause dissension and great believer. All right Brain guidelines please.

[00:40:30.11] spk_3:
So every organization needs to have brand guidelines. The brand guidelines need to explain what’s your logo and what are different lockups of that logo? Is there a horizontal version? Is there a vertical version? It needs to describe your fonts, You know, what are the funds in your logo? What are your headline fonts? What your body copy fonts? And what colors do you have in your palate? What’s your primary color palette? Is their secondary color palette? Brand guidelines should also show dues and don’t for your logo. So for example, don’t change the font and the logo. Don’t stretch it. Don’t put it behind a different colored background. Don’t change the colors, things like that. So even if a non profit does not have brand guidelines, they should make them. We actually did a poll during our session, we asked all the attendees if your organization has brand guidelines and about, Let’s see about 85, said they do have brand guidelines, which is great. Um, and if they don’t, we said you should just go make some and you can make them literally in a Microsoft-word document where you just type out here are colors. Here are fonts, here’s how our logo works and then build on it over the years and make it a more expansive document. But it’s really important to have to make sure there’s consistent communication. So if the non designer at a nonprofit starts to utilize, let’s say another colour like Mike was saying, maybe you’re gonna explore a monochromatic color, a different hue of color in your main palette that should then go into your brand guidelines. So other people that pick up on your work, let’s say an external design agency uses those same colors and things feel cohesive. So we’re big believers in brand guidelines for consistency but also knowing that they can evolve over time as your brand

[00:41:11.01] spk_0:
evolves. Likewise. Yeah. And I’ll also like to say that brand guidelines, you know, they’re, you’re mentioning, how do you start, you know, how do you start designing something blank piece of paper? What can you do? Well, you really should look at your brand guidelines in there. There should be also samples of, you know what a poster’s should look like, what should a page and website look like. So these are all guys to help any designer pick that brand guy lines up and start to use it because it’s all about building and strengthening your brand recognition. And the first step is building that brand guideline and then following all of those elements and using them consistent.

[00:42:23.10] spk_1:
It’s time for a break, send in blue. It’s the all in one digital marketing platform that has tools to build end to end digital campaigns that look professional that you can afford and that keep you organized. It’s all about digital campaign marketing, most marketing software enterprise level made for big companies with the big company. Price tag, sending Blue is priced for nonprofits. It’s an easy to use marketing platform that walks you through the steps of building a campaign to try out sending blue and get the free month. Go to the listener landing page at tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant in blue. We’ve got boo koo but loads more time for design for non designers. You have some software resources that are simple enough that people can use them but fancy enough that they can do the do the do at least some basic, some basic design like color topography, et cetera. Where should we, what can we start with? What is what’s the first resource that you like mike.

[00:42:38.40] spk_0:
Oh for me, my bread and butter was would always be creative cloud, which is Photoshop still a thing illustrator in design. Um, but also utilizing newer apps like sketch or sigma, which is more about web design. Digital focus materials josh can talk to more about that

[00:42:53.60] spk_1:
spell sigma pleases ph

[00:42:55.54] spk_0:
f uh f I G F

[00:42:57.66] spk_1:
a thick. Okay,

[00:42:59.15] spk_0:
big and a fig

[00:43:00.13] spk_1:
leaf. Okay. Uh,

[00:44:33.59] spk_3:
and I can, I can pick up on that because the tools that mike mentioned are for people who are designer designers and who are more advanced, they can use the creative cloud programs to design things from scratch. They can use figure sketch to design websites from scratch a tool that we love. And we actually use ourselves and also encourage our nonprofit friends to use those non designers is Canada and Canada is probably a very popular program at lots of non profits because first of all it’s free for most nonprofits to use. But it’s also very user friendly in terms of developing templates. So developing a template for a postcard or a flyer or business cards, something like that. It has a really nice web based kind of drag and drop interface that still lets you make things that are customized and fun and branded. So we think Canada is a really nice starting point because you can really do anything in there are session. We actually asked all the attendees, you know, what kind of design work do you find yourself doing most often? And social media was number one, but people said they do web, they do email, they do print. Um there’s so much you can do within Canada to create something that’s beautiful and still fits within your brand guidelines and your brand architecture. So we were big fans of Canada and something else. Speaking of email, male chimp, constant contact platforms like that, make it pretty easy to develop a blast templates that you can apply your colors to apply. Not maybe not your direct funds, but a font that resembles your font to make things still feel nice and feel cohesive and feel engaging. So we like those tools specifically for email blasts, but recommend can refer a lot of other design endeavors.

[00:44:54.59] spk_1:
Cool. Okay, even I’ve heard of Canada, I think it’s I think that’s pretty, pretty widely known, but I’m glad, you know, a little more detail. Um and you mentioned. So like Canada you can do the postcard template. So those those templates that you do could be part of your brand guidelines. Here’s our here’s our template for an announcing event. Here’s our template for whatever campaign postcard, etcetera. Okay,

[00:45:17.09] spk_3:
Yeah. And camp gives you these kind of starter templates. So it can say, you know, postcard four by six inches. So it gives you the the real estate to work with and then you can actually design the peace within it. So you’re not kind of crawling in the dark. It gives you a nice starting point. Okay.

[00:45:18.49] spk_1:
All right. I’m glad to see, I’m trainable. I’m glad to know that. I’m glad to learn that there’s there’s hope beyond symmetry. All right. Um, but we still got a good amount of time together mike. What what else? Any other, any other resources?

[00:46:03.28] spk_0:
George resources for color. Uh Good one is coolers dot C O C O L O R S dot C. O. What they do is you can start to pick and choose and make your own palette and create different color combinations. What you can also do is lock in certain colors. So let’s say in your brad guidelines, you have a blue or red and a green. You can punch those colors in, lock it and then just start to play and create different palettes around it. So I think that’s a really good resource to use for

[00:46:05.49] spk_1:
colours, coolers,

[00:46:07.03] spk_0:
spellers. Sorry?

[00:46:28.88] spk_1:
Yes, coolers. You said it coolers dot C. O. Right. Yeah, that’s yeah. Okay. Okay. Um um, say a little more about the sweet that you both mentioned. The that includes, um, Photoshop. Uh, what was the suite of, It sounds like a suite of three in design, Photoshop and illustrator, illustrator, illustrator. Yeah. What is that expensive for? For folks?

[00:47:09.28] spk_0:
It can be it’s a subscription based type deal. Now, before you could just buy it outright and then I get free updates, but now it’s a subscription based, so yeah, you’d have to pay monthly for it. Uh To me it’s it’s worth it because that’s what I use every day. Uh interesting what josh says if it’s feasible to have a whole team to use it um because I need to get multiple accounts for it. But yeah, illustrators mostly used for icon vector work, it’s actually drawing things out and making vectors out of it so you can scale it. Photoshop is used to retouch photos um and in design is mainly for printed pieces like brochures, laying those out books, magazines, china reports.

[00:47:16.78] spk_3:
Yeah, I’ll just say, you know, cost around 100 a little under $100 per license. So per per person to access these programs as well as others, a little under $100. And one thing might mention

[00:47:30.34] spk_1:
Like $100 per month per person.

[00:47:32.47] spk_3:
Exactly, roughly. Okay. Yeah. And this is still for like the kind of design or design or someone who’s a little more adept and skilled and has more experience in the design space to use programs like these that can really unleash their skills. And one thing mike said that I think worth mentioning, especially since tony you mention Photoshop before is a lot of non profits tend to use Photoshop for creating templates for let’s say for a postcard for a social media post. And we actually don’t recommend that Photoshop is really a photo editing tool and if you’re going to make simple templates, we definitely recommend Canada it’s a lighter weight, easier to use. Program Photoshop, it gets a little complicated files get big and like maybe you could talk a little more about Photoshop is not the right fit for that. We try to restrict Photoshop to photo editing, which is really

[00:48:31.97] spk_0:
its core purpose. You can get very in depth with Photoshop, but it’s not really needed. If all you’re making is a template for something. It’s a lot of times. Professional people retouch photos, video, all of those things. So yeah, completely not needed. Okay, canvas, canvas, canvas.

[00:48:58.87] spk_1:
Alright. Um All right. We still got some time, uh, techniques. You know, how to how to visualize, you know, like what goes on in this designer brain of yours. Like what what are you thinking about while you’re creating something? What does give you a little peek? That’s like that’s why I always sucked at math and science. I never knew what was going on in their mind. Like you show me how to do it. But what are you thinking about? How do you conceive

[00:49:57.57] spk_0:
of it? Yeah, it’s I’ll give you another peak. Um It’s it’s it’s keeping these fundamentals in check. But then also looking at the world around you, looking at type around you, looking at colors around you, look at how other people are doing it. You know, create mood boards for yourself? Look at other anything that gives you visual stimulation. Go for it. And it’ll kind of help the board. What’s the mood board. So, mood board is something that helps get all of your thoughts Home together distilled onto one board. So that’s photography style color type. You know, you start to combine certain things that you find work well together and then when you then you can step back and you see it as a whole, we call that a mood board. So that helps you visualize um creating systems or identities for for branding and design in general. So it’s kind of like one of the first steps you do in your inspiration process. Okay. But yeah, some of some

[00:49:59.78] spk_1:
other quick tips. Yeah,

[00:50:54.36] spk_0:
yeah, sure. We talked about color, but maybe we can talk a little about type type and white space. Um I think for everything we’re gonna talk about, you really want to keep things simple even for, you know, designers, we’ve been designing for years, keeping it simple is always the best way to go. So in terms of typography, maybe just pick one typeface and use contrast. So different weights, different sizes, but just keep that one, you know, font and you just kind of use that throughout your piece, you know, white space? Just making sure we call a reductive design after you design something, start taking things away, just take things away and see how that looks. Does it feel cleaner. Does it feel more legible or did you lose something, you know, did you lose some of that? Um and for hierarchy, you know, we use all these different devices in terms, But one thing we always try to keep in mind is, you know, the point is to have the user be able to navigate from wherever you want from the start to finish. So you want to really create strong visual hierarchy. So using type, using colors, Using that white space to your advantage, not giving too much clutter, not using too many colours, not using too much type, not using too many shapes. So just keep it really simple. I think that’s that’s really the best tip we can give.

[00:51:22.76] spk_1:
Do people read bold, heavier, bigger fonts first and then smaller funds after. Right? All right, so that’s that’s again, I’m just learning, I’m trainable. So that’s a visual cue, you can absolutely look to your first, then look here that we want you to read this other thing

[00:51:51.16] spk_0:
that’s the smallest. Yeah. Use it to your advantage. Use uh boldness, the size, hit it with a color, get people drawn into that and then pair it with something that’s calmer. Media sans serif. Uh, font sensors, meaning, you know, these two types serif and sans serif. One has a little extra additions to the ends of the letters. Sensory

[00:51:57.96] spk_1:
culebra is a sans serif and times new

[00:52:11.45] spk_0:
times roman is a is a serif. Yeah. You know, so, you know, just using using those things to your advantage. Yeah. Doesn’t matter. Go big. Um go big, go bold draw you in. Um, and then, you know, use type and then use all these other elements to avenge.

[00:52:48.75] spk_3:
Yeah. Just to add on to what mike was saying. I think the most important thing or a really important takeaway is to definitely use restraint when it comes to the number of colors you use the number of funds you use it. So often the case that we’re working on a project where are non profit partner will say we need to do this much in this small space and we say we can’t so we need to start to figure out what can be removed and still get your message across or do we need this to be a two page piece instead of a one page piece. So I think the big take away should be that sometimes you need either more space to get across your message or you need to take pieces out to do so in a way that sticks and gets people to take action.

[00:53:16.45] spk_1:
Okay. And Mike mentioned reductive design white space. Yeah, it’s it’s it’s soothing. It’s calming. You know, what about, you know, I assume this is valid practices to share the peace with other people? Absolutely. Are they reading it right? Does it upset

[00:53:19.71] spk_0:
them, et cetera, yep. What was it was like a B testing where you give two designs to samples? The same user base and then they, you know, then we can see which ones they gravitate more towards which one is more effective.

[00:53:50.85] spk_1:
A B of course, for for a broader audience. I was thinking just within your team. No, that’s absolutely what does this look like? You know, talk me through your as you’re looking at it. What are you thinking, things like that? All right. Um, All right. So there’s, there’s hope, there’s hope for the non designer. You’re not gonna get a fine arts course, you’re not gonna get a fine arts degree in in 25 minutes. Not profit radio but there’s there’s, there’s basic, there’s basics. Alright, Alright, we’re gonna leave it there sound all right,

[00:54:03.34] spk_3:
Sounds good.

[00:54:12.54] spk_1:
Okay there, josh, Lyman founder and president at Great Believer and Mike Yamagata, art Director at Great Believer. Thank you very much. Thanks guys.

[00:54:14.11] spk_3:
Thanks tony

[00:55:07.24] spk_1:
each of you and thanks to you listener for being with non profit radio coverage of 21 Ntc where were sponsored by we should be sponsored by Great believer with all the shout out. I’m giving you a great believer, uh, their design expertise, you know, But no, we are, we’re grateful to be sponsored by turn to communications turn hyphen two dot C o next week. It’s an archive show. I will pick a winner. Trust me if you missed any part of this week’s show, I beseech you find it at tony-martignetti dot com. We’re sponsored by Turn to communications pr and content for nonprofits, your story is their mission turn hyphen two dot c O and by sending blue, the only all in one digital marketing platform empowering non profits to grow. tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant in Blue,

[00:55:23.44] spk_5:
our creative producer is clear. Amirov shows social media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our web guy and this music is by scott Stein. Mhm. Thank you for that. Affirmation scotty. You’re with me next week for nonprofit radio big non profit ideas for the other 95% go out

[00:55:42.34] spk_0:
and be great. Yeah.

Nonprofit Radio for October 5, 2012: Friends From Events & Get Engaged 1

Big Nonprofit Ideas for the Other 95%

Listen live or archive:

Tony’s Guests:

Andrea Nierenberg
Andrea Nierenberg: Friends From Events

Andrea Nierenberg, president of Nierenberg Consulting Group, talks you through her friendly steps for meeting more people at events of any kind, and building a real relationships with them. It’s remarkably simple.

This segment with Andrea has a survey. Please take a moment to answer three quick questions. You’ll find it below. Thank you! If you could also share it with other nonprofit professionals, I would appreciate it.

Amy Sample Ward
Amy Sample Ward: Get Engaged I

Amy Sample Ward, our social media scientist, kicks off her new status as contributor. This month is Part I of a series on real engagement and building trust through the social networks. She’s membership director for Nonprofit Technology Network (NTEN) and blogs for Stanford Social Innovation Review.


Create your free online surveys with SurveyMonkey, the world’s leading questionnaire tool.

Here is a link to the survey: http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/6ZPZGM5

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If you have big dreams but an average budget, tune in to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.

I interview the best in the business on every topic from board relations, fundraising, social media and compliance, to technology, accounting, volunteer management, finance, marketing and beyond. Always with you in mind.

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Hyre hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent, i’m your aptly named host it’s october fifth, two thousand twelve oh, i hope you’re with me last week. Yes, i do simply i hope you were here because last week was the law of attraction to attract major gift prospects and potential board members, you have to put your best foot forward to get what you’re seeking. Melanie schnoll begun is managing director at morgan stanley private wealth management remember, she helps her ultra high net worth clients make charitable gifts and get on boards, and she had practical and valuable advice that applies to any charity soliciting a major gift or recruiting a boardmember also private benefits not dirty but bad. We’re not talking friends with benefits. These air the rules against private and your mint excess benefit transactions and private benefit generally these rules keep your charity operating for the public good. Emily chan from the non-profit and exempt organizations law group is our monthly legal contributor and she explained all those rules this week. Friends from from events andrea nierenberg, president of nierenberg consulting group, talks you through her friendly steps for meeting more people at events of any kind and building a real relationship with them. It’s. Remarkably simple advice and get engaged. One amy sample ward, our social media scientist, kicks off. Her new status as contributor. This month is part one of a series on riel engagement and building trust through online social networks. She’s, membership director for non-profit technology network and ten, and she blog’s for stanford social innovation review. Are you on twitter at this moment? If you are, then you should be following us on the hashtag non-profit radio on tony’s. Take two in between the guests, perseverance, that’s, what i blogged this week and that’s what i’ll talk about at roughly thirty two minutes into the hour. Right now, we take a break. When we returned, i’ll be joined by andrea nirenberg, and we will talk about friends from events. Stay with me, co-branding dick, dick tooting, getting ding, ding, ding, ding. You’re listening to the talking alternative network duitz e-giving. Nothing. Good joined the metaphysical center of new jersey and the association for hyre. Awareness for two exciting events this fall live just minutes from new york city in pompton plains, new jersey, dr judith orloff will address her bestseller, emotional freedom, and greg brady will discuss his latest book, deep truth living on the edge. Are you ready for twelve twenty one twelve? Save the dates. Judith orloff, october eighteenth and greg brady in november ninth and tenth. For early bird tickets, visit metaphysical center of newjersey dot or or a nj dot net. Hi, i’m donna, and i’m done were certified mediators, and i am a family and couples licensed therapists and author of please don’t buy me ice cream are show new beginnings is about helping you and your family recover financially and emotionally and start the beginning of your life. We’ll answer your questions on divorce, family, court, co, parenting, personal development, new relationships, blending families and more. Dahna and i will bring you to a place of empowerment and belief that even though marriages may end, families are forever. Join us every monday, starting september tenth at ten am on talking alternative dot com. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Duitz lorts durney yeah, welcome back. We’re always talking about big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent, and today is no exception to that. In the studio with me now is andrea nierenberg she’s, author of several books, and i’ll ask her to name a couple of those titles in a few moments. She’s, president of nierenberg consulting group, which you’ll find at nierenberg group dot com you’ll find her name is spelled and i e r e n b e r g nierenberg group dot com, and i’m very pleased that her work and her expertise brings her to the studio and the show. Andrea welcome. Thank you so much, tony it’s great to be here. It’s a pleasure to have you i’m glad you’re with us. Thank you were talking about friends from events. People get a little intimidated at events what’s what’s up. People do because they think that when they go to any kind of an event that they have to get something and i always say before you go, set a goal in your mind that you’re curious, you’re going to go to meet a couple of new people, learn about them, and i always say when i talk about networking, the opposite of networking is not working that every time you meet someone it’s an opportunity to learn from them, be a resource or give something first, if you go with that sort of premise, it’s fun, all right? And we’ll go into detail on each of those. You know, you have a lot of advice around those, but but this is potentially walking into a room full of strangers or mostly strangers. I mean, if i only know two or three a handful of people out of the room, i might not see those people it’s intimidating. It might be, but you could do your research before you go and that’s something that we all have available right now. You can go online, you can see a little bit about the organization you can see about the event that’s going to be coming up, even a social event on a lot of times, i’ll just, you know, connect with the person who’s giving the party or whatever just to learn a little bit about that. So for something it’s a business related, i say, get in touch with the greeter or the organizer before. The event or after you’ve done some homework so you make an introduction b e mail or call them, i’ll say, i’m going to be coming and you know, i don’t really know anyone there. What advice might you have? People are shocked when people do that, then do something really important. Send a note after you’ve spoken to the person or connected with them online it’s that given you some feedback, a hand written note just to say, i’m really looking forward, all right, and we’re goingto that kind of detail. I pulled listeners before the show, and we did have low survey response this week, so maybe less reliable than usual. But one of the questions i asked was, do you prepare before attending your charities social events, for instance, who you’d like to meet, research those people and think about talking points with people? And eighty percent of the people said yes, and twenty percent said, no, they do not. So for the eighty percent will have advice. We will put a finer point on that, and for the other twenty percent, we’ll get you up to speed. Let’s, say a little more about the researcher and how first, how are we going to find out who’s going to be there? Well, sometimes you can go right online and you can see who the board of directors are if there’s a speaker who the speaker is, you can see people that have been other events that they’ve had, and again, you may not get a guest list for that particular evening or that day, but at least you’ve got some people. And again, you may not meet those particular people, but at least if you do, you have the opportunity to go to google or to go to their site or the link dan or anything to find out a little bit about them. So if you do have the opportunity to meet them there, you have some talking points are but there are other people that you could meet that you don’t have. I did the research on. Okay, andi, if this is your own charities event, you might be a fundraiser or an executive director for a boardmember going to an event, then you definitely can get a copy of the certainly i just i’m so excited about this new friends of events, i threw the microphone across the across the table, but i’m back don’t worry on dunaj un injured as well. So then, if you’re one of those people and it’s easy that you definitely should get a list of all the attendees and go through it. It’s very easy and, you know, especially if you say, you know, i really love to meet these people and connect with them on and differentiate yourself. I always say also go to google alerts because any time that somebody has been in the media or the press or anything, you can get some information and you’ll get it like in a low. So you want to set up a google alerts for someone. Now, if this is a big event, you would probably wouldn’t set it up for all the all the hundreds of people who are coming for your key people that really happened. They have that all the time for your key people, because it’s it’s something that’s ongoing because you’re just not going to go to the event, meet them and that’s it. You want to build a relationship? That’s the whole idea. And also, you don’t want to stop the people. I mean, this is this is just getting a zai say to some people gathering intelligence and information, you’re just pulling in. So you have knowledge. When you meet somebody, you have a very short window of time to make a first impression. Okay, understand? So clearly our research is part of our goal setting. When this is all subsumed, i guess in having a goal for the afternoon or the evening. Absolutely. I want to send some live listener love out tio new bern, north carolina and a story of new york that’s queen’s write stories. Queens. Of course. I knew that i used to live in forest hills, queens on dh. This may be a popular time in the story of two because it’s beer, it’s octoberfest and a story of new york happens to be known for its beer gardens. So welcome a story. Welcome. New bern, north carolina. Live listener love out to out to you that’s. Nice, of course. Well, did you expect other one that no, in fact, i’m going to be in a story tomorrow. So that’s what? Okay, cool. You thought i was? A crash host? No etiquette. Okay, that you’re great. Well, don’t get carried away. But you thought it would be okay. Okay, we’ll be fine. Um with just a minute left or so before our first break. What else should we be thinking about when we when we know who these people are that we want to talk about what we want to talk to at that event position you’re, you know, your introduction, something that’s kapin pool to them and something that you could get your point across also, but something very short, brief focus on the other person, don’t focus on herself, which a lot of times people do say something to that person that when you walk up to them, is something that you admire about them. You’ve heard them speak. You’ve read something about their work, something like that and then put out your hand and introduce yourself. Take the initiative, tying your research that you did to the opening a couple lines. We’re all right. We’re gonna take this break and when we return, of course andrea nierenberg stays with me, and i hope you do, too. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Buy-in are you fed up with talking points, rhetoric everywhere you turn left or right? Spin ideology, no reality, in fact, its ideology over intellect, no more it’s, time for action. Join me, larry shot a neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven easter for the ivory tower radio in the ivory tower. We’ll discuss what you’re born, you society, politics, business, it’s, provocative talk for the realist and the skeptic who want to go what’s really going on. What does it mean? What can be done about so gain special access to the ivory tower? Listen to me, larry. Sure you’re neo-sage tuesday nights nine to eleven new york time go to ivory tower radio dot com for details. That’s, ivory tower radio, dot com e every time i was a great place to visit for both entertainment and education listening tuesday nights nine to eleven it will make you smarter. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com welcome back, andrea nirenberg is here and we’re talking about friends from events. What is thea the next step after you or you want people to be confident? Let’s? Take that and you want to put my hand out on dh introduced myself, right? I say you have to have your intangible tool kit with you and your tangible tool kit. Okay, what your intent? Intangible you’ve done your research, you’ve set a goal for the event. You’ve also thought about your appearance. You thought about the fact that when you walk into the room, you’re going to smile and research tells us that most people do not smile when they walk into a room, and when you smile and you walk in, first of all, you become more confident you feel more confident internally, you’re approachable, and it also is something that most people aren’t always doing there exactly. So watch the next time you walk into an event. Also, think about what you’re going to say to people, have you or introduction, you know you’re twenty second, if you will introduction, sort of a headline that you’ll have also some headlines about me, yet you have somebody says hey, tony, what do you do? Right. Well, say really, even though they want to know what you do, they really want to talk about who more than anybody, right? Thumb. So right. I mean, myself with there being polite. Absolutely. But i’m just saying, but that’s, how you draw a conversation with people. So as we all know, it’s very common sense also something so basic and self simple. Turn off all your equipment. I know i say this, but how many times do you go somewhere and people are still connected? Have great eye contact. Sounds simple, not always done in a firm handshake. Simple things, but all this is in your intangible tool kit. You know, because you have to think about these things. Also, take a quick look in the mirror and make sure you do give yourself a smile because i have a greeting in my office is a mirror is has a wonderful greeting. If you smile into it, it smiles back. If you frown into it, it returns that greeting it’s basic but basic works. Plus, you want to look to make sure you have spinach thing for understanding through exactly i talk. About that in a lot of my books and people laugh, but i say, you know, what’s critical it’s critical, and then in your end, in your tangible tool kit, this is keep have your business cards, not to give them out unless somebody asked for them, but have them so that they’re with you. I always say, have a prop with you to like something that you might where i wear a lot of pins have an interesting pan, something like that. So, you know, you can start conversation also pen and paper because your people took it was very full. Well, it’s not that full because what happens things are no, i’m pinned on bulky with my cards. No, no, no, no, not a lot less is just want one cup, one interesting thing, okay? And the thing is, i always say, don’t matter how sharp your mind is, it’s still weaker than the pale of stinks so i may learn something about you, toni, and then i’m thinking, i want to be able latto follow-up but i don’t have to write something down, so if we’re in a longer conversation, i might say, with your permission, could i write a few notes down because i’d like to be able to follow-up you don’t think that’s, you don’t find that craft if we’re in a conversation for awhile for discussing things not go? No most the time, the reason i have is after we walk away, then i think development officer going more morgan’s, you know, you’re not interviewing the person, not drilling them, but you know how sometimes you just like, well, that’s, right? You talk for a while, then you might say, just let me make a couple of those yeah, right, you know? And i’ll use their business card, teo, to make those, but no, i’m gonna correct on that because one of the things is i’m glad you brought that admonished no, no, not at all, but what happens if the business card if you think about in the far east and i’ve been there eight times and i always think about that when you get someone’s business card, they give it to you almost like it’s, like it’s them. I have heard that exactly, and people study it, they look at it, they come in on it, so you know what i’ve started. To do when i go to advance or when i meet people anywhere, i will get the card. Then i might comment on it. Tell me a little bit more about that and i just did this on one of my client programs that we do these webinars and all thie advisers in the room were like saying this’s, fantastic. Okay, something to dio, but we’re not in the far east, so i mean, here in the us we live in. We don’t. We don’t revere the business card. It’s maura, we should those, but but you know what, it’s? Another talking point. So the thing is, we usually to convince me of this. All right, well, i don’t want to convict e what i always say. I know, i know. I always say take the best and leave the the rest. Okay? But my point is when i will be with you so i know twenty tow woobox tangible and, boy, i got a front once i’m learning all the time. But the funny thing is that when you do look at someone’s card or ask some questions no, that part i love because because there’s often there’s information on the card that i think, oh, i used to live there or but i don’t look at it until i’m in my house. I met you, so i’m not. I’m not disagreeing with you about the staring at the card, actually reading it in the president, nothing glancing at the card really, i am being admonished is no question about that, but that’s okay, yes, we are definitely having fun. So but it’s the it’s, the not writing on the card, you know, because we’re not in the far east, it doesn’t matter. Well, again, i always say take don’t take the bus leaving, the rest were gone and i got the window, okay, but my point is because sometimes if you write on someone’s card, you know, a lot of times then you know it gets lost or whatever i say take it back, put it into your database or wherever you keep your information and that’s really what you need to dio and then put down your notes. So i’m putting my notes elsewhere. Now, if i’m in the midst of the conversation and it’s a lengthy one, as you suggested, then i’m saying, as i’ve done you mind if i take a few notes? So i need to have a little piece of scrap paper with many scrap paper? Nice little, you know, booklet being admonished again. I i’m screwing this up so badly that you’re going to make me a hermit. I never got to see this is never going to another. You could take scrap paper. It’s. Okay, but my point is, i take a little like all these wonderful little, you know, mole skin, but yeah, they’re pretty they make a much more efficient for station pieces. They make a professional appearance. Of course. All right, you’re straightening me out there, not admonishing. Okay, let me send a little live listener love out to maywood, maywood, new jersey. I have relatives in maywood, and that could be them. I don’t know. That’s grove street in maywood, new jersey. Then that would be my aunt uncle, but could be anywhere else made with the big town maywood, new jersey live listener love. And also hey, fay, china that’s. Not that’s, not in wyoming. I don’t mean. Hey, fay, china, wyoming. I mean the city of hay faye in the country of china as well. And were very apropo to send live listener love teo to our asian listeners because we’re talking about the business card and how it’s revered and how sloppy i am at events know that you’re you’re saying it makes very good sense what i did use those in a little bit now feeling defensive, you know, that’s very bad i would those little scraps i would take in the corner on it was actually not a scrap. I mean, i would have, like, a legal pad, a couple pages, and i would have it folded, but i would go off into the corner and make my notes there, but i like i like the idea of doing it face to face with the person and having a little conversational, beautiful piece of stationery that i’m writing on or some herbal note, because it makes the other person sometimes feel well, you know what i’m saying is really important, and you’re taking an interest this guy’s a big shot. Look at this cool look, it’s called a notebook people, and i always ask permission of stock it absolutely right. I’m with you. Yeah, i’m the crash one and you know i don’t know there’s different kinds of people. Yes, we can meet absolute have them identified, categorized where those with those types of people. Okay, well, after i’ve done my own research on the people i’d like to meet if i have, i’ve identified them, so i’ve already done my homework, but i may not get to meet them, so i always want to be prepared. I walk in the door, right? The greeter is right there if i’ve had in any kind of conversation with that person in advance. It’s wonderful to be able to say hi, so great to meet you in person because you have done the previous i’m coming. I might not know too many people. If not, i still seek that person out just so i can introduce myself busy though i am not going to spend a lot of time, but you go over and say hello. I just wanted to introduce myself. Thank you so much. I’m looking forward to the event and then come back at the end also to say thank you. Okay, simple talk to the people that are in front of you and behind you in line when you’re checking. In because just to say hello, what brings you to the event? So at least start conversations, people usually that air standing by the food at the bar? Isn’t it true? Yeah, great places just to walk over to people because it’s all about starting the conversation of working, the impression is very collegial around the food table you’re sharing force and well, serving for their not shaking or you’re just talking, everybody gets their own eating. Forget my events in-kind events you’re running, but i don’t know that’s an idea, but we’re also we’re only sharing the serving fork, so but literally there’s a physical sharing it is sharing the table space around which you’re walking, you started cos bar you’ve got your elbows on the bar? Yeah, so you’re sharing and basically all you’re doing, especially for people who get intimidated a lot of times about events saying, oh, who do i talk? Teo this’s. Perfect, because you could just start a conversation. Hello? What brings you here? Open ended questions would always have your exit strategy, then exit strategy thing. The other thing is people who are by themselves, you know, there was always somebody standing or sitting alone and we’ve all been there, so i always will walk up to somebody and start a conversation with them. Also, if you’re in an event when i’m there, the odds are that guy standing alone is gonna be named tony martignetti looked out, we know it’s a lot of that’s great, so i actually do engage, but now that’s a very friendly thing to do because people who are standing alone, you know, they don’t know what to do with their hands have a drink in one hand, the other hand is in their pocket or ah, there, you know, feigning using their phone, which i know you’re that’s bad, i mean, definitely should be disconnected when you’re walking into an event supposed princessa you don’t really want to be distracted right in the midst of a conversation, even if even if there’s a tone going off and you ignore it, it’s still just, you know, it’s a distraction, right? It is, but but these people standing alone, they’re they’re fainting, using mail checking, you know, you can walk up to them and saying, of course, well, what’s, the worst right? And they’re not going to give you the worst know it wasn’t really that great there alone don’t who are there other categories of people that we threw? The other group is like if there’s everybody’s engaged and there’s, we’ve talked to all the other we’ve talked about then i always say, walk up to a group now, not to people, because two people could be having are having a conversation so you don’t want to interrupt, you know, want to stand there, but if it’s three or more people just walk up and i do this all day, that teo and i will stand there usually they know you’re there after a few settlements, right? And i’ll say something like, you look like the friendliest group here, i hope it’s okay, that i came over here alone and i never tried that, all right? I just weighed on my way in because naturally, the group will start, expand and allow you in people just do that. I mean it so’s but that’s a good one. This looked like the most interesting group. But then if you go to the group next to them, you can’t, you know, because then you can use another life or something. Like that or else by that time, you could bring over, say, tony, i’d like to introduce you to or do you know, the people over there with it’s walk over together? And isn’t that a key sort of seeming like the host you’re trying to take over from those who want to seem like making connections so little boy about exactly and that’s? Why i always take on that premise in my mind that i want to be the host or hostess when i walk in for myself. So i want to greet people and be open and everything, and also because i’m an introvert, i’m a learned that you are martignetti learned extra that’s well, that’s very encouraging for the twenty percent of people who who said they don’t do their research and actually related to that. I asked another question, preshow you’re at a professional conference and you’re the last person through the lunch buffet. There are two seats left, one is at a table of strangers. The other is a solo seat at a small table all by itself. Where will you sit? Eighty percent said they would sit at the table, strangers twenty percent said they would set up the solo table, so for that for that twenty percent that we’re talking to, so you’re meaning that they’d sit by themselves instead of sitting at a table of strangers, and then i set it up solo table, so there’s nobody’s going to sit with them. So so now for your for the person who’s dahna needs to be a learned, extroverted what’s your advice there because that’s that’s you i exactly, i would say, you know, you need to have your own kind a pep talk in your mind that when you walk in and say, you know what, i’m going to jump out of my comfort zone, and i’m going to sit with some other people i don’t know because what’s the purpose of going and sitting by myself, i’m there to learn and to meet and connect with people and say that to yourself. And if you ask the person next to you, you know, has this seat been taken? Obviously is open so you can just perfect opportunity to say hello to the person on your left person on your right and just daughter conversation, but just if you think about learning e-giving sharing and asking open ended, high gain types of questions to the people, then it’s not scary, then you don’t have to focus on yourself, okay? And small talk is has a place in this right? Small talk is big talk you say to the person is a seat open. Okay, now you’ve already opened the conversation, right? So that’s, the first person why is small talk big talk? Because that starts the conversation report and everything like that and just be open and observing and aware. So the person sitting next may, maybe they’re all talking to people. Eventually there’ll be a lull in the conversation. So while i’m watching, i’m observing and then i might just say to somebody, you know, i couldn’t help, but over here, would you mind if i, you know, offered a piece of advice on that or something? And a lot of times you get into that situation, i’m thinking of the sitting at the sitting in a seat table, strangers people start looking at you, whether they’re in a conversation or not, they start to recognize that you’re they’re just like when you’re in the in the bar area, you know? Milling in joining that group, people will start. Teo will start to recognize yes, but it’s also, you know, when you sit down and you’re the last person to sit down it’s like you make a presence right there by doing that, so even if they’re all talking to each other, you know, you sit for a minute or two, but then you just start the conversation they know you’re there being an extra vert can be learned it’s very much learned. I talked about that a lot, okay, you mentioned the exit exit strategy. All right, so now we’ve been in a minute conversation a little too long, andi were sort of getting back to small talk now, like now we’ve now we’ve exhausted goodcompany ation and we’re back talking about the weather and traffic what’s my for that if we’re going to follow-up i always say there’s four things to do in every conversation learn something about the other person. So you tell me your name. Tell me a little bit about you. I want to focus on you, the other person give something. So maybe something you told me. I could give you a piece of advice. You know, tony there’s an article that you might be interested with your permission, would it be okay to send it to you? And then i would always ask you, your preferred method of communication if we were going to stay in touch, so take something away, and then if we were going to stay in touch, find a reason to follow-up say, you know, you said you’re an email person, would it be okay to reach out to you the e mail in the next week or so? Maybe set up a coffee or something? And then it’s been great meeting you enjoy the rest of your time here? Or i might say, my time’s already been well spent. Thank you so much for the conversation enjoyed the rest where i might say, tony, i don’t know if you’ve met so and so and put the two of you together and then walk away, right? Andrea, i’m gonna believe you gave about thirty five tips in this time that we’ve spent together, so people will have to go back and listen to the podcast and take notes because incredible advice. We just have about a minute before we have to depart, tell me the name of a couple of your books, non stop networking had improved your life, working career, million dollar networking a sure way to find, grow and keep your business. And i’m very proud about the book that’s coming out networking for veterans, which was done in conjunction with military and it’s coming out on veterans day. And can we find all information about that at nierenberg group dot com? Right? Andrea, i’m going to take so i’ll take a look at the time because this is really very important to me. Tell me what it is that you love about the advice that you give the work that you’re doing around this subject that we’re talking about, because it’s, you know, i was an old dale carnegie instructor if anyone ever read that years ago in the book how to win friends and influence people, and it was very, very important to me because i was always very shy. When i moved to new york, i said, i’ve gotto really put myself out there and build my business and do everything i was going to, and i always hear my wonderful dad up in heaven. Saying to me, read that book and then take the course, and i became an instructor while i was a publisher during the day and that’s that’s a long time ago, because i started my business nineteen years ago. But mr carnegie’s advice is everyday common sense, and this is what networking really is. If you look at it about giving first being a resource and sharing with people and making friends building trust simple. Andrea nirenberg is president of nuremberg consulting group nierenberg group. Dot com. Andrew, thank you so much for being a guest. Thank you, been a pleasure. Stay with me, tony’s, take two, and then any sample war. It kicks off her new status as contributor. When we talk about get engaged, one and i have a feeling he’s going to a lot of overlap between andrews conversation and amy’s conversation. Stay with us. Talking alternative radio, twenty four hours a day. Joined the metaphysical center of new jersey and the association for hyre awareness for two exciting events. The small live just minutes from new york city in pompton plains, new jersey, dr judith orloff will address her bestseller, emotional freedom, and greg brady will discuss his latest book, deep truth living on the edge. Are you ready for twelve twenty one twelve? Save the dates. Judith orloff, october eighteenth and greg brady in november ninth and tenth. For early bird tickets, visit metaphysical center of newjersey dot, or or a h a n j dot net. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way. Look forward to serving you. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Dahna if you have big ideas but an average budget, tune into tony martignetti non-profit radio for ideas you can use. I do. I’m dr. Robert penna, author of the non-profit outcomes toolbox. Welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent time now for tony’s, take two. My block this week is perseverance. Last weekend, i did the tunnel to towers five k in here in new york city it’s ah, memorial event for a firefighter who ran through the brooklyn battery tunnel on his way to the burning the world trade center towers on september eleventh, two thousand one. And he was last seen at the corner of west and liberty streets that’s the last time he was seen alive. And so that’s what? The race starts on the brooklyn side of the tunnel and goes to west and liberty streets. And there was a there are a lot of wounded warriors walking that, um, that five k and one of them. I don’t know his name, but he moved me. He had lost in one of our wars, both legs and an arm, and he had those they’re called either j legs or sea legs. They’re called both the artificial limbs below his thighs and also had an artificial arm, and he was followed by someone who had is a wheelchair with them one of the very high tech wheelchairs, but he did not need it. He had it following him, but he never used it. And just watching him come through the tunnel. A zay was going past him, gave me chills and made me think about perseverance. And so in all our work lives and our personal lives as well. In honor of that very wounded warrior, i encourage you to persevere and that’s on my block, which is at tony martignetti dot com. And that is tony’s take two for friday, october fifth forty second show of the year with me now is amy sample ward as a snu status as regular social media contributor. Last time she was here was the one hundredth show in july. She is membership director for in ten the non-profit technology network and she’s a blogger for stanford social innovation review. Any sample word? Welcome back. Thank you. I didn’t know you were going to make me cry today. Oh, yeah, it was very human moving you just like long stride in. I was there with you. You know, you were painting a picture. Well, good radio is an intimate coming. I’m very glad of that. Heimans we’re talking today about getting engaged and engagement, of course, in online networks, this is all sort of setting the right kind of tone for our for our work online, right? Yeah, i’m so surprised how much andrea already stole our thunder for this conversation. I feel vastly under equipped. I’m not here with bucks and i don’t have a toolbox don’t like really great tweet oppcoll phrases i don’t have any of that, so we could just bring her back. No, you know what you’re doing very model, you know what you’re doing so let’s, apply your lessons, which overlap with hers. Teo teo online. What? We’re going to have the right kind of tone yeah are are working in the networks i think a lot of organizations, when they’re thinking about either starting profiles or getting them more active, the question they have is, well, what do we talk about what we do, what we say, you know, because they know that just re posting content from their website isn’t very engaging, but they’re also like, well, at least we have that content so that’s something, you know, they don’t know what to do, but just like what? Andrea? Had listed off at the end, you know, be the resource for the community, build trust start the conversation because maybe they’re just following twitter and they’re not saying anything. You don’t know what to say, you know that all those principles apply online and not that, like that’s all that you’re ever going to do? I mean, we’re going to keep talking about engagement for a few segments, you know, there’s more that you can do to build that up, but when you’re just starting and at first and as your default, you know, one today, make sure you are being a resource to the community post something that isn’t your own content, but, you know, is something that people are looking for or is in the news, et cetera and make introductions you don’t have to just tweet hey, everyone, follow me. Maybe one day you can also tweet hey, i’m at the sky at the conference today. Tony’s great follow him that’s about example but way understand the larger concept. Yes, well, that’s what that’s, what followed friday is all about? I don’t know if you use the hashtag ff follow friday you’re supposed to encourage your followers to follow people that you find interesting. Yeah, and i love it when i actually see organizations do it. That’s, of course that’s on twitter buy-in andi, you know, just with the pound sign and an ff and saying, you know, hear other organizations also fighting the fight with us or or whatever and showing that it’s not about them, not the only ones in this important during this important work. Here’s other great u turns out someone else cares about cancer, who knew? You know that there’s always other other organizations, and it doesn’t have to be the people you have. Ah, you know, standing partnership, mou with and it’s a real thing about jargon jail? Yes. Memo of understanding yes, first time, but not if but you know, it’s it’s, not people that you have to recommend. Yeah, but if i am a charity, why would i be if i was being devil’s advocate? Cause i do agree with what you’re saying. If i’m a charity, why am i going? Encourage my followers to follow other organizations that they might then start volunteering with go to their walk, run, start donating to them what i am going to take that chance. So that is a great segway into actual data that we can talk about. S o markgraf bitters, strength of weak ties, which is back from the seventies. But it is great and still still alive and well today from the seventies. So he identified four components of what he calls tie strength. And one of the four is reciprocity, so saying and setting the tone and showing that you are so confident and at home in this whole ecosystem of other organizations, that you’re willing to recommend other organisations, you’re willing to point out the research that someone else did. That’s actually the research maybe your community was looking for and you just don’t do that research, you know, so creating the reciprocity being the first one to do it so others no. Hey, it’s. Okay, we can actually work together in this eyes, one of those four components to actually bring the community together and strengthen it. Okay. I want to get to the others in a very brief second baguettes and live listener love teo schenectady, new york upstate new york’s connected e is that where i believe that’s? Where union colleges that was one of the colleges that rejected me nineteen eighty among it’s, it’s, a long and distinguished list of colleges that rejected me. Union college was among the my beliefs connected in new york. I’m pretty sure seoul, seoul, south korea welcome and rifle colorado. I love it. I love it. Rifle welcome live listener love out there. What are gary’s other? Wait, wait, mark. Exactly. I’m sure one of them is probably active listening good being a good active and attentive listener. Sorry, sorry. Mark so the other 3 and these still tying to some of what andrew was saying earlier trust time and intensity. So how are you building trust being transparent, showing that you have, you know, confidence in the other people, whether that’s the community saying, you know, giving you feedback and you actually saying yes, i heard you and that’s great feedback time, so not just posting at noon and then never engaging the rest of the day, you know, because it’s not you’re not going. You’re not spending much time with people, and it doesn’t mean that you have to literally have facebook open all day long and your chest watching facebook but it means once you post something, maybe check back in in two hours because if people commented, they don’t want to see it took you two days to notice that the comment, you know so doesn’t have to be ah lot amount of time, it’s just the consistent time, you know, on then last is the intensity, so don’t just reply and say thanks, thanks, you know, on twitter blogger exactly you want to actually read what they tweeted to you and then respond to the message? Okay, so thanks for that comment or, you know if someone posted on your organization’s facebook wall say, oh, that’s a great idea, here’s what i think of it or, you know, have some substance tow how you’re replying because a lot of organizations think, well, we’ll just right. Thanks. Thanks. Thanks. Every time someone retweets us and yeah, they do get the feeling of the you got it. But then they look at your twitter stream and i go. So you just say thanks no matter what you know, like you could automate that and the robots of the internet could do it for you so making it really human bon ce again. Just strengthens that connection, okay? I think another way would be if we talk about facebook clicking like all the time and giving again there. One word, you know, thanks. Whatever, but rather than just clicking like i mean, like, so good, i mean, there’s a value in like, but you don’t you don’t just stop there every time, exactly, exactly. And sometimes alike is all you can do. Sometimes someone post just thanks to you. Well, just hitting like that is great. You know what? An eye for an eye i but if someone took the time to write a thoughtful comment or to try and give you a suggestion, they want more than a thanks or or a like, you know? Okay, now you talked earlier about engagement and and i want to talk about certainly beings a little open this around engaged, posting things that are appropriate for openness and transparency on the sort of on the governance non-technical side. But they also translate to engagement on the social media side what’s your advice around some of those, like the nine, ninety and things. Yeah, i think it’s i definitely think everyone should post their nineties because at the end of the day, they are publicly available, so it isn’t that people couldn’t find it out about you putting it on your website. I mean, the number of people that would download it is still very small, but the fact that you are being transparent and forthcoming sets a much better tone. We’ve even had people at inten email us and say, oh, my gosh, i saw on this page that you’re nine, ninety is visible i think i think that was a mistake to really have your way, and we’ve had to reply and say yes, we put it there. We want you, by the way, you could have got it from the state attorney general likely our star star scott go. Exactly. Okay, so what else? What else besides the nine? Ninety? So i also think that there’s, you know, other than that one time of year when you have the nine ninety, there are lots of times that you could be sharing things openly in a way that isn’t just here. We put it up on the website. But we want you to engage with us around this like we just got a grant. And this is what we’re hoping to do with it and, you know, here’s, the plan, whatever join us on a call to talk about all that we’re going to do in this community with this new gripped, you know, it gives recognition to the funder, which, hey, what funder does not love recognition, but it also sets the tone again from the beginning that, hey, you’re, we expect you to care about what we’re doing, and we’re going to give you the opportunity to you hear about it firsthand for, you know, as we’re getting started, not a report two years later, and we want your feedback doesn’t mean you have to use every single piece of feedback, but you’re giving them a platform to connect with you from the very beginning of that of that program, the one that troubles me i see often is a list of board members that’s typical, but just a list of names here’s, our board and then he is this is president, the chair of the board, the treasure but there’s no little little bio mean, yeah, you know, i don’t want their home addresses, but give me a little richness and what? What their help me connect with your board so that i can see what makes them passionate about your work. Exactly. And i think, you know, a lot of organizations have tried to make their staff page very engaging. You know, like here is the email address for this person or here’s, the twitter account for the team or whatever. But then you go to the board page and, like you say, it’s, just a list of names, why not connect to their linked in profile or it doesn’t have to be again, yeah, doesn’t it to be there home phone number, but give it something so that you recognize it is a social space we’re working in and people could look that up linked in profile is a great idea. They’re about paige about dot com something exactly some depth. Okay, um, let’s, take a break, and when we come back, of course, amy sample ward stays with me, and i hope you do, too. Talking. Hi, this is nancy taito from speaks band radio speaks been radio is an exploration of the world of communication, how it happens in how to make it better because the quality of your communication has a direct impact on the quality of your life. Tune in monday’s at two pm on talking alternative dot com, where i’ll be interviewing experts from business, academia, the arts and new thought join me mondays at two p m and get all your communications questions answered on speaks been radio. Have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potential jules it addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. 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We’re talking about online engagement with segments called get engaged one because there’s going to be and get engaged too, and maybe get engaged three with new social media contributor amy sample ward. You want to create a tone that is open and encouraging to how do we how do we encourage people to post and comment? Well, a lot of organizations, i think, struggle with that because they are waiting for it to happen magically, like this engagement fairy is going to go about their community, and then everyone is just going to give them lots of ideas. So part of it is, you know, asking questions versus just posting here is thie information, you know? What do you think about it or we’re thinking about doing, you know, every friday we have ah, staff brainstorm, what do you do on fridays? You know, things that don’t require you to go research something to come back with a response, you know, that starts to build ah, little bit of engagement over time, and then people just get used to talking with you in that space, but the other part of it that’s a little bit more proactive is actually listening to the community, see? See who else is out there that maybe follows you that every time they post a question, everybody starts replying, you know? And and just an influencer exactly. And using the word influencer jargon jail whenever it’s called lawrence was perfectly fund-raising jail. So but there are rules. There are boundaries and rules on this show. Only i put people in jogging owes your first time. I think we’re changing the rules. We’re gonna have trouble all right? Down, sir. And influence or influences? Yes, but i think that that word has gotten overused by, like, you know, just by certain platforms that are supposed to just magically calculate, you know, what’s your influence of influence school and all of those things. And people forget that it’s totally contextual. You may have someone that has five followers, but every time they post every one of those five followers responds, and someone could have five thousand followers and that a single person did anything you know. So just because that person has, quote unquote more clout because so many more people follow them and yeah, exactly. And they’re connected to so many other people that have lots of followers, that person that gets everyone of their followers to take action every time. Well, they have way more influence in my book, you know? So don’t just look people up, and then look how many twitter followers they haven’t think, oh, great, they’re on our influence or less, but really look at who’s, who tweeted your blah glink that got everyone to click through, you know who posted about you on facebook and had all their friends like it, et cetera, and then connect with those people personally, like send them an email or, you know, facebook, messenger or whatever and say, we know that you’re amazing, the community listens to you, you know, you’re you’re so smart, whatever pump them up on, then say we’re wondering if maybe you wanted to give some of your insights about this project we’re doing, and for the next two days, you know, you could post about it and and will put put it on our facebook page or you can tweet for us from this event we’re doing tonight. So they’re tweeting from your organizational account and from their own, and so all of those people that normally respond. Are now responding to the organization’s account, you know, so it builds their credibility as well. I’m i’m so smart and recognize that, you know, i’ve been tapped for this, but you get a steal a little bit of that is an organization, you know, i’m going to guess you don’t think much of the there is a there is a site that i mentioned a cloud with a k k o ut where once in a while, you know, you get something you got somebody give you plus one crate chaos on for professionalism or something. I’m going to guess you don’t think too much of people’s klout scores, i do not write, okay? Because i don’t i don’t think it takes into consideration the context, you know, like i was saying it it’s such a rudimentary kind of algorithm, and you go in there and i’ll be ranked with someone that i’ve never heard of with the same score on the same topic, and i think, well, either my score now is really low cause i don’t know that person or it’s totally inflated, and we’ve never met, you know? And so what? It just doesn’t make sense. Okay, especially when you can earn points by bringing people into the platform. I don’t think that algorithm works. All right, why don’t you leave us? We with a parting thought about engagement, something way haven’t talked about yet, i how about a challenge? And then we can talk about that in the next segment, so i would say for the next month, try to ask some questions and then next time we can talk about what you do after that what’s, the next step up the ladder, now that you’re asking questions scene, if people are responding, what kinds of questions do they answer their questions? That is just crickets, you know, eso try and pay attention to what about the question, you know, is different for the ones that are responding, and once that don’t get response and the next time we’ll talk about the action part. Okay, exactly next time, which will be get engaged to will be the call to action. Exactly. Amy sample ward, our social media scientist blogger for the stanford social innovation innovation review membership director for intend the non-profit technology network and her sight is aimee mann sample war dot org’s or dot com they both direct. Okay, amy, sample ward dot ford and you forgot one important title, which is the new est jargon jail keeper? No, i didn’t forget that was actually intentionally left that we’re gonna have trouble with boundaries. You’ve just created such an open, collaborative environment. There are limits, teo. Everything you’re going to learn this. Ok, thank you very much for being in studio a real pleasure and my thanks. Also, of course, to andrea nirenberg next week, your year end campaign. I was a blackbaud its conference b b con on monday, just this past in washington, d c and next week i’ll play the first of eight interviews that i did at that conference. This one will help you plan your year end campaign, and this is not a coincidence to see how now we’re in the fourth quarter. It’s october year end. You see this? This doesn’t just happen. These things have actually thought about strategically. Our legal team returns also next week. Gene takagi and emily chan from the non-profit exempt organizations law group in san francisco. What will they have? If you join the linked in group, you’ll know before the show because i don’t know yet and the linked in group, of course we have people from washington, d, c, peoria, illinois, and south carolina and pakistan. Are you in angie nierenberg when she departed actually told me oftheir that she’s going to posts a resource checklist on the linked in group and also the facebook page? So go to the lincoln group to find that i have my chronicle of philanthropy podcast called fund-raising fundamentals it’s a ten minute monthly podcast you’ll find on the chronicle of philanthropy website. You’ll also find it on itunes, wishing you good luck the way performers do around the world this week in estonian nail comey niall comey, may you get a nail in your tire i don’t know why the estonians want that it’s better than the other things i can think of. But just across the baltic from stock home is estonia, and on behalf of them, i’m wishing you a week of nail gumi our creative producers claire meyerhoff sam liebowitz, our line producer. The show’s social media is by regina walton of organic social media, and there are boat producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. I do hope you’ll be with me next week. One to two p, m eastern. Talking alternative dot com handup. I didn’t think that shooting. Good ending thing. You’re listening to the talking alternative network waiting to get in. Nothing. You could. Hi, this is nancy taito from speaks been radio speaks been radio is an exploration of the world of communication, how it happens in how to make it better, because the quality of your communication has a direct impact on the quality of your life. Tune in monday’s at two pm on talking alternative dot com, where i’ll be interviewing experts from business, academia, the arts and new thought. Join me mondays at two p m and get all your communications questions answered on speaks been radio. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three the conscious consultant helping huntress people be better business people. You’re listening to talking alternative network at www dot talking alternative dot com, now broadcasting twenty four hours a day. Oh, this is tony martignetti athlete named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas. And mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio friday’s one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting. Are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication. And the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office need better leadership? Customer service sales or maybe better writing are speaking skills? 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