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Nonprofit Radio for March 16, 2018: Date Your Donors

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Jonah Halper: Date Your Donors

Jonah Halper is author of the book “Date Your Donors.” He wants you to enjoy the full breadth of fundraising relationships. He’s founder and partner of Altruicity consulting. (Originally aired 3/4/16)

 

 

 

 


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Oh, hi there. Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent on your aptly named host. Oh, i’m glad you’re with me. I’d suffer with logar mania if you talked to me about the idea that you missed today’s show date your donors. Jonah helper is author of the book. Get your donors. He wants you to enjoy the full breath of fund-raising relationships he’s, founder and partner of altruicity consulting and he’s with me for the hour. This originally aired on march fourth twenty sixteen on tony’s take two new relationship videos responsive by pursuant full service fund-raising data driven and technology enabled tony dahna slash pursuant radio and by weinger sepa is guiding you beyond the numbers. Wagner, cps dot com tell us attorney credit card processing into your passive revenue stream durney dahna may slash tony tell us let’s get started with jonah helper and get your donors. Jonah helper is author of the new book date your donors. He wants you to enjoy the full breath of fund-raising relationships he’s, founder and partner of altruicity consulting and he’s with me for the hour. So glad to welcome jonah helper halper halper back to the studio has been a guest before. His new book is date your donor’s he’s, a non-profit marketer and fundraiser with over ten years of experience specializing in new donorsearch acquisition and engaging gen x and wires. He’s, founder and partner of altruicity consulting. They’re at altruicity dot com. The book is at gate, your donor’s dot com and he’s at jonah helper already chuckling. Yeah, welcome back to the studio. Welcome back to the show. I haven’t thrilled in here. Thank you so much. Good to see you. Good to have you here. Congratulations on the book. Thank you. How did you get to the concept of dating and donors? So i started doing ah, training fund-raising training a couple of years ago. And i just found i started using a lot of dating analogies that was very natural on daz. I started tio go down that rabbit hole of discussing, you know, how fund-raising is is akin to relationships in courtship and attraction and things along those lines. I started to think about about my career as a fundraiser, and i noticed that there were even even the people who, you know. Classically trained in fund-raising and, you know, had the experience, some fundraisers were unbelievable at the craft, you know, there’s some fundraisers who, you know, we’re okay, they’re mediocre or they were just, you know, kind of putting in the time and they’re doing the kind of, ah, the best breast practices of the business, but there was a clear line between those who were the born fundraisers or seemingly born fund-raising and those who weren’t and i started to wonder why that wass and it wasn’t something you would able to see in a resume, it wasn’t something that was just, you know, you can look and see their track record and see why that was the case. It was experiential, like i would interact with these people, and that was it was kind of like an use of cool, like, it was just like you would be around them and you would be, you know, wanting to be around that would be attracted to and as that started to take shape, i started teo kind of more put, ah, structure around it to say, what is it that those type of people have that makes people want to? Be around them as a fundraiser or as just a human being. And, you know, one of the interesting kind of correlations i found was it was very someone of my high school experience, which is you, weren’t you were you were not so cool in hyre i wish i was on the other side. But you know what it wass is i went to a boarding school, all boys, a tremendous amount of testosterone. And basically, you know, the need and the desire to be on the in crowd was the most important thing to make. Yeah, i i spent so many waking hours just trying to figure out the chess moves that would take me to be in the inner circle. And what it did is it drove me further and further away. I became like the hanger on ah, and i thought i was i thought was a cool guy. I thought i had, you know, certain skills. I thought i you know, i was in a terrible ballplayer. Like the things that were important to high school boys. I was a terrible ballplayer. I i got my my varsity letter in announcing oh, i as one step below cheerleaders, annan varsity letter ship. So, i mean, i dealt with these things with a sense of humor and a nem barris ingley a large number of times. It would more be people laughing at me then with me. Right, which only, which only further perpetuates that downward spiral. Yeah, three guys, a joker reason he’s the jester. But he’s not, you know, it’s. Not even always laughing with them. Like i said so. All right, so i dealt with it. That was my athletic outlet was announcing right there and managing rights to carry soccer balls on and off the field. Make sure nobody was on the bus on time. So you’re announcing a managing in-kind of understandably why, you kind of self selected into certain kind of career. Yeah. Now, now announcing right for myself. Exactly. I’m not shepherding a bunch of high school kids on a bus on then announcing touchdown. Thie irony. The irony is i knew any i still know nothing about sports, right? I mean, i have trouble distinguishing football from baseball. Well, so have a great fundraiser is that you can talk intelligently on any subject for about two and a half minutes, lord, help you. If they want to have a deeper dive in texas well, two and half minutes they’ll be laughing that will be actually laughing at me. But i football is the one with the field goals, i think. Yes, yes. Your baseball has the three pointers. No, basketball is through your basketball to report. Okay, so so the irony was, you know that there’s somebody whispering what? What to announce almost exact my ear. Oh, that’s got a touchdown. Touchdown number fourteen that’s? Uh oh, yeah, here he is, steve berman, who was a friend of mine. I couldn’t remembers number, but that’s how i dealt with my awkwardness and oppcoll snusz so? So where i’m going with this is is that i found there were certain kind of character traits of that of that high school kid who seem to be the center of attention. And then i found that things don’t really change from high school things like yeah, i know i don’t i hope i’m in outlier and that in your theory, i’m an aberration. We’ll know what it does is it way kind of grow into a lot of the things that we are lacking in high school, high school, you’re just naturally you’re trying to figure yourself out there’s not necessarily the confidence there, you know, there’s a discovery that’s going on there so it’s not a natural thing for you kind of say, this is who i am, these with skills i bring that confidence that’s kind of grown over the years, but that what i’m alluding to when i’m kind of referencing now is the fact that confidence and clarity whether whether it’s real or not on the high school level, right, that perceived confidence is something that people are attracted to, the fact that you say i know who i am, i know what i stand for. This is what, whether for good or for bad, this is who i am, people want to be around people who have that who have the kind of that confidence say this is what we stand for. This is what i’m excited about. This is where i’m headed, and i want you to join me and confidence and clarity or a couple of things that were going to talk about yes, because as you’re suggesting, those are traits of good fundraisers. Those those outlier fundraisers that are at the at the high end? Yeah, absolutely. Okay, cool. Uh, what’s. So why don’t we go out a little early for a break right now? It seems like natural place and we come back, we will dive into the details of date. Your donors stay with us. It’s. Time for a break pursuant. Their newest paper is demystifying the donor journey. They want you to be intentional. Deliberate about stewarding your donors so you don’t lose them. This is very much what jonah and i are talking about today. Same subject different take pursue. It will help you create and fine tune your donorsearch stewardship plan paper is that tony dahna slash pursuant radio now, back to date your donors, jonah helper. My guest. We’re talking about his new book date your donors. Um, you want to start with authenticity, and so ah, this is where i was not so authentic in high school, but i believe i’m much more authentic now, but sure, authenticity a great trait for fundraisers. Yeah, you know, it’s it’s interesting. Because when you are in the business of raising money, you’re interacting with a lot of people. Who are high net worth who travel in certain circles? Have a certain lifestyle, it’s easy to kind of pander to them and try to say, you know, i want to be on the inside so i can get money from them. That’s the kind of at the perspective especially young fundraiser has is how can i get into this this network? And what i was when i mention before and when i think applies when it comes to authenticity, is andi also packaged in the non-profit, you know, jargon of mission and vision, the idea is that you should know what your folks what you’re standing for there is a few of my jonah helper and working with a special needs charity, and this is my my job and my mandate and what i’m raising money for. I’m not jonah helper, mr country club. I’m not jonah helper, mr poker player, you know, hanging, hanging out with with these individuals, they may become friends and that’s fine, and they may become my network, but i’m coming to them not underneath the guise of being a buddy of being one of their friends just being part of their network, but rather, i’m coming through the through the lens off my mission, what i’m in the business of doing, where i’m headed with this, what i hope to accomplish with my mission and how these individuals can be a part of that experience in a way authenticity is not me trying to fit into their world, mohr them trying to fit into my world, and and that requires me not to be focused on myself, right? And i know what i am, what i stand for, but rather interact with them, and then hopefully they see what who i am or what i stand for, that authenticity, what i’m really in the business of doing, and they’ll gravitate today, and they’re hopefully attracted to it, right? Not metoo them but them to me. So let’s, break this down because you’re talking about authenticity of the person and also authenticity of the organization cracked. All right, so let’s, start with the person. This is where we get to confidence, you know, you you want yeah, yeah, you just don’t want people to be molding themselves to what they think, the donor that they’re meeting that day or that our wants them to be right. But be true to yourself. Well, they’ll see right through that in there is if you’re the type of person who’s going to be mike mission creep like, you know, you know, i may be the business of doing this well, but you’re excited about that. Well, let me chase you down there about you know, about that that i know what i’m in the business of doing this is who i am, what i stand for that person’s a hedge fund, you know? Ah, man or woman, i am a fund-raising professional for this organization. That’s what i do know this is who i am and what i do if the if the stars align and they’re interested in what i’m doing, they’ll support it. If this is not of interest to them, it is not a priority for them if it’s, you know, not meant to be it’s not meant to be, but the moment i start chasing people down this, then i’m effectively being that kind of aggressive door knocker to say, you know, give, give, give me, me, me, i i and that’s why i don’t want to be playing now, but what about when you get into situations like you’re meeting with a donor and we get into a political conversation or something religious, you know where you’re your stars are not aligned with theirs, you know, maybe you’re different political spectrum, different into the political direction, then they are how do we how do we stay authentic? So it’s? Interesting, because i’ll give a kind of ah kind of case in point, you know, there’s some people who use social media, where there’s like a clear demarcation line between the personalizing, the professionalizing we’ll have, this is my missing my business account like this is my business facebook this is my organizational facebook presence on this is my personal place facebook president and never shall the twain you know me that that is not my approach. My attitude is my my priorities, my belief system, you know, what’s important to me what i don’t think it’s important to me is as much ah factor in my relationship with these individuals than than anything else. The fact they may not agree with me politically, or the fact that may not agree with me what it is, then that’s that’s their prerogative, but at the same time, it’s nothing to do with the mission vision might cause i think mature people can make that clear separation between what is relevant, teo, the supporting whatever the good work that i’m doing other educational, humanitarian or are you know, whatever it is as and what jonah helper you know, does on his on his free time now, there’s importance of someone being trustworthy and having credibility and respect and you can ruin that by what’s going on in your personal life. So there is absolutely a certain amount of of measure that goes into what you’re doing. Discretion, yes, absolutely absolute discretion. But because people look and people see and if you want them, if you want them to give you their money and to trust you with their money to accomplish a certain good, if they think that you are not a trustworthy person because of the way you live or your reckless in some way or form, then that obviously is going to hurt you on the business side. But i think that things that are whether it’s politics or religion, you can agree, be respectful and you can agree to disagree and i don’t think that will ah, bill deepti, be a deal breaker. In fact, what i find is that when people know jonah helper father for jonah helper, you know, his religious level or his political involvement that just shapes me as a person, and i find that the people who have become fast friends within become my donors are people who become friends and in a bigger way than just, you know, thank you for your check, and i’ll keep your loophole. You’re good how the good work is, you know, playing out it’s become more friends, i think a good example that is, when i had, you know, a couple of my last children, i would get presents from some of my donors because it was clear that i wasn’t just fundraiser was jonah halper, of course, you know, help her father. Father? Yeah, yeah, so that s so there’s, of course, abounds there, okay? And i see that playing more now in our presidential election year i politics come up more in conversation that with donors, potential donors when i’m with clients, then you know, then even just six, six or eight months ago, if you’re too highly spackled like if you’re like, you know what i mean? Spite i i was like, like, mr clean jeans, there’s no power there’s no depth to you outside of your job, people are not going to find a way not going can connect with you, there’s not gonna be that human connection because your justice, you know, tom aton doing the work of your organization and you’re not a human being. So i think i think those other things that add flavor, not color and deep in the relationship, obviously again with certain amount of discretion depends on how you live your life. But but, yeah, i think that’s so important people realize who you are as a person and even not just as you’re, you know, you mentioned social media, but just in conversation, you know, you don’t have to be the raging donald trump or bernie sanders fan. You could be respectful of the other person and say, you know, you know, o r, you know, maybe you don’t even need to in a conversation say what your aspirations are and who you hope will win just oh, you know, okay, yeah. He’s cool or hillary’s lullabies finite. You know, matt, i see points in her, and most people are not going to say who do you stand? Who do you want? You know, they’re not going to challenge that way and that’s another thing also is that when there is a conversation where you want this is that you have a position or you feel strongly about something, i think that if you’re open minded person or healthy person, those those conversations can be interesting without devolving into, you know, for violence. So i think i think that you could you could have those conversations, and just by virtue of the business, you have those conversations because you could be at a country club, you could be on the golf course, and you’re not talking business for ninety percent of the time you’re talking family talking politics, you talking religion and time all the things that everyone talks about. S o yet you have to be kind of present and in that experience and be really yeah, and you want to get beyond the small talk? Yeah, you make the point that your donors, you know, we’re looking for common ground, so we start conversations often with weather right? Because everybody shares that. But, you know, if that goes on for more than like a minute and a half, i start to get antsy way got to get further than the weather, and they know why you’re there like there’s, no qualms that the reason why you’re in their offices because they talk about the mission in vision of your organisation, what you hope to do and why you need their money. So it’s it’s not like you pulled the wool over the eyes. We’re talking, you know, baseball and the next thing you know, we’re talking money. They know why you’re there so it’s just a matter of of guests making the connection, finding the connection, whether it’s through friends, your common connections, whether it’s, tio shared interests, whatever case, maybe, but they’re expecting the having a deeper conversation about what you’re doing, and they respect you for what you’re doing. You know, this is that was this is the business that you chose to be in your raising money for a worthy cause and making wonderful impact. So there’s nothing to shy away from its not fund-raising is not a dirty word here a lot. Of these traits, but all of these traits, or that you’re seeking in fundraisers, can’t be hyre ascertained from a from a resume, and you mention this in the book, too, that that, you know, it’s a personal business, you want to meet people before? I mean, obviously there’s gonna be a personal interview, but you don’t find resumes, a very valuable tool for recruitment, basically what i’m saying, right? I think i think in general you’ll find word of mouth is always the strongest, you know is whether you’re looking for new business or whether you’re looking tto find their best people. Companies around the world have wonderful policies where there’s incentives if you refer people to the company and they get a job there for existing employees. There’s a reason for that? Because if you’re willing to put your reputation on the line to bring someone in who you think would be a good fit for the company, then that then that person has a better chance of being a good person as opposed to just another resume and an inbox so there’s absolutely value ah, stronger value and sitting in front of somebody and interacting with them. In a in a real way to be able to determine if they’ve kind of got the personality and the kind of the gumption to do the work and do the fund-raising i needs to get done that you will never be able to get by just looking at a piece paper. Yeah, how poised are they right? Right? I mean, you might think, well, you know, the interview is an artificial, um, environment and there’s high stress, you know, for the interviewee, but so is fund-raising i mean, if you’re meeting a donor for the first time, that’s a bit of high stress, a potential donor for the first time, actually, if i could show a quick story that i think way don’t really care way stay in the abstract, i don’t know i love no, we love stories. All right, so it’s interesting. You say that you know, it’s high stress experience interview process. When i got my first job, i met with i want to like a job fair, for it was for the jewish federation system, which is like the united way for the jewish community and it was a national it was the national umbrella. Organization that hosted this job fair and there must have been twenty different cities represented the had their own local jewish federation, and i went to this Job fair is super green 20 year old kid, i did not even know what i was applying for. I was like, i want to help the jewish community that’s all i knew, i didn’t know fund-raising know anything on i start interviewing for all these jobs called campaign associate? I thought political campaign no, no campaign means fund-raising so i didn’t know that when i was interviewing, but i’m all the interviews that i had, there were what you’ve described grilling me, you know? What would you do in this scenario? And then you’re at an event and this happens, you know, a lot of that kind of stuff. And as someone who is new, that was jarring. I didn’t know even what to proud of process that what the right answer was this is the wrong answer. There was one organization there representing one federation there from baltimore, maryland, with me who ended up becoming my first boss kind of ruin the punch line there, but he didn’t ask me any. Questions about fund-raising or non-profit what would you do in a difficult situation? Not none of it. It was. What books do you like to read? You like wwf wrestling? Or is it calling out? It was all of this random stuff, and i sat with him for forty five minutes, and we just, like, talked and at the end of the forty five minutes there’s, like, all right, we’re done, and i was totally confused because especially in context of all the other interviews that i just had, this one was like, like, he was, like, wasting my time. Yeah, i got to call backs. He was one of them and i ultimately went to baltimore ended up starting my career in baltimore for three years there, and i finally mustered the courage to ask him. Obviously, once i have the job because i want to, you know, scare amount of hiring me, i said, you know what? Why did you hire me? He said, you have a nice smile, you carry a good conversation, the rest you’re going to learn on the job, and that was very powerful because that was him sitting across from a and saying is he a nice guy? Does even nice smile? Is he? Is he great interact with? Because that part is harder to teach the art and that’s the part that you master that from high school is a part that i like god it’s trial by fire? Exactly. I got that out of high school, but that was something that was a lesson that i’ve taken with me since then to know that you were a you hire the right person not to fill a position where a lot of the other ones were, they were looking to federals phil position, and they’re trying to determine my skills if i was good for that position, but rather he said, here’s a guy who i think has potential, i’m going to hire him and i’ll obviously augment the position to be right for him and b he was looking at me for my potential here’s, somebody on dh what i was able to present on the emotional and the human side, the science of how to go out there and raise money. I had no doubts the twenty year old kid you could learn what do you like it? Outstanding so so you had clarity, you were you were clear about who you were. You exuded confidence, no doubt and and and led to the hyre yeah, okay, all right, what are the traits? What else do you like to see in individual fundraisers before we get to that? This clarity of organization around mission and things like that? What else do you like to see in a fundraiser? So, obviously, you know, one of the one of the most important ones is, you know, and they often they they even say it on resumes on a job, but descriptions is, you know, self starter, but i want to dive labbate deeper in that idea of being that kind of entrepreneurial person to get out there and create new relationships, because when you are an entrepreneur, whether you work for a big company organization or you are on your own, a fundraiser is somebody who has to build their own network. If you’ll come into a new city or a new organization, you’re not necessarily hopefully, you’re not just picking up the dozen are one hundred donors that already giving you’re going out there and raising new money, and that requires you to be a self starter to say okay. Where are these people? Who would be interested in supporting this cause? How do i get introduced to these individuals? How doe i interacted them? How do i stay in touch with them? And all those kind of skills require you not sitting on your couch eating bon bon. Sorry. If that’s your approach, then it’s not gonna work if you want to be sitting behind a desk. It’s not going to work, you have to be somebody who enjoys the thrill of going out there and and making those contacts so that’s that’s one of them, you know, main things that i that i look for, somebody who has that kind of drive to kind of get out there and make it happen as if you’re building your business. Because you aren’t your house. You’re building your network, your own proverbial roll independent for your business, it’s, for the good of the mission. Exactly. All right. So let’s, go to the organization side being being clear and confident on the organization side because we want to be successful in our dating relationship with our donors. Come, you want a clear clear statement of mission. Somebody like you like eight word mission even right? So that’s a lot. A lot of you know, the consultants who will help the organisation shape their mission has to be concise. It has to be super concise. You know what you could share with somebody on one floor trip up in the elevator, right? It’s? Really? What? Who are you? What? What? What’s the organization. And if your job is tio and malaria deaths done, we’re in the business of ending larry desk. You’re not waxing poetic about how you’re going to do it and buy what deadline you just want to be able to say mission is what you’re in the business of doing. So you should be able to clearly say, like you said, you know, eight words or, you know, one sentence, this is what we’re in the business of doing. The only thing you might claire qualify it with maybe his location like right ending malaria deaths, west africa, right, right. That’s tied to your containers? Yes, exactly. If you if you are central africa and that’s your job and that obviously is in their mission statement. Absolutely. But again, it’s. Not going on about, you know, your values and the vision for this it’s just clearly what you’re in the business of doing much kruckel sip of water because it looks like your first thing. Andi, i will suggest that we talked about so the mission you have some examples of missions in in the book, remember? I mean, charity water is very brief form, so i’m obviously a big fan of charity water. They bring clean water to basically to the people in africa and, well, it’s interesting they limited to africa and it’s a whole nother conversation about the scope of their vision, but they do of many, many different villages in central africa, on some other areas as well, but basically they are fund-raising organization and the fund water projects on the ground, so they don’t actually drill themselves. They have organizations on the ground doing the drilling, but they are a fund-raising organization that funds those those well projects, and they’re one of the organization has a very concise mission statement. Yeah, a lot of them dio i’m trying to think it was your forjust certainly particularly well, no, just that was one example you cite. Some of the books so people have to buy the book way can give the whole book about paige, expect this only non-profit radio this’s not provoc radio should expect you should have high expected. Yes, but we can’t bring you all two hundred rich pages. Yes, of data. And i would have come with a list of the mission statements prepared. Dahna okay, after mission, we’re moving to our vision. Yes. Now we’re getting a little more detail. Yes. So so and when you talk about vision, obviously i’m doing it through the context of dating and relationships. You know, vision is where you’re headed. So when i talk about dating when you’re dating for a purpose, right, you’re looking to find somebody who can spend you know, whether it’s rest your life with our meaningful part of your life. The idea is to find somebody who wants similar things, as you, you know, using the dating analogy. Do they want to have children? Do they want to live in the city or the suburbs? Do they want to be? Yeah. Primary breadwinner. Both, you know, both working whatever the case may be. But these air important conversations you have when you’re dating someone seriously, where we headed together is unit because if you’re not on the same page of one wants children and it’s important to him, and the other one doesn’t want children that’s probably a deal breaker, so so, you know, the correlation to fund-raising is that i am and discovered that in my first marriage kayman oh, there you are, bring i could bring some case study in on the way outside our competition advice to se eso eso eso when i was so when you’re when you’re doing the fund-raising business cerini fund-raising business and you’re and you’re looking to get someone to support your cause, you’re not supporting your cause for what they are. It is now right? You’re not we’re break, we bring clean drinking water to central africa that’s not the case that’s gonna get someone open their wallet, what’s going to get them to open the wall is this is where we are now, but this is where we’re headed, and if they buy into the idea of where you’re headed, then they’re going to support you. So if they like, if they see that vision of your organization is the white picket fence with the dog and the tire swing, then they will support you. They’re not here to fill holes or to cover your gaps in your budget. They want to know that you are a viable organization and you have some great things in mind and you’re headed in their group great direction. So that’s, what i talk about vision and through the dating perspective is the idea that you’re selling somebody on where you’re headed. We need a break. Wagner cps, here’s an excerpt from their latest testimonial quote, they’re accessible, they care about their clients end quote, can you say that about your accounting and ordered firm? Go to the site weinger cps dot com, check out their credentials, check out their clients, then you know how i like to do it. Pick up the phone and talk to you. Eat huge tomb regular cps dot com now time for tony, take two. I’ve got three new videos, all on the same subject. Build your grantmaker relationships that may sound familiar to you. It was on the show a month ago that was february sixteenth. Now it’s in video repurposed you see different format and perhaps you learn better by video that’s possibility. Although then you’re probably making a mistake listening to non-profit radio audio podcast. If you learn better by video, then you’re wasting your time right now. Right now, this minute, the second that you’re spending this thing to me right now. Right now. Now, this one right now, it’s wasted it’s wasted, squandered, um, or maybe just a little interested in video, but you also like audio so let’s go on that hypothetical because otherwise you would’ve turned me off already. And then you’re not even gonna know what the videos were about because you already shut me off ten seconds ago. This is what the videos are. They are three versions of the panel that i moderated at the foundation center. We have the full version. That is roughly ninety minutes. There’s the broadcast version roughly fifty minutes. That’s. What you heard on the show back in february and there’s the executive summary, which i pared down the whole ninety minutes to about ten minutes. Chopped it. But you know, executives, you know, they never get we all know this, right? The executives never know the full story they don’t get into the weeds. So if you want the executive summary, you can have it for about in about ten minutes, but do it do so at your own peril? I would say there’s lots of good advice from this panel for the foundation center. You remember it, you know it was a couple weeks ago, but in case you want a fuller version, you know, then you got the link to the ninety minutes. If you want to hear the broadcast version again by video for some reason, maybe you learn better by video, but let’s not get into that morass. Anyway, i got videos for you, and if you wantto, if you want to refresh your recollection that’s a that’s, a term of art in the law, by the way, refresh, you’re talking to a witness and you give them a writing, a paper and that’s used to refresh their recollection. It would be admissible just for that purpose. So if you want to refresh your recollection, then maybe you want thea the broadcast version or the executive summary. Let’s see this? Those of the panel is on grantmaker relationships and we are going to continue with that. We continued with that the following week, some losing myself. So if you if you ah phew, like if you come in and out of the podcast and is only some you listen to some you don’t you want to know that grantmaker sze we talked about twice there was this there was this panel from the foundation center that i moderated, and then the week after was, um, john hicks from d l b remember dylan’s like bull picks, so if you are interested in grantmaker relationships, you feel like you’re not doing well in grantmaker relationships, you’ll want to check out the videos and also that show that was that followed with john hicks. All right, we’ve got my video with links to these three versions of the video that is at tony martignetti dot com. Now let us return to jonah helper, the wise and the wise and experienced jonah helper and date your donors. Okay, jonah helper. Thank you for your indulgence, sir. Hey, you do you freely with ntcdinosaur provoc? I think i actually attended. Not last year, the year before that, and it was amazing there was yes, it was. I had a first all they had, like, big band on stage. You’re talking about twenty fourteen. It might have been twenty. Forty, right? Yeah. I had a fantastic time. It was and it was in california. It was in san francisco that year. I loved it. I mean, they were great. The organizer’s there were we’re fantastic. Yeah. Okay. I think that was twenty. Thirteen. Twenty fourteen. Was my first one there in washington, d c okay, so they alternate east, mid and west sametz been so twenty three years ago. Yeah. It’s a it’s a lot of smart people, they had a big band on stage. It was i mean, it was heaven enchantment, and it was like, well, i wasn’t expecting that andi conference in general gave me that kind of flavor. It was with the sessions or great, the people in the hallways, you know, i always love the hallways, the hallways of the best because that when you meet, you always meet the best people in the hallways. Sessions are good because you can hear the training and they’re in their and the great sessions, but there’s nothing better than being able to just bump into somebody and find out they’re doing amazing work, and it could be a small church in virginia, and they’re doing phenomenal things that you could apply to your organisation in some, you know, specific instance, i love that, yeah, that kind of randomness on dh and the ntc, the non-profit technology conference did that for me. We were talking about your organization and and its mission and vision statements, and you also want, you know, you want organization to be clear about who their primary customers are and not two morph into something that you really don’t belong doing or being with or, you know, again being true to yourself, being say more about that. Yeah, so so, you know, make a good story that i heard from my friend nancy lublin, who is the founder of dress for success, and was then chief old person of do something dot orgryte, which is thine engagement. So the fact that she was, you know, not a team made her the old productions on crisis text long theo, of course treyz his text leinheiser heard one. She started well shouldn’t start do something, yeah, but she might as well have started because where i’m going with that story on dh, everything she touches turns to gold and that’s, not luck, i mean it’s, she is a a tour de force. I mean, she is unbelievable, but the story that she she shared with me was that when she came to do something that or go it was a centres was a brick and mortar centers around the u s where teens we could get involved, and it was founded by melrose place actor shoe, and it was andrew shoe his name was on and it was it was a floundering organization. They were having a major major problems, and they were presented when she came aboard with an opportunity for i don’t know where the dollar amount was my been two hundred fifty, three hundred thousand dollars from the company that that said build a teen center near our call center like near, you know, our operations and, you know we’d love to have a teen center over there. And nancy, as the new ceo of the organization of deuce of do something that orc sa declined the money and an organization that is starving for cash. Yeah, so it it seems to be like, you know, like, what are you doing? You know, your new new new kid on the block here on dh you’re turning down this money and when she brought her into the offices or, you know, in in our offices, she sat down with the leadership in legends like, how how badly do you want this job? You know, your seemed to be kind of walking your way out of it and she said, you know, you need to trust may because this is not the future of do something that i do something right, forget the dot org’s it’s not future of do something to have all these brick and mortar, you know, places for students to kids to come together, it needs to be online and she after that point shut down all the physical locations, took the whole thing online, rebranded to do something as do something dot or ge and and is now getting forget the corporate dollars that she turned away the two hundred thousand tens and tens of millions of dollars they get and primarily comes from from companies so arab hostile will partner with them for teens, for genes. They found that homeless teenagers the number one thing that they wanted were a pair of jeans. Why? Because i don’t have to be washed every day and its owner’s homeless, he doesn’t have access to clean clothes, a pair of jeans are cool enough, you know, generic and cool enough that you could wear and where without having to clean them every day. And that was something that homeless teenagers wanted, and they partnered with aeropostale for kids who had no better privilege to donate their genes threw in the store. It created a tremendous amount of foot traffic into air apostle, and that was vow valuable to them, the co-branding was strong, and it turned out to be a wonderful partnership, and they’ve just replicated that that kind of model of companies adopting programs, supporting their their their operations, it they have done tremendous amount, because so your point they were focused on the mission of, of serving young adults who want to volunteer, and it was not going to be a brick and mortar place. It was going to be online and because she was paying attention to that and not the dollar, she was able to take this organization which was floundering, and make it the powerhouse that it is today. And that she’s now entrusted in the hands of the other time the chief operating officer, aria finger she’s, now the ceo of do something that oregon are on ours, but on non-profit radio toy. So there you go as ceo and as ceo. And then and then they spun that off because, yes, okay, i said yes, because our online they’re able to serve millions and millions of teens like five million’s i mean, they have, and they have this big treasure trove of data. Yes, about teen engagement and know how to engage them in issues. I think they’re think their sweet spot is, like sixteen to twenty five or so. And then beyond twenty five, they used your primary money is coming from companies. Big data or data is so important. So because that’s the case then, like, you know, think that something that you mentioned earlier about how nancy level went into crisis text line that was born out of the fact that they were getting texts, emergency tests, tech of young adults who are suicidal, we’re getting abused or things along those lines and as an organization as there to help people, what do you do with that? They weren’t equipped, they were equipped. And then they found the typical the standard nine nine eleven was not going to be able to handle us, especially for the digital age where people are going on their cell phone and there more comfortable hiding in the bathroom on their cell phone and texting somebody on emergency, they needed to do something. So that kind of stuff has outgrown has grown out of do something dot or ge and that’s? Why, you know, have crisis tax line? So it is there’s so many wonderful examples that you can see where, especially in their story, where they straight stay true to their mission. And if it wasn’t if if if emergency texting was not right for do something dot or ge, they didn’t just, like, expand the mission to fit under, do something out or they made it crisis that’s now a new organization, nancy’s now the head of that, and that was a new thing. It wasn’t like mission creep and now we’re doing, you know, we’re solving another problem. They started a new organization with all focus on your primary custom. Absolutely cool. All right, after we’ve started this relationship, we need to keep it going. And you call this i don’t have a name. That chapter was somewhere you say from lust toe love s o the analogy, the relationships going off you’re so so we all know this and in our in our our own relationships, you know, your boyfriend, girlfriend, whatever it is at the early, early part of the relationship, this tremendous amount of lust, right there is the attraction it’s, new it’s, fresh it’s, exciting and that’s so important because that is going to be, you know, the chemistry needs to be there that’s vital to the success of meeting new people and starting to develop a relationship with them. But it needs to mature right in there is if the relationship is only on that’s. The part i missed in high school. Yeah, the maturity and the whole thing. And during the last night, i had a lot of lost. But you know what to do with it all i’m in the same boat, my friend. S o so yes, so so that that has to mature. So if you get somebody to become a donor of your organization shin right, they may be enamored and they might be a beautiful organization. You could be a charity water you could be, you know, do something that or go any of these clauses that are gorgeous. I mean, they they look gorgeous, their offices a gorgeous they just have got that locked down, but it needs to mature. And it was the relationship with them needs to be more than just face value and it’s not just i’m excited to be part of this, you know, sexy organization. It needs to mature to say, look, i’m a partner. I’m somebody who’s not just early part of the job. I’m a partner. I’m in this for the long haul. I want to help them grow, whether it’s capital improvements, whether it’s, you know the infrastructure, whether it’s special projects, whatever the case may be, i want to see this organization grow from where it is now and where it’s headed. And that means that the relationship needs to mature where they have a greater stake in the game. And that means lino much like in our own personal relationships, where we might do certain milestone things, like move in together, there needs to be that kind of advancement, that kind of moves management and to use, you know, fund-raising jargon to take that relationship from one that’s courtship and maybe a first gift to now increase that support over time. Part of this is a plan. So when you have, we need to be more structured maybe then are in on our dating side and our our relationship side. But we need stewardship plan, basically, what belongs in our stewardship. So i like to talk a lot about new donorsearch accusation because, you know, you mentioned if you have something as a donor and you want to keep one of the chapters is called, keep the fire alive, right? So that you want to put some good practices in place. You know, i talk about there in the in charge of keeping the fire alive and latto kind of moves that move that relationship along, that you should treat someone like an investor or treat them like family right now, or and and and and while it may sound like that’s ah, dichotomy that’s outside the investor way investors or relationships, right? Are you treating me like, like, a business transaction or so the nice thing is that it’s not mutually exclusive because what happens is in your relationships, there are absolutely expectations. If you if we decide tony, you and i decided we’re going to move in together, right? What? We have a wonderful relationship. We love each other. We have a wonderful relationship. We want. We’re going to move in now, and we’re gonna have it going to take it to that one. Quote. Next-gen metoo do this by the way, if your way, my wife, my my feelings in indianapolis. So nobody listens to this show so you don’t worry about it. Word getting out exactly right. Good. We could talk after, okay. So, so if if we want to take that to the next level, is there anything truly different about our relation with each other? Do we love each other anymore? The moment that we are now in the same apartment. No. Right. There’s? No inherent change. That happens between the way you feel about me and i. Feel about, you know, the decision that we’ve decided with it. What we have done is we’ve increased expectations on each other that there’s a certain kind of shared life now that we have that’s more than we had before because we’ve said that this is a priority cubine dark commitment deepen our commitment. So now, now that we’ve deep in our commitment, i am now have a certain level of responsibility to you, right? You have there’s a certain level of investment that i’ve now made, right? Then i know how to manage that’s, like just know if i move in with you and i lived like a single person, right? I don’t care about your feelings. I know it was anything of the week before when we weren’t living together. It was any behaving the same way. But now that we live together, i have a new set of standards that i have to abide by, and it’s me and it’s mutual, right? You have expectations toe on me. I have expectations on you and that’s. Not a bad thing. It’s a it’s a healthy thing, but what happens is i need to meet those expectations. So if i wanted if i if you’ve given me something, if you give me money a cz a fun as ah someone who’s going to give money a donor and i take that money. The relationship starts that right? It’s not thank you for your gift. I’ll speak to you next year. It’s. Now that i’ve taken your ten thousand dollars, i have a responsibility to you to make sure that you know how your money is being spent. Oh, so this gets to our city. Our stewardship plan? Yes. Oh, starts appointed stewardship plan is that when i get to give, when i when i get money from a donor it’s, not just another box to check off and say okay, i got this gift. I got to go get another fifteen or twenty other gifts. Tto meet meet mike. Now, how are we going to right this should how so, how do you really take this? And deep deep in that relationship so there’s everything from leadership roles. There’s these opportunities when it comes to getting them to open up their own home and their own network a lot times people think that if you ask somebody to do favors for you favors going, quote, like open their home for a party meeting or to give your cause that’s burning equity that deepens relation because e-giving to you. So finding ways to cement leadership positions for them to spend more time in your offices. And when i mentioned treating like investors and treat them like family, why should they only have a relationship with you? Right? You are representing an organization, there’s. Some other wonderful people in the office is it’s. Some of the best donors and leaders i know come into the organization and they say hello to everybody from the person at the front desk to the person in the mail room. They know everybody because this is their family now. So those types of opportunities that ways to kind of systemized that are important you could see in the book the whole bunch of suggestions for that. All right, we’re gonna go further. We gotta take a break. But don’t go a little more into this idea that asking people asking donors and volunteers to doom or is not burning them out. It’s deepening the relationship and not doing that could burn them out. So stay with us, you got to take a break. Tell us the credit card and payment processing company. You check out the video at tony dahna slash tony tell us and that is going to explain that long, long tail of passive revenue that you can enjoy when the companies that you refer joint tell us. And you, the non-profit earned fifty percent of everything tellers gets the video. Is that tony dot m a slash tony? Tell us now, back to jonah helper asking people to do more. Yes, whether they are donors or board members, this is not typically does not lead to burn out. What leads to burnout is give me your your annual gift. And now give me your annual gift a year later and a year later and there’s no substance beyond you’re giving, right, right. So the so let’s talk about i want to take a cold pill that back little bit. Because i think a lot of the fear of asking people to do more comes some of the fear of asking in general, especially asking for money. You know, fund-raising is not a dirty word. And i know so many professionals and leaders. In the business of consultants, talk about how it’s not a dirty word, but i kind of tied into the relationship side of things in the sense that when you’re asking for money from somebody, if it’s devoid, if it’s void of a relationship, right, if we’re just asking and you’re dialing for dollars it’s, it’s, it’s taking the relationship out of it and it’s just making us and no one enjoys all transactions for that and no one loves that no one likes to do that that’s terrible when there’s a real relationship in that leads to money it’s beautiful and obviously you can hear the correlation between like sex and relationships. If it’s just mechanical and there’s no relationship behind it, it may be fun. You may get the gift let’s not underestimate great, but but my point is this is probably not going to be a sustainable long term strategy. You’re not going to get somebody that may give you one time, but it’s not going to be a capacity gift. They could probably give you a lot more than what they’re giving you and you’re and it’s not like there’s any relationship behind it, so if you’re if you’re going to go after those easy shots like that, then you might get lucky, right? Teo? But but in the end of the day, if you if you develop a real relationship than the asking for money, is the exact opposite of a negative experience is the most powerful, empowering, beautiful next up in that relationship that makes people go? Yes, i’m i’m in this i’m in this relationship, i’m in it for the long haul. So it’s it’s kind of it’s kind of that double edge sword where fund-raising could either be a terrible, terrible experience, transaction transaction, a wallet with legs, right? Yeah, you know, it’s the sex appeal of just the fact that they have money versus somebody who’s, a partner partner in the cause and he’s excited about the vision and wants to see that succeed and right on dh wants to do more than just give exactly you’re not going to know that until you start asking, even if it’s just give it’s done in the context of i am partnering with you and the way i’m doing, doing my share is by giving you money because if you’re going to be on the ground drilling wells or curing our ending malaria deaths or, you know, providing needs for special needs children, i’m not as a donor, i may not be the expert on how to do that, but i know if i give you money and i trust the experts, it will get done and that’s fine, they built, they’ll become a partner in dollar and that’s fine, but it’s not a transaction, it’s more than that because they they are bought into the vision of the organization, all right, on a part of getting people to buy in and having them feel insiders is sharing the occasional downside failure. Yes, i’ve seen i’ve seen the good, bad and the ugly on this. I’ve seen organizations that are afraid to share information with their donors on day worrying about it. It’ll burn relationship, and those tend to be the relationships that were never strong to begin with. But the there are wonderful examples of how failure or you know where something did not work and it may not be, you know, gross of, you know, abuse or are you no mistrust think some things just don’t work and you know you put your your organization on the line, you try big things and it doesn’t pan out it’s a wonderful opportunity to deepen the relationships. Okay, i’ll give you ah, quick story example, i was in scott harrison who’s, a ceo and founder of charity water in his office, and he was telling me about early on and charity water before it was like, the very sexy, very sexy that, like what it is today hey told me early early on, he had a couple people on staff on payroll, they were doing their first projects, and they were going to go by that it belly up, they did not have the funds for payroll, they they were really desperate, and scott told me that he sent out a number of, like, blow, you know, emails to people who are in his periphery, you know, just to these donors and basically say, like, i need help, i need help, we’re in trouble, we’re doing great work, it wasn’t just like, you know, bail us out was like, we’re doing amazing work, but we’re in trouble. And one individual guy named michael birch, who was the who’s, a tech entrepreneur hey was the founder of bebo, which is a british base like social network from the nineties, like i bought by, i think, a well for eight hundred million dollars and he’s done not numerous projects that also brought in a lot of money, but here was a guy, michael birch on dh. He responded to scott and said, i’m happy to meet next time i’m in the new york area, i think he was in san francisco and he meets with with scott and scott in-kind of bears, a soul tells, tells him everything going on and, you know, they’re doing great work, but it’s just not catching on. They’re breaking their teeth and it’s just not happening, and michael birch gives him some recommendations gives him some advice, and then he says, i’ll see what i can do, you know, as faras giving you a little help, so he goes home. I don’t know how many days it was, you know, whatever was in the story that scott told me, but scott told me that he was sleeping in bed and his phone went off. I know texts or phone call, but was from michael birch and say, he said i sent you some money. I’m wiring it to your account. I hope it helps, and skye trembling opens up his bank account and there’s, a one million dollar gift that was sent from michael birch to charity water. And that was that trust that michael had, and he was really kind of like the one of the first major donors that they had that kind of went all in on them. He was somebody after hearing the troubles and tribulations, but was bought into scott harrison, who is, you know, the personality, come on, the mission that he stands behind and said, this is something i want to support, and they turn that negative in a tremendous partnership into this day michael and his wife are huge supporters of charity water. Everybody is not perfect in ceo land. You talk a little about flawed characters. Yeah, because because with this natural, you know, things don’t always go perfectly. We might even make mistakes. I mean, that that was not a mistake, that scott sure that’s got made, but but things don’t always go perfectly, and we know that from our personal relationship characters in history succeed. Yeah, i mean, so we all know this from our own personalized ships, you know, sometimes you date somebody, it doesn’t work out, and it goes down in flames, sometimes amicable, sometimes it’s definitely not their, you know, whatever it is, whether it’s dating marriage were human rights. It’s the human condition um so in the nonprofit world it’s true as well, we don’t have, you know, perfect relationships, and there are times where you butt heads with a person that you’re involved with a lay leader of volunteering your organization, and you might no longer be the right person to have that relation with them might be somebody else. It might be something that you can work with them and see through tio, but the communication and like any relationship and i talk about in the book about commune importance of communication, you can either work through it or if it’s, you’re not the right person to either find somebody else. If they are bought into the cause, if if it’s the cause they care about, they might be ableto be kind of handed off to somebody else. And if it’s destructive, which sometimes, you know, a fraction of the small fraction of the relations are and it’s not in the best interest of the organization for them to be aligned with his lay leader donor evan, if they give a lot of money and it could hurt the organization, you gotta cut your losses and pull out so there’s. Absolutely. Ah, whole spectrum on relationships and how you handle them. Depending on what’s the best interest of the organization. We’re gonna leave it there. The book is date. Your donors did your donor dot com and you’ll find jonah he’s at jonah helper. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Congratulations again on the book. Oh, thank you for having me next week. Continuing this theme with your intentional stewardship plan. If you missed any part of too today’s show i’d be seat. You find it on tony martignetti dot com were supported by pursuing online tools for small and midsize non-profits data driven and technology enabled. Tony dahna slash pursuant radio red jersey piela is guiding you beyond the numbers. Regular cps dot com and tell us credit card payment processing, your passive revenue stream. Durney dahna may slash tony tell us our creative producer is claire miree family boats in the line producer producer. The show’s social media is by susan chavez, and this music is by scott stein. You with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Go out and be great. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Get in. Nothing. Cubine are you stuck in a rut? Negative thoughts, feelings and conversations got you down. Hi, i’m nor ing. Sometimes the potentiality tune in every tuesday nine to ten eastern time, and listen for new ideas on my show. Beyond potential live life your way on talk radio dot n y c. Metoo are you feeling unhappy with your body, shape or size? Ever feel out of control with food? I’m eliza that from nourish the soul and on the show, you’ll uncover the route to these imbalances and discover a permanent solution. Latto having a healthy relationship to food and your body. Join us every thursday morning at eleven a, m eastern time on talk radio dot. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com are you into comics, movies and pop culture at large? What about music and tv? 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Nonprofit Radio for March 4, 2016: Date Your Donors

Big Nonprofit Ideas for the Other 95%

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Jonah Halper: Date Your Donors

Jonah Halper is author of the new book “Date Your Donors.” He wants you to enjoy the full breadth of fundraising relationships. He’s founder and partner of Altruicity consulting and he’s with me for the hour.

 

 


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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, i’m glad you’re with me. I’d be hit with five grossing alvey a lie tous if i drew a breath to hear the words you missed today’s show date your donors jonah helper is author of the new book date your donors. He wants you to enjoy the full breath of fund-raising relationships he’s, founder and partner of altruicity consulting and he’s with me for the hour on tony’s take two, the non-profit technology conference and ntcdinosaur live are you in? We’re sponsored by pursuing full service fund-raising data driven and technology enabled, you’ll raise more money pursuing dot com so glad to welcome jonah helper halper halper back to the studio has been a guest before his new book is date your donor’s he’s, a non-profit marketer and fundraiser with over ten years of experience specializing in new donorsearch acquisition and engaging gen x and wires he’s, founder and partner of altruicity consulting they’re at altruicity dot com the book is that get your donor’s dot com and he’s at jonah helper already chuckling. Yeah, welcome. Back to the studio. Welcome back to the show. I haven’t thrilled to be here. Thank you so much. Talk. Good to see you. Good to have you here. Um, congratulations on the book. Thank you. How did you get to the concept of dating and donors? So i started doing ah, training fund-raising training a couple of years ago. And i just found i started using a lot of dating analogies that was very natural on daz. They started tio go down that rabbit hole of discussing, you know, how fund-raising is is akin to relationships in courtship, in attraction and things along those lines. I started to think about about my career as a fundraiser, and i noticed that there were even even the people who, you know, classically trained in fund-raising and, you know, had the experience. Some fundraisers were unbelievable at the craft, you know, there’s some fundraisers who, you know, we’re okay. They’re mediocre, or they were just, you know, kind of putting in the time. And they’re doing the kind of the best breast practices of the business. But there was a clear line between those who were the born fundraisers or seemingly born. Fund-raising and those who weren’t and i started wonder why that wass and it wasn’t something you would able to see in a resume, it wasn’t something that was just, you know, you can look and see their track record and see why that was the case, it was experiential, like i would interact with these people, and there was there was kind of like an use of cool, like, it was just like you would be around them and you would be, you know, wanting to be around that would be attractive, and as that started to take shape, i started teo kind of more put, ah, structure around it to say, what is it that those type of people have that makes people want to be around them as a fundraiser or as just a human being? And, you know, one of the interesting kind of correlations i found was it was very someone of my high school experience, which is you weren’t you were you were not so cool in high school, i wish i was on the other side, but no, you know what it was is i went to a boarding school, all boys, tremendous. Amount of testosterone. And basically, you know, the need and the desire to be on the in crowd was the most important thing to make. Yeah, i spent so many waking hours just trying to figure out the chess moves that would take me to be in the inner circle. And what it did is it drove me further and further away. I became like the hanger on on. I thought i was i thought was a cool guy. I thought i had, you know, certain skills. I thought i you know, i was in a terrible ballplayer. Like the things that were important to high school boys. I was a terrible ballplayer. I i got my my varsity letter in announcing oh, as one step below cheerleaders. Annan varsity letter ship. So, i mean, i dealt with these things with a sense of humor and a nem barris ingley. A large number of times. It would more be people laughing at me then with me, right, which only, which only further perpetuates that downward spiral. Yeah, three guys, a joker reason he’s the jester. But he’s not, you know, it’s. Not even always laughing with them. Like i said. So all right, so i dealt with it. That was my athletic outlet was announcing right there and managing rights to carry soccer balls on and off the field. Make sure nobody was on the bus on time. So you’re announcing a managing in-kind of, understandably, why you kind of self selected into certain kind of career right now. I’m announcing right for myself. Exactly. I’m not shepherding a bunch of high school kids on a bus on then announcing touchdown, thie irony. The irony is i knew any i still know nothing about sports, right? I mean, i have trouble distinguishing football from baseball. Well, so have a great fundraiser is that you can talk intelligently on any subject for about two and a half minutes. Lord, help you. If they want to have a deeper dive in town. Well, two and half minutes they’ll be laughing that will be actually laughing at me. But i football is the one with the field goals, i think. Yes, yes. Your baseball has the three pointers. No, basketball is through your basketball to report. Okay, so so the irony was, you know that there’s somebody whispering what? What to announce? Almost exact my ear. Oh, that’s got a touchdown. Touchdown number fourteen that’s? Uh oh, yeah, here he is, steve berman, who was a friend of mine. I couldn’t remembers number, but that’s how i dealt with my awkwardness and snusz so? So where i’m going with this is is that i found there were certain kind of character traits of that of that high school kid who seem to be the center of attention. And then i found that things don’t really change from high school things like, yeah, i know i don’t i hope i’m in outlier and that in your theory, i’m an aberration. We’ll know what it does is it way kind of grow into a lot of the things that we are lacking in high school high school. You’re just naturally you’re trying to figure yourself out. There’s not necessarily that the confidence there, you know, there’s a discovery that’s going on there. So it’s not a natural thing for you kind of say, this is who i am, these with skills i bring that confidence that’s kind of grown over the years, but that what i’m alluding to when i’m i’m kind of referencing now is the fact that confidence and clarity whether whether it’s real or not on the high school level, right, that perceived confidence is something that people are attracted to the fact that you say i know who i am, i know what i stand for this is what, whether for good or for bad, this is who i am, people want to be around people who have that who have the kind of that confidence say this is what we stand for. This is what i’m excited about. This is where i’m headed, and i want you to join me and confidence and clarity or a couple of things that were going to talk about yes, because as you’re suggesting, those are traits of good fundraisers, those those outlier fundraisers that are at the at the high end? Yeah, absolutely. Okay, cool. Uh, what’s. So why don’t we go out a little early for a break right now? It seems like natural place and we come back, we will will dive into the details of date your donors stay with us, you’re tuned to non-profit radio tony martignetti also hosts a podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy fund-raising fundamentals is a quick ten minute burst of fund-raising insights, published once a month, tony’s guests are expert in crowdfunding, mobile giving event fund-raising direct mail and donor cultivation. Really, all the fund-raising issues that make you wonder, am i doing this right? Is there a better way there is? Find the fund-raising fundamentals archive it. Tony martignetti dot com that’s marketmesuite n e t t i remember there’s, a g before the end, thousands of listeners have subscribed on itunes. You can also learn maura, the chronicle website, philanthropy dot com fund-raising fundamentals, the better way. Welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Jonah helper, my guest, we’re talking about his new book date your donors. You want to start with authenticity and so this’s where i was not so authentic in high school, but i believe i’m much more authentic now, but sure, authenticity a great trait for fundraisers. Yeah, you know, it’s it’s interesting, because when you are in the business of raising money, you’re interacting with a lot of people who are high net worth who travel in certain circles, have a certain lifestyle, it’s easy to kind of pander to them and try to say, you know, i want to be on the inside so i can get money from them. That’s the kind of at the perspective especially young fundraiser has is how can i get into this? This network? And what i was when i mention before and when i think, applies when it comes to authenticity, is and also packaged in the non-profit, you know, jargon of mission envision, the idea is that you should know what your folks what you’re standing for there is a few of my jonah helper and working with a special needs charity, and this is my my job and my mandate and what i’m raising money for. I’m not jonah helper, mr country club. I’m not jonah helper, mr poker player, you know, hanging, hanging out with with these individuals, they may become friends and that’s fine, and they may become my network, but i’m coming to them not underneath the guise of being a buddy of being one of their friends, just being part of the network, but rather i’m coming through the through the lens of my mission, what i’m in the business of doing, where i’m headed with this, what i hope to accomplish with my mission and how these individuals can be a part of that experience. So in a way, authenticity is not me trying to fit into their world, maur them trying to fit into my world, and and that requires me not to be focused on myself, right? And i know what i am, what i stand for, but rather interact with them and then hopefully they see what who i am or what i stand for, that authenticity, what i’m really in the business of doing, and they’ll gravitate today. And they’re hopefully attracted to it, right? Not metoo them but them to me. So let’s, break this down because you’re talking about authenticity of the person and also authenticity of the organization cracked. All right, so let’s, start with the person. This is where we get to confidence, you know, you you want yeah, yeah, you just don’t want people to be molding themselves to what they think, the donor that they’re meeting that day or that our wants them to be right. But be true to yourself. Well, they’ll see right through that in there is if you’re the type of person who’s going to be mike mission creep like, you know, you know, i may be the business of doing this well, but you’re excited about that. Well, let me chase you down there about you know, about that that i know what i’m in the business of doing this is who i am, what i stand for that person’s a hedge fund, you know, man or woman, i am a fund-raising professional for this organization. That’s what i do know this is who i am and what i do if the if the stars align and they’re interested in what i’m doing, they’ll support it. If this is not of interest to them, it is not a priority for them. If it’s, you know, not meant to be it’s not meant to be, but the moment i start chasing people down there, then i’m effectively being that kind of aggressive door knocker to say, you know, give, give, give me, me, me, i i and that’s why i don’t want to be playing now, but what about when you get into situations like you’re meeting with a donor and we get into a political conversation or something religious? You know where your yours the stars are not aligned with theirs, you know, maybe you’re different political spectrum different into the political direction, then they are. How do we how do we stay authentic? So it’s? Interesting, because i’ll give a kind of ah kind of case in point, you know, there’s some people who use social media where there’s like a clear demarcation line between the personalizing, the professionalized we’ll have this is my missing my business account like this is my business facebook this is my organizational facebook presence on this is my personal place. Facebook president and never shall the twain you know me. Ah, that that is not my approach. My attitude is my my priorities, my belief system, you know, what’s important to me what i don’t think it’s important to me is as much ah factor in my relationship with these individuals than than anything else. The fact that may not agree with me politically, or the fact that may not agree with me what it is, then that’s that’s their prerogative. But at the same time, it’s nothing to do with the mission vision might cause i think mature people can make that clear separation between what is relevant, teo, the supporting whatever the good work that i’m doing other educational, humanitarian or are you know, whatever it is as and what jonah helper you know, does on his on his free time now, there’s importance of someone being trustworthy and having credibility and respect and you could ruin that by what’s going on in your personal life. So there is absolutely a certain amount of of measure that goes into what you’re doing. Discretion, yes, absolutely absolute discretion, but because people look and people see and if you want them, if you want them to give you their money and to trust you with their money to accomplish a certain good, if they think that you are not a trustworthy person because of the way you live or your reckless in some way or form, then that obviously is going to hurt you on the business side. But i think that things that are whether it’s politics or religion, you can agree, be respectful and you can agree to disagree, and i don’t think that will bilich deepti be a deal breaker. In fact, what i find is that when people know jonah helper father for jonah helper, you know his religious level or his political involvement that just shapes me as a person, and i find that the people who have become fast friends within become my donors are people who become friends and in a bigger way than just, you know, thank you for your check, and i’ll keep your loophole. You’re good how the good work is, you know, play out it’s, become more friends, i think a good example that is, when i had, you know, a couple of my last children i would get presents from some of my donors because it was clear that i wasn’t just fundraiser was shown a helper, of course, you know, help her father. Father, you know so that yes, there’s, of course, abounds there, okay? And i see that playing more now in our presidential election year i politics come up more in conversation that with donors, potential donors, when i’m with clients, then you know, then even just six, six or eight months ago, if you’re too highly spackled, like if you’re like, you know what i mean? Spy eyes like like mr clean jeans. There’s no there’s, no depth to you. Outside of your job, people are not going to find a way not going can connect with you, there’s not gonna be that human connection because your justice, you know, thomason ah, doing the work of your organization and you’re not a human being. So i think i think those other things that add flavor, not color and deep in the relationship, obviously again, with certain amount of discretion depends on how you live your life. But but i think that’s so important people realize who you are as a person and even not just as your you know, you mentioned social media, but just in conversation, you know, you don’t have to be the raging donald trump or bernie sanders fan. You could be respectful of the other person and say, you know, you know, o r, you know, maybe you don’t even need to in a conversation say what your aspirations are and who you hope will win just oh, you know, okay, yeah, he’s cool or hillary’s lullabies finite, you know, matt, i see points in her, and most people are not going to say who you stand, who do you want? You know, they’re not going to challenge that way and that’s another thing also is that when there is a conversation where you want this is that you have a position or you feel strongly about something, i think that if you’re open minded person or healthy person, those those conversations can be interesting without devolving into, you know, for violence. So i think i think that you could you could have those conversations and just by virtue of the business, you have those conversations because you could be at a country club, you can be on the golf. Course, and you’re not talking business for ninety percent of the time you’re talking family talking politics, you talking religion and time all the things that everyone talks about eso yet you have to be kind of present and in that experience and be really yeah, and you want to get beyond the small talk? Yeah, you make the point and get your donors, you know, we’re looking for common ground, so we start conversations often with the weather, right? Because everybody shares that, but, you know, if that goes on for more than, like, a minute and a half, i start to get antsy, right way got to get further than the weather and they know why you’re there like there’s, no qualms that the reason why you’re in their offices because they talk about the mission in vision of your organisation, what you hope to do and why you need their money. So it’s it’s not like you pulled the wool over the eyes, we’re talking, you know, baseball and the next thing you know, we’re talking money. They know why you’re there so it’s just a matter of of guests making the connection, finding the connection, whether it’s through friends, your common connections, whether it’s, tio shared interests, whatever case maybe, but they’re expecting the having a deeper conversation about what you’re doing, and they respect you for what you’re doing, you know, this is that was this is the business that you chose to be in your raising money for a worthy cause and making wonderful impact so there’s nothing to shy away from its not fund-raising is not a dirty word here a lot of these traits, but all of these traits or that you’re seeking in fundraisers, can’t be hyre ascertained from a from a resume, and you mention this in the book, too, that that, you know, it’s a personal business, you want to meet people before? I mean, obviously it’s going to be a personal interview, but but you don’t find resumes, a very valuable tool for recruitment, basically, what i’m saying, right? I think i think in general you’ll find word of mouth is always the strongest, you know is whether you’re looking for new business or whether you’re looking tto find their best people. Companies around the world have wonderful policies where there’s incentives if you refer people to the company and they get a job there for existing employees. There’s a reason for that? Because if you’re willing to put your reputation on the line to bring someone in who you think would be a good fit for the company, then that then that person has a better chance of being a good person as opposed to just another resume and an inbox so there’s absolutely value ah, stronger value and sitting in front of somebody and interacting with them on in a real way to be able to determine if they’ve kind of got the personality and and the kind of the gumption to do the work and do the fund-raising i needs to get done that you will never be able to get by just looking at a piece paper. How poised are they right? Right? I mean, you might think, well, you know, the interview is an artificial, um, environment and there’s high stress, you know, for the interviewee, but so is fund-raising mean, if you’re meeting a donor for the first time, that’s a bit of high stress, a potential donor for the first time, actually, if i could show a quick story that i think way don’t really care way stay in the abstract. I don’t know i love no, we love stories all right, so it’s interesting, you say that you know, it’s high stress experience interview process. When i got my first job, i met with i want to like a job fair, for it was for the jewish federation system, which is like the united way for the jewish community, and it was a national it was the national umbrella organization that hosted this job fair, and there must have been twenty different cities represented the had their own local jewish federation, and i went to this Job fair is super green 20 year old kid, i did not even know what i was applying for. I was like, i want to help the jewish community that’s all i knew, i didn’t know fund-raising know anything on i start interviewing for all these jobs called campaign associate? I thought political campaign no, no campaign means fund-raising so i didn’t know that when i was interviewing, but i’m all the interviews that i had, there were what you’ve described grilling me, you know? What would you do in this scenario? And then you’re at an event and this happens, you know, a lot of that kind of stuff, and as someone who is new, ah, that was jarring. I didn’t. I didn’t know even what to proud of process that what the right answer was this is the wrong answer. There was one organization there representing one federation there from baltimore, maryland, with who ended up becoming my first boss kind of ruin the punch line there, but he didn’t ask me any questions about fund-raising or non-profit what would you do in a difficult situation? Not none of it. It was what books do you like to read? You like wwf wrestling or is a lot now. It was all of this random stuff, and i sat with him for forty five minutes and we just, like, talked and at the end of the forty five minutes there’s, like, all right, we’re done, and i was totally confused because especially in context of all the other interviews that i just had, this one was like like he was like, wasting my time. Yeah, i got to call backs. He was one of them and i ultimately went to baltimore ended up starting my career in baltimore for three years there, and i finally mustered the courage to ask him, obviously, once i have the job because i want to, you know, scare amount of hiring me, i said, you know what? Why did you hire me? He said, you have a nice smile, you carry a good conversation, the rest you’re going to learn on the job, and that was very powerful because that was him sitting across from a and saying, is he a nice guy? Does even nice smile? Is he? Is he great interact with? Because that part is harder to teach the art and that’s the part that you master that from high school is a part that i like god it’s trial by fire? Exactly. I got that out of high school, but that was something that was a lesson that i’ve taken with me since then to know that you were a you hire the right person not to fill a position where a lot of the other ones were, they were looking to federals phil position, and they’re trying to determine my skills if i was good for that position, but rather, he said. Here’s a guy who i think has potential, i’m going to hire him, and i’ll obviously augment the position to be right for him and b he was looking at me for my potential here’s somebody on dh what i was able to present on the emotional and the human side, the science of how to go out there and raise money. I had no doubts. The twenty year old kid you could learn. What? Do you like it? Yeah. Outstanding. So so you had clarity. You were you were clear about who you were. You exuded confidence, no doubt and and and led to the hyre. Yeah. Okay. All right. What are the traits? What else do you like to see in individual fundraisers before we get to the this clarity of organization around mission and things like that? What else do you like to see in a fundraiser? So, obviously, you know, one of the one of the most important ones is, you know, and they often they they even say it on resumes on a job. But descriptions is, you know, self starter. But i want to dive a little deeper in that idea of being that. Kind of entrepreneurial person to get out there and create new relationships, because when you are an entrepreneur, whether you work for a big company organization where you are on your own, a fundraiser is somebody who has to build their own network. If you’ll come into a new city or a new organization, you’re not necessarily hopefully you’re not just picking up the dozen are one hundred donors that already giving you’re going out there and raising new money, and that requires you to be a self starter to say okay, where are these people who would be interested in supporting this cause? How do i get introduced to these individuals? How doe i interacted them? How do i stay in touch with them? And all those kind of skills require you not sitting on your couch. Ng ng bon bon. Sorry. If that’s your approach, then it’s not gonna work if you want to be sitting behind a desk it’s not going to work. You have to be somebody who enjoys the thrill of going out there and and making those contacts. So that’s that’s one of them, you know, main things that i that i look for. Somebody who has that kind of drive to kind of get out there and make it happen as if you’re building your business because you aren’t your house, you’re building your network, your own proverbial roll independent for your business, it’s for the good of the mission. Exactly. Okay, all right. So let’s go to the organization side being being clear and confident on the organization side because we want to be successful in our dating relationship with our donors. You want teo clear, clear statement of mission. Somebody like you. Like, eight word mission even right? So that’s a lot. A lot of you know, the consultants who will help the organisation shape their mission. It has to be concise. It has to be super concise. You know what you could share with somebody on one floor trip up in the elevator? I it’s really what? Who are you? What? What? What’s the organization. And if your job is to tow and malaria deaths done, we’re in the business of ending larry desk. You’re not waxing poetic about how you’re going to do it and buy what deadline you just want to be able to say? Mission is what? You’re in the business of doing so, you should be able to clearly say, and like you said, you know, eight words or, you know, one sentence, this is what we’re in the business of doing. The only thing you might claire, qualify it with maybe his location like right ending malaria deaths, west africa, right? Right. That’s tied to your containers? Yes, exactly. If you if you are central africa and that’s your job and that obviously is in their mission statement. Absolutely. But again, it’s not going on about, you know your values and the vision for this it’s just clearly what you’re in the business of doing. What cycle? A sip of water. Because it looks like your first thing. Andi, i will suggest that we talked about so the mission you have some examples of missions in in the book. Remember buy-in charity water is very brief form. So i’m obviously a big fan of charity water. They bring clean water to basically to the people in africa and, well, it’s interesting. They limited to africa. It it’s a whole nother conversation about the scope of their vision. Ah, but they do of many, many different. Villages in central africa. I’m in some other areas as well, but basically they are fund-raising organization and the fund water projects on the ground, so they don’t actually drill themselves. They have organizations on the ground doing the drilling, but they are a fund-raising organization that funds those those well projects, and they’re one of the organization has a very concise mission statement. Yeah, a lot of them dio i’m trying to think it was you referred to certain certain one in particular, you know, just that was one example, right? You cite some in the book, so people have to buy the book way. Can give the whole book about paige, expect there’s only non-profit radio. This is not proper radio. Should expect you should have high expected. Yes, but we can’t bring you all two hundred rich pages. Yes. Date. I would have come with a list of the mission statements prepared. Dahna. Okay, um, after mission, we’re moving to our vision. Yes. Now we’re getting a little more detail. Yes. So so. And when you talk about vision, obviously i’m doing it through the context of dating and relationships. You know, vision is where you’re headed. So when i talk about dating when you’re dating for a purpose, right, you’re looking to find somebody who can spend, you know, whether it’s rest of your life with our meaningful part of your life. The idea is to find somebody who wants similar things is you, you know, using the dating analogy, do they want to have children? Do they want to live in the city or the suburbs? Do they want to be, you know, primary breadwinner, both, you know, both working whatever the case may be, but these are important conversations you have when you’re dating someone seriously. Where we headed together is unit because if you’re not on the same page of one wants children and it’s important to him, and the other one doesn’t want children that’s probably a deal breaker, so so, you know, the correlation to fund-raising is that i discovered that in my first marriage oh, there you are, bring i could bring some case study in on the way outside our competition today, vice to se eso eso eso when i was so when you’re when you’re doing the fund-raising business being the fund-raising business and you’re and you’re looking to get someone to support your cause, you’re not supporting your cause for what they are. It is now right? You’re not. We’re break. We bring clean drinking water to central africa. That’s not the case. That’s gonna get someone open their wallet, what’s going to get them to open the wall is this is where we are now, but this is where we’re headed, and if they buy into the idea of where you’re headed, then they’re going to support you. So if they like, if they see that vision of your organization is the white picket fence with the dog and the tire swing, then they will support you. They’re not here to fill holes or to cover your gaps in your budget. They want to know that you are a viable organization and you have some great things in mind, and you’re headed in their group great direction. So that’s, what i talked about vision and through the dating perspective is the idea that you’re selling somebody on where you’re headed, okay, where this relationship with right shows that it is going to go okay, i hang out because i have to talk a little about pursuing through sponsors our show and you and i’ll catch up in a minute or two pursuant you’ve heard me talk about one of their cloudgood aced tools, velocity made specifically for gift officers to keep the gift officers on task. Now i recognize the gift officer might be you. You might be the ceo, and you’re the director of development. All the more reason i think, that you need to check out pursuant and their tool velocity and all the more reason that you need technology to be helping you in your day to day because you’re wearing so many hats. 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You can get the tool without the consultant, you don’t have to have the fund-raising consultant you can use the tool that they’re using and get that value so you know, it’s got the analytics is the metrics, and it keeps you on task in you’re fund-raising so you know, if you need to raise more money, velocity can help you do it and there’s all the info about velocity at pursuing dot com now it’s time for tony’s take two the non-profit technology conference is this month coming up march twenty third through twenty fifth in san jose, california. I hope this is not news to you. You’ve heard me talk about it before i hope you’re going to be there or if you can’t be there subscribe subscribed to ntc live, which is the live audio stream that yours truly will be hosting for them. This is an excellent conference, it’s my third on tc getting interviews for non-profit radio third time i’ve been there, it’s, just a bunch of smart people that can help you use technology mohr effectively in your day to day pursuant is going to be there, they’re going to be right near me. I’m going to be on stage hosting this ntcdinosaur stream pursuit will be there, and you could check them out there, too. Um, it’s, all at ntcdinosaur, sorry, and ten and ten dot or ge, and also have info at tony martignetti dot com. And both places will have the the schedule of people that’ll be interviewing. And, again, those interviews going to be on anti seelye, ve the stream. And then also, of course, they’ll be on non-profit radio in the coming months. Okay. Jonah helper. Thank you for your indulgence, sir. Hey, you do you freely with ntcdinosaur provoc technology? I actually attended. Not last year, the year before that. And it was amazing. There was. Yes, it was. I had a first. All they had, like, big band on stage. You’re talking about twenty fourteen. It might have been twenty. Forty, right? Yeah. I had a fantastic time. It was. And it was in california. It was in san francisco that year. I loved it. I mean, they were great. The organizer’s there were fantastic. Yeah. Okay, i think i was twenty thirteen. I was a twenty. Fourteen. Was my first one there in washington, d c okay, so they alternate east, mid and west sametz been so close to twenty three years ago. Yeah. It’s a it’s. A lot of smart people. They had a big band on stage. It was. I mean, it was heaven enchantment, and i was like, well, i wasn’t expecting that. Andi conference in general gave me that kind of flavor. It was with the sessions or great, the people in the hallways, you know, i always love the hallways, the hallways of the best. Because when you you always meet the best people in the hallways, sessions are good because you can hear the training and they’re in their and the great sessions, but there’s, nothing better than being able to just bump into somebody and find out they’re doing amazing work, and it could be a small church in virginia, and they’re doing phenomenal things that you could apply to your organisation in some, you know, specific instance, i love that, yeah, that kind of randomness on dh and the ntc, the non-profit technology conference did that for me. We were talking about your organization and and its mission and vision statements, and you also want, you know, you want organization to be clear about who their primary customers are and not two morph into something that you really don’t belong doing or being with or, you know, again being true to yourself being say more about that. Yeah, so so, you know, let me get a good story that i heard from my friend nancy lublin, who is the founder of dress for success and was then chief old person of do something dot orgryte, which is teen engagement, so the fact that she was, you know, not a team made her the old productions on crisis text long yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. Just treyz his text leinheiser heard one she started well, shouldn’t start, do something. Yeah, but she might as well have started because where i’m going with that story on dh, everything she touches turns to gold and that’s, not luck. I mean, it’s, she is a a tour de force. I mean, she is unbelievable. But the story that she she shared with me was that when she came to do something that or go it was a centers, it was a brick and mortar centers around the u s where teens would could get involved. And there it was founded by melrose place actor shoe. And it was andrew shoe. His name was okay. And it was it was a floundering organization. They were having a major major problems, and they were presented when she came aboard with an opportunity for i don’t know where the dollar amount was my been two hundred fifty, three hundred thousand dollars from a company that that said build a teen center near our call center. Like near, you know our operations and, you know, we’d love to have a teen center over there. And nancy, as the new ceo of the organization of duitz of do something that orc sa declined the money and an organization that is starving for cash. Yeah, so it seems to be like, you know, like, what are you doing? You know, your new new new kid on the block here on dh you’re turning down this money, and when she brought her into the offices or, you know, in in our offices, she they sat down with the leadership in legends like, how how badly do you want this job? All right, you know, you’re seemed to be kind of walking your way out of it, and she said, you know, you need to trust may because this is not the future of do something that i do something right, forget the dot org’s it’s not future of do something to have all these brick and mortar, you know, places for students to kids to come together, it needs to be online and she after that point shut down all the physical locations, took the whole thing online, rebranded to do something as do something dot org’s and and is now getting forget the corporate dollars that she turned away the two hundred thousand tens and tens of millions of dollars they get and primarily comes from from companies, so arrow pasta will partner with them for teens, for genes. They found that homeless teenagers the number one thing that they wanted were a pair of jeans. Why? Because i don’t have to be washed every day and its owner’s homeless, he doesn’t have access to clean clothes, a pair of jeans are cool enough, you know, generic and cool enough that you could wear and where without having to clean them every day. And that was something that homeless teenagers wanted, and they partnered with aeropostale for kids who had no better privilege to donate their genes threw in the store, it created a tremendous amount of foot traffic into air apostle, and that was vowed valuable to them, the co-branding was strong, and it turned out to be a wonderful partnership, and they’ve just replicated that that kind of model of companies adopting programs, supporting their their their operations, they have done tremendous amount, because so your point they were focused. On the mission of, of serving young adults who want to volunteer, and it was not going to be a brick and mortar place. It was going to be online. And because she was paying attention to that and not the dollar, she was able to take this organization which was floundering, and make it the powerhouse that it is today. And that she’s now entrusted in the hands of the other time the chief operating officer, aria finger she’s, now the ceo of do something that oregon are on ours, but on non-profit radio toy. So there you go as ceo and as ceo. And then and then they spun that off because, yes, okay, i said yes, because our online they’re able to serve millions and millions of teens like five million’s i mean, they have, and they have this big treasure trove of data. Yes, about teen engagement and know how to engage them in issues. I think they’re think their sweet spot is like sixteen to twenty five or so. And then beyond twenty five, they used your primary money is coming from companies. Big data or data is so important. So because that’s the case then, like, you know, think that something that you mentioned earlier about how nancy level went onto crisis text line that was born out of the fact that they were getting texts, emergency tests, texts of young adults who are suicidal, we’re getting abused or things along those lines and and as an organization as there to help people, what do you do with that? They weren’t equipped, they were equipped, and then they found the typical the standard nine nine eleven was not going to be able to handle us, especially for the digital age where people are going on their cell phone and they’re more comfortable hiding in the bathroom on their cell phone and texting somebody on emergency. They needed to do something so and that kind of stuff has outgrown has grown out of do something dot or ge and that’s? Why, you know, have crisis tax line? So it is there’s so many wonderful examples that you can see where, especially in their story, where they straight stay true to their mission, and if it wasn’t and if and if and if emergency texting was not right for do something dot or ge, they didn’t. Just like expand the mission to fit under, do something out or they made it crisis that’s now a new organization, nancy’s now the head of that. And that was a new thing. It wasn’t like mission creep, and now we’re doing, you know, we’re solving another problem. They started a new organization with all focus on your primary custom. Absolutely cool. All right, after we’ve started this relationship, we need to keep it going. And you call this i don’t have a name a chapter with somewhere you say from lust toe love. Well, so the analogy, the relationships go ahead. You’re so so we all know this and in our in our our own relationships, you know, boyfriend, girlfriend, whatever it is at the early, early part of the relationship, this tremendous amount of lust, right there is the attraction it’s, new it’s, fresh it’s, exciting and that’s so important because that is going to be, you know, the chemistry needs to be there that’s vital to the success of meeting new people and starting to develop a relationship with them. But it needs to mature, right and there’s if the relationship is only on that’s the part i missed in high school. Yeah, the maturity and the whole thing is stirring up a lot, so i had a lot of lost, but okay, you know what to do with it all i’m in the same boat, my friend. S o so yes, so? So that has to mature. So, yeah, if you get somebody to become a donor of your organization, right, they may be enamored and they might be a beautiful organization. You could be a charity water you could be, you know, do something that or go any of these clauses that are gorgeous. I mean, they they look gorgeous, their offices a gorgeous they just have got that locked down, but it needs to mature and it was the relationship with them needs to be more than just face value is not just i’m excited to be part of this, you know, sexy organization. It needs to mature to say, look, i’m a partner. I’m somebody who’s not just early part of the job. I’m a partner. I’m in this for the long haul. I want to help them grow whether it’s capital improvements, whether it’s ah, you know the infrastructure what, whether it’s special projects, whatever the case may be, i want to see this organization grow from where it is now and where it’s headed. And that means that the relationship needs to mature where they have a greater stake in the game. And that means lino much like in our own personal relationships, where we might do certain milestone things, like move in together. There needs to be that kind of advancement, that kind of moves management and to use, you know, fund-raising jargon to take that relationship from one that’s courtship and maybe a first gift to now increase that support over time. Part of this is a plan. So when you have, we need to be more structured. Maybe then are in on our dating side and our our relationship side. But we need stewardship plan, basically what belongs in our stewardship. So i like to talk a lot about new donorsearch accusation because, you know, you mentioned if you have something as a donor and you want to keep one of the chapters is called, keep the fire alive. Right? So that you want to put some good practices in place. You know, i talk about there in the in charge of keeping the fire alive and howto kind of moves that move that relationship along, that you should treat someone like an investor or treat them like family right now. Or and and and and while it may sound like that’s ah, daikon that’s outside the investor way investors or relationships, right? Are you treating me like, like, a business transaction? Or so the nice thing is that it’s not mutually exclusive because what happens is in your relationships there are absolutely expectations if you if we decide tony, you and i decided we’re going to move in together, right? What? We have a wonderful relationship. We love each other. We have a wonderful relationship we want we’re going to move in now, and we’re gonna have to take it to that one quote next-gen metoo do this by the way, if you’re my wife. Well, my by floods in indianapolis, so nobody listens to this show so you don’t worry about it. Word getting out exactly right. Good. We could talk after, okay. So so if if we want to take that to the next level, is there anything truly different about our relation with each? Other do we love each other anymore? The moment that we are now in the same apartment? No, right? There’s, no inherent change that happens between the way you feel about me and i feel about, you know, the decision that we’ve decided move it. What we have done is we’ve increased expectations on each other that there’s a certain kind of shared life, now that we have that’s more than we had before, because we’ve said that this is a priority deepened our commitment, deepen our commitment. So now, now that we’ve deep in our commitment, i am now have a certain level of responsibility to you, right? You have there’s a certain level of investment that i’ve now made right than i know how to manage that’s, like just know if i move in with you and i lived like a single person, right? I don’t care about your feelings. I know it was anything of the week before when we weren’t living together. It was any behaving the same way, right? But now that we live together, i have a new set of standards that i have tto abide by and it’s me and it’s mutual, right? You have expectations to army. I have expectations on you and that’s. Not a bad thing. It’s a it’s. A healthy thing. But what happens is i need to meet those expectations. So if i wanted if if you’ve given me something, if you give me money a cz a fun as ah someone who’s going to give money a donor and i take that money. The relationship starts that right, it’s not thank you for your gift. I’ll speak to you next year. It’s. Now that i’ve taken your ten thousand dollars, i have a responsibility to you to make sure that you know how your money is being spent. Oh, so this gets to our city. Our stewardship plan eso starts appointed stewardship plan is that when i get to give, when i when i get money from a donor it’s, not just another box to check off and say okay, i got this gift. I got to go get another fifteen or twenty other gifts. Tto meet meet mike. Now, how are we going to try this house? So how do you really take this? And deep deep in that relationship so there’s everything from leadership roles. There’s these opportunities when it comes to getting them to open up their own home in their own network a lot times people think that if you ask somebody to do think favors for you favors going, quote, like open their home for a parley meeting or to give your cause that’s burning equity that deepens relation, because giving to you so finding ways to cement leadership positions for them to spend more time in your offices. And when i mentioned treating like investors and treat them like family, why should they only have a relationship with you? Right? You are representing an organization, there’s. Some other wonderful people in the office is it’s. Some of the best donors and leaders i know come into the organization and they say hello to everybody from the person at the front desk to the person in the mail room. They know everybody because this is their family now. So those types of opportunities airways to kind of systemized that are important you could see in the book the whole bunch of suggestions for that. All right, we’re gonna go further. We gotta take a break. But don’t go a little more into this idea, that asking people, asking donors and volunteers to doom or is not burning them out. It’s. Deepening the relationship and not doing that could burn them out. They’ll stay with us. Like what you’re hearing a non-profit radio tony’s got more on youtube, you’ll find clips from stand up comedy tv spots and exclusive interviews catch guests like seth gordon, craig newmark, the founder of craigslist marquis of eco enterprises, charles best from donors choose dot org’s aria finger do something that worked and they only levine from new york universities heimans center on philanthropy, tony tweets to he finds the best content from the most knowledgeable, interesting people in and around non-profits to share on his stream. If you have valuable info, he wants to re tweet you during the show. You can join the conversation on twitter using hashtag non-profit radio twitter is an easy way to reach tony he’s at tony martignetti narasimhan t i g e n e t t i remember there’s a g before the end he hosts a podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy fund-raising fundamentals is a short monthly show devoted to getting over your fund-raising hartals just like non-profit radio, toni talks to leading thinkers, experts and cool people with great ideas. As one fan said, tony picks their brains and i don’t have to leave my office fund-raising fundamentals was recently dubbed the most helpful non-profit podcast you have ever heard, you can also join the conversation on facebook, where you can ask questions before or after the show. The guests were there, too. Get insider show alerts by email, tony tells you who’s on each week and always includes link so that you can contact guests directly. To sign up, visit the facebook page for tony martignetti dot com. If you have big dreams and a small budget tune into tony martignetti non-profit radio, i d’oh. I’m adam braun, founder of pencils of promise. Asking people to do more. Yes, whether they are donors or board members, this is not typically does not lead to burn out. What leads to burnout is give me your your annual gift. And now give me your annual gift a year later and a year later and there’s no substance beyond you’re giving, right, right. So the so let’s talk about i want to take a cold pill that back a little bit because i think a lot of the fear of asking people to do more comes some of the fear of asking in general, especially asking for money, you know, fund-raising is not a dirty word, and i know so many professionals and leaders in the business of consultants talk about how it’s not a dirty word, but i kind of tied into the relationship side of things in the sense that when you’re asking for money from somebody, if it’s devoid, if it’s void of a relationship, right, if we’re just asking and you’re dialing for dollars it’s, it’s, it’s taking the relationship out of it and it’s just making us and no one enjoys all transactions for that. And no one loves that. No. One likes to do that that’s. Terrible when there’s a real relationship in that leads to money. It’s, beautiful, and obviously, you can hear the correlation between like sex and relationships. If it’s just mechanical and there’s no relationship behind it, it may be fun. You may get the gift let’s, not underestimate. Great. But but my point is, this is probably not going to be a sustainable long term strategy. You’re not going to get somebody that may give you one time, but it’s not going to be a capacity gift, they could probably give you a lot more than what they’re giving you and your and it’s not like there’s any relationship behind it. So if you’re if you’re going to go after those easy shots like that, then you might get lucky. All right, you know that, but but in the end of the day, if you if you develop a real relationship than the asking for money, is the exact opposite of a negative experience is the most powerful, empowering, beautiful next step in that relationship that makes people go? Yes, i’m i’m in this i’m in this relationship, i’m in it for the long haul. So it’s it’s kind of it’s it’s kind of that double edge sword where fund-raising could either be a terrible, terrible experience transaction transaction, a wallet with legs, right? You know it’s the sex appeal of just the fact that they have money versus somebody who’s, a partner partner in the cause and he’s excited about the vision and wants to see the succeed and right on dh just wants to do more than just give exactly. You’re not going to know that until you start asking, even if it’s just give it’s done in the context of i am partnering with you and the way i’m doing, doing my share is by giving you money because if you’re going to be on the ground drilling wells or curing our ending malaria deaths or, you know, providing needs for special needs children, i’m not as a donor, i may not be the expert on how to do that, but i know if i give you money and i trust the experts, it will get done and that’s fine, they built, they’ll become a partner in dollar and that’s fine, but it’s not a transaction, it’s more than that because they are bought into the vision of the organization, all right, on a part of getting people to buy in and having them feel insiders is sharing the occasional downside failure. Yes, i’ve seen i’ve seen the good, bad and the ugly on this i’ve seen organizations that are afraid to share information with their donors on day worrying about it, it’ll burn relationship, and those tend to be the relationships that were never strong to begin with. But the there are wonderful examples of how failure or, you know, where something did not work, and it may not be, you know, gross of, you know, abuse or are you no mistrust think some things just don’t work and, you know, you put your your organization on the line, you try big things, and it doesn’t pan out it’s a wonderful opportunity to deepen the relationships. Okay, i’ll give you ah, a quick story example. I was in scott harrison who’s, a ceo and founder of charity water in his office, and he was telling me about early on and charity water before it was like, the very sexy, very sexy that’s what it is today hey told me early early on, he had a couple people on staff on payroll. They were doing their first projects, and they were going to go by that it belly up. They did not have the funds for payroll. They they were really desperate, and scott told me that he sent out a number of, like, blow you. Know emails to people who are in his periphery, you know, just to these donors and basically say, like, i need help, i need help, we’re in trouble, we’re doing great work, it wasn’t just like, you know, bail us out was like, we’re doing amazing work, but we’re in trouble. And one individual guy named michael birch, who was the who’s, a tech entrepreneur, he was the founder of bebo, which is a british base like social network from the nineties, like i bought by, i think, a well for eight hundred million dollars and he’s done not numerous projects that also brought in a lot of money, but here was a guy, michael birch, and he responded to scott and said, i’m happy to meet next time i’m in the new york area, i think he was in san francisco, and he meets with with scott and scott in-kind of bears, a soul tells, tells him everything going on and, you know, they’re doing great work, but it’s just not catching on. They’re breaking their teeth and it’s just not happening, and michael birch gives him some recommendations, gives him some advice, and then he says, i’ll see what i can do, you know, as faras giving you a little help, so he goes home. I don’t know how many days it was, you know, whatever was in the story that scott told me, but scott told me that he was sleeping in bed and his phone went off. I know texts or phone call, but was from michael birch and say, he said, i sent you some money. I’m wiring it to your account. I hope it helps, and skye trembling opens up his bank account and there’s a one million dollar gift that was sent from michael birch to charity water. And that was that trust that michael had, and he was really kind of like the one of the first major donors that they had that kind of went all in on them. He was somebody after hearing the troubles and tribulations, but was bought into scott harrison, who is, you know, the personality on the mission that he stands behind and said, this is something i want to support, and they turn that negative into tremendous partnership into this day michael and his wife are huge supporters of charity water. Everybody is not perfect in ceo land. You talk a little about flawed characters. Yeah, because because with natural, you know, things don’t always go perfectly. We might even make mistakes. I mean that that was not a mistake, that scott sure that’s got made, but but things don’t always go perfectly, and we know that from our personal relationship characters in history succeed. Yeah, i mean, so we all know this from our own personalized ships, you know, sometimes you date somebody, it doesn’t work out, and it goes down in flames, sometimes amicable, sometimes it’s definitely not their, you know, whatever it is, whether it’s dating marriage were human rights. It’s the human condition s o in the nonprofit world it’s true as well, we don’t have, you know, perfect relationships. And there are times where you butt heads with a person that you’re involved with a lay leader of volunteering your organization, and you might no longer be the right person to have that relation with them might be somebody else. It might be something that you can work with them and see through tio, but the communication and like any relationship and i talk about in the book about commune importance of communication you can either work through it or if it’s, you’re not the right person to either find somebody else. If they are bought into the cause, if it’s the cause they care about, they might be ableto be kind of handed off to somebody else and if its destructive, which sometimes, you know, a fraction of the small fraction of the relations are and it’s not in the best interest of the organization, for them to be aligned with his lay leader don’t even if they give a lot of money and it could hurt the organization, you gotta cut your losses and pull out so there’s absolutely ah, whole spectrum on relationships and how you handle them depending on what’s the best interest of the organization. We’re gonna leave it there. The book is date your donors did your donor dot com and you’ll find jonah he’s at jonah helper. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Congratulations again on the book. Oh, thank you for having me next week. I don’t know because about five weeks from today, when we’re in the studio but you know it’s going to be excellent. Have i let you down? Ever has non-profit lady radio let you down? If you missed any part of today’s show, i admonish you, find it on tony martignetti dot com. I’m still not sure about the singing this year, so i’m still i’m still thinking about that. We’re sponsored by pursuant online tools for small and midsize non-profits data driven and technology enabled pursuing dot com. Our creative producer is claire miree off. Sam liebowitz is the line producer. Gavin dollars are am and fm outreach director shows social media is by dina russell on our music is by scots died. Be with me next week for non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent go out and be green. What’s not to love about non-profit radio tony gets the best guests check this out from seth godin this’s the first revolution since tv nineteen fifty and henry ford nineteen twenty it’s the revolution of our lifetime here’s a smart, simple idea from craigslist founder pregnant mark insights orn presentation or anything? People don’t really need the fancy stuff they need something which is simple and fast. When’s the best time to post on facebook facebook’s andrew noise nose at traffic is at an all time hyre on nine a, m or eight pm so that’s, when you should be posting your most meaningful post here’s aria finger ceo of do something dot or ge young people are not going to be involved in social change if it’s boring and they don’t see the impact of what they’re doing. So you got to make it fun and applicable to these young people look so otherwise a fifteen and sixteen year old they have better things to do if they have xbox, they have tv, they have their cell phones me dar is the founder of idealist took two or three years for foundation staff to sort of dane toe add an email address their card it was like it was phone. This email thing is fired-up that’s why should i give it away? Charles best founded donors choose dot or ge somehow they’ve gotten in touch kind of off line as it were and and no two exchanges of brownies and visits and physical gift. Mark echo is the founder and ceo of eco enterprises. You may be wearing his hoodies and shirts. Tony talked to him. Yeah, you know, i just i’m a big believer that’s not what you make in life. It sze, you know, tell you make people feel this is public radio host majora carter. Innovation is in the power of understanding that you don’t just do it. You put money on a situation expected to hell. You put money in a situation and invested and expected to grow and savvy advice for success from eric sabiston. What separates those who achieve from those who do not is in direct proportion to one’s ability to ask others for help. The smartest experts and leading thinkers air on tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent.

Nonprofit Radio for October 21, 2011: So You Want To Be A Consultant & NextGen:Charity Conference 2011

Big Nonprofit Ideas for the Other 95%

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Tony’s Guests:

Henry Goldstein
Hank Goldstein: So You Want To Be A Consultant

Hank Goldstein, author of “So You Want To Be A Consultant” for the Association of Fundraising Professionals, and a partner at The Oram Group, offers insight into the ups-and-downs, and ins-and-outs of consulting to nonprofits. When should you start thinking about consulting? What personality does it take? How much should you charge?

 

Jonah Halper
Jonah Halper: NextGen:Charity Conference 2011

Conference co-founder Jonah Halper talks about this year’s NexGen:Charity on November 17 & 18 in New York City. Who are their great speakers and what’s the conference about? My show is a media partner of NextGen and Jonah announces a $300 conference discount for listeners!

 

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Durney welcome to the show, this is tony martignetti non-profit radio i’m your aptly named host. We’re always talking about big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I certainly hope you were with me last week when we first talked about giving beyond the czech non-cash e-giving interview was recorded at the national conference on philanthropic planning, where i was earlier this month in san antonio, and my guest was michael king of the national christian foundation, and he shared the process for closing gif ts of unusual assets, like collectibles, real estate and intellectual property second guest last week was proactive prospect research with our regular contributor, maria simple, the prospect finder. She followed up on her earlier conversation with me in a previous show by going into greater detail on making your small shop prospect research proactive this week. So you want to be a consultant? Hank goldstein is the author of so you want to be a consultant for the association of fund-raising professionals and he’s, a partner at the orem group he’s going to share his insight into the ups and downs the ins and outs of consulting for non-profits when should you start thinking? About consulting what personality does it take and how much should you charge? We’ll talk about all that with hank after that next-gen charity two thousand eleven i have with me the conference co founder jonah helper. We’re going to talk about this year’s conference on november seventeenth and eighteenth in new york city will find out who the great speakers are, what that conference is all about. My show is a media partner of the nextgencharity conference between the guests. As always, tony’s take two. My last week’s block post separate the juice from the pits is getting a lot of comments. A juicer at a restaurant got me thinking about fund-raising and how you should best spend your time. We’re live tweeting this week. Use the hashtag non-profit radio to join our conversation on twitter that hashtag again non-profit radio we’re going to take a break, and when we returned, i’ll be joined by hank goldstein. We’re going to talk about being a consultant for non-profits so stay with me. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way. Look forward to serving you. Is your marriage in trouble? Are you considering divorce? Hello, i’m lawrence bloom, a family law attorney in new york and new jersey. No one is happier than the day their divorce is final. My firm can help you. We take the nasty out of the divorce process and make people happy. Police crawl. Offset. Two, one, two, nine, six, four, three, five, zero two for a free consultation. That’s lawrence h bloom two, one two, nine, six, four, three five zero two. We make people happy. Dahna hey, are you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com. Durney welcome back to the show with me now is hank goldstein. He is a principal partner of the orem group consultants to non-profits he’s, the past chair of giving us a foundation and former chairman and president of the association of fund-raising professionals, both nationally and in new york. He’s, an adjunct professor of philanthropic management at the new school. And he’s, the author of the association of fund-raising professionals monograph. So you want to be a consultant? I’m very pleased that his work and that booklet brings him to our show. Hank goldstein. Welcome. Thank you. Good to be here. Pleasure to have you. Why did you write? So you want to be a consultant? People were always coming up to me at conferences and wherever, and would sell your consultant. I’d like to be a consultant. How much should i charge? What do i have to know? And so i thought about that for a while and finally decided to put it on paper. And a f p was good enough to publish it was. How much should i charge? Always the first question. It’s right at the top of the list that you can read it in. Their eyes, we’re going to get to that had a charge, and how much to charge we’ll get to that later is do you think this is ah, natural progression to do? Most people think about this who are working in non-profits i think at some point it crosses the mind of just about everybody on it could be a variety of reasons they’ve had a bad day at the office, and they’re angry at their boss is one reason, well, maybe that’s not a reason, but it’s a rationalization. And then another reason a good reason is they think about their careers very often there ten or fifteen years in, and they’re thinking about what should i do with my life? And it arises in that fashion. They’re laid off from a job, and i seen some very senior people laid off in the last couple of years, and instead of looking around for another job, they say, well, maybe i should be a consultant and some of them do i always tell him it’s easy to start it, it’s hard to stay in it, okay? And we’re going that’s. Excellent. Well put, we’ll talk about that, too, do you have to wait ten or fifteen years. I mean, if you’re if you’re thinking of it consciously yourself, without any of these external loser, all external reasons for thinking about it lay off for ah, bad day at the office. But if you’re thinking about it on your own, do you have to wait ten or fifteen years? No, not at all, but i think you need to have a few years experience under your belt. I had a call the other day from a very bright young woman who graduated from princeton. She’s done this she’s done that she wants to work for dahna for non-profits for the rest of her life, and she wants to be a consultant. And i said, well, pile up a couple of years experience working for somebody, particularly in the area of non-profit hearing that attracts you, then we can talk about your being a consultant, but right now you haven’t got anything to sell to anybody, and we’re talking about consulting. Are we thinking, are you thinking this is independent work or working for a consulting firm? Well, it’s both used to be that one could aspire to join the staff. Of the consulting firm that’s. What i did way back when and in those days it was possible consulting firms had fatter payrolls, and i guess they were paying lower, but it was possible to get in that way today with virtual consulting the firm’s of mostly shrunken size there only a few really large ones that take people on most firms are one, two, three, maybe four partners and that’s it s so it’s much harder to get a job in a consulting firm unless you bring in a client or two on that, of course happens. And i guess having that client or two would would help you either way. I mean, if you want to be an independent, sure, it helps a lot to have somebody that, you know, is going to travel with you as as your first first or second client. Yeah, and the way that first or second client often comes about is hyre you’ve either been separated from your job or you decide to separate from your job, you decide to become a consultant and you say to the powers, i’d like you to be my first client, and very often that happens. And that’s, what gets people started? So that gets them going then as i said earlier, it’s easy to start, harder to stay in where is the second, third and fourth client coming from that’s going to pay the rent, the overhead and your salary and your health benefits and your dogs, chow and laura’s? What does it take to be a successful consultant if you’re thinking about it? Well, i think you have to look at your personality in in shorthand. I think that there is such a thing as a consulting personality. What is it? It’s it’s a person who’s willing to take risks probably has a slight case of attention deficit disorder because you like to do more than one thing at a time, you can discipline yourself so that your time is well spent. You have expertise either as a generalist or in some particular aspect of not-for-profits work and that’s and you can work without a lot of structure. The other side is this staff personality you, khun you like structure you don’t mind having somewhat someone tell you what to do, you can abide the politics of the organization with which you’re a silly ated and it’s a single thing and you don’t have to struggle with trying new hunt for clients and serve clients at the same time, which as a consultant one is obliged to do no matter how successful you are on staff. I imagine some people get a little frustrated by having lots of responsibility but not so much authority see that goes between those. Well, i think that happens quite a lot that in not-for-profits where thie asset base is thin, throwing a lot of work at people without consequence. Responsibility is one of the major sources of frustration or as i like to put it, stresses combustible and people burn out, and one of the reasons they burn out is number one. They don’t really control their environment. When you are a consultant, you control your environment, whether you do it sagely or not is another question buy-in environment you mean who you’re working with, what your hours are, how you work, how you build exactly, you want to sit in your jammies and work? You couldn’t do it, it’ll depend, but it does depend a lot on your own self discipline. Five we’re going to take a break. Sure, hank goldstein is going to stay with us. Of course, we’re going to talk a little more about attention deficit disorder as it relates to consulting and other things. So stay with me. I didn’t do anything to get independent thing. You’re listening to the talking alternative network, you waiting to get you thinking. Cubine are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping huntress people be better business people. Hi, this is psychic medium. Betsy cohen, host of the show. The power of intuition. Join me at talking alternative dot com mondays at eleven a. M call in for a free psychic reading learned how to tune into your intuition to feel better and to create your optimum life. I’m here to guide you and to assist you in creating life that you deserve. Listen. Every monday at eleven a, m on talking alternative dot com. Are you feeling overwhelmed in the current chaos of our changing times? A deeper understanding of authentic astrology can uncover solutions in every area of life. After all, metaphysics is just quantum physics. Politically expressed buy-in, montgomery, taylor and i offer lectures, seminars and private consultations. For more information, contact me at monte m o nt y at r l j media. Dot com talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. I’m christine cronin, president of n y charities dot orc. You’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Welcome back to the show. Hank goldstein and i are talking about his monograph for the association of fund-raising professionals. So you want to be a consultant, hank let’s. Talk a little more about the personality that it takes because this is this is the first thing you mentioned when i when i said, you know, what does it take to be successful? You gotta have the right sort of personality. So you mentioned risk acre, or at least i guess not. Risk averse. What? What are the risks? Well, several risks are, first of all, getting in keeping clients is one. A second risk is longevity. You’ve got to be able to stick it out on maybe go a while without an income. Wait, let’s, stop there. Go a while without an income. Well, you start up something. If you’ve married well, it may not be a problem. Otherwise coupled. Well, that was my mistake. I see. Yeah. Now i know where you were when you know where you major state where years ago. But the point is, you have to be able to sustain yourself if you leave a job and maybe you take that employer with you. Is your first client? How long will that last? So there is that these days on that sort of a big, maybe two it’s a big you might just be leaving. Ah fund-raising zor staff job, and they have no intention of your first glass so that’s, right? And when you leave the harbour, you think you know where you’re going, but it’s a big ocean and you don’t always you don’t always know. S o i think that’s important in these days providing healthcare for yourself for your family, that’s an expensive proposition on it has to be calculated providing for retirement benefits along the way. So there are a lot of benefits people get when they have staff jobs that they have to replace when they’re on their own. Now that frightens some folks and they take, you know, wake up in the morning and they realized, oh, my gosh, that’s, that’s a big order. Maybe i better just say it. Stay where i am. It may be boring. I may hate my bus, but it’s safe onda lot of people don’t, you know don’t believe isn’t that sad though it well, it depends on the personality no. It’s not sad if you don’t have the personality to be a consultant to be an entrepreneur, to be a risk taker, the worst mistake you can make is if you’re not built for that to go out and try and do it, you’re going to fail and you’re not going to be a happy camper. But then you could s o and this is outside your monograph, but you could then look for another job as an employee has a statue and that night count, boss, absolutely no it’s not outside the monograph. I counsel people that all the time that you know what, you strike me as a really great person, terrific at what you do. But my bet is you would be better off if you’re not happy here. Look for another job is an employee. Don’t try to be a consultant. I don’t think you’re going to like it. All right? What about the attention deficit disorder you mentioned for? Well, that lady d’ya know what i mean by that? Is i i’m a multi tasker. I like to do several things at the same time. And i like working for a client very intensely, but then that burns down, and i’d like to go on to something else. And work just is intensely and come back to the first one sort of the way i do puzzles. So a lot of different juggling. A lot of different things that weren’t so yes, andi, i think that i could do that. I have personality for that. So in my work, that stands me in good stead. But it’s, not for everyone. Some people like to have a single task. Like to stay with it. I have a daughter who’s, a scientist totally opposite from me. She likes to sit in her lap and concentrate on one thing for a very long time. The you also mentioned discipline. Your your time is your own right. You gotta manage it. Right? Your time is your own. You have to manage it. And these days, more people work from their home krauz. And that makes it even harder because there are a lot more distractions for many years. First one, i had a company. Then i sold it. Then i was a smaller company. I’m still a smaller company, but i switched from having an office on fortieth street. Toe working from my loft downtown and i didn’t realize how much of a shift that would be because there’s a discipline in just getting on the subway and going to the office and being in an office, i thought i’d been working at home, on and off forever. I didn’t realize what a big difference actually being near all the time would make, but because i am a really disciplined person, i had no problem taking care of all my obligations, doing everything and still stirring the soup literally because i love to cook so i could handle that, and i know that that’s, not everybody. Some people just can’t do it, they procrastinate, they never quite get to work or they’re too busy shopping online. Teo, pay attention if you feel that you have the personality than what what’s the first step. I mean, imagine you have to have some money to get started. I think you have to think about what you’re earning now and either how long you can go without an income or what, at a minimum, do you need for the first year? And if you’re really conservative as i am in some regards. Maybe over three years, how much would you have to generate in order to maintain a lifestyle that you would feel comfortable with? And don’t make the mistake of thinking that when you work for non-profits as a consultant, you’re unnecessarily going to make more than you did as a salaried person? That’s something we haven’t talked about yet? It is not written that because you’ve become a consult, buy-in you will make more than you did before? No, not necessarily. Maybe if you’re at the lower scales of not for-profit employment, you will, but i see top people who were making two, three hundred thousand dollars a year laid off their very unlikely to make that as a consultant any time soon. Okay, the balance would be, i guess, quality of life, the balance is quality of life, and i think along those lines in deciding whether you want to be a consultant, decide whether you’re going to be regional and sleep in your own bed every night, or whether, like me, you get hives if you don’t get airline tickets twice a week, so this is sort of leading to marketing, which is which goes to the point. You’ve mentioned twice, is different to get in and versus staying in. You’ve got if you’ve got your first one or two clients, you’ve got, you’ve got to keep it up. There are really three pieces that have to be balanced out once you decide that you’re in this and you’re working at attracting clients, some marketing and branding is obvious of obvious importance website and so forth, so so within that you have to be willing to self promote right, you can’t be can’t be a shrinking violet really modest about your ability and what you can learn the value you can add through. No, i think, you know, and i think you need to have a track record that’s why i send people back to the office who haven’t really got the experience or a specialty or whatever. I regard myself as a generalist dahna with a an inch inch deep in a mile wide, and you can consult that way because you can hand off to specialists as need be, but certainly marketing and branding is one piece serving clients, of course, is the most important piece because the first client leads to the second and into the third and so forth, and of course, you have to manage a business and buy-in once you hyre receptionist, you’re a totally different game. Once you have employees, you really are in business, and a lot of folks will tell you that and it’s true, once you have employees, you’re working for them. They’re not working for you so it’s a totally different model than if you’re just by yourself. Bring calling yourself a consultant, which sounds like a way to get started because you don’t have that overhead. Right with hank goldstein and he’s, the author of the association of fund-raising professionals monograph. So you want to be a consultant? Let’s, talk about serving those clients because you made the point. Client referrals are critical and very inexpensive. Way to get the next client, right. Some of the most common way, ninety eight percent. How can you make sure? Oh, is that right? I think. It’s all word of mouth. Okay, i know there’s. Certainly in my practice, right? How can you make sure that you’re going to serve the clients? I mean, aside from having the experience service servicing multiple clients at the same time is a delicate balance it’s a delicate balance. And i think that for me and this may be oversimplified and we only have a limited period of time. I think the most important thing and serving a client is to make the correct diagnosis. The problem they come in with is almost never the problem arika and understanding what the problem is is ninety percent of the solution. It’s when you go to the doctor when she or he makes the diagnosis correctly, that’s most of the cure because then they give you a bunch of pills, but if they make the wrong diagnosis and they give you a bunch of pills, you’re not going to get better. I think it’s the same with serving clients, figuring out what it is they’re actually looking for, whether they understand that or not, and then delivering that that to me is the essence of the practice and that’s above the neck. It isn’t running around looking busy, it’s thinking it through and advising accordingly. Yeah, there are mechanical things to do in their important, but the first thing is to understand what the client really needs. So how come the c suite? People in a. Non-profit don’t understand what their problem is. They talk to themselves. Okay? What do you mean? Well, it’s, easy to too insular. I think very often, i think very often there’s insularity. I think that very often there trying to read their board and deliver what the board expects them to deliver hyre training to the test, so to speak and a cz organizations grow, they developed what i call hardening of the categories and it’s less possible for them to think freshly. One of the great advantages you bring as a consultant is your gut and your enthusiasm and your experience. But most of all, your honesty not to be a nice guy, necessarily. You don’t have to be a bad guy, but you have to be willing to tell the truth. And oddly enough, people don’t always like to hear the truth. If they look fat in that dress, you have to be able to tell them that, and they don’t always want to hear it on dh the they’re often more receptive to that difficult to hear message when it is an outsider who they’re paying a fee to versus somebody on the inside is a staff person, right? I can’t tell you the number of times i’ve been in a situation where someone said, but you know what? I’ve told them that, but they won’t listen to me. They’ll listen to you that’s because you’re outside, yes is very important to have that independence, but got to make the most of it and that khun b o okay, well, forget what i was going to say. What do you mean, make them? Well, you have to make the most of it by being a good consultant. You have to listen, we’re not in listening mode right now. We’re talking, but i’m listening. I know you are, and i appreciate it listening to what the client says help to make the right diagnosis, listening carefully on not just popping off. So when you do deliver a judgment it’s considered even if you i had a hypothesis before and turned out to be exactly right, you try to hear it through before you deliver a sermon about what they should be doing. What did you say your name was? No winkelstein i’m listening gets harder and harder, so the part of what i was going to suggest is that this can also be very gratifying. As a consultant, because you can bring the perspective and there’s a greater likelihood that it will be heated. It’s a great insight that we haven’t talked about that there’s a great satisfaction in helping folks, but you have to also keep in mind that a client has an inalienable right to reject your advice, and they do that about fifty percent of the time. So the best thing you can do is deliver it and hope for the best. Very often, i find myself way out in front of my client on a particular matter, and instead of being either egotistical about it or frustrated about it, you accept them the way they are. You try to bring them along, but it’s very important that you respect their perspective. So even with that limitation is very satisfying to be changing the world let’s, talk about some of the harder side the financial side of this. You said that one of the early questions you get, you can read it in people’s faces. How did they not so much what to charge yet? We’ll get to that. But how do you decide how you’re going to charge for your time? To clients, yes. What i tell people or advised people who are thinking about this question about what am i going to charge? What salary would you like to be able to maintain? Just take a number, whatever it is, one hundred thousand fifty thousand seventy five, whatever it doesn’t matter, add thirty percent for taxes and maybe some benefits, or even thirty five percent. Um, where you going to sit in your garage or in your kitchen? Or you’re going to have an office? What other expenses air? You’re going, tohave. You gonna have to upgrade your computer. You’re gonna have to have new phone lines. Figure out a budget for do-it-yourself when you have all of that done. That’s your base that’s the amount that you have to cover. That’s the nut, as we say and that’s where you that’s where you start, everything on top of that is money that comes into the business. Remember that you have to market it and branded buy-in you have to be able to find clients. And sometimes that means traveling, which is not compensated. You have to spend time writing proposals that are not acted on. You have downtime on you have to. Build into your fee the fact that you’re not able to deliver five days a week, every single month if you have an application rate of seventy or eighty percent that’s sensational. And what does that mean? An application? Right? Well, that means that even in a place like mckinsey, they can’t keep an employee an associate one hundred percent of signed, even a law firm can’t keep an associate or a partner one hundred percent of sign there’s certain amount of downtime, that’s not covered. And you have to build that into your structure. I wanted i asked you because i want to keep you out of jargon jail on this show. We have judge jails in jail. No, i hope i haven’t gone near no. You traded closely. But i kept you out most. Most people i could do that for. Thankyou. So in just a minute or so that we have left all these factors go in to deciding how you’re going toe. How you’re going to charge for your time. Yes. And then you know how much you’re going to charge, right? And then you can divide it anyway. You want you can divide it by day, hour week, however, and charge accordingly, i generally i i prefer a per diem it’s, easy for clients to understand. It’s, easy for me to understand. I was a liberal arts major. I’m not real good at math, so i know that labbate that works for me, okay? Hank goldstein is the author of. So you want to be a consultant for the association of fund-raising professional he’s, also principal partner of the orem group consultants to non-profits hank, thank you very much for being a guest, thanks very much. Been a pleasure. We’re going to take a break when we returned. Tony’s, take two, and then i’ll be joined by jonah, helper of the nextgencharity conference. Stay with me. Dafs you’re listening to the talking alternative network. Duitz are you feeling overwhelmed in the current chaos of our changing times? A deeper understanding of authentic astrology can uncover solutions in every area of life. After all, metaphysics is just quantum physics, politically expressed hi and montgomery taylor and i offer lectures, seminars and private consultations. For more information, contact me at monte m o nt y at r l j media. Dot com are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication, and the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharpe, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office needs better leadership, customer service sales, or maybe better writing, are speaking skills. Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. If you’re in the new york city area, stopped by one of our public classes, or get your human resource is in touch with us. The website is improving communications, dot com, that’s, improving communications, dot com, improve your professional environment, be more effective, be happier, and make more money improving communications. That’s the answer. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com no. Welcome back to the show. Time now for tony’s. Take two at roughly thirty two minutes after the hour, my block post from last week was separate the juice from the pits. Juicer in a restaurant that i like on twenty third street organic. I saw it and i saw in action and it got me thinking about fund-raising and how you should allocate your time to things that are valuable, the juice and disassociate yourself from things that can be big. Time draws the pits and it’s getting a good number of comments. So that’s what? I want to talk about it again this week, someone sheila bonem sheila recommended. She suggests the daily five that you always make five calls to donors every day, irrespective of everything that’s going on around you. Your goal is to always do at least five calls a day and those other things that could be going on around you. Could the administrative requirements you know, meetings could be volunteers sort of committee work that can take a lot of time, but she always tries to make five calls a day. Two donors toe. And also i think that probably helps ground her. In what her riel work-life needs to be, it could be very centering. I think nancy, in the comments on the blogged, shared her bless and release approach, meaning that you have to recognize when a relationship isn’t going to be fruitful and, as i said earlier, sort of start to disassociate yourself from that person or that relationship could be a corporate relationship to not necessarily individual person. So some very, very good comments on the block this from last week’s post the post again to separate the juice from the pits. Um, your time is valuable and it’s limited and that’s basic message you’re not just going to find time, you have to make it so make it an allocated wisely. And my blogged as always, is that mpg a dv dot com with now jonah helper in the studio. Very pleased that he’s with me. He is co founder of the next-gen charity conference along with our e t men who couldn’t make it today. And jonah is a consultant to non-profits his company is altruicity jonah helper. Welcome to the show. Thrilled to be here. Thank you. Pleasure to have you now. And i want people. To know that this show my show, by the way, it’s twenty martignetti non-profit radio because you’ve forgotten the name of the show that you were listening to, um, we are a media sponsor of the next-gen charity conference, but sadly, yes, you are with you from the first last year, and we’re going with you this year too. Why did you and ari start? Nextgencharity last year short, i was a professional fundraiser for the better part of ten years right out of school, twenty years old started doing it and loved it. Absolutely that i actually my first job, i didn’t even realize it was a fund-raising job. It was called the campaign job, and i thought it was political. I get there, i find out it’s actually fund-raising but but what i what became really my calling was the education piece of this? What happens is if you’ve a donor and you want to get from zero to ten thousand dollar gift there’s an education that happens. There’s a buy-in there’s ah there’s, a riel passion that you’re trying to convey over to this individual getting bought it and that’s what excited may andi throughout my ten years doing fund-raising i began to see a knowledge gap. I saw that the big organizations where i was trained was trained in the jewish federation system. Established been around one hundred years. You know, incredibly, you know, incredibly successful, sustainable organization. But what i found was that became very insular, very kind of focused on on who they were. I’m not really looking outside some of what goldstein was saying earlier. Precisely. I definitely identified with that on dh. You know, being young, definitely the federation system. I was on the news on the young end of the spectrum, i began to realize that the big organizations were not looking outside of their usual peripheral vision on does great things to be learned from all people. In fact, everybody does some things right. And if you believe that to be the case, if your antennas are up, you begin toe look, successes that happened outside of your organization, or even your industry, or even outside of the non-profit world. And, you know, being somebody who is constantly looking toe learn, i felt that there was this need to develop something that would be built around ideas, you know, and then ultimately became a conference around ideas my men ar e he was on the committee of mine when i was working for a special needs organization. He was there very vocal kind of that loose cannon on the rolling deck spoke his mind was very opinionated, but a lot of the same things that we were a lot of the same issues that we had in the nonprofit world. We realized that we have this common interest to see this education happen and kind of over a falafel or swarm on whatever it is. It was almost like that cliche, right? The business model on a napkin, and we said, we can do this. We were inspired by other conferences, but like the ted conference or gel where they were built around ideas, they weren’t built around certain institutions. It wasn’t just for fundraisers or wasn’t just for marking people wasn’t just united ways it was basically, if you have something innovative, something is game changing. We invite you to come and share that, whether it’s on stage, you know, whether you’re one of our successful presenters and you get on station share that or even in the audience. I mean, we have great, great audiences with people from all over, from startups to meet major marquis names. And they have a lot to learn from each other as well. Now, i am disappointed that you didn’t know that between short on dh, full off. Now. I’m very one is a deep fried, and the other could be lamb or chicken. So you mentioned ted in jail that next-gen is based on those models? What makes next-gen a different type of conference. Okay, so the conference that most people are familiar with is the type where you may have a general session with some big flashy name that would be like a draw, you know? Wow, they no one, you know, keynote for the day, the plenary session precisely, and sometimes that person has some real value to add and sometimes it’s purely the name. And then most of the conference is built around workshops, workshops to teach you how to be a better fundraiser, better market or better, you know, keeping employees happy for whether it’s middle, middle management or wasn’t where, whether its executives, that idea is to train them and have them in these workshops, and that happened throughout the day. The ted model andare model is to just have short innovation, innovative or game changing ideas shared on stage, like a broadway experience where instead of having workshops it’s that kind of general session or the keynote session, we’re taught where presenters speak on ly for up to eighteen mini snusz because that’s pretty much persons attention. Span. Oh, so that’s the longest long longest will hear a speaker is eighteen minutes exactly. And in fact, that speaker has a countdown clock on there on the stage. The countdown accounts down from there a lot of time so they know exactly how long they have. And for these presenters, these are people who have successes. Some are big names and some are not. But they have something that will really change the face of philantech. This is what you said earlier. Everybody does something. Well, precisely. Maybe some of us do most things well, but everybody does something well. And so you found what? People’s niches. Andi invited them to speak. It’s definitely curated. I mean, we we we we have a lot of focus on making sure that it’s the right person on stage, they obviously have to be eloquent and be able to convey their idea. There’s a lot. People of great ideas but may not be right to convey it, but at the same time, we want to give people a certain but a little bit of focus. Even though it’s not workshops, we want to unite people. An idea that they’re going to. Get something specific out of these presentations, so the theme the arc of the day this year is educate, inspire impact so educate focuses around the education system, but also about how knowledge and powers our decision making on about how constantly having your intent is up makes a world of a difference. I mean, a lot of us take that for granted, but if you’re not if you’re kind of in your tunnel, if you have that tunnel vision and you’re not looking around you, then you’re not in a learning mode. S o, you know, educate is one one aspect, and then we have inspire, which is, you know, anyone who gets into this business in philanthropy come in and come into it with great deal of passion, you know, my father is a partner in the firm, right? I’m sure unless it’s in the rules that, you know, children can’t work for the family, but the business for the partners, that would be something i could easily get into our investment banking. I mean, if i’m a good fundraiser from good at raising capital for non-profit, i might be good at raising capital for a hedge fund. And a lot more money to be made over there, so people who get into this line of work are doing it for a bigger reason than the paycheck s o they get into that, but when you start getting down to the nitty gritty and you’re dealing with the paperwork and you’re dealing with all the, you know, the more monotonous aspects of fund-raising or development or whatever you’re doing in the organization, you need to kind of really reignite that passion and remind yourself why you’re doing what you doing so that the inspire pieces there as well, and then the last one is impact there’s a great deal emphasis nowadays on accountability for organizations to say, you know, we’re going down this route, and we have measured reasons for doing it. Labbate a lot of every organization has noble aspirations for what they’re trying to accomplish with our mission, but i believe it’s, melinda gates who said it’s bowling in the dark, you maybe bowling for those pins, but if you’re not, if you don’t know where throwing you might not be being, you know, as effective as you can be, so we definitely have a focus. This year on the impact component as well and and what that means for the organisations in attendance, there’s a lot of conversation in the non-profit community about impact of i’ve had ken berger on ceo of charity navigator talking about impact and outcome measurements had an author of the non-profit outcomes toolbox on talk about the same thing, so impact of of the three i know that impact is a lot of what i’m hearing in the absolutely absolutely absolutely so so how many speakers they’re going to be on a two conference it’s amazing, you know we have right now, i think sixteen or seventeen, we always end up getting a couple aa couple late stragglers people kind of want to see how it all looks and then say, okay, i’m interested in doing it. It’s it’s a numbers game like in fund-raising we have our wish list, we ask our wish list and plenty them say no, but the ones that say yes, we celebrate in the office and ones that say no is just one more no before yes, we’re going to keep pounding them so the audience is going to see roughly eighteen speakers eighteen to twenty three bodies in the same argast ditore, iam speakers just come on and off the stage, you expect the theater. It’s it’s actually properties to the tribeca performing arts center. So it’s it’s, where they do the tribeca film festival, it’s, a it’s, a it’s, the real deal outstanding. My guest is jonah helper, co founder of the nextgencharity conference. We’re going to take a break, and, of course, john will stay with me, so i hope you do, too. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. This is tony martignetti aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio friday’s one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting. Do you want to enhance your company’s web presence with an eye catching and unique website design? Would you like to incorporate professional video marketing mobile marketing into your organization’s marketing campaign? Mission one on one media offers a unique marketing experience that will set you apart from your competitors. Magnify your brand exposure and enhance your current marketing hyre your services include video production and editing, web design, graphic design photography, social media management and now introducing mobile marketing. Their motto is, we do whatever it takes to make our clients happy. Contact them today. Admission one one media dot com. Told you. Lively conversation. Top trends, sound advice, that’s. Tony martignetti, yeah, that’s. Tony martignetti non-profit radio. And i’m travis frazier from united way of new york city, and i’m michelle walls from the us fund for unicef. The nextgencharity conference two thousand eleven is november seventeenth and eighteenth at the tribeca performing arts centre. You could get information registration, but next-gen charity dot com. My guest now is jonah helper he’s, cofounder of the conference. Who are we goingto see among these eighteen speakers coming across the theatre stage? Sure. All right, so some of them are big names. Craig, you mark from craigslist, who i believe was on your show was a guest on the show. Yeah. Talking about then he was talking about craigconnects. Okay. So what’s he going to focus? Well, obviously, craigconnects is one of his more recent projects that he’s doing he’s. I believe it was insider information, but i believe he is doing a talk on customer service. He kind of views himself as a customer service expert. And he has some really, you know, creative and resourceful things to share a two conference. And then we have other individuals, like dr peter diamandis, who is the founder of the x prize foundation. That is the foundation that gives big pools of prize money towards certain campaigns of innovation. So they want to get private spacecraft into space without, you know. The use of, for example, nasa, but to rely on ingenuity and teams a big pool of money, whoever could get into space, you know, fulfill a certain number of criteria and come back down, you know, alive and safe and that’s one of the projects that they’ll fund if they’ll find that they do something built deep sea exploration, their board is incredible if you look at their board, i mean it’s it’s, larry page from google and it’s james cameron, the director, obviously has the deep sea water thing don’t for him. It’s it’s, a real he’s got incredible board and so he’ll be talking at our conference about, you know, pushing innovation. We’ve got marc ecko who’s, a famous fashion designer echo unlimited here in new york city. Ah, he is a champion of ah breaking through bureaucracy he’s incredible, incredibly talented at spreading the word and also rattling the cage. He did a couple things definitely just google his name and see what he did to air force one. I’ll leave that as a teaser for you. How is his last name? Spelled e c k echo. Hey, is he has an organization on called unlimited? Justice that is, that mission is to stop corporal punishment in class and believe it or not, in twenty or twenty two states in the us, it’s still okay to hit a child in the classroom? The same states it’s it’s illegal to hit a prisoner in the prison system, but you can smack around a kid on dh that would sound like something that would be easy to change, you know, go to the you know, whatever it takes, we’ll go to the powers to be in the city in the state and say you can’t hit kids but it’s not so easy. This tremendous bureaucracy and he’s already gotten two states to change thiss wanted to put in a ruling to effect a law into effect that you can’t hit hit a kid in the classroom. So he’s another person who’s presenting we definitely have other unconventional ones. Teo neil strauss, famous journalist for the rolling stone magazine hey also wrote a book called the game, which is for for ah kind like the bible for how to pick up women he’s b he became the number two pick up artists in the world he was under taken. Under the wing from the by the number one in which for so we could write this book, he wrote this book tremendously successful, and we’re having him talk about how to seduce your donor. Oh, excellent, yes, it is interesting because you can go to a conference here in here from a gazillion fundraisers or consultants on how to fundraise. So we thought, well, how do we approach is from a new direction, you know, it’s about relationships and fund-raising about relationships and why don’t why don’t we have somebody? Who’s, an expert on relationships in a kind of a sexy, offbeat way? Give a talk, you know, to that end so definitely you can go online, see the full roster that we have, and we’ll be adding a couple more between now and the conference in november seventeenth. So, you know, we’re very excited with our ostro’s here, all right, and it’s eighteen to twenty speakers on that first day in november seventeenth and then what’s the second day eighteen okay, so the second day is very not traditional for unconference most conferences have predetermined workshops, you select rich which workshop you want to attend, so between the nine and eleven hour in the morning you could choose between four or five different topics sometimes, you know, i don’t know which one to go. This is very different. This’s calling unconference or open space. The model isn’t isn’t created by us, but it’s something that’s still not heavily adopted in the conference world. We’re basically attendees come no pre assigned agenda no preassigned workshops, they come and basically it’s a new agenda developed by the people who comes. So i get to the room and i say, okay, you know, i’m having problems of my organisation with donor attention or another person comes along and says, i’m trying to get volunteers how do i get volunteers? They come into the room big ballroom, big giant like three m giant post it notes they can write their issue and different a lot of areas in the room, they can post their issue, and then people congregate. Either they have answers, or they might have similar questions, and they can network around those issues. So it’s kind of organized chaos where where they come in and they and they get the solutions that they need andi network on a high level you know, we’ve all been to conferences with networking the conversation khun tend to be very superficial. You know where you’re from when you go on home. What did you have for breakfast? This is networking in its finest form it’s around the issues. And so do you know how many issues will you’ll be able to accommodate what we have? I believe we have the ability to accommodate ten issues at a time we have in the big bar and there’s these ten pillars which kind of create these natural pockets for people to congregate around. And we’re gonna let people post their their issues around these areas. We wanted to be organic. We want people to be ableto get the solutions that they need. And we’re not going to try to put a square. You know peace in a round hole. We want to give them the ability to say this is your programme. This is your agenda. This is your networking event. Get the solutions that you need, not the ones that we think you need. And how many blocks of time do you have allocated, teo? Ten topics per block. So? So basically the you know, the whole of the second day the conference, which actually is at the broad street ballroom, which is about a mile away from the tribeca performing art center, which is on day one, the broad sea ballroom wait, we’re going to be in there from nine a m to one p m and so the first two hours is going to be focused on this this unconference a smile where people can write their issues the second two hours with lunch in between is going to be industry round tables. So if you are in the health, carrie, you know, area of philanthropy or if you’re in education or if you’re in sciences or the arts, whatever it is, you can network with people in your industry so instead of it being a random experience at another, not another conference, you’re able to congregate with other people who are in your areas of expertise and then have these, you know, with these around table captains or hosts from the attendees lead the discussion with that with that round table group in each of the you know areas and the conference is the next-gen charity conference it’s november seventeenth and eighteenth with the second day being an unconference it’s ah, at the tribeca performing arts center on day one and jonah what’s day to where’s the forty, forty one broad street is the broad street ballroom. You could get information about the conference and registration at next-gen charity dot com. And as i said, this show is a proud media sponsor. You have one more thing to absolutely, you know, because you were one of our earlier doctors. Well, you know, we’ve made early adopter discounts available to attendees, which are no longer available because you were an early adopter. We want your audience and your friends and your colleagues to have that early adopter price. So if use the tony radio as a discount code, check out, you’ll take three hundred dollars off the price, which isn’t available to anybody else. Can i block that? Absolutely. Tony radio. Tony radio. Any idea? Check out. Excellent. Thank you, jonah. Thank you very much for being a guest. Andi, i also want to thank hank goldstein next week. It’s going to be year end giving tips. That’s going to be the subject. But i don’t know yet who the guest is. Going to be so if your ah fan of the show on the facebook page, you will find out, but that’s going to the topic next-gen next week, you’re in giving tips, and then scott koegler, our regular tech contributor and the editor of non-profit technology news is going to share the latest in tech for your shop. Keep up with that’s coming up for pete’s sake. Sign up for the insider email lorts on our facebook page. It’s, facebook dot com, of course, and then the name of this show like us click that like button you can listen live or archive you’ve been listening live listen archive it’s on itunes every show is archived there. Find our itunes paige at non-profit radio dot net the creative producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is claire meyerhoff line producer and the owner of talking alternative broadcasting. His sam liebowitz and our social media is by regina walton of organic social media. Help you be with me next week for talking altum at talking alternative dot com the show tony martignetti non-profit radio always big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent next friday one to two p, m eastern. Well. Think think, think, think, think, think, think, think. You’re listening to the talking alternate network. You waiting to get a drink? Cubine duitz looking to meet mr or mrs right, but still haven’t found the one. Want to make your current relationship as filling as possible? Then please tune in on mondays at ten am for love in the morning with marnie allison as a professional matchmaker, i’ve seen it all. Tune in as we discuss dating, relationships and more. Start your week off, right with love in the morning with marnie gal ilsen on talking alternative dot com. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? 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NextGen:Charity Interview With Ari Teman & Jonah Halper

These guys are the NextGen:Charity co-founders. They met at a special needs nonprofit, hit it off, and wanted to see nonprofit conferences do it better.

Ari announces a deep, deep discount of $150 for next year’s NextGen at the Town Hall theater in NYC.

At the end, I say we’re at NextGen 2007. I was excited into the past.

Click here to get the discounted price for NextGen:Charity 2011, November, 17-18, 2011. (Note: you don’t need the discount code. The discount will be open until December 25, 2010.)

Click the video to watch.