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Cerini welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent, i’m your aptly named host tony martignetti what a coincidence i found this show if you think you’re non-profit is left out left out of consulting conversations left out in terms of fees that get charged press and media if you generally feel that you don’t get the attention that your small and midsize non-profit deserves, you have a home here at tony martignetti non-profit radio last week was an archive edition because i was at the national conference for philanthropic planning, doing interviews and talk later about that on tony’s take two, but last week we had regina walton, or from organic social media, and she explained and shared with us why you should be online. How to get started online on how to manage your non-profits reputation online also in last week’s edition John murcott from karma 4:1 one he shared how smart and simple online fund-raising khun build your relationships and unlock dollars for your non-profit this week, smart sales training strategies to kick start your fund-raising my guest is larry sharp, director of neo-sage, and he is going to share with us corporate sales lessons to help your non-profits fund-raising it’s a full we’re for a full hour of fund-raising this show with larry sharp and around the half hour on tony’s take, too, which is exactly at one thirty two. I’m going to share some notes from the national conference on philanthropic planning and a lot of exciting, interesting interviews at that conference last week, which is in florida, and they’ll be coming up on shows in the future, and i’ll talk a little about those on tony’s. Take two and also, ah, conference that i have coming up next-gen charity conference in november. All that on tony’s, take two after this break, larry sharp for a full hour of fund-raising stay with me, talking alternative radio, twenty four hours a day. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Oppcoll is your marriage in trouble? Are you considering divorce? Hello, i’m lawrence bloom, a family law attorney in new york and new jersey. No one is happier than the day their divorce is final. My firm can help you. We take the nasty out of the divorce process and make people happy. Police call us ed to one, two, nine, six four three five zero two for a free consultation. That’s lawrence h bloom at two one two nine six four three five zero two. We make people happy. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com offgrid dahna altum welcome back to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m joined now by larry sharp, larry’s director of neo-sage on the web that’s n e o hyphen s a g dot com and he’s going to share smart sales training strategies to kickstart your fund-raising ah, full hour of fund-raising text tips from larry stage larry is director of neo-sage, an influence training center in new york. His clients learn how to sell fund-raising network and influence effectively he’s, the director of special projects for the world energy forum and a guest instructor at columbia’s graduate school of business, and i’m very glad that larry’s practice brings him to the show today into the studio. Welcome, larry. Thank you very much, madam. Thank you, larry. Sales for non-profits sales has sales and sometimes marketing have sort of a pejorative connotation. Negative connotation should should non-profits be thinking about salesmanship. That’s ah that’s a great question and the reality is you’re right most people who work in the not non-profit world there are their helpers there healers they’re crusaders there, find the right word. They went to the right thing and save the world that’s great, but the problem with that is that’s, often directly in directly against the idea of making money in business. So while you absolutely need these people there’s no non-profit world without them, you’ve gotta have them. You also have to have the money part. You’ve gotta have the business guy or the money guy somewhere in there and that’s, the sales and marketing guy, which often is a problem, you’re right, they’re not profit world worries about that, so their answer usually is well, i’m so passionate about this problem is issue this concern, i’m going to try to somehow infuse the person on the of the phone or in front of me or through my letter with that same passion, and please, please, please give me money, please give me money because we’re all passionate about this cause that’s correct? The problem is that is traditional begging for money, which, if you’re very well known, i have a large marketing budget or big footprint that may be okay when you are small not-for-profits nobody cares. As sad as it is, if it isn’t my issue, i don’t care, and if i have enough mind to give i probably already have a larger not-for-profits e-giving tio so you as ah not non-profit have to change the way you think this is very hard. Let me try to get this out so that the non-profit people here don’t don’t have a heart attack what stands in their way, they have to stop thinking that they are begging for money. They have to stop thinking that they are enforcing the agenda of their donors. They’re enforcing the agenda of the people who want this issue will concern dealt with if you’re trying to take take kids to art if that’s your charity for trying tio save a certain type of animal if you’re trying to move energy in a certain direction, whatever it is you have to act like hey, i’m out there doing this you want it done someone’s gonna pay for it, it’s gotta be you. I’m enforcing your agenda, i’m enforcing you’re well, i’m doing what you want me to do. I’m actually not non-profit i’m not a charity, i’m an association. I’m like a lobbyist, i’m in association trying to get your agenda push trying to get your will move forward now i’m gonna have to change the name of the show. Now to what? Tony martignetti associate association radio i don’t love it, they don’t know i can’t do that. You’re invested in this, i’m not saying you won’t use those words. Of course you want to still keep the culture of your organization, but your thought process should be we are serving our donor base versus we are serving the actual people that we’re giving the money to or providing a service too. It is an entirely different mindset we’re doing this for you sort of on your behalf? Yes, exactly, it’s a whole different way. If they do that, all the same will happen is their language will change the language would change from things like please give us money to save the kids to hey, you want the kids saved? So we to do that we need x dollars brought us our check so we can do this. You wanted to and of course they’ll use their own language. But that feeling all of a sudden makes me feel like he am part of team, right? You wanted to, we’re in this together we’re doing the work for you because i already said on your behalf, and you hope that this will get the actual donors to not just write the check and walk away what you really want the donor to do is write the check and feel part of the team, so of course, when they do that, they start talking about it, they suck any of the people they volunteer it’s such a better way of moving your you’re non-profit forward, and i’m glad we’ve got a full hour to explore this because absolutely you spend so much time getting a donor’s your you don’t want to have to spend that time again to replace them when they write you just one check or come to just one event and then you never hear from them again or hopefully this doesn’t happen, they don’t hear from you again. Ah, yes, the tight right, the time invested buy-in getting a brand new donor extraordinary. Why i do that multiple times when you don’t need to and the second part is if if they really become part of the team, you don’t have to spend so much time getting the second donor zoho q, you don’t have to spend, so much time getting volunteers, because they’ll help you. My guest is larry sharp, director of neo-sage, and we’re talking a full hour of fund-raising. Larry, of course, is staying with me after this break. I hope you do, too. You couldn’t do anything, including getting thinking things. You’re listening to the talking alternative network, get in. Nothing. Cubine hi, i’m new york state senator joe a dabo. I will be hosting a Job fair on friday, november 12 at aqueduct racetrack in queens, contending into three p m, we will have over one hundred companies looking for qualified workers. They’re all to be lectures on jobs, try to jeez and networking. So come and bring plenty of resumes and join me on friday, november twelve at aqueduct racetrack for a Job fair from 10 a m to three p m. For more information, please call pete in my district office at seven one eight seven three eight one one one one altum. I really need to take better care of myself if only i had someone to help me with my lifestyle. I feel like giving up dahna is this you mind over matter, health and fitness can help. If you’re expecting an epiphany, chances are it’s not happening. Mind over matter, health and fitness could help you get back on track or start a new life and fitness. Join joshua margolis, fitness expert two one two eight sixty five nine to nine xero. Or visit w w w died mind over matter. N y c dot com are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way. Look forward to serving you. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. I’m joined by larry sharp, director of neo-sage ennio hyphen s a g e dot com we’re here to find out whether larry really is is he? Is he a new sage? Has he brought sagacious nous to the studio? We’re finding out this hour around fund-raising and he’s already shared. Sort of the wayto reorient your thinking around fund-raising let’s get into some of the details, larry, how can non-profits start too implement a different way of thinking. Let’s just start with they’re just conversations conversation face to face conversations that might have with a donor on the phone let’s not do telemarketing yet, but just on the phone or in an event, how do we re orient the thinking to our conversations? The most important thing we want to talk about? And this is the sad what we don’t do what most not-for-profits there was discussed the need they spent a lot of time talking about the need. This is a problem. Oh my god! This is a problem. The world is ending. These kids were dying the the fish are dying, the animal’s dyeing the every whatever is dying and bad things are happening while that’s not bad to start, you always wanna end on a positive piece and that’s what isn’t done? What happens is they say the world’s ending oh my god, we have to do something you should help us versus saying the world’s, anybody blah, blah, blah and here’s a success story there’s the critical piece that’s often missing people don’t wanna be part of a problem. They would be part of a solution. So expresses a need to problem kids were sick, animals are dying. Yeah economy’s being destroyed, the environment being destroyed whatever is your issue. But you know what? Here’s some success we’ve had here’s how we’ve made things better. There is a bright side right here and that gets someone to say really how really? Well, that seems awesome that draws the person in. The problem is we’re so busy trying to show people the need will not give him the positive side of but we’re doing something great. We begin to feel like this is an interesting concept. If you’re always around, you know, poverty and you find some aid workers sometimes you come back from africa or south east asia, some very depressed economy, they come back and they’ll tell you, the world’s ending the world’s full of pain everything’s horrible. No must be around them. Yeah, but they should come back and say the world’s terrible things. But you look what we did. We save twenty five kids, or we save twenty five animals or we, you know, low with the carbon emissions or whatever is your charity, and then everyone goes, wow, that sounds great. So the critical piece and a conversation is discussed the issue. But then talk about the positive things that are happening. Show the success stories show the light that makes me want to come to you. Yeah, and i think that second part you’re right is not emphasized. A lot of fundraisers will say that the hook the need is the hook, right, and it sounds like years indeed it is. But go a step further and b positive how you’re helping toe solved that means yes, the issue is people think and this is a big problem. They think that donors give because they want to save the x. No, i always give for very different reasons all different types of reasons, most of them very selfish. Most of them are very selfish what people give and people don’t get that they want to feel powerful, they want to feel good, they want to they want to feel to doing something, they want to get recognition things of that sort that’s a very big reason why people give it’s not just because they want to save the whales will save the kids are saying the environment, it could be because they want to feel good, you know, an interesting story i was excuse me, i work for a couple non-profits and one of them was doing a training course for smaller non-profits and doing a training course, one person was upset and the person said because when i do this event, this person wants to come and have a booth at my event and sell his book, and i said, okay, while you upset well, you know, he don’t makes twelve thousand dollars, but you know what? I don’t want him doing this and making money, blah, blah i said, ok, he gives you twelve thousand dollars, right? Yes. Why do you care? What do you do at twelve thousand dollars? We do a lot with kids, so why? Do you care? In fact, you know what you should do. Tell him if he wants to be exclusive he’s gotta pay you twenty of rushing about two more people next to him selling books after that’s whatyou d’oh and let three people sell books there and get thirty six thousand dollars and save your kids. We’ll give one guy twenty and save your kids stop thinking the person who gives has to be his passion as you they don’t, they have to write the check. They obviously value your organization if that guy selling books every single year you do this event, he’ll give you twelve thousand dollars every year without complaining. Why you mad? Yeah, right. So what we have to worry about when it comes to our donor base is caring about our donor base, not caring what the people or animals or environment we’re trying to save kayman dahna base making about them. You will see all of a sudden all shoot up the money will just stop coming, right? Well, while you’re thinking about fund-raising i mean, of course, of course against the need and the work is paramount, but fund-raising is a very, very close second to executing our program. Whatever. Yes, some silent. Be very clear about that. Absolutely, this is on ly we’re talking about fund-raising of course, we don’t wantto sacrifice the value of the action of a profit just to make money. Baizman tio no, no, no. You’re absolutely right. Let’s so let’s dive in a little into some detail about direct mail that maybe a piece that’s devoted to fund-raising or it could be a newsletter. Direct mail. What advice do you have around? Absolutely generally speaking, you do not want to ask for that random amount of money more than once a year. So now you’re talking about a direct mail deal, you personalized letter hopefully doesn’t say, dear friend, i mean, i think you’d want the fund-raising pieces to be personalized absolutely that’s that’s the mail that you’re talking about right now, that individualized plans correct, okay? And i really would hope that today’s market there’s print is out there who can easily personalize everything if if you’re listening, you’re seeing yourself. I don’t i don’t have a database like that. Trust me, there are tons of people can personalize your mailing if you do that, you get the mailing out there. You want your your plea to be generally yearly, almost like a membership. You don’t have to use that word if you don’t want to depend upon the culture of your charity. If you are a membership type char to use that word. If not, who cares? Whatever. But you want to ask for the big hit yearly? Well, that’s the five hundred dollars a thousand dollars. Ten thousand dollars whatever that is that’s the one big hit yearly to want from the person that person should feel like i wrote my big check. I’m set. I’m part of team. Not now. Next year’s. Next have to write my bait again. That is an exception here. You can now begin to ask for more money throughout the year. But not the quarterly. You know fund-raising that is really impersonal, really unknowing and has turned many people off and it’s it’s on the it’s on the non-profits schedule. Yes, exactly. Well, that’s. Exactly right. Only perfect. Let me just remind people my guest is larry sharp, director of neo-sage. And we’re spending a full hour with your fund-raising sales training techniques to kick start your fund-raising. Larry, i’m sorry. Go ahead. No, you’re totally right. Tony it’s. The issue here is non-profits or again thinking about themselves so they want to raise money every quarter. Nice, but instead, think about the donor do the once a year you owe me a big hit because you’re part of my members should be part of team. Got it. No problem. Whenever that’s a should be done, i don’t know, depends upon the calendar of the non-profit. But then quarterly you want to do targeted specifically to that individual, for example. Let’s say your your charity deals with i’m gonna make up kids with cancer, right? Whatever. So maybe you decide that these people you figure out through the surveying or asking or internet surveying or check boxes on your mailer. However you decide to get that data, what are they specifically interested in? They’re interested in this piece that piece, this piece. So you say, you know what, what? This year we’re taking the kids who have cancer to disneyworld, whatever that is. And if the raise money for that, send it to those people who checked, you know, make a wish for cancer. Whoever check that one. Those people get that specific mailing saying, please give us money for this specific trip for this specific issue you want us to segment exact perfect word? Yes segment beautiful. I want you to segment on mr hayward. I want you to segment we have george in jail on tony martignetti non-profit radio, but i don’t think this is georgina segment. I think everybody understands segmenting, so there is a reprieve if anybody was wondering, especially since i’m the one who brought the word up so i never i put myself in jargon jail if it doesn’t happen, so keep listening. But that won’t happen. There won’t. Go ahead, please. Miree second, once we do that now what happens is i’m giving because i see a result. I now see what’s happening. I’m due, i’m making a difference and on what i’m specifically interested in yes, i want to see happy kids, you know, before they pass we can shit. Maybe it’s in my family may be someone i know it’s close to me. Maybe i didn’t get something when i was a kid. Whatever it affect me that’s why i care about that. So now i’m going to drop. My thousand dollars provoc woobox whatever that is to help these kids go to disney world now here’s a critical piece. When when the next quarter you asked me for more money. There better be pictures of that trip, the better the details of that trip. I need to see what i did. Outcomes absolutely. I want to see those happy kids. I want to see smiling kids. I want to see him hug and mickey mouse. I want all those things to make me feel good. Because the next court, when you asked me for the next trip, i’ll write another check again and again again. And we are seeing within the past, say, four, five years or so a much greater emphasis on donors learning the outcomes. Yes and charity’s being accountable. And some charities do it quantitatively. I often use example of charity water. They have a very good website where you can see on a global map where your money was spent and how deep the will it well is in the community in south africa that they that they drilled and what the outcome was. How many people in that community we’re help, i mean that’s one example. But it’s a great example. Outcomes krauz yes. And we also than the next piece in this whole concept is we do not want to do what so many charities do and make it broadbased. There are fourteen million children with this problem. Ten thousand kids every day have this ninety thousand whales every year do so. And so whatever. That’s. Nice to maybe start the juices flowing. Right? But you have to make it in individual. Yeah. Where did my money go? Yes. Ninety thousand whales. Which one did my one hundred fifty thousand dollars help? Yes, absolutely. They want to know it was emma. That whale right there. That’s the one. You know, we tagged her and saved her calf. Yes. Thanks to you helping pay for the boat that went out there, did it? Yes. I want to feel that i want to say yeah, that’s my boat. I’d put money on my boat. I better keep paying off. My boat won’t go out there and help the emirs of the world. Of course, we’re talking about this critical segmentation, larry and i just want to remind people that several shows ago we had tim cannon on from mcvicar and higginbotham, which is a print shop on better shop, and they do that type of work and print shops and letter shops generally, as larry said, are sophisticated enough to help you segment your database. Once you’ve gotten the data collected to segment it and that’s really where i’d like to go let’s, spend a few minutes. How do we talk about how we collect this data in order to do the segmentation that you’re recommending? Actually, the print company can assist you? They’re also because maybe if you have a yearly ask or whatever the case may be within your yearly, ask on the sheet where they fill out far from the box, a thousand bucks, two hundred bucks, whatever they’re filling out you also say, and you were interested in check all that apply, and just that right there will have to do it. There’s also something called and ah, i hope it’s not it’s a pearl, a personal earl and out of print shops could do that also where they send it out and you go to a specific website just for them, you know, x charity slash tony m yes. I’ve seen those in direct mail pieces that i’ve gotten there we go click there and you feel your survey out right there, you know, i’m interested in emmett a whale and bobby the fish and jimmy to shark alright, that’s, what i care about whatever the case may be, so you care about as an example, maybe you care about the shark fin soup issue, right? Everyone’s cutting a shark fins off, killing sharks, right? That’s, what you care about, okay, great. So the next time we do a campaign to help, stop that, i can guarantee you’re getting a letter and i want five bucks, but maybe you don’t care about emmett a whale may be care about the sharks, it doesn’t matter. What i’m worried about is what you care about, not what i care about. So a personalized earl on dh, really? Just aside from knowing what that specific donors interested in the charity now knows that that donor is interested enough to go from the mail piece or the email to click through to the personal you are also the we’ve got them we know we have that donor at least at the threshold, yes. Absolutely. And he’s an ex piece. You also find out what pieces are important. T to your your donor base. Let’s say you find that nobody cares about shark fin soup. I’m making it up, right? I have no idea anyone cares but let’s say that you don’t abase you send out your letters, b get a thousand back. We hope you haven’t made doughnuts. I hope so. Right. And out of the thousand ten k about the sharks. Maybe either you shouldn’t publicize him so much. Well, maybe the reverse. Maybe you need a better campaign and get people to care. This gives you some insight in what you’re doing, right? Maybe you should say, you know what? I should stop doing this. I should take take this part of my charity away, give it to a specialized charity because my people don’t care about it. All the reverse. No one cares what i do. And outreach program to get people to understand. This is an important issue. This data is very, very valuable. Especially thie example. You just mentioned it’s it’s so small. But there’s another challenge that does this work so well. Yeah, maybe. And especially in the midst of a recession, which i hope is ending soon, but we’re still in it. Maybe not technically, but everybody is not an economist thinks we’re still in the recession when non-profits have to be more efficient? Yeah, maybe one of their tasks one of their programs isn’t isn’t one that they’re doing the best and isn’t one that their constituents are that interested in, and they can they can shift that program elsewhere, absolutely, and maybe even swap donors, maybe even do a joint, you know, event who knows how you can do this so there’s an important piece, so i hope that’s clear on the on the direct mailing side let’s, talk a little more about what you might, including a reply device. I mean, i’ll always telling our clients that every direct mail piece should come with some kind of reply device for someone for the recipient toe asked for more information, tell them that they’ve already included the organization in their state plan, which is a type of fund-raising consulting that we do, what else can we include in a direct mail piece to get people to share information with us? There are several things the first thing you want to do is you want to make sure you give them something some type of gift in a certain way, then i give you could be like a church key could be that could be, you know, a pin pins bleed or not are very powerthru early. So you liked a little get off pens or so because pin’s tell people i’m part of the part of crew. I’m part of a team, little lapel pins and that kind of thing, very power for the great or really detailed, specific information in southern information that no one else knows. These two things are very powerful. They feel to gift oh, i want to give back. So maybe an insider newsletter if it’s a newsletter, it can’t just be here’s what’s going on at the charity nobody reads that you’re fooling yourself. Nobody reads that if it’s here something you don’t know, here’s something nobody but our members know here’s something happening in the secret, you know, you know, volts of power, something like that. Yes, people read that if it’s that time of insider information great. Or if it’s something that could be ah, story. Directed towards them, like the story of the kid’s going to see mickey mouse, that’s a positive story, something like that. But if it’s, just his was happening on a charity, nobody reads that and has also very consistent with sort of traditional fund-raising wisdom, which can often be wrong. But in this case, it’s, consistent with what you’re saying and that is sharing more detailed information with your your better donors. Yeah, eso. How to induce someone from giving five hundred dollars a year to a thousand dollars a year. Part of that will be that you’ll get our insider newsletter or our president’s circle. Yeah, email alerts on breaking events around are our issue perfect. My guest is larry sharpies, the director of neo-sage. We’re going to take a break, and, of course, larry joins us after this break, and also after this break, tony’s, take two. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Hi, i’m new york state senator joe a dabo. I will be hosting a Job fair on friday, november 12 at aqueduct racetrack in queens, contending into three p m we will have over one hundred companies looking for qualified workers. They’re all to be lectures on job strategies and networking. Come and bring plenty of resumes and join me on friday, november twelfth at aqueduct racetrack for a Job fair from 10 a m to three p m. For more information, please call pete in my district office at seven one eight seven three eight one one one one bonem are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications? Then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way look forward to serving you. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com durney welcome back to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent were right around thirty two minutes after it’s roughly one thirty two eastern time. So it’s time for tony’s take two. Last week i couldn’t do the show because i was doing podcast interviews at the national conference on philanthropic planning that’s where we had an archive edition of the show last week. Ah, did six interview’s in conjunction with the chronicle of philanthropy, thes air interviews that will be coming up on upcoming shows. But just to give you a little sense of some of the people we talked to, one of the subjects was red flags in planned giving that was aviva bed occur what to look out for in planned e-giving we all know i’m a plan giving fund-raising consultant so i’m the first to say plan giving could be an outstanding way to build endowment or in other ways, just help your non-profit long term, but there are some technical sides to plan giving, and you do need to be careful. And aviva benwikere raised some of those red flags for us in that interview endowment management strategies, my interviewee there, along with the chronicle of philanthropy, was catherine miree, sharing methods and techniques for keeping your endowment safe. Um, we had to washington d c insiders. An attorney in a lobbyist, emily lamb and perry wasserman perry. Washington is actually the lobbyist for the host organization for that conference, which is the partnership for philanthropic planning. He’s their lobbyist, emily lamb, is an attorney in washington with skadden, arps and used to before that was with the treasury department working on in the in the tax in the tax area and are subject with emily and perry was how legislation and regular the regulatory environment is going to be affecting, um, fund-raising and non-profits generally, especially with the elections coming up in just a couple of weeks had a cripple your career in five easy steps. That was robert sharpe of the sharp group crippling your career in five easy steps. That was really very interesting. Sort of. Ah, ah, hook a way of getting you to pay attention to your career. Um also had an melvin from harvard university. She was talking about motivating and marketing to your plant e-giving donors. You can see my blogger post on each of these interviews at my block, which is m p g a d v dot com, and you could also keep listening to the show for full interviews with each of these guests cause we’ll have the full interviews broadcast. If you don’t know when those air coming up, you wouldn’t know because i don’t know yet, but when they do come up, you confined out by getting our insider weekly email alerts, go to the facebook page for the show and get those alerts, of course, facebook, dot com and then it’s tony martignetti non-profit radio and you can sign up there for our insider email alerts in november. I’m going to be speaking at the next-gen charity conference that’s here in new york city, but we’re also going to be doing a podcast interviews of mohr speakers from that conference that’s november eighteenth will be doing the podcast interviews, and they’ll be for broadcast on later shows. And then on the nineteenth, i’ll be leading a workshop pg and so me planned giving in social media using social media, too. Reach out to your fund, your your plan giving donors and that has special considerations because plan giving donors are typically sixty and over, but we know where they’re where they’re going. Social media wise, is it facebook? Is it twitter? We know, and i’ll be sharing that in the conference. Also, i’m very pleased that i can offer with you offer you twenty percent off that next-gen charity conference for listeners of the show to get that twenty percent discount to the ah next-gen charity conference, which is on november eighteen and nineteen in new york city, you could go to the blogged or the facebook page and look for that twenty percent off discount. My guest this week is larry sharp, and i’m really glad that we’re spending the full hour talking about fund-raising sales training strategies to kick start your fund-raising larry is a corporate sales trainer on dh ah, director of neo-sage, which is a consultancy that trains clients, had a cell fund-raising network and influence effectively. Larry, we we had been talking about direct mail and newsletters and direct mail pieces. How about the telephone? How can we shift? Are thinking about fund-raising in the way that you suggested and do this, if if if we’re doing telephone outreach, sure, just generally speaking, when you’re doing the telephone, you’re talking to people who donated before now with the do not call list it’s difficult to do cold calling for for for not-for-profits an exception might be say, if you’re doing your ah your list for a college, maybe call me alumni that might be cold sometimes, but the exception of that generally speaking, people who’ve done any before the tactic here has to be as soon as you call you want to start giving them information right away. It’s ah, hey, tony, how you it’s latto from x y z charity? This call is because you don’t want to just call in just seeing it sounds apologetic. Yes, sorry to be calling, but you’re not saying that, but it sounds like you’re apologizing and really should be calling straightforward got important news to share you don’t want to train your donor base into thinking i call just cause you want your dahna metoo think i call because there’s a reason so as soon as you pick up the phone hey tony’s latto x y z charity here’s. Why i’m calling, you should know x y z you should be aware of bump up, up, up, up, here’s what’s happening where you care boom boom, boom ba boom whatever that is, then go into a specific reason why you want the money. A specific reason such as and because of this, we have a new initiative, tony. And the new initiative is we’re going to now take the kids to you know, niagara falls because we know that’s going to help them out. And the doctors were saying, what is what we should do blah, blah look to really help us out to make this really happen. We need you to do now, what’s that is at least double what you gave last time. So if you gave to earn fifty it’s at least five hundred, you may want to shoot four thousand whatever it is. But you want to go for a very high number for your first ask realizing most of the time you’re going to know. Okay? The reason why you do the high ask at first is to call the law of contrast the influence love contract states. I will measure everything by the first thing i see. So my first one thousand now to fifty seems cheap. Ah! Vice oversea to fifty thousand expensive. So you’re measuring the second number, which will get to yes, in contrast with the first law of contrast, are so so two fifty seems like a cz you said a little compare two thousand. So i’m gonna ask for i must say, you know, to make this really happen. Tony, we really need tto help us out with a thousand dollars. Can you do that, tony? Now odds are you’re going to say no. Wow, but not like that. You said, wow, it’s, a lot of money because i’m a two hundred dollar donor. Zack clean under fifty dollars, to fifty donors, a lot of money for me. I’d love to. I can’t right now. Time to tough. Whatever you’re going to say, then you go and do you go to low and then medium so close, high, low, medium and listen to my language in doing this, i’m going to ensure that you do not go lower than last year. That’s the first time would ensure since i know what i’m still getting to fifty out of you. So i start with a thousand bucks you say can’t do it, you know? What? Tony, honest and completely, you know, you could if you want to go back to what you did last year, which is two fifty here’s that most people doing for us that most people don’t really help us. A lot would be if you go five hundred. Can you do five hundred? Okay? He said, i just did, yeah, you could go down into that fifty, but most people are, but most people doing doing five hundred most will gave me last year doing five hundred. Most people are will help us tremendously or ah, common amount. Some word that invokes law of social proof social proof means if other people are doing it, i should be doing it. So you know, your language should invoke social of others are doing it. What we’re expecting, what we’re seeing, what people are doing, the most common amount, any language you could be part of the trends are the trend exactly in the different word, but and we have to, because each cherry has their own culture, so the words i’m using may not function in your charity specifically, but use the language that your culture of the culture, that chap you can use that says that that says other people are doing is a trend it’s common, and you could be part of that trend. Exactly correct your your strategy, you’re offering people the ability to stay in the same at the same level. You haven’t minimized what they’ve done for you in the past, saying you could stay there, but what most people are doing who are involved in this issue is going much hyre without your saying much hyre exactly exactly right so that’s, why you do it? So at a minimum, you’re going to say, look, larry, i love the charity i love you guys. Let me stay at two fifty, okay, great, thanks, tony let’s two, two, fifty so no matter what, you’re not going below that, i’m getting something out of you and you’re not going lower, but with this tactic, the odds are if you can afford it yoga hyre now, if you can’t afford, you can’t afford it, i got it times a tough some people can’t, you know, put the money out, but if you can afford it, you’re going to go hyre if you can’t, you go to fifty and hopefully next you you keep it going, keep it going. Keep it going until eventually hope every donors over a thousand over ten thousand, over a hundred thousand we hope whatever we can get, the reality of it is they’re not going to give more than they can afford anyway. But if they’re out to fifty from last year, they probably can get to fifty again. So that’s going to go? We don’t want to say, you know, last you gave to fifty because then they say, well, you know this shit. Can i just do one twenty five times the Job just 2:100 and over some before you know what the given ten dollars? So we start with the high number so if you want to, you could stay there. But here’s that most people are doing here is a trend. And hopefully more of them will go towards the raising two two. Fifty two, five hundred that’s. What? We have seen that you see that slowly clients? Absolutely. Yes. Should these calls be scripted? Of course. How do we prepare? Absolutely a hundred percent. The people you want to use can be any. You can use anybody you want. To do your fund-raising it’s generally best if the people are part the charity, sometimes they don’t do it. Sometimes they hyre outsiders part not necessarily employees, right? Could be volunteers motivated bones here. Somehow part of the chinese doesn’t happen of us have to be an actual employees. Could be other donors could be donors. Kids could be anyone someone who somehow part of that team. This way. If the person begins to ask questions, they can say some they can say yes. I am part of this team, you know, my mother donates and, you know, on the weekends, i sometimes go with the kids out to, you know, the orchestra or whatever’s your charity. Right? So i went there last year. The summer camp. So that means okay. We’re all together. It’s. Instant report. What part of same as we have something in common. You absolutely better chance again. You could hire outsiders, but that has to go down a little bit. You don’t gain that same report. Okay. So, it’s best that people who are somehow connected to part the charity? Yes. That’s. The who who? You have to do it. How do we prepare these? We literally want them to have a one sheet er a page that is eggs dig zach script of what you want them to say in that order. In addition, wantto have, at a minimum a second sheet of paper, which is your rebuttal script, which is where you go when people tell, you know where you go when people give me excuses and often this is not even used. But having those scripts there make the telemarketer feel it ever safety, blanket. See, people think we have to have the script there in rebuttal sheep so that the person can use it, they can, but it’s not necessarily used it’s there so they can feel more confident if they have a problem. I’ve got someplace to go if they’re just up in the air, becomes, yeah, well, again, she and what we would like becomes that if they have a script, they can look at it, go through it, and if they don’t need it, they can ignore it. But they know it’s there, it gives them confidence. The robot a script should be there and the most important thing the wrap up once that person says yes there. Should be a script. The wrap up, it’s, be great. Ok? Is that going to be via our online or you are going a lot. Great. Please go to blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Are you near a computer right now? Great. Could you log on to that’s? All right there to do. If it’s via a psa. Pleasure going, you know, mail it. How to mail it, what to do with their with their she too. Should they send them something? If it’s a credit card form, how do you feel that out? Whatever the wrap up is. And then of course, in the end, you’re going here’s. The most important thing at the end. You want to provide benefits? This is so anti non-profit. Okay. But we do instead is we thank them twenty five times instead of thanking them twenty five times. Say something like this. Tony, this is so great. You give in the five thousand dollars, you know, what’s gonna happen. These kids are going to get this. That this? That this and from last year we know this this and this is going to happen. This is really great. You know what, tony will? Say i feel fabulous about mike that’s. Exactly. Correct. Only wish i could have given more. Yeah. Can i get two checks? It’s? Awesome. Fund-raising nirvana. Absolutely. Against the outcome. Yes. You want to share the outcome? Even before it’s it’s occurred. This’s what your gift is going to do for us one hundred percent. This is the benefit you want to show. Then you can thank them. Then you can thank them. You are not allowed not-for-profits listen to me. You are no longer allowed to thank them until you first give them the benefit. Once they get the benefit and they go wow, that’s! Great. You’re going to say thankyou, tony actually great after not before otherwise they start to think shevawn e-giving hundred bucks thanking him early bleed or not increases buyer’s remorse. Thanking them early actually lowers the chance they actually go through with the give you will find just by changing that the people who pooh promise and then don’t deliver that gap gets smaller just by doing that. Thanking someone before you give benefit. Thanking someone early actually increases buyer’s remorse i think doing a favor maybe i should have gone to fifty. I’m not really sure that begins come to play hesitation, hesitation. This economy means no or it means i just write two hundred bucks on it instead of my father and i pledged so all this and you get a lower number, something that happens, so thanking them early literally lowers the men of money getting in, changing just that you will see a difference but share the outcome. Of course, please assume assume the person commits yes, and you’ve you’ve given them the pertinent information, okay, i’m with larry sharp he’s, the director of neo-sage, and we’re talking smart sales training strategies to kickstart your fund-raising we’re going to take a break, and after the break, we’ll come back, talk about email and maybe some goal setting. Also, how do you set your fund-raising and your fund-raising goals all with larry’s advice from sales training strategies? I’m tony martignetti, host of tony martignetti non-profit radio stay with us getting anything, wounding e-giving ding ding, you’re listening to the talking alternate network get in! Think. Cubine is your marriage in trouble? Are you considering divorce? Hello, i’m lawrence bloom, a family law attorney in new york and new jersey. No one is happier than the day their divorce is final. My firm can help you. We take the nasty out of the divorce process and make people happy. Police call us ed to one, two, nine, six, four three five zero two for a free consultation. That’s lawrence h bloom two, one, two, nine, six, four, three five zero two. We make people happy. Hyre durney is lack of capital or credit keeping you up at night? The show me. The money conference is coming to the roosevelt hotel, forty five east forty fifth street in manhattan on november third. This’s the best business networking opportunity to meet potential investors and lenders, and get answers from our expert panel of business and financial advisors. From or information, call six four six six one nine eight, xero nine one or online at rose otto accounting that’s r o s a d o accounting, dot, com, slash show me the money. This is tony martignetti athlete named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Technology fund-raising compliance. Social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio fridays, one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Welcome back to tony martignetti non-profit radio my guest is larry sharp. We’re talking fund-raising for the full hour. I think that was very interesting information about buyer’s remorse and saying thank you too quickly and too often in the in the telemarketing calls. Larry. Excellent. Thank you very much. Of course. Let’s switch teo, email. What advice do you have around email emails? Ah, great tool there’s some issues, though, that the ideas people often send emails out weekly or monthly and think they’re giving updates, and they think they’re helping their actually knowing their donor base. The reality of it is what emails you want to do, two types of emails, the one is maybe an ask and that’s. Okay, but if we do the ask the rules off the mailing we talked about earlier are the same rules once a year, and then maybe once a quarter or so for specific issue. Any other e mails you send have to you have to be one of two things one some really big issue that someone is going to care about specifically, like again, i care about sammy, the shark and not em of the whale you’re going to send me the note about sammy the shark, not about emma the whale, not about what’s going on in the field, not about what’s happening my charity. In reality, i get too much email, i’m not going to read it it’s going to begin to annoy me delete, delete, delete, delete and when the important e mail comes in, i’m not going to read it. I’m going to another one of these e mails delete so either it’s about sammy the shark or it’s that same idea on ly a recorder on lee once a year, same rules. The last thing is, if i have something very special that no one else you know, that’s really going to affect everything like all of a sudden, you know, bill gates joins our charity, you know, something huge like that send the email, but a monthly or weekly email just cause will on ly annoy you don’t abase and they’ll begin to become immune to it and they just shut off your your advice goes back to the importance of segmentation. You need to know what your donors are interested in so that you can push that information and that’s ah! That’s a web term, you know, push, push information out to them that they’ve expressed an interest in absolutely i think we’re in two thousand ten approach fast approaching two thousand eleven were past the days of here’s what’s new writers what’s happening where it’s not specifically targeted to the person’s interest. Absolute sure, yes, those rules on email events. But what about using events for fund-raising events believe or not are really, really important more important than people think, and they don’t have to be huge gall events. They could be very small if you have a good donor base asked them to support the event in one of their buildings, one of their facilities, their home, their office, one of the case. Maybe the reason why events are important are several number one is it creates camaraderie amongst the people in the charity they feel like they’re part of team when you can bring your donor base in and say, hey, look, these are the people who are going out there and, you know, cleaning off the seals or, you know, save this person actually saved emma, right? He’s the captain of the boat and again showing people that they’re part of their part of something bigger. We talked about the trend, you know, here’s the trend in giving around when we talk about telemarketing, but you can see that you’re part of a trend you’re part of something in here is palpable evidence you’re surrounded by all your a ll the people who are sympathetic to the same issue. Yes, absolutely. So you want to do events for that reason, but the second reason is you want to share special information. This is when you want to do the corporate video that comes out before anyone else sees it. This is when you talk about the special plan, a program you going to put in place next year that no one else knows about this is when you’re going to share these atoms insider information that on ly we know that’s when you share there’s another reason why i do it. You want the donors to begin to see value in networking if the donor base our business owners or sales wraps, or people who want to do business and being relationships to their world to the firm’s toe other toe, other charities they may support if they start seeing value and donating, then they want to be part of the process. They want to be part of this organization. Is he additional value? Now? This turns off a lot of non-profits they can’t stand the idea of having an event and people doing business there that turns some people off well, time to turn back on because it’s a very important reason why people get together. And if all of a sudden i start seeing that when i go to your events, there are some heavy hitter donors there that i could somehow benefit you to my personal family. My personal fortune, my, my emotional i have ah, vendors i can use somehow i can benefit from being around these people. I’m gonna keep donating. What’s. Interesting. There is. That is exactly what ah, non-profits do recognize around boardmember ship? Yeah, we’re always recruiting people who can do business together. And the more powerful their board, the more powerful people they’ll be able to recruit to the board hundred percent. But why is that limited to the board? Absolutely. He totally right. In fact, if you get bored members to show up in sweet twist their arms and get them to show up at the events. You get more people who just want to board members. Yes. You want to see the boardmember? So even that mohr people showing up more camaraderie. Mohr mohr almost. I’m part of this team and more loyal donors who will keep donating every year and assist you volunteering, allowing you to use the facilities there, their homes except for et cetera. Where we have just about ninety seconds or so left together. What about goal setting fund fund-raising goal setting. Can you give us just a couple of tips on how we can? We can do that. What you want to do? This is the difficult thing. You have, you individual fundraisers. You actually want them to come up with their own goals. This is what’s. Odd people use it from the top down. I should deal from the bottom up. Who are the people who are in charge of fund-raising? Are they have a fund-raising director? Do you have actual tele call telemarketer people? Do you have, you know, print shops who you using? Ask them what they think they can dio and then give him a nudge. What? If we do better, what if we do better? What can be a good goal? While we do that? We want the people at the bottom to take ownership of the goal themselves again. I wouldn’t do it. I’m part of this. I’m a volunteer. Make twenty five phone calls. I’m gonna call it for forty five as make this goal. Get the people the bottom to start to give you the idea and from that, build your goal. All right, top up about sorry. Bottom up yet my guest has been larry sharp. He is the director of neo-sage again. That’s. Any oh, hyphen s a g dot com on an influence training center in new york. Want to thank larry very much for being on the show and coming to studio. Thank you. Thank you. Pleasure having you, larry something on larry’s website from dale carnegie, i found were not people of logic were people of emotion. That’s sort of a paraphrase of a dale carnegie quote, but i think it sums up what larry’s talking about the reason people give and how you can motivate that emotion in them next week. I don’t know. Who’s going to be next week, we’re not confirmed so that’s. Why you should get the insider alerts from the facebook page. Go to the facebook page, sign up for our alerts and you’ll find out the moment i find out who next week’s guest is going to be and that’s a facebook dot com tony martignetti non-profit radio you also see my live appearances there. The creative producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is claire meyerhoff, always grateful for her help in directing the show and giving advice around creative ideas and timing of the show. Thank you very much. Claire, our line producer and the owner of tony of talking alternative broadcasting is sam liebowitz and our facebook and social media for the show is done by regina walton of organic social media. I’m tony martignetti, the host of tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent, even though we don’t know who the guest will be next week. Join us next week, friday, one p m eastern on talking alternative broadcasting right where you are right now at talking alternative dot com. Hyre i didn’t think that shooting. Good ending. You’re listening to the talking alternate network to get you thinking. I think. Cubine i really need to take better care of myself if only i had someone to help me with my lifestyle. I feel like giving up dahna is this you mind over matter, health and fitness can help. If you’re expecting an epiphany, chances are it’s not happening. Mind over matter, health and fitness can help you get back on track or start a new life and fitness. Join Joshua margolis, fitness expert at 2 one two eight six five nine two nine zero or visit www. Dot mind over matter. Y si dot com. Cerini this is tony martignetti athlete named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio fridays, one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting hi, i’m new york state senator joe a dabo i will be hosting a Job fair on friday, november 12 at aqueduct racetrack in queens, contending into three p m we will have over one hundred companies looking for qualified workers. They’re all to be lectures on job strategies and networking. So come and bring plenty of resumes and join me on friday, november twelve at aqueduct racetrack for a Job fair from 10 a m to three p m for more information, please call pete in my district office at seven one eight seven three eight one one one one. Altum are you stuck in your business or career? Trying to take your business to the next level and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause. Of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. 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