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Special Episode: Coronavirus & Nonprofits

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My Guest:

Lisa Brauner: Coronavirus & Nonprofits
My guest for this special, short episode is attorney Lisa Brauner. We cover the laws that govern your organization and the policies you may need to enact. Staying level-headed, how do you handle travel, your workplaces, parent employees, freaked out employees, and keep all your stakeholders safe? Lisa is a partner at Perlman+Perlman law firm in New York City.

 

 

 

Top Trends. Sound Advice. Lively Conversation.

Board relations. Fundraising. Volunteer management. Prospect research. Legal compliance. Accounting. Finance. Investments. Donor relations. Public relations. Marketing. Technology. Social media.

Every nonprofit struggles with these issues. Big nonprofits hire experts. The other 95% listen to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Trusted experts and leading thinkers join me each week to tackle the tough issues. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.

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Nonprofit Radio for March 13, 2020: Sexual Harassment In Nonprofits

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Listen Live or Archive:

My Guest:

Lisa Brauner: Sexual Harassment In Nonprofits
It’s everywhere. Our community is no exception. In this week when the Harvey Weinstein sentencing is scheduled, we return to the perspective from late October 2017, when the allegations against him had just gone public. Attorney Lisa Brauner provides legal perspective for women and organizations. She’s a partner at Perlman+Perlman in New York City. (Originally aired October 27, 2017)

 

 

 

Top Trends. Sound Advice. Lively Conversation.

Board relations. Fundraising. Volunteer management. Prospect research. Legal compliance. Accounting. Finance. Investments. Donor relations. Public relations. Marketing. Technology. Social media.

Every nonprofit struggles with these issues. Big nonprofits hire experts. The other 95% listen to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Trusted experts and leading thinkers join me each week to tackle the tough issues. If you have big dreams but a small budget, you have a home at Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.

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View Full Transcript
Transcript for 480_tony_martignetti_nonprofit_radio_20200313.mp3

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[00:00:14.44] spk_2:
Hello and welcome to tony-martignetti non profit radio

[00:01:04.16] spk_3:
big non profit ideas for the other 95%. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, I’m glad you’re with me. I’d be forced to endure the pain of Sarko Sisto sis, if you infected me with the idea that you missed today’s show. Sexual harassment in nonprofits it’s everywhere. Our community is no exception in this week when the Harvey Weinstein sentencing is scheduled. We returned to the perspective from late October 2017 when the allegations against him had just gone. Public attorney Lisa Bronner provides legal perspective for women and organizations. She’s a partner at Perlman and Pearlman in New York City. In this originally aired October 27th 2017 tony Stick to 20 NTC were sponsored by wegner-C.P.As, guiding you beyond the numbers wegner-C.P.As dot com But Kudo Mountain Software Denali Fund is there complete accounting solution made for nonprofits tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant Mountain for a free 60 day trial and, by turn, to communications, PR and content for nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to dot CEO here. Is this a broader and sexual harassment in nonprofits?

[00:03:46.96] spk_4:
Sexual harassment, The most recent revelations and national attention started with producer Harvey Weinstein, then the California State Legislature, where 115 legislators, staffers and lobbyists signed an open letter of complaint. The next I saw was screenwriter and director James Toback, who has over 300 women accusing him. I know one. Last October, the Access Hollywood tape embarrassed candidate Donald Trump. About two years ago, many women came out against Bill Cosby. Bring it back to this week. A celebrity chef John Besh and a celebrity journalist, Mark Halperin, are incriminated. Both resigned their positions. It’s everywhere. I think we need to talk about this in nonprofits. The guardian dot com has a piece dated 10 2017 titled, He was a senior manager in a global charity. I was 18 when he assaulted me here in the U. S. A Los Angeles Times article is USC Fundraising executive leaves post amid sexual harassment investigation. That’s from 10 11 17. His name is David Carrera. I’d like your stories and comments to be part of our conversation today. You can call the studio at 8774 Aito for 120877 for a tow for 120 or treat us with the hashtag non profit radio hashtag non profit radio were also on Facebook live on the tony-martignetti non profit radio page. Working on getting that up right now. Let’s bring in Lisa Bronner, my guest for the hour. She’s an attorney and partner at prominent Perlman Law firm in New York City. Her focus is employment law advising and representing employers in workplace law related matters. But she also has advice for employees, volunteers and board members. The firm is at Perlman and perlman dot com. It’s p r l P R L Their brothers spelled same way. Could be different. One within you won with the aid, but it’s not p e r l

[00:03:51.05] spk_2:
and they’re at tax exempt lawyer Lisa brother. Welcome.

[00:03:52.43] spk_0:
Thank you. Thanks for coming to the studio. I’m delighted to be here, tony.

[00:04:10.14] spk_4:
Thank you very much. Um, what What? What’s your sense of the prevalence of sexual harassment in non profit? So matter no necessarily numbers, but, uh, as somebody practicing in the in the area. What? What, uh, what’s your feel for this?

[00:04:36.60] spk_0:
I think the issue effects nonprofits justice, it effects for profits. The issue of sexual harassment is an issue dealing with an abuse of power. So when you have ah, you have situations of power dynamic. There are potentially situations where sexual harassment may arise.

[00:04:39.65] spk_4:
Yeah, it’s exploitation of power in a relationship, right? Is unequal power in the relationship?

[00:05:21.73] spk_0:
Yeah. There can be co worker. There can be there can be co worker. Ah, sexual harassment. There can be conduct that’s unwelcome. But what? The things that you were describing Our situations where there is a power dynamic and an abuse of power and justice for profit organizations may not have policies addressing the issue. Non profits as well may have situations where they do not have policies or procedures that address that addressed the topic and that provide a mechanism to address it.

[00:05:48.74] spk_4:
Okay. Okay, um, we’re gonna We’re gonna be talking from the organization perspective. Also, the individual perspective. I did get some comments on the website and by email. Um, so I’ll be sharing those throughout, you know, But let’s, uh I’d like to start with, um, prevention on. I know you do a lot of training in that area for nonprofits. Um what? Let’s Let’s talk about the policy. There ought to be a policy on sexual harassment.

[00:06:01.05] spk_0:
Yes, what

[00:06:01.34] spk_4:
should be in it? What tell Tell us

[00:06:16.20] spk_0:
so a policy regarding sexual harassment should, first of all, not be limited to sexual harassment. But all kinds of unlawful harassment investment that’s based on someone’s legally protected category could be race religion categories that various laws recognize as worthy of legal protection,

[00:06:22.49] spk_4:
orientation, sexual orientation,

[00:07:07.52] spk_0:
orientation, different things like that. So the policy should set out examples of what sexual harassment, what kinds of conduct could constitute sexual harassment. Welcome physical conduct, verbal conduct, unwelcome visual conduct, visual things that could be pictures. Posters could be pornography in the workplace. So the policy should set out what kinds of things give example so that employees and their supervisors understand about what kinds of things could caught could constitute sexual harassment to give examples of the type of behavior that the organization prohibit.

[00:07:08.01] spk_4:
Yeah, what are we talking about? Basically, this is what I’m not asking. You mean essentially, What are we talking about? What kind of conduct behaviors are we talking

[00:07:15.74] spk_0:
about? Okay, so the posse should give examples of what it is. Okay? The policy should also have a complaint procedure and tell employees where they need to go, who they should contact

[00:07:32.80] spk_4:
specifically. Like here’s the phone number. Here is the address of email, maybe address. If it’s an off site location. Here’s the person’s name. I mean, not just contact a supervisor that’s sounds inadequate.

[00:08:24.24] spk_0:
Well, it may be. Contact. Contact a supervisor or contact your supervisor and contact. Human resource is okay. Sometimes the policies will include a phone number or an email, but not always the case. It may be contact wth E. Contact the human Resources Department or contact the director of Human Resource is okay contact in the event it’s It’s your supervisor who’s engaged in who you believe has violated the policy. Contact another supervisor and and or contact human resource is. So in other words, you’re giving your giving the position or the title of the of the person to be contacted and where to go and what the avenue is in order to make a complaint. So it’s important to have the complaint procedure, and it’s also very important that there is a policy that prohibits retaliation. The law prohibits retaliation.

[00:08:39.84] spk_4:
We’re gonna talk about that right now, find to bring it up because part of policy. But, yes, we’re going to get to a situation where someone feels that they were retaliated against on That’s illegal,

[00:08:52.54] spk_0:
right? Okay, that’s illegal. And it’s a very important, very important area to train on and to have a policy about because sometimes the complaints itself, maybe meritless. And what ends up happening is theirs, then retaliation. And that’s also unlawful. And that can also get an organization.

[00:09:09.01] spk_4:
Yeah. Now devolving the situation is devolving badly, right? Okay,

[00:09:10.84] spk_5:
um um,

[00:09:47.60] spk_0:
so that there should be policies. And also there should be postings in the workplace regarding the various agencies at the at the federal and state level. And if the organization’s covered under the federal laws that prohibit discrimination, there should be postings in the workplace letting employees know what their what their rights are with respect to filing a complaint. Externally, the hope is that the organization has a policy that prohibits sexual harassment and a complaint procedure so that it can be addressed internally and early before before an issue escalates. How

[00:10:03.09] spk_4:
prevalent are these policies? I’m hoping I’m sure 100% e I know. Should I? No, that’s the normative. What’s the reality? what do you do? You see that there rocking a lot of places. Uh,

[00:10:33.04] spk_0:
I see that there can be gaps that that there may not always be policies in place and or they haven’t been kept up to date with changes in the law. They’re also should be a policy that addresses even bystander obligation. So if you see something even apply, see something, even if even if they don’t feel that they are that the conduct is directed towards them that they should be reporting it, they should be reporting it using the complaint procedure that it’s an important thing for others who observe violations of the organization’s policy to report it, because that’s a way to prevent these things from occurring.

[00:11:12.91] spk_4:
Your escalate if your witness to something that’s a lot of what’s in the press is a lot of people who are aware stood by Oh, you know, we’re quiet about it, And rumors were, you know, circulated. But never anything official. Uh, don’t I’m thinking of the cases in Ah, in Hollywood, especially, um Okay, um let me, uh Let’s Ah, let’s take a break.

[00:11:37.00] spk_3:
It’s time for a break, wegner-C.P.As so that your 9 90 gets filed on time so that your audit is finished on time so that you get the advice of an experienced partner. You each tomb and ah, whole firm that has a nationwide non profit practice with thousands of audits under its belt. Wegner-C.P.As dot com. Let’s hear more of sexual harassment in nonprofits. Now

[00:11:57.81] spk_4:
back to Lisa Broner. She and I are talking about sexual harassment in nonprofits. You want to join the conversation? 8774804120 is the number, or treat us with hashtag non profit radio. And we’re also on Facebook live. Thank you, Lisa.

[00:11:59.04] spk_0:
You’re welcome. Okay. All right. Yeah.

[00:12:01.08] spk_4:
All right. You don’t go anywhere.

[00:12:02.53] spk_0:
I’m still he

[00:12:03.30] spk_4:
Excellent. All right.

[00:12:04.50] spk_5:
Um, I

[00:12:05.37] spk_2:
want to get

[00:13:59.64] spk_4:
our I want to get our first, um, communique in first story for story this one came from And email. Um, this woman is a professional fundraiser. Once I partnered with the dean and a visiting alumnus who was also a dean at another university for a cultivation dinner. He put his hand on my hand when we were at the table alone. It was very uncomfortable. I must have been barely 30. The next day we had meetings set up for him to meet with other university officials, and I was alone in the car with him. He put his hand on my leg. I really don’t remember the details, but I do remember thinking he was a pig. Another time, an alumnus asked me out during a cultivation meeting. Of course I declined and steer the conversation back on topic of supporting his alma mater. And finally I was working with an alumnus who agreed to make a six figure gift and asked that I pick up the check at his apartment at 5 p.m. I wasn’t thrilled with his request, but I didn’t feel like I had a choice. I went. He offered me a drink. I accepted, and then we went to dinner. The following week, he contacted me and asked if I wanted to meet him again and said that quote, I seemed sad and that he would cheer me up. End quote. It felt so dirty and like he believed I owed him somehow for his gift to the institution. He didn’t like it when I declined and said he was wrong, that I was happily married with one with a beautiful daughter. This raises a couple of things for me. First is is one woman three times three stories. So, you know, we had me to think we hear these numbers, uh, one woman could experience ah, harassment abuse at the hands of multiple guys. Um, Lisa, this race is also an interesting relationship. The fundraiser donor. I mean, the donor obviously has vastly greater power than the fundraiser.

[00:14:05.37] spk_5:
Um,

[00:14:20.07] spk_0:
you raise you raise an excellent point, and that is that as the and sometimes that organizations may not be considering. That’s the issue of non employees, harassment of of employees and that employers can still be liable for harassment that’s committed by non employees against their employees.

[00:14:27.86] spk_4:
Employers can be liable.

[00:14:29.21] spk_0:
Yes. Yes. Okay. Employers can’t be liable. So it’s very important that the policy the sexual harassment policy that we were talking about, that it addresses specifically that the organization prohibits that they’re prohibition off against sexual harassment includes harassment of their employees, the job applicants and employees by non employees.

[00:15:02.61] spk_4:
So interesting. You just brought in job applicants to yeah, have nuances that the laws here. This is why we have experts. Okay. Job applicants are covered as well as employees. Okay. I’m sorry. God, I want to point that out. Guys.

[00:15:06.34] spk_0:
Yeah, uh, and, uh,

[00:15:07.95] spk_4:
could be volunteer’s board members.

[00:15:19.16] spk_0:
It could. It could be board members. Could be donors. It could be other non employees. That could be it could be a vendor who comes on premises who’s who’s sexually harassing an employee.

[00:15:25.88] spk_4:
All right, so our policy needs to make sure that it’s covering not only harassment by employees,

[00:15:42.00] spk_0:
exactly against other employees, but also that it’s covering harassment by non employees against employees and that the organization has a plan for how they’re gonna address those situations. Okay, depending on what the situation is.

[00:15:44.78] spk_2:
The other thing, this

[00:16:44.88] spk_4:
raises for me now, and I want to make explicit that, uh, for purposes of tony-martignetti non profit radio. Today, we are assuming 100% truth and validity in the stories that I’m gonna be reading. That’s not how the law works. That’s not how an investigation would work, but, um, it’s my show. So for the for today, we’re taking these all at face value as truth. Okay. Um, so that raised that because I’m gonna like nit pick a little bit and I want to see if this makes any difference to you. Um, some of these three stories that the woman shared were pre gift, and one was post gift. The gift I already been made. It was a week after the gift had been made. Uh, does that Does that make any difference to you in a analysis of whether the power still exists, whether they could still be sexual harassment,

[00:16:46.65] spk_0:
it doesn’t. It doesn’t. It doesn’t make a difference. And you raise a good point. Are allegations for over

[00:16:53.68] spk_4:
this year’s all I could do a spot them like a student in love, But I can’t answer any of them. That’s why you’re here.

[00:18:28.56] spk_0:
So s Oh, yes, allegations. That’s allegations. And you’re asking whether there’s difference between what pre gift or posted three ideas is that we recognize that the nature of the relationship has a has a power imbalance, uh, and that the donors in a position of giving or taking away and and the employees although their employment is not, is not ah is not governed by that, so that when we talk about the power dynamic, we’re talking about a supervisor and employees. But the employees may be feeling well. Ah, this is a donor. It’s a big donor for the organization. It puts me in an awkward situation when really, what the employees should be saying, whether it’s a donor or or a vendor coming on premises, because it’s not really about the power and balance. When you’re dealing with non employees is it’s if that employee believes that they’re they’re being sexually harassed, that it’s an unwanted, unwelcome sexual advances, then they should be telling their employer about what the situation is. Okay, this is what happened to them. Your question was, doesn’t matter whether it’s pre gift or post gift. It doesn’t matter. The point is, is that if it’s unwelcome conduct, that’s really what the focus is. If it’s unwelcome conduct, then that’s something they should be reporting to their employer so that them employer can address that with the donor.

[00:18:29.64] spk_4:
Okay, very good. Excellent. Thank you. Setting the second spot, the issues, But I’m not, uh

[00:18:35.35] spk_0:
it was good. That was a very good question about after

[00:18:43.90] spk_4:
passing. And we think that woman for sharing for sharing her stories. Thank you very much. um,

[00:18:44.86] spk_2:
let’s talk about some

[00:19:04.64] spk_4:
training. So we we we have a policy that you leave. We have, ah, Lisa broader approve policy, All right, It’s It’s bona fide has everything. It should, um, training on boarding employees on boarding board members again, all all focused on prevention. We want to stop these things from from happening what we were doing. Our training.

[00:19:43.21] spk_0:
I think training is probably one of the best investments and non profit can make training for its for its employees, for supervisors separate training for supervisors because the supervisors, the actions that the supervisors take can result in the organization being strictly liable. So separate training for supervisors and also and training for employees. And I don’t see this, but I think it’s a very good idea for organizations to be providing us part of their on boarding for board members, providing training on what the organization’s policies are regarding sexual harassment and retaliation.

[00:20:18.85] spk_4:
Okay, you said you’re not seeing that, but it’s a good idea. Yeah, All right. So, Well, there’s a lot of good idea it. So this is important. So, um, organizations, you know you’re getting you’re getting free advice here. Ah, have on boarding your board. Members include training on the not only the organization sexual harassment policy, but prevention recognition of the of the, uh of what’s inappropriate. What’s that? That is part of the policy.

[00:20:20.50] spk_2:
What about from the board member of perspective? How about if, let’s take a

[00:20:45.00] spk_4:
small organization? There isn’t an HR person, um, small organization 45 people. And it’s the CEO who, uh, someone a woman believes is is, uh, engaged in harassing behavior. It doesn’t feel that she can reported anywhere in the office, goes to a board member. What’s a board member? How does a board member react to that?

[00:21:16.47] spk_0:
I think the board should should have. There should be some mechanism. As I said, there really needs to be a policy for a small organization on on how how to address that. Maybe the board decides they’re going to bring in a They’re going to bring in a consultant, someone to investigate someone with experience investigating such claims and then report to the board that person’s findings.

[00:21:19.73] spk_4:
So that would be a part of your policy. I guess how it’s going, how the investigation is going to be conducted.

[00:22:05.03] spk_0:
Absolutely. The sexual harassment policy would indicate that not only here’s our complaint procedure, but once you complain how we’re gonna handle it, there’s gonna be a prompt and thorough investigation which an employer has a legal obligation to dio both a prompt and thorough investigation. There’ll be an investigation, doesn’t need to be done internally and and often times an organization will decide to go external so that they have an independent person who’s investigating the complaint. And then the results of that investigation will be reported to that. Employees the employees always also has the right to go externally. There are government agencies where they can make complaints of sexual harassment. Whether they go, if they’re covered by the federal law, that can go to the e o c. On if they’re if the organization is covered, I should say, if the if the organization is covered by the federal law because there have to be 15 or more employees, they could go to the federal agency that enforces certain Equal

[00:22:55.24] spk_4:
Employment Opportunity Commission, and we’re gonna get into some of that on the state and local also, Um what? How about in the moment? Okay, I I want to cover the employees and also the person to whom it’s reported. What say it is the CEO. So in the employee, in the moment it’s happening in the workplace, something inappropriate has just happened in the lunch room. It just happened right now, and I feel that I’m the female who feels that I’ve been abused, harassed. What do I do right now? It’s happening right now.

[00:23:26.74] spk_0:
Well, really. The best thing for someone to d’oh when they feel that there’s unwelcome conduct is to let the person know who engaged in that conduct, that the conduct is unwelcome immediately, immediately. Sometimes, sometimes the person isn’t aware of what they said. Maybe they are, but sometimes they’re not, that whatever is being said is unwelcome, and the employees should tell that person it’s always that’s the best. First step is to tell the person that the conduct is unwelcome.

[00:23:31.39] spk_4:
Just using those words what you just did.

[00:23:34.89] spk_6:
What you just

[00:23:46.18] spk_4:
said is really inappropriate. And I don’t like it. Yeah, it’s it’s okay, okay. I’m trying to empower people, all right, in that moment. Okay? So call it out immediately.

[00:23:47.86] spk_0:
Called out immediately, or sometimes if somebody’s processing it and is taken aback.

[00:23:53.49] spk_4:
Yeah, I read a lot. That right? I didn’t know how to react. I was frozen. I didn’t Yeah, okay,

[00:24:36.14] spk_0:
then when they are able to be in a emotional state toe, have that conversation to tell the person that it’s unwelcome and it needs to stop immediately so that that’s a first, best step and then to follow whatever the complaint procedure is about how to report that those kinds of things. What is what is the organization’s complaint procedure? Sometimes they don’t feel comfortable. Person doesn’t feel comfortable going to that person directly. I mean, the best way to to have something stop is to tell that person that it’s unwelcome,

[00:24:48.74] spk_4:
right? But that could be hard going back. Let’s say she was frozen in the moment. Five minutes later, the last person she wants to see is that guy. So So Then go to the next step, which is Follow the complaint procedure.

[00:24:52.16] spk_0:
Yes.

[00:24:54.53] spk_4:
Okay. What if there is no complaint procedure?

[00:25:13.68] spk_0:
Thank Goto. Go to another supervisor. In other words, if it’s your supervisor, if it’s an employee supervisor who’s engaging in the conduct, go to another supervisor, find any supervisor to address it and have that supervisor step in to stop to stop the behavior.

[00:25:35.24] spk_4:
Okay. Excellent. Now you’re the supervisor. You’re the You’re the import. Yet you’re the supervisor in the office. Someone has just come to you. It just happened three minutes ago. I didn’t know what to do. I got myself out of the situation. I mean, I can’t remember all the details, but I do remember that he touched me this way. What do you as the supervisor do? What do you say? What do you do in that moment? It just happened.

[00:25:48.74] spk_0:
So the supervisor, it’s going to depend again on this on the particular fax of of the organization. And what? How big they are in terms of what what other resource is they have. So in an organization that has a human resource is person and where the policy and procedure is contact human contact. Human resource is they will go to human resource. That supervisor should go to human resource is immediately immediately. And tell them this has been reported to may.

[00:26:16.92] spk_4:
Okay, um, I want you to hold that thought we’re gonna come back to see because I take a little break, cause I gotta take care of my sponsors. Okay, so

[00:27:38.33] spk_3:
we need to take a break. Cougar Mountain Software, Their accounting product Denali, is built for non profits from the ground up so that you get an application that supports the way you work. That has the features you need. And the exemplary support that you’ve heard about that understands you. They have a free 60 day trial on the listener landing page at now. It’s time for tony Steak, too. 20 NTC The 2020 non profit Technology conference coming up. Baltimore, Maryland. I hope you’re going. It’s an outstanding conference. There are a lot of very wise speakers there, and as you’ve heard many times, it is not only four technologists by any means. It’s for anybody who uses technology, which is all of us. I’ll be there on the exhibit floor in Booths 3 16 and 3 18 capturing lots of smart interviews for the show Coming months in the show we’re sponsored, thereby Cougar Mountain software so you’ll see us in a booth. Oversized booth double booth together. Um, thank you to Cougar mouth and software for sponsoring us at NTC. Come

[00:27:38.57] spk_2:
by, Come by, Say hello

[00:27:43.41] spk_3:
if you’re there. Come see us in Booth 3 16 and 3 18 Um, we’ll be the ones making a lot of noise doing interviews because I have an external speaker so you can hear it all in the video on this is that tony-martignetti dot com. And that’s tony Steak, too. Let’s go back to sexual harassment in nonprofits.

[00:28:28.86] spk_4:
Lisa Brauner were back with her. She is, uh ah. Partner, attorney and partner at Perlman and Pearlman in New York City. Um, if you want to join the conversation about sexual harassment in nonprofits 8774804120 is the number 8774804120 tweet us with hashtag non profit radio were also on Facebook live on the tony-martignetti non profit radio page. I give you a little homework assignment, but actually, I do remember where we were,

[00:28:30.72] spk_0:
but when I say I’m sorry, let your mom.

[00:28:53.11] spk_4:
Oh, thank you very much. Thank you. A lot of times I don’t remember. So you’re off the hook In case you forgot. I remember. We’re now in a smaller I know you do. We’re now in a small organization um, without a policy, and the employee has just come right now to you as a supervisor. What do you say first? What do you say to her?

[00:29:12.64] spk_0:
I think the supervisor would express concern about what the employees had expressed to the supervisor and let the employees know that they’re going to address it if there’s not. If there’s not an HR person

[00:29:16.17] spk_4:
from their isn’t

[00:30:12.60] spk_0:
they will. They will. They will bring it to the and is still is your hypothetical still that it’s the CEO who had engaged in the conduct or just another supervisor? Okay, so another supervisor. So then there’s no policy. But I think the logical step would be that the supervisor then brings it up the chain of command and the absence of a policy. Yeah, it would make sense to bring the complaint up the chain of command, meaning that the supervisor then goes to the CEO and addresses it with them and the CEO and the absence of having an HR person that would be a conversation, then with the board. And there may be a determination. They’re gonna bring in an employment attorney to investigate the complaint, and there will then be some discussion about the fact that there needs to be a policy that I was going back to the policy because it’s really a baseline is that Polish

[00:30:16.11] spk_2:
should have won. For God’s sake, I have get one. If you don’t have one, get one. For Pete’s sake, just have it. What? What you

[00:30:21.76] spk_4:
know. But we have to cover the contingency because I’m sure it’s not 100% coverage of these things. As you’re well aware, the policies are not 100% of nonprofits,

[00:30:29.05] spk_0:
right? And I would also say, Get insurance, get GPL insurances, employment practices, liability insurance.

[00:30:43.98] spk_4:
Pl thank you for defining that. Otherwise you’d be in jargon jail, e p l employment practices, liability insurance. Talk to your insurance carrier about E p L coverage. Okay,

[00:32:15.32] spk_0:
yeah, so that’s a good idea to. And the training is really it’s essential, and not just about preventing sexual harassment but really preventing retaliation, training for employees on the issue of bystander being a bystander, and obligations to report violations of the policy that they see even if they are not personally affected by what’s going on. So the training on those issues, this really critical sexual harassment prevention, other kinds of preventing other types of unlawful discrimination, harassment in the workplace and preventing retaliation, which is an area that really is it is, ends up getting a lot of organizations in in trouble. A National, a large national nonprofit organization, recently settled a retaliation case for close to $2 million earlier this year. The allegations were, and it was it was a case that was settled. So these allegations thes were just allegations. The allegations were that the organization had fired the HR director and the in house counsel after those individuals reported to the organization that they believe there were complaints of discrimination not by them but by others. And the allegation brought by the E. O. C. Was action brought by the E. O. C. Was that that those two individuals had been terminated in retaliation for having brought forward complaints by

[00:32:20.72] spk_4:
having done their job.

[00:32:31.51] spk_0:
Yeah, settlement was $1.95 million. So the issue of although these were allegations the issue off claims of retaliation are very important for organizations to take seriously and to prevent those those claims from arising by offering by having training for both their board and their employees.

[00:34:20.69] spk_4:
I want to bring in another story I got This is, uh, on the website tony-martignetti dot com Comment. I was working for three years in an embassy of a foreign country in the U. S. A. And during those same three years, I was sexually harassed by different diplomats and employees who were locally hired. I wasn’t the only one suffering from this treatment. Many of my co workers would complain to me about this behavior and there were never any consequences. Even after talking to the perpetrators immediate supervisor or to the administrator of the embassy, we were cornered in offices. Minister would measure our breasts in front of other people. Nothing doing it private makes this behavior justifiable. But there were even witnesses of this behavior, and no one did anything about it. We’d receive sexual propositions, or cat called in the office. And we were all too afraid to speak up because this could have consequences against us women and no consequences against the perpetrators. After three years of silence, I had had enough. So I decided to speak to the administrative Minister in charge of the personnel about my problem. But although she behaved as an ally, I wasn’t comfortable enough to give her names because in the list I would have had to include my boss. I told her I was willing to start a campaign with workshops to train men about appropriate workplace behavior with female co workers. She told me to follow up and write an email with my ideas. Needless to say, she never responded to my email. Um, all right, this raises a few things. Doesn’t sense non non profit so foreign to Foreign Embassy in the U. S. I. C. A resident of resident non citizen. Do they have different standing? If you if you’re not a citizen of the U. S. Does that matter?

[00:34:24.64] spk_0:
Well, I don’t know. I don’t know whether there are particular laws that apply to embassies better located in the United States and the rights of those individuals.

[00:34:35.73] spk_4:
All right, well, let’s put it in a knot

[00:34:36.78] spk_0:
of us. If it was US organization is different. If it’s a different, it’s a different situation.

[00:34:45.60] spk_4:
Okay, let’s put it in a U. S. Non profit. Uh, it’s a resident non citizen. Do they have any lower level of standards?

[00:35:41.34] spk_0:
they have. They’re working for US organization. That’s my hypothetical here, you know, here in the United States, then they would still be protected by our law by their own employees. And our the laws prohibit discrimination against employees, depending on. Like I said, they’re federal. We didn’t really go into it. But their federal, state and local laws and those laws in terms of who’s covered which employers air covered, may depend on the size of the organization. So we there’s a federal law called Title Seven, and that applies to employers with 15 or more employees. So and then states and localities have cities have their own laws prohibiting employment discrimination, and they may have, ah, lower coverage. So, for instance, in New York, both state and New York City human rights laws require generally that you have. You have four or more employees in order for that organization to be covered by the loss.

[00:36:00.38] spk_4:
Okay, Another thing I see here is ah, retaliation, potential retaliation. But we talked about that illegal.

[00:36:29.80] spk_0:
Oh, retaliation. This is retaliation to talk about retaliation. What it is is if if if somebody, if an employer takes some action against someone for engaging in legally protected activity. And what that means is complaining of discrimination or participating, even as a witness in a complaint of discrimination. Opposing discrimination, those kinds of things air protected by the law, those kinds of complaints and participation investigation. So if some action is taken against an individual because they engaged in legally protected activity that’s considered retaliation

[00:36:43.55] spk_4:
would raise a claim of retaliation.

[00:36:52.59] spk_0:
Yeah, putting it quite simply, I mean, there’s a little bit of a different standard, but that’s if if something happens to them because they did that, then that’s generally considered unlawful retaliation.

[00:36:57.08] spk_4:
That’s a that’s a good level for for us. Okay, I don’t wanna get into Ah ah. See Ellie course legal legal education course.

[00:37:04.62] spk_2:
OK, the other thing I

[00:37:18.23] spk_4:
see here is what if the organization isn’t taking action? Suppose there is a policy and they’re not following the policy as the employees. As the aggrieved employees, I don’t see anything happening now. You said I have the EOE see the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. I could go there

[00:37:27.29] spk_0:
if if the organization’s covered you talked about, this may not be covered.

[00:37:40.75] spk_4:
It may not be, um, where just help me out where I’ve been aggrieved and I don’t see my organization doing anything that are following the policy. Wegner following their own policy, and it’s a bigger organization over 15 employees. What do I do?

[00:38:03.51] spk_0:
So employees have the right to file a claim of discrimination either with the federal agency. If the organization is covered, has 15 or more employees or with their state or local But state or city agency government agency that enforces the laws of that state or say we’re varies from state to state or not Every city may have

[00:38:31.97] spk_4:
right. The smaller cities are not gonna have a human rights commission. Um, what about hiring your own attorney? Is there any value in that as the employees it’s been, It’s been three or four weeks. I haven’t heard anything back. I don’t see anything happening. Nobody’s talked to me value in the hiring an attorney to help you enforce your rights,

[00:38:49.97] spk_0:
and employees could. I mean, as an attorney for organizations, I think it’s best for employees to to try to use the the processes that are in place and if they’re not able to, if if if they’re not able to avail themselves of those avenues

[00:38:57.16] spk_4:
where they availed themselves, but they’re

[00:39:13.22] spk_0:
not getting back. You’re not getting a response. They may not be satisfaction, but they’re not getting response to the allegations. There’s not. There’s not an investigation being done, and it’s not proceeding in the manner in which the policy has said then they certainly are within their rights to tiu contact an attorney.

[00:39:22.60] spk_4:
Okay, Okay, um, you got take another break again, hanging with this

[00:39:42.97] spk_3:
time for our last break turn to communications their former journalists so that you get help building relationships with journalists so that your call gets answered when there’s knees. When there’s news that you need to comment on so that you stay relevant in your work, including a former journalist at the Chronicle of Philanthropy, they understand our community there at turn hyphen to dot CEO. We’ve got butt loads. More time for attorney Lisa Bronner and sexual harassment in nonprofits.

[00:39:58.88] spk_4:
We are continuing our conversation. Ah, with Lisa Brauner in

[00:40:04.61] spk_2:
studio and I’d like to turn

[00:40:20.25] spk_4:
to another another avenue. This is, uh, this is from Vanessa Chase. Vanessa Chase election and her sight is the story telling non profit dot com and she says at a conference. One of the facilitators used his session to talk about how, when people make mistakes, they should be welcomed back into the community. His

[00:40:38.47] spk_2:
reason for choosing this topic was self serving. He disclosed that he sexually harassed women at this same conference the year before. You believe that you believe somebody and was essentially forcing everyone to welcome him back.

[00:41:14.41] spk_4:
Unfortunately, the conference organizers did not know one that this had happened, and to that he was going to use this moment to essentially give himself a second chance without any consultation with the conference organizers or the broader community. As an attendee, I immediately felt unsafe. My whole body tensed up and was like that for the remaining two days of the conference. I resented that I was in voluntarily put in this environment and that there was no way for me to easily leave because we were at a retreat center. Then, of course, there were the women who were harmed by this facilitator who were in the audience and some who were not in the audience, and

[00:41:17.21] spk_2:
they had no idea that this

[00:41:44.51] spk_4:
was going to be publicly aired. This conference had no clear, transparent policies in place for people to report sexual harassment. This meant that nonprofits who may have clear internal policies for this unintentionally put staff in unsafe environments where the policies were not consistent with the organizations Lisa brought her. This is interesting. One conferences. You send your employees to a conference. Let’s say you have the employer. You pay all the expenses. What’s the situation here?

[00:41:45.72] spk_0:
It’s very interesting, very interesting issue that’s being raised. And I ended the I think we talked about that. There is There was one conference or one organization that created a way about

[00:42:04.51] spk_4:
that. Yeah, we’re gonna get to that.

[00:42:05.87] spk_0:
Okay, so it’s It’s a very interesting issue, and

[00:42:27.70] spk_4:
their employer liability is that. Is that possible? Employer liability. Again, let’s take my hypothetical. We approve the conference. We’re paying for the expenses for travel and meals and lodging while you’re there. It definitely is related to Europe. Your employment. Obviously those would have paid for it. Is there potential employer

[00:42:28.95] spk_0:
liability? Courts have ruled differently on the issue of when and employers liable outside the workplace, certainly where there can be things outside the workplace and organizations sponsored event and something like that

[00:42:41.68] spk_4:
off outing

[00:42:42.36] spk_0:
where Gala, Where there could be open

[00:42:44.34] spk_4:
house in the office. Well, I’ll be in the office, but we’re you’re thinking off site

[00:43:06.45] spk_0:
outside the four walls of the office. And I think in a in a situation like that, where an employee feels that they’re in an unsafe situation, they have to tell there employer about that because that’s not something that the employer could have anticipated.

[00:43:09.47] spk_4:
Agreed? This is that it was a bizarre one.

[00:43:21.90] spk_0:
Yeah, so? So it’s it’s really kind of outside outside the scope of something that an employer may have envisioned as the courts have gone differently about, you know, how far that how far the workplace extends.

[00:43:30.49] spk_4:
Okay, um, what if you are on a conference organizing committee?

[00:43:47.88] spk_0:
And I’d also say one of things that she was alleging not that she was sexually harassed, but simply that she felt uncomfortable by by being in the presence of someone who had who had a certain that he that he sexually harassed others

[00:43:59.46] spk_4:
right at the conference in the year before, right? Okay, you know, You know what? I’m not even gonna I’m not going to get into the issue. Could she allege? Well, she could certainly allege Could should be successful in a claim of sexual harassment. She the woman who wrote the blood post Vanessa Chase election.

[00:44:08.83] spk_0:
She’s not asserting anything. I know

[00:44:30.73] spk_4:
she’s here. Yeah, it’s interesting. Maybe legal question for me, but let’s not get into it. It’s gonna get too detailed. Let’s take this. What If you’re a volunteer or you’re a conference organizer? You’re in a F P association of fundraising professionals. You put on him conference every year. Do you have an obligation to have a policy around this around? Harassment discrimination for your attendees?

[00:44:47.74] spk_0:
Well, it’s not an employer. It’s on an employer obligation is more of a question of is the environment that you want to create for your attendees, one in which everyone is acknowledging that they’re gonna abide by certain rules when they attend that conference?

[00:44:52.30] spk_4:
Well, I think that yeah, they’re certainly unwritten rules,

[00:45:10.16] spk_0:
but what are they going tohave? Are they going to have written rules? Do they wanna have everyone agree that when you when you come to our conference, you’re going thio agree to certain behavior in certain conduct, And if you don’t then we reserve our right to to not have you attend our conferences anymore. But it’s a different question than an employer. Sure. Okay, All

[00:45:19.39] spk_2:
right, well, I’m testing the bounds of the law. Okay, so it suddenly it’s at least

[00:45:26.16] spk_4:
an issue for conference organizers.

[00:45:27.95] spk_0:
It’s an interesting issue. It’s an interesting issue that blogger races. Yeah,

[00:45:32.30] spk_4:
absolutely on. And if you’re in, this is from again, this is from Vanessa Chase Election, she suggests. If you’re a conference attendee, exercise your agency to attend conferences that are doing their best to create safe environments for women. Ask conference organizers to share their policies publicly and use part of the opening session to make sure all attendees know about the policies. Seems reasonable.

[00:46:02.26] spk_0:
I think I think her hers talking about employers making enquiries particular

[00:46:04.48] spk_4:
is making me incredibly,

[00:46:28.23] spk_0:
particularly where particularly where let’s say, an employee had raised if an employee raised an issue and said I felt uncomfortable because there was this person who admittedly sexually harassed attendees at the conference. It would be interesting for an employer to pursue whether or not there there, that conference organizer has a code of conduct the conference organizer. It might not have crossed their mind, even that there, that there that there should be one. But it’s an interesting issue there now,

[00:47:16.87] spk_4:
all unnoticed because it’s on non profit radio. So every every non profit conference organizer is now on notice. You can play this for them, and any reasonable conference organizer would be listening to non profit radio. So play this. They are unnoticed on dhe. That’s going to, uh, you know, not that we’re trying to help you. I mean, I would like to help you after the fact. I’d like to prevent it to begin with, but conference organizers, ifyou’re non profit, uh, you’re on notice. Case case closed. Okay, Read. Stockman tweeted. Hey asked where would folks find a sample policy for ideas and related to this? Exactly. Read is the non profit ah technology network and 10 which I’m a member of a B sample. Ward is the CEO, and she’s our monthly social media

[00:47:21.38] spk_2:
contributor and they do have

[00:47:32.55] spk_4:
a code of conduct on it. Includes the non profit technology conference as well as I think. I think this would pass Lisa broader muster, but I’m not gonna put you on the spot to say for sure. But where Where is it? Apply a lend 10 spaces again in 10. The non profit technology network, including, but not limited to and tens online

[00:47:39.66] spk_2:
community, platform, online community, social media, right? Yes, webinars and

[00:47:43.90] spk_4:
trainings, they explicitly say Social media, non profit technology conference, non profit tech, ground up snot and 10 labs, et cetera. What What are they talking about? Discrimination Is the unjust er prejudicial treatment of others related to gender, gender, identity and expression, sexual orientation, disability, mental illness, euro, typical ality or atypical ality, physical appearance, body size, age, race or religion that sound pretty comprehensive to you.

[00:48:13.55] spk_0:
It includes categories that, ah are not legally protected in New York, but it may vary from state to

[00:48:20.88] spk_4:
state. They’re being very going beyond that. This is, of course, that they’re entitled. Have anything they want in their policy, right, and

[00:48:25.83] spk_0:
they can put go beyond what’s required. They can put with what they would like in their policy,

[00:49:03.25] spk_4:
And then it goes on t mention behaviors that harassment includes, which I don’t have time to take off, but so you can find an example, um, and then also includes how to report. Uh, there’s an email talk to an intent community team member and how you identify them by their lanyard. Or you could make an anonymous report. They have a WUFU site platform that you could use for anonymous reporting. So it does cover that. And the answer is you can look att en 10 you go to, uh, and 10 dot or ge slash ntc slash at a glance with hyphens between the words slash code of conduct with hyphens in between the words Thank you and 10 for that contribution. And Lisa brought in. We have just a minute. Why don’t you leave us with the last bit of advice, Please?

[00:49:38.86] spk_0:
I think that if you’re gonna have ah takeaway from today is the importance of having policies that prohibit sexual harassment that prohibit retaliation, prohibit unlawful retaliation and that you do trainings for your supervisors and your employees on preventing discrimination, preventing unlawful discrimination, harassment and retaliation in the workplace

[00:49:45.13] spk_4:
and for individuals. Call it out because it’s not going to stop.

[00:49:50.57] spk_0:
And for individuals, it’s important to to call it out and address it. If the conduct is unwelcome, you let the person no employees should let the person know who is engaging in that conduct, that the conduct is unwelcome.

[00:50:03.83] spk_4:
We have to leave it there. OK? Lisa Broner, attorney and partner at Perlman and Pearlman in New York City. There, Perlman and Perlman dot or GE and also at Tax Exempt Lawyer.

[00:50:12.11] spk_3:
Next week, Jamie burst with your organization’s health. If you missed any part of today’s show, I beseech you, find it on tony-martignetti dot com were sponsored by wegner-C.P.As guiding you beyond the numbers. Wegner-C.P.As dot com by Cougar Mountain Software Denali Fund Is there complete accounting solution made for nonprofits tony-dot-M.A.-slash-Pursuant Mountain for a free 60 day trial and by turned to communications, PR and content for nonprofits, your story is their mission. Turn hyphen to dot CEO

[00:51:26.15] spk_2:
creative producers Claire Meyerhoff. Sam Liebowitz is the line producer. Shows Social Media is by Susan Chavez. Mark Silverman is our Web guy, and this music is by Scott Stein be with me next week for not profit radio. Big non profit ideas for the other 95% go out and be great talking alternative radio 24 hours a day.

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Nonprofit Radio for September 26, 2014: Critical Development Committee & Creative Commons 101

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Greg Cohen: Critical Development Committee

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Greg Cohen is senior associate at Cause Effective. He wants you to understand how important your development committee is to your board and your organization. What does a high performing committee do and how can you support them? Plus tips on recruiting and mentoring.

 

 

 

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Hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host. Oh, i’m glad you’re with me. I’d be hit with red know cora did itis if i saw that you missed today’s show critical development committee greg cohen is senior associate at cause effective. He wants you to understand how important your development committee is to your board and your organisation. What is the high performing committee do? And how do you support them? Plus tips on recruiting and mentoring and creative commons one oh one carly leinheiser explains what creative commons is and how valuable it khun b if you need video images or publications or want to release your own to raise awareness. She’s, an attorney at perlman and pearlman we talked at ntcdinosaur fourteen the non-profit technology conference on tony’s take two, get off a less is back and a very special, a less show next week. Responsive by generosity siri’s you know them. They host multi charity five k runs and walks. I’m very glad that greg cohen is in the studio with me. He is a senior associate at cause effective since two. Thousand six he has provided training and coaching on fund-raising and governance to the boards and staffs of hundreds of non-profits for over thirty years, he’s worked to the wide range of non-profits greg cohen, welcome to studio very glad to be here. We had your colleague susan gabriel on about three weeks ago or so, and i am so in love with what cause defectives work does and how smart you all are on when she introduced me to you, i said, yes, this is definitely an important topic development committee. Please just remind us what cause effective does it’s a non-profits were non-profit ourselves, we’ve been around for over thirty years and where a capacity building group with a focus on helping other non-profits build communities of supporters with a particular emphasis on individual donors. We help them strengthen their boards both for governance and stewardship functions, as well as to make boardmember sze confident and effective fundraisers, aki function and the third area is to advise groups on the strategic use of special events. So not event management, but more the big picture of if we’re going to do something special this year, how do we make? Sure, it aligns with our capacity in our long term organisational objectives, and we don’t steer off the cliff running an event that doesn’t really fit who we are and who our audiences are and that’s related, the third part is related to what susan and i talked about using anniversaries exact effectively, basically when i would say that in a nutshell, it helps you get to the next level for small organizations that are struggling, particularly with fund-raising but also governance? Well, they may not really know that they have governance issues. Um, i think cause effective is a very good place for these organizations again, so it’s, particularly about diversifying funding when we’re talking about fund-raising for groups that have been very dependent on government or foundation, a few sources to diversify into individual donors and don’t know quite what the first steps are in aa strengthening, i think everything every organization feels its board could get to the next level so very much helping boards figure out how to be better planners and stewards of their organization. How does cause effective charge for its work? So about half our clients have a third party like united way. Or a foundation like new york women’s foundation who have funded us to work with them to strengthen them in a particular area. And about half come in having found a source of funding, either unrest, districted or a boardmember someone who feels the topic is important and helps fund our work with them. We also do a lot of work for free through partners like the foundation center and the non-profit coordinating committee, where we offer workshops, i do a lot speaking at the foundation center, i’ve never done non-profit coordinating committee, maybe you can get me in there. I don’t i’m on the board, so you are i’m talking e expected to get me, but i have done a lot of the foundation’s enter through the years on either planned e-giving or charity registration. They have an open house in november foundation center i’m speaking on plant giving a great that open house our development committee? Yes. Why is well, let’s start with why it’s important that we get to whether everybody needs one? Why is your function so important on the board as a committee? So i’m going to get a little high concept for a minute. And talk about the sociology of philanthropy and one of the key principles is that people are motivated to give and respond to their peers people who are like them in a socioeconomic way, perhaps, but i’m sure staff people listening are familiar with the fact that after a while, because they are always speaking to their boards about every possible topic, they’re urging them to fundraise becomes part of the wallpaper just become something that becomes routine. So how do we break through that to encourage and support boardmember sze to fundraise in ways that they can really here and the development committee, which is made up of their peer board members, is a key way for board members to talk to board members as a team about how we’re going to approach fund-raising for this organization, it sounds like even a small board six people should have ah, development committee absolutely so even if it’s a committee of two, although i would work to grow the board and grow that committee that’s important because the other thing is every critical function of a non-profit needs somebody who owns it. So if ah, a lot of organizations think, well the whole board should be fund-raising that’s absolutely true, the function of the development committee is to be the little wheel that turns the big wheel board fund-raising not to be the people who the rest of the board has delegated to go out and raise the money that the port thinks it should be raising, but rather it’s, the people who leave the meeting thinking about how do we move the board forward towards some fund-raising goals in between those meetings, just the way the staff does. A lot of times, i think boards delegate the fund-raising to the staff person, and they see maybe hiring their first director of development as the panacea, the cure all that’s right now, we can relax now we don’t have worry about fund-raising cause we have a director, we hired a director development so it’s his or her job. So this is why that peer-to-peer concept is so important because if we can visualize around every boardmember their facebook and lengthen networks, they’re connected to dozens, if not hundreds of people, but the staff would never have access to those folks were it not for board members willingness to be in front. Of those folk shin’s share their passion for the mission of the organization. So and typically, staff members don’t come in with the multiple of networks that aboard represents. So we say aboard is the vanguard of individual fund-raising and they have to be willing to reach out themselves to connect with other people and that can’t be delegated to staff, even if that the director of development does have networks, they’re not the networks that you, khun that person can bring to the organization their networks of other professional fundraisers, friends and family. But but it’s it’s not appropriate for this staff person to be asking their friends and family just be supporting argast that they work for well, we like staff people teo fund-raising actually, but it’s limited to their network. And if you have six, eight, ten boardmember sze sitting around the table who might offer access to hundreds more people, you’re leaving that resource untapped if you only rely on the staff to do that individual relationship building within their circles. Okay, then what is the relationship between the board development committee and either the director of development or even let’s? Consider a smaller shop that don’t even have a director development where it’s, the executive director. Sure. Well, let me start, actually, with the functions of the development committee, then it’s easier to understand. Taking taking over. All right now, i just think it’s a little. All right, well, okay. You know, i’ll say that it’s in a way the staff leads from behind. So they’re the ones who are the professionals who are thinking of, in a sophisticated way about where the organization could go for fund-raising collecting the information on what’s effective and but what they’re doing is they’re guiding the board leadership into howto have the conversation about fund-raising and supporting their fellow board members, kind of from behind, right? Okay, so so they they may in fact be either masterminding or thinking in conjunction with the head of the development committee or the board chair how we’re going to move this group, but they’re they’re letting the board voices lead the conversation around the table instead of it being their voices thie other thing is there plenty of tools that board members need? They need elevator speeches. They need talking points. They need help thinking out cultivation events to bring their friends in aa lot of different activities and events that are going to need the support of staff, the most valuable thing the boardmember brings is the ability to get someone to respond to their phone call or their appeal. Excellent. Ok, i just wanted to lay out, yeah, i didn’t want to get into detail, okay, don’t upset you, okay, we’re gonna go because right after this break was going to take right now, we’re definitely going to get into what does this committee do? Great. And then we can talk more in detail about the the staff functions to support that in detail. Sure, i just want to lay out the general landscape relationship. Thank you very much for indulging me. All right, we’ll go out for a couple minutes. When you come back, greg and i are going to keep talking about your critical development committee. E-giving didn’t think dick tooting good ending. You’re listening to the talking alternate network, get in. I think. Cubine this’s, the cook said about wear hosting part of my french new york city guests come from all over the world, from mali to new caledonia. From paris to keep back. French is a common language. Yes, they all come from different cultures, background or countries, and it common desires to make new york they’re home. Listen to them, shed their story, join us, part of my french new york city. Every monday from one to two p, m. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Dahna you’re listening to the talking alternative network. Oppcoll welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Greg let’s, let’s, move right into this. Now, what does this important development committee do? Right? So i said, it’s, the little wheel that turns the big wheel aboard fund-raising so what are the functions of that cock? First thing is, it helps the board have a conversation about what are its goals for fund-raising as a subset of the goals of the overall organization, sometimes an organization says, okay, we want to raise fifty thousand dollars from individual donations this year through a combination of our event staff driven fund-raising inboard fund-raising and that goal sits there. However, the the board itself doesn’t have its own thermometer for its own activities, and commonly there’ll be a board meeting and every will say, you know, we have the big anniversary gala coming up. I know everybody’s going to go out and sell tickets and sponsorships, right? And everybody agrees at that moment, there’s a good feeling in the room, and then they go back to their regular lives and expect, as in the past executive director and the board chair going to pull the rabbit out of the hat so what we want to do is set goals for the board specifics, both for events and overall so of that fifty thousand what’s our board promised to the organization that we’re going to do let’s say we’re going to twenty thousand of it minimum, and we’re going to have a stretch goal a thirty five toward the fifty that way, the exact director knows one they can write that number into the budget and actually spend on it rather than live in suspense until the end of the year to see are the boardmember is actually able to come through and two, it gives a rallying point throughout the year for that board development committee toe work with the other boardmember sze to say, hey, we’re up to fifteen, you know, with this spring reception, we could get toward twenty five of our goal who you thinking of bringing and how much do you think they’d be able to do? So, you know, they say what gets measured gets done and setting goals for board specific fund-raising and having knows that gold monitored, but and supported by members of the board itself is a strong way to actually tow actualize those girls. What happens if the development committee brings these goals to the larger board and there isn’t support for them, so it has to be consensus, right? You can’t the ah, one of the most important characteristics of non-profit is it’s, not a command and control culture, it’s by consensus and, of course, what’s. Most important is that you bring in the board members who have the most ability in terms of your financial goals. But if you have a board with varied economic impact in a diverse board, then you also want goals that have to do with capacity. How many new people worry bringing into the organization? How many new donors without regard to the size of their gifts, how many people are we asking and those air goals that every boardmember can embrace without regard to? Hey, i don’t know anyone of high net worth and your point earlier was that these this is peer-to-peer so its board members in the development committee bringing these goals eggs, activities exactly to their fellow board members versus the staff, and it voids the awkwardness of saying, hey, reach a bigger goal that goes for my salary. Right, you can see where that might not be a most comfortable conversation foran executive director not to set a goal, but to exhort boardmember is that’s kind of hard when it when it’s partly your livelihood that’s at stake, so that’s goal setting the second thing is i mentioned is monitoring toward the goals. The third thing is supporting board members, so checking in and saying, how’s it going? What are you hearing when you’re out talking with your friends about the work or your colleagues at work? Are there additional tools that you need? What kind of events would help you bring in the folks that you think might be most interested in your circle in our work? So they’re they’re getting the chance to ask the board members how’s this process going rather than again? Exhorting people have him leave the room and be on their own teo to meet their individual fund-raising goals there’s the idea that they’re backing them up, and in fact, we advocate a buddy system where each member the development committee takes a few people on the board if you have a board that’s large enough who are not on the development. Committee and works with them over the course of the year in partnership to help them reach their goals. All right, we’re gonna have some more time talking about the buddy system of that. Because it’s ah, it brings back to my boy scout data on ah, we had troops whims. You have a swim in the water front now on the waterfront of been inspected. That’s a part of the truth from you had a buddy system and everybody had to be near their buddy swimming. And these are body checks. So we’re going aboard united now checks and hopefully they’re not drowning in the water. The board members, they’re i’ve taken that foreign so away. Other things that the committee does but let’s sze check in which this support role is this, i guess it’s not on ly at board meetings, but but we can be particularly between the time right took in board meetings is when we’re together. We have ah good feeling of working as a group and being aligned. The hard part is when we go back to the rest of our lives, family and work and our board responsibilities tend to fade in the face of the immediacy of those other things having development committee people checking in with board members in those periods between board meetings is a way to keep that present in their lives. All right, so that’s the monitoring and support role that’s that’s, right of the committee that’s right and listening, you know, there’s such a key thing in all fund-raising but hearing how’s it going for this difficulty thing of asking for money and and and finding out what’s, easy, what’s, hard, and and also because each development committee person is talking to a few people, they start to see what the commonalities are, you know, something’s missing from our pitch, i’m hearing that from several people. What about dealing with the recalcitrant board members so kind of in a version of everybody bring in stories, but sure, if you want to tell me so in a version of the buddy system, one one great system is to take boardmember sze who are experienced and confident and match them up, whether they’re on the development committee or not matched them up with newer boardmember czar or board members who are more reluctant to ask and have them go. Out together, for instance, on and ask so that the lesser experienced person had has a chance to see how it’s done and participate first. So great great example a peer-to-peer support there thie other area that often happens is chaillou i think i’d liketo have host a house party to get some of my friends, but i’m not sure enough people will turn up, and i wouldn’t want the embarrassment of having an empty room. Well, is there another boardmember thatyou could pair up and co host together, for instance? Excellent. Okay, and we’re going to talk about the recruiting, but but just it’s coming to my now the ah fund-raising expectations e-giving of board members at the recruitment stage can we just can we talk about that confession? How explicit should we be? Should it be in writing? Not in writing? How do we have this conversation about fund-raising expectations at recruitment? Great questions so that that’s really the next evolution of board fund-raising goal setting, which is ok overall, is aboard. We’re going to set some goals and then the next step is to say, what does each person think over the course of the year, they khun do toward those various goals. Can they host an event? Will they show up at other events? How many new people do they think they can bring into the fold? How many people do they think they can ask for money and at what levels? And, of course, for their own giving what? What between events and an annual gift? Do they think they’ll give and that’s important? Because that’s really where the rubber meets the road and being able to match the aspirations of a goal with what’s actually likely toe happen over the course of the year, and it let’s board members reflect on what they can, what there actually able to do? Dahna what’s easy and then what becomes a stretch? And if you add up, if you get people to write down on ah pledged pledge form pledge is probably the wrong word, but a projection form of what they can do, and you add that up, you see two people’s own projections of what they do get anywhere close to what we’re projecting as a goal overall, and if it’s too far apart than either you have to lower your goal or ask people. To redouble their efforts. All right, but still sticking with the recruitment stage. Yes, we putting all this, these expectations in writing for the boardmember the the potential boardmember boardmember including yeah, ideally, yes, because particularly if you’re trying to recruit people who are experienced and fund-raising the more organized and clear you are about what’s expected the more comfort that they’re going to feel in joining your board. You know, they say you want something done, ask a busy person. Yes, the worst thing you could do is say you’re so great and experienced wolf will find lots of roles for you. I think busy people run from vagueness. If you say we are looking to recruit five sponsors from fortune five hundred companies, you work for such a company and you have a network. It is our hope that you will help us, particularly the sponsorship area. Then the person can evaluate. Can i step into that role? And can i meet those expectations or not? Versus so often we recruits on because we have unspoken sense of what their connections will bring spoken and and then it turns out either the person’s already committed those connections to another cause or they’re not a confident fundraiser and the last thing they’re going to do is turn around, use their business relationships for the charity. Okay, okay. Let’s, let’s. Go back, tio the functions of the of the development committee beyond the goal setting and monitoring. And so there’s ah, one really critical one, which is to celebrate success. And that doesn’t mean just when the check arrives. But when that person who was a recalcitrant, ask her, ask their first person whether they get a yes or a no, we want to say, i want to acknowledge tony for stepping forward and actually sending out that appeal that we might then want to be the step pick somebody else. Okay, okay. I don’t want the recalcitrant. Okay. Ah, so we’re doing this in public at the board meeting at the board neo-sage celebration is the best way tio provide positive feedback for somebody’s step so that’s another aspect of that pure culture, which is we all have an equivalency of effort. And when we when we step forward to do that and show her on the bus ah, the rest of us acknowledge it and celebrated and in all forms you notice? I wasn’t talking about the amount of money i’m really talking about nufer fund-raising activities, right? And what other one of their activities should we be should be celebrating the first ask the first ask turning out ah, above and beyond kind of number of people to an event taking a leadership role by hosting an event or at the event itself, doing a great job with follow-up and saying thank you to donors on behalf of the organization and the board there’s so many activities that don’t involve asking that any boardmember can undertake, and then we want to say, great job, you know, both to reward that person and also to give the message to the other people around the table, you have the chance to step in the limelight as well. That’s cool the celebration. I haven’t heard that you mentioned the board members thanking i love that. I have heard that suggestion that at a board meeting or a special event, i’m a special evening, a bunch of board members around a table, and they’re just thanking donors for having made recent gift so i love a one to one thank so encouraging board members to make a phone call, maybe to someone that they haven’t met, you don’t know me. My name is greg on the border cause effective and, ah, i’m calling to thank you for your support and ah, and then you wantto what’s that person thinking there’s an ask buried here and then you have the boardmember say, i just have one question for you, and they think here’s, where the shoe drops, why did you choose to support our cause? And then they’re going to hear a bunch of extraordinary reasons that come from the heart of that donor it’s reinforcing to the boardmember oh, you know, we’re not out there with our tin cup. People are giving because of a connection to our mission and when’s the last time you got a thank you call from a board member of a charity you donate to never happens. So even the smallest organization that’s their comparative advantage against channel thirteen. Yes, they can thank every single one of their donors personally, right? Logistically, do you like to do those where? It’s a bunch of board members in a room together, and they’re they’re encouraging each other? They’re making individual falls or you rather have people do it from their home or their office depends on the size of the charity, you know, university’s love those call a thon. Alumni call it on things. Thank you. Call. Thank you. Write well for whatever i think it’s hard enough to get a board together for its general deliberations so i wouldn’t complicate matters. Ah, and let people also let people make those calls on their own schedule. So you’re giving them a list of dahna people little information about them? Ah, script that’s one of the forms of support staff can provide so that until someone gets their sea legs in these calls, they know what to say after a few it’s going to go easy and yeah, and you’re gonna hear terrific, heartwarming stories about why this is it right? So that, yes, your point that reinforces for the boardmember there are people all of us and it says now now now there is a step toward their getting confidence to be askanase themselves. Excellent that’s a great one. Okay, this celebration and the thank you’s. What else is there more this committee can be doing to turn the bigger wheel. Well, do you want to touch on recruitment? Not yet. It felt more that the committee khun do other functions. Those air, those air, the main function. Okay, can we talk about staff support? I have time to go short. The agenda with you. You’re you’re the board meeting with an agenda. I’d rather talk about a staff support for all these activities for yes. And then we’ll come to recruitment and mentoring. Right? Our buddy staff support. So ah, this could be the executive director without who doesn’t have a director of development supporting this a ll this committee work that’s correct. It’s always the exact director who has some involvement. Even with the development director. Just the way you observed the board can’t relax when they hyre their first development director. To manage all this. The staff can’t relax just because the board’s formed the development committee and there’s a good, vital conversation about board fund-raising taking place. They’ve got to be providing those tools. And that support because boardmember don’t have the time toe manage the infrastructure of fundrasing that’s still falls to the staff, including very importantly, if this is working, having a system for tracking all the contacts, all the people and the contacts that are made with those folks over time. So there’s a good record of the relationship that’s important staff function yes entering into r r fund-raising database are exactly our cr m database that’s, right? The contacts that are made calls that i made the right back we get, and then something very basic when so in response to a board appeal, so let the boardmember know that it happened so that they can say thank you and avoid the embarrassment of running into the person who is waiting to be thanked and the boardmember doesn’t realize the person made a gift, right? So keeping the board members up to date on what’s happening in terms of their contacts and overall for that monitoring function is really critical. All right, so the running of these reports, right for right? For the for the board, right? And it’s it’s, partly the staff celebrating with the board to say, hey, your donor came back this year with an even bigger gift when you give me a call and say thanks that’s. Great, yes called. All right, um, i have to talk. Ah, i’d like to talk about ah, an organization sponsors non-profit radio generosity siri’s and i don’t know do doo ahh and your strategic use of events, teo do runs and walks ever ever figure in so some of our groups do do walks, we don’t get involved in any of the you’re not planning on you know, but but we’ll ask the question, you know, do you have a broad enough constituency base to have confidence that you’ll recruit enough people to make a walk or run successful? You know, you need zack, i need a word pretty well established network, and you need people who are willing to be the cheerleaders to bring people together in that, for instance, for organizations that can’t generate hundreds of unity’s hundreds. If you’re gonna have your own stand alone event for organization that can’t do that generosity, siri’s generosity, siri’s dot com their sponsor and they host multi charity five k runs and walks i am seed one of theirs last november, little chilly day. But it’s still great fun. There were about a dozen charities they had about no two hundred or so to fifty runners. Among these dozen charities, one hundred thirty, one hundred forty thousand dollars was raised, and it was great fun. And none of the charities could generate enough support. Enough participants on their own. But collectively through generosity siri’s they had this great event and generosity. Siri’s does all the all the back end work of licensing. We were in what’s the huge park in brooklyn that take part. We’re provoc piece of problem back park. They got the licence to get the port a johns to get the amplification and the big start the starting gate way in the finished gateway. And, um, it’s all done. Very smart, great. And its collective that’s. Quite if you would like tio. See if it makes sense for you to be a charity partner of generosity. Siri’s do what i do. You know, i like to talk to people. Pick up the phone. Devlin is the ceo and he’s at seven. One eight five o six. Nine, triple seven if you prefer generosity siri’s dot com a l s i’m keeping this video on the top of my sight tony martignetti dot com for a third week because i want people to get off a less is back let’s give them a chance to see how they’re going to manage this enormous growth. And next week we’re going to hear directly from the ceo and president of l s she’s going to be my guest. Barbara newhouse, we’ll hear first hand how they plan to manage this enormous spike in donors and dollars. The show next week is going to be a google plus hang out on air. We’re doing it from the chronicle of philanthropy offices in washington that’s where l s is that’s where the chronicle it obviously and that’s where i’ll be, because i’d like to be face to face with with barbara new house so you will join the google plus hang out on air at tony martignetti dot com that’s the place to view. We are definitely taking questions for barbara throughout the hour if you know how hang out on air works, you just type in your questions if you don’t, we’ll explain at the beginning, so very exciting show. Next week and very different format you come here to, well, not don’t come here, come to tony martignetti dot com and that’s, where you’ll watch the hang out on air with a less is president and ceo barbara newhouse, and that is tony take two for friday, twenty sixth of september thirty eighth show of this year thank you, greg, for indulging me little pleasure. Um, let’s, let’s, talk about let’s continue the staff support training. I’m glad you brought it up. Of course that’s one of krauz defectives great loves as something we provide, which is so few people come to a board with either fund-raising experience or a positive fund-raising experience, right? We’re lucky if we can recruit someone who’s been a great fundraiser for their alumni association or another non-profit but most often we’re recruiting people who are willing and interested, but i haven’t had the chance to fund-raising a systematic way before and of course, like everything else that we need to master in our lives, we need some training and information so staff arranging for training to make boardmember more confident is a great idea and cause effective could be the real happy that makes you happy to be a provider of such training latto onboarding persuasive years of experience, i could see you moving and motivating boardmember toe task that they’re not comfortable with at the beginning of your of your so i’d say it’s a little bit like arthur murray’s dance studio, we paint the steps on the floor, we get people toe awkwardly, try those steps and it gets more and more fluid until they discover you know what? I really like this so let’s, move them. Tio recruiting yes, talk some about recruiting to the development committee, so we have our board who were responding specifically for this committee, so i always take the extreme position not often embraced by every board. Every new member of the board should be placed on the development committee, plus one other committee. So i like to give the message right, it’s just a place to start. Absolutely because one people are at their highest point of enthusiasm, usually when they’re joining aboard two they don’t know better, right? If the culture of the board is a few people carry all the weight for fund-raising we don’t want them to sink to the lowest. Common denominator after going to a few meetings, so let’s grab them while they’re hot and put him on that development committee and then if you’re organized enough maybe to serve on one other committee as well, so that would be my preferred position. But i would say, of course, anyone who’s got prior experience ought to be recruited because they can help with the planning function and be creative about how the board can be fund-raising but really, what it really is a question of there’s someone have to desire to give it a try, and if you’re providing the tools and the training than anyone who’s willing ought to be added to that committee and bring in that new energy, can they also be mentors? Now they’re new board members? Can they be mentor? They’ve got what has the Numbers and actually 1 of the great ways to turn around the culture of a board that has gotten a little stagnant on fund-raising or has never stepped up is to bring in some fresh blood who are able to say when i did it over here, this is what worked and really help revitalize that culture i’ve even seen that work with some organizations that have young professional boards or junior boards where the enthusiasm of those young folks actually ah, crosses over and helps the established board embrace some goals with greater energy infecting them. They’re like their youthful energy that’s, right and vigor that’s right? Who do we look forward to lead our development committee? That’s a great question, so good question forty minutes, that’s a pretty good now they’re evolving right chair the development committee. You want someone who’s, a good cheerleader who relates well to other board members can communicate well, they don’t have to be the most generous giver on the board or necessarily the greatest getter. In fact, you probably don’t necessarily want the wealthiest person on your board to behead development committee because other people will look and say, well, they have the resource is of course they do. It seems effortless. You don’t identify with the right, right? So you want someone who’s really out there showing their commitment to the organization, but both by e-giving stretch gift themselves and out there asking widely in their circles durney ideally, that person would have prior experience, but it’s really the effort? They’re willing to put in that counts the most in their willingness to be a role model, because and this is true for all bored fund-raising if you’re not a giver yourself, it’s very hard to ask others to do something you’re not doing beyond that. I think it’s great to get experienced people for that mentoring and butting up, they can help with the training. They can help build the confidence. So you do want a cadre of people who are comfortable around the fund-raising conversation and who are well regarded by other board members so that they can induce them to join that conversation. Let’s, have a body check? Yes, the buddy system could we say more about how the development committee is mentoring and buddying with shirts? Are what’s the idea that you’re providing focus on fund-raising gear around and you have somebody on the development committee who really comes to understand what’s going on in the mind of their fellow boardmember who their networks are can be a thought partner and how to reach them. I can understand where their fears or inhibitions are and helped develop ways of overcoming them also hears what do you need to be successful? Would you like practice in making the elevator speech? Would you like to be paired with someone who’s going out, making an athlete, see how it works? Do you want a staff person to join you? And you’re asking because you’re not confident that you could answer detailed question about the organization’s program so that someone who can check in and ah, that the boardmember can reveal themselves to without exposing the fact that they might feel like to write about a topic and facing the professional staff, that might be an important aspect. We have just a minute left, okay, i really would like to hear what it is that you love about the work that you’re doing with boards. Well, you know, we say that boards are the most important volunteers of any organization, so we work with so many fantastic organizations and missions and boards are the place where you see people who, despite busy lives, step forward to make these organizations successful, make incredible sacrifices are incredibly generous with their time and expertise. So it’s fantastic to be in a room with people who are thes chief cheerleaders as volunteers around the widest range of causes it’s very noble calling great going senior associate at cause effective on twitter, they are at cause effective, and greg on twitter is greg causevox greg cause you want to follow him. Greg, thank you so much. My pleasure. Thanks so much. Now the interview that i did at ntcdinosaur profit technology conference on ah, creative commons one o one with carly leinheiser welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of the non-profit technology conference and t c twenty fourteen we’re at the marriott wardman park hotel in washington, d c with me is carly leinheiser she’s, an associate at perlman and pearlman that’s, a law firm in new york city. And her workshop topic is share use remix an introduction to creative commons. Carly welcome. Thank you. It’s. A pleasure to have you. Thanks, it’s. Great to be here. Thanks. And thank you for taking time on a pretty busy conference day. What is creative commons that i think a lot of people have heard of and not so familiar with? Sure. So creative commons is itself a non-profit they were founded in two thousand won with a mission of making the basically making content. On the internet accessible, so they developed a suite of licenses, which are basic copyright licenses that allow creators, artists, authors to distribute work under one of these licenses, and that signals to anyone who might find their work that it’s freely available for use subject to certain different restrictions. So this is quite a service, really it’s a certain unorganised ation serving non-profits and making content available, right? I mean, they’re serving not only non-profits but sort of ah, the larger idea of basically the commons there, they’re making a easier to put more works into not exactly the public domain because they’re still under copyright but making more works freely available for anyone to use. So the idea is that right now, the way copyright works is any time that somebody creates a work it’s automatically subject to copyright, you don’t have to register it. You don’t have to put a notice on it if you’ve created a work it’s copyrighted on dso that’s what is known as the all rights reserved model and that’s what happens automatically so if you are an artist and you get benefit from distributing your photos online and having other people take them and incorporate them into their works. It’s hard to do that because somebody would have to seek you out and get individual written permission from you in order to do that. Otherwise they’d be infringing your copyrights. But most people’s experiences it’s incredibly easy to find content online that you can just, you know, screen. Grab our download and creative commons brings the law in line with that experience that it’s fine it’s easy to find content online, it’s easy to incorporate it into new works. And so by with using these licenses, it makes it easy for people to know they have permission from the artist to do that. Do we need to know a little bit the basics of intellectual property law before we go to into too much detail? Well, i think that that sort of covers it so i could say copyright well, i could talk a little bit about it. Copyright is ah, is basically a bundle of rights that anybody who creates a creative work gets in their in their work. So you have a set of exclusive rights that you’re the only one that you khun the only one who can exercise those rights with respect to your work and um and then you can also assigned those rights or licenses rights out to other people. So you have the right to use the work to distribute it, to make copies, to make derivative works or a new work based on the original work, so that something like a translation or collage would be a derivative work and to license that out to other people. So what you’re doing with the creative commons licenses, you have your bundle of rights and you’re saying anybody can use my work. Anyone has access to my work. Andi anyone can exercise those same rights as long as with all creative commons licenses, you have to give attribution or credit s o you link back to the original work and then there’s certain other restrictions that are in some of the different licenses. Okay, on dh. Some of those different restrictions is get a little too technical. Know that’s that’s, sort of the heart of creative commons there’s. Six basic licenses. So all of them, including attribution requirements. So say i post a photo online and i license it under a creative commons attribution. License that means anybody who came across my photograph could take it, download it, use it, put it into a new work. All they have to do is give me attribution. So that means maybe linking back to my web page just putting my name on it. And i i would normally specify how i want to be attributed. So some of the other restrictions are share alike. Which means that i would license my photo under a creative commons attribution share alike license meaning anyone could take my photo, download it, use it, make a new work with it. But if they did that and distributed that new york new work, they’d have to release it under the same license. On this is a concept called the copy left and the ideas that i’ve created a work that someone else is used. And then now their work is also in the commons for anyone to use s o, for example, wikipedia’s content is licensed under c c it’s, cc by essays are creative commons attribution share alike license so anyone can use the content on wikipedia and incorporated into a new work. But then they have to also license it in the same way, so grows the body of work. Exactly. They’re two other restrictions. One is no derivatives, meaning you can download my work. You can share it or distribute it, but you can’t change it in any way, so i’m not allowed to make a new work based on it. So you’ll see this sometimes with some sort of reports that in the case of non-profits, maybe report that you’ve published on a particular policy issue, and you want that shared as widely as possible. But you don’t want people sort of taking accepts. Reinardy. Or, you know, photos, or maybe personal histories, things that, like you want shared sort of intact on dh. The last restriction is a noncommercial restriction, so that means anybody could use the work as long as what they do with it is for a non commercial purposes. Ok, thank you, little detail. But details, i think, are interesting. I think they are. You think they are. I think they are all right. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Oppcoll have you ever considered consulting a road map when you feel you need help getting to your destination when the normal path seems blocked? A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you, too? He’ll call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight, three that’s two one two, seven to one eight, one eight, three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com. We look forward to serving you. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. I’m christine cronin, president of n y charities dot orc. You’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. How do we how doesn’t know provoc about using creative commons? What do we need to do right xero assumes we create something. I understand we have a bundle of automatic rights, but we’re talking about now making it available under creative commons license. Sure. So if you want teo well, i guess i’ll start with how do you find works that you could better license? Okay? Because they think that’s a lot more people have experienced with searching on flicker, for example. So if you’re looking for save photographs to put on your website or incorporate into a brochure and you want to find a photo that’s, all you have to do is give attribution to the person who made it. You can go on. Flicker flicker has a search feature and also the creative commons website itself has a search feature where you can go in and specify what you want to do with the work, whether it’s going to be for commercial or non commercial purposes. O r all you want, you want the least restrictive license and you put in your search terms and it pops up. So when i was putting together my talk, i wanted to find pictures of cute cats because that’s, what people like to look at on a saturday morning esso i search for cute cats license under creative commons license and found a whole bunch as far as really seeing your work under creative commons license if you’re distributing it online, creative comments has a licensed chooser on their website, so you don’t even have to really know the technical restrictions you go in and you say, i want people to give me attribution. I want to allow derivative works or not if i allowed derivative works, i want them to be released center share, like license or not, and i’m ok or not with the commercial uses, and then creative commons tells you which license you’ve picked on degenerates thiss html code that you can embed on your site, which then makes your work searchable by license. Okay, you become part of the search results and and it generates a little button you can put on the work, so you’ll see in a lot of like footers of websites thiss you know this pages published under creative commons license in which one? Okay, now the search function sounds pretty. Easy finding finding going back to finding content. Pretty simple. Yeah, it’s really simple the the only risk is you want to make sure that that thing’s air correctly tagged so but it is really pretty intuitive and you khun search you can search flicker you khun search through google images i think that there are more and more search engines that are supporting a search by license, so it is really easy to use and in terms of releasing your own content, any restrictions on what that content is? Well, i mean, it’s basically anything that’s subject to copyright so you wouldn’t you use a creative commons license with se your trademark or something that was protected by patent law, not copyright law. It also doesn’t deal with model writes in photographs, so if you have a photograph that includes an image of a person, creative commons doesn’t really deal with that person’s right of publicity or protections that they get for being in the photograph. So there was actually a litigation over this issue where a company used a photograph that included an image of a person, and the photographer had released the image under creative commons license. But never secured the model rights s o the person in the image sued the company and ask them to stop using it. Okay, are there other other cases that air don’t necessarily mean litigation case? Maybe client examples? You know that air that interesting, that and somewhat, you know, instructive. Yeah, so, no, i don’t have any specific client examples. They do have some examples i found in researching for my talk. One of my favorites actually is the brooklyn museum, which is i live in brooklyn, so i have a lot of pride for the brooklyn museum. They do really interesting things with their they’ve done two very interesting things. One is that a lot of their collection, they made their collection searchable by license. So much of their collection is very old and in the public domain, so you can now search their collection online and see what’s in the public domain and use those images if you want, and i actually incorporated a few of their images into my presentation and where stuffs not out of copyright but they on the right, innit? They’ve released it under creative commons license so you can use some of the works in their collection, another interesting thing that they did was in connection with the show they did a few years ago, go called who shot rock n roll, which was a series of portrait it’s and photographs relating to rock n roll. They did a remix contest, so they had chris stein and believes his name from blondie put together a bunch of tracks that he released under a creative commons license. And then anybody could download those tracks, remix them, upload them and those tracks would again be really center creative commons license. And they picked a winner, and they’re all available on their website. Um, it’s really interesting. So it was this great way to engage with their community and sort of further their mission of, like, getting culture out to the public on really engaged people while completely avoiding the issue of having to get signed releases and have people wave their their rights or sign rights toe in their tracks that they made to the brooklyn museum. They were just available to use, which i think is a really interesting example of what you could do. So photo contest anything like that video as well, video yeah, absolutely. I think on a new tube, isn’t there? Ah, little pull down window, whether you want to use a have a standard creative commons license to your video yeah, i wouldn’t be surprised i’m not positive, but i think that sounds right. Ok, i think they have a three or maybe four licensing options, and one of them, i think, is standard creative commons license. Yeah, and actually, when i was uploading my slides, teo the ntc, they asked whether i wanted to release my slides under creative commons license or not, so they’re they’re on top of it. Excellent. Well, you know, i don’t know what teo asked specifically, but what more do you want to share that we haven’t talked about? Let’s see, i think i mean, one of the things that i think is most interesting for me is they think a lot of non-profits have have sort of limited experience using creative commons in looking for photos and things like that on flicker, but i think that there are a lot of great examples of non-profits really saying they’re content under creative commons license, so not only so the brooklyn museum is a good one, but and wikipedia is another one. There’s, another organization called teach aids that creative commons features it’s a case study on their site. They big, they make sort of educational health materials that are really sandorkraut of commons license so anybody can download materials from their sight, redistribute them on, and i think for non-profits that have any kind of educational mission thie idea that you could create these materials and then just release them out into the world and they would be freely shared and no one had to worry about, like, violating your copyright if they wanted to download a report or, you know, i know your rights pamphlet or health materials, those kind of things i think are really great uses for creative commons, particularly for non-profits that have a mission based on education, where you’re not worried about so much selling individual copies of your materials, but that the more you get the word out about your organization by distributing materials, you’ll get your name out donordigital here about you, and you don’t have to worry about the transaction costs of negotiating, you know? Oh, okay, that person could buy a copy to do this or that. So i think it’s one of the more interesting things, all right, i hope listeners will pay attention to a creative commons both in terms of their own you’re your own work and and searching for others as well. Sounds like it, sze i’ve learned a lot more about the community then thin. I knew. Thank you very much, carly. Yeah. Thank you for the pleasure. Carly leinheiser is associate perlman and roman. You’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of ntc non-profit technology conference twenty fourteen. Thanks so much for being with us. My thanks to everybody at the non-profit technology network and ten next week. Barbara newhouse ellis is president and ceo for the hour joined the hangout on air at tony martignetti dot com regular time one p m eastern. If you missed any part of today’s show, find it on tony martignetti dot com it’s, the store it’s, the center of universe you’re seeing this so all things emanate from there generosity siri’s and their charity support team that helps you in your fund-raising think about them for multi charity five k runs and walks generosity siri’s dot com seven one eight, five or six. Nine, triple seven our creative producers, claire meyerhoff. Sam liebowitz is our line producer. Shows social media is by julia campbell of jake campbell. Social marketing and the remote producer of tony martignetti non-profit radio is john federico of the new rules. Our music is by scott stein. You with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Go out and be great. I didn’t even think that shooting the ending. You’re listening to the talking alternate network. E-giving dahna cubine come. 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A little help can come in handy when choosing an alternate route. Your natal chart is a map of your potentials. It addresses relationships, finance, business, health and, above all, creativity. Current planetary cycles can either support or challenge your objectives. I’m montgomery taylor. If you would like to explore the help of a private astrological reading, please contact me at monte at monty taylor dot. Com let’s monte m o nt y at monty taylor dot com. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com way. Look forward to serving you. Talking. Hyre