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Laurence Pagnoni: Get To The Next Level
Laurence Pagnoni is author of “The Nonprofit Fundraising Solution.” Based on his work as an executive director and fundraising consultant, he has proven strategies to get you to the next level of fundraising revenue. (Originally aired November 8, 2013)
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Oppcoll hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m your aptly named host oh, i’m glad you’re with me. I’d be stricken with neff roma golly, if i had to pass the idea that you missed today’s show it’s actually never throw megally get to the next level. Lawrence paige nani is author of the next the non-profit fund-raising solution. Based on his work as an executive director and fund-raising consultant, he has proven strategies to get you to the next level of fund-raising revenue this originally aired on november eighth twenty thirteen i wish he would pronounce his name panjwani lorenzo panjwani on tony’s take two video from venice. We’re sponsored by pursuant full service fund-raising data driven and technology enabled, you’ll raise more money pursuant dot com let’s go with our first segment here is lawrence paige nani. I’m very pleased that lawrence paige no knees book and his work bring him to the studio. He has spent twenty five years in the nonprofit sector and was an executive director of three non-profits he’s been a faculty member at the gnu heimans center for philanthropy and fund-raising we’ve had guests from there. And the coach is a group of executive directors with the rutgers business schools institute for ethical leadership. His book is the non-profit fund-raising solution. Powerful revenue strategies to take you to the next level. Lorts back. Tony, welcome to the studio. Thank you so much. I’m glad to be here. It’s. A real pleasure to have, you know, i love having live in studio guest. It just makes it that much more special. Congratulations on the book, it’s. Just it’s out this month, right? Yes, just a few weeks ago. And and delighted it has a robust sales so far. Excellent. Very good for you. I think i have to ask you this. I’ve wondered about this since i first saw your name, which is years. Why isn’t it pan yanni wipe agnone. How did you i’m not martignetti why did you? Somewhere along the lineage, you went to pack no knee. Well, had that happened? It’s, my grand, my grandmother would like your question. It’s, lorenzo, antonio peggy oni that’s your your it’s like a little birdie operate you’re you’re ah, expression of it is accurate. And but, you know, in american vernacular gets paige. No knee. I hate that. I hate that your grandmother would love the pan uni i was a beautiful name. It is so operatic. Um, the non-profit fund-raising solution. What is the problem? Well, under capitalization of the sector plagues more than seventy seven percent of non-profits they have a vision, but they don’t have the money to implement it. And many organizations spend years on a plateau under two hundred fifty thousand dollars trying to execute their vision for some small non-profits ah, humble budget is more than adequate, and they’re doing good services and they are meeting their vision. So don’t mean to imply that you need money too. Do your work. There are amazing volunteer organizations, but for those organizations that that need money, i wrote the book in that spirit of trying to help them tio, to go to the next level which is such a ubiquitous question. I mean, i get that a lot on dh. I work only really in the plant giving and the charity registration niches. But even i am asked a lot, you know? How do we get to the next level? Can you help us get to the next level? So there are a lot of organizations that do want to go to increased fund-raising revenue it’s the number one question i get when i give seminars or public trainings, and somebody inevitably will wander up to that micah’s i say in the introduction, and and ask me, how do you get to the next level? And on the one hand, it’s a poetic question, but on the other hand, it’s for my sensibilities, it’s a business question with mathematical methods behind it, and the book tries to explain that if you get your leadership understanding the vision for what the next level looks like if the board supports that vision, if you think about hyre level strategies and you work on changing the culture of your organization so that the organisational development matches that vision that’s the foundation there’s four aspects are the foundation for going to the next level, and then the rest is tactical most fund-raising is tactical. The strategy comes from the organization, and we’re gonna have time to talk about the organisational development as well as the strategies and tactics were because i love that we have the full hour together, so the symptoms of this problem are mean, ah, event to event fund-raising or maybe sole source revenue streams? Yeah, most foundation grants have ah, three year limit. There are some exceptions to that, of course, places like the robin hood foundation, which see themselves as long term partners. Um, but event to event without any cash reserves and some organizations just go year two year like that and and and make do and with a little bit of luck and and providence, they they squeak by, but it’s hard to plan having an impact on your mission and on the sector, the field of service, if you will, that you’ve chosen. If you really want to help at risk kids, i have a better chance getting into college or getting the right on the right employment that’s a great example because it’s exactly it’s for you you do have to plan for years that’s a life cycle of a child and if you’re you know, as you say, just getting by year to year, how can you plan for that child’s future? You can’t. You can’t plan for your own that’s, right? Um, do you think that since we see such a reliance on events, i have a theory, i don’t, but you khun you’re free to disagree that the reliance on events is so that people can avoid what they fear, which is having to sit across the table from someone and looked him in the eye and ask them for a gift. Well, it’s, funny as best as i understand it and i’m always learning events were the history of them goes back to having an opportunity to thank your individual donors. They weren’t actually fundraisers unto themselves, and then they course morphed into that when in fund-raising when the event ah, is linked to individual giving and get in to get the individual giving program, they always raise more money, because the point is that the twenty percent of your individual donor base who gives eighty percent generally on your revenue since the recession, we see it’s maybe seventy, thirty um they need to be talked to individually and thoughtfully, and having tough conversations with donors is part of that territory, and i think a lot of people are, um, are shy about that. Money, of course, is one of the great taboos of life and so it’s fraught with emotional issues um, you allude to cem cem research done by stanford about the dominant revenue source? We’ll flush that after us. Sure. Well, you often hear people say that they need a diversified revenue base. Yes, and i’ve heard that for years as a fundraiser, and as in the former executive director, i used to worry about how much time and energy that talkto have more than one or two revenue streams. So a few years ago, stanford university ah did research on one hundred and forty hundred forty one non-profits that that had gotten over the fifty million dollar mark annual budget, what they discovered was a surprise that those organizations generally had a dominant source of revenue and possibly a secondary source of revenue and wasn’t as diversified as smaller non-profits but they also said that smaller non-profits still needed to diversify until they got to that plateau ah, when or they got to that level, when they could break through for a dominant source of revenue. And the reason this is interesting is that those non-profits that got over fifty million, they knew everything there was to know about that dominant source of revenue, if it was individual giving say, for example, habitat for humanity? Their dominant source of revenue is individual giving, followed by in-kind donations followed by foundations. They knew everything there was from about individual giving from ah, there first acquisition to plan giving and the whole continuum within those two ends. Yes, um, we are going, tio take a break and we’ll of course continue with lawrence, and we’ll talk a little more about the the inflexibility that we’re talking about now and that sort of tradition of of dominant source giving. But then we’re gonna move on, and we’re going to talk about what it takes for the organization, too develop within before he can get to the next level. So hang in there. You’re tuned to non-profit radio tony martignetti also hosts a podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy fund-raising fundamentals is a quick ten minute burst of fund-raising insights published once a month. Tony’s guests are expert in crowdfunding, mobile giving event fund-raising direct mail and donor cultivation. Really all the fund-raising issues that make you wonder am i doing this right? Is there a better way there is? Find the fund-raising fundamentals archive it tony martignetti dot com that’s marketmesuite n e t t i remember there’s, a g before the end, thousands of listeners have subscribed on itunes. You can also learn maura, the chronicle website philanthropy dot com fund-raising fundamentals the better way. Duitz welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Lawrence paige nani is with me. He is the author of the non-profit fund-raising solution. So before the break, we were talking a little about thiss dominant source so they knew their dominant source and maybe a secondary source very well. So it’s so it’s not so bad. Teo teo, be focused that way. No. Ah, it turns out that that that there are different levels in every revenue source of from an average level two quite skilled level. What they had a have, of course, in their dominant source of revenue was they had to have deep and abiding expertise. Ah lo, staff turnover amongst the fund-raising staff was very important for those organizations because the institutional memory of with their donors had to be preserved. It’s called development for a reason it’s a developmental process. So if you’re walking the walk with a donor through their lifetime of giving, if they get comfortable with a fundraiser, the chances of that fundraiser being able to raise more money are much higher now. Of course, that’s that’s ah juxtaposed to the chronicle philanthropies article this past year, which showed that the turn of the dissatisfaction amongst fundraisers with their organizations was extremely high. Yes, and i we talked about that on the show. Did you? Yeah, i was distraught to hear that. And because fund-raising is a noble profession, and when it’s not respected, the process is not respected than people expect returns too fast, or they expect the fundraiser toe come in with donors ready to g o without having to cultivate them for your mission. And these are very irrational ideas dominate the conversations around fund-raising but it’s called development for a reason, and those non-profits that god above fifty million that had a dominant source were they had a patients to their culture, and they respected the cultivation process and they closed, you know, on on major gifts much more frequently than those that didn’t have that culture. What was the first organization that you were executive director of? Oh my, it was a soup kitchen for the homeless in richmond, virginia, and i’m guessing there are a lot of lessons you learned there. Oh, my goodness, i on the and in the book i tell the story of how i forgot about the board. No, i didn’t. I didn’t technically forget about board. I attended board meetings. I prepared my reports. I i i had the board book ready and met with the committee’s when they needed me. But in my soul they were superfluous. And what was really important was getting the programme metrics right, and getting the fundraising going. But i came to see how the board in my second executive directorship here in new york at harlem united i came to see how the board it could give the organization a gift that the ceo cannot, which is the gift of longevity and survivability. And that great word that we use in this sector. Sustainability, um, so in your ah experience in was in west virginia, richmond in virginia, at the soup kitchen. Were you sort of dragging the board along as you as you worked on the metrics that were important to you? Or you would just take kicking them? Was mohr lifestyle okay? So clicking from behind? Well, there was the italian radio, the italian right, more likable bull in a china shop. But ah, the urgency was, of course, that homelessness was extremely bad. The single room occupancy. Hotels in richmond, virginia, were closing, ah, at a rapid rate, and the homeless shelters were were increasing. So we had a a profound sense of urgency, and then right in the middle that the aids epidemic was becoming clearer to us. And so there was this sense of urgency, and we in fact founded three different organizations. Ah, as spin offs to to our non-profit but i came to see the value of board leadership and bored endorsement and and to recruit people that did add value, not everybody is meant to be a boardmember and i had made the mistake of just recruiting volunteers that had a passion for the board without necessarily having the business, talents and skills that i needed to fulfill the mission that we were, we were aimed at over ten to twenty years, and we’re going to talk later on about one of the opportunities that you’ve identified leadership counsels for maybe the type of people that you’re talking about, not suitable for the board, but have interest and passion. And so there may be another role for them. Yes, so let’s talk about the board now the board has to buy-in it’s essential at the board be developed before the organization is going to get to the next level? Oh, yes, ah, a lot of ceos inherited inherit aboard when they take a job that isn’t necessarily up for the task, and they wait on the sidelines for something magical to happen with that board, and they don’t necessarily see themselves as an intervening variable to bring the board to the next level themselves. But i recommend in my book that they do see themselves as part of the change process for the board by meeting personally with board members by recruiting people who have the skills and talents that they be delighted to have in leaders and that’s. Not all. They’re not always easy processes. They take time, but you’re trying to develop a shared vision on the board, exact between the executive leadership and the the ceo executive director and the and the volunteer leadership that’s, right? This could take a long time to align a vision it can, but there are plenty of examples where it happens rather fast. I mean the board no share one the board in richmond, virginia. The board of harlem united here in new york. They were united around the being thought leaders in the field of of ah, innovative health care for people who fell outside the health care system, the homeless and indigents. And they they i saw their revenue streams from the government, both federal and state, as needing to be reformed so that they could get the funds that were needed. For example, in nineteen ninety one there were no article, twenty eight healthcare, primary care, organised clinics for people living with aids. They were only the peruse of mental health. So what the board did with the executive staff leadership is they formed a statewide organization called the adult they healthcare coalition, and they changed the way the revenue stream were structured so that article twenty eights could include primary care for people living with aids. Article twenty eight is a federal state of new york state state health. S o that you could receive third party medicare. Reimburse oka okay, it’s, an amazing revenue stream, extremely stable. And it helped people keep people out of hospital emergency rooms so you can provide care at a much lower rate. So sometimes revenue streams have that level of complexity to them and you need a board that could understand the thinking behind them, and sometimes revenue streams are easier to understand. I mean, i think that’s why people often gravitate to foundation grants, they can look at a foundation’s website, they could understand the application process, and they throw there their hat in the ring to see if there are going to be, you know, lucky. Let zoho focus on again the achieving this shared vision across the board, so it certainly takes place in inboard recruitment board meetings and month after month, i mean what’s the what’s, the executive director’s role in trying tow, align the board with this with a common vision. Well, one of my great teachers, carl matthiasson, who was expert in board development hey used to say that a board will talk about anything and then he’d pause and he’d say, if you let them sound the point, the point was that the executive director, um, in in private dialogue with the board chair or the executive committee had to understand how to i’ll create an agenda that was consistent with where they were headed so that the organization didn’t waste a lot of times. Often times, you know, can you imagine tony in an average year, how many board meetings i sit in and listen? And so much of what boards talk about is not is inconsequential to their their deepest desires and goals, paperclips and on dh office supplies a cz one example, you know, thinking ok and no on the worst, and the executive director doesn’t want to be micromanaged, you know, you hear that language a lot. Of course. On the other hand, the executive director is under macro managing and thie opposite, of course, of micro management is macro management and macro management is about the strategic alliance of the vision and here’s, where you see a lot of executive director’s check out the and it leaves them vulnerable to being micromanaged. So i encourage in the book for the culture of a board to be robust and that the ceo see him or herself as part of a shaper or leader in that now lot of non-profit see, youse will read that and they would go well dahna you know, i’ve been doing of course i’ve been doing that for years, but when you look across the sector that’s not necessarily the habit off many ceos. They they often see themselves as just employees of the board and they and they abdicate that board leadership responsibility. Yes, even though they’re not the named chair of the board. But you’re advocating that they still have a strong role in board leadership that’s, right? And some ceos who were former program directors and then that he became the ceo. Ah, they’re not by their character change agents. So what i’m describing is a character of a ceo that’s really a change agent because i’m interested in high performing non-profits that that solve the social problem that they set out to solve, whether it be reducing teen pregnancies or having more kids get through the school system successfully or or adult employment, for example? Um, so those ceos of those kinds of organizations generally are changing agents and it’s not to say there’s something bad about the ceos are not it’s just that i think that they have to think about, ah, different place in the sector that might be better suited for their skills and talents. Okay, let’s, talk briefly about the gift of significance that you recommend from, um, from board members and you in the book, you have a calculation for what that ought to be boardmember boardmember and we don’t really have a chance to go through that calculation, but what? What? Why not a significant gift? Why? Why is it a gift of significance? Well, that’s a significant point, most boards think about board trust e-giving as giver get, um dahna and then there’s a third part of that is unsaid, which is give, get or get off, get off! So i never liked that, and i taught at the united way here in new york city for many years, i taught their board seminar and and did the given get policies and there’s wisdom to that, and i’m not opposed to give and get policies, but i think there’s a ah much more thoughtful way to engage the process, which is to have a conversation about a gift of significance. What for you when you look at your philanthropic giving in the past few years, given your current income, what is a significant gift that stands out amongst all your, um, you’re you’re you’re giving and the reason that this is a particularly good approach for trustee is that a trustee is stepping up in a leadership capacity toe inspire other donors to give by their giving, and they have to see the connection between how they think about they’re giving and what they want the donors of the organization to do. Because the development director or the vice president, institutional advancement or the ceo needs to say my trustees have stepped up, they’ve made leadership gifts one hundred percent a hundred percent they khun cumulatively give um, you know, twenty six thousand seven hundred fifty three dollars, i’m that precise when i calculate the cumulative giving of aboard and reported back to donors and the donor’s often laugh, but i’d rather give them the real numbers to know that this is a real process if you’re if their boat donors of your trustees on your board, that can’t give a gift of significance, that’s not sure everybody can give a gift or significance. I mean, i’ve had its what’s significant to them. Exactly. I’ve had consumers of services that that social work, term consumers or program members on the boards that i’ve worked at, and and i’ve used the same principle with them it could. Be five dollars could be fifty dollars, but for them, it’s a significant gift and it’s in phrasing it that way is a gift of significance. It captures the energy that we’re looking for around thinking about being a fund-raising leader and of course, ideally too from time to time, you want to ask the board to stretch beyond their normal giving, which is when you’re in a campaign or ah, special drive or there’s an anniversary, things like that. So continuing with some of the strategies that you recommend you like, like parlor gatherings over what’s, a parlor gathering could be in an office conference room could be in your living room. Ah, parties with a purpose is that is the general frays, and the purpose is the benevolence that the party ah it’s, not a party for a party sake it’s a party for a purpose and the purpose is to sponsor and endorse and give money to the charity that is is the primary focus. They’re ninety minute gatherings. I describe the actual methods and rollout and is very user friendly chapter but ah lot of organizations keep waiting for that moment when they’re going to go. To the next level and fund-raising courses of practitioners art so here in the parties where the purpose you see avery practical method that you could roll out in two to three months, sixty to ninety days. In fact, one of the smaller non-profits that listens to your radio program read the book their whole development committee. They’re all volunteers. Well, i love them because they’re listening. Yes, i don’t care what they do fund-raising wise. Frankly, lawrence, i don’t care if they bought your book or not. They’re there listening to the show that you could stop there. I love them. Whoever you are, we love you. You know who you are. We love you. I’m sorry. I know it’s true. And they they are going to do a party when they called. I said i’ll give you a free as i do anybody, i give anybody of free forty minute phone conversation about questions they have about the book. Or i also come into organizations to meet with the development team or aboard team anyway. So i gave them a free consultation and they wanted to do a party with a purpose in the future. And i said, oh, no, we’re going to have it before the year. And we’re doing it now. And they’re going to be doing it right after between christmas and new year’s. Excellent. Excellent, indeed. Love lawrence paige, nani this’s uh, thiss was this a very, very good show? He’s, you should get this book if you don’t have it non-profit fund-raising solution. You ought to tony’s take two and more with lawrence coming up first, i’m going to chat about pursuant because they have a tool called billboard, and it helps you manage your communications. Naturally, you are multi-channel email landing pages, micro sites, donation forms, et cetera. The social networks don’t separate those integrate. I thought of that myself. I think i might, you know, it’s been a few weeks business since i’ve been in the studio because i was away, but i believe i said that a couple weeks ago don’t separate into great because billboard is integrated communications management puts all these tools and that all these channels together into one management tool and not only management but also analytics so that you know which of your channels our most effective because after well, depending on how many campaigns you do and and how engaged you are might be after three months, you want to look back, but if not if you’re not that prolific, maybe after a year. Or so you want to look back and see what’s been the most effective? The analytics will answer that then you find tune and you improve and you raise more money or get more volunteers or have more successful events, whatever it is you’re engaging for, you’ll do it better with the unified, integrated management and the analytics that go with billboard. So if you want to improve your engagement, your outreach, check out billboard at pursuant dot com really pursuing is a perfect sponsor for small and midsize non-profits our listeners obviously say it all the time because they have these tools that you can use separately online or, you know you can choose ah, larger suite of tools together or at the highest level, you know, they actually do on site, you know, campaign consulting, live bodies, helping you manage your campaign, so but you don’t have to go that far, so i just think they’re perfect, you know, sort of ala carte and i love the ceo trent chant ryker has a background in non-profits and recognizes the challenges that small and midsize shops are facing around fund-raising and engagement. Pursuant, dot com i’ve got video from venice, the net cia. I was there last week. Oh my goodness! Ah, in fact, exactly this time last week, there are gondolier is in the background, so you got to check that out and i’m talking about how you keep your plans e-giving above water, you do it by cultivating and soliciting the right prospects. The video with the gondolier ears is that tony martignetti dot com and that is tony’s take two for friday, second of october thirty ninth show of the year. Let’s, get back to lorenzo panjwani let’s talk more about parlor gatherings. Lawrence, you do is a very, very askew, said user friendly chapter you have a lot of very robust advice, and i’ve always liked the idea of a small, intimate gathering, so we’re going to focus on my prejudice for these types of events, not to the exclusion well here on the show, and we don’t have a chance to talk about everything all the strategies that you have in the book, but the book is full of lots of fund-raising strategies i happen to like the i never heard them called parlor gatherings, but i like i like that idea. Um, who should host these thes parlor gatherings? Generally? There’s one one host who has a good network of friends, were colleagues, family members and in turn out twenty five to thirty people. Um, i’ve been it parties where the purpose parlor gatherings that have as much money as seventy five that’s a big parlour, yeah, but they have, you know, they’re people with big names, and they have big networks and s o mostly, the host is responsible for inviting the guests, mostly the host. Now, in some organizations where our host doesn’t feel that they could deliver twenty five to thirty, people, maybe they have a co host or i’ve done three hosts and each of them commit delivering, you know, ten people and and that’s worked very well, especially because they’ve had the support and partnership of two other people that they like and they’re going to do it together, and they see it as a ah fun thing to do. I love the fact that most of the the expense budgets on parlor gatherings are a couple hundred dollars. We don’t put out a lot of fancy food we use cheap. Wine or no wine at all, depending on the organization that always has to be thought through. Um, and we don’t spend money on trinkets or literature. Um, um if the if the host once, um ah, paper invitations as opposed to just using ah elektronik invitation service, like ping ah, the host then has to pay for the cost of that, not the organization. And, um and as i said, they are usually planned in sixty to ninety days. Okay? And you want you want nobody to talk for more than five minutes? That’s, right? Who? You should talk. Well, it has to be somebody. Ah, that that people can emotionally connect with generally a client or consumer who is prepared to deliver, um and it’s comfortable talking to a group of those could be very tender, intimate moments when it’s, when it’s someone who’s benefiting from the services of the organization. That’s, right, it’s seen i’ve seen tears in in colleges, scholarship recipients. But the cause is something causes you mentioned run much more deeply even than education. Yeah, i people who have healed from years of recovery. People who have been supported in their process of coming out of jails and prisons, people who i have ah been through adoption processes, i mean, their stories are extremely powerful, and telling a story is what you need to help them work on and prepare for, so that they have some flare on some theatrics to it where the the audience makes eye contact with them, and that that they have good hand gestures and that they’re articulate and everybody, of course, has their own style. I’ve been where some climb i’ve been to some parties with a purpose where the clients are very studio vote j and they have a quiet manner, but nonetheless, your grandmother would appreciate it slipping little italian, italian and there you are, italian listeners. Ah, they’re they’re quieter in their presentation, but nonetheless still powerful because they prepared still very moving, very moving video is often good at larger events, but in smaller events ah, the intimacy of the smaller room gives gives good stage two to two personal witness who else should be talking? Well? The the some official from the organization of boardmember or volunteer or staff member ceo doesn’t have to be to say, you know, no, the ceo is more than happy, more than welcome to think of him or herself, but again in a high functioning fund-raising culture, everybody should be empowered to talk about the money and teo, talk about the money in a way that that other people get it and doesn’t have to be the ceo there. There’s a one of the stories i tell in the book is a first party with a purpose for a small agency in brooklyn substance abuse recovery agency. They never did any private fund-raising they’d always relied on government grants and their first time out, they raised twenty six, twenty seven thousand dollars. They had two clients tell their story and ah, boardmember, who never saw herself as a fundraiser, stood up and was crying after listening to the two consumers tell their story, and she burst out with a five thousand dollar pledge and somebody else in the room matched it, and none of that was prepared. But it was prepared conceptually because we do have a bias in who we invite, that we try to invite people that we know something about, that they have some means now we’re not. We’re not strict about that, but we do ask the question, ahn do seek people who have that some level of affluence now, a lot of smaller non-profits say right off the bat, i don’t know anybody, you know, with the level of affluence, and i say, okay, well, let’s work with what we have, and but amazingly they always find somebody who writes that eighty percent of the rooms check on dh rehearsing you like tio, you’d like to rehearse. These rehearsing is very important, you know, the penultimate example of steve jobs that before he passed away at at apple, his his launches of new products were legendary, right? That he practiced those for weeks six, seven weeks every single day of running the whole team through rehearsals and himself, and anything worth goat doing is worth practising foreign preparing well for so don’t think you could just, like, call the client up the night before and say, would you speak tomorrow at our, you know, party with a purpose? That’s not the way to do it? And what about the important follow-up to your parlor gatherings? Well, ah, part of the second speaker or the third speakers role is to ask for funds. And and ah, pledge form has handed out, and some people fill it out right there and it’s collected as people leave, and for those that don’t hand the pledge, forman follow-up is necessary first of all, follow-up is necessary for everybody to say thank you way we have a rule of sending out our thank you notes and forty eight hours ah, business hours, which a lot of non-profits find, you know, really? Ah, hi rule to meet, but we think it’s important that people get both paper and email, thank you’s, and they get a cumulative understanding of what happened at the party because a lot of donors are going to leave and they’re not going to know the cumulative results that they participated in that twenty six or twenty seven thousand or five thousand or twenty five hundred was raised whenever share that impact you want to share that impact and you want to be let people feel the good vibes of that they participated in, that they made it happen. And so the thank you notes need to go out the the results need to be go out by both female and paper and then of course the e-giving history needs to be recorded in your database and there’s no excuse for a non-profit whether they’re volunteer with no budget, not having a database, as i say in the book, you can go to e base dot or get a free database that was developed by the rockefeller family foundation at my website for the book the non-profit fund-raising solution dot com there’s links to free databases, or you could just use a good excel spreadsheet and stay organized or an access that a base that’s comes with your you know, your computer there’s no excuse thes days for you don’t have toe spend, you know, ten thousand a month with razors, edge or something? Thank you for sharing those resources to leadership councils we alluded to these earlier what’s the role of a leadership council. Well, a non-profit has a board that that worries about its governance. Generally we say that the executive staff is supposed to be worried about one, two, three years of management, and the board should be thinking about five to ten years. The pentagon, of course, has a seventy five year strategic plan, so they know where they’re going to. Be, i would like our sector to know a lot more about where it’s going to be, but no pat, no matter how powerful your board is, you still need mork community endorsement for your organization and the leadership council gives you that it’s a non governance structure. Some people call it honorary councils or advisory councils. I like the term leadership council because it’s, what we’re looking for, we’re looking for them to be leaders and sometimes those leaders khun step up and say things that your board can’t say, or your executive staff can’t say about your cause. And as we saw this pit last year or two years ago with planned parenthood, there were many people on its leadership council who spoke up in their defense where they’re bored, needed to keep ah quieter, acquired or voice so leadership councils are very important, and sometimes you put people on leadership councils who don’t want to do the heavy lifting of governance, and sometimes you put them on because you have good feelings about how they love your organization and you want to maintain that relationship, but they’re not appropriate for the board. So it’s a it’s a mix of characters, we’ll take a break for a couple minutes, keep talking about leadership councils and i’m going to do live listener love i gotta start with where i’m going to be next week. Mexico city, mexico welcome ola kato. I’m going to be there next week for opportunity collaboration, which used to be a sponsor of the show, actually staying over just overnight in mexico city and then flying the next day to x stop, where the opportunity collaboration unconference is going to be new york, new york live listener loved to you also to st louis, missouri, brooklyn, new york and wilmington, north carolina live listener love to each location each person forget the location the love goes to the person not to their office or their building or their block it’s to you heart to heart live listener love beijing beijing is frequent listening. Beijing thank you very much. Niehaus and seoul, south korea also so grateful for the loyalty coming from seoul on your haserot affiliate affections to our many affiliate listeners throughout the country at our am and fm affiliate stations and we’re going to have some new ones to announce. Give me a couple weeks we got some announcements coming up, but in the meantime, everybody who’s listening now from all our am and fm stations affections out to you and, of course, the all important podcast pleasantries for the over ten thousand people we know who listen, whatever device that whatever time, doing whatever activity podcast pleasantries to you, let’s, take a break, and then we go right back into lawrence paige nani like what you’re hearing a non-profit radio tony’s got more on youtube, you’ll find clips from stand up comedy tv spots and exclusive interviews catch guests like seth gordon. Craig newmark, the founder of craigslist marquis of eco enterprises charles best from donors choose dot org’s aria finger do something that or an a a me levine from new york universities heimans center on philanthropy tony tweets to he finds the best content from the most knowledgeable, interesting people in and around non-profits to share on his stream. 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To sign up, visit the facebook page for tony martignetti dot com. Oppcoll what is our leadership council going to do? I lied endorse for legitimacy, credibility there, there to say, we like these guys what they’re doing, we endorse and it there’s power by that association with their name, and they don’t even have to do anything just to have that happen. We do want people to do things on the leadership council. They’re generally a couple things. We want them to come to an annual gathering of the leadership council so that they could get their own personal update about the organization. Secondly, we want them to to meet with us individually, us being the development ofthis war, the executive office. We want to meet with them individually to talk about their own gift to the organization, plus their network of possibly doing guess what? Ah, party with a purpose for their network. So there’s a lot of in few inches integration of the tactics in part two of the book, while part one is all about the way you think about fund-raising part two is all about the the inter marriage of various tactics. For example, in a leadership council, i think i mentioned this in the plan giving chapter. You could have a leadership council just for the people who are part of the plane. Get me that there is a chapter devoted to plan giving their importance. Only reason. Lawrence’s here. We’re not talking about that chapter three. Only thing that drew me to the book. I read it from backward. I read. I read that chapter first. The plan giving is ah, well, many times non-profits overlook having a plan giving society for there the donors that that give through their bequests or their wills or insurance policies or whatever the mechanism and having a leadership council of your plan giving group is very important. Ah, there was a small client i worked with here in east haven, connecticut. The shoreline trolley museum. They’re in the in the midst of closing on a two million dollar campaign so that they could have proper buildings for their antique trolleys. They have one hundred antique trolleys which tell the story of the trolleys from the eighteen hundreds. Amazing place. My kids love it and the they never had paid attention to their legacy. There they’re playing e-giving ah, donors and we started to talk to them or and organized that group and they have a leadership council now off their plan giving donor and twenty, twenty one people joined the first year. And i think four five have joined the second year, and they were unsung people who had thought about e-giving for the future where i think you would know better than i. But something like a low seven percent of people think about a plan gift. Whereas in there course of their life, like eighty five or ninety percent of people think about giving. But upon their death, they generally just leave their money to their to their family. Yeah, there’s. Some small percentage of people that have, ah, charitable bequest in there will yes, when the leadership council is advocating an endorsing, who were they advocating in endorsing, too? Ah, to the press to other thought leaders conferences during the height of the aids epidemic, the leadership council that i put together at harlem united many of those leaders would would mention in their addresses about aids and howto compassionately respond. They would mention that they were on the honoree council of harlem united. It meant it meant legitimacy for them and for us that they would mention that it worked both ways you had ah, leadership council, you said in the book that had fifty five members? Oh, yes, what that sounds huge. Yes, and i had the same response to the ceo, and he turned around and said, but look at my mission, i’m i have to represent, you know, thiss whole county and there were, i don’t know twenty four, five smaller towns in this county, and he represented three sectors, not just the nonprofit sector, but government and business and real estate was a big factor of that. So he needed a large counsel, and he saw the wisdom of that, and he i actually had a staff member hired to manage that leadership council, and it brought him it was a wise move. Um, it brought him a lot of impact because he he didn’t neglect his leadership council. A lot of times leadership, council’s air started. I see i go in and, um, auditing and organization and i look at their letterhead, and i see i say, oh, you have an advisory council says here? Well, yeah, but not really learns i said, what do you mean? Well, we really don’t you know, that was a couple years ago, and it was so and so’s idea and and it’s just fallen by the wayside. You see there’s an example where the culture of the organization didn’t embrace the tactic tactics don’t raise money? Yeah, excellent on their own, they need a culture to nest in and if they’re if they’re if the tactic is in an organization where the where it’s loved and cared for it then produces results, so then they get the crazy idea that, oh, well, the leadership council never really did raise much money for us, totally disassociating themselves from lack of developing it and creating a plan for it. At harlem united, our leadership council was reviewed every year, and the plan was updated and revised and evaluated, and that was brought to the boardmember that the board? I’m sorry at a board meeting, we we always had cochairs for the leadership council, male and female, pretty consistent about that for capital campaigns, male and female leaders of the campaign cabinet and those two leaders i would invite to come in and give a state of the union of the our leadership council to the board and it was, and the board members would go to the annual gathering of the leadership council. The board members were asked to do that. And so there was nice synergy and harmony there no competition. We have just about a minute and a half before to wrap up, and so i want to spend that time asking what it is that you love about the work that you do well, fund-raising is a noble profession and it’s a bridge builder between the idea that you have that will make the world a better place and the money you need to actualize the program. And so the methods of fund-raising are build that bridge, and and you love building bridges, and absolutely one of my old teachers used to say, if you build bridges don’t don’t be surprised when people walk on them or walk over you, but nonetheless fund-raising is that bridge between the non-profits idea and the reality of making it happen? Lots of very good ideas in the book it is the non-profit fund-raising solution powerful revenue strategy is to take you to the next level. Lawrence paige nani lawrence’s l a u r e n c e panjwani perfect. Thank you so much for being guests. Been a pleasure. I’ve been delighted to be here. And i wanna shout out just quickly to all by blogged readers. About forty, five hundred of them raise your block non-profit fund-raising solution dot com and you can sign up there to be on the block. Outstanding. Thank you again. Thank you. Yes, thank you, lorenzo. So more live. Listen, love while we were doing it the last time a couple of countries checked in india live listen love to you and and tokyo tokyo loyal listeners thank you very, very much konnichi wa. If you missed any part of today’s show, find it on tony martignetti dot com where in the world else would you go next? Week’s show claire meyerhoff is with me for our discussion of your plant e-giving legacy society hint. We don’t really like the phrase legacy society pursuant full service fund-raising you’ll raise bags more money i’m not talking about those little court bags that you put your three ounce shampoo in when you fly. I’m talking about duffel bags like the marines carry onto those c one thirties when they’re going overseas. Filled with money pursuant dot com. Our creative producer is claire meyerhoff. Sam liebowitz is the line producer. Shows social media is by susan chavez. Susan chavez. Dot com on our music is by scott stein, thank you for that information. Be with me next week for non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Go out and be great. Buy-in you’re tuned to non-profit radio. Tony martignetti also hosts a podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy fund-raising fundamentals is a quick ten minute burst of fund-raising insights, published once a month. Tony’s guests are expert in crowdfunding, mobile giving event fund-raising direct mail and donor cultivation. Really, all the fund-raising issues that make you wonder, am i doing this right? Is there a better way there is? Find the fund-raising fundamentals archive it. Tony martignetti dot com that’s marketmesuite n e t t i remember there’s, a g before the end, thousands of listeners have subscribed on itunes. You can also learn maura, the chronicle website philanthropy dot com fund-raising fundamentals the better way.