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Oppcoll hello and welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent on your aptly named host we have a listener of the week texas state chaplains they have fire chaplains and law enforcement chaplains, the grand pooh bah of the chaplain’s doug pruitt tweeted, this is what he said. Is there a twelve step program to help me with the addiction of listening to the show? Love it beautiful music to my ears. My heart flutters for six months on that. So are we treating back and forth? And i did have to admonish him that theft of non-profit radio content is a sin, but i absolved him because he did profess they’re texas state, chaplin’s dot or ge and at texas chaplin’s, thanks for loving non-profit radio you cowboy hat wherein god men. Congratulations on being our listener of the week oh, i’m glad you’re with me. I’d suffer the embarrassment of live over jh in if you left me left me with the idea that you missed today’s show the trump implications with one hundred days of experience on saturday tomorrow, what does the administration look like for non-profits in the arts? Legal services, community development, healthcare, et cetera. How about foundations? What is your board mead to think about? Ruth mccambridge is editor in chief at non-profit quarterly and she’s with me for the hour on tony’s take two sexual harassment in non-profits we’re sponsored by pursuant full service fund-raising data driven and technology enabled, you’ll raise more money pursuant dot com, and by we be spelling supercool spelling bee fundraisers. We be e spelling dot com what a privilege to welcome ruth became used to the show she’s president and edited editor in chief of the non-profit quarterly, her background includes forty five years of experience in non-profits, primarily in organizations that mix grassroots community work with policy change beginning in the mid nineteen eighties, roof spent a decade at the boston foundation non-profit quarterly is at non-profit quarterly dot or ge and at np quarterly. Ruth mccambridge, welcome to the show. Thank you. I’m glad to be here. Tony it’s a pleasure to have you, ruth i’m glad we could work this out and you could spend the hour with me. Thank you so much. Uh, thank you. Just a day after the election. Thie editors. That non-profit quarterly. Published four things non-profits must do the day after a trump victory that was november ninth and you were recommending advocacy strategies and creating collaborations and greater engagement on and also you said, don’t turtle up fight for your vision now, one hundred days in how do you feel about those things? Lorts i think we were right on the mark, i think that was exactly what we needed to dio and, you know, this has been a funny experience to cover the non-profit sector during this period because i think, you know, putting this in perspective, i feel like there was a lot of success in the previous five or ten years in many of the issues that a lot of the non profit sector advocates on. So you think about issues of climate and immigration and race, race, racial justice, you know, all of those issues were kind of, you know, they were kicked onto a field with a very aggressive opposing force very quickly. And so, in my opinion, if it ferg non-profits what, what their ace in the hole is is the ability to organize communities, too pose alternative visions, teo what’s being maybe proposed it. By government and by corporations. So, you know, not profits to a large extent represent the best interests of their communities. And if you don’t have a base, you there’s really essentially nothing you khun dio, if you have a base there’s a lot you can do. And if you have the base of twenty organizations who feel the same way you d’oh there’s an awful lot you could do and i think that’s all been really proven out in the last couple months. There’s been enormous. I’m just a what was just a day after the day after the inauguration. I think the inauguration was a friday. And then on saturday, with the women’s marches throughout the throughout the world and i was at the arms of the one in d c it was enormous. The one in here in new york was enormous. And that was just starting the same day. That was the same day you published four things non-profits must do and its continued its just continued. Since then, it has been almost breathtaking. Toe watch what people are doing. I think for a long time we’ve been talking about some of the principles of what we’re now doing and some of the possibilities that were in front of us, but in terms of really taking the, you know, tools and our areas of strength and mobilizing that, i think non-profit you have done and absolutely awesome job so that you’ll see people mobilizing across states and across fields and really kind of putting together constituencies that are large enough to actually make a difference. You know, i think you were right on point with your four recommendations from that that november ninth article and and as we’re talking, i just, you know, just take off the examples, the the reaction to the to the well, you want to call it a muslim ban or where you want to call it immigration reform attempts, but the times to the march for science just within the past week or two on dh very local, um, organizing as well, it’s it really it really has been quite it’s, actually quite uplifting and sort of unfortunate that we’re going through it that we need to that we feel we need to but nobody’s, you know, people are not turtle ng up the way you the way you recommended they not on november ninth, right? Yeah, i think i think that’s right? And, you know, you’ll see behind any of these movements don’t necessarily mention the names of the many non-profits that have been involved in them, you will see the fingerprints of, you know, just tens and sometimes hundreds of non-profit so i was looking at the at the decision that the judge made the other day the federal judge made about about really ah, enjoining the trump administration from punishing sanctuary cities buy-in wide by withdrawing federal funding, well, that suit was brought not just by the county, the santa clara county and the city of san francisco, but also from a number of associations non-profit associations across the state. S o they signed on to that effort as an amicus brief, and in almost every bit of the resistance, you will find it anywhere from ten to hundreds of non-profits involved. Okay, so it’s been it’s been very interesting to watch? We’re going to take our face first break, ruth, and when we come back, we’ll talkinto talk about some of the different sectors arts, education, legal services, some of the winners and losers in this first hundred days. We’ll talk a little about foundations, so everybody stay with us, you’re tuned to non-profit radio. Tony martignetti also hosts a podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy fund-raising fundamentals is a quick ten minute burst of fund-raising insights, published once a month. Tony’s guests are expert in crowdfunding, mobile giving event fund-raising direct mail and donor cultivation. Really, all the fund-raising issues that make you wonder, am i doing this right? Is there a better way there is? Find the fund-raising fundamentals archive it. Tony martignetti dot com that’s marketmesuite n e t t i remember there’s, a g before the end, thousands of listeners have subscribed on itunes. You can also learn maura, the chronicle website, philanthropy dot com fund-raising fundamentals the better way. Oppcoll welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Ruth that’s, the just charity navigator, had something very interesting. I got my inbox just within the past few days, some of the some of the big gains in terms of fund-raising now this is this is just fund-raising from the charity navigator site, so maybe not representative overall, but but from the charity navigator site donations to the up eight thousand percent, the seven southern poverty law center, up fourteen hundred percent planned parenthood up a thousand percent environmental defense fund, up five hundred percent. Those are some, you know, they’re cutting across sectors, and, uh, this is some pretty astonishing numbers. People are people are individuals are responding, i think, that’s one of the really remarkable things is that people knew exactly who they had to give to as a cz mainstay organizations nationally. Um, so we have, you know, that the enormous amounts of money flowing towards the oil, you and some very creative ways they’re, you know, people decided to implement rage e-giving so that every time they heard another stupid thing, you know, that was coming at them, that didn’t feel good about that they could just basically press a button and make a donation. I mean, it was it was, you know, people were creating aps and, um, putting up phony websites and directing it all of the donations to the you and i mean, there there was a lot of playing around online that was aiding in those donations. Um and, you know, personally, i am grateful that they that they understood who they trusted enough to be able to give two on that national level. What we do not know yet is how that kind of giving to national organizations is re being reflected in at the local levels. For instance, our local environmental will justice groups getting, um, seeing more money are local legal services, office office is being protected the way they need to be those kinds of things that really do you know, because all all of what’s been done is being is being done in networks, and those include not just large organizations but a lot of small local organizations. So, you know, i’m very curious to see where that’s going. Ok, you mentioned rage giving. I hadn’t heard about that that’s ah, that’s. Brilliant, though. Yeah, that was attractive. A constructive response. Rage e-giving exactly. Yeah. Okay. We’re touching on legal service is a little bit let’s. Go. I do want explore some of the individuals sectors with you. Um, what are you seeing around legal services? Immigration? What do you see? Well, it’s, you know, it’s been a very confusing scene. I mean, for the immigration groups, trump’s attempts to halt immigration. Um it was threatening to cut off their money if he had cut off the money, even even suspended it for a while. Those organizations had the possibility of actually walking over a funding cliff because they don’t know they didn’t have a lot of other money in there to kind of sustain their operations while he took his time figuring out who they let into the country. Andi so they were actually being, you know, there’s sustainability was seriously being threatened for awhile with, you know, with some of the legal service’s offices and the legal organizations that have been helping to bring really a brilliant array of suits in response to some of the executive orders etcetera that have been brought by the administration. They’re having their own problems. I mean, we’ve got lsc being threatened with extinction on effort that i do not think would is going to succeed, by the way, unless, of course, legal services corporation, they’re legal services are the ones that provided and the reason why it won’t succeed, hopefully, is that it traditionally had really bipartisan support, a tte the federal level. Okay, well, i think people recognize that as a as a basic right. The right of the right, tio to a defence when you’re facing a criminal charge and that’s what that’s, largely what legal services provides is that is that criminal defense for those who can’t afford their own? Well, well ell, isi provides helped for a lot of people, like people who have been denied benefits. Um, if there’s a veteran who’s suffering from p ptsd with, you know, there’s been a ah kind of a horrifying whack of ability to access benefits if they were for some reason, you know, discharged dishonorably or whatever, and the ability to get benefits and situations like that is very much dependent on legal services office. Okay. Yes, broader. Broader than just criminal defense. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Um, how about in education? I mean, of course, the administration is devoting a lot of money to vouchers. I think the number i think i saw non-profit quarterly. Twenty billion dollars attn least desired. And that shift hasn’t been made yet. But you know the implications for public education when there are people when everybody gets a voucher. But only some people can afford to supplement that voucher to send their kids to brovey ah, private school. And then what does that do to the population of students in the public school? And do the public schools become the you know, the place of last resort, the education of last resort? What do you thoughts around education? Well, you know, i mean, this has been a long standing argument. That’s been going on in the so called education reform movement is you know, what exactly does education reform and tail? What? What experiments in that area are successful and which have not been so successful. And what does it mean for the future of education? And i think having somebody who’s so firmly on the side of vouchers and charter schools and such in the top position, and particularly who has a history in the philanthropic pushing of that agenda, which there are a lot of fairly major flat surface who have been who’ve been inhabiting that area of really pushing that set of solutions is a problem. I mean, it’s definitely a problem in the end, you know, it’s really going to be up to the parents and the communities to express what they do and don’t want that could be very hard. I mean, you’ve got the broad foundation, you know, i brought in in san francisco, who has been very heavily pushing that agenda and really was it was essentially proposing in a take off los angeles schools, did i say san francisco before but it’s, los angeles, and so, you know, this is not this has been in a kind of a film tropic take over of public altum that has been extremely uncomfortable and kind of undermines, not kind of, but definitely undermine democratic systems, i guess we’ll have to wait and see what the actual proposals are, and part of that comes from the from the detailed budget also, and then see how how education organizes, you know, as you’re saying at the local level and then also nationally right. Okay, so that’s that until we know more, i guess that was kind of an open, open question. You had something really interesting on february, february twenty first, it was non-profits your sole goal in twenty seventeen. Pick a fight with trump. Do you remember that? Remember that piece? Sure it wasn’t. It wasn’t your by line, but okay, tell us that was it was brilliant, but i don’t want to. I don’t want to say you’ll be more eloquent about it. Tell us, tell us about that piece. Pick a fight with trump, your sole goal? Well, i mean, i think it’s more of the same it’s just encouraging people to take on their civic responsibilities wherever they are that you know it is is incredibly important at all times, you know, but particularly now i wantto say something about this about where we have been, and i want to say something about non-profit quarterly and all of this because i think that we uniquely among our peers took on the it took on the politics of this moment, and we felt honor bound to do that, and i wantto i’m sure they’re people out there saying what? Does this have to do with non-profit management? I would say it has everything to do with non-profit effectiveness because what we can do as organizations really depends on our ability to master both our internal the way we function internally and then too have influence on our external environment. So, um, if if i’m sitting around managing an organization absolutely beautifully and at some other level and government, they decide that no longer is abortion. Ah, political, you know, a decent political option, then i’ve got a big problem. So it’s it’s and just about every field is subject to those kinds of political decisions and agency decisions, so if you don’t have the ability to influence your external environment, you really are putting your organization a terrible risk. Look, um, and i think that’s been our our point of view, you know, since we started so when you get a big change like this in a in an administration and it’s really quite profound change on many levels, both in terms of process in outcomes, it really is important for people to, you know, spend more of their time, spend more of their strategic sense in figuring out how they’re going to maintain their external environment, such that their missions can be achieved well. And again, going back to your your editorial piece from the day after the day after the election, you know, i you seem to have staked out that space clearly and quickly check yes, we did, i mean it, and it wasn’t hard, it wasn’t it wasn’t easy to keep. I do want to acknowledge that we did get a lot of emails from people who say, but, you know, you’re not just working with with non-profits that are in the spaces that are, you know, you know, that are in play right now, and you’re not supposed to be taking political positions. Well, we’ve kind of always taken positions on policy because we do recognize it is being one of its a governing mechanism for a lot of what non-profits d’oh, um, and so we feel that we’re justified in taking on policy issues and that non-profits need to really understand that those boundaries between, you know, their boards be seeing their boards, and larger governing systems are more porous than they actually often believe. Yeah, and that that same charity navigator press release that that i saw there were some losers. Cancer research institute down five percent. Thie alzheimer’s association down fourteen percent. Again, this is giving from the charity navigator site that’s. All they were measuring from e-giving from their sight. So, you know, health, health and diseases on that that i mean that’s just that’s just two examples, but let’s talk about the health care healthcare sector, which is different from disease advocacy. I understand that, but let’s talk about health care. Um, there’s a lot of reform, you know, they were trying to do something in his first hundred days, didn’t materialize? Health care is seems very much in flux. So what? What are you seeing? Buy-in you know, it’s always so interesting to look at the giving us a numbers when you think you kind of know what’s going on from field to field and it is hard to get a grip on. And some of i would say in the last ten years, some of the rules that we assumed pretty much applied all the time don’t necessarily apply anymore. So, for instance, um, i think a few years ago, it might even have been last year. There was a decline, no there’s an incline in health funding, so that helped fun help funding actually went up, and even at the point where there was more money around in the government for health and that is that it’s kind of not usually what happens generally when there’s more like government money around in a particular area, but give the individual giving will fall away a little bit, and that didn’t happen. I think it might have been last year might have been the year before, and so some of those rules aren’t holding true. I can’t remember a time when we saw the kind of surge of giving toe advocacy organizations that we just saw, and so i’m curious, but not at all convinced that that e-giving will decline for other kinds of organizations. There are flux is from year to year, and sometimes the condition of our economy and general politics will just mean an absolute disaster for a whole field of organization. So that happened during the recession, it hit the the art sector the hardest would any have buddy have been have predicted that? Maybe not, but in the hindsight, it absolutely makes sense. But it nearly destroyed a lot of organizations and, you know, people didn’t know what to make of it, so they would they looked at it and they tried to, you know, they you heard over and over again? Well, opera is dead. Um, the symphony is a dying entity, you know, all of those kinds of, you know, do saying and yet it wasn’t true, it really waas a function of primarily of theater kana me and people there was just a perfect storm of factors that overtook that sector really quickly. And so to some extent, i mean, we can say, yeah, you know, by this this very limited sample this has happened, but we can’t really tell, yeah, okay, i will say that it probably does not help patient advocacy groups that there have been repeated scandals reported over the last year that some of those patient advocacy groups are being controlled by funding that is coming from pharmaceuticals that doesn’t help. Also also in question is basic research dollars that often lead to healthcare outcomes. National institutes of health, other organizations all right, ruth, i need you, teo, standby with me while i do a little business okay, and there’s more with ruth, of course coming up and we’re going to keep talking about the trump implications. Just, uh, indulge me while i first talk about pursuing you know them sponsors they’ve gotta fund-raising boot camp it’s it’s this it’s may coming up in may it’s a one day intensive it’s on site, and they will make you think critically about how you identify major gift prospects manager portfolio and make your asks if you feel like you need to help getting to the next level in fund-raising go to the boot camp it’s, a small group so space is limited you’ll find it at pursuing dot com click resource is and then training fund-raising boot camp re be spelling spelling bees for millennial fund-raising a night with live music, stand up comedy, dancing and a spelling bee all to raise money for your organization. Check out their video at we b e spelling dot com, then get in touch with ceo alex career and book a fundraiser a night for your organization. Now time for tony’s take two sexual harassment in the non-profit workplace i didn’t see people talking about this amid the bill o’reilly ouster from fox news, but i would like to talk about it, and i want to include your opinion, whether you’re a victim witness and if if witness did you know what to do in the moment hr professional attorney or just someone with an opinion, i’d like to hear it. You can comment anonymously on my video, which, not surprisingly, you will find at tony martignetti dot com and that is tony’s take two we got to do live listener love it’s amazing! Sam keeps san keeps updating the list for me, it started like, ah, half of what it was, and now he just keeps adding cities and states and countries. S o i’m going to start domestic this week in that i’m going to try to do it in the sequence of people came, so we had some late comers. I’ll call them out in a second, but with us from the beginning. Tampa, florida, woodbridge, new jersey swan’s borrow north carolina, south orange, new jersey, kent, washington, new york, new york live listen, love the live love goes out to you and you’ve been with us from the beginning of san francisco, california, also from the beginning now, some of the late comers. I’m glad you’re with us. I’m glad you’re with us, but try to make it on time. Next time, if you would please that’s. Wilmington, delaware, brooklyn, new york, brooklyn. Come on. I mean, it’s. Come on. You should be here on time. Charlotte, north carolina and detroit, michigan. All right. More love than admit than admonition live! Listen loved all those cities. Let’s, go abroad germany! We can’t see your city. I’m sorry, it’s masked but of course, good dog u k i don’t know whether it’s ah england island or whales, you can’t tell, but uk so glad you’re with us. You could you’re welcome to tweet using hashtag non-profit radio. You could tell us what which which country you’re in uk pointers argast argentina point of star days, guadalupe quarter lupe, mexico point of star days that covers it for now and then, of course, we got to do the podcast pleasantries because that’s, where over twelve thousand people are listening now week after week after week over twelve thousand on the podcast so grateful that you’re with us through itunes, stitcher, pod, bay player, etcetera, etcetera, there’s a keep mentioned was one in germany like podcast dot d whatever your platform doesn’t matter, podcast listeners pleasantries to you and the affiliate affections to our am and fm listeners through out the country at those community radio stations. So glad that you are with us whenever your station fits non-profit radio into its weekly schedule, i’m glad and the affections go out to our affiliate listeners. Okay, ruth, thank you for your indulgence with that it’s. Very important. Tio got express gratitude whether it’s, love or pleasantries our affections it’s gotta go out you get, you know, um so let’s. See? Oh, the other thing i want to point out about your the sole goal in twenty seventeen peace pick a fight with trump was that thea and i’m sorry. You know i don’t i didn’t write down who duitz byline was out. Do you remember the waters? I think it was joe water joe waters. Excellent. I wanted i should i should get down because i wanted to give him give him credit. It was pointing out that the trump, you know tweet twitter platform twitter account with twenty four, twenty five million followers. It can be really powerful. And positively and negatively, it sends a lot of traffic to the links when he when he tweets a link and to the organization websites where you just mentioned the place, the guy does generate a lot traffic on twitter, huh? So that was part of joe’s point was, you know, pick a fight with him and maybe you’ll get it. You’ll get some good publicity, you know, everybody approaches in their own way. Joe is in cause marketing, and so he thinks that way on dh that’s, that’s what’s so great about the quarterly is that, you know, you’ll have people coming in from all possible disciplines thinking about okay, what can we do? What can we do right now, that’s going to make a difference? Um, and often times it’s just brilliant it’s just the right thing at the right time. And so, yeah, we’re very grateful to jo jo always comes in with these these kind of odds suggestions that take you back for a minute and then you’re like, yeah, well, people should be checking you out so non-profit quarterly dot or ge and at and p quarterly, and i’ll say it again at the end. Yeah, people should be checking out non-profit quarterly. Um, okay, let’s. See, uh, my voice cracked, let’s. See? So, how about let’s go? A little general, you know, tio toe toe boards. What do you feel like? Boardmember sze should be paying attention to wolber thinking about oh, boy, i have a lot of good a lot of thoughts about that, don’t you? Yeah, don’t hold back on the radio. Well, i’m going home. I’m going to start just talking about the most basic, the most basic kind of stuff we are in of very unstable place, even though right now the, you know, the market is pretty much flying high and you know, they’re they’re they’re some good financial indicators. We are in a situation in which nobody should assume that a bear, their usual flows of money are going to flow in the same way. So, you know, good. A good example of this was all of what was going on around the sanctuary city stuff where, you know, cities and jurisdictions were being threatened with federal de funding if they didn’t if if they didn’t comply with what the feds were asking them to dio and there was a lot of my going there was a lot of money, billions of dollars or for new york and other other big cities, billions surprise and so threats, you know, tio x out the cdbg money, which is cerini development block grant money all there’s going to be all kinds of barricades set up and, you know, with a lot of work, they maybe then take it back down again. We’ve been pretty effective at doing that is a sector over the last a hundred days, but but the fact of the matter is we really can we can’t assume the economy is going to be good for the next few years, and we cannot assume then we have to assume that there may be a downturn in giving and you may have some, you know, generally available government funding sources cut off, and when you have, like, multiple effects on revenue streams, you may have a serious problem in terms of the of the sustainability of your organization and that’s just how it goes. And so what boards need to be thinking about, in my opinion right now is making sure that they do not get caught without sufficient reserves and to be ready to kind of downsize if necessary, to make some of those preliminary plans so that if something does happen that really deeply affect them, that they’re able kind of, you know, step back and sustain on, but they don’t take it is kind of a sudden event. This is a good reason, by the way, for boards and executives to be paying close attention to their environments. And, you know, most good, really executives really do pay attention to their own funding sources. But there, you know, if other first princes funding sources of their partner agencies, who they’re dependent on for some, you know, part of their supply chain gets cut off, you know, what do you do then and there’s going to be, if you know, if i had my guests, there will be those kinds of instabilities in the next year, and boards need to be prepared to move quickly to deal with the effects of that. All right? Now you started off saying these things may happen, you know, uncertainty basically is is ruling. But now now, in the last couple of sentences you just said, if in your estimation things will happen. So where? No, i don’t. I honestly don’t know what will happen. I think that that non-profits, you know, can head off and they’ve been very successful and heading off some of the stuff that’s been coming down, but but it is possible that even the economy overall could with with the amount of kind of turbulence in the country right now, it is possible that the economy could go a little wonky and that might cut down on donations. People need toe look att their own budget and their partners budgets and try to figure out, you know, how do we best secure what we have in place and don’t allow ourselves to fall into a hole? You raise a good point about not only your budget but those to rely on those you partner will you mentioned in the supply chain? I think the unemployment number just came out today, wasn’t it? Department of labor very, very small growth in unemployment in very small decline in unemployment in the first quarter. I think that was just this morning. I think i just saw that this morning. Um, well, you know, and i will say that that kind of cuts pope way. So let’s, i mean, let’s, just talk about some of the, you know, kind of what happens around those employment number it’s, because we’ve been doing this whole siri’s in the last little bit on non-profit wage ghettos. I don’t know if you saw any of those, but essentially there’s some fields among non-profits that consistently pay less than a living wage to their frontline workers, and those fields are in the middle of expanding. They’re being pushed to expansively, you know, include elder pick care, disability, kind of personal attendants in disability. Um, some of the workers and nursing homes and child early child care, so the workers in those fields tend to be women. They tend to be people of color. Um, and they’re being paid at such low wages that many of them are on public subsidies of one kind or another. They’re taking public benefits essentially much like, you know, fast food establishments have been doing liketo work it it came up you need you need ah ah subsidence. You know our walmart or whatever. So, you know, when the employment market is good, it reduces the number of people who are willing tto work under those conditions. And so there’s been this very intense um, workforce deficit in those area so that, you know, those organizations, they’re having a very tough time keeping up with the demand because they pay such low wages and they haven’t been working hard enough on getting those rates increased because the wages are very often driven by the rate the rates that they’re being paid by the state government. So, you know, there’s all kinds of effects that are going to flow out there and it’s not always completely straight forward, and some may flow to the benefit of some areas into the deficit of others, which is why we always need to keep such a close eye on that. Yeah, i mean, and then on the other end, nasdaq just hit a record of six thousand this this week within a day or two ago, and you also make a point. I want to put a finer put up. I want to say it explicitly, a lot of what you’re talking about with boards and their their considerations points to the need to diversify your revenue. You know, you can’t be all government revenue, you can’t be all event driven, you can’t be all individual fund-raising that’s gotta be a mix in your and your revenue stream, and so that you know you’ll you’ll be able to weather hits in one sector better than that. If you’re in one spot and that’s and that’s the one that takes a hit diversity of revenue, you know, that could be sometimes easier said than done, and i know because some kinds of organizations lend themselves to certain kinds of funding, so, you know, if you’re talking about, uh, disability organization or, well, at least a service organization in that field, or you’re talking about a medical, you know, a medical facility ah, big part of their revenue is going to be driven by the fields there and on dh trying to make up a cz much as wood keep you stable if that one source goes, you know, goes wacky, it could be very difficult because it’s a very difficult thing to do because people are used to funding certain things and not others i still remember working with with an organization that provided services to people who had disabilities and they were literally unknown in their community except if you use, um, because all of their funding came from government, what that does is it leaves you without any flexibility or buffer to hard times it could. It could really be the death of you. And i mean, i think we saw that on the big case fags, right? The case here in new york city, we’ve talked about that. Yeah, no, i don’t want to be a wannabe, pollyannish. Oh, and, you know, dictating with that, but we’ve had we’ve had lots of guests on who who have talked about using local community. You’re bored chambers, social media, too, to broaden the message even, you know, even in the case where you know it’s it’s an institution where that you really don’t know them unless you’re benefiting from their services or your or your family is there are ways of getting you have growing a constituency, and i’m not saying that you necessarily could could offset all the loss in government revenue if you’re, you know, if you that kind of an organization but there are things that can be done it’s difficult, but not impossible to diversify the revenue. All right? We could talk more about this. I don’t wanna cut you off on that subject, ruth. But we do have to go to a break, and you know, i’ll keep chatting on the trump implications, okay? Like what you’re hearing a non-profit radio tony’s got more on youtube, you’ll find clips from stand up comedy tv spots and exclusive interviews catch guests like seth gordon. Craig newmark, the founder of craigslist marquis of eco enterprises, charles best from donors choose dot org’s aria finger do something that worked neo-sage levine from new york universities heimans center on philanthropy tony tweets to he finds the best content from the most knowledgeable, interesting people in and around non-profits to share on his stream. If you have valuable info, he wants to re tweet you during the show. You can join the conversation on twitter using hashtag non-profit radio twitter is an easy way to reach tony he’s at tony martignetti narasimhan t i g e n e t t i remember there’s a g before the end he hosts a podcast for the chronicle of philanthropy fund-raising fundamentals is a short monthly show devoted to getting over your fund-raising hartals just like non-profit radio, toni talks to leading thinkers, experts and cool people with great ideas. As one fan said, tony picks their brains and i don’t have to leave my office fund-raising fundamentals was recently dubbed the most helpful non-profit podcast you have ever heard. You can also join the conversation on facebook, where you can ask questions before or after the show. The guests are there, too. Get insider show alerts by email, tony tells you who’s on each week and always includes link so that you can contact guests directly. To sign up, visit the facebook page for tony martignetti dot com. If you have big dreams in a small budget tune into tony martin. Any non-profit radio, i d’oh. I’m adam braun, founder of pencils of promise. Welcome back, big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. I’m with roof, mccambridge and she’s, the editor in chief at non-profit quarterly. Anything else you want to say on that diversity of revenue subject like a seventy metoo it’s a it’s a funny one. You know, when we were we started out the hour talking about how the surge of funding went to particular organizations that you know, that trust that public trust where you’re willing to actually send your money to a place it builds over time very seldom happens suddenly you can build it, you definitely can build it. And sometimes, if really key institution is all of a sudden that risk people will flock to it. So of course they’re ways to, you know, try to, you know, uh, move on to a broader base of funding, but there is there is there is some truth of the matter that if you look out after over a field of organizations, you will see very similar funding mixes in those organizations like they’re similar to each other. Um and some fields just have mohr individual money in it than other fields. Still that’s. True. I understand. For sure, when we see that in in the graphics every well i look at you mentioned giving us a before i look more it atlas of giving. I don’t know if you’re familiar with atlas of giving, but i look because i look at their quarterly quarterly numbers and you see it in the pie charts. Of course, what goes to religion? Education by far, then goes to arts and the environment, right? Yeah, i agree. What about boards? You said you had a ton of advice for boards and bored, bored xero topic listeners. One is understand what your financial mixes and how to kind of almost, like, protect yourself against what could potentially happen in what is a very unstable time. So that’s number one secondly, you know who are your friends in the community? Like, do you have supporters? Have you built a base that will protect you if something happens? This has been really important to some kinds of groups, like planned parenthood. You know, even the very local groups are very often actively protected by the communities around them, and these are important things to consider. Like how connected are you to your community? How much might day risks to come out and make sure that you’re okay? Those are important questions to be asking yourself right now. The second is, what are the relationships? The third is, what are the relationships that with between yourself and others that you want to particularly try to develop a this point, and that could be anywhere from, you know, local funders, even if you’re not in, you know, and in a timing period where you would usually goto a funder, maybe it’s time to check in with the thunder’s not asking for money, but just simply checking in, making sure that relationship is stable. You know, all of these things are things that the board needs to think about just in terms of self protection. But then on the other level, boards need to think about what, to what extent are they willing to get involved in advocacy and even advocacy? Not necessarily on their own specific issues, but on issues that are related to their values based. So, for instance, and an organization who is in early childhood development might want to get involved in immigration organizing because of the effect that it has on the community that they’re in and so i i’ve seen more and more of that actually going on with with organizations that aaron one field understanding that kind of the the effects of policies in another field. Well, you know, we’ll have negative effects on the community, and then they get out there and advocate and that’s a decision really, that sits at the board level, and that advocacy may become easier to do because there’s been talk about repeal of the johnson amendment, which is what prohibits five o one see threes from political advocacy currently, but that’s that’s been called into question, i think it was it might have been right get tonight, can i just interject here program is us from partisan political work advocacy. We can always figure out how to get it. It’s the partisan political work in, you know, particularly around elections that ends up being the biggest problem for organization for non-profits yeah, all right, um on we’ve had gene takagi on on i’m pretty sure you know jean, don’t you? Yeah, he’s, our legal contributor he’s on he’s on once a month and he’s talked about political ad because and we covered. It during the campaign anyway, so that that prohibition has been questioned in in the first hundred days, so we’ll see if that if that ends up going away or not, i think that was i think that was by trump on twitter, i think, but i know it’s come out of the administration and some channel or no, i mean, there there have been those proposals to do away with the johnson amendment was which basically the johnson amendment protects this sector from being seen as a cz too partisan, and i think that it makes sense that when we advocate for something that we are seen as and we are functioning in, you know, the best interests of the community that we’re not working on, you know, on issues that have to do with one party affiliation or another that were really specifically working on issues form or altruistic reasons, if we whillans if we lose the protection of the johnson amendment, you’re going to have some organizations, you know, engaging mohr even than is currently happening in partisan political activity, and the reputation of the sector, in our opinion, would be damaged reputation ruth, we just have like a minute and a half left or so. So i’m gonna have to ask you to be. Be concise about foundations. What what’s the role. I think i think that the foundations have been incredibly well behaved in general, some of the large national foundation incredibly well behaved in, waiting to see what’s evolving and trying to respond to what’s evolving on the ground. They haven’t said we’re only going to fund this or that in response to the election, and i think in retrospect, that was the exact right position to take because we tried to get them to tell us, you know, where they’re going to change their grantmaking of embassies and they they never told us they were going to change their grantmaking embassies, and what they have done, i think, is just watch very carefully at where the energy is emerging and try to support what’s happening. Roof mccambridge she’s, editor in chief and president of non-profit quarterly, they’re at non-profit quarterly dot or ge and at np quarterly. Ruth, thank you so much for sharing. Thank you. A real pleasure next-gen idealware makes a major announcement on non-profit radio executive director karen graham will be with me if you missed any part of today’s show, i beseech you, find it on tony martignetti dot com responsive by pursuing online tools. For small and midsize non-profits data driven and technology enabled, and by we be spelling supercool spelling bee fundraisers, we b e spelling dot com, our creative producers clad meyerhoff. Sam liebowitz is the line producer. Durney mcardle is our am and fm outreach director. Shows social media is by susan chavez, and this music is by scott stein. Be with me next week for non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent go out and degree. Hey! 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