750th Show!

Tony Martignetti
Hello and welcome to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio, big nonprofit ideas for the other 95%. I'm your aptly named host and the podfather of your favorite hebdomadal podcast. It's July. It's Nonprofit Radio. We've got the live music, and that can only mean one thing. It's our 750th show and 15th anniversary jubilee. Woo! Woo is right. Here's our associate producer Kate with what's coming up for show number 750.

Kate Martignetti
Hey, Tony, your co-host is Claire Meyerhoff. We've got much more live music from Scott Stein. Our contributors Gene Takagi and Amy Sample Ward are here. Everyone is with us.

Tony Martignetti
Thank you very much, Kate. Claire Meyerhoff, how are you? So, uh, creative producer of Nonprofit Radio, how are you doing?

Claire Meyerhoff
I'm, I'm doing just fine. I'm just in awe And that once again, every year we come together, the same gang of 6, and put on this fantastic show. And this one is number— can it really be true? 750. It's true. That's a huge number, 750. Like when you were a kid, if like someone was saving up to buy something that cost $750, that was, you know, a lot, a lot of money. If you went to the grocery store now and it came to $7.50, you'd be like, well, yeah, that kind of makes sense. So 750 really is a huge number and 15 years.

Tony Martignetti
Yeah. July of 2010, the show began as, as you counseled me because of the first 2 shows were The Tony Martignetti Show. You counseled me that that was a mistake, that nobody's going to know what the hell that means. I was playing off, playing off one of my early influences. I thought, well, that guy has a show named for him. So, but you, you showed me the correct path. You know, you got to have nonprofit in there somewhere. And I chose Nonprofit Radio, and we're going to be talking a little about radio today. But yes, it was July 2010. It was 15 years ago. And you've been with me since.

Claire Meyerhoff
I have, because we knew each other before for a couple of years through the wonderful world of planned giving, which we both are professionals in. And we knew each other that way. And we had dinner in Cary, North Carolina, at a steakhouse. And at that table you said to me, you know what, I want to do a radio show about nonprofits. And I was like— and this was before like podcasting was really commonplace or anything like that— and I was like, well, have you done a radio show before? No, no, no, but I, I know I'd be great at it. I'd love to do it. And I go, well, you know, there's a lot to doing a radio show. Do you know about this? Do you know about that? Because my background, for our audiences, I worked in, in, um, radio news for many Many, many years. I've worked at XM Satellite Radio. I've worked at— I've worked for ABC Radio and WTOP in Washington, D.C., the all-news station. And so I know a lot about production and putting things together and how radio really is something that you can kind of do it all by yourself, as opposed to television where you need all these other elements that come in like camerawork and all that. So I said to Tony, I go, well, you know what? You know, I'll help you with this. And you were like, oh, you know, that would be great. And we discussed the name and some other things. And then I made for you— I thought what would be really helpful would be to make these kind of show sheets that when you're pre-interviewing people. So maybe you can talk a little about that. What did I

Tony Martignetti
make? Yeah, I still use your show sheets for the run of show. Kate and I use them every single week. Yeah, so, you know, over the years I've adapted it, but it's based off of what you gave me for like show number 3 or something or whatever. So, right, let's, uh, let's bring some other folks in.

Claire Meyerhoff
Sure. So I'd like to talk a little bit about, about our influences in radio because what Tony said to me, he said, I love, you know, car talk and I love these radio shows. They're so important to me. So I'd like to talk a little bit about everyone else's influence is in radio. My quick is I grew up around New York City, and so we had a lot of radio. I listened to WNEW, you know, Scott Muni, Allison Steele, the Nightbird on WNEW. And I just, I loved radio from, you know, when I When I was a kid. So how about everybody else? Scott, what did you grow up with in the, in the Midwest?

Scott Stein
Yeah, I grew up in Akron, Ohio, and the station that really was pivotal to me was WAPS 91.3 The Summit, which is a wonderful music station. They're still around, still doing great stuff, emphasis on independent music and local music and just stuff that wasn't getting played anywhere else. And really It's not an overestimation to say that, like, it— or an overstatement to say it really helped shape my musical taste for years to come.

Claire Meyerhoff
Hey, very cool.

Tony Martignetti
Amy? Yeah.

Claire Meyerhoff
What you got?

Amy Sample Ward
Well, I did not grow up listening to the radio because my dad loved music and was always playing his own curated, you know, playlist records.

Tony Martignetti
Your dad, Tim? Tim.

Amy Sample Ward
That's right, Tim, the one and only Tim Sample. And so I associate radio with when I got a car and turned 16 and actually drove myself places and was like, what? You mean to tell me that there is music that is not blues? Oh, how interesting. So I would listen to any radio station just for You know, like that eyes-opening, oh my gosh, there's so much out there in the world experience. Yeah.

Claire Meyerhoff
That warms my heart as a radio girl. That really, really warms my heart because the car, you know, the radio, the airwaves, traditional terrestrial radio is just the airwaves and they're free. And basically anyone could have a radio station and broadcast it. And the FCC—

Amy Sample Ward
Well, and I grew up, you know, in the American classic situation for that, like country roads, no other cars, windows down,

Claire Meyerhoff
nice,

Amy Sample Ward
just listening, you know.

Claire Meyerhoff
I love that so much. Gene, what do you have for us?

Gene Takagi
So I'm like Amy and didn't listen to a lot of music on the radio because I had mixtapes back then, and that was my big thing. But if I was listening to the radio, it was often listening to like local sports teams. And I grew up in Vancouver, British Columbia, so the Vancouver Canucks, Go Canucks, was a big thing for me. And Seattle Supersonics back in the day, the NBA, and bring back a Seattle NBA team.

Claire Meyerhoff
Wow, that's, that's, that's really, that's really amazing. And you're, and you're, and you grew up in Canada, so everything had a C in front of it.

Gene Takagi
Yeah, if there was a popular music station I listened to, it was CFUN, which was now defunct, but Yeah, that was the pop station back in the day.

Claire Meyerhoff
And did you listen to the games on and the sports on AM or FM?

Gene Takagi
Oh, it was almost always on AM. I don't think FM had sports back then.

Claire Meyerhoff
Right, right. That's cool. Hey, Kate, we know you're younger than we are, but do you ever listen to the radio?

Kate Martignetti
Oh, yeah. Mostly in the car. But my mom loves the South Jersey classic rock.

Tony Martignetti
Stations.

Kate Martignetti
So that was constantly on wherever we went— grocery shopping, to the beach. Like, that's all I think we listened to.

Tony Martignetti
Do you know the call letters? W— what it was?

Claire Meyerhoff
But I bet you do know every word to Livin' on a Prayer.

Kate Martignetti
Oh, oh, for sure. If Scott started playing it, I could probably sing it.

Claire Meyerhoff
That's Bon Jovi country.

Tony Martignetti
Right. South Jersey, Bon Jovi country. And Bruce Springsteen, of course.

Claire Meyerhoff
Bruce Springsteen. So, Tony, how about you? What are your, what are your earliest radio memories?

Tony Martignetti
Yeah, uh, rock and roll, uh, 102.7 WNEW. Uh, you mentioned Scott Muni and Allison Steele. Um, there were, there were others. Um, Pat St. John, classic, uh, classic rock DJ in New York City.

Claire Meyerhoff
Dennis Elses.

Tony Martignetti
Dennis Elses. Exactly right. Yep. Dennis. He was what?

Claire Meyerhoff
Pete Fornitell.

Tony Martignetti
Pete Fornitell. Yeah, you, you, yeah, you were obviously listening as well. You remember them better than I do. Yes. Pete Fornitell had that twangy voice. Pete Fornitell.

Claire Meyerhoff
He wrote a book, Radio in the Television Age, and I went into the city and because they had a signing at a bookstore. So he was there and Dennis Elses was there and I was going to Plattsburgh State at the time. And Dennis Elses, Pete Fornitell wrote in my book and then Dennis Elses wrote Rock lives all over, even in Plattsburgh, he wrote. And do you know who I gave that book to for his collection? I gave it to Sam a few years ago when I visited his studio. I gave it to Sam in New York,

Tony Martignetti
our old producer Sam Liebowitz.

Claire Meyerhoff
He has a really nice collection of like books about radio and music, and I thought that book would fit well in there. So I gifted that book to him and he—

Tony Martignetti
Oh, cool. That's very thoughtful. Very thoughtful. And then later years, you know, you mentioned the kind of influence on my On the, on the podcast, uh, Car Talk, definitely on, on National Public Radio's WNYC. It was the station in that we got in, uh, New York and New Jersey, WNYC. The Car Talk guys, uh, you know, you can't approach them, but they could— they certainly were an influence. You know, that I knew they had elements, comedic elements that you could look forward to. Each show or every couple shows, like Stump the Chumps. And their credits, you know, the closing credits, their car driver was the— they had a Russian car driver, Pikap Andropov. So, you know, stuff like that. Cornball, right, exactly. Corn. But you could count on it every week, they were going to credit Pikap Andropov for being their chauffeur. So things like that. And then, so elements of the, of the Car Talk show, and then also another show on WNYC, which was pure talk. Brian Lehrer. I don't know if he's still there. But he became nationally syndicated, I think. Yeah, Amy's saying, Amy and Scott, yes, you've heard Brian Lehrer. He originates from WNYC.

Scott Stein
He's still there.

Tony Martignetti
He's still there.

Scott Stein
Still on WNYC every week, uh, a week, uh, every weekday.

Tony Martignetti
Awesome, awesome.

Amy Sample Ward
That's syndicated across the public media network.

Tony Martignetti
Oh, across which network?

Amy Sample Ward
Public media.

Tony Martignetti
Okay, yeah. Well, Claire, I got the idea for the Tony Martignetti Show from the Brian Lehrer Show, but Tony Martignetti is not quite widely, uh, and even in 2015, so even more so in 2015 And what am I saying? In 2010, in 2010, 15 years ago, uh, not as widely known as Brian Lehrer. And so, you know, everybody knew him as a political junkie, and he had a lot of political guests, and, uh, that was mostly what he did, as well as general news. But, uh,

Amy Sample Ward
you have to reserve The Tony Martignetti Show for just wherever you happen to be and the name of what chaos you are bringing to any scenario. You know, that's just The Tony Martignetti Show. Nonprofit Radio Is a podcast, you know.

Tony Martignetti
All right, thank you. Like when I go to NTEN, I could, I could— that's right, I could brand it.

Amy Sample Ward
Like, okay, get ready everybody, it's the Tony Martignetti Show.

Tony Martignetti
When I go to the nonprofit technology conference each year hosted by NTEN. All right, so—

Claire Meyerhoff
You know what, we could have called it Nonprofit Podcast, but it's— we put the word radio in it. You'd like that, you know, Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Because, because why, Tony? It's the sound of it.

Tony Martignetti
Well, radio was an influence for the show, and, uh, I, I have some nostalgia for radio. And radio is a very personal medium, you know, like you're saying, listening in the car. It's just radio seems to be talking to me, you know, when I listen to radio.

Claire Meyerhoff
Yes.

Tony Martignetti
I feel like the host, the DJ, they're talking to me. And that's what I want, you know, I want to be talking to our listeners, each of our listeners, and sort of channeling what interests them so that they're a part of the conversation as much as can be. So that was— those were my thoughts for around why radio.

Claire Meyerhoff
Well, and your instincts are correct because when I was in, you know, broadcast journalism school at American University and we were learning the basics, we learned that radio and television too is a one-on-one medium. Like when you're talking, when you're on the air, you're just talking to one person. So you don't say like, you all out there in radio land, you just say you. So if you're doing a news story about a traffic thing, you just say, you know, if you're traveling on, you know, I Choose 70, blah, blah, blah. You don't say, all you people out there on the road, thousands of people listening to me. It's just you. And so, so it's a very personal, personal medium.

Tony Martignetti
Those were the, those were the influences. I'm glad Brian Lehrer still has the Brian Lehrer Show nationwide. Uh, he was, uh, when you, when you hear Brian, you'll know he was, he was an early influence for this very show. And, uh, it's time for, uh, live, live, full live song number 1. Scott Stein.

Scott Stein
Hello again.

Tony Martignetti
You're gonna play a song that, uh, that I asked you to play. Uh, you— the— your album is Uphill. We might get this on the video. There's the album right there. It sits— it resides on my desk because I play it.

Scott Stein
Oh, thank you.

Tony Martignetti
The album is Uphill, which sounds challenging, but you made the last song It's a good life.

Scott Stein
Yeah, it's— well, it's— I think it's a challenging record. It was, it was reflective of a fairly challenging time in my life, and it was important to— in the narrative of the record— to be building towards something hopeful or something that, that hints at something better to come.

Tony Martignetti
I know folks are gonna love the 3 songs you're doing for us today, so let's give an early shout. And where can we Buy your music.

Scott Stein
Oh, the best way to support me directly is actually at my Bandcamp site. So that would be scottstein.bandcamp.com. You can order physical CDs or purchase downloads. That's the best way because there's really no middleman other than the little bit that Bandcamp takes. My music is also available in the iTunes Store, which is also— if that's your preferred method, That's great. And it's also on the streaming services, Spotify, Apple Music, etc., etc.

Tony Martignetti
Everywhere fine music is, is heard.

Scott Stein
Indeed.

Tony Martignetti
All right. Thank you. Please, Scott, It's a Good Life.

Scott Stein
All right. I got some inside information. Someone slipped me a copy of the master plan. My sources are dependable, but they're in a language I don't understand. You know, I've always been a cynic since the day that I can remember. Always skipping past silver linings, always looking for the snow in September. But baby, baby, baby, it's a good life. Oh baby, baby, it's a good life. No matter who you are, we all can see the nearest star. Oh baby, baby, it's a good life. Hi. Some days you're awful busy. Some days you can't get a damn thing done. Some days you get the car keys. Some days it's the keys to the kingdom. Sometimes the changing of the guard is faster than the changing of the seasons. Sometimes the people that you love fly away for very good reasons. But baby, baby, baby, it's a good life. Oh baby, baby, it's a good life. No matter how you sing this song, there's always someone singing along. Ooh, baby, baby, it's a good life. Ooh, baby, do what you do. I once was a beginner who only knew what he knew. But baby, baby, baby, it's a good life. Oh baby, baby, it's a good life. Don't just stick to what you know. Let it fly and watch it go. Ooh baby baby, it's a good life. Oh baby baby, it's a good life. Oh baby baby, it's a good life.

Tony Martignetti
Oh, Scott, that's just a beautiful song. Beautiful song. Don't just stick to what you know. Let it fly and watch it grow. I love that. I love that line. The whole song. Lovely. Beautiful. Thank you.

Scott Stein
Thank you, Tony.

Tony Martignetti
Claire, it's a good life.

Claire Meyerhoff
It is a good life, especially here on the 750th Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio broadcast. And, you know, Tony had to learn what's called Audacity in order to produce his podcast. And I do— I have a podcast and I do it in GarageBand. And now with AI, there's a lot of tools. So, Scott, I'd like to ask you, you know, you're a musician and you're in this world. How do you like— do you produce your own music and record it? And how does that— how does that all go?

Scott Stein
Yes, in a way. I always have a team around me of some sort. I play a number of instruments, but not all of my instruments. Usually when I'm doing a recording, I mean, I don't have my own studio, so I will go into somebody else's studio and do the work. I can do a little bit here at home, but most of it has to happen elsewhere. And I always have a producer online— excuse me, on the project. And in that case, their role is to be kind of the in charge of the project and to be an expert set of ears. You know, I always want somebody who can tell me, hey, that vocal line's not working, or hey, that's really good, do more of that. Coming up with ideas for instruments, especially this last record where there's a lot of, a lot of textures, synthesizers, things that I don't usually use. And I did that because I went to a specific producer, a friend of mine named Mark Marshall, Because I knew he was somebody who could help me figure out what the sounds in my head were and how to get them out and how to do it effectively and to bring his own experience and his own expertise into the room.

Claire Meyerhoff
You know, the role of a producer is so important, and I work in the nonprofit space like Tony, and, you know, we have conferences, right, and meetings, and we do webinars and all that. And because my background is production, when I'm working on something, I bring that those skills, you know, to, to the event or the webinar or whatever. And a lot of times I'll write, I'll do like a rundown or a show sheet, and the person will go like, wow, you know, I've never seen this. And I think the role of production is very like underrated in the nonprofit space. Like when you put on an event or when you do something, like how do you, how do you produce that? And because there's so many little pieces to it. And, and Amy, when it comes to the NTEN, I'm sure there's a huge amount of production involved, involved in that. Can you tell us a little bit about that? that?

Amy Sample Ward
Yeah, I mean, Tony will laugh. Like, like everything, there's an NTEN way that we do things versus maybe the standard way. But we don't, we don't have a staff person whose job title is the conference. We don't have, um, a producer. You know, when you're having a large in-person event, there's, um, what they call a pre-con, which is meant to be like the incoming group, like somebody from NTEN would go and represent us. And then there's like the head of catering, the head of security, the head of AV, that everybody sits there behind a little name tent and kind of reports in before the doors open and all the work starts. And all 15 of us show up and they're always like so baffled. And they're like looking for chairs and everybody's like, no, it's fine, I can stand. And then when And they like ask, okay, everybody go around, all 15 of us do an intro, you know, because everyone on the team produces the NTC and everybody has different pieces of it that they're in charge of. And, you know, our like escalation is to the team. Okay, if something's not working, who is available, like on radio, right? Who's available to meet in the staff office? Yeah. There's not just one person who all that weight is on their shoulders and they have to decide everything. But really, you know, I think we say to the community, we're, we're always stronger together, and we are always stronger together. So, so we do it as a team.

Claire Meyerhoff
Very collaborative.

Tony Martignetti
Yeah, totally.

Claire Meyerhoff
In your professional life, what kind of things do you present? Do you speak at You know, conferences? Do you do webinars? Tell us a little bit about what, what you do, where the role of, of like producing it and putting it together and then presenting it come, come together.

Gene Takagi
Yeah, that's, um, I'm always dependent upon other organizations and other people to, to put it together. But yeah, I, I do a lot of webinars and, and speaking at conferences and things like that, and very, very I'm thankful for, for all of those people who can make it, uh, come together because I, I just talk and maybe show a few slides.

Claire Meyerhoff
So you do produce those slides? Perhaps you are putting together your slides with your, with your key points.

Gene Takagi
There, there you go. And I try to keep them heavily visual, which is really, really hard for a lawyer.

Claire Meyerhoff
Yeah, yeah. So, so on a, on a— what's a typical topic you might speak on? What's your specialty that everyone wants to hear Gene talk about?

Gene Takagi
Well, I'll say right now it's about nonprofit advocacy. And, you know, during these challenging times, nonprofits do have a voice and they do have influence. And thanks to vehicles like Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio, we get to help encourage nonprofits to learn what their sort of authority is, because it's usually a lot greater than they think. it might be so that they can speak out and hold, you know, hold the line when the line seems to be moving and pushing them back.

Claire Meyerhoff
That's really interesting because these, these are kind of, you know, tumultuous, tumultuous times. I was at the Carolina's Planned Giving Conference back in May, and we had a whole panel about legal stuff, and, and we had some really good speakers. And the one thing that, that I took away from it was that, that there has become a You know, in our, in our society, there's a lot of distrust now in, in, you know, government organizations, even nonprofits and things like that. There's this sort of, you know, distrust that there used to be. People trusted, you know, basically trusted the government and trusted colleges and trusted nonprofits. But now there's been like a, you know, an erosion, I think was the word that they used. And do you find that there's kind of an erosion of, of trust? These days, Gene?

Gene Takagi
Yeah, I think in all areas there's a little bit of erosion of trust and skepticism from the general public, but the nonprofit sector still, I believe, is leading as the most trusted area. And that's really something to hold on to as we can build bridges and then sort of take a stance in what we're doing. So really, really just counting on nonprofits, if you will, to continue to sort of advance human rights, civil rights, all of the things that nonprofit sectors have— the nonprofit sector has traditionally done. And so, um, I'm hopeful for, for better times and, and more nonprofit voice out there.

Claire Meyerhoff
That's a— that's an excellent point. And I think that nonprofits can use that in their messaging, um, you know, their public-facing messaging about how, you know, trusted they are. And they can show that in different ways by, you know, having a survey or, or showing their you know, um, their output, like we did XYZ this year, and, and have photos of it and really show that, that nonprofits are working and working for their, their mission and for their people and for their, for their donors.

Gene Takagi
Yeah, and it's not all of the regular things that people might be thinking of with ICE and with some civil liberties, but just things like AI. And, you know, what happened with OpenAI housed in a nonprofit? Is it going to be a for-profit? It's Like, there's a lot of stuff out there where the nonprofit sector plays a critical role, um, and standing up for, for what the nonprofit sector is supposed to be, um, is really important. But thanks for asking, Claire.

Claire Meyerhoff
So when you say AI is a nonprofit, I, I don't even know. I mean, I use ChatGPT quite a bit. It helps me, you know, figure things out. And, and, you know, it's like someone to talk to that's a trusted person who does not have an ego. So I do use the ChatGPT for, for work, but What do you mean AI is a nonprofit?

Gene Takagi
Well, OpenAI, the creators of ChatGPT, it was started by Sam Altman and Elon Musk as a nonprofit organization, and they housed much of the assets that still run ChatGPT. So the whole intellectual property owned by it, how Microsoft has come in with a lot of money, whether it was going to turn into a for-profit or it has turned into a for-profit, or Is shuttled. The assets were probably licensed back down into the for-profit, although we don't know all of the sort of the mechanics of it. But ultimately, thanks to some nonprofit advocacy out there, it's going to stay sort of this tie to this nonprofit organization and not just completely moved into a for-profit. And the nonprofit is supposed to maintain the ethics of the AI use, you know, whether it's been successful or not. At least there is some regulation. Right. around how that AI can be used. So I'm thankful for that. And the, again, the nonprofit advocacy that kept that nonprofit in that game.

Claire Meyerhoff
And I think, you know, the, the, when my friends who don't understand nonprofits that much and they go, well, aren't nonprofits this or that? And I always say, well, you know, the number one thing about a nonprofit is it's nonprofit. No one can make like a ton of— yes, you can pay your people big salaries or whatever. You can spend a lot of money on, on things, but you don't have shareholders and you can't make a profit. So Gene, do you think that that's an important element of AI staying as a nonprofit because it can be less, I don't know, greedy?

Gene Takagi
Yeah, I think that is part of the point is that it's not just influenced by people who are self-interested and, you know, self-dealing to themselves and their buddies. But it also is like the attorney generals and the IRS saying, hey, you have to engage in primarily charitable activities. It can't be just purely commercial. So let's see whether you are actually engaging in charitable activities. And how strict the regulators are and how much enforcement you can do when you've got limited resources, especially these days for the IRS, is another question. But I'm again thankful that there is a nonprofit sector in the U.S. It's not completely unique, but it is something special. that the country needs to treasure. And Nonprofit Radio right there.

Claire Meyerhoff
Right there.

Tony Martignetti
As we're talking about artificial intelligence, it's important to point out that it's not all AI that is part of a nonprofit. We're just talking about what— Gene's just talking about one company, the nonprofit OpenAI, the one founded by Sam Altman. There are lots and lots of for-profit artificial intelligence, large language model, entities. So, you know, we're just talking about the OpenAI remaining nonprofit, which is very— which is promising so far, like as Gene is saying.

Claire Meyerhoff
Yeah, this is a great topic for our 750th Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio show. Tony, you've brought so many different experts onto your show. You've helped so many people over 15 years. It's just It's just truly amazing.

Tony Martignetti
It's a labor of love. And now I get to do it each week with Kate. So we're talking about production, Kate. Well, what— how do you feel? How do you feel about what we produce each week?

Kate Martignetti
Oh, well, I always look forward to it because I get to come and meet with my uncle on Zoom. And that's always a lot of fun. My godfather, you know, I get to go bother him. Um, it feels good to, uh, put something out each week, um, something that you're obviously passionate about, and I'm starting to become passionate about it just by listening to it, to our show each week. Um, and it's something that I can like now talk about with others and be like, hey, I'm doing this podcast with my uncle and this is what we're doing and this is how we're, um, helping people.

Tony Martignetti
Cool. Oh, I'm glad. I'm glad, like, you feel empowered and, uh, you're spreading, spreading the word of the, the value of nonprofits in our country. That's awesome. I, I did— I'm very glad to hear that. That's awesome.

Claire Meyerhoff
What kind of skills have you picked up, Kate, since you've been doing this endeavor? Have you picked up any new skills?

Kate Martignetti
Well, on the more like production side, um, Tony has taught me how to use Audacity. Um, it's not something that I personally use every day, but he was able to like teach me what he knows if I did ever want to produce something of my own, uh, vocally. So that's pretty cool because I had no clue how to do anything with like a mic. I didn't know how to, I guess, edit my voice if I'm too loud or too soft, that kind of thing.

Claire Meyerhoff
Nice. It's good.

Tony Martignetti
Yeah, I'm glad. Yeah, very glad. And, uh, in a couple of weeks, your family will be visiting and we'll be doing the show, uh, side by side.

Kate Martignetti
Oh, that's— I would look forward to that.

Tony Martignetti
From my studio office every late August. Yes. All right, Scott, you're gonna do another song for us. Um, I want to remind folks, you're— the best place is, uh, Bandcamp. Best place to buy your music. It's— is it bandcamp.scottstein, did you say?

Scott Stein
It's the other way around. It's scottstein.bandcamp.com.

Tony Martignetti
Thank you. Okay, best place. But you're also, of course, on Apple, Spotify.

Scott Stein
Yes, all those services.

Tony Martignetti
Wherever fine musicians are heard.

Scott Stein
Indeed.

Tony Martignetti
So this song, uh, intro this song for us.

Scott Stein
Uh, it actually brings us back to an earlier conversation because I always tell people this is a song about what happens when, like, you begin by hearing your favorite song. Maybe you hear it on the radio, and then you hear it in a bar, and then as years pass, eventually you hear it at CVS. Yeah, so that's, that's what I'll say. And, and the, you know, our coping mechanisms. This is, this is a new-ish song. It has not been recorded yet, so maybe at some point in the future it will be available commercially. And I assume my keyboard's coming through okay, yes?

Tony Martignetti
Yes, and your balance is very good, yes.

Scott Stein
Fantastic.

Tony Martignetti
Driving too fast.

Scott Stein
All right, here we go. The alarm goes off early in the morning and I roll on out of bed. Leftovers of last night's dream still running through my head. And I make my coffee, make my breakfast, rub my eyes and start the day. Drop the kids at school, a kiss Goodbye, and I am on my way. We live out on a quiet little street, on a quiet little block. It's the kind of place where you can drift away, where you can leave the doors unlocked. And at the far end of the street, there's a highway. You could hear the river burn. Sometimes in the evening I take my car to the edge and make my turn. I'm driving too fast on the highway now. I know I'm headed somewhere, but I don't know how. Feel that sudden wind blowing through my hair. Nothing on my mind except the open air. I'm driving too fast on the open road. I don't care what direction, don't care where it goes. Speeding past the corner of my hometown, but I'll be back home before the sun goes down. It's true that I was younger when you met me, when we didn't have a care. It's true that I got one foot on the ground and the other in the air. Sometimes I'm not sure whose face is in the mirror every day. Am I looking at the face of a survivor? We'll just run, it's turning gray. I'm driving too fast on the freeway now. I'm trying to feel lighter, but I don't know how. Listening to songs from way back when, wondering when a way back's coming back again. I'm driving too fast on the open road. I don't care what direction, don't care where it goes. Counting down the miles till the speed trap town, but I'll be back home before the sun goes down. I'm Marc Silverman. Now I know it's getting late now, and I know it's almost night, and I know you think I'm reckless, and I know you're probably right. Now I know that I'm lucky, I know that nothing's guaranteed, and I know that I got all the love that I will ever need. I still feel like a young man, I know that I got time, but it's hard to slow the car down without the fear of being left behind. I'm driving too fast on the highway now. We all got older, but we don't know how. Listening to songs from way back when, wondering when we'll be coming back again. I'm driving too fast. Lost on the open road. I'll find a new direction, though I don't know where it goes. Coming round the corner back to my hometown, but I'll be back home before the sun goes down. Whoa, whoa. Whoa.

Tony Martignetti
Fantastic, Scott. Thank you. Driving too fast.

Scott Stein
Thank you.

Tony Martignetti
I'll go a new direction, but I don't know where— I'll find the new direction, but I don't know where it goes. A lot of— you've seen some brilliant lyrics. You do some— you turn some very good phrases. Yes. Outstanding. Thank you. Thank you. Scott, it was, uh, it was show number 158, uh, in 2013. It was September of 2013 when you first debuted Cheap Red Wine, uh, as our, as our theme song. So number 158 to 750, uh, I, I get inspiration from Cheap Red Wine. I listen to it on my own time as well. Um, I just love it. I, I'm so glad we got connected by your attorney friend and my attorney, Joe Becker.

Scott Stein
Yeah.

Tony Martignetti
And that Cheap Red Wine is a part of Nonprofit Radio for so long. So thank you.

Scott Stein
Thank you. I'll put a quick plug in. He's going professionally now as J.R. Becker, author of a number of children's books which have done really well. So if you have kids and you're looking for like thought-provoking children's— excuse me, children's books, Like, yeah, his stuff is great.

Tony Martignetti
J.R. Becker, what a humble artist you are, throwing to somebody else. A lot of artists wouldn't do that.

Scott Stein
Well, you got to have a network of people who support you, right? And, and it works when you— better when you support in kind.

Tony Martignetti
That was very gracious. Thank you. Claire, Claire Meyerhoff, you joined with— your first show was show number 2. Really? Single digits. Show number 2 was July 23rd, 2010. And we talked about—

Claire Meyerhoff
Wow, I was only like 15. That's amazing.

Tony Martignetti
We talked about storytelling and jargon.

Claire Meyerhoff
Yes, jargon jail.

Tony Martignetti
I developed jargon jail thanks to you. Jargon jail. I still put folks in jargon jail. So that's, uh, thank you very much. I love having you as a creative producer. Thank you.

Claire Meyerhoff
You're welcome, Tony.

Tony Martignetti
Gene, you joined next. You joined show number 7. It was your first show with us in August of 2010. So just a month later, a month after we started, show number 7. And that was the show when we had Stephanie Strom was also on the show. She used to be the New York Times reporter. But Gene, you've been with us a long time. Thank you very much.

Gene Takagi
It's always been my pleasure and also to often be in jargon jail.

Tony Martignetti
No, well, I— you always skirt jargon jail because you explain things. Amy, you joined, you joined in show number 100.

Amy Sample Ward
Yeah.

Tony Martignetti
It was July of 2012.

Amy Sample Ward
Yeah, the bar was high. I was like, there's live music, there's all these other people. Like, I guess this is the show every time. No, that was just because it was the And,

Tony Martignetti
and that was my first time we announced that we had 1,000 listeners.

Amy Sample Ward
Yes.

Tony Martignetti
Now, of course, we have over 13,000 each week. But—

Amy Sample Ward
But now Kate will get to experience what I got to experience in the early days of getting to sit next to each other at your microphones in the studio.

Tony Martignetti
Yeah, that's right. That's right. When we both—

Amy Sample Ward
You can really cut Tony off on his jokes a lot faster than the way Zoom does it, you know? Yeah.

Tony Martignetti
Yeah, well, that's not a good practice. We don't want to do that too often. Yes, we were both in New York City. You would, of course, we would come into Sam's studio, we'd be side by side. And Kate joined. Kate joined on show number 645, which was June of 2023. It started as something fun. Her family was visiting and I wanted to try it out because she has— she's a trained professional. Yeah. And in voice, and I just loved the way it sounded. So we've been with it since.

Kate Martignetti
That's so sweet. Yeah, no, it was a lot of fun. You came to me and you were like, well, I need to do my show. Do you want to do the sponsors and kind of introduce people? And I was like, yeah, I'll try. I was a little nervous, but then I ended up really enjoying it and you ended up enjoying it. And now I'm here.

Tony Martignetti
Absolutely. Yeah. So thanks to each of you. It wouldn't be Nonprofit Radio without each of you, each of you. So thank you. And our listeners, I'm speaking to you, dear listener. Thank you. Thank you for your support. I'm talking right to you. Thank you for listening. Thank you for being with us. It wouldn't be Nonprofit Radio podcast You know, a podcast without listeners, that's called a diary. So, we're not a diary. We're a podcast. And I'm grateful that we have you as a listener with us. Thank you.

Amy Sample Ward
But, Tony, you need some gratitude also because in 15 years, I, you know, I was not Claire or Gene. So, but came in at 100. So still, somehow I've been here for 650 of these, and you have changed. The show has evolved. You— it's hard to change. Humans are not good at change, and you have been open to change, to supporting the sector, to meeting people where they are. And I just want to give you

Tony Martignetti
Thank you. Thanks very much, Amy. It's an honor to do the show and to help our community. And so that's why I'm grateful to each of you for helping us because we're all contributing. We're all helping the nonprofit community. We're doing it through Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Claire, you have a little ode.

Claire Meyerhoff
I do, Tony, because I've just known you for so long, and every year we talk about this anniversary show. Oh, what are we going to do? We've done skits, right? We've done like all kinds of crazy things, quizzes and skits over the years. So this year I thought I would just write you a little poem. So here is my ode. It's on my, on my phone. Here is my ode to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. Oh, thank you. So many shows, thousands here, 13,000 people, 15th year. It's a podcast to help nonprofit folks with shared expertise peppered with jokes. Show after show, guest after guest, Tony features only the best. 15 years now, an epic feat. 750 shows, Each one a treat because Tony strives for podcast perfection, always moving in the right direction. To host a podcast week after week takes commitment and time. It's not for the meek. It's for a guy like Tony who cares a great deal, cuts through the noise, keeps it real, hosting his show with zeal and zest. Educating, pontificating, and all the rest. Well, this ode is now nearing its end, written by Claire, Tony's longtime friend. So Tony, for you, I offer 3 cheers, and for Nonprofit Radio, best wishes for the next 15 years.

Tony Martignetti
Thank you, Claire. Zeal and zest. Thank you, Claire. That's very sweet. Thank you.

Claire Meyerhoff
I wrote that last night while watching Boardwalk Empire, which I love. I sat there and came up with my little poem on my iPhone. And, you know, I was inspired all about this, you know, radio show because this happens to be the 40th anniversary of Live Aid, which was the huge contest— concert at Wembley Stadium in London to benefit, you know, the problems in Africa with, you know, starvation and the situation. And, you know, Queen, performed this massive 21-minute set that's just epic that people watch over and over again. And, you know, when Freddie Mercury sings the Radio Gaga and that song, it's really an ode to radio, which at the time, you know, radio was being threatened by this new MTV thing and music videos and would radio die? And I can't believe in 1983 that they wrote this song, especially these lyrics. In it, you've had— about radio— you've had your time, you've had your power, you've yet to have your finest hour. What did Queen mean by that in 1982? The finest hour, could it possibly have been, I don't know, looking into the future and being podcasting?

Scott Stein
Hello, we Radio Gaga. Radio Goo Goo. Radio Gaga. All we hear is Radio Gaga. Radio blah blah. Radio what's new. Radio someone still listening.

Claire Meyerhoff
Wow,

Tony Martignetti
their their own tribute to radio. Absolutely right. Yeah,

Claire Meyerhoff
I'm gonna cry.

Tony Martignetti
Someone still loves you. I've I've heard that. I've saw I saw in a couple places that Lady Gaga is named for that song. Her love of that song is why she chose Lady Gaga. So, Claire, thank you again for the ode.

Claire Meyerhoff
Oh, I'm glad you like it. You know, I'm not much of a poet, and I know it. But I have written many a birthday, bridal shower, funeral. I've written lots of, lots of poems for friends when they say, I don't know what I'm gonna say. I'll say, well, you know, let's write a little poem. And I'll come up with a little, just a little little poem like that, little ode to my friend Tony, who works so hard because people don't realize the amount of work that goes into a podcast, to booking guests, to, you know, actually, you know, organizing the whole thing, writing it, you know, all the little things that go into it. And for Tony, for you to do it week after week, 750 shows, 50 shows a year, you know, some people can manage like one podcast a month. They, you know, they do a podcast for a little while and it falls off. There was an article in the New York Times a few years ago that said, like, the average podcast— remember that, Tony? That it— the average podcast only lasted, like, so long and then it— and then it fell off.

Tony Martignetti
Well, look, Michelle Obama's podcast did not last. We had Bruce Springsteen and Barack Obama had a podcast together. Yeah. And all— both of those podcasts, Michelle Obama was by herself. Barack and Bruce had— were co-hosts. Those 2 podcasts are survived by Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. We started before them and we're continuing and they've tanked.

Claire Meyerhoff
You know, I've read about Prince Harry and Meghan Markle and how they got this great deal with Spotify, right, to do all these podcasts, but they could never really get it done. They just did like a little bit. And I read that, you know, they would go into meetings and have these highfalutin ideas about like, oh, let's interview like Putin and Trump together. Like, wouldn't that be a great podcast? Well, yeah, that would be a great podcast. But do you, like, know these people? Can you, can you book these guests?

Tony Martignetti
Yeah.

Claire Meyerhoff
And your podcast failed, you know, as far as I know. And then Spotify just said, you know, see ya, because it's the content. Like, if you can't make the content, it doesn't matter who you are. If you can't create that content, if you can't show up week after week and get your guests to show up, because that's, that's a hard thing, is to book the guests and get the time and put it all together.

Tony Martignetti
Well, and that's why radio was such an important influence for me because the shows I mentioned and just every radio show has to produce. Some are daily, like the Brian Lehrer Show was daily and still is. And Car Talk was weekly. But, you know, again, those early influences and every other show I used to listen to on WNEW, you know, the hosts had a show up for their 4-hour block, right, every day. And I guess, you know, that's the, that's the inspiration. That's why it's Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio.

Claire Meyerhoff
750 shows. Wow. And that's 15 years. So in, in 15 more years, we'll have what, 1,500 shows in 15 years? How old will we be?

Tony Martignetti
Uh, we will— I'll be 78.

Claire Meyerhoff
Oh my God.

Tony Martignetti
We can do that. We can do that. I'm going to keep working until I become a dinosaur and nobody will hire me anymore. But that has nothing to do with Nonprofit Radio. The podcast will continue even after I'm a dinosaur. All right. The time has come for me to say thank you. Thanks very much for being with us for the 750th. I look forward to these every single year for a month in advance. We've been counting down on the show. Kate knows, 3 weeks, 4 weeks ago, I started counting down every single show. It's 2 weeks away. So we're here. So thank you. Thanks to each of you. And again, thank you to our listeners. Thank you for listening to Tony Martignetti Nonprofit Radio. We wouldn't be a podcast without you. We'd be a diary. Scott, this beautiful song that I licensed— so, so glad, as I said, that, uh, uh, now, uh, JR— JR Burton, is it?

Scott Stein
Becker.

Tony Martignetti
JR Becker brought us together. Uh, Cheap Red Wine. Uh, I, I love adding it to the beginning and end of each and every show. Please.

Scott Stein
Well, thank you so much. I'm happy to do it. And again, congratulations, 750. My goodness. So

Tony Martignetti
thank you.

Scott Stein
All right, here we go. Baby, just keep on talking. Sooner or later, I'll figure out just what you mean. All right. You're seeking romantic advice from a billboard. I'm looking for answers up on a TV screen. And we can't agree on nothing. We can't tell our ups from our downs. We're disappointed in each other. Now tell me, baby, ain't this love that we found? You know, you used to be the one that I'd run to. You used to find me charming, but I can't figure out how. You said you thought I was handsome, but it doesn't matter now. So keep falling for my punches as long as your time will allow, 'cause all I've got are empty promises, a bottle of cheap red wine, and a bow. I know some girls that deliver diamonds. They You won't talk to the kind of clothing that I wear. Well, I'm too poor to afford the good stuff, and you're too easily distracted to care. Well, I ain't got too many options, and so I'm gonna do the best that I can. But maybe you'll have some competition one day when I'm a winner. You know, you used to find me charming, but I can't figure out how. You said you thought I was handsome, but it doesn't matter now. So keep falling for my pawns as long as your time will allow, 'cause I love cut and rip your promises, a bottle of cheap red wine and now. Whoa. Oh yeah, baby, let's raise our glasses. Think of dreams of better days. The other people can kiss our asses. They don't like the things we say. And I ain't gonna curse the heavens. I won't flash no victory signs. 'Cause we're pumping for each other as long as we've nobody else in mind. Nobody's waiting in line. Oh, we're just Just like cheap red wine. Whoa! Yeah! Hey, you know Oh, you used to find it charming, but I can't figure out how. You said you thought I was handsome. Never mind, it don't matter now. To keep falling for my punchlines as long as your time will allow. 'Cause I've got a heavy promise, here's a bottle of cheap red wine and a down. A cheap red wine and a down.

Kate Martignetti
If you missed any part of this week's show,

Tony Martignetti
I beseech you find it at TonyMartinetti.com.

Kate Martignetti
Our creative producer is Claire Meyerhoff. I'm your associate. The show's social media is by Susan Chavez. Marc Silverman is our web guy, and this glorious live music is by Scott Stein.

Scott Stein
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Tony Martignetti
Thank you for that affirmation, Scotty. Oh my. Be with us next week for Nonprofit Radio, Big Nonprofit Ideas for the Other 95%. Go out, be great.

Amy Sample Ward
Always so much better live, Scott. Aw, thank you.